NoVA SugarBabies

[CruisingXX]

Anyone have any Intel on this one, claims to be married and wants side with husband approval, she is reaching out.

Randomly.

https://members.seeking.com/messages...b-7a5369fb58bc

[Shier]

Shier mentioned it in a prior thread. The best counter to a high ppm is what most refer to as "game. " Problem is that "game" is incredibly difficult online. Short pithy charming responses that make someone laugh can also be misread and misconstrued via text / messaging / etc.

When I get hit with a high ask that isn't completely out of the question, or even when it is, but I really want to close the deal, Ill tell the SB that it's not a number that's out of the question, but really depends on the in-person chemistry. That's when Ill propose an in person date. If she's super hot, Ill go drinks at a bar at a high end restaurant with plans for dinner. I'll usually set the reservation for about 30 minutes after the scheduled meet and then hang at the bar. When the SB comes in, I tell her to meet me at the bar and that they are getting the table ready for you. This lets you feel her out over drinks. If you're not feeling the vibe you can abort and come up with an excuse to exit stage right before dropping cash on the meal. If things are going well, the hostess will grab you and the date when the table is ready.

Solid strategy!

After that, it's just a matter of convincing the SB to go to the Fc for less than her ask. With the exception of the pure mercs, most SBs are willing to drop the panties for a lot less than their initial ask, if you're able to mimic the guy that she would've banged for free if she met him on match, tinder, or out at a bar. You'll be surprised at how many of these ladies will drop their panties after a few glasses of wine, a few laughs, a wink and a smile. Once you get into their head, then any allowance on top of the Fc session is just gravy. Make her cum hard, and you've sealed the deal for a discounted rates in the future. Minus the wine and laughs.

Based on my experience there is no foolproof "game" that works on all girls. Some girls want the party guy that will show them a good time, some want the dark silent brooding type, some want the older experienced mentor, etc etc. Find your wheelhouse and play to your strengths.

One thing that I've noticed all girls do want, which is something Shier also mentioned, is that want someone who comes across as confident. Don't confuse this with arrogance. It's a fine line but the latter will kill a date pretty quickly. Also, even a hint of desperation will also deep six your shot of lowering a high ppm ask, and might even kill the shot at getting to the Fc. This is where having a strong rotation makes getting more pussy easy. If you don't need to seal the deal because your rotation is stacked, the SB will get that sense. Plus being older and in a situation where I truly DGAF, also helps.

This is 95% of the game. Be super nice, super friendly, super fun, but don't hide it that you're willing to say "I wish you well" and walk.

I swear that most ladies have some sort of radar for measuring how much a guy wants to fuck them. When they get the sense that you're willing to walk, it makes them want you more because of the need for an ego affirmation (eg why doesn't he want to fuck me? What do I need to do to make him want me? Etc).

This is also where being relatively fit, dressing nicely etc also come into play (also mentioned recently). Based on conversations I've had with lots of these girls, there are a lot of mongers out there who have difficulty with basic hygiene, who are obese, don't take care of themselves, smell bad, are complete asshats, etc. These dudes expect SBs to drop the panties for the allowance only. Many do, but that's also why they start with the high ppms. Differentiate yourself with basic hygiene, decent clothes, a modicum of style, being height weight proportionate, slightly charming, and relatively respectful, then both pussy and lower allowance amounts shouldn't be too hard to come by. If you're relatively decent looking, then the pussy will come at an even lower price.

The one thing out of that list is that I struggle with is fitness. However I say right on my profile that I've got a "Dad Bod", so it weeds out / gives warning that they're meeting Jonah Hill not Josh Brolin, and it spares any surprises at the M&G. However I am still man-shaped, and FFS I follow some basic hygiene and style cues. These guys that are hairy and smelly and don't trim their nails or get haircuts or shave properly, or wear their velcro New Balances to the M&G. Well truthfully I LOVE those guys and hope they keep at it, as they make me look good.

[Pathfinder04]

So have read a few methods but they all share a common trend. Personnell what's worked for me is just accepting there ask get them in person. See how solid the ppm is see if she will lower it. If she seems pretty set then just go back to the hotel room and take the gamble of well I only have z, that's actually worked for me twice. Both had 1000 dollar asking got them both for 400 cause they were already there. This is only recommended if it's going to be a one time thing.

To me, there are so many girls that I am not going to waste my time negotiating with one who is charging more than I think is reasonable. I think if you do that you're going to get a subpar experience. Usually I just try to have normal conversations and vibe with the girl and the PPM conversation takes care of itself. They usually come back with something reasonable, but if they don't, you just say 'thank you, you seem really nice but I'm going to pass. ' The good ones will come back with a better offer.

[David032]

Any tips on countering a high PPM offer without alienating the SB? I was proposed with a 650 ppm. If I knew exactly what I'm getting into, I may. But I can't justify that initially or even continuously. Do you guys have any tips on getting that number to come down?

So have read a few methods but they all share a common trend. Personnell what's worked for me is just accepting there ask get them in person. See how solid the ppm is see if she will lower it. If she seems pretty set then just go back to the hotel room and take the gamble of well I only have z, that's actually worked for me twice. Both had 1000 dollar asking got them both for 400 cause they were already there. This is only recommended if it's going to be a one time thing.

[Mazvid]

Nice! Can you please share the expected ppm for her? I've tried PM'ing you and got a inbox full notification. .

Oh my bad. Just cleared the inbox. It was pretty low. The first time we met without discussing ppm. I had like 100 on me at the time and gave her that. Other times it was a bottle of wine. I think the most I ever gave her was like 200.

[FunTimeMonger]

So decided to post some of the girls I have been in contact with over the years that are still active. Some have been reviewed some haven't. So might be an update on some.

Julia.

She is a really fun date absolutely the girl in profile pictures. Though after being on her snap for a bit. Becarefuly don't burn her cause she is spiteful if hurt.

https://members.seeking.com/member/f...5-1f4b4030ca18

Serenablueeyes.

Does ask for a super high ppm can be talked down in person. Lot curvier than pictures hard to get a hold of honestly just ok she's someone who's on my list to message when everyone else fails and need to get laid.

https://members.seeking.com/member/8...1-5f40262ac2e3

Alluringcoupl.

She used to have a single profile now she's doing some weird stuff with hubby. If your polite and talk to her right she'll offer no hubby. But her asking price is GPS in the begging like 1000 k I walked away it was to much work anyone else get lucky.

https://members.seeking.com/member/c...f-8d921330a15d

Ashleyy22.

Gave me some sob story talked to her for a bit. She said wanted to go slow no ppm required till intimacy I was like sure. She no showed for Two dates so moved on anyone else get lucky with her.

https://members.seeking.com/member/b...0-c614be7f622d

Crystal.

Got to text with her but her schedule seemed super busy and couldn't lock down a meet and greet. She also texts in spurts then dissappears. Anyone else have any luck with her.

https://members.seeking.com/member/9...dWlkZS5ubC8%3D

Mandy.

This girl was a complete freak anything was on the table if the mood was right. She's also clean and on BC. Like I said if she's horny she'll fuck all night.

https://members.seeking.com/member/b...2-6b710e6b8338

[Dimples572]

But your inbox is full.

My bad. Should be good now.

[ProCatHunter]

But your inbox is full.

[ProCatHunter]

Any tips on countering a high PPM offer without alienating the SB? I was proposed with a 650 ppm. If I knew exactly what I'm getting into, I may. But I can't justify that initially or even continuously. Do you guys have any tips on getting that number to come down?

Shier mentioned it in a prior thread. The best counter to a high ppm is what most refer to as "game. " Problem is that "game" is incredibly difficult online. Short pithy charming responses that make someone laugh can also be misread and misconstrued via text / messaging / etc.

When I get hit with a high ask that isn't completely out of the question, or even when it is, but I really want to close the deal, Ill tell the SB that it's not a number that's out of the question, but really depends on the in-person chemistry. That's when Ill propose an in person date. If she's super hot, Ill go drinks at a bar at a high end restaurant with plans for dinner. I'll usually set the reservation for about 30 minutes after the scheduled meet and then hang at the bar. When the SB comes in, I tell her to meet me at the bar and that they are getting the table ready for you. This lets you feel her out over drinks. If you're not feeling the vibe you can abort and come up with an excuse to exit stage right before dropping cash on the meal. If things are going well, the hostess will grab you and the date when the table is ready.

After that, it's just a matter of convincing the SB to go to the Fc for less than her ask. With the exception of the pure mercs, most SBs are willing to drop the panties for a lot less than their initial ask, if you're able to mimic the guy that she would've banged for free if she met him on match, tinder, or out at a bar. You'll be surprised at how many of these ladies will drop their panties after a few glasses of wine, a few laughs, a wink and a smile. Once you get into their head, then any allowance on top of the Fc session is just gravy. Make her cum hard, and you've sealed the deal for a discounted rates in the future. Minus the wine and laughs.

Based on my experience there is no foolproof "game" that works on all girls. Some girls want the party guy that will show them a good time, some want the dark silent brooding type, some want the older experienced mentor, etc etc. Find your wheelhouse and play to your strengths.

One thing that I've noticed all girls do want, which is something Shier also mentioned, is that want someone who comes across as confident. Don't confuse this with arrogance. It's a fine line but the latter will kill a date pretty quickly. Also, even a hint of desperation will also deep six your shot of lowering a high ppm ask, and might even kill the shot at getting to the Fc. This is where having a strong rotation makes getting more pussy easy. If you don't need to seal the deal because your rotation is stacked, the SB will get that sense. Plus being older and in a situation where I truly DGAF, also helps.

I swear that most ladies have some sort of radar for measuring how much a guy wants to fuck them. When they get the sense that you're willing to walk, it makes them want you more because of the need for an ego affirmation (eg why doesn't he want to fuck me? What do I need to do to make him want me? Etc).

This is also where being relatively fit, dressing nicely etc also come into play (also mentioned recently). Based on conversations I've had with lots of these girls, there are a lot of mongers out there who have difficulty with basic hygiene, who are obese, don't take care of themselves, smell bad, are complete asshats, etc. These dudes expect SBs to drop the panties for the allowance only. Many do, but that's also why they start with the high ppms. Differentiate yourself with basic hygiene, decent clothes, a modicum of style, being height weight proportionate, slightly charming, and relatively respectful, then both pussy and lower allowance amounts shouldn't be too hard to come by. If you're relatively decent looking, then the pussy will come at an even lower price.

[BobDingle10]

I usually wait after two or three sessions before reducing the allowance. If the SB has a profile that's more than a few months old, she knows the deal. Most mongers, especially the ones willing to drop high amounts will see them 1-3 times max and move on. You leverage you're willingness to have a long term sugar relationship to your advantage.

I know, some mongers are going to call me out for not treating the SB correctly. To that, I will counter with the fact that it's a win win. The sb would've gotten kicked from rotation for being too expensive. She doesn't want that, and I don't either, but when newer SBs are in rotation, they get more attention.

These are two of the different techniques I'll use to juggle a large rotation without going broke.

Most importantly, this is all made possible by those mongers who are complete petty asshats. To those guys out there, can't tell you how much I truly do appreciate you. It's your sh! Tty personality that ensure my d!ck is constantly getting wet.

But more importantly, just treat these SBs with a modicum of respect. Even if they don't deserve it. You'll find it goes a long long way.

Sounds solid. And methodical. I just wanted to add to the freebie knowledge base.

For me the best situations where I was able to turn pay for play into reduced / free came with being genuine.

One young lady I lucked out. The allowance I was giving her ppm she didn't actually "need" and she told me so. She then told me she wanted to see me more often and I could give her one ppm allowance a month for 3-4 visits. Of course I took her up on it. Her school schedule didn't allow for that many visits a month so I never worked that way. But it got to the point where she only expected ppm every other or every third visit.

Another lady I got that way a few years back because we hooked up just before the holiday season. So I played poor cause I had blahblahblah expenses during the holidays and she was cool with slashing the ppm in half. Then after the holidays it stayed there. I offered more a few time and even had cash in my hand that she pushed away because we had good chemistry. Then it became a thing when she hit hard times so she got ppm when she asked but most times it was here's some gas money and extra for incidentals and that's it.

It's best to work the SB's you have the best sexual and personal chemistry with. I have one now that I've seen 3 times this year and going to work the "I could see you a bit more often if you'd allow me to shave off x dollars" move. Make it enough so that it feels like a discount to you, but not so much that she feels devalued.

Dude above is right that a lot of mongers are pure shite people and most non-merc SB's will value the long term safety and routine of someone whose company they enjoy than having to wade through a cesspool of dudes for a few dollars more (Eastwood!

[ProCatHunter]

Thanks for the updates, sounds like a nice roaster. I am wondering how you're keeping all of them busy and still not blowing up your bank account. I've got an issue of plenty myself, with 3 college co-eds, a freshman, a junior, a senior, and another 23 year old just added, and I am having trouble keeping a budget and maintaining all of them. I'm going to have to stop seeing the longest running one for while to keep from going above, which honestly I've been these past months. With you meeting each one of them 3 to 4 times a month, and even at 500, that's a lot of dough. Of course it's all personal I understand, and I do make good money myself, but started thinking what's the end game here instead of blowing a lot of dough on SB pleasures. Curious to hear how you guys think.

For me, luckily the two new expensive additions are out of state. So far they are ok with seeing me about 2 ce a month each. Justifies the higher rate for me and I get variety between the two of them. They are living the college life and so are relatively busy with classes and hanging out with friends.

The other new addition is a true unicorn. This one doesn't want allowance, uses the small allowance I give her to buy me gifts, and doesn't order anything substantial when we go out. Just a drink or two, a house salad or a soup, and then back to her dorm for an Fc session. She's a senior so she's older than the other two, and a solid 7, compared to the other two being 8/9's. That said, she's happy for me to swing by in the middle of the day when I'm between meetings. We'll hang for two hours and then I'm out. She is also the one asking me for overnights. My main concern with this one is that she gets too attached.

The other two that have been in rotation have largely been on ice. Wasn't too difficult though. I was actually on vacation with the family for two weeks, then told them that I got busy with work, etc etc. If the one that is looking for our threesome partner doesn't come through, I'll probably put her on the back burner. The other one is in collegiate athlete and so her schedule is crazier than mine since she has away games. Probably will only see her once or twice this fall because of her schedule. Might also drop her off the rotation completely. We'll see how things go with the new additions.

The other 2/3 that are still in the lineup are now super low allowance and I see them very occasionally. I'm relatively certain I am in rotation for them and that they each have a main SD or are dating outside of the bowl looking for someone serious. I get a random booty call every now and then, or will give them a random booty call, just to keep communication lines open.

Long story short, my budget got smacked the past few weeks because I've been adding to the rotation, which means expensive m&gs, dates, etc. Now that the dance card is full, it will drop back down to manageable levels. No more Azumi, Lewnes, or Minibar dates. A local brewpub, PF changs, or mid / lower level restaurant is fine for the newer additions. The ones that have been in rotation for a while are all just straight to the room or their places, a few drinks, and then off to the races.

Anyway, that's how I juggle my rotation. For two ways I am able to get a reduced allowance from the ladies who have been in rotation for a while, see my prior post.

[ProCatHunter]

I agree that once you've slept with them once, they know you are a safe fun time and probably can make them orgasm like rockets. They have now given away most of their leverage. I have negotiated somewhat on subsequent visits but any wording, guidelines, and tips would be appreciated for negotiating allowance down and possibly all the way to free.

I usually wait after two or three sessions before reducing the allowance. If the SB has a profile that's more than a few months old, she knows the deal. Most mongers, especially the ones willing to drop high amounts will see them 1-3 times max and move on. You leverage you're willingness to have a long term sugar relationship to your advantage.

For example, these days I've noticed that most of the mid range SBs ask for ppm, especially those who have been burned by a guy who promises to pay at the end of the month and ghosts. If you started ppm and have seen a lady 2-4 times in one month, you can recommend a weekly allowance, that is a little more than the ppm, and then see her on Sunday and then again on Friday or Sat. It'll almost be like a 2 for 1 deal. This is something I'll do with a SB who is a true sub and who is into me. The "higher" weekly allowance is attractive to them, and since they are into you, the additional date is fun for them, and you just reduced your allowance amount by 20-40%. So let's say you had a ppm amount of $350, the weekly amount would be $500. Basically you're getting a ppm of $250. If you're not sure if you can trust her not to see you again, tell her that you've proven yourself to be trustworthy and that you'll give the allowance at the end of the week. If she's really into you, then she'll be fine with it. I’ve also found that a lot of these girls are terrible at maths.

Another option I'll use with a SB that I'm on the fence about, or am considering moving out of rotation is to tell them that I've hit financial hard times because (insert excuse here). Could be a market crash, could be you invested heavily in Peleton, could be your wife decided that you have to send your son to private school, or if you're single without kids. Your mom got sick and doesn't have health insurance. You get the point. Then I say, I want to keep seeing them, but just can't afford them and want them to be able to have the lifestyle they deserve. (I. E. Baby, you are so amazing. And I don't want to let you go, but I want you to have the lifestyle you deserve).

These girls will reactivate their profiles and then get hit with the shitstorm that comes with all the mongers flooding their inbox. Petty mongers like "the curve" will tell them that they've misspelled the word "discreete" (or pick at them for something as equally asinine) and then the SB will start messaging you, blowing up your inbox, negotiating against herself (ie I know the ppm amount we had was $400, but if you're able to do $350 l, I'd be ok with that). Can't tell you how many times a SB has come back and said that she was fine with taking less since she knows that once whatever financial hardship has passed, I'll make it up to her. Once I get a message like that, then I counter with a response like "baby, you're worth $400, but it's really hard to do $350 right now, would you be ok with $300 - and then when things get better, I'll make sure to take care of you.

Once the new rate is set, it's set, and it doesn't change, especially when you're willing to drop them from rotation.

I know, some mongers are going to call me out for not treating the SB correctly. To that, I will counter with the fact that it's a win win. The sb would've gotten kicked from rotation for being too expensive. She doesn't want that, and I don't either, but when newer SBs are in rotation, they get more attention.

These are two of the different techniques I'll use to juggle a large rotation without going broke.

Most importantly, this is all made possible by those mongers who are complete petty asshats. To those guys out there, can't tell you how much I truly do appreciate you. It's your sh! Tty personality that ensure my d!ck is constantly getting wet.

But more importantly, just treat these SBs with a modicum of respect. Even if they don't deserve it. You'll find it goes a long long way.

[DasHottCalla]

Any tips on countering a high PPM offer without alienating the SB? I was proposed with a 650 ppm. If I knew exactly what I'm getting into, I may. But I can't justify that initially or even continuously. Do you guys have any tips on getting that number to come down?

[LSaberWookie]

I agree that once you've slept with them once, they know you are a safe fun time and probably can make them orgasm like rockets. They have now given away most of their leverage. I have negotiated somewhat on subsequent visits but any wording, guidelines, and tips would be appreciated for negotiating allowance down and possibly all the way to free.

Timing also plays a key role. It's been discussed on this an lots of other sugar forums, but end of month when rent and bills come due, and before that biweekly or weekly paycheck hits will make a lot of these ladies do what they wouldn't otherwise consider something they might not otherwise.

Then once they sleep with you, you don't count against their number (though lots of these girls don't care about that) and have proven you're not a psycho murderer (plus points if you're fun in bed and make them cum), allowances come down and they are a lot more willing to work with you. This of course doesn't apply to the Merc types who used to dance or who are pros.

This is why I've always liked the sugar bowl, since things just get easier over time. The two that I've had in rotation for a few years are basically fuck buddies. They contact me when they're bored or need help, I do the same.

Anyway, and everyone with any experience in the bowl knows it's a YMMV game. I'm sure there are plenty of profiles you've messaged that wouldn't pay me the time of day. Perfect example is the girl who wouldn't do bb with me, but was happy to go bb with you. Maybe I caught her when she needed funds, but she made it clear to me that bb wasn't a menu option for me.

I've also found that interactions can be completely random. I've messaged some of these ladies in the past under different profiles and have been left of read. Oddly enough, under a new profile with the same pics and profile information, I'm the best thing since sliced bread? Often times, there is no ryhme or reason.

One thing is for sure though, after losing some weight, it has made a significant difference in terms of allowance rates and responses.

[Zerry]

It's confirmed I'm fat and ugly LOL.

I need to start a business for taking dating profile pictures.

Anyway, maybe take 6 months off the bowl, and invest your play money differently. Get your teeth whitened, lose xx pounds, hire a personal shopper / stylist, or. Figure out how to make more play money.

A good many women do not care about a person's looks, but they still care about a person's presentation. Skinny slobs have it better than fat slobs sure, but the appearance of wealth and style is king.

Out in the wild girls are fucking actually rich dudes for free, including fat ugly ones, for the same reason people buy lotto tickets.

Control what you can (maybe / maybe not your weight) and distract them from what you can't. Apparently you're saying that giving them 300 isn't distracting enough.