Massage Parlor Reports

[QUOTE=DannyBo;3764868]Not finding any reviews of Meridian in Cocoa I decided to bite the bullet And TOFTT.

Bad decision. I was met by a nice looking 25 ish year old Asian girl. No offer of TS, And straight to the rub. Massage was OK decent tease but pretty weak in general.

On the flip I fell asleep And dreamed That I was offered a BJ, And paid up front. In my dream she actually used Seran wrap, And my dream turned into a nightmare.

Stay home.[/QUOTE]Called Meridian in Cocoa yesterday, and apparently some of them speak Mandarin. Went to Zen Spa last week, paid the usual house fee for an hour, . 40 tip for HJ. Massage was pretty good, I always get strong. Probably won't go back to Zen unless everything runs dry. Took a trip to Orlando a week or two ago and spent $$. 80 for an hour of the best FS I've ever had at a parlor. May TOFTT and try out Meridian tomorrow or sometime this week, I love when providers are closer to my age.

For those who haven't seen mandy before, should give her a shot, this is my third time had her, she such a sweetheart, you got to do the massage part it was excellent, massage+FS hh =150 very reasonable, go see her you won't be disappointed, we need some provider like her in space coast treat her right and she will treat you good, play safe fellas.

[QUOTE=JdaLittleBir76;3776843]For those who haven't seen mandy before, should give her a shot, this is my third time had her, she such a sweetheart, you got to do the massage part it was excellent, massage+FS hh =150 very reasonable, go see her you won't be disappointed, we need some provider like her in space coast treat her right and she will treat you good, play safe fellas.[/QUOTE]To mirror some of the previous comments, you may have trouble with Mandy if you are even mildly allergic to cats. I have seen her 4 times in the past 3 months, and she's up to 3 cats now. She always assures me that they live and stay on the couch in the living room, and never go into her bedroom, but lately the dander has been triggering my asthma. It's not a huge place to begin with, and with the 3 cats, there's bound to be dander everywhere.

Also, last time I visited, it was the day after her birthday and she was showing me the gifts she had received. I asked if they were from her BF and she told me that she got rid of him a while ago. However, as I'm leaving her place and driving out the driveway, I see her BF across the street just hanging around (always wearing a baseball hat, plugs in earlobes, beard, tattoos). Just something to note as it may weird some people out. I've never had him in the house or in a car out front during a visit, but apparently some people have.

[QUOTE=JBarba;3777169]To mirror some of the previous comments, you may have trouble with Mandy if you are even mildly allergic to cats. I have seen her 4 times in the past 3 months, and she's up to 3 cats now. She always assures me that they live and stay on the couch in the living room, and never go into her bedroom, but lately the dander has been triggering my asthma. It's not a huge place to begin with, and with the 3 cats, there's bound to be dander everywhere.

Also, last time I visited, it was the day after her birthday and she was showing me the gifts she had received. I asked if they were from her BF and she told me that she got rid of him a while ago. However, as I'm leaving her place and driving out the driveway, I see her BF across the street just hanging around (always wearing a baseball hat, plugs in earlobes, beard, tattoos). Just something to note as it may weird some people out. I've never had him in the house or in a car out front during a visit, but apparently some people have.[/QUOTE]Cats never be a problem with me because I got 1 dog and 2 cats in the house too, but boyfriend thing really make me think of going back or not, all I know about her was she and her ex-husband got a daughter, maybe the ex-husband is the boyfriend you saw, girls never want to tell you the truth about their life, they wanted you to be their regular, but yes I hate when the pimps, boyfriend, or husband around when I fucking their girl LOL hahahah.

[QUOTE=JBarba;3774196]I visited Zen Friday and was greeted by Amy at the door, first time I had seen her there. I go for the hour with her. TS was perfect, making sure all parts were thoroughly cleaned. After she dries me off, she brings me back to the room and asks if I like strong or light massage, I tell her strong, as I prefer a lot of pressure. Not the best massage, but very firm pressure applied the whole massage, and I was feeling really good. Amy then lightly rubs her nails across my whole body and I couldn't wait for the flip.

During the flip, nice, unrushed handshake with plenty of attention to all parties below. After a bit of OTC roaming, I moved over to her kitty area. She says she pull down but wanted to know how much I would be tipping. I told her. 6 and she pulled down her shorts and put some lube on my fingers and I went to town. I pointed at her lips in hopes of BJ, and she asks me if I had and made the gesture with her hand as if she was ripping a condom wrapper open. Unfortunately, no rain coat so she said next time.

I've never received anything more than a handshake at Zen, but with Amy, I got a little more and feel like I could've gotten even more. Will definitely be trying to get with her next time I visit.[/QUOTE]I did return hoping to find a quieter session and was pleased with the results. I didn't get Amy but did enjoy my time. At first was worried as I arrived at the start of the day and apparently that tends to busy. Asked to come back in. 30. Knowing what was possible, I returned and was enthusiastically met and taken back. Once sans clothes I was taken back for the TS and was thoroughly cleaned leaving absolutely no 'cracks' or 'crevices' without playful attention. Back to the room with the typical beginnings. On the flip we discussed options but never $. This is what I really like about Zen and often will tip generously when I leave satisfied and un-hasseled. I did get the very distinct impression that FS was absolutely not on the table or anywhere else (perhaps with Amy but with her there is definitely a $ negotiation). What I got was a very enthusiastic 69 and finished with a good HJ with ass play. I walked away drained and happy and left the house a better than average donation to our cause. I could more perhaps in O-town or PT but there is something to be said about the lack of $ haggling at Zen. I hope that that will continue.

Saw her last week and she told me Monday was her Birthday. According to Mandy, Her boyfriend got her into serious legal trouble and she broke up with hm. Sounds like she is still with him. She also told me a while ago that he thinks she just does massage and HJ. Just saying be cautious if he's still lurking around. I like her, just be safe concerning the BF.

[QUOTE=JdaLittleBir76;3777282]Cats never be a problem with me because I got 1 dog and 2 cats in the house too, but boyfriend thing really make me think of going back or not, all I know about her was she and her ex-husband got a daughter, maybe the ex-husband is the boyfriend you saw, girls never want to tell you the truth about their life, they wanted you to be their regular, but yes I hate when the pimps, boyfriend, or husband around when I fucking their girl LOL hahahah.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=EastDragon;3776822]Called Meridian in Cocoa yesterday, and apparently some of them speak Mandarin. Went to Zen Spa last week, paid the usual house fee for an hour, . 40 tip for HJ. Massage was pretty good, I always get strong. Probably won't go back to Zen unless everything runs dry. Took a trip to Orlando a week or two ago and spent $$. 80 for an hour of the best FS I've ever had at a parlor. May TOFTT and try out Meridian tomorrow or sometime this week, I love when providers are closer to my age.[/QUOTE]Good Luck, Hope it works out better for you than me. She took me for an. 80 tip BTW.

[QUOTE=ScottFlMahalo;3777757]Saw her last week and she told me Monday was her Birthday. According to Mandy, Her boyfriend got her into serious legal trouble and she broke up with hm. Sounds like she is still with him. She also told me a while ago that he thinks she just does massage and HJ. Just saying be cautious if he's still lurking around. I like her, just be safe concerning the BF.[/QUOTE]Most of them have a boyfriend lurking. He knows what she is doing, he's living off her. Usually no problem, unles she's doing it against her will.

[QUOTE=GrahamM;3756142]A had a pleasant surprise recently when I discovered that Marika (Post Road) is full service. A real shame that she'll be leaving the State this month. But she is mentoring a new girl to take over. I'll be giving her a try next week.[/QUOTE]Met the lady taking over for Marika. She is nice. She is full figured. She is older. She is not unattractive relative to all those things, but she is all those things. It's not bad, it just is, so depending on your tastes you can decide. I am told she will be advertising soon but it was to be on Craigs so will have to wait and see.

[QUOTE=Spokes;3779834]Met the lady taking over for Marika. She is nice. She is full figured. She is older. She is not unattractive relative to all those things, but she is all those things. It's not bad, it just is, so depending on your tastes you can decide. I am told she will be advertising soon but it was to be on Craigs so will have to wait and see.[/QUOTE]I was lucky to get an appointment in on Marika's last day here. Had a chance to meet with Marika's replacement. I only had one appointment with Ky at MM, and this was over a year ago, but Marika's replacement is a dead ringer for Ky. Ky has been in and out at MM, from what I was told there, and makes me wonder if this is her under a different alias.

So I had to go to Orlando and decided to check Golden Gate before I came back and OMG am I glad I did. Pandora was my masseuse and my oh my. She is attractive, bubbly, late 20's early 30's ball of fun. She led me to the room and asked if I wanted a TS and of course I said yes. Undressed and taken to the shower and she immediately placed my finger in her snatch which led to her engulfing my member like she hadn't eaten in a week. She washed all areas and was doing some AR when she started talking to another gal who came in to watch I guess. She seemed like she liked what she saw. More BBBJ and then toweled me off and back to the room. Rubbing her body all over me and taking her time then she found jr again. Next thing I know she is sucking him from behind. Wow that was different. CFS where she road like a champ and then she wanted greek. Told me more $ but I said no and she said to try it. So I did. Wow that woman likes sex. Anyway I opted for the CIM, off with the cover and she again devoured me until I finished. Nice massage and then dressed and out the door. Another girl came out as I was leaving and god did she look good but I didn't get her name. $$6 was the total and well worth it in my opinion. Ill def be going back soon. To each there own but I've never had service like that over here. Yes way more expensive and an awful drive but for me its worth it.

[QUOTE=GhostDog;3755231]After action report. King Spa caught my eye, so had to stop. New to me provider, pretty standard. Her name is "Mia". Older but still skilled. Quick hhr, for. 6 with table shower. Nice ball play in the shower, very flrity and playful. Back to the room, and a good massage, and again, played them balls like an old pro. I have been making the rounds so I knew I would give her a workout, especialy at her age. Wrong. Wrong! She worked her magic and had me busten in no time. Light otc play. Not bad overall, but I still prefer Zen. Another. 6 for tip, but I prob could have done. 4 but she was nice so its all good $2 total. However I do agree with the overall opinion we need to keep these prices down.

Side note, does everybody agree that the AMPs are much better then the places with Americans running the show?

-GD.[/QUOTE]In regards to your side note, I've never gone to an American spa here. But from what I've read I agree that the AMP's are much better. And as with any other places, you will get some girls in the AMP's that demand much higher prices,(Palm Tree is one I've experienced) but over all yes, AMP's are better and I'm a Zen guy as you are. Play and stay safe.

I visited MM again, and the reports on here are accurate. Though I never saw the boyfriend. The damage was $. 5 for HH massage then FS. It's true her FS menu is limited, but the massage she gives is amazing. Better than most clinical massages.

[QUOTE=ScottyM3;3780536]In regards to your side note, I've never gone to an American spa here. But from what I've read I agree that the AMP's are much better. And as with any other places, you will get some girls in the AMP's that demand much higher prices,(Palm Tree is one I've experienced) but over all yes, AMP's are better and I'm a Zen guy as you are. Play and stay safe.[/QUOTE]I feel like, for the most part, AMPs are a more enjoyable experience. Especially, if you are looking for an actual massage. In my experience, most American girls just lightly graze your body, apply barely any pressure, and just rush to get the massage part over with. Most; why just feels like getting your body lathered with lotion. AMP you really get your money's worth and the massages are top notch.

Also, it seems like ladies at AMP are much more appreciative and laid back as far as tipping. Most American girls (again, in my experience) demand the $, $.5, $$ scale and bring it up all upfront, whereas AMP give off the impression where they aren't expecting anything upfront and really appreciate being taken care of.

[QUOTE=JBarba;3779923]I was lucky to get an appointment in on Marika's last day here. Had a chance to meet with Marika's replacement. I only had one appointment with Ky at MM, and this was over a year ago, but Marika's replacement is a dead ringer for Ky. Ky has been in and out at MM, from what I was told there, and makes me wonder if this is her under a different alias.[/QUOTE]You and I both. I was actually the very last appointment Marika had before calling it a day and leaving the State.

Her replacement is called Chloe and she'll be up and running very soon I believe (maybe this week). I have seen her twice (once alone at Marika's place, and once as four hands with Marika (wow! And enjoy her very much. I'll certainly be a regular. She has Marika's phone so anyone who had visited Marika can call / text that number. I believe to start she'll be completely utr and only seeing clients who had visited Marika. If anyone has forgotten her number, you can PM me for it. I doubt she'll reply if your number is not on her phone though.

I searched but couldn't find any info on the AMP on Palm Bay Rd across from the new Harris building, towards Conlan. Any feedback on the place?

[QUOTE=JBarba;3783345]I searched but couldn't find any info on the AMP on Palm Bay Rd across from the new Harris building, towards Conlan. Any feedback on the place?[/QUOTE]Standard massage with HE handshake.

[QUOTE=RayRay201;3784302]Standard massage with HE handshake.[/QUOTE]I just left. Avoid and take your money elsewhere. I was in the area and stopped in. I was greeted by one of the best looking, young Asians I've seen in Brevard. 20 ish years old and about 90 lbs. I tell her I want an hour, she tells me too much drama today so she can only do a half hour for .6, but promises to take special care of me. I was honestly really excited for this session.

After I lay down I'm given a 3 minute neck rub and then she proceeded to kiss and whisper in my ear to turn over. I'm thinking WTF, but after kissing my ear I'm more excited. She tells me. 6 tip and does the hand gesture. Ask if anything else is on the menu for more, but told no. I tell her. 4, but .2 extra if she takes off her clothes. She says ok and gives the most uninspired handshake with all her clothes on. I roam and am stopped because she "gets cold easy". Finish and am wiped down and told ok time is over. I get dressed and just want to get the fuck out of there. I give her the $40 and she starts bitching that she said $60. I told her she didn't even give a real massage and kept her clothes on. She makes a disgusted face, opens the door and says "bye" with the biggest load of attitude.

$100 for cumulative of 10 minutes spent in that building and a horrible handshake. Again, avoid this place.

[QUOTE=RDouglas;3756505]Has anyone had an experience with bed bugs after visiting King Spa? I went there about 16 days ago (pleasant time, good shower), and since then have had two bites on my butt that occurred at night. Bites resemble online pics of bed bug bites, Don't wish to harm the place's reputation, but if I receive any more bites, I'm calling the exterminator.

RD.[/QUOTE]Just to set the record straight, I've had an exterminator to my house, and he found no evidence of bed bugs. Also I've had no new bites in the last three weeks, so apparently it was a false alarm. Sorry, King Spa.

[QUOTE=Jones1101;3773584]Drove by this morning. Yes the big sign on the building is gone, but the smaller, wooden sign by the street was still there. Also the neon lights were also on.[/QUOTE]I hope Mimi is still there. I received very good service from her in February. I preferred her over Suzy, who promised more "next time". I won't have a chance to check it out for another two weeks.

[QUOTE=JBarba;3783345]I searched but couldn't find any info on the AMP on Palm Bay Rd across from the new Harris building, towards Conlan. Any feedback on the place?[/QUOTE]Sorry wish I saw earlier and warned you. That place has never been good to me. Been 3 times I believe, few months in between each because I know how these places tend to change. Every time was standard HE and attitude. Last time I went I got the HE where they air Indian style sitting facing you to avoid any touching of them. Down the street Zen is much better.

[QUOTE=JBarba;3784480]I just left. Avoid and take your money elsewhere. I was in the area and stopped in. I was greeted by one of the best looking, young Asians I've seen in Brevard. 20 ish years old and about 90 lbs.[/QUOTE]This is across from Harris on Palm bay rd? I'll check it out tomorrow morning before work if I have time, young providers are my bread and butter.

Update on Meridian, I had a fantastic time, got more time than I paid for and received FS. I'll do a longer update tomorrow, but I believe my experience was not typical.

Tried Massage Chi at 1700 Dairy Road for the third time, and that will be my last visit. I visited shortly after they opened and they were very jittery / nervous about making any sounds and they were even hesitant about offering a HE. That hesitancy is still there. I tossed out a suggested fee of $100-$120 and the girl still said no, "We just massage here, OK?" Fee was and still is $70. They have no table shower, just a standing shower in the back. Sorry I cannot remember the name. Both women are nice, and both are honest enough to tell you how slow it is there. Well, one reason it is slow is that the Traffic on that north section of Dairy Road is blocked by road repairs. But even when that road finally opens up, their extreme conservative approach is probably going to kill them. If it matters, I believe they are Chinese and not Korean.

I just paid her a visit. If you're planning to see her, you better make it sooner than later. Remember when I said she has some issues going on. Well she just negotiated a year of vacation and the stint starts the second week of May. It's too bad, I always enjoyed my time with her. Will miss her! There's a little time left!

[QUOTE=JPerez0909;3780871]I visited MM again, and the reports on here are accurate. Though I never saw the boyfriend. The damage was $. 5 for HH massage then FS. It's true her FS menu is limited, but the massage she gives is amazing. Better than most clinical massages.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=ScottFlMahalo;3787328]I just paid her a visit. If you're planning to see her, you better make it sooner than later. Remember when I said she has some issues going on. Well she just negotiated a year of vacation and the stint starts the second week of May. It's too bad, I always enjoyed my time with her. Will miss her! There's a little time left![/QUOTE]I've try to get a hold with her days ago, and never get a reply, yeah I can say she is the prettiest provider around so far, I like the type of body she got, and the boyfriend is always a issue for us, just got to be careful, play safe.

Heading down to the SCoast from the dry deserts of and AL. Usually stop in at Zen and have visited many of the local providers so looking for something new or at least different. Reviews seem mixed for Meridian and I've tried Tokyo on a recent visit (not too bad) and may even try the Palm Bay rd site (I like a challenge). Open to suggestions, wouldn't mind a fuller menu as Zen tends to be limited. Suggestions?

Well first it was CL now it's BP. The personals on BP are all gone, even the massage section. Not sure for how long but for now, adios BP. Play and stay safe people. PS... They even got rid of the Therapeutic section from CL

Does anyone have Veronica's digits. I just grabbed them off her ad when I needed something. Shit I should've saved a few more. LOL. Thanks.

[QUOTE=ScottyM3;3789630]Well first it was CL now it's BP. The personals on BP are all gone, even the massage section. Not sure for how long but for now, adios BP. Play and stay safe people. PS... They even got rid of the Therapeutic section from CL[/QUOTE]This is ridiculous in is truly the end of Times. Via con Dos. D B.

[QUOTE=ScottyM3;3789630]Well first it was CL now it's BP. The personals on BP are all gone, even the massage section. Not sure for how long but for now, adios BP. Play and stay safe people. PS... They even got rid of the Therapeutic section from CL[/QUOTE]Looks like all we got left is skip, the games site. For the most part.

[QUOTE=Boxdoc;3789976]Does anyone have Veronica's digits. I just grabbed them off her ad when I needed something. Shit I should've saved a few more. LOL. Thanks.[/QUOTE]314-642-1841. She has a Missouri area code (and a funny story about it).

[QUOTE=Pbfla321;3790443]Looks like all we got left is skip, the games site. For the most part.[/QUOTE]At the rate they're going it won't be long till all of the sites are down. Just don't shut down the parlors. Play and stay safe.

[QUOTE=ScottyM3;3789630]Well first it was CL now it's BP. The personals on BP are all gone, even the massage section. Not sure for how long but for now, adios BP. Play and stay safe people. PS... They even got rid of the Therapeutic section from CL[/QUOTE]As long as the 'demand' exists there will arise a forum to replace BP and CL's postings. That is so long as the Internet remains free and unrestricted. BP shutdown really hurts those geographical areas that are 'dry' for traditional AMPs and it's those places that BP and CL allowed us to keep track of 'business's that often change contact and locations. For obviously good reasons. Something will arise from the ashes. Usually does but I wish the Feds would work harder on squashing real criminals. Like those infesting DC. As for us, we just need to play safe and Smart cause the guys with tin badges are apparently board and have nothing better to do.

Hadn't been here in a long time and was hoping the scenery had changed. Just as I had hoped with the parlor on pb rd I was disappointed. I had a probably mid 40's provider who said her name was Kim. I opted for 30 minutes and a table shower. Table shower was so rushed that I felt like a toddler getting a bath by mom before rushing out of the house. To the room. She says we're going to start with me on my back. Perfect, get business out of the way then relax for a massage, or so I thought. She points to my main man, "massage there? No trouble?" Yes is my answer. She gets her box of oils and tissue and starts with a mechanical HJ. I ask for top removed and get told I can only touch. UTC roaming was allowed for top, otc for bottom, sort of. Allowed pussy contact outside pants but had legs squeezed shut so tight she could crack an almond. 2 minutes in she starts saying, "hurry and finish". Well that's a turn on. About 8 minutes in I do. She cleans up, says "ok we done, you want water. " No massage was give. Contemplated arguing, decided to cut my losses and move on.

Pros-decent cushions, HE.

Cons-everything else.

Will not repeat, ever. Terrible HE, no massage. Not attractive.

Damage was. 6 and. 2 tip.

This pertains to the place on Garden Street in Titusville, next to the tax place.

Anyone else dimwitted or disbelieving like me? This place has all the markings of happiness. I was thinking either previous posters had listed the wrong place or maybe this place is so over the top great they are trying to keep it for themselves LOL.

Neither. This place is straight up legit. But more than that, mamasan knows when someone like you or I come in what we are looking for. I think she enjoys toying with us. She was working her hands right up to my equipment, even an accidental brush up or two. Things a normal masseuse wouldn't let happen. She just wanted to get a rise out of me (literally) and leave me hanging. As I walked out at the end of our session she had a big smirk on her face when she asked me for her tip. It was obvious she knew what I'd came for but didn't receive. Worse part, I think I recognized her from another place elsewhere in Titusville that I had been last year where the same thing happened. Has this place moved from its original location?

[QUOTE=DevilDog23;3725200]Has any one been to the MP on Garden Street by Beef O Brady's in Titusville. Thanks.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Cutter56;3731020]Yes straight massage by older mammason no joy.[/QUOTE]

Well I decided to stop by zen spa the other day. When I walked in I was greeted by Amy, at first I was a little disappointed due to reports on here but everything ended very nice. She started with the table shower and roamed a lot. Sure every inch was washed up real good. Headed to the room where I was told to lay down face first. After about 3 minutes of massage she starts doing the soft touch and told me to roll over. I didn't necessarily want to because I wanted the massage too, however jr won out. She proceeds with a very good He and allowed me to roam up her shorts. Didn't get any further because her legs were clamped shut but not ass. After all was done she told me to flip over and continued the massage. Damage was. 4 tip over house fee. She never mentioned any donation during the whole time.

[QUOTE=SidewayZ;3796246]Hadn't been here in a long time and was hoping the scenery had changed. Just as I had hoped with the parlor on pb rd I was disappointed. I had a probably mid 40's provider who said her name was Kim. I opted for 30 minutes and a table shower. Table shower was so rushed that I felt like a toddler getting a bath by mom before rushing out of the house. To the room. She says we're going to start with me on my back. Perfect, get business out of the way then relax for a massage, or so I thought. She points to my main man, "massage there? No trouble?" Yes is my answer. She gets her box of oils and tissue and starts with a mechanical HJ. I ask for top removed and get told I can only touch. UTC roaming was allowed for top, otc for bottom, sort of. Allowed pussy contact outside pants but had legs squeezed shut so tight she could crack an almond. 2 minutes in she starts saying, "hurry and finish". Well that's a turn on. About 8 minutes in I do. She cleans up, says "ok we done, you want water. " No massage was give. Contemplated arguing, decided to cut my losses and move on.

Pros-decent cushions, HE.

Cons-everything else.

Will not repeat, ever. Terrible HE, no massage. Not attractive.

Damage was. 6 and. 2 tip.[/QUOTE]I'm assuming you're speaking of Royal Spa on Wickham just north of Post? It's been a while since I've been there but I've only seen two girls there, yes a bit older, Tina and Ruby. Not the greatest looking but not ugly, still easy on the eyes. When I used to go in I'd get the hour for. 8, they never rushed me, could be a rush in the shower being only HHr. Anyway, I've always had a good shower, a very good massage and a very good HE, I've roamed and had them lift their shirts for bare top roaming. No it's not the best around, but if you want a pretty good massage with a simple HE, I would say it's the place to go. Of course there could be different personnel there now. Play and stay safe.

Our little blonde cutie is on vaca courtesy of her Uncle, so sad she was one of my go to girls and wasn't jaded. Yet.

[QUOTE=Lookin3;3797920]Our little blonde cutie is on vaca courtesy of her Uncle, so sad she was one of my go to girls and wasn't jaded. Yet.[/QUOTE]Sad but true.

Long time lurker, but getting things back together, I feel the need to post. Been frequenting the spa across from the Catholic Church in north ccb. Usually at least two girls on duty, no choice. Paid door fee and put 0. 4 on the table. After a good rub that works out all my back issues (really), generally get the flip, the girls come out, no down under but a good release. I would say it's fun for the easy utility value.