"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[JZLizard]

So JL, when is hunting season beginning for you this year? I remember the GF might not leave town? It's nice to live vicariously. I feel like I am doing that already. My public dating is nil and I am angling for an UTR that is low volume. So in my profile as to "I'm seeking" I just put no travel, dinner, or drinks, just you and me LOL. We'll see if I scare all of them away. I might try mixed / black. I usually screen for Cauc / Asian, but I have had several great times with the former. They might be easier and cheapr as Hollywood says. After all, I just want a FB to show up and Polish my knob without being the 12th for the day.

Re: POF. I established a profile and got caught in this testing BS that took AN HOUR! When I finally got to screening I hit the age thing too. So we have to put our age under 30 to see these 20 yr olds.

Old girls: So I started screening for up to 40 yrs old thinking they are more desperate. Well so far they are the epitome of GPS AND less appealing t me, so back to the teenies.

Unfortunately I never know for sure when I will get my next "mancation" from the GF, it depends on her schedule and there's nothing on the immediate horizon in the next few months at least. Sometimes an impromptu trip will arise, it's just hard to predict when. I usually get about a months notice which is usually ample time to make some SB contacts for a little travel play. I've considered creating some "needs for business related travel" for me that is independent of her schedule, but it's so much easier when she travels first because it distracts her from focusing on what I might be doing while she's gone.

Regarding your thoughts on cougars: I used to always think that once a cougar turned the corner (after mid-late thirties or so) they would look in the mirror and say to themselves "ok, I'm not as hot as I used to be, it's time to lower the standards". However, my experience with women has been that either they are generally not as smart as that, or let's put it more tactfully and say that their behavior is more hormone-driven than logical. In other words, they tend to become even more demanding, more bitchy, and less pleasant to be around the older they get. I'm not necessarily saying all females become worthless after 40 (for those of us with wives / girlfriends / mothers / daughters / etc.). I'm saying the kind of women who will advertise themselves on an SB site. Or, better yet it applies to regular civvy dating as well. If they are still single at age 40, there's a good chance they are just plain damaged goods. Sure, some of them end up divorced for reasons that aren't their own fault, but for the most part if they were really a woman worth keeping around, someone married them a long time ago and did just that.

Speaking of which, the other day I was watching Amy Fisher's live web cam. Yes, Joey Buttafuoco's Amy Fisher. She was sitting there on the bed, chubby and looking like a nasty mess, and she was bitching about how nobody would pay $2! She was going "what's wrong fellas, ya like to just show up and try to get a looks fer free do yas"? In a jersey accent. LOL It was the stereotypical hormonal rant, but she was chastising potential customers -- some of the worst salesmanship I've ever seen. I was just sitting there laughing, refraining from saying things like "come on Amy, calm down, nobody wants to get shot in the head here". But I took the high road and did not. She eventually logged off.

[Playa12]

As some may know I broke up with my sb gf about 4 months ago. I saw her today for the first time in a month. It's not really about the sugar anymore. Thats basically over. I spent about 55 dollars throughout the day. I will now refer to her lovingly as my "pillow princess". Because that's what she is. Part of why we had to break up.

The other part was her lack of endurance. But as a regular girl to see once or twice a month, she's cool, in love (and too pretty to ignore). And she is still exclusive to me except for maybe an occasional girl she has on the side and I am not even sure of that.

I think we may have found a way to have a successful afternoon date. Low drama, very loving, and it keeps us connected. Here she is today with no makeup and her hair undone. Almost time for walking dead and then afterward I am gonna drop by to see my new "tomboy princess" for a car date.

Fuck it, I'm moving to LA. LOL.

[HollywoodGuy]

I guess I was a bit woozy from my date with the "pillow princess". I accidentally took an ambien instead of the vitamin C I was gonna use to perk up for my date. Woke up 3 hours later and called to apologize for flaking. I'll try seeing her tomorrow.

[HollywoodGuy]

As some may know I broke up with my sb gf about 4 months ago. I saw her today for the first time in a month. It's not really about the sugar anymore. Thats basically over. I spent about 55 dollars throughout the day. I will now refer to her lovingly as my "pillow princess". Because that's what she is. Part of why we had to break up.

The other part was her lack of endurance. But as a regular girl to see once or twice a month, she's cool, in love (and too pretty to ignore). And she is still exclusive to me except for maybe an occasional girl she has on the side and I am not even sure of that.

I think we may have found a way to have a successful afternoon date. Low drama, very loving, and it keeps us connected. Here she is today with no makeup and her hair undone. Almost time for walking dead and then afterward I am gonna drop by to see my new "tomboy princess" for a car date.

[FotoGuy1970]

UPDATE on SA POT 2: She asked to postpone lunch date due to feeling under the weather and we decided to get together tomorrow and go straight to the FC. She is looking for 2-3 visits a week at $$ - $$$ per week or whatever I feel comfortable with. Never had such a hot SB with such low expectations. If she's really good in the FC I plan on giving her a bit more than she's expecting, to make sure she keeps cumming back to me.

SA POT 3: Almost right after I posted my previous report, I had an initial message to HCB get responded to. She's local, has never been a SB before, and has no idea what to expect, but she is definitely aware that she'll need to be spending FC time with me before I open my wallet. We decided on 1-2 visits per week at $. 5 per visit. Again, another young hottie with low expectations. This is very, very rare for this area.

[FredMoore]

So JL, when is hunting season beginning for you this year? I remember the GF might not leave town? It's nice to live vicariously. I feel like I am doing that already. My public dating is nil and I am angling for an UTR that is low volume. So in my profile as to "I'm seeking" I just put no travel, dinner, or drinks, just you and me LOL. We'll see if I scare all of them away. I might try mixed / black. I usually screen for Cauc / Asian, but I have had several great times with the former. They might be easier and cheapr as Hollywood says. After all, I just want a FB to show up and Polish my knob without being the 12th for the day.

Re: POF. I established a profile and got caught in this testing BS that took AN HOUR! When I finally got to screening I hit the age thing too. So we have to put our age under 30 to see these 20 yr olds.

Old girls: So I started screening for up to 40 yrs old thinking they are more desperate. Well so far they are the epitome of GPS AND less appealing t me, so back to the teenies.

[Dandy Don]

It's been years since I used POF, but to the best of my knowledge it does have "age matching" features that will typically make it challenging to contact girls if you are outside of the age range they've specified being interested in. Pretty much all the civy dating sites do this in one way or another, otherwise the young hot ones would get flooded with hits from guys outside their range, and that's not good for business because it frustrates them into avoiding the site. Some of them only limit your search results to women for which your profile meets their requirements, and some of them even block messages -- POF may be one of the latter, I simply don't remember.

One thing you can try to do is create a profile that takes 15 years or so off your age, then simply come out in your intro letter and explain what you're looking for. Do not expect a high level of response from this approach, in fact it's going to be a fraction of your response rate from SA and some might flat out tell you to fuck off. Don't get discouraged -- civy sites are very different from the SD sites. You might find girls on POF that subconsciously want to be an SB but have not really given it enough consideration yet. Your note propositioning her might get the mental juices flowing. She may not respond at all, but in a few weeks you may see her on one of the SD sites. So if nothing else it does help to recruit new SBs. So, even if it looks like you're not getting results, you may actually be benefiting by an increase in female membership on the SD sites in your area.

I found some good stuff on POF several years back -- I wasn't SB hunting, it was free pussy costing me only maybe dinner and drinks -- but it didn't come easy. Lots of requests sent out, many of whom never respond at all. All it takes is that one that rocks your world though.

I thought at first I would play it straight and see what happens but that isn't going so well so far. So probably in another week I will create a more fake profile and take that approach of saying I am younger than trying to explain. I am usually a good talker.

[FotoGuy1970]

After taking a few months leave of absence, I've jumped back into the sugar world. No success yet, but I have several nibbles I'm working on:

CL POT 1: Really nice girl next door type with just a few extra pounds in all the right places. Really interested in the whole SD / SB relationship, but it's been tough to arrange even so much as a M&G with her as she lives 90+ minutes away and still lives with parents. But her communication skills have been solid and she's been giving a GFE through texts so far and she has zero expectations as far as what I would provide to her. The only hurdles will be actually getting to see each other.

CL POT 2: Hot college girl who is financially strapped, so is looking for a SD to help her out. She's really hot, but she's 2 hours away. However, she is willing to meet halfway. We've discussed a possible M&G for next weekend. However, her communication skills are the worst and she admits that. Long, long breaks of silence between text messages, which I hate. Between the distance and the lack of communication, I'm not sure how this one will work out.

SA POT 1: Young hot, sexual blonde with big tits. She has a busy schedule, but we're trying to work it out. She indicated she may be good with skipping the M&G and just going to the FC, which I normally don't like to do. If she's as kinky and wild as she claims to be, she'll be a keeper.

SA POT 2: Had a M&G with this really cute young college girl last night. She liked to talk. She says that she's been in 2 arrangements before and both were mutually beneficial, but so far there hasn't been any discussion of sex, which is a bit of a red flag for me. I've heard the "I've been in mutually beneficial arrangements before!" line in the past, but when it came down to it, the girl was only interested in getting paid and giving nothing in return. I'm kinda worried that that may be the case here. It's been hard to get a bead on her: She seems awkward and uncomfortable and nervous, but I don't know if that was just first meeting nerves. We're supposed to have a lunch date today and "see where it goes", so I guess today will give me a better indication of what to expect from this one. Regardless, the wallet stays closed until we go to the FC.

I have a few other random POTs on SA and CL who have expressed interest, but so far the ones I discussed above are the best / most interesting ones. I will report more when I have more to report.

[JZLizard]

This is a great idea and I created a profile on POF. And sure enough, several girls from SA are on POF. But here's what I have been encountering. Every time I message them I get this automated message: So and So accepts messages only from certain users. Why not message one of your Matches instead? Return to your inbox.

A little research revealed that POF allows users to block messages based on various criteria, including age. I am in my mid-40's and of course I am messaging girls in their 20's. So far, I haven't been able to successfully message anyone under 30. I find it hard to believe that every single woman under 30 that I have message has ruled out older guys, especially if they have profile on SA. So I am led to believe that POF is doing this, but of course I could be wrong.

Anybody else experiencing this?

It's been years since I used POF, but to the best of my knowledge it does have "age matching" features that will typically make it challenging to contact girls if you are outside of the age range they've specified being interested in. Pretty much all the civy dating sites do this in one way or another, otherwise the young hot ones would get flooded with hits from guys outside their range, and that's not good for business because it frustrates them into avoiding the site. Some of them only limit your search results to women for which your profile meets their requirements, and some of them even block messages -- POF may be one of the latter, I simply don't remember.

One thing you can try to do is create a profile that takes 15 years or so off your age, then simply come out in your intro letter and explain what you're looking for. Do not expect a high level of response from this approach, in fact it's going to be a fraction of your response rate from SA and some might flat out tell you to fuck off. Don't get discouraged -- civy sites are very different from the SD sites. You might find girls on POF that subconsciously want to be an SB but have not really given it enough consideration yet. Your note propositioning her might get the mental juices flowing. She may not respond at all, but in a few weeks you may see her on one of the SD sites. So if nothing else it does help to recruit new SBs. So, even if it looks like you're not getting results, you may actually be benefiting by an increase in female membership on the SD sites in your area.

I found some good stuff on POF several years back -- I wasn't SB hunting, it was free pussy costing me only maybe dinner and drinks -- but it didn't come easy. Lots of requests sent out, many of whom never respond at all. All it takes is that one that rocks your world though.

[DogSun]

This is a great idea and I created a profile on POF. And sure enough, several girls from SA are on POF. But here's what I have been encountering. Every time I message them I get this automated message: So and So accepts messages only from certain users. Why not message one of your Matches instead? Return to your inbox.

A little research revealed that POF allows users to block messages based on various criteria, including age. I am in my mid-40's and of course I am messaging girls in their 20's. So far, I haven't been able to successfully message anyone under 30. I find it hard to believe that every single woman under 30 that I have message has ruled out older guys, especially if they have profile on SA. So I am led to believe that POF is doing this, but of course I could be wrong.

Anybody else experiencing this?

For her dating life, she probably wants someone younger, which is why she has the age restriction. Probably not going to be so picky when it comes to sugar. So the solution is simple. Create a new profile and lie about your age. If all you're looking for is a sugar relationship, and the girl is into that, she's not going to care that you're older than your profile states.

[Dandy Don]

Here's something I've used with some success. pof.com It's a free dating site, and you will find women on here that are interested in a sugar relationship. One thing you can do if you're not a paying member for SA, is to sign up for a free membership and look at the women that are active in your area. You'll find more than a few that are also on POF. Once you find them, proposition them on POF and they're usually at least receptive to some negotiating. It's takes more work this way, but if you're not willing to pay the monthly membership fee, it is an option.

This is a great idea and I created a profile on POF. And sure enough, several girls from SA are on POF. But here's what I have been encountering. Every time I message them I get this automated message: So and So accepts messages only from certain users. Why not message one of your Matches instead? Return to your inbox.

A little research revealed that POF allows users to block messages based on various criteria, including age. I am in my mid-40's and of course I am messaging girls in their 20's. So far, I haven't been able to successfully message anyone under 30. I find it hard to believe that every single woman under 30 that I have message has ruled out older guys, especially if they have profile on SA. So I am led to believe that POF is doing this, but of course I could be wrong.

Anybody else experiencing this?

[JZLizard]

In my experience, what makes an SB an SB is that they are selective.

That is pretty much the defining criteria. Where it gets tricky is that there are varying degrees of each type of girl.

The characteristic of a pro is that they will fuck anyone for the right price, and there is no emotional investment on their part. The characteristic of a true SB is that they expect financial help, but they still choose their partners and often get emotionally invested. I personally don't stay with any SB long enough to see how bad it can get, but I've met girls who told me flat out they fell in love with their last SD and they are looking for something similar in their next relationship, it happens.

There are a lot of girls who have daddy issues or for whatever reason are genuinely attracted to older men. It's been that way since the beginning of time. If they do have that itch to scratch, are they more likely to look for some old dude that hasn't got a pot to piss in, or are they more likely to seek out someone who can take them on nice trips and buy them nice things? Pretty much common sense. They are drawn to SD sites because there is some perception of wealth among the men and an upscale vibe (as well as the verification of credit card payment from the men which helps them feel safer about their dating preference and meet ups). If they just wanted to get fucked by a random cock, they can get on Tinder and make that happen in about 10 minutes. They are looking for cock that's a little less random and comes with additional benefits.

An escort / UTR girl doesn't care who you are or what you look like as long as you're not too creepy and are willing to pay.

[Madaboutmax]

In my experience, what makes an SB an SB is that they are selective. They are looking for financial support, but are not willing to do anything for anyone to get it. As much as the financial support, they are looking to be treated better than they are typically treated by guys closer to their own age. They want a gentleman that cab show them the finer things, have fun and avoid the drama. They usually are surprised and how much of a difference experience makes in the bedroom.

I've had several SBs now that started off making it clear they want a "No Strings" relationship, but ended up wanted to be a girlfriend.

So many have sexual fantasies that younger guys just candle handle or can't make happen. When they have the best sex of their lives with a man twice their age it changes their view completely.

Some of my best experiences have been with new SB'S that enter the lifestyle reluctantly and appreciate someone who can guide them in their sexual exploration.

They all complain about guys on the Sugar sites that treat them like straight hookers off Backpage. There certainly on plenty of pros on the sites, but if you want a tru SB (in my definition), you need to bait your line for the fish you want to catch and act accordingly.

Just my thoughts.

[JeanSaulPartre]

I think "my friend" was playing this game for the last six years. Yes, he got a bit wrinkly with time, but in his hay days he was a model for a well-known brand. His experience with "sugar" has been very positive and he is now a big fan of SA. SA did well, for him, I believe.

I also think my friend have seen enough pros, UTRs, ERo $, BP and the oThER site material to tell a professional apart from a genuine person, who is new to this and trying to have a bit of fun while making an honest buck. He is a god tipper and his problem, I heard, not to line up SBs, but to figure out how to fit a few of them in his busy life. I would not immediately insult his intelligence just based on his never visiting this site.

What I said was that one finds people who will fit in their sugar lifestyle. His lifestyle is limited to a few hours after work. Since he is an intelligent and a decent looking man with some cash to burn, he does find and retain intelligent and good looking young women who would rather adjust to his timeline (which, on the surface, is no different from one's "appointment" with a pro) than look for anything more involved. If an SB agrees to seeing you in this setting, this automatically does not make her a UTR and / or a pro. In fact, I would argue that some SBs who agree to see my friend in this setting (that, in addition to a date may or may not include a fancy dinner or a gift card, but nothing else) consciously chose to limit their exposure so that they do not get themselves in that deeper. Again, I leave it up to you to take this at my word or draw your own conclusions.

The worst thing we can do is believe that what is truly out there is defined by our own limited experiences. In addition to the experiences I've shared here, others have posted fully believable anecdotal experiences to this thread about their "relationships" with real SBs, and anyone who has been paying attention can see that some of those encounters are far different than the hourly escort / UTR experience.

[JZLizard]

I think the notion that "the real SBs" of the non-escort type are keen to be a part of the SDs life and take two $hits about him being successful or what not is not quite true.

I'm not fully certain I understand the basis of your disagreement completely, but my most recent mention of real SBs being attracted to successful men has nothing to do with how much she cares about him as a person if that's what you mean.

I mean that women like successful men. They have money, they are smart, they have confidence that the average poor working stiffs don't have and they have status in life. Women are attracted to that. Anyone who has trouble understanding that has a long way to go toward understanding women. Whether you are talking about true SBs, hookers, or the typical housewife, you are going to have to search for a long time to find one who would express a preference for a run of the mill lackey over someone who has achieved some things in life.

I am quite certain "my friend' had the pleasure of the company of at least two "real SBs" absolutely non-escort type who were content with seeing him in a totally "escort-like" setting, for a couple of hours in a hotel, paid arrangements for purely intimate purposes. I think the SBs actually wanted to totally compartmentalize the encounter, so that "my friend" had no part in their "real" life once the sugar relationship started. Interestingly, while "my friend" went on dates before sugaring, he had a lot more in a way of intense engaging conversations and text exchanges. Once sugaring started, these stopped.

Just sounds like "your friend" encountered a couple of pros. If he has not yet been able to meet any real SBs, it's going to be impossible for him to create an *informed* (operative word) opinion about the differences between the two. There are a lot of guys whose approach to meeting girls completely determines the type of girls they will meet. They never modify their technique, so they never see any other type of girl.

Is your friend relatively young (by SD standards I mean), attractive and successful? To the point that he has no problems getting laid and attracting women significantly younger than him outside of the realm of SD websites? If so, he will quickly find he has the type of real SB I'm talking about lined up waiting to meet him on these sites. If he is 75 years old, not in the best physical condition of his life, or has never had much dating success anyway, he is going to find himself on a different end of the supply and demand spectrum in terms of the sugar world.

The worst thing we can do is believe that what is truly out there is defined by our own limited experiences. In addition to the experiences I've shared here, others have posted fully believable anecdotal experiences to this thread about their "relationships" with real SBs, and anyone who has been paying attention can see that some of those encounters are far different than the hourly escort / UTR experience.