"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[HollywoodGuy]

Well, I'll be damned.

Dr Milrod is a sex therapist. Checking out her site after HG's comment to see whether she was engaged in a total waste of time, I see she charges $180 per hour to fix sex problems.

She's also written multiple scholarly studies on 1 men who patronize prostitutes, 2 preferences of men who patronize internet sex sites, 3 "Emotion Management among the Clients of Escorts," 4 "The Internet Hobbyist," and other articles. This lady appears to be seriously studying our culture.

Probably because she isn't gettin any or she is tired of dating broke guys and is trying to figure how to get paid for what she is already giving away for free. Or maybe she just figures she will jump on the wealth re-distribution band wagon and take money from guys that have proven they like to spend it.

[Almsga62]

Guys I need some advice. I know a single mom with 3 kids. She's nice looking cute sweet girl. Low paying job. Trying to make ends meet. No help from baby daddy. I been giving some amounts lunch money 5 10 sometimes a 20. I can give more. Would like to be FWB type sugar baby. Don't know how to move forward. Not sure if she would be into that. Her age is 29. She does need money.

[Literal2]

Well, I'll be damned.

Dr Milrod is a sex therapist. Checking out her site after HG's comment to see whether she was engaged in a total waste of time, I see she charges $180 per hour to fix sex problems.

She's also written multiple scholarly studies on 1 men who patronize prostitutes, 2 preferences of men who patronize internet sex sites, 3 "Emotion Management among the Clients of Escorts," 4 "The Internet Hobbyist," and other articles. This lady appears to be seriously studying our culture.

[Dsprdo]

I started reading this thread in February of this year and was immediately hooked. I began to explore a couple of the SD sites and sent out notes in earnest in April. I've learned a ton through the combined wisdom of the brothers on here and felt it was time to look back and recap. I didn't keep records of how many initial letters I sent out but I'm sure it ran into the hundreds. I estimate I went on about 25 M&G's since May. Of those 25,11 have wound up with POF; another five were willing but after I met them in person I elected not to move forward. Of the 10 or so that I met with that I didn't succeed in bedding, it was a mixed bag. Over half of them decided not to go forward for reasons other than sugar amount. In some cases I would say that they got cold feet, and decided that they just weren't ready to take the plunge. This seemed to be the case with several girls that I would say were absolutely new to the idea of a sugar relationship. In other cases it was due to either a lack of attraction to me or shortcomings in my closing game; as I've seen them subsequently active on SA. The rest boiled down to dollars. I decided early on that I would try and stick to HG's program of $ per visit; and have been generally successful. My first couple of girls were one and done; one by my choice and one by hers (we had not discussed sugar, she refused to tell me what she was thinking, so I gave her $ and when I contacted her again she said she really needed $ I had one girl for a couple of months at $.5 a visit, and one at $$ per week, and my current regular is 500 per month. Of the 11, I am still seeing two. Of the nine that aren't around anymore, only one broke off with me. I haven't had any real drama from any of the girls, and most have been to my house. All in all it has been a great year.

The $ a visit allowance isn't always a success. In the last couple of weeks I have had M&G's with two girls set up who had agreed to $, only to have them flake on me. I think both of them were more UTR types supplementing the budget for the holidays who may have gotten a better offer.

I came very close to throwing the budget to the winds this week. I met a 21 year old blond, green-eyed spinner who said she was absolutely new to the bowl. She works as a bartender, had moved here from out of state, has her own apartment with no roommates. I was captivated by her. We met a second time to go over expectations and get the money talk out of the way. She agreed to everything I put on the table, and lightly traced her nails on the back of my hand as we talked. I asked her what she felt she needed as far as financial help, and she wouldn't say. I offered $$ per week, which would cover her rent, and without hesitation she refused. I asked again what she had in mind since she was so quick to reject my offer and she still said she didn't know. We were pressed for time, so I had to leave and told her that I would be in touch the next day and would think about the finances. She gave me a terrific kiss and walked me to the door. On the drive home she texted me and said she had canceled her plans for the next day so that we could get together-and oh, by the way, could I have her allowance for her then. That night I thought long and hard about upping the ante, even if it meant cutting my current regular loose, because I REALLY wanted this girl. Eventually, blood returned to my brain and I began to think of the anomalies. On our very first scheduled M&G, she flaked without a call or a text. I had overlooked it when she apologized the next day, but it called into question her reliability. We had the financial discussion at her apartment, which was very nice and nicely furnished. I had taken that as a good sign, but now began to wonder how she afforded it, based on the back story and what I knew of her job. Finally there was the matter of the allowance. I had said "per week" and she kept coming back with "per month", and still hadn't given me an idea of what she wanted. Basically I was about to start bidding against myself, throwing numbers out there until she heard one she liked, and she was expecting a month's worth up front. She sent me another nice text that evening, saying she was looking forward to the next day. I responded that I was thinking things through and would be in touch. The next morning, with a clear head, I told her that I would not be able to meet her needs and wished her well. She fired back a couple of snarky comments, that I politely deflected, then she ended our conversation pleasantly. She was the prototype of what I am looking for if everything she said had turned out to be true, but I think I made the right choice. I am sure I will continue second-guessing myself for a while.

[HollywoodGuy]

With a reminder to myself and all other mongers that the world of anonymous sex forums is seldom as it appears, I am passing along an interesting PM I received.

I am taking the liberty of sending you a link to a survey of baby boomer hobbyists aged 60+ being conducted by Dr. Christine Milrod. She is a legitimate sex counselor and researcher. I included her website and email in this PM. She's conducting a serious, completely anonymous, study of mature hobbyists because it's not been studied before and the bulk of past research is limited to street prostitutes. ********** about 20 minutes with about 100 questions. Personally I thought it was very interesting. You can contact *** Dr. Milrod directly, if you have any questions.

Here is the link: https://www.psychdata.com/s.asp?SID=157878

Christine Milrod, PhD, LMFT, AASECT
info@sexandlifecoaching.com
www.sexandlifecoaching.com

I know nothing about this survey and haven't decided whether I will participate or not. Mainly I'm too paranoid. However, I wish somebody would study the true components of normal male sexual happiness, mature and otherwise. There is so much political bullshit about what's normal and natural and what's not. I read in the news that Utah is about to legislate approval of gay marriage; this in a state which was universally condemned for legal polygamy for decades. Excuse me? Gay sex is ok and natural but polygamy isn't?

I was initially attracted to usasg because its members routinely referred to the USA as sex prison, a term I wholeheartedly agree with. Maybe if there is more serious research demonstrating that it is normal for men to find happiness by having sex with multiple women, our country will become more tolerant of our practice and the bars of the prison, such as draconian divorce laws and public humiliation for infidelity, will disintegrate.

I don't think old men are much different from young men in their fantasies and desires. There is for many of us a wonderful crossover point in life when our attractive bodies and potency have faded but our bank accounts have swelled and we find that fucking multiple young women without complications has become much easier than it ever was when we were young, and the advent of sugarbaby websites has made it even easier.

Worlwide everyone knows that men having multiple partners is totally normal as is practiced routinely in many many countries and is legal. In the bible all the powers that be including Abraham (demanded by G*d) and Noah had more than one partner (King David was reported to have 1000 consorts). Even in the puritanical US of A all men of means are expected to have more than one woman if for no other reason than to assert their alpha status. Although I am sure that is just an extra on top of the real reason. And lets not even talk about the legal age of marriage in some countries (12 to 16).

Studying this topic is a total waste of time. IMHO.

[HollywoodGuy]

Got back on SA, and was able to land a 19 yr old with no meet and greet. She came to my house (rented apartment I got on my Airbnb account under a fake name).

Because even though I'm single I want to hide my identity initially. We talk for a bit exchanged about less then 20 text back and forth. She complained her last sugar daddy was cheap only 100 bucks and dinner every time they met, and the other sugar daddy that gave her 400 per meet only hooked up with her once. 100 bucks is pretty cheap for my local market. She came to the apartment, she was a little bigger than her pics, but I don't mind thick girls with some booty. We talked for about an hour. She is pretty smart and seems pretty normal, her grand parents are actually millionaires from a law suit. She has a good family and actually had to cancel our first get together because of a family get together. Cool with her mom, but had some daddy issues, because her dad gave up on her when she went through a rebel phase. She seemed pretty normal and not give off any P.S.ycho alert that I look for in sugar babies. She doesn't tell any of her friends about this, another sign she is normal.

She only has one friend that she tell about this, and she is a topless waitress in California, that and the fact she had a p4 p one night stand with a sd are the only warning signs I saw that concerned me, also the fact that she came to my house without a meet and greet seemed UTRish, but I'm close to her age and she claims that I was the only SD she didn't meet in public first. She was also expecting the one night stand with the SD to turn into an ongoing thing he just never called her again.

Enough with her P.S.ychological profilelshe Philipino 5'4 with a nice round ass. Oral was ok I popped twice and she seemed to have fun as well. Right now she is on booty call SB status. I will see her again, but I think there maybe better deals to be had, but the fact that she is pretty normal and attractive are major plus's. I will continue to explore trying to get 1 to 2 quality SB's as far as looks and not being P.S.ycho into rotation for the winter season. Not a bad re entry into the bowl considered that I didn't have to do a meet and greet first and the texting was minimal.

You never did state what you paid her. Add in the room cost and any other cost and it might be a bit pricey. If you still want to continue with her, make her do every sexual move you ever wanted out of a girl. And for as long as you want. No excuses. Or back her down to $ a meet.

[Literal2]

With a reminder to myself and all other mongers that the world of anonymous sex forums is seldom as it appears, I am passing along an interesting PM I received.

I am taking the liberty of sending you a link to a survey of baby boomer hobbyists aged 60+ being conducted by Dr. Christine Milrod. She is a legitimate sex counselor and researcher. I included her website and email in this PM. She's conducting a serious, completely anonymous, study of mature hobbyists because it's not been studied before and the bulk of past research is limited to street prostitutes. ********** about 20 minutes with about 100 questions. Personally I thought it was very interesting. You can contact *** Dr. Milrod directly, if you have any questions.

Here is the link: https://www.psychdata.com/s.asp?SID=157878

Christine Milrod, PhD, LMFT, AASECT
info@sexandlifecoaching.com
www.sexandlifecoaching.com

I know nothing about this survey and haven't decided whether I will participate or not. Mainly I'm too paranoid. However, I wish somebody would study the true components of normal male sexual happiness, mature and otherwise. There is so much political bullshit about what's normal and natural and what's not. I read in the news that Utah is about to legislate approval of gay marriage; this in a state which was universally condemned for legal polygamy for decades. Excuse me? Gay sex is ok and natural but polygamy isn't?

I was initially attracted to usasg because its members routinely referred to the USA as sex prison, a term I wholeheartedly agree with. Maybe if there is more serious research demonstrating that it is normal for men to find happiness by having sex with multiple women, our country will become more tolerant of our practice and the bars of the prison, such as draconian divorce laws and public humiliation for infidelity, will disintegrate.

I don't think old men are much different from young men in their fantasies and desires. There is for many of us a wonderful crossover point in life when our attractive bodies and potency have faded but our bank accounts have swelled and we find that fucking multiple young women without complications has become much easier than it ever was when we were young, and the advent of sugarbaby websites has made it even easier.

[Literal2]

All the activity on the thread is good to see, and the contributed wisdom and experience is a real benefit to the skill sets of pussy hounds everywhere. I hope it keeps up.

As for the resident senior geezer, or one of them anyway, I report 2013 brought me only four new sbs actually fucked. Well, one was really a stripper. Another was a 27 divorced mom, very hot ("I haven't been with an older guy before," she said euphemistically, "but that was the best sex I've had in a long time." I just said, oh yeah? But I was giving myself a high five and yes! On the inside).

The other two were terrible. A 23 yo skinny country girl but big boobs and tobacco reek all over her and especially in her mouth, dumb as a pineapple. She texted and called me for months, when you comin back? What happened to you? Etc. Also a 30-something fatty covered with tats who talked incessantly and was impossible to arouse. Big downer to ye old ego. She too wanted more insertions of sugar afterwards but I knew the truth, she didn't really love me for myself! Plus I couldn't stand another minute of her jibber jabber.

Uniquely, in 2013 I made dates through sd4 m for another 4-5 girls and canceled them. They all seemed attractive enough from the chat and pix but the bad experiences decreased the excitement level of my anticipation I guess and in some cases I was just tired and in others got distracted by a football game and such.

Such is geezerdom! Bored or too tired or distracted (sometimes) even for young pussy.

Still the four new actually fucked females takes me over 90 lifetime, not much I know for some of you seriosuly priapic brothers, but I'm pleased. I didn't start mongering until I was 56 and for all the years before that I was only about 30 total. Of course I didn't have p4 p for the 30 (unless you count the financial nuclear bomb that was my first wife).

Anyway, happy holidays to all fellow mongers and may all your 2014 pots lift their skirts for you and may they all be wet.

Lit2.

[Rob Taylor]

Got back on SA, and was able to land a 19 yr old with no meet and greet. She came to my house (rented apartment I got on my Airbnb account under a fake name).

Because even though I'm single I want to hide my identity initially. We talk for a bit exchanged about less then 20 text back and forth. She complained her last sugar daddy was cheap only 100 bucks and dinner every time they met, and the other sugar daddy that gave her 400 per meet only hooked up with her once. 100 bucks is pretty cheap for my local market. She came to the apartment, she was a little bigger than her pics, but I don't mind thick girls with some booty. We talked for about an hour. She is pretty smart and seems pretty normal, her grand parents are actually millionaires from a law suit. She has a good family and actually had to cancel our first get together because of a family get together. Cool with her mom, but had some daddy issues, because her dad gave up on her when she went through a rebel phase. She seemed pretty normal and not give off any P.S.ycho alert that I look for in sugar babies. She doesn't tell any of her friends about this, another sign she is normal.

She only has one friend that she tell about this, and she is a topless waitress in California, that and the fact she had a p4 p one night stand with a sd are the only warning signs I saw that concerned me, also the fact that she came to my house without a meet and greet seemed UTRish, but I'm close to her age and she claims that I was the only SD she didn't meet in public first. She was also expecting the one night stand with the SD to turn into an ongoing thing he just never called her again.

Enough with her P.S.ychological profilelshe Philipino 5'4 with a nice round ass. Oral was ok I popped twice and she seemed to have fun as well. Right now she is on booty call SB status. I will see her again, but I think there maybe better deals to be had, but the fact that she is pretty normal and attractive are major plus's. I will continue to explore trying to get 1 to 2 quality SB's as far as looks and not being P.S.ycho into rotation for the winter season. Not a bad re entry into the bowl considered that I didn't have to do a meet and greet first and the texting was minimal.

[HollywoodGuy]

Yeah, well she doesn't turn down the money, and she definitely can use it. She also was quick on the draw when she decided that the GD card wasn't something she was comfortable with.

But she's also at least equally hooked on the emotional support and mentoring that I provide. Maybe even more so, because those are things that are making a bigger difference in her life and where it's headed, and she damned well knows it. And you can't buy that with money.

But your approach is clearly working well for you and your situation, and I see your logic. If I was able to play the game the way you do, I'd probably have a similar attitude. But then again I'm probably an outlier on the range of the normal SD / SB dynamic.

Thats why the $ offer is so relevant. I can get a hottie a day at $ $ But they are only in it to win it. But at $ a day there has to be an interest in more than just the cash. And cash only girls even if they are good in bed are never really good enough in the long haul to keep my attention. It is the emotional dynamic that keeps me in the sugar bowl as opposed to the UTR world.

[Walruscl]

I want them to be in it for the money and the honey. The money gives me leverage that even if unspoken is understood. And the honey to make it sweeter. But it has to be both or its just a paid booty call (or worse) some girl that thinks she has some control over you.

Yeah, well she doesn't turn down the money, and she definitely can use it. She also was quick on the draw when she decided that the GD card wasn't something she was comfortable with.

But she's also at least equally hooked on the emotional support and mentoring that I provide. Maybe even more so, because those are things that are making a bigger difference in her life and where it's headed, and she damned well knows it. And you can't buy that with money.

But your approach is clearly working well for you and your situation, and I see your logic. If I was able to play the game the way you do, I'd probably have a similar attitude. But then again I'm probably an outlier on the range of the normal SD / SB dynamic.

[HollywoodGuy]

Same here. We recently had an unusual week where we were able to see each other twice, with the 2nd time being a last minute decision on my part to play rather than work. She made a point of saying that she just wanted to see me and to skip the sugar (which if anyone is following my tame-by-comparison adventure, she's done that a few times before).

I've been tempted to go allowance, but between the issue of her not wanting a Green Dot and some other recent drama, I've held back on that. And what occurs to me now is that it would deprive her of the ability to definitively demonstrate that she's not in it for the money. I appreciate her more on the occasions she does that, and I think it makes her feel good to do it.

Interesting twist anyway.

I want them to be in it for the money and the honey. The money gives me leverage that even if unspoken is understood. And the honey to make it sweeter. But it has to be both or its just a paid booty call (or worse) some girl that thinks she has some control over you.

[Walruscl]

I do know my ATF cares about me as an IRL BF. The ultimate question is if she would see me if I couldn't afford to pay her? As long as I can afford the Allowance I will never test her since a deal is a deal. But that would be the ultimate test. My guess is that she would still see me since we have an amazing connection.

Same here. We recently had an unusual week where we were able to see each other twice, with the 2nd time being a last minute decision on my part to play rather than work. She made a point of saying that she just wanted to see me and to skip the sugar (which if anyone is following my tame-by-comparison adventure, she's done that a few times before).

I've been tempted to go allowance, but between the issue of her not wanting a Green Dot and some other recent drama, I've held back on that. And what occurs to me now is that it would deprive her of the ability to definitively demonstrate that she's not in it for the money. I appreciate her more on the occasions she does that, and I think it makes her feel good to do it.

Interesting twist anyway.

[FredMoore]

Pretty much. It's similar cuisines. Everyone has different tastes. Personally, I'm not a big fan of "transactional" dates. I much prefer to have the woman want to be with me because of me rather than the sugar. But, then I'm also a realist and know that few twenty somethings want to be with those of us who are long of tooth unless we can offer something more.

Drat that pesky Emotional tie that many of us look for.

Even with UTRs (SB #2) and Pros I look for some sign that they like me and don't just look at me as an ATM. Silly I know. I do know my ATF cares about me as an IRL BF. The ultimate question is if she would see me if I couldn't afford to pay her? As long as I can afford the Allowance I will never test her since a deal is a deal. But that would be the ultimate test. My guess is that she would still see me since we have an amazing connection, but that she might seek another SD for the dough. She is not greedy and what I give her seems to be enough since an ex pays her.

[BikeRider]

So its basically the same price as SD4 M.

Pretty much. It's similar cuisines. Everyone has different tastes. Personally, I'm not a big fan of "transactional" dates. I much prefer to have the woman want to be with me because of me rather than the sugar. But, then I'm also a realist and know that few twenty somethings want to be with those of us who are long of tooth unless we can offer something more.