"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

**JZLizard** · 10-22-14 18:31

Originally Posted by FeelGoodMd [View Original Post]

Gentlemen, I discovered a new word for GPS today. I was having dinner with this PYT (18, tight spinner body) and we were talking about what we each wanted. She said that she was looking for a man to "financially dominate" her.

To me the term "financial domination" would imply she is asking you to revoke any and all spending power she might have, removing her access to every last penny she has and requiring her to ask permission to gain further access to it.

Female vernacular resulting from female logic, I suppose.

**FeelGoodMd** · 10-22-14 18:10

Gentlemen, I discovered a new word for GPS today. I was having dinner with this PYT (18, tight spinner body) and we were talking about what we each wanted. She said that she was looking for a man to "financially dominate" her.

Since this was a new one on me (though I had a feeling I knew where it was going) I asked what that meant. She explained that she wanted to find a SD who would "open up his wallet and completely spoil me. " She wanted to become "dependent on his money and the gifts he gives me. ".

I suggested that she might have difficulty finding such an arrangement in our area, but I guess she needs a little more reality before she is cured of this evil illness. I told her I would open up my wallet and give her $, or $$ if we were really compatible in bed.

As you can imagine, there was no FC after dinner.

This one has GPS bad, brothers. Stay away!

https://www.seekingarrangement.com/m...ec61b55a/view?

**JZLizard** · 10-22-14 13:25

As Fred said, hickies are just plain stupid. It's been a long time since I've needed to worry about them, but thank god none of my SBs tried that. I remember back in the day, literally having to pry a girl off my neck, my hand to her forehead, that I could feel trying to mark her territory like that. 99% of the time they do it to be shit-stirrers -- I seriously doubt anyone accidentally became a human leech in the interest of accidental passion. The purpose of hickies, after the age of 12 or 13, is either to intentionally try to get someone in trouble, or stake a claim to let others know you've been with someone recently.

In the case of an SB, I'd say the motive could be only a couple I can think of:

- Maybe she likes you a lot, then her rationale could be that if she gets you in hot water with your wife then there will be more money and attention for her.

- She wanted to do it just to be an ass and get you in trouble. Some women's way of feeling on top of the "competition" with men, it allows them to underhandedly attack you while simultaneously saying "oh! I got carried away because you turned me on so much". The devious side of a female's mind should never be underestimated.

But I guarantee you it was not an accident, nobody just sucks / bites a subcutaneous hematoma on another human being by accident, if they got carried away to that extent it's because they were HOPING to get carried away to that extent. Sometimes they may do this in a less conspicuous area (chest or abs hidden by shirt as they are giving head, etc), but because they are easier to hide, I find them far less concerning, and I typically interpret that as more of a sign they like you (I. E. Telling other girls you're taken if they see you naked) than somewhere visible like on the neck (I. E. Thereby negatively impacting the way you look to others, professionally or otherwise).

Another trick I've seen is when suddenly some lipstick goes on right before sex, then at some point when you are most distracted, a gentle kiss goes right behind the ear. Unless their victim is unfortunate enough to be sporting a mullet, they know this is an area that is very visible to others but that you won't see in the mirror (and it may not even come off in a shower). Once again, they just couldn't control their desire for you, that's why it ended up behind your ear rather than on the visible portion of your neck. Yeah right, beware the devil.

I personally would run far from that one if married. Bang her relentlessly otherwise. If you really like her you might warn her that doing stuff like that might turn out badly if she encounters a married guy with a bad temper that just realizes she ruined his life by putting something like that on his neck.

**BeardedMan67** · 10-22-14 12:27

Originally Posted by SlowMo [View Original Post]

Congratulations on the upcoming date! Would you mind sharing what the dollar figure is? I know some guys will tell you that whatever you proposed is too high, but each market has different dynamics. Plus, I feel that if she scratches your itch, almost any amount is worth it compared to someone who doesn't.

And just remember this:

"You choke the chicken before any big date, don't you? Tell me you spank the monkey before any big date. Oh my God, he doesn't flog the dolphin before a big date. Are you crazy? That's like going out there with a loaded gun!

225. I was initially going to offer 175, but she was just so darn cute!

**FredMoore** · 10-22-14 10:32

VaSD1.

" she left hickey marks on my neck " Whoa! That is a deal breaker for a married guy. #1 it is red neck to sport a hickey (we're talking preteen crap) and 2) she disrespected you. Perhaps she got lost in her passion but what the F are you going to do to explain that?!

Re: sleeping after the big O that is a job well done as long as she wakes up and gets back in the action. If time is limited I wake 'them up with reentry.

M&G with a 9/9/9/? Mixed 20 yr old. We hit it off and she is ready for the FC but my problem is she lives 2 hours away. In my heightened state of affairs at home it makes it virtually undoable. Alas! I think she would be a keeper but I don't think I can manage it.

Re: 18 t0 19 yr olds, they are more of a challenge for me getting them to the FC. I can't date in town so basically I need an UTR I guess. Anyone in Central Va working a 18/19 yr old successfully PM and I can share info.

**VaSD1** · 10-22-14 01:03

Met my 23 yo MILF nurse tonight. First date was M&G, tonight was to the FC. My first mixed girl (black and asian). Former college cheerleader and just a sweet little spinner. She's was a SB a few years ago with a richer and younger guy than me, went from that situation to a traditional relationship that ended badly, decided to come back to the sugar world and I'm glad she did. Had a couple of drinks in the hotel bar then up to the FC. She insisted on shaving her kitty before the roll in the hay so I had to twiddle my thumbs for a few minutes (strange, I didn't care but again she insisted). She meant to do it before coming to meet me but realized while getting ready she was out of razors so stopped on the way to get one. A great session and she was really into it (guess it had been a while). Needed a cover for the sexo but she happily swallowed the load at the end. Had two things happen that I haven't run across before. One, she left hickey marks on my neck (not good for a married guy) and second she was riding on top with my finger in her back door when she came hard and just rolled over and passed out. I lay there for a while and next thing I know she is snoring. Let her sleep for a few minutes before I woke her up for the final go. This ever happen to anyone else? Damage was $ point 5 and I was happy with it. Will see her again I'm sure.

**HollywoodGuy** · 10-21-14 22:14

Actually I only go to like 50 miles out. So maybe the percentages are a tad higher, but not much. In the 50 to 100 miles out they would be much higher as those are the low income far away suburbs. And if I ever have to budget down, that's where I am moving. Because its pussy heaven out there.

**HollywoodGuy** · 10-21-14 19:54

Why is it so tough to get the ball rolling? I just crunched the numbers for girls in my demographic within 100 miles of me. Of all the girls on SD4M only 30% are in my demographic by age and race (18-28 black or mixed). Out of those, half aren't good looking enough (down to 15%) fully a third of those left are aren't serious. That leaves 10% of the girls left. Out of that 10% more than half of them don't even read my message (down to 5%) and of the ones that do, 50% laugh at my offer or don't respond. That leaves about 1% that are actually DTF NP's for $. And 1% that are UTR for $. Which is ok if they are new enough or low mileage. If they are UTR I usually wont see them unless they are 18-22.

Of that 2% (NP and UTR combined) maybe half of them have the right chemistry to get to, long term SB status (whether they started out as NP's or UTR's I don't care). Sounds discouraging, right? Well some days it is and some days it isn't. The only reason I have any success is that I hit up every single girl the day they sign up. I don't really worry about screening them much to get an intro letter out. Of all the girls that agree to my terms I only M&G maybe half of them. I mostly reject the ones that come back as possible pros, or too far away or both.

And when I find a keeper, I keep her for as long as possible, years. Also, I don't demand intercourse on the first date (but I do on the second). Once I am on the date a combination of game, need and true NP status takes over. I started out like everyone (most everyone) as a green newbie. I never really dated until my fifties. I threw caution to the wind and got burned as fast as possible by as many women as possible to speed up the learning curve, and paying $$$ a date no problem.

The only reason I am so strict with a new girl now ($) is that I like to go out a lot, so its the only way to stay on budget. Any girl that proves herself over time is going to be rewarded beyond that. Some girls are long term players and want all the other perks of having an SD beyond the cash. They are out there, you just can't give up looking.

Another way to look at it is this. In the beginning it took me 30 FC dates to find a keeper (that number would be lower but some girls didn't wanna keep me. LOL) . As I tightened up my selection process its gone to below 10. And this year its gone to 1 out of 5 that I have kept for at least 10 dates. But in the last 7 years I have only averaged 1 new GF level relationship per year. Looking at another number the site says I messaged 950 girls in the last 6 months. So I will guess about 1500 this year so far. This led to 20 M&G's that went nowhere, 24 FC dates of which 5 girls made it to or will get to 10 dates or more. And not one new GF level new girl. If it wasn't for holding on to my long term regulars (years) I would be toast. I did start out the year with a GF, but had to break up with her before being able to replace her (my usual MO). No problem, as I am enjoying the single life for now.

**SlowMo** · 10-21-14 19:19

Originally Posted by BeardedMan67 [View Original Post]

Wow guys I think I might have hit a home run on my first time up to bat. Met an incredibly cute 18 year old girl tonight at a local coffee shop. We had emailed each other 4-5 times and she asked me to go get coffee. I got there first but didn't see anyone matching her pics. I got my drink and sat down. As I turned my my drink I saw her. WOW- absolutely stunning. I sat down and she got her drink and came over. We introduced ourselves and just started talking. We talked about everything for over an hour. I finally broached the arrangement. She said she already felt comfortable with me and she was down with it. I offered her my decided upon fee and she took it right away. No haggling back and forth. She said I'm so happy we met!! We have a date set up for this coming weekend. I am stoked! I was incredibly nervous about the meet and greet but it went so well.

Congratulations on the upcoming date! Would you mind sharing what the dollar figure is? I know some guys will tell you that whatever you proposed is too high, but each market has different dynamics. Plus, I feel that if she scratches your itch, almost any amount is worth it compared to someone who doesn't.

And just remember this:

"You choke the chicken before any big date, don't you? Tell me you spank the monkey before any big date. Oh my God, he doesn't flog the dolphin before a big date. Are you crazy? That's like going out there with a loaded gun!

**HollywoodGuy** · 10-21-14 18:06

Originally Posted by HollywoodGuy [View Original Post]

If she does follow through it will be well worth it. If not, at least I got her off my list. My gut says its in my favor. Her body was a solid 9 if you like small girls. So my original guess wasnt too far off. She was a 7/9/8/8. If they truly want to compete (meaning earn some money), they have to get real about the game. This girl tonite knows she's hot but she also knows that putting her nose in the air is gonna get her nowhere.

She txted me today trying to upsell me for intercourse on the 2nd date. I passed. Next.

**JZLizard** · 10-21-14 13:14

Originally Posted by HollywoodGuy [View Original Post]

Here is one I messaged about 6 months ago. Her profile disappeared and she rejected my offer anyway. Suddenly I see she has a new profile. So I make the same offer again. Radio silence. So as a last ditch attempt I tell her how hot she is. She replied with her phone number. 30 MILF 5'0" 100? Gym fit body. Another 7/9.

That reminds me of a fun story.

Once, I had a civy find that was a recent college grad (just met her on match, no talk of support or anything, but being without any real job prospects or experience and so much younger than me, I felt she was looking for either a potential husband to ease her stressful life or someone who could help her advance her career, or preferably both). Things weren't progressing like I wanted them to, and I figured out why. She had met someone else her age a few weeks before me that she had been seeing and felt like she "loved" him.

So one time we go to a restaurant for munchies, drinks and conversation kind of late (maybe 9 pm). She goes to the restroom and as she's walking back to the table, I get a good look at her head to toe and realize what an impressive looking woman she is, so right as she reaches the table, I said "damn, you are hot". She pushes her chair back in, comes and sits on my lap and starts deep French kissing me right there in the restaurant without saying a word. It wasn't quite as awkward as it sounds because it being late, the restaurant had dimmed the lights a little bit and turned up the music for a little bit of a lounge atmosphere, but still people were looking at our table wondering what had just taken place. It probably looked like I had either just proposed or slipped a horny pill in her drink.

Now the flip side of that -- I've seen some women say "I wish for once a guy would tell me I'm beautiful instead of telling me I'm hot". So, when dealing with women there's never a sure thing. But I'd say in general telling them they're hot probably never hurts.

And, oddly enough no I didn't get laid that night after the restaurant. She had to be at an interview the next morning (she said. Possibly meeting the other guy). But I did fuck her a couple of weeks later and it was worth waiting for (and free of charge).

**HollywoodGuy** · 10-21-14 12:49

Here is one I messaged about 6 months ago. Her profile disappeared and she rejected my offer anyway. Suddenly I see she has a new profile. So I make the same offer again. Radio silence. So as a last ditch attempt I tell her how hot she is. She replied 10 days later with her phone number. 30 MILF 5'0" 100? Gym fit body. Another 7/9.

**FredMoore** · 10-21-14 09:49

Originally Posted by Minnanon [View Original Post]

In general, how long does it take experienced SDs to get from first contact to a meet and greet, and from there to an FC?

Also, general ratio of flakes to serious girls others see. For every woman I've talked to that seems serious and not playing games, I've talked with 9 that: just stop talking; or make a date then cancel; or who insist on getting paid $$ or more just to show up and get treated to dinner at an initial M&G; or are shocked, shocked that an SD wants to have sex with them, they just wanted a platonic relationship.

.

There are several factors such as YMMV, the market you're in, and the type of SBs who you are attracted to.

If you "got game" then the girls are going to fall for you. This can be good looks, great personality, or that "power" feel about you. The biggest thing IMHO is confidence. You know what you want, are not tentative, and make it easy for them to say yes.

A market that is overly competitive is difficult and the girls can be choosy. If there are lots of flakes, and we all encounter them, you'll get a run of failures. If the Pro ratio is high you will have success. They are all about the money. And speaking of money. They all have a price. You might be too low. Hollywood brings up a good point. If you select the hotties (9 to 10) they are pickier since they get more attention.

I do much better with 7 to 8's. And if you can date in public you will have an easier time of it. When I lived in an apartment I could always take them out to dinner then ask them back for a drink. 2 of them said no sex and I did not pressure them, but as the night wore on they became comfortable and went for it.

**HollywoodGuy** · 10-21-14 01:48

Originally Posted by HollywoodGuy [View Original Post]

It could be the same day or a few weeks. Today a beautiful girl messaged me back from Sept. 7th. This one pictured would have been a same day but I was too busy. Now its been like 3 days. Seeing her tonite. 23 5,6" maybe 110+ 7/9/8/? So far. Just an FYI. I always choose a girl with a hot body over a beauty queen face. Reverse that and you are more likely to encounter a GPS girl. So a 7/9 is gonna get my attention way faster than a 9/7. Its looking at their body that keeps me going in bed.

Well I went to see the tatted girl in the pic and she turned out to be a chill UTR girl. Recently transplanted to my fair city as so many of them are. She looked just like her pic below. Super tight and tattooed from head to toe with at least a dozen piercings. We wasted about 5 minutes talking in the car in her driveway. She had me lower my pants and we had a decent make out and HJ session. She was trying to rush me up but when she realized that wasnt gonna work she backed down her speed a bit. I am sure she would be great in bed and she said she liked it rough. Which I believe as I pulled on her nips a lot harder than most girls could take (it was closing in on a punishment level pain scale). I was a little surprised she didn't go for the BJ, but oh well. I sucked on her perfect pierced nips which seem to give rise to some real passion. She said she would come over to the FC for a second date. But until it happens who knows. I told her it would still be the same $ for fucking in the FC as it was for the car date and she said she was cool with that.

If she does follow through it will be well worth it. If not, at least I got her off my list. My gut says its in my favor. Her body was a solid 9 if you like small girls. So my original guess wasnt too far off. She was a 7/9/8/8. One big advantage to living here is that all the prom queens, captains of the cheerleading team, and girls that would be 9,s or 10's in their little or not so little town, all move to L.A. thinking they are gonna be models, singers, dancers or actresses. When they get here they realize very quickly they are a solid 8 but far from star quality. And then the competition begins. If they truly want to compete (meaning earn some money), they have to get real about the game. This girl tonite knows she's hot but she also knows that putting her nose in the air is gonna get her nowhere.

**BeardedMan67** · 10-21-14 00:11

Wow guys I think I might have hit a home run on my first time up to bat. Met an incredibly cute 18 year old girl tonight at a local coffee shop. We had emailed each other 4-5 times and she asked me to go get coffee. I got there first but didn't see anyone matching her pics. I got my drink and sat down. As I turned my my drink I saw her. WOW- absolutely stunning. I sat down and she got her drink and came over. We introduced ourselves and just started talking. We talked about everything for over an hour. I finally broached the arrangement. She said she already felt comfortable with me and she was down with it. I offered her my decided upon fee and she took it right away. No haggling back and forth. She said I'm so happy we met!! We have a date set up for this coming weekend. I am stoked! I was incredibly nervous about the meet and greet but it went so well.