"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

**BigTigger** · 07-09-13 21:45

Originally Posted by AliasSM [View Original Post]

Well you all warned me and it finally happened. I've been playing in the sugar world for about 18 months now and prior to that for decades have been messing around with escorts and the massage parlor scene. If been a faithful reader of this forum for a long time and truly value the experience of the pros on this board.

I' been married for longer than many of you have been born, and all of this finally caught up with me this week. My SO found a condom in the washing machine after doing a batch of my laundry. Yes, it was a stupid mistake and I was totally negligent in leaving the evidence behind (it was at least a new one still in original wrapper) , but it is just me and her in the house and its hard to come up with a logical excuse as to how it got there.

Any assistance here would be appreciated. She is still talking to me, but just barely and is looking for a plausible explanation. She has no other reason to be suspicious, other than the usual tell-tale signs like late nights at work and an occasional business trip.

HELP!

1. Tell her you found it at work by your desk and being as you weren't sure who was playing the joke, put it in your pocket to save embarrassment.

2. Let her know you were planning to get your sperm tested for possible freezing and you needed the condom for that process. It's a take home test kit to test vitality and you were trying to be sneaky, because you didn't want her to think you were weird.

3. Tell her some teenage girl and her bf asked you to buy them for them because they were embarrassed. When you came out with the one, they were gone. You meant to throw it away, but got distracted because it was so hot outside.

4. Tell her you grabbed it when you were at the gym. It was in the locker you had and didn't realized it until you got in the car. You didn't want to leave it in the car as that would have looked suspicious.

5. Tell her there was a demonstration where a church group was yelling about the bible and abstinence and another group was protesting them saying protection and giving out condoms. You took one because you didn't want to be rude and you really didn't want to be talking with either group. But you felt you could at least support the group pushing protection. Completely forgot the condom was there.

5. Tell her a bunch of flying monkeys were throwing condoms at drivers when you pulled up to the stop light, you rolled your window down to see what the commotion was all about and this one fell in

**AliasSM** · 07-09-13 21:09

Well you all warned me and it finally happened. I've been playing in the sugar world for about 18 months now and prior to that for decades have been messing around with escorts and the massage parlor scene. If been a faithful reader of this forum for a long time and truly value the experience of the pros on this board.

I' been married for longer than many of you have been born, and all of this finally caught up with me this week. My SO found a condom in the washing machine after doing a batch of my laundry. Yes, it was a stupid mistake and I was totally negligent in leaving the evidence behind (it was at least a new one still in original wrapper) , but it is just me and her in the house and its hard to come up with a logical excuse as to how it got there.

Any assistance here would be appreciated. She is still talking to me, but just barely and is looking for a plausible explanation. She has no other reason to be suspicious, other than the usual tell-tale signs like late nights at work and an occasional business trip.

HELP!

**HollywoodGuy** · 07-09-13 17:59

Originally Posted by John HandCock [View Original Post]

Hi, new to this and since this forum seems to be the closest to me I have been following it. I"ve read a great many of the post and was so impressed with you gentlemen that I joined SD4M last week. WTF was I thinking, must have been with the little head because the big head would never had made that decision. Anyway I digress. What I'm having a hard time understanding is why not just date these ladies as if in a normal dating ritual? The only advantage that I see vs the pro is that you might get to spend more time per visit vs the pro"s set time standards. It seems to me if you have time to juggle any amount of women then why drop the sugar on them every time you meet. If you have that kind of money to drop most of these ladies would still be willing to date you knowing somewhere down the line that the boyfriend would get them something nice, or give them some extra $$ to play with. The only thing that comes to me is that it might take longer finding these ladies because from what I've experienced over the last week is if they smell any type of sugar they come out of the wood work. Another post will be forth coming as to what sort of sugar should one give out because some of the request that I have gotten would be considered highway robbery at gun point. So Why not just date and juggle them as opposed to being a daddy?

The true non pro SB scene is very nuanced. Hang around. It's well worth it at any age. And I could never date 10/10 teenagers off eharmony. Yet I have a waiting list I"ll never get to in the sugar world

**F Scott** · 07-09-13 17:55

Originally Posted by John HandCock [View Original Post]

Hi, new to this and since this forum seems to be the closest to me I have been following it. I"ve read a great many of the post and was so impressed with you gentlemen that I joined SD4M last week. WTF was I thinking, must have been with the little head because the big head would never had made that decision. Anyway I digress. What I'm having a hard time understanding is why not just date these ladies as if in a normal dating ritual? The only advantage that I see vs the pro is that you might get to spend more time per visit vs the pro"s set time standards. It seems to me if you have time to juggle any amount of women then why drop the sugar on them every time you meet. If you have that kind of money to drop most of these ladies would still be willing to date you knowing somewhere down the line that the boyfriend would get them something nice, or give them some extra $$ to play with. The only thing that comes to me is that it might take longer finding these ladies because from what I've experienced over the last week is if they smell any type of sugar they come out of the wood work. Another post will be forth coming as to what sort of sugar should one give out because some of the request that I have gotten would be considered highway robbery at gun point. So Why not just date and juggle them as opposed to being a daddy?

Let me add my welcome to the clubhouse, John.

I think you will find us all willing to share. How old are you, and are you married? Not to pry by any means, but the essential aspect of the SD / SB equation is that it offers us older, married dudes access to women we would hardly have a chance with in real life. If you are a 30-something stud, you don't need this. If you are in your 50's, single or married, and happy banging women you meet at a bar who are your own age, you don't need this.

However, if you want to experience the Fountain of Youth, then keep on reading through the journal, but understand it is not as easy as calling up an escort and getting your nut, nor is it as unemotional and simple as that. I feel I can speak for most of my brothers here in saying that we strive for something richer, more complex and far more rewarding than trying to "beat the clock."

I'd be interested in hearing why you feel signing up for SD4Me was a mistake. What part of the country are you from? If you haven't realized this yet, this particular thread, though posted in Richmond, is national in scope. I myself am from the great mid-west.

Again, welcome,

Scott

**Igor Mongorsky** · 07-09-13 17:24

Originally Posted by John HandCock [View Original Post]

Hi, new to this and since this forum seems to be the closest to me I have been following it. I"ve read a great many of the post and was so impressed with you gentlemen that I joined SD4M last week. WTF was I thinking, must have been with the little head because the big head would never had made that decision. Anyway I digress. What I'm having a hard time understanding is why not just date these ladies as if in a normal dating ritual? The only advantage that I see vs the pro is that you might get to spend more time per visit vs the pro"s set time standards. It seems to me if you have time to juggle any amount of women then why drop the sugar on them every time you meet. If you have that kind of money to drop most of these ladies would still be willing to date you knowing somewhere down the line that the boyfriend would get them something nice, or give them some extra $$ to play with. The only thing that comes to me is that it might take longer finding these ladies because from what I've experienced over the last week is if they smell any type of sugar they come out of the wood work. Another post will be forth coming as to what sort of sugar should one give out because some of the request that I have gotten would be considered highway robbery at gun point. So Why not just date and juggle them as opposed to being a daddy?

The answer is in the numbers. Sure, these women might be willing to "date" you, but how would you meet them? I don't know about you, but that little hottie waitress might be willing to date me in exchange for some help with her college tuition, but I can't just go ask her that. With these sites, you can M&G a hundred ladies and you are bound to find some that you have chemistry with. Once the chemistry is there, anything is possible. You might not even have to give sugar every time.

**Hernando** · 07-09-13 16:15

Originally Posted by John HandCock [View Original Post]

It seems to me if you have time to juggle any amount of women then why drop the sugar on them every time you meet. If you have that kind of money to drop most of these ladies would still be willing to date you knowing somewhere down the line that the boyfriend would get them something nice, or give them some extra $$ to play with.

Welcome John!

The girls on SB sites are looking for money. So if you are not offering something in return for their bodies then you had better look like George Clooney or go to Match dot com.

Having said that sweeping statement, it isn't quite that simple. The girls are looking for other things like an experience, wining and dining, travels, validation that they are worthy of being loved, sex, to name a few. But without an offer of $$ you will not get any traction after the M&G. There are a few studs here who are attractive enough to keep some babies off the clock though .

**Dsprdo** · 07-09-13 15:09

Originally Posted by John HandCock [View Original Post]

The only advantage that I see vs the pro is that you might get to spend more time per visit vs the pro"s set time standards.

Time is one part of the equation for sure, and the other is quality of the encounter itself. A pro is almost always only interested in getting it over with as quick as possible so that she can move on to her next encounter. Finding one that is actually into it and enjoys herself is hard to do, and usually means high end. My 25 yo tattoo baby enjoys sex as much or more than I do, and she certainly has more O's than I do. It's hard to find a pro that you can leave with her legs quivering to the point she has trouble standing up. A lot of us also enjoy some emotional attachment with the SB's that isn't there with a pro.

**Dsprdo** · 07-09-13 14:59

Originally Posted by John HandCock [View Original Post]

So Why not just date and juggle them as opposed to being a daddy?

I think most of the guys here are in one or both of two categories: 1) Older guys looking for hot young baby's that might not be obtainable without the introduction of Sugar, or 2) Guys with a SO who are looking for an uncomplicated thing (or things) on the side. I'm early 50's and in good shape, but I don't think I'm going to pull many 25 yo's. I realize there's always an exception but it might take a year of trying with no luck. If you're getting your needs met without Sugar, kudos. I will say that at least one of the women I have met on here is a no sugar arrangement, but she is hoping it turns out to be a white picket fence story with me taking care of her for the rest of her life.

**John HandCock** · 07-09-13 14:05

Hi, new to this and since this forum seems to be the closest to me I have been following it. I"ve read a great many of the post and was so impressed with you gentlemen that I joined SD4M last week. WTF was I thinking, must have been with the little head because the big head would never had made that decision. Anyway I digress. What I'm having a hard time understanding is why not just date these ladies as if in a normal dating ritual? The only advantage that I see vs the pro is that you might get to spend more time per visit vs the pro"s set time standards. It seems to me if you have time to juggle any amount of women then why drop the sugar on them every time you meet. If you have that kind of money to drop most of these ladies would still be willing to date you knowing somewhere down the line that the boyfriend would get them something nice, or give them some extra $$ to play with. The only thing that comes to me is that it might take longer finding these ladies because from what I've experienced over the last week is if they smell any type of sugar they come out of the wood work. Another post will be forth coming as to what sort of sugar should one give out because some of the request that I have gotten would be considered highway robbery at gun point. So Why not just date and juggle them as opposed to being a daddy?

**Dsprdo** · 07-09-13 12:07

It was a quiet couple of weeks on the SB front for me because of work and some family issues, but things really picked up this week.

Tattoo baby 7/7/7/9. I had not seen her for almost three weeks. She had texted me a lot over that time, gradually seeming worried, then maybe a little pissed, then kind of forlorn. When we started out I was worried that she was going to turn out to be a nando 1, but she has really proven to be a keeper. I finally decided that I had to make time for her or maybe lose her, so I texted her and apologized for my lack of attentiveness, and asked if she was free for the evening. Initially she responded that she couldn't make it do to a childcare issue, but in a short while she circled back and said she was free for a few hours after all. She was happy to see, me and very affectionate. Sex with her just keeps getting better, and I think she will continue to be a regular for the foreseeable future.

K-baby 8/7/9/7. This new baby is who I've been spending my time on. She is a Korean-American MILF, smart, funny attractive, affectionate, truly seems to have a thing for older men, who seems new to the SB world. She makes no bones about wanting someone to help provide nicer things in life for her and her child than she can afford on her own, but does not seem driven only by money at all. We have had several fun dates where we laughed and had a good time. We had an awkward conversation about sugar at the start and I think it is very important to her that she not feel like an escort. We finally made it to the FC, and it was good but not great, I think maybe due to first tee jitters on both our parts. I did not provide any sugar at that point, I am going to circle back in the next day or so and give her something to help with the bills so it is a little removed in time and space from the FC in order to make it seem less transactional to her. If our second rendezvous shows an improvement on the chemistry, I can see her being a Quality SB that I put on a weekly or monthly allowance.

Long Distance Baby 8/8/7/7. In keeping with the recent theme of lost lambs returning to the fold, this SB is flying in to see me this weekend. She was the very first woman I met through a SD site while I was on the east coast on business about six months ago. We hooked up there briefly, then even though I was still in town our schedules didn't mesh and we stopped seeing each other and lost contact. About a month ago she texted me out of the blue and we started a conversation, ultimately resulting in a fly in for the weekend. She is looking for a long term relationship more than a SD, so my expenses for this visit will be her ticket (frequent flyer miles) , entertainment expenses this weekend, and a couple of gifts for her while she is here.

Cornfed Baby 7/6/9/8. This nursing student was a meet and greet from about a week ago. She is a little heavier than my tastes run to, but easy to talk to and eager to please. She is looking for a weekly allowance that is actually pretty reasonable, but she wants it to be a regular, ongoing thing. We had a great makeout session in the car after the meet and greet, and she was pretty much ready to go right there, but car dates in a parking garage are not really my thing at this point, so I disengaged and said good night. After thinking about it I decided that I didn't want to commit to a weekly allowance so I texted her and explained that I am going to be traveling too much for work to see her that regularly and asked if she would be willing to meet on an infrequent basis. She first responded that would be okay but then didn't reply to my per-visit offer. I was thinking of her as a booty call baby only, so I think I'm okay with that, and who knows, she may resurface later.

I have two other pretty good POTs that I am lining up for M&G's with. I am now getting in the same boat as some of you, needing to cull the herd a little due to resource constraints. I would not have imagined having this problem a year ago! This has been a great ride. One thing that interests me is how it seems that my target demographic seems to be defining itself. I love looking at the hot 18-22 yo's, but just haven't had much success there, partly because of drama, partly difficulty in connecting with them, partly logistics. They require a lot of work! I seem to be having a lot of smooth, naturally progressing connections in the 25-32 yo MILF realm. Love the HYB's, but I think I can be very happy in this market as well!

**Hernando** · 07-09-13 11:12

Originally Posted by Bachatas13 [View Original Post]

Recently met with my first SB, we talked about how it was our first time doing something like this over a couple of beers? The M&G went great felt like there was a connection! We talked about the arrangement and we left with a great mutual understanding. We exchanged several text msj for a couple of days after our meeting but now she's gone. Haven't heard from her at all! Any suggestions or what I might have done wrong?

Sorry to hear that but welcome to the club Bachatas. You need to have a thick skin in this business. These Babies are fragile, flighty creatures and are besieged by dozens if not hundreds of guys hitting on them. So they are filtering through all the proffers and M&Gs to settle on that one (or multiple) SD to give their favors to. What happened to you most likely, is she liked you but met others later who appealed to her more. Appeal could be as simple as how much $$$ the Pot Daddy is willing to offer. You probably got outbid. An AM girl I am talking to said that she got over 100 emails when she posted her profile. It literally took her 1 week to catch up to the old ones as well as new hits coming in, So we have a lot of competition.

New listings are prime farming for most of us since we want someone fresh and non pro. Since we all like to catch a naive new lister, the competition is fierce.

Keep at it. What happens with these returns that we all experience is that the SB found that the grass is not greener just because a SD gives a few dollars more, or is a little younger and cuter. Or their better deal disappeared and they need to go back to a known entity.

I wish my ATF would come back) :

**John G Smith** · 07-09-13 05:54

I thought I'd give a quick update since a few things happened this weekend.

Latina Artist. We were suppose to meet this Sunday, but she got cold feet and canceled at the last minute. I actually sensed she was getting cold feet, so I suggested we cancel the date, which she admitted she was nervous and was going to ask to cancel. She still insists she wants to have an arrangement but she just needs a little more time. She's a true-first timer and she isn't asking me to give her any money while she gets comfortable with me. So it's not costing me anything but time. However I was annoyed that she wasted one of my valuable Sunday slots. The nice thing though is that I know she will be exclusive to me.

Brown and Busty. I thought she might be a potential QSB (Quality SB). I met with her earlier today and she is indeed busty but her stomach isn't quite as tight as I would like. We were suppose to go to the FC, but some things came up so it ended up being a glorified M&G. She's still very interested in me but I don't see her quite as a QSB anymore because her body isn't tight enough. The pics I found of hers through Facebook were a bit old I guess and she's put on some weight since then. Her tits are still amazing and she would make an excellent secondary option if she didn't live so far away. Last month I would have kept her on my stable, but I'm really trying to stay streamlined, so I'm going to have to make a tough decision on whether to cut her loose or get rid of someone else in the "B" slots.

Punk SB. Had a very quick 30 minute visit in the FC late last week. The FC cost more than the allowance I gave her and it was way too quick but we both had a tight schedule. We don't have great chemistry, but she's a young one. I'm definitely not going to do a short FC like that again, that's for sure. If we can't get a better routine, I might have to cut her loose as well.

(Pot) Asian MILF. This one has been soaking for a while. She will be the oldest SB I've ever met, she's 33. We talked briefly a couple of months ago, but she said she was going to explore other options because I wasn't the race she was looking for. She contacted me out of the blue recently and she expressed interest. I gave her my allowance offer, which wasn't exactly what she wanted, so she disappeared again for another week or two. But then she came back and said she still wanted to meet to see if there was chemistry. She's driving down to me (over a hour drive) , so I don't have too much to lose. She is very attractive and I've always wanted a pure Asian SB, which has been elusive to me. So we have a coffee date in a couple of days, so we'll see how that goes. The allowance she's seeking is in my QSB slot, so she'll need to meet those standards otherwise I won't pursue things further with her.

(Returning) Collegiate SB. This girl burned me earlier this year as I famously wrote on these boards. But out of nowhere she started texting me again and being super friendly. So far I've just played it cool. I'm not going to be burned again. So I'll be friendly but I won't pursue her at all until she makes very overt moves and shows a willingness to have a fully "mutual" arrangement. So I doubt this will go anywhere. But I just thought I'd bring her up since it seems everyone here is seeing a return of ATFs and unicorns. LOL

**John G Smith** · 07-09-13 05:26

1) You stay committed (Married) because. Pick the most important one)

- #2 children. I grew up without a father, I turned out okay but seeing the vast majority of SBs who don't have fathers just reaffirms that I want to be there for my daughter so she doesn't end up a stripper or a Nando1 girl with daddy issues or end up in BigTigger's stable, Lol. J/k

2) You rank sexual attraction and performance with your SO as :

- #3 Very Low. After the kids she let herself go and she's not very adventurous in bed. Won't even give BJs.

3) You have sex with your SO / week :

- $4 None. I've actually dropped the ball on this the past year. The more experiences I've had with hot young SBs, the less inclined I am to have sex with my SO. This is bad because it's a common tell-tale sign a man is cheating when they pretty much stop having sex. But I honestly I just can't get it going for my SO anymore. Then again I've told her she needs to workout, which she absolutely refuses to do. So it's not totally on me. I warned her we would have sex less if she let her body completely go. I'm not a gigalo, I have to be attracted to the person I'm having sex with.

4) you have sex with all your SBs :

- Didn't quite understand this question, I think it got cut off somewhat. But on a good month, I'm maybe having sex with my SBs 4-6 times a month. On a bad month, it may be 1-2 times. In the grand scheme of things, I'm still not having sex that much. Because I'm married and with my work, I can't see SBs as often as some of you other guys. When things were good with my SO way back when, we were having sex 25-28 times a month. So I'm still not close to replacing that with SBs. I'm trying to focus on quality rather than quantity until I get divorced at some point.

5) Has a SO ever caught you in flagrante delicto? (this includes suspicion, reasonable certainty, etc) which led to divorce or close monitoring

- #4 No. She'll make sometimes off-hand comments that I was seeing my girlfriend and such when I was out. But she hasn't found any hard evidence and if she has, she's never confronted me with it. So the game right now is basically to make sure I allow her to stay in a state of plausible denial. Don't do anything that will shove it in her face.

6) Do your SOs suspect your infidelity?

- #3 Maybe. But again see my last answer.

7) What are you spending now / month (include ALL costs)

- #3 $1000 + I'm in the high range over a grand but I've been trying to reduce my costs lately or at the very least not spread myself too thin and just spend it on the ones that are worth it to me.

8) what is the most you have spent / month?

#2 $2 to 3000 + My ATF from late last year was the recipient for the most of it. Plus the costs of going to see her, FCs, food, gifts, Christmas gifts, and etc. It added up.

9) How many SBs have you carried on an average month?

- #3 2. I recently was carrying on 3 to 4 but I'm trying to get it down to 2-3. Preferably 2. One backup, one primary.

10) Are your SOs happy with you? (are they cleverly fooled?)

- #3 Somewhat.

11) How much time do you spend with your SB on average / visit?

- #3. When I have a long-term SB I tend spend at least 6 hours with them. But for the short-term SBs and temporary babies, lately it's been about 2 to 3 hours. Often times I don't want to spend any longer than that with them unfortunately.

**HollywoodGuy** · 07-09-13 03:49

Originally Posted by F Scott [View Original Post]

Hollywood,

When it is the first visit to the FC I always ask if they are comfortable with the lights on, and it astounds me how many of them say yes, and that it would be the first time! It makes me think that we older dudes are also in the prime of OUR sexual lives. Sure, maybe we need some chemical assistance, but certainly not in the experience department. Onward, my brothers! There are babies out there who need us! It's a tough job, but somebody's got to do it.

Tally ho,

Scott

Looking back on my teens and early twenties I can see now how I wasted some good opportunities due to lack of experience to get the job done (not to mention the funds). I can see now how the girls I dated would have been putty in my hands. But like they say, youth is wasted on the young. Today I was just looking at one of my babes and thinking. Damn she is beautiful. It's very understandable why they love us senior citizens. We are the total package.

My little teen is exactly the type of girl I could never get back in high school. Hot, bratty, cheerleader. Now they only wish they can get more of my attention. And happily settle for the day or 2 a week I can fit them in, in between the competition (of which they are totally aware of). I commonly show my babes the pics of the other girls so they know they are not any hotter than what I already have. Not to mention the bedroom skills they are required to have just to stay in the game.

Please lets get out of this recession so we can all fully reap the benefits of this dramatically expanding sugar world full of willing, hot and desperate to live life to the fullest girls that beg for our attention.

**Igor Mongorsky** · 07-09-13 01:44

OK, this is weird. A while back I had a sort of an arrangement with a former provider. We've met up many times over the years. I don't remember how we came to an agreement about sugar, or even if there was one. I'd just slip something into her purse at the end of the date, usually an overnight. She never said anything about it. It averaged out to maybe $250 a date, not including gifts and other expenses. No hotel needed because we each had our own place and could host.

It was a perfect arrangement for a while. One day after an unusually long absence, she suddenly reappears and starts hitting me up for a boatload of sugar. I refused. After that I never saw her again. I took her disconnecting her phone and not answering email as a sign for me to get permanently lost.

Flash forward to today and I haven't talked to her for over two years. Reading the messages here started me thinking of my old ATF again. I said to myself, wth, what have I got to lose? So I fire off an email just to see if she was still alive. Surprisingly, she replied back with her phone. We ended up talking for over an hour. We picked up like it was yesterday. She ended the conversation by saying she'd like to come over next week and spend the night. Wow. OK. I suggested booking a room at a nice local hotel. She said she would really like that.

Looks like this might pay off, although I give only a 50% chance of her following through. I have a hard time figuring these girls out. You just never know.