"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

**SubCmdr** · 08-13-12 08:28

I've been running silent, running deep and running hard. Operating outside of my usual patrol area I have found these new waters to be a target rich environment and have exceptional success deploying my WPAD.

My new orders sent me under the polar cap into the waters off the coast of southern California. My assignment: perform a recon of Southern California to determine suitable targets for WPAD deployment. This is one of my reports.

I come ashore at the port of San Diego and I'm met by Pot SDSB1. AA, light skin. 23, 5'5', smoking hot body, gorgeous eyes, a very exotic look. Jump in her car and we head off to dinner. Have a wonderful dinner together during dinner I learn that she has some Asian in her explaining her most unique looks. After dinner I ask her to give me a ride and she agrees to drop me off at my center for west coast operations. During the drive I learn that she has never had a SD but is very interested in the sugar world. She said that her circle of friends all have them. She said that is a very accepted lifestyle choice in the southern California area. And everyone she knows is very open about it. In fact she has been around her friends SD's before and they are mostly pretty cool guys. She also informed me that some of them make their entire living in the sugar world. She indicated that would not work for her because she doesn't want to be controlled and is much more interested in the chemistry that she shares with someone and wants to consider the sugar a bonus. Well that is just what I want to hear. I'm thinking we share some chemistry so mentally I've already got her ankles up on my shoulders. When we arrive at my base of operations, I invite her in for a debriefing. But, she declines my request to add her panties to my collection. I slip her some sugar to thank her for the ride and she heads off into the night. We exchange many positive texts. It is most unfortunate that our schedules failed to line up. We never meet again.

SubCmdr out

**JoesParty** · 08-12-12 17:46

Originally Posted by SubCmdr [View Original Post]

Joe,

It is great to hear that you are keeping your CPO low. With all this talk about E involvement it is nice to know there are others who recognize we are just in another trading pit; working hard; watching the bid / ask price and closing closing the deal when the price is right.

Panties on the floor; legs in the air; face down & ass up. Just keep pounding that nasty thing into the mattress. Get in; Get off; and get home. No need to make things complicated.

Update: I rolled over like a cheap SUV and sent West Coast SB some sugar. The pussy is just too good! And even with the little extra sugar I am still keeping my CPO low. I consider it portfoilo (I. E. Pussy) insurance or like a (pussy) futures contract. It will either pay off or I'll lose my entire investment.

SubCmdr out

The futures contract analogy is apt. As I've noted, I've dabbled in the futures market from time to time. As I'm sure you know, pussy is a fickle commodity. And I mean "commodity" literally; although we like to think one is different from another, in the end, they're almost indistinguishable. Sorry to be so blunt, and I mean no disrespect to anyone, but most of us aren't looking for a LTR relationship here (or we've learned our lesson about doing so).

You may recall that I made an investment in ATF, and I have yet to see any possibility of repayment on that contract. In fact, my broker appears to be ignoring my calls. I am *this close* to declaring it a complete loss and moving on. Here's to hoping you have better luck. But keep in mind that it rarely pays to "double down" on your investment, especially in a sinking market.

**SubCmdr** · 08-12-12 10:21

Originally Posted by JoesParty [View Original Post]

Finally, she was grateful for my sugar, which was less than half of what I was providing to the last SB, and if you take into account the CPO formula, then it's approaching ridiculously low levels. This one's a keeper.

Regards,

Joe

Joe,

It is great to hear that you are keeping your CPO low. With all this talk about E involvement it is nice to know there are others who recognize we are just in another trading pit; working hard; watching the bid / ask price and closing closing the deal when the price is right.

Panties on the floor; legs in the air; face down & ass up. Just keep pounding that nasty thing into the mattress. Get in; Get off; and get home. No need to make things complicated.

Update: I rolled over like a cheap SUV and sent West Coast SB some sugar. The pussy is just too good! And even with the little extra sugar I am still keeping my CPO low. I consider it portfoilo (I. E. Pussy) insurance or like a (pussy) futures contract. It will either pay off or I'll lose my entire investment.

SubCmdr out

**JoesParty** · 08-10-12 10:26

The target, as noted in an earlier post, is an 18 year old student with a bit of an anime / cosplay fetish. If you're anything like me, you'll have to look up those terms. We've had two M&Gs to date; one over sushi and one at a movie. I provided nominal sugar at the second, because she had previously mentioned a need for replacement printer ink in order to finish a project. She very much appreciated the gesture and was eager to meet again.

She has another SD, whom she has been seeing for a couple months. He is OK with her seeing other guys, as am I, because neither of us has the time to give her the support or attention she wants. If I ever meet the guy, I owe him a beer, because he has done a great job of showing her the sugar bowl ropes.

I figured I would try to close the deal last night with dinner and a relaxing evening at a local hotel. Dinner was nice. Although she is very shy, she is starting to open up to me. In fact, I learned quite a bit about her life and her time with "Bizarro George" (as I'll call the other guy). We both had a good time.

We retired to the hotel, where she showed me a few websites that helped explain her hobby. It was interesting, but to be honest, I was concerned about time, as I couldn't stay out too late. I finally just asked if I could kiss her, and after a bit, we made our way to the bed.

Long story short: Fabulous 18-year-old body. A bit inexperienced, but she has the basics down and seems willing to take direction. I'm usually one and done, but she asked-no, insisted-we go for three rounds. In the end, it was clear we both enjoyed ourselves.

Finally, she was grateful for my sugar, which was less than half of what I was providing to the last SB, and if you take into account the CPO formula, then it's approaching ridiculously low levels. This one's a keeper.

Enjoy the weekend, friends. I know I will.

Regards,

Joe

**ChiGuy606** · 08-09-12 09:48

Great to hear from you again Nando. So sorry things are over with your ATF. As sucky as the whole situation is at least this gives you the opportunity to start working on patching things up at home, from my limited knowledge of your situation it sounds like mending the home relationship is probably the better long term solution for you than divorce. But in any case, thanks for coming back here. Your perspective is certainly valuable to us.

As I said before, you could (and should) write a book someday.

As for me, I've been busy! Busy busy busy!

I am holding off on making a post until panties are confirmed grounded. However that doesn't mean panties have not been hitting the floor in my world. Legally Blonde is consistently blowing my mind (among other things) on a weekly basis now, and is just getting dirtier & dirtier with me each time. Hopefully I'll have an update with new conquests soon.

Be safe & have fun all.

**Golfcart** · 08-07-12 23:51

Originally Posted by Hernando [View Original Post]

The girls protesteth too much about how they are not hookers even though they are accepting money in return for sex. I certainly don't like to think of my Baby as a hooker but she is still taking care of my needs in return for a generous allowance. So what is she? A wife? Haha.

Does it matter? Why not simply enjoy a woman within reasonable limits and not worry about it? There's something somewhere about moderation being a virtue and somewhere else about pigs getting slaughtered. It's when the thing gets out of hand that it gets out of hand.

The board has been on a swing for a long time supporting one bad idea after another. It reminded me of no limits poker. Now, all of a sudden a few of us have had it blow up in our face. And this comes as a surprise.

Things are okay in moderation with eyes wide open.

**Looking Around** · 08-07-12 22:15

Originally Posted by NiceGuy804 [View Original Post]

I am CONSIDERING doing something, and can think of no better place to air it than this forum. I'm considering hiring a legitimate assistant with "Benefits for bonuses." Have any of you gentlemen tried this, and with what result?

She said,"I don't go fishing off the same dock I work at." Sage advice.

**JoesParty** · 08-07-12 20:56

Originally Posted by Zomby [View Original Post]

To be honest, the *only* way I see this working at all is if you are talking about a *personal* assistant, unconnected with any company or corporation, *and* you offer the "job" to an existing SB as an additional benefit for *her, *and* you trust her a whole bunch. Even then, given the laws concerning sexual harassment in employment, you're opening yourself up for a criminal prosecution *and* a civil lawsuit later on if things go sour.

If you're working for a company and thinking about hiring a secretary or assistant there, forget it. If HR finds out, you're in the same sexual harassment boat, even *if* you and her are OK with it. The "beauty" of the harassment laws is that they can also be used by other, ostensibly unaffected employees, against you if they can make the case that others are being slighted in favor of your "assistant with benefits."

You could lose your job, and even make it harder to find another one if the details become public. Your current company might not reveal the circumstances of your termination, but they would be within their rights to do so if the case becomes criminal.

That completely ignores the possibility that if you are going to hire this person, you have to provide your real name on the paychecks, plus be responsible for all the taxes, FICA, etc.

/z

Originally Posted by NiceGuy804 [View Original Post]

I am CONSIDERING doing something, and can think of no better place to air it than this forum. I'm considering hiring a legitimate assistant with "Benefits for bonuses." Have any of you gentlemen tried this, and with what result?

I'm with Zomby on this one. Even if you are self-employed, have no other employees, and both you and the girl are in on the "job description," YOU are shouldering all the personal risk here. What if the relationship goes south? What if she convinces some authority figure (and God help you if she hires a lawyer) that her "mean, disgusting boss demands sex all the time"? It's your word against hers, because you definitely don't want to put your arrangement in writing.

Add to this the other obstacles that Z points out, plus workers comp, insurance, and the like.

You are better off, as he notes, in throwing a few extra bucks to an existing SB to work as an occasional independent contractor, maybe providing cleaning services, filing services, etc. Nothing substantial, and nothing on a regular basis. WAY too many risks here.

**JoesParty** · 08-07-12 20:48

Originally Posted by Max999 [View Original Post]

As I've stated on this forum once before, I'm not a big-time player in the SD game. I have made small forays into it over the years with mixed results. I think I realized that I was too much of a soft-hearted sucker to profit from the SD-SB arrangement. In time, I also realized that I didn't have the sexual stamina and availability to get my money's worth out of the arrangement even where the SB was fully willing. But then, those may be my unique shortcomings.

Nevertheless, I did learn a few things. The main thing I learned is that this is supposed to be a hobby, right? It's supposed to be something that we pursue peripherally to our main focuses in life like family, work, love, enlightenment, etc. We're not supposed to become enraptured in the hobby to the detriment of other, more important life pursuits. We're not supposed to fall in love with women who we pay to spend time with us. We're not supposed to want to love someone that we have to pay to be with us. You know, we do "pay" them to tell us how ageless we look and act, how beautifully we make love, how great listeners we are, how thoughtful we are, how much of an aswer to their prayers we are. And we "pay" them to dress like a princess and fuck like a freak. We "pay" them to remember our birthdays when the SO doesn't. We "pay" them to kiss us long and passionately like we are the only men they could ever love. We "pay" them to thoughtfully surprise us with a wine and cheese picnic getaway after a tough week at work. In short, we pay them to be good / great actresses.

For the most part, they don't forget that they are in the "business" of acting out a particular man's romantic fantasy. We shouldn't forget that we are in the "business" of paying these women to be "lovable." But those of us who can't play and pay without actually falling in love are in for miserably disappointing and unfulfilled lives for as long as we stay in the SD game.

Well said. I am one of the guys who gets sucked in emotionally, though I am trying to change my stripes. I think some of the guys who are lucky enough to be with girls to whom they give little (or even no) allowance may quibble with this a bit, but even then, I think the basic message is important to take to heart: Whatever your situation, make sure nobody is taking advantage of you.

**Max999** · 08-07-12 20:41

As I've stated on this forum once before, I'm not a big-time player in the SD game. I have made small forays into it over the years with mixed results. I think I realized that I was too much of a soft-hearted sucker to profit from the SD-SB arrangement. In time, I also realized that I didn't have the sexual stamina and availability to get my money's worth out of the arrangement even where the SB was fully willing. But then, those may be my unique shortcomings.

Nevertheless, I did learn a few things. The main thing I learned is that this is supposed to be a hobby, right? It's supposed to be something that we pursue peripherally to our main focuses in life like family, work, love, enlightenment, etc. We're not supposed to become enraptured in the hobby to the detriment of other, more important life pursuits. We're not supposed to fall in love with women who we pay to spend time with us. We're not supposed to want to love someone that we have to pay to be with us. You know, we do "pay" them to tell us how ageless we look and act, how beautifully we make love, how great listeners we are, how thoughtful we are, how much of an aswer to their prayers we are. And we "pay" them to dress like a princess and fuck like a freak. We "pay" them to remember our birthdays when the SO doesn't. We "pay" them to kiss us long and passionately like we are the only men they could ever love. We "pay" them to thoughtfully surprise us with a wine and cheese picnic getaway after a tough week at work. In short, we pay them to be good / great actresses.

For the most part, they don't forget that they are in the "business" of acting out a particular man's romantic fantasy. We shouldn't forget that we are in the "business" of paying these women to be "lovable." But those of us who can't play and pay without actually falling in love are in for miserably disappointing and unfulfilled lives for as long as we stay in the SD game.

**Zomby** · 08-07-12 18:17

Originally Posted by NiceGuy804 [View Original Post]

I am CONSIDERING doing something, and can think of no better place to air it than this forum. I'm considering hiring a legitimate assistant with "Benefits for bonuses." Have any of you gentlemen tried this, and with what result?

To be honest, the *only* way I see this working at all is if you are talking about a *personal* assistant, unconnected with any company or corporation, *and* you offer the "job" to an existing SB as an additional benefit for *her, *and* you trust her a whole bunch. Even then, given the laws concerning sexual harassment in employment, you're opening yourself up for a criminal prosecution *and* a civil lawsuit later on if things go sour.

If you're working for a company and thinking about hiring a secretary or assistant there, forget it. If HR finds out, you're in the same sexual harassment boat, even *if* you and her are OK with it. The "beauty" of the harassment laws is that they can also be used by other, ostensibly unaffected employees, against you if they can make the case that others are being slighted in favor of your "assistant with benefits."

You could lose your job, and even make it harder to find another one if the details become public. Your current company might not reveal the circumstances of your termination, but they would be within their rights to do so if the case becomes criminal.

That completely ignores the possibility that if you are going to hire this person, you have to provide your real name on the paychecks, plus be responsible for all the taxes, FICA, etc.

/z

**JoesParty** · 08-07-12 11:35

Originally Posted by Hernando [View Original Post]

Dear John

Thanks for your thoughts. Age is a funny thing. I am lucky to appear a lot younger than my age. Probably 45 to 52 as I am told vs my real age 63. Never the less, for an early 20 something even 40 is old. We were out all the time in public but when she had to consider bringing gramps into her circle of friends / family she was clear that it wasn't happening.

Divorce If you are unhappy in your relationship with W I would recommend divorcing sooner than later and moving on John. You are young and depending on your finances you will have many years to recoup your loss. At my age my earning power is limited by time and demand. A divorce would decimate me, but what price happiness? Most of us here who are married are not happily married (no secret there) We are all trying to have our cake and eat it too. Right? That mouthful will turn into a bitter pill eventually.

Overnights I have a job that requires me to travel for a day or two at a time, so it was easy to continue my schedule without raising suspicion. In the end she was suspicious and did not want to find out the truth that she suspected. She would have eventually done the private eye thing anyway. As was said earlier all it takes is a little slip here, a receipt there, to raise the bar.

GV is a good suggestion but I am tech challenged and just relied on the old tried and true phone. If it wasn't that it would be something else.

Short visits Are probably the hardest to detect because most of us have reasons to be off the radar for a few hours here and there. What made my affair so real were the nights together. We would go out for dinner, eat in, make love, then read together or watch TV like real people. It wasn't all about the hooker thing of racing into the notel, fucking our brains out, then going home to momma. That is a clear cut hooker / john scenario and is great if sex is all you are looking for. But in the end call it what it is anyway These relationships are call girl / john affairs. The blog at Seeking Arrangements is interesting if you have never gone on there. The girls protesteth too much about how they are not hookers even though they are accepting money in return for sex. I certainly don't like to think of my Baby as a hooker but she is still taking care of my needs in return for a generous allowance. So what is she? A wife? Haha.

Welcome back, Nando. I was starting to wonder if we'd ever hear from you again. Your post a couple months ago was a wake-up call for me, as I'm sure it was for many others. My wife, too, was having nagging suspicions. She never really articulated it, but I could tell she sensed something was amiss. So I decided to significantly curtail my activity. And just in time, too: She suddenly has taken a very active interest in the family finances. Had I not put a stop to my more obvious expenditures, I would have had some serious explaining to do. At this point, I can make do with a little bookkeeping slight of hand (nothing nefarious, just reclassifying my meager expenses).

I don't think I would have been as lucky as you, though. She would have exploded, and the resulting boom would have taken me out, I'm sure. I don't think our marriage would survive her finding out what I've been up to. And even though I am young (mid-30s) , we are so financially intertwined, and frankly, she makes more money, that I would be devastated financially. So it is best that I keep things simple and low-key from now on.

This is not to say that I stay with her only for the security or the money. When I seriously considered leaving last summer, I made a mental list-you know, the old pros and cons. And I was a bit surprised that the pros significantly outweighed the cons. I didn't think I was happy. But going through the exercise made me think about how luck I really am. What are the odds I'd find all of this in someone else? What if I *couldn't* find all of this in someone else? So I stayed, and I don't regret it.

Still, our relationship obviously is missing something I crave, so I'm out there playing in the sugar bowl. I struggle with this constantly. Is there a way to fix things at home? I guess the answer is "maybe," but neither of us seems interested in investing the effort to find out. Perhaps someday.

I hope things work out for you, one way or another, soon.

**Hernando** · 08-07-12 10:55

Dear John

Thanks for your thoughts. Age is a funny thing. I am lucky to appear a lot younger than my age.probably 45 to 52 as I am told vs my real age 63. Never the less, for an early 20 something even 40 is old. We were out all the time in public but when she had to consider bringing gramps into her circle of friends / family she was clear that it wasn't happening.

Divorce If you are unhappy in your relationship with W I would recommend divorcing sooner than later and moving on John. You are young and depending on your finances you will have many years to recoup your loss. At my age my earning power is limited by time and demand. A divorce would decimate me, but what price happiness? Most of us here who are married are not happily married (no secret there) We are all trying to have our cake and eat it too.right? That mouthful will turn into a bitter pill eventually.

Overnights I have a job that requires me to travel for a day or two at a time, so it was easy to continue my schedule without raising suspicion. In the end she was suspicious and did not want to find out the truth that she suspected. She would have eventually done the private eye thing anyway. As was said earlier all it takes is a little slip here, a receipt there, to raise the bar.

GV is a good suggestion but I am tech challenged and just relied on the old tried and true phone. If it wasn't that it would be something else.

Short visits Are probably the hardest to detect because most of us have reasons to be off the radar for a few hours here and there. What made my affair so real were the nights together. We would go out for dinner, eat in, make love, then read together or watch TV like real people. It wasn't all about the hooker thing of racing into the notel, fucking our brains out, then going home to momma. That is a clear cut hooker / john scenario and is great if sex is all you are looking for. But in the end call it what it is anyway These relationships are call girl / john affairs. The blog at Seeking Arrangements is interesting if you have never gone on there. The girls protesteth too much about how they are not hookers even though they are accepting money in return for sex. I certainly don't like to think of my Baby as a hooker but she is still taking care of my needs in return for a generous allowance. So what is she? A wife? Haha.

**NiceGuy804** · 08-07-12 10:32

I am CONSIDERING doing something, and can think of no better place to air it than this forum. I'm considering hiring a legitimate assistant with "Benefits for bonuses." Have any of you gentlemen tried this, and with what result?

**AliasSM** · 08-07-12 06:08

Nando,

We are all just a phone call or misplaced receipt away from being in your shoes right now, so it's easy to sympthasize with your situation. My W of almost 40 years would already have me out of the house and be looking for the lawyer, so I try to be extra careful with my current roster of SBs. But it only takes one slip to screw it all up.

For others out there trying to stay under the W's radar, I agree with John that Google Voice is by far the best option. I was just out of the country with the W over the past few weeks and had to disable my cell due to no international plan. I was still able to stay in touch with my SBs through the hotel wireless connections and Google Voice. The txts were enough to keep me sane on what could have been a long week without SB contact.

I was even able to get a number assigned that was real close to my real cell number. It's so easy to use, my W has no idea what I am doing when I'm txting back and forth with the SB. Sometimes even in the car right beside her.

Stay safe and keep up the good posts all.