"Sugar Babies" and "Arrangements"

[Peter Johnson]

Not on network news, but if it happened it would certainly be discussed on *this* site and we would all know about it. And just in general, I likewise am aware of ZERO examples of someone doing sugar dating getting busted by LE for solicitation. Some might worry about it, but when it simply isn't happening in the real world, to take serious precautions against it is a form of paranoia.

I personally don't take serious precautions against it. Instead, I take very simple common sense precautions.

And ok, we will agree to disagree if any SDs are being busted, stalked, or murdered as a result of their SMS or similar communications. You say "it isn't happening" as in 0.00, and I say it likely is. Everyone else can decide for themselves as well.

[Peter Johnson]

If you married guys want to discuss how to pay for membership, how to communicate invisibly and how to hide money. Somebody start a new thread on it. Call it "Ghost F'and Tactics for the Married Man".

I'm single, and I don't care about "discretion". Not sure why you think caring about privacy, security, and avoiding criminal prosection is somehow exclusive to married men.

But sure anyone can start a new thread, and anyone can post there. Or not.

[CrazyRocket]

Keep in mind that even Apple, which has been relatively privacy focused company, has recently bent over for Trump administration and struck down an app that made tracking ICE personnel possible.

Do not trust any big tech company at these times. They might even release info without a court order now.

Different times, different expectations.

On the topic of this thread turning into security talks: I personally find it productive to read about experienced people's input. It takes a few scrolls to skip. I sometimes wish we had an FAQ kind of section to put common pitfalls for newcomers, though. I was once burned for giving out my actual number when I was under the influence of the little head unfortunately.

[LotharioPK]

I talked to her and yes something definitely off. She says "I've never done this before", but then sounds like a hardcore escort once the conversation progresses. I think she insisted on CFS as well, but I don't remember that part for sure. Anyway just not for me and I balied pretty quickly.

I've seen Dixie many times and yes, she can be a little skittish at first, but if y0u are patient, she's a lot of fun. Definitely one of the very nicest girls I've seen.

[Airmantroy]

Half of this thread gets taken up by security-related stuff like buying gift cards and fake phone numbers and what have you. Can we move that to it's own separate thread and keep this one just about the girls, please?

If you married guys want to discuss how to pay for membership, how to communicate invisibly and how to hide money. Somebody start a new thread on it. Call it "Ghost F'and Tactics for the Married Man".

[FarFarAway]

As far as an instance with someone being outed using Google Voice, I doubt that would be front page news on CNN. "Google Voice Outs Monger". But there are news stories every day about someone's texts being used against them in a criminal prosecution, or similar.

Not on network news, but if it happened it would certainly be discussed on *this* site and we would all know about it. And just in general, I likewise am aware of ZERO examples of someone doing sugar dating getting busted by LE for solicitation. Some might worry about it, but when it simply isn't happening in the real world, to take serious precautions against it is a form of paranoia.

[TheAnswer4]

Half of this thread gets taken up by security-related stuff like buying gift cards and fake phone numbers and what have you. Can we move that to it's own separate thread and keep this one just about the girls, please?

[AtlPrince]

Unless its a high profile murder case or a serious offense, Google doesn't comply with law enforcement, specially if its related to dealing with girls LOL.

Talking loud and saying nothing. It's "safe" in what respects? What kind of attacks does it it protect you from. Your messages via Google Voice are vacuumed up by the NSA and Google is happy to give all your texting history to any law enforcement agency that requests it.

(And again, I never said using SMS or Google voice is crazy or "wrong". I'm not such a simpleton, and as to think that way. But just be aware of the actual risks and then decide for yourself).

[Peter Johnson]

Even if google knows or could figure out who I am, that does not necessarily put me at risk from what I truly fear. A SB figuring out my IRL identity and trying to parlay that into a score, or my SO figuring out what I have been up to. Those are the real risks in this game. And as I siad, the other indicators mentioned by the OP, I've never seen any of that. Even when I have potential for my sugar life crossing over to my real life, because of google being involved in my work world. Yes, I am careful. I use a VPN into the large corporate server too.

I never discuss an arrangement by text, not because of any OpSec concern, but because I think it is to my advantage to do it face to face. I also am fanatic about covered sex. I am a cautious person generally. I just don't see some of these other precautions as rational, because, as I said, I have never heard or seen of someone getting bit by not doing them.

Please relate an instance where someone was 'outed' when using Google Voice. Yes IK Google is terrible for consumers, and knowing that keeps me wary.

Ok, then makes sense if you are only concerned about SO figuring out what you are doing, or SB trying to blackmail or extort you. And if you aren't discussing $$$ over chats, then that lowers the risk tremendously, with no paper trail there. (As long as you don't use Venmo or Zelle for ppm...cash only, of course)

As far as an instance with someone being outed using Google Voice, I doubt that would be front page news on CNN. "Google Voice Outs Monger". But there are news stories every day about someone's texts being used against them in a criminal prosecution, or similar. That's not going to happen with Signal, especially with disappearing messages on. And again, there's no real downside to using it, at least if the girl agrees to move the conversation there.

[Peter Johnson]

I used to work for google before and google voice is safe.

Talking loud and saying nothing. It's "safe" in what respect(s)? What kind of attacks does it it protect you from?

Your messages via Google Voice are all vacuumed up by the NSA, and Google is certainly happy to give all your texting history to any law enforcement agency that requests it.

(And again, I never said using SMS or Google voice is crazy or "wrong". I'm not such a simpleton as to think that way. But just be aware of the actual risks and then everyone can decide for themselves).

[AtlPrince]

I used to work for google before and google voice is safe. The verification number that you use during signup can be removed and you can still use the gvoice as text only. You can repeat the process and can have multiple GVoice numbers.

Even if google knows or could figure out who I am, that does not necessarily put me at risk from what I truly fear. A SB figuring out my IRL identity and trying to parlay that into a score, or my SO figuring out what I have been up to. Those are the real risks in this game. And as I siad, the other indicators mentioned by the OP, I've never seen any of that. Even when I have potential for my sugar life crossing over to my real life, because of google being involved in my work world. Yes, I am careful. I use a VPN into the large corporate server too.

I never discuss an arrangement by text, not because of any OpSec concern, but because I think it is to my advantage to do it face to face. I also am fanatic about covered sex. I am a cautious person generally. I just don't see some of these other precautions as rational, because, as I said, I have never heard or seen of someone getting bit by not doing them.

Please relate an instance where someone was 'outed' when using Google Voice. Yes IK Google is terrible for consumers, and knowing that keeps me wary.

[FarFarAway]

Being smart and rational, and not taking unnecessary risks is not "paranoia."

Being lazy and careless and reckless is not a strategy I would recommend.

But it all comes down to personal decision about cost/benefit, risk/reward.

I would never say someone is "wrong" to discuss terms of an arrangement over SMS, just like I wouldn't say someone is wrong to BBFS some girl from the site. But also there is a much bigger downside (in lost pleasure) to using a condom, rather than the non existent downside of using Signal for texting. That's the part I don't get.

Well, I do lose a good number of sb prospects from insisting they communicate via Signal, so that is the real downside. However, the recent two deranged psychobitches have made me even more comfortable with my decisions here.

Even if google knows or could figure out who I am, that does not necessarily put me at risk from what I truly fear. A SB figuring out my IRL identity and trying to parlay that into a score, or my SO figuring out what I have been up to. Those are the real risks in this game. And as I siad, the other indicators mentioned by the OP, I've never seen any of that. Even when I have potential for my sugar life crossing over to my real life, because of google being involved in my work world. Yes, I am careful. I use a VPN into the large corporate server too.

I never discuss an arrangement by text, not because of any OpSec concern, but because I think it is to my advantage to do it face to face. I also am fanatic about covered sex. I am a cautious person generally. I just don't see some of these other precautions as rational, because, as I said, I have never heard or seen of someone getting bit by not doing them.

Please relate an instance where someone was 'outed' when using Google Voice. Yes IK Google is terrible for consumers, and knowing that keeps me wary.

[Peter Johnson]

I don't think your paranoia is well placed.

Being smart and rational, and not taking unnecessary risks is not "paranoia."

Being lazy and careless and reckless is not a strategy I would recommend.

But it all comes down to personal decision about cost/benefit, risk/reward.

I would never say someone is "wrong" to discuss terms of an arrangement over SMS, just like I wouldn't say someone is wrong to BBFS some girl from the site. But also there is a much bigger downside (in lost pleasure) to using a condom, rather than the non existent downside of using Signal for texting. That's the part I don't get.

Well, I do lose a good number of sb prospects from insisting they communicate via Signal, so that is the real downside. However, the recent two deranged psychobitches have made me even more comfortable with my decisions here.

[Peter Johnson]

Wouldn't Google Voice give you sufficient protection, without the downsides of Signal? I really like it. It works on my burner, and I can access the account via browser, so I never have to have the burner inside an office / residence. It is buried in my golf bag, or elsewhere.

Agreed, likely borderline.

Google voice messages are not end to end encrypted, and also Google is notoriously terrible for privacy. All those messages are easily accessible, and all vacuumed up by the gov't. And likely your cellular provider also has easy access. They aren't private or even remotely close.

"Yes, Google Voice texts are encrypted during transit between your device and Google's servers using TLS, and are also encrypted when stored (at-rest). However, these are not end-to-end encrypted messages, as a message can be unencrypted once it leaves Google's texting gateway and travels through the standard, unencrypted SMS network to the recipient. ".

So if you ever share any pics or personally identifiable conversational info via SMS, google voice, mysudo, etc, then it's out there. Also your Google Voice acct is likely easily connected with your phone, which is likely connected with you. Ok, if you bought a burner phone with cash, and stored it in a faraday bag...and never switched it on, near home, then could help, but that isn't very practical to stay in touch with others. And why do all this when Signal works just fine...and install it on a burner phone if you want, but I don't even bother with that part myself.

What are the downsides of Signal? I'm not aware of any of them, besides many dumb girls refuse to use it. But that's not a downside of the app or technology itself. You don't have to give out your # with it and you can even register it with a different # than your main cell. It is just so solid and can also enable disappearing messages after a certain period of time. (I usually set for 4 weeks with these girls).

[FarFarAway]

All it would take is one subpoena to Google, whether an overzealous prosecutor or a crazy SB you knocked up and walked away from tracking you down for child support, and Google will instantly provide them all your info.

Has this ever happened, anywhere, to anyone's knowledge? I've never heard of it, and I'd wager you can't provide an example.