Rants and Stupid shit in Orange County

[BSouthgate]

Unfortunately, trafficking in this industry IS a thing. It happens far more than a lot of people on this forum realize. Is it that way in every AMP? No, absolutely not. There are many AMPs, including a lot of the favorite ones on this site, where the girls are not trafficked and all have docs to be in the country legally. There are also quite a few where it's not that way. I don't want to get into the debate here as it's a fruitless discussion, but there are certain signs I look for that indicate girls just might be trafficked, and I tend to avoid those places "just in case. " I don't want to be feeding that network by any means.

Now another thing to consider is there's "trafficking" and there's "quid pro quo trafficking. " Without mentioning names, there's one prominent shop in OC where the girls live with the owners. They get cheap room and board to live in the owner's house. But as a condition of getting that cheap room and board they have to keep working at the shop. They may be documented, but have no marketable skills and speak little English. So if they were to quit the shop they'd have to move out, which means they'd need another roof over their heads and another source of income. They're free to go at the end of the day so they're not trafficked per se. They aren't being enslaved. But that can also be considered quid pro quo trafficking since they're kind of stuck.

I agree that trafficking exists, just like fatal attacks by mountain lions and deaths from lightning. However, lion attacks and lightning strikes are rare. Trafficking is more common but still infrequent enough to be rare.

Since 2018, there have been, according to the California Penal Code definition, between 600 and 1200 annual cases of human trafficking in all of California. https://htcourts.org/california/. If OC had a proportionate share of these cases, OC would have between 50 and 100 cases of trafficking per year—most of these involved street prostitution, some involved escort girls, and some involved children and men. About ten percent were not prostitution-related, and many involved internet interactions between adults and children. Probably less than a fifth involved massage parlor women. So, OC MPs have trafficked 10 to 20 women this year.

According to RM, there are at least 400 MPs in OC. Given the high turnover, let's assign five women to each MP annually. Thus, 2000 MP women work in OC each year. Of these, fewer than 1% of MP girls are trafficked according to the Cal State penal code definition.

Now, just so we know what we are talking about, what is the California definition of human trafficking? It is precisely "violating or depriving the personal liberty of another with the intent to obtain forced labor or services, sell or procure the person for commercial sex, or exploit the person in an obscene manner. " For example, one person was convicted of trafficking because he, one time, offered a 17-year-old girl the potential to work in an incall brothel. The girl refused and reported the guy who went to jail.

It is lucrative for police departments and especially for NGOs like the Polaris Group to find "trafficked" women. To do so, they often use "evidence of the kind that Grimmy uses in his post, that is, that the trafficking "victim" lives in the home of the business owner or on the property of the business. However, this custom is a rule in many Asian countries. I ran a small medical charity business in China and frequently housed my employees in my home / clinic / office. Restaurant owners and hotels, large and small, all do this. According to xxx and the California police and NGOs, we all were trafficking.

[Grimmy23]

For those who do not know about the Robert Kraft story, a summary follows. Then, I will comment on why a book or essay such as that suggested is sorely needed.

Robert Kraft Story. I write from memory of reading news accounts and watching youtube podcasts on the subject. Some of my details may not be correct.

Kraft is a billionaire businessman who owns the New England Patriots and several other sports enterprises. In 2019, Kraft visited at least one massage parlor in South Florida. On one occasion, he happened on a parlor under police investigation with hidden cameras. The police were on an anti-trafficking campaign, hoping to get better funding and fame for themselves and collaborating nonprofits. The police were thus able to record Kraft getting a blowjob. When Kraft was being driven out of the parlor's parking lot, the police stopped his car to identify who he was. Kraft was one of many mongers who visited this MP who were on camera and identified in the same way. A court threw Kraft's case out because he had been secretly video-recorded, which is illegal.

More importantly, despite using coercive interview methods with the masseuses, the police could find zero evidence of trafficking. In short, they had spent millions and had only achieved embarrassment for a horny billionaire. Note that this is only one of many such unsuccessful attempts to find non-existent trafficking of Asian prostitutes.

The American public has been influenced to believe that the trafficking of Asian women for prostitution is widespread and that all erotic parlors are loci of trafficking. Honest investigative reporting is necessary on this subject. I suggest that a young monger reading this thread consider studying this subject.

I am familiar with standard research practices and would happily advise and mentor such a person. Please DM me if you are interested in discussing this.

Unfortunately, trafficking in this industry IS a thing. It happens far more than a lot of people on this forum realize. Is it that way in every AMP? No, absolutely not. There are many AMPs, including a lot of the favorite ones on this site, where the girls are not trafficked and all have docs to be in the country legally. There are also quite a few where it's not that way. I don't want to get into the debate here as it's a fruitless discussion, but there are certain signs I look for that indicate girls just might be trafficked, and I tend to avoid those places "just in case. " I don't want to be feeding that network by any means.

Now another thing to consider is there's "trafficking" and there's "quid pro quo trafficking. " Without mentioning names, there's one prominent shop in OC where the girls live with the owners. They get cheap room and board to live in the owner's house. But as a condition of getting that cheap room and board they have to keep working at the shop. They may be documented, but have no marketable skills and speak little English. So if they were to quit the shop they'd have to move out, which means they'd need another roof over their heads and another source of income. They're free to go at the end of the day so they're not trafficked per se. They aren't being enslaved. But that can also be considered quid pro quo trafficking since they're kind of stuck.

[BSouthgate]

I agree with you. Please also note that the two books I referred to on the topic of how sex workers feel about their work were White women writing primarily about White women.

Meanwhile, I hope at least a few people out there (I mean not on this board) grasped that the women who helped out Kraft were not enslaved.

Lift Her Up.

Lift Her Up.

For those who do not know about the Robert Kraft story, a summary follows. Then, I will comment on why a book or essay such as that suggested is sorely needed.

Robert Kraft Story. I write from memory of reading news accounts and watching youtube podcasts on the subject. Some of my details may not be correct.

Kraft is a billionaire businessman who owns the New England Patriots and several other sports enterprises. In 2019, Kraft visited at least one massage parlor in South Florida. On one occasion, he happened on a parlor under police investigation with hidden cameras. The police were on an anti-trafficking campaign, hoping to get better funding and fame for themselves and collaborating nonprofits. The police were thus able to record Kraft getting a blowjob. When Kraft was being driven out of the parlor's parking lot, the police stopped his car to identify who he was. Kraft was one of many mongers who visited this MP who were on camera and identified in the same way. A court threw Kraft's case out because he had been secretly video-recorded, which is illegal.

More importantly, despite using coercive interview methods with the masseuses, the police could find zero evidence of trafficking. In short, they had spent millions and had only achieved embarrassment for a horny billionaire. Note that this is only one of many such unsuccessful attempts to find non-existent trafficking of Asian prostitutes.

The American public has been influenced to believe that the trafficking of Asian women for prostitution is widespread and that all erotic parlors are loci of trafficking. Honest investigative reporting is necessary on this subject. I suggest that a young monger reading this thread consider studying this subject.

I am familiar with standard research practices and would happily advise and mentor such a person. Please DM me if you are interested in discussing this.

[DWaits]

Thanks for the posts about OC before this forum. Interesting reading.

[Lift Her Up]

Someone should find a Chinese translator, and interview the actual girls working the local shops.

The problem with a western woman writing a book about Asian sex workers is that they bring tons of baggage to their viewpoint. You might recall the billionaire owner of the New Englan Patriots got busted for getting a HE in Florida. The newspapers started talking about how bad it was that these women were trafficked and implied they were held against their will and forced to do sex acts with disgusting American men. But when they started poking around, they found there were no guards or goons keeping these girls from fleeing. No one was beaten or threatened. They were just women who chose to come to the US to make 100 times what they would make back in China.

Our society is increasingly anti-male, anti-older male, and any male sexual urge is disgusting. Women are all virtuous or victims, and their monetizing their sexuality is a form of freedom and self-expression, and their sexual urges are beautiful.

So what it would take is a Chinese speaking Chinese woman to interview these ladies. There are some work conditions that don't meet local legal standards, but they do meet Chinese standards in China, and so they are all fine with those rules and never complain about them. More than half of Chinese don't make a $500 a year, and these girls make $1000 a week. Who complains about making 100 times your normal salary? If you were making $100 k here, and you were offered a job making $10,000,000 a year working in a foreign country, would you be complaining?

Of course Asian women enjoy sex too. But female sexuality is much more restrained. The culture is more conservative in many ways. More generally, Asian culture has much more self-control in all ways. How many times have you seen a Chinese woman drinking a coke or eating french fries? Look at how thin most of these women are. But they don't go to gyms, they just don't eat that much.

I agree with you. Please also note that the two books I referred to on the topic of how sex workers feel about their work were White women writing primarily about White women.

Meanwhile, I hope at least a few people out there (I mean not on this board) grasped that the women who helped out Kraft were not enslaved.

Lift Her Up.

Lift Her Up.

[JerkieChan]

So, last week, I got a txt from an unknown number on my prepaid phone. It reads"I am back from my trip to Korea, how are you?

I though she was one of my favorites, so I replied "Sorry", I don't recognize your number, who is this?

She then wrote"This is Grace, we met at the jewelry show. " and she sent a picture of a beautiful middle age Asian lady next to another non-Asian older lady in an afternoon party setting.

Sounds to me like it was an attempt at a "pig butchering scam. " I've experienced a similar scenario a few times, always with a case of mistaken identity, contacted by a successful, attractive Asian woman. I couldn't find their pictures online either.

[Duke1973]

So, last week, I got a txt from an unknown number on my prepaid phone. It reads"I am back from my trip to Korea, how are you?

I though she was one of my favorites, so I replied "Sorry", I don't recognize your number, who is this?

She then wrote"This is Grace, we met at the jewelry show. " and she sent a picture of a beautiful middle age Asian lady next to another non-Asian older lady in an afternoon party setting.

I searched the picture online and could not find anything.

Me: sorry, I don't know you, you got the wrong number.

Grace: Sorry to bother you, I checked and you are right, I got one of the digit wrong.

Me: No problem, it happens. Have a great rest of your day!

Grace: LOL, are you saying that you received this type of txt all the time.

Me: No no no. Just once in a while.

Grace: By the way, where are you from? I am curious.

I did not reply and deleted the text history, but I kept the picture of that beautiful Asian lady. The communication stopped after that.

No, I am not sharing that picture here, at this time.

[BSouthgate]

Well how would we feel doing this same job? We all love a good session. So what if MMS said that we could get a job. Every Asian woman who came in, we had to flirt with her, and get turned on, and give her an orgasm. Most assuredly, these customers are not going to be 25 year old super models. They are more like 50 year old plain janes packing a dozen or two extra pounds. Half a dozen of them come in a day. And if we are not nice and flirty with them, they might give a $20 tip or even a dine-and-dash. How much do you think we would enjoy that sex? And now imagine doing it for years. Maybe never having any woman we were actually attracted to. And feeling guilty that we are selling our bodies rather than doing honorable work. How much job satisfaction would we have?

I knew a woman who dated a gynecologist. A guy who inspects pussies all day long. Well he had a hard time getting aroused. In his particular case, he liked slapping this girl across the face during sex, and probably some more serious S&M. She didn't find out, because she called me to pick her up and help her get out of that situation.

It was 2006. My girlfriend, Jasmine, and I went to a massage / sauna place in a small Beijing hotel. I was about 64 years old then, and she was about 48. Jasmine was thin with a plain, very Asian face and small breasts and ass. She was modestly attractive but not beautiful.

They gave us two massage beds about two meters apart. We undressed to our underwear. Jasmine wore a bra and panties, and I wore boxer shorts.

A short, cute girl and a rather tall, handsome young man entered the room. The guy was her masseur, and the girl was my masseuse. They were both in their twenties.

Jasmine's therapist asked her to lie face down, and my masseuse had me lie supine, looking at the ceiling. She put a hot towel over my eyes and began massaging my legs.

After about ten minutes of work on my feet, calves, and thighs, my masseuse's tiny hands found their way under my shorts to more sensitive parts of my body. Delicious sensation. At about the same time, I heard Jasmine moaning pleasant moans.

My masseuse whispered in my ear that, for a small tip, she could take me to a private room to complete my massage and give Jasmine some privacy with her masseur. Jasmine's moans were getting more frequent and louder. I nodded that it was ok.

When I took the towel off my face, I saw that Jasmine was on elbows and knees and the young male masseur was passionately licking her pussy from behind. Her moans were becoming screams.

My masseuse, Little Xie, and I snuck away to a private room, where we made love for half an hour. Afterward, we chatted. I took her number and paid her the 400 RMB tip. I went back to the reception area to find Jasmine.

Jasmine and I went to a local bar and shared our stories. Her masseuse had used his tongue to help her reach orgasm and then they had fucked in doggy position until she came again simultaneously with her masseur. She had also left a tip of 400 RMB to her masseur.

Jasmine and I parted ways shortly after this event. Our breakup had nothing to do with our massage adventure. I saw Little Xie twice in Beijing hotel rooms. I remember her as an ardent lover.

Encounters with gigolos like Jasmine's masseur are not nearly as common as those between men and pros like Little Xie. I have heard that they are more common in the SARs, Hong Kong and Macau. But this event, rare as it may be, proves the point that male pros also enjoy sex with older women who are not super models.

[BSouthgate]

Someone should find a Chinese translator, and interview the actual girls working the local shops.

The problem with a western woman writing a book about Asian sex workers is that they bring tons of baggage to their viewpoint. You might recall the billionaire owner of the New Englan Patriots got busted for getting a HE in Florida. The newspapers started talking about how bad it was that these women were trafficked and implied they were held against their will and forced to do sex acts with disgusting American men. But when they started poking around, they found there were no guards or goons keeping these girls from fleeing. No one was beaten or threatened. They were just women who chose to come to the US to make 100 times what they would make back in China.

Our society is increasingly anti-male, anti-older male, and any male sexual urge is disgusting. Women are all virtuous or victims, and their monetizing their sexuality is a form of freedom and self-expression, and their sexual urges are beautiful..

Almost all accurate.

At least all of this is approaching the truth. Agree about the Robert Kraft stuff.

I spent years living in China. The increase in income for these women is not 100 times but more like five times. Remember, many of them, despite what they tell you, did sex work in China. Still, you are right. They retain their frugal lifestyles when they immigrate but earn much more.

I agree that female sexuality is restrained, but it is only restrained because of cultural pressures, not because of biology. In primitive hunter-gatherer societies, women often have multiple male partners. That increases the probability of bearing children. Read "Sex at Dawn" by Christopher Ryan. Women, on average, masturbate about as much as we do. There is higher variability in female sexuality. I have had one wife who wanted sex several times a day and another who never wanted sex. Similarly, with my former girlfriends. Those who chose prostitution because they are on the high end.

In China, both men and women are thinner than in the US. This is due to increased activity levels. Unfortunately, this trend is changing for the worse.

[DarkRoomDaddy]

Stein book out of print. I ordered Albert book on Amazon.

Thanks for the references.

Someone should find a Chinese translator, and interview the actual girls working the local shops.

The problem with a western woman writing a book about Asian sex workers is that they bring tons of baggage to their viewpoint. You might recall the billionaire owner of the New Englan Patriots got busted for getting a HE in Florida. The newspapers started talking about how bad it was that these women were trafficked and implied they were held against their will and forced to do sex acts with disgusting American men. But when they started poking around, they found there were no guards or goons keeping these girls from fleeing. No one was beaten or threatened. They were just women who chose to come to the US to make 100 times what they would make back in China.

Our society is increasingly anti-male, anti-older male, and any male sexual urge is disgusting. Women are all virtuous or victims, and their monetizing their sexuality is a form of freedom and self-expression, and their sexual urges are beautiful.

So what it would take is a Chinese speaking Chinese woman to interview these ladies. There are some work conditions that don't meet local legal standards, but they do meet Chinese standards in China, and so they are all fine with those rules and never complain about them. More than half of Chinese don't make a $500 a year, and these girls make $1000 a week. Who complains about making 100 times your normal salary? If you were making $100 k here, and you were offered a job making $10,000,000 a year working in a foreign country, would you be complaining?

Of course Asian women enjoy sex too. But female sexuality is much more restrained. The culture is more conservative in many ways. More generally, Asian culture has much more self-control in all ways. How many times have you seen a Chinese woman drinking a coke or eating french fries? Look at how thin most of these women are. But they don't go to gyms, they just don't eat that much.

[BSouthgate]

Do the hookers sometimes really enjoy sex? This has been discussed in a few points recently in the MP thread.

My contribution to the discussion is to suggest two books. The first is Martha Stein, Lovers friends slaves, the nine male sexual types and their psycho-sexual transactions with call girls. Stein says she observed about 3,000 sex acts, perhaps exceeding Masters and Johnson's record. The second is Alexa Albert, Brothel, the Mustant Ranch and its women.

I put a lot of credence in women who have spend a whole lot of time with sex workers, talking with them.

Lift Her Up.

Stein book out of print. I ordered Albert book on Amazon.

Thanks for the references.

[Grimmy23]

My first MP visit was 1971. The Immigration Reform Act of 1965 went into effect in 1968. MP girls were all White then. I didn't encounter an Asian until 1985. Then they flooded the market with their numbers and their usually superior service, at least in my opinion. This held donation levels down. The first time I was offered FS was in 1974, by a White girl, and I was quoted. 4. Years later I remember being quoted $ by a White. But in 1985 the Asian girls did FS for. 4 at least in SoCal, even though the CPI more than doubled from 1974 to 1985. I've been with Asians ever since, maybe an occasional Latina.

And yes, in my earlier post I forgot to mention the telephone directories too, what a trip those were.

Lift Her UP.

In the early 90's I picked up one of the infamous newspapers. I think it was LA X-Press. One of the classifieds in the back said something like "I'm a real college girl, not a pro. I give a sensual full body rub at my place nude. " They were operating out of large mansion in Bel Air. I made an appointment and was greeted by an absolutely gorgeous white 20-something year old. She literally could have just walked off the campus of UCLA. I seriously was interested in dating her as I was about 22 or 23 at the time. Don't think I didn't try. LOL. Anyway, the service wasn't anything spectacular by today's standards, but she did get completely naked and rub her oiled up tits all over my body. I was allowed to touch her everywhere except between her legs, and she finished me with a HJ. I saw her multiple times hoping to get more and even trying (unsuccessfully) to get a real date with her. She was without a doubt the most gorgeous provider I've ever been with. It was early in my mongering days and I didn't even realize you could get a BJ or even FS for about the same amount of money a lot closer to home. Her HJ wasn't even that good. As a matter of fact on my first visit I had to show her how to finish me off. But for some strange reason, probably a combo of looks and personality, she remains one of my ATFs to this day. I really wish places like that existed today, where you could get a young whire homegrown girl next door type like that who gets naked and gives a HJ or BJ. I don't need FS or even want it from most providers.

[James D 2004]

In the early 90's, there was a Korean AMP on Baker Street in Newport or CM. I went there at midday. My masseuse was a 20-something, slightly overweight Korean angel. While I was supine on the table with my face in the hole, I felt this delightful sensation of her tongue flicking my anus. Wow, did that feel heavenly? My introduction to rimming.

Oh yes, the OC register classified at the turn of the century. I got some no-touch dancers but once I got lucky. The pretty teen white girl was fresh off the bus. She upsell me FS but they weren't allowed to take condoms into the room. So we did it bare.

Once I got a 19-year-old dancer with Indian ancestry (India in South Asia). I thought she was another no-touch dancer. As usual, I had to sit safely with my back on the bed headboard. Her face was average and she had the body of an average 19-year-old, eye candy enough. In the middle of her naked dance, she got on all fours with her butt facing me. Then she started reversing slowly towards me. When her asshole was about a foot from my face, I closed my eyes in horror as I was never that close to anyone's asshole. I opened my eyes when her full ass was on my face.

For the first time, I looked at someone's asshole right before my eyes. It was beautiful. For one, the starfish was so tight that nothing could have come out. That's better than pussy in a way. It doesn't smell. And I couldn't resist licking it while shivering a bit because of the strange emotion. From then on, that is another thing I'm looking for. That also explains my pedo tendency. Delicate teen girls are more likely to have a tight good looking asshole. I won't go there unless they are really HYA Koreans, most not. So I am a loyal patron of the Enclave (RIP) crew.

[BSouthgate]

Yup, I was a regular ay many of them by SCP!

There was one on 2nd floor by the Mcdonalds by the old Sports Authority and one down the street in the Office building just next to the 73 Fwy. All we're korean and always bare love making man those we're the days.

Plus, all the one by John Wayne Airport on Birch and Dove St.

Yes, that was where that tender Korean princess introduced me to the joys of rimming.

[HapaBoy86]

There was a period in the late 90's where there were some really nice massage parlors in the Costa Mesa / South Coast Plaza area. !

Yup, I was a regular ay many of them by SCP!

There was one on 2nd floor by the Mcdonalds by the old Sports Authority and one down the street in the Office building just next to the 73 Fwy. All we're korean and always bare love making man those we're the days.

Plus, all the one by John Wayne Airport on Birch and Dove St.