Rants, Raves and Opinions AKA "The Octagon"

[Bucks97]

I totally agree with you Bucs...,most of these guys would be shocked if the truth were to be known about how many of these girls are on one kind of a drug or the other. I recall someone saying to stay away from a provider because she was on the needle hard and I asked my self, how dess he know all of the girls he sees isn't hitting the needle? HARD! With the current landscape of just about every addicted person turning to heroin because of its availabiluty, cheap price, and how addictive it is. I mean what do these guys do? Carry a urine test kit? Hair test kit? And have a lab follow them to thier appointments? Most of these ladies are using our funds to attain drugs to feed thier addiction, do not buy into the fantasy that they are using the money for anything other than that.

Some folks on here will probably know of the individual. Sometimes it's just hard to believe someone you've come to trust, consider a friend, and has vehemently talked about the problems of heroin use is in fact a heroin user. I've had other cases where a provider will go through a list of the drug problems of others in the business while denying her own involvement, only to see her turn up in the mugshots with a drug charge. Usually these days, those charges involve heroin.

We'd all like to think we can instantly spot drug users, that they're obvious, that they're horrible people we can dismiss easily. The sad fact is that they're not. Often, they're pretty damn good people with a particular, potentially fatal weakness. And that's something that leads them to do this for a living, because it beats shoplifting and all the copper was long ago removed from the vacant buildings. True, the ones who don't even bother to hide their addictions anymore are worse off and probably closer to fatal overdoses and are even more dangerous to be around.

I have actually run into the occasional young woman who really is doing it as a temporary way to pay some bills.- but they are I believe the exceptions. I'm sure there are some others who do this for the long haul and are not addicts, though I certainly wouldn't bet on it in any particular case. And there are at least a few I know of who've gotten clean, seem to be doing well, and, guess what? They don't go back into the hobby. This is in part because drug addiction is an occupational hazard of being in the hobby and the temptation would make it harder to stay clean. Not to venture into forbidden topic areas, but one reason some providers won't see guys of a certain demographic profile is the belief that these guys only want to offer drugs in barter, not cash. This is an unfair characterization in part because there are also some guys of other demographic profiles, such as a former local politician, who was doing the same thing.

We'd all like to think, well most of us probably, the money we're spending isn't being used to buy drugs. But in most cases, I simply wouldn't bet on it. I don't think it helps to delude ourselves. And I can do without sanctimonious BS from guys who are convinced they're only seeing non-addicts when that's most likely untrue and they have no way of really knowing whether it is or not.

[KeepnItReel]

I'm just saying that believing some of your favorite providers aren't drug users is probably delusional and sets up a distinction that has no real difference. They're not all glassy eyed, track marked or undependable. Even among the heroin users, some are pretty good at shooting up where it doesn't show and others are just snorting it. I've simply seen way too many alert and seemingly sober women in this business who end up getting arrested with drugs or needles. I've seen at least one case of a "respected senior" swearing a higher-end provider is clean despite said provider having just pleaded guilty to drug-related charges.

It's only prudent to assume that any provider you visit in this hobby is a drug user and recognize the risks. That's why having them to your home or in your car is a bad idea. You get pulled over and she decides to ditch her drugs or supplies and suddenly you're in a whole other level of legal culpability. I'm assuming the guys who are using streetwalkers are aware of this risk, because that's a population where pretty much 100% of the providers are drug users. I'm not sure the guys using escorts are always aware of the risk, and they should be.

I totally agree with you Bucs...,most of these guys would be shocked if the truth were to be known about how many of these girls are on one kind of a drug or the other. I recall someone saying to stay away from a provider because she was on the needle hard and I asked my self, how dess he know all of the girls he sees isn't hitting the needle? HARD! With the current landscape of just about every addicted person turning to heroin because of its availabiluty, cheap price, and how addictive it is. I mean what do these guys do? Carry a urine test kit? Hair test kit? And have a lab follow them to thier appointments? Most of these ladies are using our funds to attain drugs to feed thier addiction, do not buy into the fantasy that they are using the money for anything other than that.

[PillowTalk69]

I'm just saying that believing some of your favorite providers aren't drug users is probably delusional and sets up a distinction that has no real difference. They're not all glassy eyed, track marked or undependable. Even among the heroin users, some are pretty good at shooting up where it doesn't show and others are just snorting it. I've simply seen way too many alert and seemingly sober women in this business who end up getting arrested with drugs or needles. I've seen at least one case of a "respected senior" swearing a higher-end provider is clean despite said provider having just pleaded guilty to drug-related charges.

It's only prudent to assume that any provider you visit in this hobby is a drug user and recognize the risks. That's why having them to your home or in your car is a bad idea. You get pulled over and she decides to ditch her drugs or supplies and suddenly you're in a whole other level of legal culpability. I'm assuming the guys who are using streetwalkers are aware of this risk, because that's a population where pretty much 100% of the providers are drug users. I'm not sure the guys using escorts are always aware of the risk, and they should be.

A long time may or may not have a plan that works for them in that respect. Let each person deal with ladies as fits them. We all know there are many risks and just by being in this we accept that fact. None of us in this know anything for sure. We can only take a leap of faith based on fellow mongerers and who we see and go from there with who we chose to see and not see. Have a great week and Happy Thanksgiving early.

[Bucks97]

I didn't say we can get rid of them but women who depend on their dollars by doing this aren't going to get much from the quality men if they don't use them. Drugs put you in the company of some bad dudes who are also on this. Why would any guy fuck a woman on drugs? Doesn't make sense. Why would any man use a woman who is glassy eyed, has track marks on her body and is generally undependable. Many reviews talk about guys who drop their girls off BEFORE they get busy to go visit their supplier before delivering the good. I have no illusions we can get rid of them but that doesn't mean anyone has to use their services no matter how good they fk does it? I am not self righteous. Anyone in this has no business being so as it is all illegal. Feel free to laugh and no offense taken. But if one has the opportunity to be with quality, no drugs, no worries about bfs, husbands or pimps threatening you then it seems common sense you go in the direction of best performance and least worries. Just my feelings. There will always be the drug heads in or out of this that are looking for fast money but good quality usually provides the laeast worries. Do appreciate your side of the post but not trying to get rid of something that like the oldest profession has been around for ever. Legally speaking it is one thing to get busted for visiting a lady of the evening. It is way more serious if she happens to be a user and has it in her possession. I agree there are guys who deny their favorites are using because they are good fucks if they aren't spaced out or needing a fix. But is that really where most men want to go or do we want quality in our bedfs? Have a good weekend.

I'm just saying that believing some of your favorite providers aren't drug users is probably delusional and sets up a distinction that has no real difference. They're not all glassy eyed, track marked or undependable. Even among the heroin users, some are pretty good at shooting up where it doesn't show and others are just snorting it. I've simply seen way too many alert and seemingly sober women in this business who end up getting arrested with drugs or needles. I've seen at least one case of a "respected senior" swearing a higher-end provider is clean despite said provider having just pleaded guilty to drug-related charges.

It's only prudent to assume that any provider you visit in this hobby is a drug user and recognize the risks. That's why having them to your home or in your car is a bad idea. You get pulled over and she decides to ditch her drugs or supplies and suddenly you're in a whole other level of legal culpability. I'm assuming the guys who are using streetwalkers are aware of this risk, because that's a population where pretty much 100% of the providers are drug users. I'm not sure the guys using escorts are always aware of the risk, and they should be.

[Admin2]

It's not the dope. Seriously it's not. It's the legal status. If prostitution were legal the addicts would be out of the business nearly overnight. In Argentina it's not against the law for some girl to sell me some pussy nor is it against the law for me to buy some. Because of this, there are an estimated 30,000 sex workers in Buenos Aires and probably 10,000 of them are really hot chicks. (the 30,000 includes the alternative providers as well). The competition eliminates the addicts. If some hot girl from Cleveland can come to Sincy for a weekend and earn in one night what it would take her two to three weeks back home what do you think they will do.

Of course it would shut down the titty bars though.

[Admin2]

Not sure if this is the best place to post, but thought I'd bounce this issue off the community.

I had a business meeting in an upscale hotel conference room with about 15 people, both sexes. We had an private unisex bathroom for our conference room. After lunch, I had to go #1 and there was an older guy already in the bathroom. I noticed a semi-attractive lady in our group that was waiting after me. When I get in the bathroom, I noticed the older guy had dribbled / peed all over the bowl rim and floor. Like a lot. I wasn't sure what to do. I didn't want the attractive lady thinking I left the bathroom like that so I went ahead and grabbed a bunch of towels and wiped it up.

What would you do in that situation?

Ask the attractive lady if she would give me a blowjob, and then while she was distracted I would clean the bowl. She gets a clean seat, I get a BJ. Classic Steven Covey win / win!

[BigMack]

Aside from anything else in this statement, some worthwhile and some not, the sad fact is that this hobby would barely exist if it weren't for drug abusers. I know there are guys who think their favorites aren't using. The providers may say so vehemently at times, and they even go deeply into diatribes about all the other drug abusers they know about. Guess what? They're lying. Or possibly they're delusional or in denial, like the guys who believe them. I have been in that place, and have been pretty well fooled once or twice, but I no longer am. There are simply very few women who do this for very long if they're not supporting a drug habit. So if you're going to get all self righteous about getting the "druggies" out of the business, I'm sorry sir, but I'm going to have to laugh.

Now, I would say that providers who at this point are charging anywhere north of $100 and sticking to it may be less likely to be addicts. But the reality is that one factor that's driven the prices down in this community, I believe, is the prevalence of heroin use and the need for providers to get their fixes fast. The other reality is that if you somehow actually succeeded in getting the "druggies" out of this trade, the rates would skyrocket and the entire sex trade would collapse. If you can't deal with the reality that many, probably most, of the women you're going to meet in this hobby are using, then you'd probably better get out of it.

I didn't say we can get rid of them but women who depend on their dollars by doing this aren't going to get much from the quality men if they don't use them. Drugs put you in the company of some bad dudes who are also on this. Why would any guy fuck a woman on drugs? Doesn't make sense. Why would any man use a woman who is glassy eyed, has track marks on her body and is generally undependable. Many reviews talk about guys who drop their girls off BEFORE they get busy to go visit their supplier before delivering the good. I have no illusions we can get rid of them but that doesn't mean anyone has to use their services no matter how good they fk does it? I am not self righteous. Anyone in this has no business being so as it is all illegal. Feel free to laugh and no offense taken. But if one has the opportunity to be with quality, no drugs, no worries about bfs, husbands or pimps threatening you then it seems common sense you go in the direction of best performance and least worries. Just my feelings. There will always be the drug heads in or out of this that are looking for fast money but good quality usually provides the laeast worries. Do appreciate your side of the post but not trying to get rid of something that like the oldest profession has been around for ever. Legally speaking it is one thing to get busted for visiting a lady of the evening. It is way more serious if she happens to be a user and has it in her possession. I agree there are guys who deny their favorites are using because they are good fucks if they aren't spaced out or needing a fix. But is that really where most men want to go or do we want quality in our bedfs? Have a good weekend.

[Bucks97]

Men need to trust each other for good intell just as women do. We need to support one another to keep the boards safe. Most important, we need to clean out the time wasters, the druggies, the sleepers, those who don't keep appointments without a good reason and without giving forewarnings. Most of all we men need to quit seeing ladies with drug habits, failure to follow up, and those who turn on men and territorial in their treatment of other ladies and men. It is ludicrous when any client reads another clients review who states the lady he saw had tracks over her body, appeared out of it or under the influence, mechanical and not really into it, or gives a 15 minute appointment but charges for and hour, but these same men will go back to see her again because she was hot and gave a good blow job and was okay in bed. REALLY? Okay for a $ plus and hour When I first got into this one of the most respected men on the boards had a saying that holds true even today. Take out the trash and what you have left is the good that we all seek out and want to see. Post reviews and be honest but not compromisingly honest. We all know there are some things ladies will do that they don't want known so DISCRETION is the key. PM is also a good way to distribute information but get rid of the druggies, cash and dashers, ladies with thugs and pimps who come out no where to put on the pressure. Just my 02 cents worth.

Aside from anything else in this statement, some worthwhile and some not, the sad fact is that this hobby would barely exist if it weren't for drug abusers. I know there are guys who think their favorites aren't using. The providers may say so vehemently at times, and they even go deeply into diatribes about all the other drug abusers they know about. Guess what? They're lying. Or possibly they're delusional or in denial, like the guys who believe them. I have been in that place, and have been pretty well fooled once or twice, but I no longer am. There are simply very few women who do this for very long if they're not supporting a drug habit. So if you're going to get all self righteous about getting the "druggies" out of the business, I'm sorry sir, but I'm going to have to laugh.

Now, I would say that providers who at this point are charging anywhere north of $100 and sticking to it may be less likely to be addicts. But the reality is that one factor that's driven the prices down in this community, I believe, is the prevalence of heroin use and the need for providers to get their fixes fast. The other reality is that if you somehow actually succeeded in getting the "druggies" out of this trade, the rates would skyrocket and the entire sex trade would collapse. If you can't deal with the reality that many, probably most, of the women you're going to meet in this hobby are using, then you'd probably better get out of it.

[HuntLadys29]

Not sure if this is the best place to post, but thought I'd bounce this issue off the community.

I had a business meeting in an upscale hotel conference room with about 15 people, both sexes. We had an private unisex bathroom for our conference room. After lunch, I had to go #1 and there was an older guy already in the bathroom. I noticed a semi-attractive lady in our group that was waiting after me. When I get in the bathroom, I noticed the older guy had dribbled / peed all over the bowl rim and floor. Like a lot. I wasn't sure what to do. I didn't want the attractive lady thinking I left the bathroom like that so I went ahead and grabbed a bunch of towels and wiped it up.

What would you do in that situation?

I guess you could have left it alone walked out and said that old guy pissed all over the toilet seat so be careful, and kept on trucking. I know my wife would never sit on a unisex pissy toilet she would have either not used it and waited or just squatted over the bowl and let it rip either way she would not Have cleaned it up nor Sat. On that toilet and I'm sure that attractive woman would not have either. Either way good story to put on the board.

[BuyingSmiles]

If you were a gentleman, you would have let the lady go in front of you. Then she would have found the mess!

I'm just messing with you dude. I probably would have done what you did as well.

Play safe.

Or he coulda just yelled who in the hell pissed all over the seat!

[MrNiceGuyCincy]

Not sure if this is the best place to post, but thought I'd bounce this issue off the community.

I had a business meeting in an upscale hotel conference room with about 15 people, both sexes. We had an private unisex bathroom for our conference room. After lunch, I had to go #1 and there was an older guy already in the bathroom. I noticed a semi-attractive lady in our group that was waiting after me. When I get in the bathroom, I noticed the older guy had dribbled / peed all over the bowl rim and floor. Like a lot. I wasn't sure what to do. I didn't want the attractive lady thinking I left the bathroom like that so I went ahead and grabbed a bunch of towels and wiped it up.

What would you do in that situation?

If you were a gentleman, you would have let the lady go in front of you. Then she would have found the mess!

I'm just messing with you dude. I probably would have done what you did as well.

Play safe.

[DavidNgrk]

Not sure if this is the best place to post, but thought I'd bounce this issue off the community.

I had a business meeting in an upscale hotel conference room with about 15 people, both sexes. We had an private unisex bathroom for our conference room. After lunch, I had to go #1 and there was an older guy already in the bathroom. I noticed a semi-attractive lady in our group that was waiting after me. When I get in the bathroom, I noticed the older guy had dribbled / peed all over the bowl rim and floor. Like a lot. I wasn't sure what to do. I didn't want the attractive lady thinking I left the bathroom like that so I went ahead and grabbed a bunch of towels and wiped it up.

What would you do in that situation?

[BigMack]

As long as men with lots of money run into ladies with lots of needs your analogy of might go might not be completely true. This is a business and as long as both sides remember that things should play out okay. However as long as there are tons of ladies available who need money for bills, kids and their needs, drugs, and can get it by providing or having their pimps, dealers, bfs, or husbands threaten or steal, always going to be problems. The later are the ones who need to be outted and removed from the forums just as A2 had done with some of the ladies with attitudes and guys with the same. Take out the trash and the forum will become a place for good service at reasonable rates, not a jungle of douche bags which we see on a semi dailey basis although the house is in the process of being cleaned up and the quality has surely gone up thanks to ladies and gents speaking up. Just my 1 cent. Obama tax.

[CharmingBlake]

This is crazy shit here going on. This is a freakin business and a hobby not a dam dating service. Providers should have no problem giving a reference. These me make this happen for us and if a provider wants to be in this business, you can't get hooked just as the client shouldn't get hooked. It's very rare anything good comes from letting your heart into someone else's. Most of these men are married, why would any provider not give a reference exspecially because your jealous. Come on, these men don't belong to us. That is why there is such a variety because they want to see who they want. I have had problems in the past with getting refs from other providers because they don't want there client going elsewhere. Guess what? They ain't your man. My partner and I live together and there is no jealousy or problems with us and no problems with myself giving anyone a ref that I have seen. Other than my partner, silk and SD are the only other two providers that have been consistent with responding back with refs. I haven't of course asked every provider on here for refs so not speaking for all but let's be real ladies. All because they see you once twice or twenty doesn't mean they should see you and only you for now on. That's why there is variety. Just my two cents. Just tired of ladies not givin refs and hearing of it too when I rarely ask for refs anyway. Ok my rants over.

I personally have chosen to refrain from providing reference check's simply because every time I do I receive a complaint from each provider pertaining to the client's. I would never vouch for someone that would create any type of problem nor put anyone in harms way. My motto is; if he's not good enough for me then he's not good enough for you. Have a great weekend!

Love,

Blake

[Cameron X]

If the roles were reversed and this were a man doing this to a provider all hell would break loose, the man would be exposed and kick out of the community. It's the same scenario for providers. No matter what the reasons (weather it be financial, ego, or plain old fashioned I got a crush on you) as a provider, it is never acceptable to express unwarranted jealousy over who a gentlemen chooses to see. It's actually very bad business and shows ones insecurities, everybody knows that. These gentlemen can see whom ever they like for whatever reason they like, end of story.

Please allow me to get something off of my chest. I will not name this provider, although she knows who she is. This is not said with anger, but you need to read this, and re-read it if necessary, because I suspect I am not alone in this happening, or feeling this way.

We are not dating. We are not even "friends with benefits." This is a business arrangement. I pay for a service that you are providing, just like I would for a plumber, a doctor, a mechanic or any number of other occupations. I can be friends with those people, too, and even enjoy their company. But the main attraction from them is the level of service they provide for me, and if I decide to take my car to a different mechanic, I don't expect the first one to watch my every move and call me on it when they find out. Nor do I expect them to call my friendship into question if I hire a different plumber for a certain job. That's business, and as the customer, it is my prerogative on what store I shop at.

If you'd still like to be friends, I am not the one who has closed that door. Otherwise, you have mistaken a business arrangement that has the added benefit of a friendship for something completely different and outside of the boundaries of what we do here. It's your call.

I trust we won't have to have this conversation again.