"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[FeelGoodMd]

I just had this text conversation with an 18 year old, tall, white, sultry Pot I met through SA....

This morning, she texts back to say... she still wanted to get together today. We agree on a meeting place. Then the convo goes off the rails:

Pot: How much should I expect in return?

Me: I don't want to discuss that in advance. It seems so. Transactional.

Me: It's safe to assume I'll give you more after spending a couple hours together in private than I did after having coffee.

Pot: Well, my last arrangement we would do whatever we were both comfortable with for 500/ h. Anything more that he wants he pays significantly more for.

Me: That's not going to work for me. I'm sorry. My gift is typically (depending on how well the visit goes.

Pot: Those are literal hooker rates.

Me: (name). Sugar babies don't have "rates. " A sugar baby accept gifts from their Daddy....

Pot: I've come to expect gifts as very very generous.

Me: I hope you will take a serious look at whether you want to be a Sugar Baby or an escort. What you're doing right now sounds a lot more like the latter.

That was that. No reply from her after that (shockingly)....

Fortunately, I started seeing a new SB last week (on her 20th birthday) who is almost a carbon copy of that Pot (a little shorter, a couple years older, and light-skinned AA), and I texted her after that exchange and said I had a cancellation in my schedule and I am available this afternoon. She immediately replied with "when and where. " Last week she never asked about money in advance, was genuinely enthusiastic about the sex, seemed disappointed when she had to leave after 3 hours to get to a birthday party her sorority was throwing for her, and texted me multiple thank you's when she discovered how much I had given her ($ in an outside pocket of her purse, and. 5 in a be'day card so she knew they were "separate" gifts). Her only complaint, if you could call it that, was that I was too gentle and she wanted me to leave "marks" next time. Later that night she texted a picture of my card sitting in a prominent place on her dorm room desk (thankfully I have generic handwriting and I didn't sign it. Even with the fake name I gave her).

I have a feeling I am going to enjoy today much better with my new SB than I would have with that Pot.

I'm happy to say I did have a FANTASTIC time with my new sorority girl SB last week, who likes to take it as rough as I like to give it out. We spent three hours together, and texted / emailed back and forth throughout the long weekend. We're planning to meet again at the end of the is week before she goes out of town.

The real follow-up, however, is a text I got this morning from the 18 year old who wanted $$ / hour. The conversation started like this (after not hearing from her for 6 days):

Pot: Sorry if we got off on the wrong foot. I would like a mutually beneficial relationship with you.

Me: Thank you for the text, K* I hadn't expected to hear from you again. I'd like the same thing.

Me: Can you accept the level of help I'm able to provide?

Pot: Yes. Would like to meet up again soon. Are you free today?

I had completely written her off, but now I'm going to be banging her in less than an hour and for only $. 5 Patience is the name of the sugar game.

[Beachesnole02]

Thanks for the input.

Was drinking beer with a few golf cart girls last month as they finished their shift, and one of them mentioned about $180 dollar day!

I am sure that I am completely out of touch these days with the trials and tribulations of 20 year olds. But if they are in college they usually get assistance from their parents and loans, is they supplement that with a part time job clearing $300 a week they can easily have party money.

Sounds like my ex wife. She worked with other doctors, socialized at the country club and could not understand why a lot of people had a problem paying their hospital bills. My line of work gives me access to the day to day finances of a broad range of people, and your average 20 year old does not have many good paying jobs in the service industry available to them.

Yes, some, not all, of the women working the beer carts at the high end clubs near the beach are making a buck fifty a day "in season". But I have worked with hot looking chicks working lessor clubs that make 0 nly 50 a day in tips and that is only for 4-5 months a year. The bartenders at the local Bonefish Grill make 70 k a year, the hostess makes minimum wage, and the good waitresses are making just enough to afford a studio apartment if they scrimp. The bartender at my favorite local whole had to get a 2nd job because she only made 30 a year because the old guys are stingy tippers. For every 40 jobs at a busy high end restaurant their are 400 at Dennys, selling dresses at the surf shop, slinging coffee at starbucks, and those girls are VERY happy with an extra 100 tax free a week. All of my babes work a real job.

God Bless capitalism. It gives us a land of opportunity.

So my 5th of July special surprised me. She had been complaining for weeks about her husband pestering her for anal sex and she kept telling him no because it hurt. Guess who whips out the lube and says she wants my cum in her a#.

[JZLizard]

I actually just stumbled across that website the other day. Haven't had the time to browse it too much, but I did run across a few gals that I had heard of from the Charlotte area. Its a bit scary to think of all the damage someone could do to an individual simply because they got their panties in a wad over something.

Yeah, I think if the "victim" reports it to the admin of dirty.com they will take it down unless the author can prove it's true, but in theory once something is on the net, it can be archived and searchable forever. This past season one of my SBs said that they talk among themselves and "review" their SDs but she wouldn't say where. I did see on Nightline or one of those shows a story about a site that is strictly for females to bag on guys (forgot the site name) but it wasn't geared toward SDs, it was more designed to warn girls about serial daters and pricks from Facebook etc. But this aspect of our hobby does bother me.

[FredMoore]

Thanks for the input.

I do live in a large metro area in the Midwest. I remember 20 years ago my girlfriend worked for a popular restaurant, and she leave work with 150-200 dollars on Thursday, Friday, Saturday. Now granted that 200 dollars went a long way back then when 1 bedroom rents with $700 dollar range and no one had cell phone.

Was drinking beer with a few golf cart girls last month as they finished their shift, and one of them mentioned about $180 dollar day!

I am sure that I am completely out of touch these days with the trials and tribulations of 20 year olds. But if they are in college they usually get assistance from their parents and loans, is they supplement that with a part time job clearing $300 a week they can easily have party money.

Sure the girls want to maximize their ROI, but here is a little rationale. What makes more sense? $150 / night slinging drinks for 8 hours vs Lying on her back (or whatever) with a sex machine pounding her for an hour bringing her to multiple Os? No contest. Also, they frequently get treated to a nice dinner and drinks and get to squire a rich stud around in front of their buds. They get the $$ ,sexual satisfaction, and an ego boost without breaking a sweat. Well, maybe some sweating involved.

[Dirty Dingus]

I don't know if you guys have seen the website thedirty.com, but it makes a very good case for never letting your SBs know your last name, and being careful about who you give photos to.

There are other similar revenge websites but this one I had not come across this one before until I googled someone's name and an article about her on this site was at the top of the list. LOL. It's quite funny to look read the submissions in your local city (click on dirty world at the top). Be entertained by it but be careful not to end up being one of the sources of entertainment.

Always stay as anonymous as possible, and in the event of a dispute / SB gone sideways, try to diffuse the situation, take the high road and then get the hell out of there, trying to exit on a positive note.

I actually just stumbled across that website the other day. Haven't had the time to browse it too much, but I did run across a few gals that I had heard of from the Charlotte area. Its a bit scary to think of all the damage someone could do to an individual simply because they got their panties in a wad over something.

[Latex]

As at least one other person has pointed out, clearing $$ per night for service jobs is pretty much the exception, not the rule. Keeping in mind the limitations of anecdotal evidence, my SB basically clears about a little over half a $ per day. That's after a couple of years in one of the more labor-friendly food chains. As low-paying as it is, she considers herself lucky to have the job, as most of the alternatives in the service / unskilled labor market pay less.

This isn't a big city area, but it's only about 90 minutes to the nearest one, and the cost of living here isn't outrageous but nor is it cheap. She's going to school, with zero assistance from her parents, and there's no way she could pull that off on just her regular job.

We started out at $$/ visit, but have since moved on to a less rigid arrangement. Earning about 3 x of a day at her regular job in exchange for 4-6 hours of naked fun is a good deal. Even if she weren't smitten with me and having the best sex of her life, those financials are quite compelling.

Thanks for the input.

I do live in a large metro area in the Midwest. I remember 20 years ago my girlfriend worked for a popular restaurant, and she leave work with 150-200 dollars on Thursday, Friday, Saturday. Now granted that 200 dollars went a long way back then when 1 bedroom rents with $700 dollar range and no one had cell phone.

Was drinking beer with a few golf cart girls last month as they finished their shift, and one of them mentioned about $180 dollar day!

I am sure that I am completely out of touch these days with the trials and tribulations of 20 year olds. But if they are in college they usually get assistance from their parents and loans, is they supplement that with a part time job clearing $300 a week they can easily have party money.

[FyrGuy33]

I have ran upon a 28 year old single mom in Roanoke Va and need some advice. She is staying in a motel with her 2 children and needs financial help. She's telling me she has no money and has to check out today. But then comes back and states she needs $300 by Wednesday. I was going to meet her yesterday for lunch but I was sick and could not make it. She wanted a $100 bucks just to meet and I got her down to $75. Does this sound like a scam? Any advice is much appreciated.

Welcome to the forum. This is a great forum to sharpen up on your SB skills. We were all new to this at one time and have learned a few things the hard way. I NEVER pay them for a M&G. I will pay the date expenses, as in dinner or what ever, but not extra to sit and talk. I can stay home with the wife for that. Under no circumstances does anyone get anything until we go to the FC. And, they get nothing until we are done. More than once I have started to get dressed again when they demand to be paid up front. That is an Escort rule, not a SB rule. And since I am paying them, I play by MY rule. Funny how when they realize you are ready to end it how they change their mind.

As has been advised, run from this one. She will only drain your funds and leave you disappointed. There are much better finds out there for you.

[JZLizard]

A very nice stripper I know had some dirt put up there about her just because her x found out she slept around and did a couple of pornos. Thank god I am not married and my job is so underground even the people I work with have never met me.

My work is fairly isolated from any real damage from something like that, but if searching on my name ever turned up a revenge page like that, I'd still do whatever was in my power to get it down even if I didn't have an SO, first and foremost just because I'm private in that way and would not be able to take something like that sitting down. Plus, I may not be in my current job forever and I don't like career options being potentially hindered by something like that. Also don't like the idea that friends and family could see that aspect of my personal life -- some young bimbo talking shit about me online.

[JZLizard]

I just had an average MILF say I could meet her for a $$ dinner, LOL. For $$ I can get 80% of 9+ non white girls and half of the 7+ white ones. I swear I can get 10 18-22 young hotties for a $ before I can get an average MILF. Must be L. A. The cost of living here is high.

Also never ever meet any girl that hasnt sent you a clear, standing straight (not bent forward) pic. No matter how pretty they look.

I usually try to get several pics. If her profile photo doesn't give me enough info, I will ask for more. Once you have several you can look for any weird patterns, like all of the photos are from one angle or none of them show her butt, etc. I've been fortunate that none of my SB M&Gs have been disappointing -- in fact I think all of them turned out as good or better than pics (mostly better). But, I learned a lot about what to look for in pic swapping when civy dating. One thing for sure, if she only sends selfies she took in a car, definitely demand to see more because she could have a decent face yet be a moose from the waist down.

[HollywoodGuy]

I don't know if you guys have seen the website thedirty.com, but it makes a very good case for never letting your SBs know your last name, and being careful about who you give photos to.

There are other similar revenge websites but this one I had not come across this one before until I googled someone's name and an article about her on this site was at the top of the list. LOL. It's quite funny to look read the submissions in your local city (click on dirty world at the top). Be entertained by it but be careful not to end up being one of the sources of entertainment.

Always stay as anonymous as possible, and in the event of a dispute / SB gone sideways, try to diffuse the situation, take the high road and then get the hell out of there, trying to exit on a positive note.

A very nice stripper I know had some dirt put up there about her just because her x found out she slept around and did a couple of pornos. Thank god I am not married and my job is so underground even the people I work with have never met me.

[HollywoodGuy]

Paying just to meet is always a scam. Always pay at the end of service and commensurate with how satisfied you are. Tell her you can get conversation for free anywhere but the pussy has value and you're willing to pay for it (just not always in quite such direct terms).

I just had an average MILF say I could meet her for a $$ dinner, LOL. For $$ I can get 80% of 9+ non white girls and half of the 7+ white ones. I swear I can get 10 18-22 young hotties for a $ before I can get an average MILF. Must be L. A. The cost of living here is high.

Also never ever meet any girl that hasnt sent you a clear, standing straight (not bent forward) pic. No matter how pretty they look.

[HollywoodGuy]

The SB in question, without doubt has / had true feelings. Problem is her age being so young, she still has not maneuvered through cycles of what it takes to make a man feel secure with her. She likes to party, go out with friends, flirt and all that comes with being a typical 21 yo girl. However, she also wants true love, stability and all that comes with that. I know her feelings are genuine, but so is her age and what she is not ready to overcome. I met her entire family for Pete's sake. Even her dad who is not the nicest of characters. Somehow they all approved of me. She is from a small town in rural Western Virginia and has not seen much outside her small town. Judging her at a raw level, she is sweet natured, loving, and naive. She claims to have had 9 sexual partners her entire life. Six boyfriends and three SD's date type things including me. So yeah, she slept with two other men for $. So having been around this hobby and other related hobbies for a bit, once a girl gets a taste for quick easy money like that, it's all but impossible for her to shake it, until she is put through the ringer of reality and usually used up by then.

Bottom line, she is not relationship material, mostly due to her age. So I'm dumping her ass and going back to regular Sugar bowl experiences. Life is short, I want more experiences before the ole general will no longer rise to the occasion. Funny thing is, once you've been with a 21 year old girl for a while in the real relationship type scenario, the novelty wears off and her being so young and pretty fades. She just becomes another woman to you. Sometimes I am mesmerized by her face and youthful beauty. She is a pretty girl, but her lying, immature ways, are not something I even remotely care to deal with in my mid-40's.

So back in the bowl I go. Hopefully the fallout with her with no go nuclear. .

Naive?. LOL.

[JZLizard]

I don't know if you guys have seen the website thedirty.com, but it makes a very good case for never letting your SBs know your last name, and being careful about who you give photos to.

There are other similar revenge websites but this one I had not come across this one before until I googled someone's name and an article about her on this site was at the top of the list. LOL. It's quite funny to look read the submissions in your local city (click on dirty world at the top). Be entertained by it but be careful not to end up being one of the sources of entertainment.

Always stay as anonymous as possible, and in the event of a dispute / SB gone sideways, try to diffuse the situation, take the high road and then get the hell out of there, trying to exit on a positive note.

[FotoGuy1970]

I have ran upon a 28 year old single mom in Roanoke Va and need some advice. She is staying in a motel with her 2 children and needs financial help. She's telling me she has no money and has to check out today. But then comes back and states she needs $300 by Wednesday. I was going to meet her yesterday for lunch but I was sick and could not make it. She wanted a $100 bucks just to meet and I got her down to $75. Does this sound like a scam? Any advice is much appreciated.

When I was first starting out in the sugar bowl and I was still naive about meeting POTs, I would pay to meet. I don't do that any more. I will treat them to whatever it is we do on the M&G (dinner, drinks, coffee, whatever) and if they travel a fair distance to see me I will even offer to give them gas money. But I have stopped giving a POT money just to meet with me. I know some brothers have occasionally given a gift card or something as a token of appreciation on a M&G and I think in some cases that can be a good idea, especially if the arrangement is all but a sure thing following a M&G. But beware of POTs saying they are all for an arrangement following a M&G, then vanishing like they were a super ninja. I myself had that happen a handful of times in the span of a few months. So then you've wasted your time and your money on someone you'll never see again.

In your particular case, she's a definite Nando1, as others have noted. Drop her and move on, this one will very likely take your money and run.

[JZLizard]

I have ran upon a 28 year old single mom in Roanoke Va and need some advice. She is staying in a motel with her 2 children and needs financial help. She's telling me she has no money and has to check out today. But then comes back and states she needs $300 by Wednesday. I was going to meet her yesterday for lunch but I was sick and could not make it. She wanted a $100 bucks just to meet and I got her down to $75. Does this sound like a scam? Any advice is much appreciated.

Paying just to meet is always a scam. Always pay at the end of service and commensurate with how satisfied you are. Tell her you can get conversation for free anywhere but the pussy has value and you're willing to pay for it (just not always in quite such direct terms).