"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[Literal2]

Gentlemen,

Hope I did not lead anyone astray on this. I wanted to get the word out as quickly as possible. If anyone has any other ideas about anonymous debit cards and how to secure them, I think now might be a good time to share.

Scott, I use cash for everything except hotels. The best I've been able to do with a credit card for hotels is this. I have several cc's which I do not try to conceal. One of them is tied to a former business and its po box. I get the statements online and pay the bill online from an account also tied to the po box and also with no paper statements. When I register at a hotel I use the po box address. The warden knows about the ccs and the accounts but doesn't try to monitor them, never sees a statement because there's no paper, and would have a difficult time doing so. If anybody ordered a credit report on me, which would be without my consent, they might get the balance and payment history for the cc but not the detail. For me it's easier to conceal transactions within a known account than to try to conceal the account. As always, we aren't talking about being able to conceal this stuff from the leo or the IRS, so I don't take tax deductions on any sb related activity.

I'm curious about prepaid debit cards but I like streamlining sb security to the extent possible and it seems like an extra step. But as you say, we live and learn.

Great posts on the thread these days.

[CantWinLosin]

Golf, that's sort of what I'm thinking. I do feel a little deceived, and it's going to be hard for me to see her as an honest SB. On the other hand, none of us or them are always 100% all the time. I'm curious about her performance, and she agreed to a level of sugar with which I can be comfortable. If this ends up being a one-off, I don't see how it can be worse than several escorts I've paid similar or higher dollar for that were one-offs. But I agree that raising the issue of the web site serves no good purpose. Now.

[Golfcart]

(Edit Delete) As for my hot South African, our play-date got postponed to tomorrow. However, we did have a discussion of sugar today, and I learned that she has some serious GPS. I explained again my limitations and abilities in this area, and we agreed to that for this meeting. It will be interesting to see if this goes past tomorrow's meeting, and how her performance is impacted.

This is my cue to chime in and say both sides must get along naturally without effort or it won't work. This includes nobody having to compromise on the sugar. Both sides need to be happy with the number. It's been August 11 since I've spouted off about this so I guess I'm not a broken record.

Turns out, she's more of a pro than she let on. Thanks to a fellow traveler who guessed who she might be based on my description and PMed me her website link, you can see her too:

http://www.ohdayne.com/#!__my-portfolio

(Edit Delete)

Her site says the guy pays in advance, not at the encounter.

A negotiating male is the other side of the golden pussy syndrome. We will appear to her as she appears to us. Plus we are using money as power. It doesn't work if being happy is the goal.

I would not meet her tomorrow. Somebody is going to be unhappy.

If I met her I would not let on I know about the website. No upside.

[Coolhand2]

First, Happy New Year all. May you find wetness between the thighs of all the Babies you're after. I have several SB reports I owe the group but this happend to me last night and it just can't wait. All of my SB's but one have been in a city two hours from me. I have switched to SA from SD4me and noticed some very nice local ones so I decided to see what was up. So there is one (22yr old college student. 5'10, nicely built with a great rack) who we had switched to email to continue our dance. She sent me some semi-nude pics where I could see the rack was more than nice. A couple more emails back and forth and I told her that I was trying to decide between her and another SB. So I get a email from her last night, with a video attached, that said "just for you." So I opened it and much to my surprise, there she was, all 5'11, stretched out naked on a bed. She then starts to masturbate, all the while talking dirty using my name. I can see the fluids on her thighs, as she gets really raunchy and cums. I am so hard by this time that I thought both my heads were going to explode. Have you ever heard of such a thing? Is this what the young folks do these days? (God I wish I was young) I have never experienced any thing like this in my life. It totally blew my mind. I have to tell you my decision is made and I'm going to get between those thighs my self just as soon as I can. It was a great way to start the New Year.

Welcome back Lit. It was you who got me started on the SB path and encouraged me to hang in there when I wasn't having much luck for months on end. Thank you for making me the Baby fucker I am today.

[CantWinLosin]

Turns out, she's more of a pro than she let on. Thanks to a fellow traveler who guessed who she might be based on my description and PMed me her website link, you can see her too:

http://www.ohdayne.com/#!__my-portfolio

Part of me is pissed, because I made it clear at the start that I wasn't interested in pros. In fairness, her site tries to emphasize that she prefers what amounts to SB type arrangements, but the fact that her site is hosted on an escort-hosting mega-site, that she wants Date-Check type references, and that she lists single-engagement rates in addition to the long-term arrangements rates, all smack of escort. But I bet a look at her photos will make it clear why I was interested.

[F Scott]

As for my hot South African, our play-date got postponed to tomorrow. However, we did have a discussion of sugar today, and I learned that she has some serious GPS. I explained again my limitations and abilities in this area, and we agreed to that for this meeting. It will be interesting to see if this goes past tomorrow's meeting, and how her performance is impacted.

Win,

I had a similar situation when I was in my first multi-fucking stage, and I'm sorry to report that it was less than satisfying. While the baby did show up, take her clothes off, and spread her legs, I had the distinct feeling she was not bringing her A game, and when things reached their inevitable conclusion, we parted in awkward silence, never to meet again. I sincerely hope I am not presaging your future tomorrow, my friend, but if so, remember you have a supportive band of brothers here who are willing to call her names on your behalf. Also, you can always abort the mission, although I will freely admit it is hard for me to forgo a good look at a naked baby once I have it penciled into my calendar. I am petitioning the god of SDs, (again, Bacchus? Priapus?) that he should smile upon you in your endeavors tomorrow, and thus bring you to your hoped-for resolution.

If all goes well, we would certainly love to hear about it, especially, (for me) , anything she says in what I imagine to be her aphrodisiacal accent. Could I have her number? I just want her to talk dirty to me.

Best of luck, and don't forget to write,

Scott

[Literal2]

I'm trying this on seeking arrangements and was wondering what you approach is. I'm used to online dating sites so not sure how to open.

Z

Z, I join in welcoming you to the thread. I was here for months but came back recently.

Why? Because the mongers here are supportive, man.

Be sure to let us know when you fuck a sugarbabe, which you will surely do if you persist, reading and applying the sugarbabe tech in these posts. If you don't, come back for support and advice. It's all cool,

[CantWinLosin]

Lit, no, I never did. My rules are: 1) If they don't have a picture, especially if they're single and under 30, chances are they either don't understand what they're doing or aren't serious. There are a *lot* of these women that fall into one or both of those categories, but the ones without pictures seem much more likely to be that way. 2) No pros, ever. This means escorts, dancers, massage providers and similar. These girls invariably have a much more mercenary attitude about it all. I've broken this rule a couple times, and ended up regretting it *every* time. 3) As mentioned before, I generally avoid black girls under 30, because they are often ghetto and usually drama-filled. But then, I tend to avoid girls below 30 regardless of race, as they often have unrealistic expectations in a number of areas.

As for my hot South African, our play-date got postponed to tomorrow. However, we did have a discussion of sugar today, and I learned that she has some serious GPS. I explained again my limitations and abilities in this area, and we agreed to that for this meeting. It will be interesting to see if this goes past tomorrow's meeting, and how her performance is impacted.

[F Scott]

Gentlemen,

In looking over the current offerings on SA, I came across the new profile of a baby who used to work for me! She was (is) a stunningly hot Latina spinner, and is clearly looking to find her new turning point, so to speak. Why couldn't it be little Scottie? I had a huge hard-on for her back in the day, and spent many a happy drive home thinking about coming upon her in the copy room late in the day, all alone, bending over to get more toner, and me running my hands over her small but perfect ass, then up under her impossibly short skirt.

Oh sorry, where was I?

This would be idiocy of the first order, right? Or could it be a cold war of sorts: I know she knows that I know what she's up to, and vice-versa, so is it mutually-assured destruction? She is not married, but she does have an incredibly strict mother, who used to stand outside the office waiting for her every night after work to escort her safely home. I used to tell her the best thing she could ever do for herself would be to run away from home and get as far away from la madre as possible. Clearly she is trying to break out and forge a new life for herself. Why couldn't I be of some assistance? Someone please talk me back from this precipice, or encourage me that there is no real danger except sore muscles from fucking her too much.

On the other hand, I have cast my fly towards half a dozen sprightly-seeming little babies, and am awaiting the responses, so perhaps this should remain where it has been for the past five years, safely tucked away under the heading "fantasy that should never be pursued."

I just hope I don't run across one of my friends' daughter's profile. Awkward.

Scott

[Fixinit]

Fix, I was interested to read your story. I've got theories about this. One is if you fuck a babe repeatedly over a long time you are likely to develop real feelings (another is, the way to a woman's heart is through her vagina). I can see how you could get attached and I hope when the break comes it's not too painful. As others have observed, the multifucking offered by the sb world can make the transition easier. I am curious about how this brings you closer to your SO. I would think it would bring you closer to splitting up.

I like your theories. Besides the fact that I was attracted to my HCB it was the repetition and intimacy that did me in. When the break comes I hope to have other interests to lessen the pain.

It doesn't bring me closer to splitting up but it makes me appreciate my SO for what she does have to offer if that makes any sense. I almost want to invest some of my efforts into my SO to see if the sex life can be rejuvenated but I know I would miss the variety that life has to offer. There were reasons why I always have chased the variety.

Quick story for today. My HCB stopped by my office for an hour today. We talked and then we were about to have some fun. The problem is she got a phone call and needed to run before we could really get into it. Sure I was disappointed but she asked if we can continue this tomorrow and of course I said yes. On her way out she asked if she could have some sugar. I gave her. 3 and she was happy. Then stupid me initiated an overnight next week which she was all for. This is what gets me emotionally attached. I need to keep this fun and away from things you would do in a relationship but damn it will be a fun night. I guess that is why the saying goes "No Pain No Gain".

Fix

[F Scott]

I'm trying this on seeking arrangements and was wondering what you approach is. I'm used to online dating sites so not sure how to open.

Z

Welcome Z,

If this pans out for you the way it has for certain others of us, I predict you will never go back to whatever it was you were doing before. That said, some time reading this marvelous thread, perhaps back to its very inception, should provide you with all the tools needed to get your fly on the water, at the very least. Practice and patience are then up to you.

If you have specific questions on specific issues, I think you will find any of the brothers here more than willing to share hints and insight. My general technique for all my fishing is to use a combination of politeness, circumspection and manners. These babies are, for the most part, amateurs who may or may not be fully aware of the details themselves, and will need to be coaxed into bed, not shoved. How you do the coaxing, and what you use for a lure, will get you a certain kind of baby. Remember, though, that very few of them are unaware of what the true nature of these kinds of sites is all about. As has been said, you are not meeting them at a health club, but you still don't want to treat them like anything less than ladies, in my opinion.

RTF, grasshopper, and you will find that which you seek, and after you have read the thread, spend some time reading baby profiles, paying close attention to the ones that you respond to yourself. They will tell you what they want you to say - "music, arts, museums, night in snuggling, night out at a nice restaurant, travel, creativity, gentleman, intelligent, love to read, love movies, etc etc." If these are things you can produce, you will have no problems.

My one cardinal rule you must never break: do not send them a picture of lower case z, ever. They will swim back to their holding spots and never rise for you again.

Let us know how things progress,

Scott

[Hernando]

Welcome back Lit!

Thanks to all my brothers out there for the concern about me whining like a baby over my HYB. Affairs of the heart are a difficult thing and this SB is my first departure from multifucking that I engaged in over the past 2+ years. I went from 1 to 2 escorts / week to monogamy. As an update I discussed my concerns about my SB's suspected reentry into the SD market and she assured me that she wasn't looking and things are grand with us. Who knows? Maybe she is playing me at my own game, but I choose to believe her. So.I am spending all of my play $$$ on her so in order to spread my seed I would need to back off from her. Ergo, since I am totally satisfied with her services, I 'm sticking with monogamy.

[F Scott]

Gentlemen,

Well, I learn something new every day! A friend pm'ed me after reading my post of helpful hints and observations concerning security, and informed me that my clever, super-secret, on-line only credit card had a serious flaw that could easily land me in some very deep, and very hot, water. If my SO, or my accountant, were to get a hold of a credit report, that account would show up, and subsequently be open to review or at least questions, the answers to which would spell my certain doom. He suggested instead getting a shell account, which basically I use for innocent purposes, then use cash to purchase at the same bank pre-paid cards to use when charging is unavoidable.

As for the incriminating account, the advice is to close it pronto, clear out the money (it actually is a debit card attached to a savings account) and pray that it just appears as a closed account. Since I am in the process of eliminating as much cc debt as I can, and closing accounts as I can, this will hopefully not arouse any suspicion. I am off to the bank to negotiate such a thing as soon as I hit "upload". Hope I did not lead anyone astray on this. I wanted to get the word out as quickly as possible. If anyone has any other ideas about anonymous debit cards and how to secure them, I think now might be a good time to share.

On another topic, my workout session with my ATF this afternoon was noteworthy for her inclusion of certain toys, which I had not had any experience with up until now. Subject of another post, I feel, but may I just say HOT! And the vocals!

All the best,

Scott

[Zman429]

I'm trying this on seeking arrangements and was wondering what you approach is. I'm used to online dating sites so not sure how to open.

Z

[Literal2]

*We have been seeing each other on average three times a week. Sometimes we just hang out and talk, other times we have fun. Last week we spent an overnight and it was a turning point I feel for what has been going on. The week prior we had an overnight and it was actually more like love *

Fix

Fix, I was interested to read your story. I've got theories about this. One is if you fuck a babe repeatedly over a long time you are likely to develop real feelings (another is, the way to a woman's heart is through her vagina). I can see how you could get attached and I hope when the break comes it's not too painful. As others have observed, the multifucking offered by the sb world can make the transition easier. I am curious about how this brings you closer to your SO. I would think it would bring you closer to splitting up.

Every one of the could-actually-meet ladies (I discount the ones from far away) that have winked or written me first has been black, and all but one was less than 25.

CWL, I remember getting those unsolicited winks / kisses etc. Mostly I ignored them because I assumed they were from unattractive girls or pros. Did you ever take the plunge with someone you met this way? I'd be curious how it played out. Forgive me if you have described this before and I forget. Alzheimers. My memory is good enough to remember that you had an active youth, to put it mildly.

Regarding the TV show, they did run a special on the SD thing. More from the SB perspective and how and why these young girls get involved in the trade.

Vroom, I watched the Ariana Huffington piece that was linked earlier, I'm not sure that's what you meant. The thing about that piece that struck me was the psychologist. When asked if being an sb was harmful to the girl, the psych said yes, because she will feel guilty later and that will depress her. The psych also said that sbs and sds were indicative of a real problem, not having morals, etc. Wait, doesn't that imply that if they don't feel guilty they won't be harmed? And I don't see why they would feel guilty if they really don't have the kind of morals that tell them not to do it. Older cats always have and always will lust after young pussies. It makes us happy. What makes people unhappy is hypocrisy. You can't even talk about this stuff (older married guys and young women) leading to happiness or you will get loudly criticized by everybody. Which is why USASG and ISG are so useful. I sent Jackson a note of thanks a while ago when I happened to be in his town. I mean it, this forum and for me this thread particularly have improved my life.

I made it clear she would suffer as much as I would with any public disclosure. She disappeared never to be heard from again.

Spit, well done. I hope I have the balls to do that if it ever happens to me.

***I put myself on double secret probation, and now, looking at it in the clear light of a new year, it seems silly and pointless. There are just too many sweet, sweet babies out there to limit myself to just one.*** I like the pursuit almost as much as the goal, so I am getting my tackle out again, and heading off to the SA pool to see who is rising. ***

Scott, you are the real deal. Lead on brother, and don't forget to write!

Re Scott's post on security and multiple babes. I agree with all his procedures and have used most of them. I'm glad to learn Scott's opinion about license plate disclosure. It's analogous to hotel registration I guess. You don't want to register under a fake name because that's breaking the law and breaking the law leads to problems with the folks against whom our security procedures are ineffective. Similarly, you don't want to mess with license plates. Often I used rental cars on my sb excursions because they were out of town. Once I rented one in town just to see a girl. Too much trouble and it uses up a lot of time better spent fucking.

Two things I would add to Scott's list are encryption software and sim cards. Check out Truecrypt if you're interested and look it over closely. You will be amazed how easy and effective it can be. RE sim cards. If you have an unlocked phone you can replace the sim card when you want a different number and a sim card is a lot easier to hide than a phone.

Still things can always go wrong. I wrote earlier about a lovely fresh 23 year old escort in Canada I hired through an agency and stupidly told I was single. Why should she care? I told her I was mid 50's but said I was divorced. The agency had my real name. Somehow she got it and called my home, the warden picked up. The girl was furious and started screaming. WTF, the girl was a 23 year old escort! The warden thought it was a crank call and threatened the girl with the police. Whew. That was about 10 years ago now but it still gives me the creeps. Weird but true story.

Another unanticipated security breach came when I left an SB in a nice hotel bar, gave her my room number and asked her to join me. When she showed up 15 minutes later she was drunk. My bill from the hotel had several extra charges on it. I complained by email but they never responded and I dropped it. To this day I worry the girl used my room number to order drinks to fortify her nerves when I left and the bar man sympathetically looked up my name for her.

So you can't anticipate everything.

I also agree with Scott that the pursuit is half (well nearly) the fun.

Good hunting to you all.