"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

**Golfcart** · 02-17-13 17:03

Originally Posted by Jbl0068 [View Original Post]

I'm new to the prospect of becoming a SD but I suppose a bit lucky. I already have a potential that wants to meet (I initiated the meet and greet after a couple of days and she was very agreeable). I was hoping to hear some thoughts on giving out numbers and photos as well as any other cautionary advice that any of you feel like passing along. I don't have a significant other so I don't have to worry about that aspect but I would be concerned about the crazies so I want to protect myself. Just so you know, before I get flamed to death, I have been reading the forum and even though I'm not a senior member yet I'm not 12 years old either. I'm just hoping to gain a little extra insight from those who are experienced and would appreciate the help.

Thanks

The question concerns giving out a cell number. A cell number can be googled to turn up our classified ad selling a washer and dryer and our real first name to go with it. Another question concerns a girl having our real photograph. Our real photograph is false proof she really knows us although we never met. She has the power to cause some future wife pause we must have met last week. How else would she have our photograph? Why would she do it? Because her expectations were not met. Women get mad.

Jb, start by reading the entire board starting with Post 1. Pay close attention to what happens when we get emotionally involved, when we think exclusivity is consistent with pay for play, when we fail to keep our personal information secure and when she has the power to show up at our work, things such as that. We have the power to hide in the weeds to protect our true selfves and those close to us but when we share our identities we give her power over us. With or without a SO we still have a life and we don't want it known among our circle that we engage in pay for play. Getting caught in an affair is survivable, maybe not to our marriage but survivable at work; getting caught in pay for play is not survivable. Jb, you're coming here at just the right time. The board has gone full circle on a lot of these mitakes showing how things are different when we have hindsight. It's here for the reading starting with Post 1, all free of charge. Note which posts you see yourself in and keep reading to see how they turned out. The bottom line is to learn the need to keep one's powder dry and how to use common sense to do it without exception. Learn this here before you journey out and are a danger to yourself.

Welcome to the board.

**CantWinLosin** · 02-17-13 10:07

With the exception of whether we're in the "golden age" of the sugar bowl (I personally think the bloom is coming off the rose, thanks to too much publicity and its attendant problems) I agree with all that John says. But I would remind you that divorce and other spousal problems are not the only, or for some of us even the worst, issues a bunny-boiler can cause. There are plenty of stories out there about jobs lost or whole careers ruined by such a crazy getting into the guy's work info and wrecking havoc, too.

Never forget that, in the end, every single girl you meet doing this is proving by their participation that they are out for #1. Some small but significant number of them will have no scruples in how far they will go for #1, and some of those will have experience at it.

**John G Smith** · 02-17-13 06:42

SA is definitely more "high-brow" than SD4M. For starters, SA has blogs which promote "white knight" fantasies, which tends to attract "normal" girls who want a knight in shining armor to take all their troubles away and whisk them away to a large castle. Whereas SD4M, the website design itself is a little more "sleazier" and on the average it tends to attract girls who just want money without all the fairytale fantasies. But it means there's a higher concentration of pros and Nando1s on that site, especially since the girls don't have to pay to be contacted. Ironically though my first psycho came from SA. So they're everywhere.

It's also why I've cautioned some of our married brothers here to be careful juggling multiple SBs and Pots. If you're juggling 4 or more girls at a time, there's just no way you can keep track of proper alibis and you may miss some early warning signs because you're caught up with too many other SBs / pots. I know it's tempting because frankly we're in the golden-age of the sugar bowl. It's a buyer's market and the HYCB real estate is in much abundance. But putting too much on your plate is a recipe for things to go crashing down sooner rather than later.

And while I agree, rule #1 is protecting your true identity and rule #2 is to follow rule #1. That said, we have to be realistic and honest with ourselves that in almost any mid to long-term sugar arrangement, the SB will likely find out your true identity. The more stuff you do with your SB, the more likely you'll accidentally leave a bread crumb of your true identity. Just read my post on "vulnerable" areas to get an idea and I still probably missed a bunch of things. So it's all about contingency plans. You need to be able to explain every M&G and every date if your SO questions you hard about it or if someone saw you. If your SB turns psycho, you need to already have your "Plan B" brown envelope, which you put together after the very first meet. Nothing should surprise you even when it does.

And above all NEVER confess. Never. Women have the instinctual defense mechanism to go into denial even when the bloody truth is staring them in the face. Probably goes back to caveman days so that "Jane" could mentally handle "Jack" putting his saber bone into "Jill","Jan", and the rest of the cave's people. So give her a plausible but vague story that will facilitate her denial. Until the SO and her private eye have the "smoking gun" on you, maintain the allusion. Eight times out of ten the SO will want To believe it even if they have serious doubts.

The recent stories by many of the members here have reminded us that this is a dangerous game, especially if you're married. Just by looking at this forum you can see a great percentage of sugar daddies will get exposed to their SO within the first 18 months of getting into the Bowl. The risk of exposure is just so much higher compared to seeing escorts and going to AMPs. For example the last meeting with my Backseat SB, she left her under shirt in my car. Even though it was dark, thankfully I caught it that night when I did a quick final checkup because my SO used my car the next morning without my knowledge.

If you have a marriage that you really value and care about, then maybe getting in to the Sugar Bowl isn't the best idea. If you just need to bang a hot girl every now and then for variety, escorts / AMPs are FAR less riskier toward your marriage (assuming you avoid LEO, which honestly isn't that hard if you're smart). As someone mentioned already, SBs are for those that need a little bit of a personal connection or "human" touch with their sex. But it comes at a price.

As for me, I wouldn't be overly distraught if my wife found out and wanted a divorce. I have some issues with her and I've basically thrown in the towel. It doesn't mean I'm not super careful concealing my identity and also insuring my escapades don't give her reason to raise questions. But I can handle the end game if ultimately I get caught and exposed. My marriage is simply not as good as some of you guys, so I'm willing to put it at the mercy of the risks of the sugar bowl. But after all the recent stories here of psychos, we should all reassess what exactly are we trying to get from the sugar bowl and if it's worth the risks. I'd say budget SDs and streetwalker mongers are probably the highest risks of exposure in the Hobbyist world.

**BigTigger** · 02-17-13 05:31

My crazy was from SD4Me. Maybe it has something to do with that fact that you don't have to pay to be contacted. On Sdaddie dot com, everyone one has to pay to send and receive emails. So that may cut down on some of the riff-raff. I think SA is the same unless you are a proven college baby (via emails address).

BigTigg.

Originally Posted by F Scott [View Original Post]

These are some truly hair-raising stories here, my friends, and certainly cautionary tales for us all. Without going back and reading all the lead-up, is there a common thread that binds all the crazy babies together? Didn't you all meet them on SD4M? It may be just my personal prejudice, but in the Chicago area, the babies on that site are, for the most part, lower rent than the ones on SA. I'd just be curious to know where they have come from.

Revvo, I hope the shit bypasses your fan, my brother. I agree with Tigg, however, don't hand your wife the goods on your extracurricular activities. I was involved in a trial as a witness many years ago, and the lawyer who was prepping me gave me this bit of advice: don't say a single word more than you have to; there is no sense in doing the other side's work for them. If your wife is going to nail you, she will do it on her own, with our without your help.

Good luck, my friend!

Scott

**Member #4290** · 02-16-13 23:29

I'm new to the prospect of becoming a SD but I suppose a bit lucky. I already have a potential that wants to meet (I initiated the meet and greet after a couple of days and she was very agreeable). I was hoping to hear some thoughts on giving out numbers and photos as well as any other cautionary advice that any of you feel like passing along. I don't have a significant other so I don't have to worry about that aspect but I would be concerned about the crazies so I want to protect myself. Just so you know, before I get flamed to death, I have been reading the forum and even though I'm not a senior member yet I'm not 12 years old either. I'm just hoping to gain a little extra insight from those who are experienced and would appreciate the help.

Thanks

**HollywoodGuy** · 02-16-13 21:30

Originally Posted by F Scott [View Original Post]

These are some truly hair-raising stories here, my friends, and certainly cautionary tales for us all. Without going back and reading all the lead-up, is there a common thread that binds all the crazy babies together? Didn't you all meet them on SD4M? It may be just my personal prejudice, but in the Chicago area, the babies on that site are, for the most part, lower rent than the ones on SA. I'd just be curious to know where they have come from.

Revvo, I hope the shit bypasses your fan, my brother. I agree with Tigg, however, don't hand your wife the goods on your extracurricular activities. I was involved in a trial as a witness many years ago, and the lawyer who was prepping me gave me this bit of advice: don't say a single word more than you have to; there is no sense in doing the other side's work for them. If your wife is going to nail you, she will do it on her own, with our without your help.

Good luck, my friend!

Scott

I used to be on SA and SD4me at the same time and then I switched to SD4me exclusively when I saw a lot of the same girls were on both. (As it costs them nothing to join.) SA is geared to promote the SB at a higher level of compensation due to thier ridiculous drop down bar suggesting how much compensation they think they deserve per month. And there are less girls (less competition). The super hotties on SD4me are less than the average girls on SA due to their higher expectations. I am in L. A. Can't speak for anywhere else. But it's a buyers market in most areas of the country as far as I can tell. And can only get better over time as the acceptability of this lifestyle to the young girls is growing at a dramatic rate. And not to get political, but if the current government trend of job creation continues to push only the lowest paying jobs as a way out of the recession this can only help the SD side of the equation.

In my industry (to go unnamed) as the margins have fallen due in large part to government over regulation, healthcare fears and higher taxes, many people have been layed off (especially women under 30) hiring has stalled and everyones pay has been cut. This not only increases the desperation of the girls but also has limited the ability of the hobbyist to budget the larger amounts spent just a few short years ago.

I remember going to industry conventions where guys would drop 5k in one night in a strip club. That would be unthinkable today.

**EasyGoingJ** · 02-16-13 19:04

Or have the potential to turn psycho in a nonosecond. My SO has always told me women are far more dangerous than I could ever imagine.

I posted last summer about how thankful I was to have resisted the urge to entertain a few that I thought I knew well enough to trust.

Turns out in each case it would have been a huge mistake and I'd probably still be uneasy if a passing car slowed.

So different from when my original sb would move in for days at a time when I was home alone, although in retrospect that could have turned ugly and she did " out " me and identify me to several of her friends, so they they knew me but I didn't know them. Very uncomfortable if you are well known in what can become a small town.

My general life philosophy has been to trust people until they give you a reason not to. I have suspended that in the sugar bowl.

Not to be judgemental, I'm out here too, but just the fact that they are out here tells you there is some dysfunction and I don't even want to imagine what could be lurking just below the surface.

So, unfortunately if you learn anything in reading this thread, protecting your true identity should be rule # 1, and rule 2 is see rule 1.

Difficult when the goal is to establish intimacy and engage in intimate acts that are enhanced by that intimacy.

**Roamin Roman** · 02-16-13 18:48

Originally Posted by Revvo [View Original Post]

Well the crazy * has called my wife back at her work now. Wife was not there but called me to asked me about her. She gave wife two different names already. I asked wife who is it Kimberly or Elissa?

Wife said she does not know. Just left a message with receptionist that she needed to talk to her about Revvo. I said I don't know who it is never heard of either. Don't you think it is strange that there are two different names? She said she does not know.

I can tell she is suspicious. Asked me if there is anything she should know. I said no very nonchalantly. I asked her if she was going to call crazy * back. She said I don't know should I. I said I don't know.

That is where it is at now.

She is getting closer. 90% chance shit will hit the fan. I think I have found the one smart crazy criminal on the planet. I am fucked.

Revvo

Keep the narrative focused on the lost credit card and your dinner with clients. Suggest that card might have been lost (or stolen) in the restaurant, and that this crazy * is probably just lashing out at anyone connected with the person she was soliciting at the table. She or her pimp probably searched the internet for your name and are hoping to scam you or your wife. Don't make too detailed a narrative (since more details provide more points that can be checked, or more points where you can create a conflicting story), but make sure all points in your narrative are consistent.

R:R

**F Scott** · 02-16-13 17:17

These are some truly hair-raising stories here, my friends, and certainly cautionary tales for us all. Without going back and reading all the lead-up, is there a common thread that binds all the crazy babies together? Didn't you all meet them on SD4M? It may be just my personal prejudice, but in the Chicago area, the babies on that site are, for the most part, lower rent than the ones on SA. I'd just be curious to know where they have come from.

Revvo, I hope the shit bypasses your fan, my brother. I agree with Tigg, however, don't hand your wife the goods on your extracurricular activities. I was involved in a trial as a witness many years ago, and the lawyer who was prepping me gave me this bit of advice: don't say a single word more than you have to; there is no sense in doing the other side's work for them. If your wife is going to nail you, she will do it on her own, with our without your help.

Good luck, my friend!

Scott

**Graham111** · 02-16-13 16:28

SB1 clued me in to say anything but married on her way out the door. Creates unneccesary issues and many of the girls deep down are looking for a long term partner. Fortunately for me I have an apartment 500 miles from home due to work. A true man cave. So that is where I receive visitors and, except for the occasional phone call, I can keep the 2 separate. My facebook is locked down and, I hope, no other potential issues.

**Blak Casper** · 02-16-13 16:25

Originally Posted by John G Smith [View Original Post]

However this time it ended up being much more lackluster. I think it had to do with her ex-boyfriend getting out of jail this week because she couldn't stop talking about him. When it came time to do the nasty she was much more distant than before.

I also felt that she was now migrating back toward her ex-bf who is an ex-con, that's a flaming red warning sign of drama.

I was hoping to keep this girl around for a cheap thrill every now and then. But the situation has just gotten too risky. She doesn't work, doesn't go to school, hangs around with criminal ex-boyfriends, possibly trying to figure out of my real real name. I have no intel on her either, so if she steps out of line, I'd have nothing to use against her.

Just remember to always be vigilant. Assume very girl is a pyscho until you can confirm otherwise.

Danger Will Robinson! Danger ahead! Drop this one now.

There is more DANGER than DRAMA ahead with this one.

Dissapear

**John G Smith** · 02-16-13 08:50

So I just got back from seeing the UTR girl. She texted me earlier in the day wanting to meet and I said I would but that I would give her just. 4$. She agreed, so I thought why the hell not.

We were meeting up for a car date late at night and at the beginning she asked if I could stop by the store afterwards to get a few supplies. I wasn't thrilled at the idea since I literally just wanted to pick her up, bang her, and then drop her off. But since she was willing to meet for just. 4$, I tentatively agreed. Plus our first encounter sex-wise was fantastic. However this time it ended up being much more lackluster. I think it had to do with her ex-boyfriend getting out of jail this week because she couldn't stop talking about him. When it came time to do the nasty she was much more distant than before.

Afterward, she still asked to go to the store but now she was saying she just wanted to buy cigs but she left her I'd at home. She asked me if I can buy them, I said I don't feel like getting out of the car. She begged me some more but I said I left my wallet at home also. I then quickly dropped her off.

As mentioned earlier, I keep all my IDs, registration, and etc in a locked box in my car. I wasn't going to unlock this just to buy her cigs. Also I would be vulnerable while in the store buying the cigs with my I'd, she could easily look over my shoulder to see my real name & address on my I'd.

I also felt that she was now migrating back toward her ex-bf who is an ex-con, that's a flaming red warning sign of drama.

I was hoping to keep this girl around for a cheap thrill every now and then. But the situation has just gotten too risky. She doesn't work, doesn't go to school, hangs around with criminal ex-boyfriends, possibly trying to figure out of my real real name. I have no intel on her either, so if she steps out of line, I'd have nothing to use against her.

Just remember to always be vigilant. Assume very girl is a pyscho until you can confirm otherwise.

**BigTigger** · 02-16-13 01:43

Wow, this is so close to what I went through. The more I thought about it, the more I realized that if the truth comes out, I'm toast either way. So I stuck to my story and eventually that won over. I did have to do some clean up. I added a picture to my account that was not me. I changed the number on my batphone. I double-checked to make sure I did not have any texts or emails that could link my pseudo to my real name. I also got out front and told the wife the preliminary story. It may be too late for that, but you do have the fact that she's given different names and could be classified as unstable. You got to get a story that works and stick to it until you are forced to tell the truth. You have to be in the driver's seat and not reactive. If you have a trusted friend, you may need to employ help and get someone to vouch that she's tried to extort from them also. Don't sit and wait for doom, take action! The worst decision is not making a decision.

Others have given good advice. It's going to hard with the police as you don't have a real name and not sure she's trying to extort you. So it's basic harassment, except that she may be telling the truth.

Revvo, there are no easy solutions with this one, I hate that this happened so early in your SD career.

Originally Posted by Revvo [View Original Post]

Well the crazy * has called my wife back at her work now. Wife was not there but called me to asked me about her. She gave wife two different names already. I asked wife who is it Kimberly or Elissa?

Wife said she does not know. Just left a message with receptionist that she needed to talk to her about Revvo. I said I don't know who it is never heard of either. Don't you think it is strange that there are two different names? She said she does not know.

I can tell she is suspicious. Asked me if there is anything she should know. I said no very nonchalantly. I asked her if she was going to call crazy * back. She said I don't know should I. I said I don't know.

That is where it is at now.

She is getting closer. 90% chance shit will hit the fan. I think I have found the one smart crazy criminal on the planet. I am fucked.

Revvo

**HollywoodGuy** · 02-16-13 01:39

Originally Posted by SubCmdr [View Original Post]

All of my Garden Tools know I'm seeing others and they are too. I asked one to be exclusive and she said no. A interesting reality check for me.

I've have this discussion with all of my regulars. There seems to be a understanding that it is not a naturally exclusive relationship. You can buy pussy. But you can't buy the person. This is because of many factors. The main one is this: We are most likely significantly older than our Garden Tools and probably married. Our Garden Tools often has not given up on that dream for their own lives. They are not going to stop pursuit of that goal just because we are giving them a little cash. Some are honest enough to tell you this straight up. Others will sell you the idea you want.

I know this has been discussed before. But I think the natural structure of the relationship with a Garden Tool does not lend itself to exclusivity. After all if we wanted to be exclusive wouldn't we just keep fucking our wives or SO's? And wouldn't our Garden Tools instead become girlfriends and wives? Can a one sided relationship really work? It has nothing to do with the money. We give them the money in order to get the pussy. After the exchange is complete the reality is that they are free to sell pussy to the next person that comes along.

Unless you are providing for their every need and have them under lock and key, the only time you know your Garden Tool is not fucking someone else is when you have your dick in her. A harsh reality but much more likely to be closer to the truth than thinking she is exclusive to you.

Go balls deep & prosper!

SubCmdr Out

Many trueism's here. (is that a word. LOL) Due to my inability to stay out of trouble (too many to list). I now have a UTR / Pro living with me. She works SD4me and BP on occasion. I have also seen her flip guys on so called normal dating site into bitches. This arrangement keeps us both protected (as neither of us wants to be in an exclusive arrangement). I have learned quite a bit watching her play guy after guy. And it's impossible for any girl to think they could be exclusive with me when they meet her. She is not allowed to bring anyone over, but they all know her living arrangements. I bring some of my girls here and it helps keep some emotional distance. Rarely do we all play together. Not really my thing. Too distracting. LOL. I realize there are many married guys on here so this is not for you. But the overall point of "You can buy pussy. But you can't buy the person." is so true. Some girls will fall in love anyway and will compete to be the #1 or ATF. These are quality problems for sure.

My live in is also very helpful in weeding out the fake non-pros. Takes one to know one, and she hasnt been wrong yet.

**Kool Breeze** · 02-16-13 00:15

Originally Posted by Hernando [View Original Post]

"Well the crazy * has called my wife " Revvo.

I hate to be the voice of doom, but all of us will be exposed if we do this long enough. The problem is that we become addicted to the lifestyle and the high that we get from it. It is much like alcohol or drug addiction. I have it bad and got exposed because I could not stop, or at least tone back to modest exposure.

You should call her (the tool) and inform her that you have told your wife, she is behind you, and will call the police if she bothers you or your wife again.

The other thing you might consider doing is throw yourself at her feet (wife) , confess a little bit, at least about this tool, and beg forgiveness. If she finds out it is better coming from you. Several of us here have gone through that trial.

Good luck Nando

Long time lurker on this thread and getting my feet wet on this side of the hobby. Nando gave good advice by telling you to call the crazy chick but go a little further and get a female friend even if you have to pay her to call her and pretend she is your wife and play along with her. From me studying this board and studying the mental make up of so called SB's the safest route to tell them is that you are either not married or divorced. That will cut the ammunition of one of them getting out of pocket and trying to blackmail you. No need to tell one of them you are married. Future reference is to make a check list. Make up your alto ego name age etc, email, prepaid or green dot credit card, different cell phone or google voice, most important is to keep your car clean and double check center console and glove compartment for any papers with your real name and address. Also when and if she rides with you and you drop her off, clean car and make sure she didn't drop any eye rings or accessories or loose hair in the passenger side of the vehicle.