"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[WoodSlinger]

Have to stop in and say thanks to the regulars that contribute here. I have been playing the sugar game for about a year and a half. I keep adjusting my strategies based on methods other posters have used with success. The knowledge that is shared here is priceless. In the past two months I have screened 50+ real email responses from M4W sections of Craigs List. I have had 4 meet and greets. Then finally I hit pay dirt this week, having spent 3 hours in a hotel with an absolutely stunning 21 yo, blonde, blue-eyed coed. Immediately following our first M&G. This was my first sugar experience since August of 2011. I do partake in well reviewed Back page girls, and have a few numbers of girls from the street that are good for a cheap quick fix.

However, I must admit that I am enamored at the idea of finding the true SB, of being her first SD. This for me is what makes the amount of work we must put in worthwhile. It's also the reason I am extremely picky of who I choose to play with. Keep up the good work guys.

WS

[JoesParty]

Well I haven't posted on this forum for a while but have been testing the waters off and on with SA over the past 8 months or so with some level of success. I have not yet found anything close enough to call my ATF and to convince me to be monogamous just yet, but have been with several SBs more than a few times and have to admit it is a fun and rewarding sport. Most of my contacts have been in the 19 to 26 yr old range and most have been fairly normal girls just looking for a little extra cash and a good time. But the sex has just been OK so far and nothing really good enough to post about.

One story worth sharing, however, it a young AA girl that I met almost 6 months ago now. She was just 18 then (19 now) and told me she was taking some college courses but I always thought that was a little suspicious. She never talked about school and never answered questions about her courses, always just changing the subject when I asked her about it. When we first met, she was very shy, but did not hesitate to agree to the FC on only the second date. We met off and on about every 1-2 weeks for a couple of months. At first she would allow almost anything but full penetration was almost impossible. I don't think she was a virgin, but she was certainly unexperienced and tight in every way imaginable. She gave a good BBBJ, enjoyed DATY, and really liked deep FK and making out. I was pretty smitten by her youth and innocence for the first several times that we met.

Of course, the newness of it all wore off pretty fast and after a couple of months, she was more and more obvious about just wanting some cash and ending the date as soon as possible. She finally rushed me through so fast one night that I just said F__k it and decided not to see her again. I have given in a couple of times since then, but the performance has been marginal at best and she even told me once that she "didn't suck dick anymore and really didn't like DATY anyway". I used her as only a backup for a few more months, but she continues to txt me off and on trying to continue the sugar as long as possible. She finally moved out of her mothers house to a place of her own, and each txt message is getting more and more desperate, even though its been several months now since we have seen each other. At this point, I'm pretty sure she is completely on her own. 19 years old, no means of support, and no school ambitions whatsoever. She texted me recently with this message:

"Hey- I got a new number I misss you so much lets meet up tomrrow and have fun for a couple of hours have sex eat me and ill suck your dick the whole me not liking it thing was a joke I love oral LOL but pllllleeeaassee ill even wear the pink thing you gave me. Please don't make me beg for the money I really need it right now it doesn't have to be a lot but you should help me because I'm asking and giving you something in return."

I'm running as fast as possible away from this desperate one. Too bad she went down hill so fast. She seemed like a keeper at one time.

Keep up all of the great posts. It's the first thing I read each morning.

I agree; keep this one out of your life. I know from experience that if you give in, they will try to squeeze every last penny out of you.

[Hsrams]

Well I haven't posted on this forum for a while but have been testing the waters off and on with SA over the past 8 months or so with some level of success. I have not yet found anything close enough to call my ATF and to convince me to be monogamous just yet, but have been with several SBs more than a few times and have to admit it is a fun and rewarding sport. Most of my contacts have been in the 19 to 26 yr old range and most have been fairly normal girls just looking for a little extra cash and a good time. But the sex has just been OK so far and nothing really good enough to post about.

One story worth sharing, however, it a young AA girl that I met almost 6 months ago now. She was just 18 then (19 now) and told me she was taking some college courses but I always thought that was a little suspicious. She never talked about school and never answered questions about her courses, always just changing the subject when I asked her about it. When we first met, she was very shy, but did not hesitate to agree to the FC on only the second date. We met off and on about every 1-2 weeks for a couple of months. At first she would allow almost anything but full penetration was almost impossible. I don't think she was a virgin, but she was certainly unexperienced and tight in every way imaginable. She gave a good BBBJ, enjoyed DATY, and really liked deep FK and making out. I was pretty smitten by her youth and innocence for the first several times that we met.

Of course, the newness of it all wore off pretty fast and after a couple of months, she was more and more obvious about just wanting some cash and ending the date as soon as possible. She finally rushed me through so fast one night that I just said F__k it and decided not to see her again. I have given in a couple of times since then, but the performance has been marginal at best and she even told me once that she "didn't suck dick anymore and really didn't like DATY anyway". I used her as only a backup for a few more months, but she continues to txt me off and on trying to continue the sugar as long as possible. She finally moved out of her mothers house to a place of her own, and each txt message is getting more and more desperate, even though its been several months now since we have seen each other. At this point, I'm pretty sure she is completely on her own. 19 years old, no means of support, and no school ambitions whatsoever. She texted me recently with this message:

"Hey- I got a new number I misss you so much lets meet up tomrrow and have fun for a couple of hours have sex eat me and ill suck your dick the whole me not liking it thing was a joke I love oral LOL but pllllleeeaassee ill even wear the pink thing you gave me. Please don't make me beg for the money I really need it right now it doesn't have to be a lot but you should help me because I'm asking and giving you something in return."

I'm running as fast as possible away from this desperate one. Too bad she went down hill so fast. She seemed like a keeper at one time.

Keep up all of the great posts. It's the first thing I read each morning.

[Dog Rice]

I got the same treatment today. Setup M&Gs w / 2 pots today. Confirming w / them (via text) several hours ago, and man just not responding. At the end, I texted them that I assume the meeting is cancelled unless I got a confirmation back. (of course, in a nicer wording). Both got cancelled. Is wearing me out a bit. I am slowing down. .

I'm just venting. I've set up initial M&Gs with two pots from the same town about an hour away for each of the past two weeks. The first was a no-show. The second has been communicating with me today, the day of our meeting, but only on a sporadic basis. We agreed to meet closer to me, so I'll show up at the appointed time, but I honestly have no idea if #2 will show either.

How hard is it, really, to respond in a timely manner to simple questions? To confirm our meeting place?

Perhaps I ask too much, but I hope not. If this one doesn't show, I'm writing off the entire town.

Vent over. We now return to our regularly-scheduled programming.

Edit to add: She just canceled. At least she did it before we were to meet, but at this point, I think it's best to focus my time on the more responsive babies.

[F Scott]

Now not everyone can or wants to roll like the Cmdr rolls. And it's all good. But if this is fly fishing please consider this one of my knot tying techniques that has worked for me.

SubCmdr out

Commander,

I Laughed Out Loud when I read this! Right on, my brother, and I will be sure to add it to my tackle box! Isn't this a great world we have chosen? Plus, I kinda love coral pink toenails myself.

Permission to leave the bridge,

Scott

[JoesParty]

I'm just venting. I've set up initial M&Gs with two pots from the same town about an hour away for each of the past two weeks. The first was a no-show. The second has been communicating with me today, the day of our meeting, but only on a sporadic basis. We agreed to meet closer to me, so I'll show up at the appointed time, but I honestly have no idea if #2 will show either.

How hard is it, really, to respond in a timely manner to simple questions? To confirm our meeting place?

Perhaps I ask too much, but I hope not. If this one doesn't show, I'm writing off the entire town.

Vent over. We now return to our regularly-scheduled programming.

Edit to add: She just canceled. At least she did it before we were to meet, but at this point, I think it's best to focus my time on the more responsive babies.

[Dog Rice]

John,

I can share some of my experience here. Before entering the Sugar Bowl this week and before escort world (previous and still overlapping w / my Sugar experience) , I have been hunting down freebies in various dating sites mainly during international travel. Occasionally, got some in US. Took a lot of time since is dating, but the return could be very high (True GFE and a lot of passion). Some of the oversea ones are truly freebies. (they setup hotel, trip, . Etc). .

Of course, the downside is the stress (such as: why can't we go to your home? Let's stay overnight somewhere? Asking me to go to fu. K at midnight? Calling me like crazy). I got some crazy gal calling me from oversea every 2 hours for several days. The stress was so high that I decided to get out of that world. Lying sucks. (learned my lesson). Now, I stick w / honesty.

After reading your story about some psycho, I will try to disclose as tiny info to SB (when I get one) as possible.

Timely post. I actually planned to talk about this very subject.

On my SA profile I clearly state I'm married and within the actual text of the profile I mention it again and that I'm looking for a "discreet" relationship. This definitely cuts down on the responses I receive. Some SBs have a problem with it morally or they're worried about the possible drama, which might come their way. Also I've noticed Asian SBs tend to be more reluctant to see married men than most in my experience.

Even still I generally believe in full disclosure when it comes to this. I need the SB on day one to understand the need for discretion. By mentioning these things in my profile, I generally get responses from SBs who are already prepared for a "Behind Closed Doors" arrangement. Also they would figure it out that I'm married / attached pretty soon when I never answer their voice calls, never invite them to my place, or by my very restrictive schedule. And believe it or not I don't like lying, so I try to keep it to a minimum. I think an arrangement is less stressful when both parties know exactly what they're dealing with.

That said, I am running an experiment on SD4Me. I'm saying I'm divorced on my profile to hopefully improve the initial response rate and to avoid the marriage predators. Then once I begin discussions, I mention I'm in the "process" of getting divorced so things aren't finalized and I still need to be somewhat discreet.

The downside to disclosing you're married is that it opens you up to blackmail by psychos. After my recent psycho experience earlier this month, I'm trying to figure out if there is a different approach to handling this. A way to explain the need for discretion while also avoiding SBs thinking they have the "I'm going to tell your wife!" card in their back pocket.

Tricky stuff.

[John G Smith]

What should I do in the future to avoid this type of misunderstanding? Obviously, close the deal! But beside that, I'm thinking I need to ensure the pot is aware I'm married and is ok with that. How do you guys handle this? Because it's never been a problem for me before.

Timely post. I actually planned to talk about this very subject.

On my SA profile I clearly state I'm married and within the actual text of the profile I mention it again and that I'm looking for a "discreet" relationship. This definitely cuts down on the responses I receive. Some SBs have a problem with it morally or they're worried about the possible drama, which might come their way. Also I've noticed Asian SBs tend to be more reluctant to see married men than most in my experience.

Even still I generally believe in full disclosure when it comes to this. I need the SB on day one to understand the need for discretion. By mentioning these things in my profile, I generally get responses from SBs who are already prepared for a "Behind Closed Doors" arrangement. Also they would figure it out that I'm married/attached pretty soon when I never answer their voice calls, never invite them to my place, or by my very restrictive schedule. And believe it or not I don't like lying, so I try to keep it to a minimum. I think an arrangement is less stressful when both parties know exactly what they're dealing with.

That said, I am running an experiment on SD4Me. I'm saying I'm divorced on my profile to hopefully improve the initial response rate and to avoid the marriage predators. Then once I begin discussions, I mention I'm in the "process" of getting divorced so things aren't finalized and I still need to be somewhat discreet.

The downside to disclosing you're married is that it opens you up to blackmail by psychos. After my recent psycho experience earlier this month, I'm trying to figure out if there is a different approach to handling this. A way to explain the need for discretion while also avoiding SBs thinking they have the "I'm going to tell your wife!" card in their back pocket.

Tricky stuff.

[SubCmdr]

Listen to your SB's gentlemen. They will tell you what is important to them. Then tie your cash to these important items. Anything that you provide that they are not getting else where is some thing that is going to be important to them and build the most valuable of intangibles 'goodwill'. Take my ATF for example. She initially meets me with peep toe shoes on. I have a mild foot / leg fetish so that works for me. During the action I'm taking her shoes off and she is self conscious about feet tell me she has not gotten her nails done and she prefers to have color on them. I'm moving up looking for the party favors at this point, but I make a mental note. The next morning I ask how much does it cost to get your nails done. She says: 'I don't know. ' That is a little white lie but I'll go with it. Here is $40 is that going to be enough? She give me a coy smile and nod. She then asks me what colors do I like. We talk about many different colors and finally tell her to pick something and surprise me. And I tell her to make sure to send me a picture.

By our next date I have not received a picture. What is the first thing she shows off when we see each other? That's right her nails. And she just had them done the afternoon of our date (so she says). The point of this story is just like all women in our lives it is the little things that count. A little 'goodwill' will get you deeper and longer in the pussy than a lot of money!

Now not everyone can or wants to roll like the Cmdr rolls. And it's all good. But if this is fly fishing please consider this one of my knot tying techniques that has worked for me.

SubCmdr out

[Hernando]

Scotty, the only gift you need to give her is your dick. Whan a girl wants to gift you enjoy the sentiment and don't feel like a reciprocation is necessary. It sounds like she will bring a little sex toy or something mutually enjoyable I would think.

I'm week 2 into SDFM cruising and have sent 20 ems and have only 2 responses so far. One is a 19 yr old college girl who is interested in chatting and the other is a 20 yr old. So wish me luck

As to the ongoing drama of my HCB, I am in the same boat as you Scotty. She has dropped me like a hot potato thanks to the W's slash and burn maneuver. She salted the earth and I don't think we will recover, but I'm still trying until the fat lady sings.

[SubCmdr]

Talking about sex before a M&G: Maybe I've been lucky, but I've never had to specify exactly what I want at future meetings. And maybe it's the hopeless romantic in me (ha!), but I don't like the idea of it. After a few months in the game, I can usually tell if the girl is in tune with the nature of the SB world by the end of the first M&G. Sometimes they make it obvious; I met a girl this week who "isn't into providing sexual favors for money." Good for you, honey, but I'm not in the habit of giving an allowance for "time and companionship." I guess what I'm saying is that, in my experience, the ones who are willing to explicitly talk about sex without ever meeting you are more likely to be pros, UTR pros, or semi-pros. Just saying

Joe,

Thank you for the perspective. Interestingly enough, I don't ever wind up meeting with the "explicit sex talkers" cause I scare them off with my requests for kinky sex or the fact that I'm not giving out much sugar. I never thought about that fact that I'm not really talking to "true SB's" (that is if there is such a thing) because I come from the lifestyle world. In the lifestyle world it's not unusual to discuss details of the encounter you are looking for before meeting. (I. E. Husband talking about his wife: "I'll be watching from the closet. She likes her hair pulled, ass slapping and to be verbally degraded. Condoms for penetration. But no ass fucking, she saves that for me.") My best experiences have been with SB's when our expectations have been stated very generally.

As for the married part, you are going to run into this anytime you treat your SB like a girlfriend. Honesty is the best policy. But we are human beings. Not everyone can fake it. Sometimes the experience is real! My current ATF knew I was married. But she is too. But separated and getting a divorce. (Actually I will probably end up in the same place). She told me early on that it was the first time she was involved with married man. Last night as I was walking her to her to her car in the mall parking lot while holding hands she says: "I got on the web site because I was ready for something different. I had no idea I would start a new relationship with someone I met there." Life happens!

Your pot baby is making the adjustment. Give her time. She will either get comfortable with the idea or she will not. Stay with it. There is nothing but upside for you!

SubCmdr out.

P. S. You lucky dog! I love Asian women. Never had one myself. I got a bad case of "pussy envy" just reading your story.

[HollywoodGuy]

The last girl I broke up with suddenly started deep throating when she saw the handwriting on the wall. Make up sex can be the best sex ever. It's good to break up with them once in a while or ignore them. They have to know they are not the only game in town. The # of babes is way way more than the # of daddies. Never forget that.

[HollywoodGuy]

Wow, there's a lot going on here the last day or so. Let me see what I can cover, and forgive me if I miss something. At the end, I'll add an anecdote of my own, along with my question of the day.

What should I do in the future to avoid this type of misunderstanding? Obviously, close the deal! But beside that, I'm thinking I need to ensure the pot is aware I'm married and is ok with that. How do you guys handle this? Because it's never been a problem for me before.

Honesty is the best policy. Really.

I am single but have about 6 regulars. And they all know about each other. Competition keeps them on their toes. I hate that phrase "spoiled rotten". Because if you do that its just like spoiled fruit. You don't want it anymore. Remember you are giving them the BFE. Make them work for it.

[Dog Rice]

Great advices, HG and Cmdr.

Seems that some gals are pushing for amount (e. G, the 2nd sentence over our first phone call is the amount she got in her previous arrangement.) and some gals don't even ask before M&G.

What is your approach? Don't talk about sugar before M&G?

I always tell the girls I will be more than happy with a HJ on the first date. How many hot girls can go on a date and get all worked up only to give the guy a HJ in the end? Not many. So really what ends up happening is they beg to give you some oral or just go all the way. About 75% of the time I get it all on the first date. And if it takes a second date. I don't care. I have had some awesome sex that didn't involve intercourse. And I think there is sometimes too much pressure for everyone on a first date to perform. Take away the pressure. You know like in sales. And what happens. Everyone relaxes and has a good time. The girls see this as respectful and usually end up showing their gratitude. Also. They see this as very mature. And thats what they all want. Not the younger guy I got to have it now or I. Ll die attitude.

Also if you have a lighter date in the daytime it can be a good warm up before seeing a regular. And then really giving it to her good. And if the light date gets heavy. Well in my case I may or may not have to cancel as I am basically a once a day guy most of the time. IMHO the supply (me) is way less than the demand (them). So why stress out?

[JoesParty]

Wow, there's a lot going on here the last day or so. Let me see what I can cover, and forgive me if I miss something. At the end, I'll add an anecdote of my own, along with my question of the day.

Talking about sex before a M&G: Maybe I've been lucky, but I've never had to specify exactly what I want at future meetings. And maybe it's the hopeless romantic in me (ha!), but I don't like the idea of it. After a few months in the game, I can usually tell if the girl is in tune with the nature of the SB world by the end of the first M&G. Sometimes they make it obvious; I met a girl this week who "isn't into providing sexual favors for money." Good for you, honey, but I'm not in the habit of giving an allowance for "time and companionship." I guess what I'm saying is that, in my experience, the ones who are willing to explicitly talk about sex without ever meeting you are more likely to be pros, UTR pros, or semi-pros. Just saying.

Gifts: Scott, I would wait and see what she gives you. Then, if you are so inclined, you have the opportunity to give considerable thought to a gift in return.

Dog Rice: You are new and excited, my friend. Take a moment to step back and think or even sleep on it. If it is meant to be, she'll still be wanting to meet you tomorrow. Talking about exchanging STD tests this early in your "relationship" indicates to me that she's too much business, not enough GFE. But maybe that's what you want. Given your statement about transitioning from the escort world, maybe that's not a bad thing. But tread carefully.

My world: I had a M&G with a 39yo (they're never 40 or 41, always 39, it seems) Asian baby tonight. Divorced, three kids, with more degrees (and probably more money) than I. She is very smart, very cute, and funny. Given her financial security, I think she's mainly looking for a boy toy to hang out with. Dinner was nice, and we wandered around the mall afterward. She wanted to go to Victoria's Secret to browse, which was promising, but they were closing as we walked by. So I walked her to my car so I could drive her to hers. We sat there and made out for a bit, and she asked me to go home with her. "Can't you spend the night with me?" isn't something I'm accustomed to hearing two hours after meeting someone.

"No," I said. "I have to be home soon."

"Just spend a couple hours with me."

It was tough, really tough, to say no. I had not arranged an extended work release with the warden, and my curfew was quickly approaching.

"Why can't you? Do you have a wife at home?"

She apparently had not carefully read my SA profile, which clearly says "married, but looking." She was visibly disappointed, and it was suddenly very chilly in the car. I see no point in lying to babies about this, and it would be hard to keep up the charade anyway. She politely thanked me for dinner and was on her way.

I've been texting her since we left, trying to gauge whether she wants to meet again. As she admits, she "really likes me." But I can tell she is reluctant to be involved with a married man. She wants to know she will be the only one I'm seeing on the side, as she is very "safe." The conversation is leading me to believe I still have a chance, but who knows? I really want to see her again, because, to paraphrase Wedding Crashers, she would have been my first Asian!

What should I do in the future to avoid this type of misunderstanding? Obviously, close the deal! But beside that, I'm thinking I need to ensure the pot is aware I'm married and is ok with that. How do you guys handle this? Because it's never been a problem for me before.