"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[DogBert77]

No, because of what he said and also because you can get banned from SA. But Yes, you should, so long as you learn to do it tastefully.

Ernie, it's a big sugar bowl and everyone should do what works for them. What I am doing is working just fine for me. I don't really see the point about discussing preferences, unless you have some exotic kinks or you are an absolutist on bare back or something. Personally, my tastes are pretty mainstream. I do have a preference for submissive types, but I have a pretty good nose for those, and it seems like most of the SB population tends that direction anyway, so not a major issue. As far as actual sex acts to be performed, I have not hooked up with a SB yet who was not down for DFK and BBBJ, and only a couple who weren't into DATY, so I just don't see any need to ask. I haven't ahd one yet who went to the FC with me and refused to give FS. Lots of them are not into BBFS. Again, I don't see any point in discussing this online. Lots of girls that will go bare back when approached right will say they won't if you ask them online. And the girls that will broadcast this info online to someone they haven't met are likely to go bare back with lots of guys. I. e. , exactly the girls you don't want to bare back. If your day will not be complete without entering the back door, OK, maybe you need to be clear about this before meeting. Personally, I prefer pussy anyway, so don't need to discuss that either. I usually only plug the pooper after I've been with them a couple times, they are a little more comfortable and I am just looking for something different to do. So I don't feel the need to discuss any of this.

Now, for those of you that need them to dress them in a pink onesie and have them suck on a lollipop while holding a teddy bear and apologizing for soiling their diaper, all while while you ream their ass without lube, OK, maybe you should pre-screeen. Not sure on the diplomatic way to put that to them, but Ernie, I'm sure you are up to the task!

[Ernest Ll]

I just want to add my view on a couple points. You should not be talking about "dollars per meet / sexual preferences in texts or emails" AT ALL.

No, because of what he said and also because you can get banned from SA. But Yes, you should, so long as you learn to do it tastefully. Younger gals want to be with someone fun and smart and experienced. And much of that comes across in your "game" And if you can discuss these things without making them feel like they are selling their bodies, you will be in deep in no time. Pay attention to their profile info and what they say in their messages. Get them to laugh. dont be rude, crude or socially unacceptable.

Since SA has taken off the "Lifestyle expectations" screen, you need to make sure you aren't wasting too much time.

I have found its all in mastering the euphamisms. Sorry, but if you have to Google that for a meaning, chances are this strategy won't work for you.

You can get to $ per meet by asking what would be an appropriate "tuition assistance" "Student Loan Relief" "Spring Break Fund" package for an afternoon of her company. Make sure you pay attention to her needs so you can customize that message. You can usually get a LOL out of them in the process, which will save you a $.

"We can meet for lunch and see where the afternoon takes us" "Meet for drinks and dinner....or room service if our in person chemistry is as amazing as it has been online"

I'm also fond of food analogies "we could meet for drinks and dinner and adjourn for dessert and a midnight snack. Maybe even a 3 am feast and / or breakfast in bed".

I've found most gals -- even the obvious non-pros -- are fine with talking about preferences, so long as you don't make them feel like a pro. They want to be comfortable with you as well, and make sure you aren't expecting to be swaddled in a diaper while you suck their nipples. My favorite is "Anything on your no fly list for playtime? About half get it -- and again a LOL -- the less quick will tell me they won't fly to see me or ask for clarification. 90% of them will answer and about 3/4 of those will at least tell you their hard limits. Open minded means different things to different girls, based on their prior experiences, which is one of the reasons I try to figure out their parameters.

Sometimes, they will ask what I'm comfortable offering, and again you can be clear without be crude or direct. "For a dusk to dawn extravaganza experiencing all Bethany has to offer, a ShowCase Showdown of Cash and Prizes valued at $600 can be yours. So hot little Bethany, come on down!

Honestly, in my city it's unbelievable how many hot and almost hot young girls are joining SA every day. They only constraints on getting them are time and money, there is no shortage of pussy.

Definitely YES in most decent sized town (Richmond and up).

[TomDickNHarry]

We have a very similar approach and result. I move even quicker though pushing for the M&G, I mention it in the very first email and it's in my profile prominently (though they barely read them it seems). I'm definitely impatient and my tolerance for exchanging dozens of emails and the like about my hobbies and other small talk just grates on me, especially when I feel like there's a good chance they'll never agree to meet. I find the "want to get to know you" types are often the ones (though not always) who will never actually meet. I literally cringe when I see the two most common replies: "I'd like to get to know you" and "what are you looking for," the second which is pretty spelled out in the profile.

Anyway, curious what personality you think needs the chit chat?

My weakest link is also moving from messaging to M&G. Once I meet a girl, my success rate is very high. One reason may be I have only one profile photo (no face), although I mention in my profile that I would be happy to share pics offline. I am somewhat impatient person, may be I am trying to get to the "business end" of the chat too early. I am mainly trying to weed out picture sellers, time wasters etc. I would typically bring up a possible meet up in person within first 5 to 10 messages. Few occasions, girls went silent after that. I spent few messages chit chat etc, but try to talk them into chat offline ASAP. I am beginning to figure out the personalities that need lengthy chat before moving into business end. The key is that they don't view you as a "creep", and trying to get into their pants quickly (although they sure know what our end goal is). Girls are very different from how we think, just have to understand in order to get into their pants.

Stay safe.

Dr. S.

[DogBert77]

Where my funnel breaks down is converting these numbers into M&Gs / FCs. I do not understand how to transition from talking about weather to talking about dollars per meet / sexual preferences in texts or emails. Perhaps that's the weakness of my strategy. Perhaps by being too nice and ensuring access to contact info it weakens the funnel down the line because I am not per-qualifying appropriately.

Cruzier.

Cruzier, you have gotten some great advice on here already. In particular, I think InTight summed it up in his post. If you want pussy, you have to go after it. SA is no different from real life in that way.

I just want to add my view on a couple points. You should not be talking about "dollars per meet / sexual preferences in texts or emails" AT ALL. Two reasons for this: (1) the chicks who want to do this are going to engage in an online auction. They are going to go to the highest bidder. You don't want to be the highest bidder. You want to get the pussy and keep as much of your cash as possible. So don't play that game. If the girls insist on it, just move on. (2) you say that your aren't really looking for pros and UTR's but those are exactly the ones most likely to want to set price online in advance. The non-pro, college girls types do not want to do this. They don't want to think they are selling their body for cash. Let them think that. Play along with it. I avoid ever talking about cash if possible, even at the meet and greet. It is amazing how many girls you can penetrate without discussing price at all. Once you've had them, you can give them whatever you want. (Of course, if you want them again, you can't be too cheap!

Honestly, in my city it's unbelievable how many hot and almost hot young girls are joining SA every day. They only constraints on getting them are time and money, there is no shortage of pussy.

[InTight]

Vanilla card works for me every time. The $100 Visa one.

Buy it and register it on the Vanilla website. Use a fake name, and use the real address of an apartment complex in your area. Just leave off the apartment number. The zip code is what the site's merchant account uses to authenticate your account.

You can use a burner phone #, or just make one up for the card registration. The phone # isn't used to authenticate the registration or purchase.

Once you register the card, go to SA and enter the same information you used to register the card. The card should be accepted for payment.

You'll then have $10 left on the card. Use it for gas next time you're at the pump. Remember the zip code you used to register the card.

Vanilla Card quit working for me couple years ago when the government stopped gift cards working internationally trying ti stop money laundering. I have used Bitcoin with success.

[Truncated]

When I used a Vanilla One debit card today it was declined. Did a little research and the problem was the the card is only valid in the USA, states that on the front of the card. But the site requires a card that is accepted internationally, at least if you try to use the form to sign up. I have a question in to admin to see if there is a way around that issue.

Vanilla card works for me every time. The $100 Visa one.

Buy it and register it on the Vanilla website. Use a fake name, and use the real address of an apartment complex in your area. Just leave off the apartment number. The zip code is what the site's merchant account uses to authenticate your account.

You can use a burner phone #, or just make one up for the card registration. The phone # isn't used to authenticate the registration or purchase.

Once you register the card, go to SA and enter the same information you used to register the card. The card should be accepted for payment.

You'll then have $10 left on the card. Use it for gas next time you're at the pump. Remember the zip code you used to register the card.

[Jd2011]

There is a lot of great advice in this thread. But this post is the best words of wisdom I have heard in awhile.

I've been out of the bowl for a while but always read this thread for the enjoyable stories. When I first signed up and sent money in within a week I was getting pussy. You are using the Nice Guy approach and as nice guys finish last you are proving the point. I start out in the first message suggesting that she text me on my burner phone (no I don't tell her it is a burner) so we can communicate privately. I found when texting I did better with a direct bad boy approach (that is not who I am so it was fun playing the game) and start suggesting she send me hot pictures and when can we meet. I did better going directly to the FC than dinner out but got laid both ways. I was looking for hot sex not a girl friend or companion. The few that I hit it off with we staid in touch and had multiple dates, it got to the point that sometimes the sex was free and mutually enjoyable. One young lady that I have many photos taken when we were naked and playing and a couple of dozen video clips of the various fun times, the only anal I have done in several years and the only video of it I have with here I am still in contact even though I'm on the west coast and she is on the east coast. I'm telling you that you get pussy only if you try, quit the gentleman shit and start being more demanding, tell her what you want and when. If she ghosts you then Next.

[Playa12]

Others here swear that a Plain Vanilla Visa gift card will work It didn't for me so I used Bitcoin and it worked just fine everything anonymous.

When I used a Vanilla One debit card today it was declined. Did a little research and the problem was the the card is only valid in the USA, states that on the front of the card. But the site requires a card that is accepted internationally, at least if you try to use the form to sign up. I have a question in to admin to see if there is a way around that issue.

[Truncated]

Gents.

I have been a premium member of SA for more than a year, now I see they try to get me into "Diamond" membership status. $250 per month and you need to verify the personal and income information. Seems like a rip-off, and more of a trap collecting information. Anyway, wanted to check if anyone here tried it and what the experience was.

Stay safe.

Dr. S.

Don't do it.

Seeking will eventually get hacked or go broke and the assets (including data) sold to a third party. That means your personal information will eventually be posted somewhere.

Remember *************.com?

Always sign up on Seeking with a fake name and prepaid card and burner phone number.

Besides, look at the company Seeking uses to verify I'd for Diamond. It's run by some guy in Durham, NC who is a kids soccer coach. No fucking way I'm giving that guy my personal info.

[BigOne73]

I've been in a traditional relationship for the past year. I've been back in the Sugar Bowl for about a month. Things have definitely changed. You can't block the pros you know like you used to be able to.

[ErkTheOne]

Anyone know this one from down in Roanoke area? Sally Val 4 u https://www.seeking.com/member/3c846...1-5ddd81e42607.

Messaged a bit but she goes quiet for long time in between. Posted in Roanoke forum also. Happy to share other info if I can.

[InTight]

I've posted a few questions in here but today marks my earnest entry into the bowl.

I'm coming up on the end of my second month of paid membership, and looking back through my accomplishments I see that I have none. I've gotten too many messages to even begin to count. I've gotten maybe 10 or so contacts (phone numbers and / or emails). And yet I've been on a single M&G that did not go anywhere. And I see that I am squarely to blame.

I've read that this is a numbers game so obviously what I need to do is work on my funnel and go on more M&Gs. More failed M&Gs means that a successful one is that much closer.

I've practiced the intro message and do well there. I've even practiced the couple follow up messages and am getting pretty decent at getting either a phone number or email. The "secret" is literally just make small talk. Just make small talk until they offer up the contact info. Nothing more, nothing less. No sex talk, no arrangement talk, no anything, really. Just talk about what you did last weekend. What you're going to do next weekend. What the weather is like. At some point, with some ladies it is sooner, and some ladies it is later, they will drop a number. Easy.

Where my funnel breaks down is converting these numbers into M&Gs / FCs. I do not understand how to transition from talking about weather to talking about dollars per meet / sexual preferences in texts or emails. Perhaps that's the weakness of my strategy. Perhaps by being too nice and ensuring access to contact info it weakens the funnel down the line because I am not per-qualifying appropriately.

I have gotten the full spectrum of messages, however. From endless penpal style talks of the weather to first message into single email with an attached crotch shot and full a la carte menu. Sometimes I feel it is less what I say and more whoever I am saying it to. Still, I am not really in search of obvious pros /UTRs. If I was I would just follow up with every "hey" message I get, which is tons.

The question that is hidden in here is what is the progression or "tempo", of you will, of messages on SA and the followup text / emails? Obviously this varies but anyone want to take a stab at some general guidelines? Also, how does one first broach the subject.

In closing I will say the worst question I've been faced with is "what's your ideal arrangement?" Do I really just say 1 time a week for $$ in a mid range hotel halfway between me and you, I'll bring the refreshments if you bring the entertainment and drop the mic? Advice here is appreciated.

One step at a time.

Cruzier.

I've been out of the bowl for a while but always read this thread for the enjoyable stories. When I first signed up and sent money in within a week I was getting pussy. You are using the Nice Guy approach and as nice guys finish last you are proving the point. I start out in the first message suggesting that she text me on my burner phone (no I don't tell her it is a burner) so we can communicate privately. I found when texting I did better with a direct bad boy approach (that is not who I am so it was fun playing the game) and start suggesting she send me hot pictures and when can we meet. I did better going directly to the FC than dinner out but got laid both ways. I was looking for hot sex not a girl friend or companion. The few that I hit it off with we staid in touch and had multiple dates, it got to the point that sometimes the sex was free and mutually enjoyable. One young lady that I have many photos taken when we were naked and playing and a couple of dozen video clips of the various fun times, the only anal I have done in several years and the only video of it I have with here I am still in contact even though I'm on the west coast and she is on the east coast. I'm telling you that you get pussy only if you try, quit the gentleman shit and start being more demanding, tell her what you want and when. If she ghosts you then Next.

[DWinthrop]

Why all the mystery? Why not say which sorority?

LOL Why? Then they will get blown up with messages and be harder for me to bang when I'm in town.

[FarFarAway]

Lots of these SBs have them. What do you think they can say about a girl, and how do you involve them in your play?

[DrSummer]

My weakest link is also moving from messaging to M&G. Once I meet a girl, my success rate is very high. One reason may be I have only one profile photo (no face), although I mention in my profile that I would be happy to share pics offline. I am somewhat impatient person, may be I am trying to get to the "business end" of the chat too early. I am mainly trying to weed out picture sellers, time wasters etc. I would typically bring up a possible meet up in person within first 5 to 10 messages. Few occasions, girls went silent after that. I spent few messages chit chat etc, but try to talk them into chat offline ASAP. I am beginning to figure out the personalities that need lengthy chat before moving into business end. The key is that they don't view you as a "creep", and trying to get into their pants quickly (although they sure know what our end goal is). Girls are very different from how we think, just have to understand in order to get into their pants.

Stay safe.

Dr. S.

Hey man. Good on you for making progress on chatting up POTs.

I think when it comes to an arrangement, 99% of the girls on the site know what's up. Guys hope for or expect sex in exchange for money. Anything else, like dinner dates, cocktails out, friendship, companionship is icing on the cake. Very, very few of us would give a girl money for any of the latter if it didn't come with the former. Girls know that. That said, some of them will still try to see if they can get what they want (money) for not having to put out. This is either some kind of fetish power move (findom?) for them that involves taking advantage of clueless guys or the sort of thing may help them rationalize that they're not really a prostitute (women's minds are amazing machines capable of bending reality into a fucking pretzel, if you haven't noticed), or it feeds their ego I. E. "OMG, guys think I'm soooo prettyyyy they pay just to give me attention and for me to text them and send selfies!

*Sidebar: If any of you do this, please stop. It's like feeding wildlife: you're reinforcing behavior that just turns them into an incessant and vapid pain in the ass.

Anyway, to answer your questions about the money aspect of the deal: I used to think the way you do. That since this was an arrangement / financial transaction that it was necessary to have the $$ and sex details spelled out before commencing. I learned from the wise gentlemen here that nothing could be further from the truth.

Now, I don't bring up money at all. And about half the time she won't either, I've found. I also never bring up money on Seeking messages, email or text, always deferring / delaying that conversation to in person at the M&G, if I have to have it at all. Also, never talk money over SA messaging - they DO seem to read / scan our messages and will ban you for talk that seems to be about escorting / prostitution. I just ask her out on a date and make sure the logistics of the evening include a place to have sex, be it a hotel or my car or my place or her place (I'm single, so have no SO to worry about). It's my job as a man to lead the date to a naked conclusion, and at the end I slip a gift into her purse without mention of $. 90% of the time nothing is said, and they are more than happy to get together again.

If she does bring up money, I follow the golden rule of negotiation: The one who states a price first loses. I ask her what she thinks an amicable arrangement would be for her. Usually, she'll come in sky-high ($700 for a dinner date? Girl, you on crack.). At that point, if I'm interested still, I'll try to talk her down, emphasizing that I'm really looking for a long-term arrangement and that she'll make much more over time if she lowers her per-meet rate to something reasonable and sustainable (for me, that's 150-250, depending on a mental algorithm that takes into account her level of youth, beauty, weight, intelligence, reliability, agreeableness, common sense, perceived level of sanity, sense of humor, quality of conversation). Most of they time they agree.

On the question of an ideal arrangement, my answer to this never includes money. I usually say something along the lines of looking for a friend and FWB to have fun and do things with, blah, blah, I work a lot, don't really have time for a conventional relationship, blah, blah, want something casual and easy, not looking to get in the way of your life, blah blah, some nights out, some nights in, blah blah. Also, if they're looking for some sort of kept girlfriend / Pretty Woman / ongoing allowance kind of bullshit, I say that I'm open to that (I'm really not), but would prefer to give them a gift / allowance each time we get together until we get to know each other better.

Or something like that.

Hope that helps.