"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[FotoGuy1970]

Hello my brothers!

I am glad to be once again among the land of the living. A quick scan of the clubhouse journal shows me many, many new names, a few old familiars, and plenty of exploits to catch up on. I will file a full report in the next few days or so, but suffice it to say that I have been dealing with health, marital and financial stresses, any one of which would have been enough to knock me out for good, but it is a testament to the power of the Bowl that I rallied, got my shit together, and am feeling optimistic about hearing the soft yet unmistakable sound of panties hitting the floor again soon!

For those of you new Brothers who don't know me, welcome and glad to meet you. Hopefully you have learned from the considerable collective wisdom that is contained in these pages, and are enjoying this most woderful and elevated of hobbies. Please keep in mind the injunction of our founder, Literal2, which is "do no harm. " These little fish are gentle creatures, if your are casting to the right ones, and should be treated as such. Banging a battle-weary war horse, no matter how much lipstick she has on, is nothing to brag about, in my opinion. For all my old friends, I hope you have saved me a spot at the table, and want to assure you that I am back from the dead, (almost literally), and am eager to read of your exploits. I have a few interesting anecdotes, but not much in the way of new exploits, except I'm pretty sure I'm a baby-daddy (how's that for a tease? More later).

Peace to you all.

Scott.

Good to have you back, Scott!

[JZLizard]

I have to say I disagree. I only consider girls that are with one guy at a time an SB. More than one they go to UTR status. Maybe being single and having some flexibility at work lets me dig deeper into what these girls are doing on their own time. If you see anyone more than once a week and for weeks or months at a time you are going to know what's going on. I have people doubt my ability to judge these situations correctly all the time. But I am usually pretty right on and don't get in denial. But of course I am always on the lookout and always investigating. Could I be fooled. Sure. But I really don't think I am and usually have no trouble getting the truth out of any girl as far as who and how many or is it really exclusive.

Keep in mind I'm not saying all women cheat and lie incessantly. I'm saying it's better to assume they do (especially in a game like the bowl), because it precludes any disappointment. There are honest women out there but they are outnumbered by the liars. This is what they do, and we can expect a much higher rate of dishonesty from SBs. Maybe you keep a closer eye on your girls. Hell, I know a guy who gives his girls free use of a car (that he's put a GPS tracking device on, which he can do legally since he owns the car). Me I don't have time to watch someone every moment like that.

There's an old saying that it only takes a few minutes to cheat. One of the old misconceptions is "they were only out of my sight for an hour or two". It happens all the time in that time frame. Women are absolute masters of deception -- they have tricks up their sleeves that testosterone prevents us from even being able to see. I don't know your girls so I'm not going to tell you they are lying, but I will tell you that seeing them once a week for any time frame is not going to guarantee their honesty (understood that maybe you're watching them in other ways).

Me personally I just know women too well. Also, being involved in technology and security, I know ways of keeping eyes on them most people don't. Yes some women can be trusted but they have to show me they are trust worthy first. In the mean time I don't hold their lies against them, I just don't expect any more from them than that and don't take it too seriously. What does it matter? I'm banging others too, I'm not going to be hypocritical about it because I don't want to answer to them about what I do anyway. Just have fun with it, unless it's a serious relationship or marriage, then watch them and test them before making the plunge.

[JZLizard]

A few days ago I met a potential SB who, during a couple days of emailing back and forth, stated many times that she was totally single, had not had sex for ages and was up for some FC fun. We met for lunch and decided we should take it to the next stage. Up in the hotel room we proceeded to act like animals in heat to the point where I flipped her over onto her stomach with the intent of taking her from behind. Much to my curiosity, there appeared to be bruises that matched the pattern of two hands on both cheeks of her ass. In fact, when I grabbed her cute butt cheeks with my hands it was like a perfect fit with the bruising. I also noticed what looked like a bite mark on her left shoulder near the back of her neck.

I was all in at that point and she, like so many other SBs I've met, told me she likes it rough and not to be afraid to bite her. WTF? How do I end up with these types? LOL Anyway after the fireworks had gone off for both of us we were laying there just sort of cooling off when I asked her casually if it had been as good as the last time she had fcked. With the most straight- poker tournament winning- face she told me the last time she had fckd was Christmas and that she felt like it was Christmas all over again. You know what? If I hadn't seen the bruises I would have believed her as well. At least I didn't drink the previous Christmas's eggnog! One and done.

LOL! I enjoyed this story, especially the handprint-shaped bruises.

[Dolato]

Hooking up is having sex. Some kind of sex. Hanging out can mean no sex. But some SB's as has been discussed here, don't just want to only hook up. If they can't hang out with you they don't want to have sex with you. I am the hangout type with some girls. But only want to hook up with others. So knowing what the possibilities are beyond that, is always helpful.

For me, hooking up has always meant having sex. Recently as I've been around more 18-23 year olds thanks to the bowl, I've heard from many girls in different areas refer to just making out as hooking up as well.

Just thought I'd share.

And I'm just catching up on the posts from the past week. To the post about finding new POTS through current / former SBs, that's tough to do but has been a great way to find a true fresh SB.

[HollywoodGuy]

My experience with women has been mostly that you have to assume they are fucking someone else unless they live with you and you really know where they are and what they are doing at all times. A true SB might have other SDs that she may or may not admit, or just banging dudes her age.

So I wouldn't say an SB is a UTR just because she has other SDs. I think what differentiates an SB from a UTR is how selective she is and whether money is her only selection criteria. Although I might say that if there is really such a thing as an exclusive UTR, it might be fair to say she is gravitating toward the behavior of a real SB just by the fact she is exclusive, because that means she has selectively chosen to fuck only one guy -- unless she has been a UTR escort at one point prior, I'd say she is more SB than UTR in that particular case.

In other words I think it's a safe assumption that even if you have an SB who says she's exclusive, she's fucking someone else whether it's an SD or just one of her boyfriends and just not telling you about it. Some women in the civy dating world are above that, but in general women lie so in order to prevent feeling like a chump it's safer to assume they will or do cheat.

It's fair play though, most of us are cheating too when we do this.

But I know. Individual semantics are what they are. I just like to categorize the girls and distinguish them clearly because to me it greatly defines their worth. I wouldn't want to gift a UTR girl at the same rate I would gift a true SB.

I have to say I disagree. I only consider girls that are with one guy at a time an SB. More than one they go to UTR status. Maybe being single and having some flexibility at work lets me dig deeper into what these girls are doing on their own time. If you see anyone more than once a week and for weeks or months at a time you are going to know what's going on. I have people doubt my ability to judge these situations correctly all the time. But I am usually pretty right on and don't get in denial. But of course I am always on the lookout and always investigating. Could I be fooled. Sure. But I really don't think I am and usually have no trouble getting the truth out of any girl as far as who and how many or is it really exclusive.

[Rouleur]

A few days ago I met a potential SB who, during a couple days of emailing back and forth, stated many times that she was totally single, had not had sex for ages and was up for some FC fun. We met for lunch and decided we should take it to the next stage. Up in the hotel room we proceeded to act like animals in heat to the point where I flipped her over onto her stomach with the intent of taking her from behind. Much to my curiosity, there appeared to be bruises that matched the pattern of two hands on both cheeks of her ass. In fact, when I grabbed her cute butt cheeks with my hands it was like a perfect fit with the bruising. I also noticed what looked like a bite mark on her left shoulder near the back of her neck.

I was all in at that point and she, like so many other SBs I've met, told me she likes it rough and not to be afraid to bite her. WTF? How do I end up with these types? LOL Anyway after the fireworks had gone off for both of us we were laying there just sort of cooling off when I asked her casually if it had been as good as the last time she had fcked. With the most straight- poker tournament winning- face she told me the last time she had fckd was Christmas and that she felt like it was Christmas all over again. You know what? If I hadn't seen the bruises I would have believed her as well. At least I didn't drink the previous Christmas's eggnog! One and done.

[JZLizard]

Truth in advertising is good Curiosit! Many SBs we all see are UTR and we just don't know that they are seeing others. I would rather know and make the decision whether I am OK with that or not. I like a nice blend between naivte and skill. I like to feel like I can show my SB something that she has not had in the same way before.

My experience with women has been mostly that you have to assume they are fucking someone else unless they live with you and you really know where they are and what they are doing at all times. A true SB might have other SDs that she may or may not admit, or just banging dudes her age.

So I wouldn't say an SB is a UTR just because she has other SDs. I think what differentiates an SB from a UTR is how selective she is and whether money is her only selection criteria. Although I might say that if there is really such a thing as an exclusive UTR, it might be fair to say she is gravitating toward the behavior of a real SB just by the fact she is exclusive, because that means she has selectively chosen to fuck only one guy -- unless she has been a UTR escort at one point prior, I'd say she is more SB than UTR in that particular case.

In other words I think it's a safe assumption that even if you have an SB who says she's exclusive, she's fucking someone else whether it's an SD or just one of her boyfriends and just not telling you about it. Some women in the civy dating world are above that, but in general women lie so in order to prevent feeling like a chump it's safer to assume they will or do cheat.

It's fair play though, most of us are cheating too when we do this.

But I know. Individual semantics are what they are. I just like to categorize the girls and distinguish them clearly because to me it greatly defines their worth. I wouldn't want to gift a UTR girl at the same rate I would gift a true SB.

[JZLizard]

My initial observations is that the Sugar bowl: Consumes a considerable amount of time, lots of SBs having high expectations, the responses from UTR girls seem to be easier to get.

Considerable amount of time is right! That's the one part of it that I don't miss during my leaves of absence from the bowl. I usually aim for the true SBs and sidestep the UTRs as much as possible. As you said, they are harder, so that of course lowers the quantity, increases the amount of time required, and increases the risk of something else going sideways like the chemistry not being right.

This is why I don't even try to approach the SB's with a "how much per fuck?" game plan -- I try to remove the transactional aspect as much as possible. The problem is most of the true SBs would either not respond to a "how much" question or would quote ridiculous (500,1000, 1500 etc) per date expectations, so why bother. It's better to meet them and try to drum up the natural chemistry, throw a few drinks down their throat and try to get them motivated to get in bed thinking about the act rather than the payment. That way whatever I gift them at the end always ends up being well-received. I don't think I force myself to pay these girls what they would quote me if I asked.

On the other hand, if you want lots of girls with less hassle, honing skills identifying UTRs is probably the way to go. There are times when I wish I had a list of fallback options for the slow nights, but with the time window of my once-a-year SB season, I really only get one opportunity to present who I am and what I'm looking for to each girl.

[FredMoore]

Interesting to see this from the other side. I consider myself UTR and not SB. I have 1 that I see about 4 times a month for $$$ each time, regardless of whether it is an hour or 3 hours or overnight. BUT I also see other people here and there as well. Most of them repeats, but not what I would classify a "regular" thing. Personally, if I found another 2 regulars I'd not see anyone else.

Truth in advertising is good Curiosit! Many SBs we all see are UTR and we just don't know that they are seeing others. I would rather know and make the decision whether I am OK with that or not. I like a nice blend between naivte and skill. I like to feel like I can show my SB something that she has not had in the same way before.

[Latex]

Having fully explored the monger hobby for about 15 years, I quit about 10 years ago for various reasons. Recently I discovered the Sugar Bowl, and after spending about 10 hours reading this forum I decided to participate about 4 weeks ago.

My experience thus far:

I opened a account on SA, created a introductory email template and emailed about 50 SB based on location and recent profiles, and received about 6 responses and was able to schedule 2 M&Gs.

M&G 1: 30 years old MILF that is recently divorced and in my book a solid 8/8, she was very open about her life and told me that she had a SD for 4 months that recently ended. We mutually decided to meet again at a hotel in a few days. After the M&G we texted back and forth and she mentioned the financials, I asked her how the last arrangement worked. She informed me that she met about 4 times per month and financial assistance ranged around $$$ per meeting. We met at a hotel had a few drinks and fun for 3 hours, the total damage was about $$ including hotel drinks and M&G cost.

M&G 2: 26 year old college girl who also recently lost her SD. I rated her about 6/7 but her personality was not to my liking. A bit to hyper. She is looking for someone to pay her rent and expenses of $1200 per month. I politely ended the meeting and via email told her I had found someone already.

POT 1: Apparently she is new to SA, and wants to discuss my budget before we have a M&G. She claims to have multiple SD offers but all below her expectations. I respond with 1 K per month budget, haven't hear back yet.

My initial observations is that the Sugar bowl: Consumes a considerable amount of time, lots of SBs having high expectations, the responses from UTR girls seem to be easier to get.

I will post a list of questions and observations soon.

[FredMoore]

Now that I am restricted as to time and money I have gotten blunter and more creative.

My new SB #1 is Asian and very naive sexually. I rocked her world on the FC visit. I hit her with a low monthly allowance and she is OK with 4 + meets / month. So the key to securing a lower price is the emotional involvement. If you have an inexperienced girl and open her eyes (and vagina) to new wonders she will want to see you at almost any price. I am giving her an experience of a lifetime that she will have a hard time beating. In a way it will spoil her for a normal horny 20 something who busts a nutt in 4 strokes. But that is a value all of us give our young girls.

Pot # 2 is a 20 + yr old White 7/9/? . She needs money and when asked what her expectations are she said $ 3 to 500 . I countered $ and she agreed. So asking price doesn't always mean anything. I will have to get a Roach motel for the deed at another $50 ,but she looks delicious.

Pot #1 is super hot and ready to go to the FC and told me to give her whatever??

FB is back and will go to the FC for a quickie. But there is value in getting a nutt inside a slim tight baby. There is no emotional connection so she is just an UTR I guess.

[HollywoodGuy]

I have tried the SD thing over the years with very little success, but things may have taken a turn recently. I live in a college town (Richmond) and love college age girls but ever since I left the bar business getting college aged girls had been tough. Recently I decided to give SD4 M another try and sent out about 30 emails to girls within 10 miles of my zip code. Looking over the selection, I was very surprised at the number of Asian girls and really good looking white girls (8+ on the scale) in my area. Even more surprising was the 11 fast replies. I booked all 11 for M&Gs and 8 showed; I haven't even bothered to call the no-shows. 3 of the M&Gs turned into motorcycle rides and 1 stayed over. The sex was just Ok that evening but the morning session was a whole different thing. I'm 46 and she's 20. I think she tried to kill me. At this point she is the only one that I've come to a standing arrangement with; her need is very modest (300/ month) with 4 overnights a month and any extra dates include sex- lets call her Tall1. She's 5'11 slender w brown hair and grey / blue eyes. She looks very much like Pippa Middleton but taller. Two days later "The Short1" texted to see if I could take her to dinner; I said "yes, but I'm more horney than hungry, what do you think?" She replied with "I love to fuck after a few drinks and I wouldn't have called if I didn't know the deal". I LOVE broke college girls. She's 22,5'0 blonde w green eyes and built like a cheerleader. She's starting grad school this fall and looking for 1 or 2 SDs to make that easier. We didn't come to a deal but we stayed in a boutique hotel downtown and fucked like it was our job. It was an expensive evening between the room, dinner and many drinks but she was great fun. I have a date with "The Asian1" this weekend and she has already mentioned her friend (another Korean 18 yo) wanted to "hangout" too. God help me and pass the viagra.

This is how its done. Rack up those numbers. If you have the quantity some quality will be in there. And no one says you have to go on a bad date twice. Outside of sticking to whatever your demographic is, there is really now way to predict chemistry and performance. We all wish their performance was tied to their looks, it would make life a lot easier. The date I had monday looked a lot sexier to me after we did it than before.

[HollywoodGuy]

I think her suggesting this is a SB credit check. Just don't know if I want to pass.

Every girl has the bar set at some level. I would still try to see her but just redirect the M&G to a different venue. If you are that attracted to her.

[HollywoodGuy]

"Hook up" is pretty unambiguous, and I think "hang out" is pretty much the next step down on the euphemism scale for "these kids today!

Hooking up is having sex. Some kind of sex. Hanging out can mean no sex. But some SB's as has been discussed here, don't just want to only hook up. If they can't hang out with you they don't want to have sex with you. I am the hangout type with some girls. But only want to hook up with others. So knowing what the possibilities are beyond that, is always helpful.

[Tidad]

I have tried the SD thing over the years with very little success, but things may have taken a turn recently. I live in a college town (Richmond) and love college age girls but ever since I left the bar business getting college aged girls had been tough. Recently I decided to give SD4 M another try and sent out about 30 emails to girls within 10 miles of my zip code. Looking over the selection, I was very surprised at the number of Asian girls and really good looking white girls (8+ on the scale) in my area. Even more surprising was the 11 fast replies. I booked all 11 for M&Gs and 8 showed; I haven't even bothered to call the no-shows. 3 of the M&Gs turned into motorcycle rides and 1 stayed over. The sex was just Ok that evening but the morning session was a whole different thing. I'm 46 and she's 20. I think she tried to kill me. At this point she is the only one that I've come to a standing arrangement with; her need is very modest (300/ month) with 4 overnights a month and any extra dates include sex- lets call her Tall1. She's 5'11 slender w brown hair and grey / blue eyes. She looks very much like Pippa Middleton but taller. Two days later "The Short1" texted to see if I could take her to dinner; I said "yes, but I'm more horney than hungry, what do you think?" She replied with "I love to fuck after a few drinks and I wouldn't have called if I didn't know the deal". I LOVE broke college girls. She's 22,5'0 blonde w green eyes and built like a cheerleader. She's starting grad school this fall and looking for 1 or 2 SDs to make that easier. We didn't come to a deal but we stayed in a boutique hotel downtown and fucked like it was our job. It was an expensive evening between the room, dinner and many drinks but she was great fun. I have a date with "The Asian1" this weekend and she has already mentioned her friend (another Korean 18 yo) wanted to "hangout" too. God help me and pass the viagra.