"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[HappyHunter44]

I have found this not to be the case at all. Besides suggesting meeting at the FC I try to stay away from specific discussions of sex with the SB. I would never bring up BBFS before the meet, if I want it I play dumb and say I don't have condoms. Most won't mention it before and once they are at the FC they have $$$ signs in there eyes and want to get it done.

Keep in mind, if you are getting the true 18-22 yo gems they are ashamed to be hookers, and looking to engage in the fantasy that this is different. The difference between meeting an older dude at a hotel for $700 and meeting an older dude at at hotel for $700 with "BBFSCIP" negotiated before hand is huge in their mind. These girls are ******, but they act a lot sluttier when you let them believe they are different then a backpage hooker. I just took a 19 yo girls anal ch*rry in her dorm this week. Didn't mention anal or any other details before, but I brought lube and condoms. I only used the lube.

Also, unless you're paying stupid money they will spend the next few days leading up to your date looking for a better offer since they have already seen your cards.

You made some huge assumptions, so your take on what I am doing is rather off. However, I understand how you might have gotten to your viewpoint.

1. None of my messages on SA or in text mentions BBFS or cip or anything like that. In fact, no specific activity is mentioned by me at all.

2. Additionally, none of messages or text mentions $ amounts for any sexual activities or any $ amounts at all.

3. To all SBs who asked about money, I state I do not discuss $ unless in person at a meet and greet. If I lose out on an SB for that, that is fine. So far though, 90% have continued planning to meet and greet even after I refuse to mention $ amount. At the meet and greet, I will then decide what to say about $. I have to see them in person first. We will see if the meet and greets happen.

4. None of these SBs are worth over 2 bills, so would never pay anything like you cite. I cannot get it up for even average babes. Even just moderately plump, forget about it. My wife was a former Ford model in New York. So you have an idea the look I go after. Followed after her Mom who was Ford model also. Wife still looks hot today, but she is still 54, not 20. Those were the days. She was free when I met her.

5. You are confusing dominant with forceful. Dominant means directing the conversation towards what one wants, even if stated in a very soft way. I wrote a book on rhetoric used by colleges and universities and the most dominant approach is also the most suave approach. That is because it directs the conversation towards your goals without even seeming to do that and it is the receiving party who thinks she reached the decisions on her own.

6. And rhetoric is the key. All the girls so far have gotten around to understanding that I want BBFS with cip and I never ever have brought up those terms or activities. They do!! There is nothing in my messages or texts that SA or anyone can say I asked for BBFS, cip, or that I linked $ to a sexual activity. Nothing at all.

7 While I agree that there are SB similarities, the country is regional and some things work culturally in some areas and not others. I recall being able to get BBFS in Florida much, much easier than in Wash DC during the craigslist days some 10 - 12 years ago. It was literally impossible to get in WY. At least for me. I mean from $100 - 200 hookers, not the $400+ ones that Miami Companions used to have. Never paid for those. In the region I am in now, moderate size towns surrounded by rural areas, I am trying to see what works here.

As stated below, it will be interesting to see if it works out and I get to bag a few babes. It is all just fun.

[HappyHunter44]

Have you been around a college girl lately? They are always on there phones. Seeking shows them as active for an hour after their last activity. It's entirely reasonable for them to be "active" 90% of the time.

I definitely see your point. I agree this could be the case.

[BStreet]

Any info on this one. https://www.seeking.com/member/4cdc8...f-0a04b40e37c3.

[BookerTNelson]

What I am going to share could be controversial, but I have had success with it, so I am going to go ahead. I noted that whenever I meet a girl in person first time, if she looked much better than her photos suggested, my confidence level and trust with her instantly goes way up. My inclination to close the deal goes way high. So, I decided to try that on girls. I always share my own photos (after I built some trust) with girls. So, I send few photos that are not the best angles, not best clothes (somewhat less attractive than actually I am). If she agrees to meet, I show up in my best shape, well dressed and the best possible attractive way. I can see their eyes lit up and they get comfortable with me very quickly. (In fact, few told me I looked much better in person than in photos). The conversation is much easier and no probing questions (compared to what I experienced before using the techniques). Nowadays, my rate of closing the deal is almost 100% (from my acceptance point of view) after I meet a girl in person. May be it is a coincidence I got better with more experience, but I have a good feeling the photo technique at least helped me in closing deals. I am not a psychologist or anyone, but there may be theory around this. Just wanted to share.

Play Safe.

Dr. S.

Ironically, this is one of the reasons I do not send a picture at all. The shift in their demeanor always works to my advantage, also being younger than 95% of the site and being attractive helps immensely to getting the them over the hump with drastic discounts.

[DWinthrop]

15. You have to be dominant in communication, as in bed. Clarity is not their strength and unless you guide the conversation exactly and are clear in what you expect they will not get it most times. They need guidance, sometimes heavy guidance. But, 95% will follow along.

I have found this not to be the case at all. Besides suggesting meeting at the FC I try to stay away from specific discussions of sex with the SB. I would never bring up BBFS before the meet, if I want it I play dumb and say I don't have condoms. Most won't mention it before and once they are at the FC they have $$$ signs in there eyes and want to get it done.

Keep in mind, if you are getting the true 18-22 yo gems they are ashamed to be hookers, and looking to engage in the fantasy that this is different. The difference between meeting an older dude at a hotel for $700 and meeting an older dude at at hotel for $700 with "BBFSCIP" negotiated before hand is huge in their mind. These girls are ******, but they act a lot sluttier when you let them believe they are different then a backpage hooker. I just took a 19 yo girls anal ch*rry in her dorm this week. Didn't mention anal or any other details before, but I brought lube and condoms. I only used the lube.

Also, unless you're paying stupid money they will spend the next few days leading up to your date looking for a better offer since they have already seen your cards.

[DWinthrop]

13. The girls who are online for what seems all day are either scammers or flat out pros. I guess they could have the app open all day on their phones, but it seems more like scammers and pros would be the ones on that much. I am all ears for a different interpretation.

Have you been around a college girl lately? They are always on there phones. Seeking shows them as active for an hour after their last activity. It's entirely reasonable for them to be "active" 90% of the time.

[HappyHunter44]

It doesn't sound like you have met any of them yet?? Am I reading this correctly?

This is correct.

I am not calling this a success yet by a long shot because I have not hit any of these SBs yet. However, I have them planning meet and greets, which must be done to get their panties on the floor. Most have already given me their schedules and available times. We will see if any pan out. I am aware the flake factor is high having been on backpage for years. We know how that goes.

Here a couple more things I will add my initial list of my 4-day experience in the Bowl. I cannot stress enough how important it is to read this thread and get a good feel of the Bowl before plunging in. It really does help. Already caught 3 scammers, but I recognized them immediately because of what others posted here.

Here is the link to the initial list: http://www.usasexguide.nl/forum/show...-Not&p=4421087#post4421087.

13. The girls who are online for what seems all day are either scammers or flat out pros. I guess they could have the app open all day on their phones, but it seems more like scammers and pros would be the ones on that much. I am all ears for a different interpretation.

14. The SBs who respond with "OK Luv," "Hey babes," and "Hey Good Looking" (when I have no picture) have to be pros or experienced UTRs. I just ditch those. Sounds too familiar to backpage days.

15. You have to be dominant in communication, as in bed. Clarity is not their strength and unless you guide the conversation exactly and are clear in what you expect they will not get it most times. They need guidance, sometimes heavy guidance. But, 95% will follow along.

[Hal1957]

So many ways to skin a cat!

What I am going to share could be controversial, but I have had success with it, so I am going to go ahead. I noted that whenever I meet a girl in person first time, if she looked much better than her photos suggested, my confidence level and trust with her instantly goes way up. My inclination to close the deal goes way high. So, I decided to try that on girls. I always share my own photos (after I built some trust) with girls. So, I send few photos that are not the best angles, not best clothes (somewhat less attractive than actually I am). If she agrees to meet, I show up in my best shape, well dressed and the best possible attractive way. I can see their eyes lit up and they get comfortable with me very quickly. (In fact, few told me I looked much better in person than in photos). The conversation is much easier and no probing questions (compared to what I experienced before using the techniques). Nowadays, my rate of closing the deal is almost 100% (from my acceptance point of view) after I meet a girl in person. May be it is a coincidence I got better with more experience, but I have a good feeling the photo technique at least helped me in closing deals. I am not a psychologist or anyone, but there may be theory around this. Just wanted to share.

Play Safe.

Dr. S.

[DrSummer]

What I am going to share could be controversial, but I have had success with it, so I am going to go ahead. I noted that whenever I meet a girl in person first time, if she looked much better than her photos suggested, my confidence level and trust with her instantly goes way up. My inclination to close the deal goes way high. So, I decided to try that on girls. I always share my own photos (after I built some trust) with girls. So, I send few photos that are not the best angles, not best clothes (somewhat less attractive than actually I am). If she agrees to meet, I show up in my best shape, well dressed and the best possible attractive way. I can see their eyes lit up and they get comfortable with me very quickly. (In fact, few told me I looked much better in person than in photos). The conversation is much easier and no probing questions (compared to what I experienced before using the techniques). Nowadays, my rate of closing the deal is almost 100% (from my acceptance point of view) after I meet a girl in person. May be it is a coincidence I got better with more experience, but I have a good feeling the photo technique at least helped me in closing deals. I am not a psychologist or anyone, but there may be theory around this. Just wanted to share.

Play Safe.

Dr. S.

[BlueEyedMan58]

I have been in the bowl all of 4 days and would like to share a little about my experience.

First off though, a really huge shout out to the mongers who contribute to this SB thread. I have been reading it for the last 2 years and when I joined the bowl, I felt like a veteran with the knowledge I had. Much appreciated!

My ground rules are: sticking mainly with 18 - 22. Have 2 in early 30's, but wow time is never kind to women it seems. The stark difference between a 20 and 30 year-old is really highlighted in SA. Even 26 shows a big slide in looks.

Results so far in 4 days:

1. Got the numbers of 12 SBs - 10 of which are DTF. Only dealing with DTF ones. Had a few others, but if not DTF I am out.

2. Of the 10 SBs, 8 agreed to BBFS.

3. Of the 8 BBFS, 6 agreed to CIP.

4. Of the 6, I might ditch 2 because they were clearly serious UTR pros. One said had motel in area (without prompting) and the other straight out asked "how much I will pay. " A bit too transactional (STG-ish) for me. One looks really nice so I might still see her once if I can get a reasonable rate for multiple pops.

5. Of the 4 left, have 2 meet and greets scheduled next week. No discussion of $ yet. One agreed to meet at FC with still no discussion of $ yet. We will see if she follows through.

6. I will take a couple gift cards with me and the usual stuff the veterans recommend. I will also take some hard cash to keep everything on the up and up because they say they need "help". And we all know they are on SA for financial assistance. As one monger put it a couple days ago, most of these girls are just one step above a standard hooker. SA gives them cover to pretend they are not. Hey, to them, an arrangement is not a cash for sex transaction. OK, whatever floats their boat.

7. I have couple POTs who only communicate on the site for now. They are also DTF, but not counting them until I have number and we move to texting and meet and greet set-up.

8. I told a couple 18 yr-olds that I would need to see ID. They looked way, way young. And they both ghosted me. Good. That means they are nothing but trouble.

9. Already ran into one that told me she had the incurable H. At least she was honest, I guess. Dropped her obviously. Another 19 year-old said she had endometriosis after the issue of whether she was DTF came up. Hmm. Sounds like a scam because she was all fun and games until the DTF part came up. Clueless. Why have those pics of the bod if cannot put out? Personally, I think it is a ruse, but moving on.

10. I have 35 messages still to be opened and read. One thing I learned is that, for most of these SBs, communication is not a strong attribute. Well, may explain partly why they are on the site to begin with. Easier to post a profile than actually talk to a guy in person to get what they want.

11. I agree that many come and go on the site based on $$ needs. I just do not get the impression based on conversation that most get a dedicated SD. Not sure what the point of that would be with all the new 18 - 22 always joining the site. Of the 4 meet and greets scheduled 2 are all new, within 5 days of joining.

12. Found some very good intel using the site recommended a couple pages back by senior member FarFarAway. Thanks dude.

https://www.truepeoplesearch.com

Dam, I knew one girl was living with her grandmother before she told me. One thing with this site is you have to manually enter the phone numbers, as cut and paste does not work and returns an error (at least it did for me) - guess that is to prevent bots wreaking havoc.

Have not tried the there site yet. Also posted By FarFarAway:

https://www.familytreenow.com

13. I do not have pic on my profile and it did not seem to impact much. So far. I can put a "fake" one that is close if I find it becomes an issue. Only 4 or 5 asked for a pic and I told them I needed total 100% discretion and had no issue meeting in public. All except one agreed to that.

14. Overall, I will see what happens with these, but for 12 real number contacts and the majority DTF and half BBFS in 4 days I am not complaining. We will see what shakes out in the wash as actual DTFs in person. Also one thing I found is if I put my number at the end of the text message over 80% of SBs just text me instead of messaging through the site. The other 20% I just said text me and they did.

Again, thanks for all the advice in advance and especially to Truncated, The Cardinal and DogBert77 for making signing up with pre-paid card an easy task.

A word of caution. Any SA girl who promises FC before meeting is either a pro or a scammer or (worst possibility) some kind of a string. I think most experienced guys on here prefer a little more discreet messaging to set up a M / G at which time they either close the deal, arrange a future date to close the deal, or walk away.

[DrSummer]

Keep focused on the final goal. The deal is not done until her panties (if she was wearing them to begin with) are on the floor and your dick is in her pussy. All the statistics mean nothing if you can't close the deal. There are many girls on the site just testing the waters and see up to what level guys go with them. They will talk about how eager to meet us, but when you try to schedule a time to meet they go silent. Typically in my experience once I meet a girl in person, the odds of closing the deal goes way up.

Play Safe.

Dr. S.

It doesn't sound like you have met any of them yet?? Am I reading this correctly?

[DrSummer]

While we should take every precaution to stay out of trouble, sugar bowl is not for the weak-hearted. Most hot girls I found in SA had some type of emotional instability or weakness. Just have to make sure we are not making it worse. And excellent advice on "after-date protocol". I follow those religiously.

Play Safe.

Dr. S.

I'm normally a quiet observer of this forum, but felt the need to respond here. I don't think any of us should go through life assuming a rape accusation looms around every corner. If I allowed myself to think that way, I would have missed out on a lot of pussy, and I've had hundreds of girls off SA alone, many of which I would call "typical hot-chick-bat-shit crazy", and some I would describe as highly unstable emotionally.

I believe a simple trick can prevent many problems: Within a couple of hours or so after the meet is over, follow up with a couple of texts praising how awesome she is, how glad you met, etc. Most of the time they beat me to this, because I've asked them to text me when they are home safely after an Uber ride or drive home, etc. , but if they don't text first be sure to do it before the next day.

It serves many purposes.

First, almost all women hate to get fucked then ignored, they feel insulted and take it personally when it happens. Not following up is a good reason a lot of these "date rape" accusations occur, some women believe that if they aren't still on your mind after you blew your load, then they have been taken advantage of in some way.

Second, if there is a problem at all, it gives you a chance to get in front of it and fix it before it becomes a major problem (don't let them sit and stew). If they aren't happy with the gift they got, apologize and promise to make it up next time even if you have decided they aren't worthy of a next time.

Most of the time their response is something like "that was such an amazing night! I can't wait to see you again! Anything that indicates positivity and that they were fine when you left them provides proof they were not raped or taken advantage of in any way.

[BookerTNelson]

I have been in the bowl all of 4 days and would like to share a little about my experience.

First off though, a really huge shout out to the mongers who contribute to this SB thread. I have been reading it for the last 2 years and when I joined the bowl, I felt like a veteran with the knowledge I had. Much appreciated!

My ground rules are: sticking mainly with 18 - 22. Have 2 in early 30's, but wow time is never kind to women it seems. The stark difference between a 20 and 30 year-old is really highlighted in SA. Even 26 shows a big slide in looks.

Results so far in 4 days:

1. Got the numbers of 12 SBs - 10 of which are DTF. Only dealing with DTF ones. Had a few others, but if not DTF I am out.

2. Of the 10 SBs, 8 agreed to BBFS.

3. Of the 8 BBFS, 6 agreed to CIP.

4. Of the 6, I might ditch 2 because they were clearly serious UTR pros. One said had motel in area (without prompting) and the other straight out asked "how much I will pay. " A bit too transactional (STG-ish) for me. One looks really nice so I might still see her once if I can get a reasonable rate for multiple pops.

5. Of the 4 left, have 2 meet and greets scheduled next week. No discussion of $ yet. One agreed to meet at FC with still no discussion of $ yet. We will see if she follows through.

6. I will take a couple gift cards with me and the usual stuff the veterans recommend. I will also take some hard cash to keep everything on the up and up because they say they need "help". And we all know they are on SA for financial assistance. As one monger put it a couple days ago, most of these girls are just one step above a standard hooker. SA gives them cover to pretend they are not. Hey, to them, an arrangement is not a cash for sex transaction. OK, whatever floats their boat.

7. I have couple POTs who only communicate on the site for now. They are also DTF, but not counting them until I have number and we move to texting and meet and greet set-up.

8. I told a couple 18 yr-olds that I would need to see ID. They looked way, way young. And they both ghosted me. Good. That means they are nothing but trouble.

9. Already ran into one that told me she had the incurable H. At least she was honest, I guess. Dropped her obviously. Another 19 year-old said she had endometriosis after the issue of whether she was DTF came up. Hmm. Sounds like a scam because she was all fun and games until the DTF part came up. Clueless. Why have those pics of the bod if cannot put out? Personally, I think it is a ruse, but moving on.

10. I have 35 messages still to be opened and read. One thing I learned is that, for most of these SBs, communication is not a strong attribute. Well, may explain partly why they are on the site to begin with. Easier to post a profile than actually talk to a guy in person to get what they want.

11. I agree that many come and go on the site based on $$ needs. I just do not get the impression based on conversation that most get a dedicated SD. Not sure what the point of that would be with all the new 18 - 22 always joining the site. Of the 4 meet and greets scheduled 2 are all new, within 5 days of joining.

12. Found some very good intel using the site recommended a couple pages back by senior member FarFarAway. Thanks dude.

https://www.truepeoplesearch.com

Dam, I knew one girl was living with her grandmother before she told me. One thing with this site is you have to manually enter the phone numbers, as cut and paste does not work and returns an error (at least it did for me) - guess that is to prevent bots wreaking havoc.

Have not tried the there site yet. Also posted By FarFarAway:

https://www.familytreenow.com

13. I do not have pic on my profile and it did not seem to impact much. So far. I can put a "fake" one that is close if I find it becomes an issue. Only 4 or 5 asked for a pic and I told them I needed total 100% discretion and had no issue meeting in public. All except one agreed to that.

14. Overall, I will see what happens with these, but for 12 real number contacts and the majority DTF and half BBFS in 4 days I am not complaining. We will see what shakes out in the wash as actual DTFs in person. Also one thing I found is if I put my number at the end of the text message over 80% of SBs just text me instead of messaging through the site. The other 20% I just said text me and they did.

Again, thanks for all the advice in advance and especially to Truncated, The Cardinal and DogBert77 for making signing up with pre-paid card an easy task.

Circle back when you've met with some. I've found that planning too far ahead of time is pointless as a good majority will either flake, just forget or something will "pop up".

[OliverNP]

Hoping some of the traveling type SDs can help with this one. I've been looking for a better way to manage POT contacts across multiple cities I travel regularly to (about 10), and I'm having trouble finding a good solution that integrates with mobile devices. I've tried various approaches with Excel, Evernote, OneNote, etc. But I'm looking for a better solution and I figured someone else probably already has this down.

I want to be able to create entries showing a screenshot of the girls SA profile and a few pics on PC or Mac, but be able to easily view or make small edits on phone or tablet (either iPhone or Android), and record her profile name, a few notes about such as days she's unavailable or other specifics (so storage needs to be cloud based).

One important feature is I want is to easily filter by city so that when I'm in that city I'm able to see my POTs in that city easily, complete with photos, profile screenshot and notes I've captured. The SA website itself is not acceptable of course for this purpose, because girls hide / delete / inactivate their profile all the time even though they are available to see SDs they already know. Ease and workflow of new entry is important. For example, I want to be able to easily take a screen clip (Snipping Tool on Windows) and paste the images in (saving images then importing them would be too cumbersome at high volume). I don't want any sort of integration with the contact list of my phone, as like many I keep my sugaring life separate from regular life. To give an idea of " high volume", I probably see between 50-100 separate SBs a year across 10 cities, but the volume of new contact entries is much higher, because there are probably 50 POTS I never meet for every one that I actually do, so I need a solution with decent image storage.

I have a hunch there is a great cross platform "personal contact manager" solution out there that would be ideal for this, it's just a matter of finding it. I've been watching this forum a long time but haven't seen this topic approached.

What do you guys use?

[OliverNP]

I definitely wouldn't play games like this. It's the best way to get a rape charge. Your DNA is obviously all over her and the DNA from your skin cells are under her fingernails and all over her house. Even if you have proof that she was a prostitute; men go to jail every day for raping prostitutes. Men even get convicted of raping their own wives. I'd just stick to the arrangement and leave the girls completely satisfied. I don't like to go and borrow problems. And I never give them half. Even if they take half of the money with a smile, they're telling all their friends that you scammed them and probably plotting against you.

I'm normally a quiet observer of this forum, but felt the need to respond here. I don't think any of us should go through life assuming a rape accusation looms around every corner. If I allowed myself to think that way, I would have missed out on a lot of pussy, and I've had hundreds of girls off SA alone, many of which I would call "typical hot-chick-bat-shit crazy", and some I would describe as highly unstable emotionally.

I believe a simple trick can prevent many problems: Within a couple of hours or so after the meet is over, follow up with a couple of texts praising how awesome she is, how glad you met, etc. Most of the time they beat me to this, because I've asked them to text me when they are home safely after an Uber ride or drive home, etc. , but if they don't text first be sure to do it before the next day.

It serves many purposes.

First, almost all women hate to get fucked then ignored, they feel insulted and take it personally when it happens. Not following up is a good reason a lot of these "date rape" accusations occur, some women believe that if they aren't still on your mind after you blew your load, then they have been taken advantage of in some way.

Second, if there is a problem at all, it gives you a chance to get in front of it and fix it before it becomes a major problem (don't let them sit and stew). If they aren't happy with the gift they got, apologize and promise to make it up next time even if you have decided they aren't worthy of a next time.

Most of the time their response is something like "that was such an amazing night! I can't wait to see you again! Anything that indicates positivity and that they were fine when you left them provides proof they were not raped or taken advantage of in any way.