"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[TomDickNHarry]

I always do M&G's but similar philosophy on dinner for several reasons. There's the expense, hate spending 100 on dinner and over an hour with them when I often realize as soon as I sit down I'm not interested, and it's true some of them are torture to talk to so you have to make small talk longer. Many I've met are fun to talk to and interesting, especially when I'm in pursuit, but you never know for sure until you get there. Drinks, coffee, maybe an appetizer at a casual cafe, that's the way to do this. Keep the commitment of both time and money minimal upfront, you can always ramp it up.

I never take an SB to dinner, at most coffee. These girls are brain dead, I can't pretend to be interested in listening to them for more then about 10 minutes. And I always make sure to mention they should leave an hour or two afterward in case we hit it off and want to start an arrangement.

If these girls are going to f*ck, they go into it intending to on the first date. The only reason to do a platonic meet is so they can get comfortable that you're not an ax murderer. But I always push to meet at the hotel first and I'm usually successful.

Don't buy into the SeekingArrangment BS about platonic dates and commitment you need to treat these girls like h**kers. That's what they are, they just don't want to admit it. If there wasn't a stigma around sex for money, every one of these girls would be on eros.

[TomDickNHarry]

If she was hot and you liked her the way I would've played it is either by text, or in person at next meet (as long as you hadn't promised a 100 gift for that meet too) is to say how much you enjoyed your meeting and totally understand she wants to take it slow and are willing to do that. And whenever she's ready, then you can financially assist her. You make clear that sugar is for intimacy. Do it nicely and make clear that you're willing to be patient, but very clearly implied you just won't pay her social meets.

I'm not sure it would've worked with her b / c to some extent you spoiled her by offering such a large date incentive, that is unless you were planning to give 4 or 5 for a trip to the FC. But if you target 2 to 3 as I do, you basically gave her half to let you buy her a meal. In her head she's got to be thinking finding guys to do that over and over is where it's at, and even if she does FC she probably thinks she should get 5 x that for it, and out of my range.

Everyone's different obviously, personally I don't mind investing time to get them to the FC, I just don't invest money mostly b / c I don't think giving them money for nothing works and is actually counterproductive to getting them to the FC. If they truly want to get comfortable with me though, I'm willing to see them repeatedly socially b / c a 19 yo hottie "9" or "10" is far more exciting to me to get to the FC than some 28 yo "5 or "6. " And if they do dates for no money, then they are sincere and actually think they will eventually FC, and you have that carrot dangling out there of an allowance for FC when she's ready. In my experience, about 75% of the time they get there w / in 2 or 3 meets. The cost is my time and some drinks, coffees, appetizers, etc.

If you do decide to go this route again, the one thing I'd do is offer a much smaller M&G amount. In no case would I ever go above $50, even that's like $25 an hour for feeding them dinner. I get plenty of M&G's and I never offer anything other than gas if they have a drive (and sure as hell not sent in advance). Often even when they ask for money for a M&G they agree to meet without it after I explain my time is valuable too and that I don't get anything out of this. Those are the girls who intend to FC and make money that way. Now in a couple of cases I have done a M&G incentive where I was really interested, but even they immediately agreed to $40 or $50 after asking for much more, and I made clear that paying for that was a one time thing only to see if there was mutual interest in doing more. Anyone who doesn't agree to that amount should be an immediate red flag that they are just professional platonic daters who string guys along thinking they will eventually FC. And yes, that's a thing. At least they if they agree to $40 or $50, then my normal donation amount is 5 x which is plenty of assistance.

On that subject I took a 19 yr old hottie to dinner this weekend and gifted her 100 afterwards as promisedbut got no action (didn't expect it) or even any affection. She wants to take it slowly and let the arrangement develop! I said no thanks by text the next day in a nice way and blocked her mobile #. I was a perfect gentleman, took her to a fancy restaurant and I drove her there in an expensive car etc. Wanted to test the waters with that kind of date but have decided it's not for me. Better to just lock down a not so hot not so young one and go with it.

[DWinthrop]

On that subject I took a 19 yr old hottie to dinner this weekend and gifted her 100 afterwards as promisedbut got no action (didn't expect it) or even any affection. She wants to take it slowly and let the arrangement develop! I said no thanks by text the next day in a nice way and blocked her mobile #. I was a perfect gentleman, took her to a fancy restaurant and I drove her there in an expensive car etc. Wanted to test the waters with that kind of date but have decided it's not for me. Better to just lock down a not so hot not so young one and go with it.

I never take an SB to dinner, at most coffee. These girls are brain dead, I can't pretend to be interested in listening to them for more then about 10 minutes. And I always make sure to mention they should leave an hour or two afterward in case we hit it off and want to start an arrangement.

If these girls are going to f*ck, they go into it intending to on the first date. The only reason to do a platonic meet is so they can get comfortable that you're not an ax murderer. But I always push to meet at the hotel first and I'm usually successful.

Don't buy into the SeekingArrangment BS about platonic dates and commitment you need to treat these girls like h**kers. That's what they are, they just don't want to admit it. If there wasn't a stigma around sex for money, every one of these girls would be on eros.

[ErkTheOne]

On that subject I took a 19 yr old hottie to dinner this weekend and gifted her 100 afterwards as promisedbut got no action (didn't expect it) or even any affection. She wants to take it slowly and let the arrangement develop! I said no thanks by text the next day in a nice way and blocked her mobile #. I was a perfect gentleman, took her to a fancy restaurant and I drove her there in an expensive car etc. Wanted to test the waters with that kind of date but have decided it's not for me. Better to just lock down a not so hot not so young one and go with it.

Even better to lock down the dinner / M&G with the 19 yr old hottie, WITHOUT promising the 100 or any gift. Once you have her at the M&G, you're in much better position to get her to the next step, whether it's that same night or on the next date. And in especially good position to do so because you haven't invested anything yet, so she knows she needs to take that step in order to get that gift. And at least then, worst case scenario, if she says she wants to take things slow and you decide you don't want to go that route, then you haven't really lost anything.

[ThunderStick46]

Once they know you are willing to pay upfront, they can string you along. Same as paying a tiny little bill because you are such a nice guy. No money until the panties hit the floor. I tell those that insist to try their luck on her WYP and I move on.

On that subject I took a 19 yr old hottie to dinner this weekend and gifted her 100 afterwards as promisedbut got no action (didn't expect it) or even any affection. She wants to take it slowly and let the arrangement develop! I said no thanks by text the next day in a nice way and blocked her mobile #. I was a perfect gentleman, took her to a fancy restaurant and I drove her there in an expensive car etc. Wanted to test the waters with that kind of date but have decided it's not for me. Better to just lock down a not so hot not so young one and go with it.

[JustLonely]

Avoid this one in RVA as she will blow up your phone with tales of woe and wanting money but not in exchange for sex.

https://www.seeking.com/member/00bee...4-bc39546b09cf

[EasyeOne]

https://www.seeking.com/member/4a4a6...f-c38b58f62005

Anyone have any info on her? We're messaging but she says she stays with her bf so I'm partially inclined to avoid just because of the potential drama.

Been talking to her but only wants casual dates, platonic relationship to start until comfortable due to bf. Moving on.

[RVASpider]

The number of Alpha Phi girls I've encountered on SA could fill a thumb drive. HOw many of them are actually DTF without a paid M&G. Probably closer to the population that can fit in a phone booth.

That's what I've figured too. I found one a few months ago who is not on the site anymore because she found a boyfriend. Seems like the hot ones want money for pics or platonic meetings.

[PeteMc]

In a drawer in my work office is an envelope that contains lotsa cash, prepaid / gift cards, an encrypted jump drive, my burner, some safes and lube, etc. Pretty obvious what that's for. No worries on anything electronic.

Believe it or not, the lube purpose isn't obvious at all to me. I always have some with me, but it could be used for anal, Intro to Anal 101 (finger training), girls that want to get a little messy and get a thigh fucking from behind, tit fuck etc. I've had some that demanded condoms and just weren't skilled orally, and I used the lube to jerk myself off and paste the face.

One might think that with the occasional flaking where the girl just doesn't show up or whatever, the lube would come in handy for masturbatory purposes. I know that was the case when I was younger and had near misses, but it's never the case now. I've now been spoiled by the ease of internet hookups. I'm surprised I can still get hard to a computer screen at all. Something about the feel and aroma of real pussy is what sets me off.

[WaterBoi]

https://www.seeking.com/member/4a4a6...f-c38b58f62005

Anyone have any info on her? We're messaging but she says she stays with her bf so I'm partially inclined to avoid just because of the potential drama.

[JustLonely]

Hello,

Got a couple of responses that are asking for $100 allowance for M&G. Some people are for it and some against.

What is the latest opinion?

Some intimacy allowed. Assuming kissing, caressing etc.

Once they know you are willing to pay upfront, they can string you along. Same as paying a tiny little bill because you are such a nice guy. No money until the panties hit the floor. I tell those that insist to try their luck on her WYP and I move on.

[WaterBoi]

Hello,

Got a couple of responses that are asking for $100 allowance for M&G. Some people are for it and some against.

What is the latest opinion?

Some intimacy allowed. Assuming kissing, caressing etc.

I mostly agree with DogBert on this. $100 for meet and greet is a bit much for me.

Nothing until FC is safer. However, if you can afford losing $100 then go for it. Everyone's budget is different here and to some people $100 is nothing. So, if you think the reward is worth it and that there's a good chance FC is on the table, maybe you take that risk? You need to just go into it with the mindset that you may be paying $100 for a boring 10 minute conversation.

[PeteMc]

I think I am with the vast majority here and say absolutely no sugar until action. There are girls on SA that never go to the FC with anyone, and never intend to. If they are hot, they could schedule several meet and greets a day and make a pretty good living without putting out. Don't encourage them. In the long run, you will save yourself a lot of time, and money, by immediately blocking them when they ask for this and just going on the next one. It's like they say in the pick-up artist community, you need to have an abundance mentality and not get fixated on any one girl.

Well said! When I got in the habit of blocking the obvious time wasters, I was surprised how the time saved benefited me by focusing on finding the next girl. There are girls coming and going all the time in most cities, some of them don't want their profile available for long so they go online for just a few hours until they have a date, and they hide their profile again until either the arrangement with that SD is over (or if the M&G didn't work out they'll be back). They aren't necessary "new" girls all the time, but they are the ones that aren't fucking a half dozen SDs at once, which are the best kind.

[PeteMc]

Hello,
Got a couple of responses that are asking for $100 allowance for M&G. Some people are for it and some against.
What is the latest opinion?
Some intimacy allowed. Assuming kissing, caressing etc.

I've never payed for platonic meets unless they incurred a transportation cost (like a $15 each way Uber ride, train / bus, brought their car more than 30 minutes etc). I do always buy them whatever food / drink they might want within reason at the meeting location regardless of whether we see each other again. I actually don't do platonic meets anymore (not intentionally, at least) because unless they are expecting to be paid to have lunch or whatever, there is little incentive for them to show up at all. I have also had cases where aunt flo has been used as an excuse to keep the first date platonic, so I've been trying to get better about tactfully communicating my expectations from the first meet.

Just remember that if anyone is paying anything for platonic dates over and above transportation expenses + a courtesy lunch, you're really hurting your own cause. It's just like offering high allowances -- it just drives up market rates and expectations, and once a girl has been getting a high allowance or having her cake and eating it too, it's hard for her to return to the humble and appreciative SB she was when she first signed up for the site. Always be a stickler.

[DogBert77]

Hello,

Got a couple of responses that are asking for $100 allowance for M&G. Some people are for it and some against.

What is the latest opinion?

Some intimacy allowed. Assuming kissing, caressing etc.

I think I am with the vast majority here and say absolutely no sugar until action. There are girls on SA that never go to the FC with anyone, and never intend to. If they are hot, they could schedule several meet and greets a day and make a pretty good living without putting out. Don't encourage them. In the long run, you will save yourself a lot of time, and money, by immediately blocking them when they ask for this and just going on the next one. It's like they say in the pick-up artist community, you need to have an abundance mentality and not get fixated on any one girl.