"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[JZLizard]

You are a braver man than I. I mean, "Aside from a paternity suit..." -- I'm a single guy like yourself, but holy s* I can't think of an outcome from sugaring much worse than that. You've written before about your penchant for BB and CIP, and while I'd be hard pressed to find anything more pleasurable than nutting deep inside a 21 year old co-ed, I have no idea how you sleep at night (not morally, but worry-wise).

It's almost always bareback for me, but nutting inside them is the exception rather than the rule. My preference is to unload in their mouth or just spray their face or body. CIP usually only happens when their oral skills aren't good enough to get me off, or sometimes I just get the random urge. But I also don't stay with any one of them long enough to be too worried about it, and I also probably wouldn't cum inside if I thought my true identity had been compromised already.

In terms of being able to sleep nights -- I have gotten one pregnant, and yes it was incredibly stressful until I saw confirmation of the abortion paperwork, but that was a long time ago and my skills toward avoiding big problems are orders of magnitude better now. Not saying it could never happen, but between my sexual habits, the level of diligence I exert toward protecting my anonymity, and the fact that I don't stay with one long enough for her to devise a plan of attack, there's just not enough there to justify any level of preemptive paranoia.

[RogerOver]

Try acquiring a bit of skill. You never use anything other than cash at a estaurant where you're pinned down into seats and vulnerable (because servers often mention the name on a card when they bring it to you), preferably not at a bar either, and if at a bar and you absolutely must use a card, never sit close to where tabs are being closed out -- leave her at the table to watch your jacket and her purse or whatever while you close it out. Anyone who has spent any amount of time protecting their identity knows that if you're really planning on surviving in this lifestyle, you need to be thinking about it at all times. And, if something unexpected happens and she does find out your name, then close the situation gracefully, without incident, and move on to the next. And, if you ever run into one stupid enough to say something like now that she knows your name she's going to google it, you just put on your poker face, say something funny like you hope she doesn't read about your serial killer background, and play it off like you couldn't care less. Then you send her home with cum stains on her dress, telling her you'll call her again and then you go dark.

Or optionally, just don't get married and leave all your assets on the table (that's the path I took). That, combined with a reasonable but not paranoid level of anonymity protection, keeps my cock happy enough. Aside from a paternity suit, there's not much any of these SBs could do to my life (other than moderate professional embarassment maybe) that could bring me down even if they tried.

Because I've designed around it.

I've opted for number two. Not married and don't give a fuck if the girls know who I am. Generally, though, I'm eating at higher end places, dropping it on the expense credit card, and don't feel like the administrative overhead of getting my money back later.

I was providing an example of how everyday interactions can lead to a girl finding out your real name. I think my skill levels are doing ok. LOL.

[Kwagmire]

Aside from a paternity suit, there's not much any of these SBs could do to my life (other than moderate professional embarassment maybe) that could bring me down even if they tried.

Because I've designed around it.

You are a braver man than I. I mean, "Aside from a paternity suit..." -- I'm a single guy like yourself, but holy s* I can't think of an outcome from sugaring much worse than that. You've written before about your penchant for BB and CIP, and while I'd be hard pressed to find anything more pleasurable than nutting deep inside a 21 year old co-ed, I have no idea how you sleep at night (not morally, but worry-wise).

[TomDickNHarry]

Are you guys giving any donations at the meet and greet? I have not been, although I do pay for the meal if a meal is involved. One chick just wanted me to give 200 for the M& G! Please advise. I'm not paying the 200, I just wanted to know if this is standard practice.

It's not standard practice at all. Some guys do it when asked or as their default, but they're not actually converting any to the FC they wouldn't anyway even as they think they are.

If you're asked and refuse, in the proper and polite way where you explain where you're coming from, at least half will meet you anyway. The ones that won't are what are called rinsers, girls just looking to get paid to be bought dinner. And yes, that's a thing, some of them are very skilled at leading you to believe it's coming while they keep collecting platonic date money until you wise up and they find another sucker.

But the way you do it is you buy dinner, drinks, coffee whatever, some gas money if she drives in. Your time is as valuable as theirs and setting expectations that physical interaction is not required for assistance is how you get rinsed. In fact the true newbies I've had over the years, were not won over by money for platonic meets, but b / c I was willing to see them a few times for dates before expecting anything, usually just for coffee or drinks, to let them get comfortable. They got no allowances for that, I did a time or two provide a small gift (unasked) and I eventually converted almost if not all. The girl I'm ideally looking for values her comfort, safety, respect and that it will be positive and fun before proceeding.

[JZLizard]

All of this is just more proof that these girls are just hookers and we really think of them that way. Seriously, if I've been fucking a chick for 3 or 4 months, hiding everything becomes difficult.

For example, just take them to a bar (not a dive). Open a tab and give up your credit card. When you close, the bartender will walk up with the bill and your card and say, "thank you Mr. RogerOver. " I've had a girl tell me, "well, I'm going home and googling Roger Over. " LOL.

Try acquiring a bit of skill. You never use anything other than cash at a estaurant where you're pinned down into seats and vulnerable (because servers often mention the name on a card when they bring it to you), preferably not at a bar either, and if at a bar and you absolutely must use a card, never sit close to where tabs are being closed out -- leave her at the table to watch your jacket and her purse or whatever while you close it out. Anyone who has spent any amount of time protecting their identity knows that if you're really planning on surviving in this lifestyle, you need to be thinking about it at all times. And, if something unexpected happens and she does find out your name, then close the situation gracefully, without incident, and move on to the next. And, if you ever run into one stupid enough to say something like now that she knows your name she's going to google it, you just put on your poker face, say something funny like you hope she doesn't read about your serial killer background, and play it off like you couldn't care less. Then you send her home with cum stains on her dress, telling her you'll call her again and then you go dark.

Or optionally, just don't get married and leave all your assets on the table (that's the path I took). That, combined with a reasonable but not paranoid level of anonymity protection, keeps my cock happy enough. Aside from a paternity suit, there's not much any of these SBs could do to my life (other than moderate professional embarassment maybe) that could bring me down even if they tried.

Because I've designed around it.

[Ltnric]

No, it's definitely not standard practice, based on prior discussions. I'd cover a meal or coffee or something like that, but no outright gifts for a meet and greet.

I also agree not normal. Any girl who wants to get paid just to go out on a date isn't taking the SB life style seriously. I would skip that. The sad part is the last time I got on SA almost every girl wanted to get paid for M&G.

[Zcochran00]

Are you guys giving any donations at the meet and greet? I have not been, although I do pay for the meal if a meal is involved. One chick just wanted me to give 200 for the M& G! Please advise. I'm not paying the 200, I just wanted to know if this is standard practice.

No, it's definitely not standard practice, based on prior discussions. I'd cover a meal or coffee or something like that, but no outright gifts for a meet and greet.

[TwoDirection]

One chick just wanted me to give 200 for the M& G! Please advise. I'm not paying the 200, I just wanted to know if this is standard practice.

I almost always do, with the amount varying depending on how interested I am in the girl. Usually $50 to $100 though, since it's a short date. $200 would have to be a perfect 10 girl.

IMO the choicest girls on the site are the ones who don't want to be paid for sex, and so paying them for a date without sex is the easiest way to get them to have sex with you.

[Geechie Dan]

Are you guys giving any donations at the meet and greet? I have not been, although I do pay for the meal if a meal is involved. One chick just wanted me to give 200 for the M& G! Please advise. I'm not paying the 200, I just wanted to know if this is standard practice.

[VeryBigBuck]

I had that happen to me a month ago on a meet and greet. Same thing checking in a at hotel, I usually try to check in solo, but sometimes it is uncertain if a room will be needed.

At a hotel, I ask SB to sit down in one of the lobby chairs out of ear shot of the front desk to avoid hearing the name usage. Or use the digital key option that the hilton brands are using. The latter is not a sure thing, sometimes you must stop by the lobby anyway.

[Al Melrose]

All of this is just more proof that these girls are just hookers and we really think of them that way. Seriously, if I've been fucking a chick for 3 or 4 months, hiding everything becomes difficult.

For example, just take them to a bar (not a dive). Open a tab and give up your credit card. When you close, the bartender will walk up with the bill and your card and say, "thank you Mr. RogerOver. " I've had a girl tell me, "well, I'm going home and googling Roger Over. " LOL.

Seriously. Farfaraway, you keep mentioning that hot chick that "craves" you. She has no idea who you are IRL?

I had that happen to me a month ago on a meet and greet. Same thing checking in a at hotel, I usually try to check in solo, but sometimes it is uncertain if a room will be needed.

[RogerOver]

Having GV on your own, regular phone gives the chance that breadcrumbs are left on it that could be found by someone more tech savvy than the SO. Also, I know of specific cases where someone had messaged w / a POT on his regular phone using GV, she called, he replied, but unbeknownst to him at the time, the return call came from his real # instead of the GV# - so the POT got his real cell phone #. Not good. I have heard that one can delete GV from one's phone when done w / it, then re-install it. This seems like a pain, and must involve re-entering info each time this is done.

I made the mistake described above, I am not really sure how it happened, but luckily I did it on my burner, not on my regular cell phone. It didn't really bother me that the POT had my regular burner # in addition to my GV #. She was a little puzzled about it, thought it made me look more like a scammer, but it didn't have any long-term negative consequences.

All very true. Opsec requires awareness and care, regardless of whether you use a burner, an app or both. Each of us uses what works for and is comfortable for us based on our own situations and assessment of risks. There's no one "right" answer.

All of this is just more proof that these girls are just hookers and we really think of them that way. Seriously, if I've been fucking a chick for 3 or 4 months, hiding everything becomes difficult.

For example, just take them to a bar (not a dive). Open a tab and give up your credit card. When you close, the bartender will walk up with the bill and your card and say, "thank you Mr. RogerOver. " I've had a girl tell me, "well, I'm going home and googling Roger Over. " LOL.

Seriously. Farfaraway, you keep mentioning that hot chick that "craves" you. She has no idea who you are IRL?

[FarFarAway]

Bowl brothers. I am going to (maybe) TOFTT by getting a paid membership on a site other than seeking. I have profiles on Established Men and Secret Benefits, and there do seem to be some relevant women on them. I am thinking about other sites I have found including Age Match. Please advise me for or against any of these.

[CantWinLosin]

Having GV on your own, regular phone gives the chance that breadcrumbs are left on it that could be found by someone more tech savvy than the SO. Also, I know of specific cases where someone had messaged w / a POT on his regular phone using GV, she called, he replied, but unbeknownst to him at the time, the return call came from his real # instead of the GV# - so the POT got his real cell phone #. Not good. I have heard that one can delete GV from one's phone when done w / it, then re-install it. This seems like a pain, and must involve re-entering info each time this is done.

I made the mistake described above, I am not really sure how it happened, but luckily I did it on my burner, not on my regular cell phone. It didn't really bother me that the POT had my regular burner # in addition to my GV #. She was a little puzzled about it, thought it made me look more like a scammer, but it didn't have any long-term negative consequences.

All very true. Opsec requires awareness and care, regardless of whether you use a burner, an app or both. Each of us uses what works for and is comfortable for us based on our own situations and assessment of risks. There's no one "right" answer.

[FarFarAway]

The goal for the girls is to have more info on you than you have on them. The ones savvy enough to understand phones today want to know a "hard" phone number (a number assigned by a LEC to a specific physical device or POTS landline) so if you crack their skull or rob them, they have something to give the cops or their BF / pimp to track you down. They know that the number they have from you may be an untraceable burner too, but at least the chance is higher that someone will be able to be tracked from a hard number than it is from an app. The girl may also do a whitepages-type lookup on the number and if it doesn't associate with a specific person, even though it's a physical phone and not an app, the girl ignore you.

In terms of raw security, a burner is more secure than GV or other app on a phone. Any app for your phone that assigns a pseudo number to act on your phone's behalf, like GV, has to at least have your phone's actual hard number stored on their servers - and that data can be subpoena-ed. A burner that required no personally identifying info to buy for cash and which you pay cash for reload cards offers zero paper trail back to you. But neither is completely secure, because both can be physically tracked down via the cell towers they connect to.

But a burner is also a separate physical device that can be found by someone. You can maybe explain it away, but it still raises questions if found. So does an app on your phone, *if* the person finding the phone is savvy enough to know what to look for and what the app does. Everybody's situation is different, but in my case, if my SO went thru my phone, having GV on it is considerably less risky than would be having pics of other women in the pics app or a bunch of unknown women's names in contacts.

Having GV on your own, regular phone gives the chance that breadcrumbs are left on it that could be found by someone more tech savvy than the SO. Also, I know of specific cases where someone had messaged w / a POT on his regular phone using GV, she called, he replied, but unbeknownst to him at the time, the return call came from his real # instead of the GV# - so the POT got his real cell phone #. Not good. I have heard that one can delete GV from one's phone when done w / it, then re-install it. This seems like a pain, and must involve re-entering info each time this is done.

I made the mistake described above, I am not really sure how it happened, but luckily I did it on my burner, not on my regular cell phone. It didn't really bother me that the POT had my regular burner # in addition to my GV #. She was a little puzzled about it, thought it made me look more like a scammer, but it didn't have any long-term negative consequences.