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Pokey, I think an example from my past is in order. I was pulled over for speeding and the officer spotted a marijuana pipe on the floor of my car. His first question was: "whose marijuana pipe is that"? Now in the span of about 3 seconds I had major decisons to make. 1) Lie about it and say it belonged to the hitchhiker I picked up earlier that day 2) Do like any good defense attorney would suggest and exercise my right to remain silent 3) Tell the truth. Now I knew if I lied about it I would get busted for sure. I would be insulting his intelligence; he'd know I was lying and I'd be going down. If I said "sorry sir, I'm exercising my constitutional right to remain silent", I would be pissing him off and since he had me dead to rights I would be busted for sure anyway. I picked option #3 and looked him straight in the eye and said "it's mine". He said "thanks for being honest", tossed the pipe and sent me on my way.
So that may be what CJ is talking about. I don't believe he is saying at all if caught in a major crime to start talking without an attorney--which you should never do. Or if a cop accuses you of driving around to pick up prostitutes--I would remain silent as well. But for a minor crime or traffic ticket where they have you nailed 100%, I think maybe honesty might be your only way out. If you hear them knocking at your car window with their flashlight while a hooker is in the process of giving you a bj and they ask whats going on, it might just be better to suck it up (no pun intended) and tell the truth. You're busted anyway and what do you have to lose?
Civ2k
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I have missed most of the arguement that seems to revolve around CJ...
But speaking as some one who has been on the wrong side of the law before (and not just this recent incident) It is usually better off to be polite and co-operative with the police. Now, I am not saying confess to a crime, I am saying, state you name, and your address, provide any back-ground info they ask for, and then POLITELY ask for an lawyer. If they persist, you just stay POLITE, and ask again, and again for your lawyer. The moment you start swearing or being rude, the LONGER you will be "detained"
For the record, in Canada Prostitution is NOT legal.... at least not the way you think it is. There is a maze of laws around prostitution in canada but it basically boils down to this.... If it happens in a PRIVATE place, away from view, it is ok. what I mean by this is if you goto an in-call service you are fairly safe (as long as the business has it's butt covered with the right permits) if you arrange for an out-call service (and do not discuss price for sex) you are ok. If you pick up a hooker on the street and the cop feels like busting you or shaking you down, that's fair game. And if you want to know a little more the law is "solisitation for the purposes of sexual relations" (miss-spelled) There are also laws about living off the avails of prostitution , and operating a brawdy house, and several more. Also, for you American shoppers, your 4th and 5th amendments don't appy up here (of course) but we have a similar law and right. While you do not have to answer any questions with out a lawyer, once you lawyer is there, they can continue to question you... (your lawyer will tell you what questions to anwser and what ones not to)
As for some info on why I picked this girl up... It was cold and wet outside and it was 1 am. I felt like doing a good deed for the week. Keep in mine to, that Canada has like 1/50th of the crime of the States and be a 30 yr old male weighing in a little over 200 pounds I felt pretty safe. Also the area that I picked the girl up wasn't in a know profession area (more like commercial and low/med income housing) so a working girl wasn't at all what I expected. Yes, I did drop her off on the strip (as that is where she wanted to go) and that is where I picked up the cop on my tail (I think).
And as for why I told the cop; it's simple really, it was the truth. If the cop had stoped me then she knew the girl was a working girl and not just a bar hopper (the stroll is only 2 -6 blocks from 5 different bars) and trying to say that she wasn't a hooker would have been worse then the truth. Also, I am pretty sure at least 2 of my co-workers saw me pull over to give her a ride so if the cop really did want to be a ***** and arrest me, I had 2 ppl who could say that they saw her hitch-hiking. Plus the fact that talking to some one, no matter who they are is not against the law, there is nothing the cop could have really done with out putting herself over the political barrel.
Just cause I am polite with the LE doesn't mean I am stupid, or afraid to stand up for my rights and privledges.... The trick is knowing how and when and what to do. the worste, it would be an uncomfortable stay in jail till bail was set, but in the end the minimal best would be a dismissal of charges. The ABSOLUTE best: a dismissal, a letter of appoligy and a notice of tranfer/termination of the officer involved.
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Poky, here's your assignment before your next post:
Re-read Civ's and RX-7's posts again and again until you understand them. They did a much better job than I in explaining the "co-operation" issue, they are more patient than I. I get the distinct impression that you are just a wanker and like to incite long winded discussions. I have a feeling you're smarter than that.
You surely know that your chances of having a negative experience with LE will be enhanced if you are an asshole and try to make the LEO look like an idiot.
Chuponalgas, the link was great. LOLTFOCOF!
RX-7, don't be concerned about the flaming, it's all mindless dribble. A poster (GettingTang~!) said he discovered using sophisticated software that I was posting under multiple ID's so I'm supposed to be some sort of fraud. Actually I'm supposed to be a mole setting everyone in the forum up for a bust in Mexico.
Truth is, I did set up one member for a bust, a couple of them, I think they were double "D's." Big, nice, round firm ones with an ass attached.
Well, GettingTang turns out to be some sort of liar because he never posted the ID's I was "using" or the name of the "software" he was "using." I gave Jackson unconditional consent to post all ID's eminating from my IP if requested by GettingTang but guess what. . . .
GT: You are obviously still trying to distract members and direct attention away from your lying ass. Your cheap shots at me amount to nothing more than a thinly veiled attempt to back away from the issue of your lies. Fortunately there are members who see that you are a liar and have no integrity very clearly so there is no need for me to engage you any further.
Be Safe and BE NICE
Country John
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Country John!
You do not belong in the WSG Forum.
To have sex with a SW or with a escort for mony is illegal.
I LE will see you having sex wite a escort or a SW they will arrest you in jail and you wiil sew the LE is right.
So please, you do not belong in this Forum.
Go back to LE and leave this Forum for people who love to enjoy to fuck a pussy.
GO! GO! GO! GO!
[size=-2][u]EDITOR's NOTE[/u]: [blue]Posting of this report was delayed pending revisions to [u]fix dozens of simple, idiotic writing errors[/u]. In fact, this report was so bad that I can only assume that you just don't give a damn about creating extra work for me. To avoid delays in future reports, please proof-read your reports before posting them.
Please review the [url=http://www.wsgforum.com/postingguidelines.html]Forum's Posting Guidelines[/url] for further information.
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Country John,
Did you belive we are doing somthing wrong to want to fuck a SW or an escort for money?
If yes, please do not loggin.
GO! GO!
[size=-2][u]EDITOR's NOTE[/u]: [blue]Posting of this report was delayed pending revisions to [u]fix dozens of simple, idiotic writing errors[/u]. In fact, this report was so bad that I can only assume that you just don't give a damn about creating extra work for me. To avoid delays in future reports, please proof-read your reports before posting them.
Please review the [url=http://www.wsgforum.com/postingguidelines.html]Forum's Posting Guidelines[/url] for further information.
[i]Thanks![/i][/blue][/size]
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Country John,
The truth is every SW and everyone of us is doing - money for sex. We are doing against the lew. So the LE is our enemy, we are people going aganst the law, and LE is after the John and they are ready to do everyting to stop us. The LE wil not have us so simply. So it is not in, plaese to say good tings about the LE.
The LE is the enemy of every hooker.
Simple
[size=-2][u]EDITOR's NOTE[/u]: [blue]Posting of this report was delayed pending revisions to [u]fix dozens of simple, idiotic writing errors[/u]. In fact, this report was so bad that I can only assume that you just don't give a damn about creating extra work for me. To avoid delays in future reports, please proof-read your reports before posting them.
Please review the [url=http://www.wsgforum.com/postingguidelines.html]Forum's Posting Guidelines[/url] for further information.
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Civ 2000,
When I am pulled over for speeding, and the Cop asked me," do you know why I'm pulling you over? I say, no but I'm sure you're going to tell me. Sometimes they get a little pissed, when I say that, but I am not going to admit guilt, even in minor traffic tickets. I win 50% of the time, but only because the cops will show up only 1/2 the time. When they do show up, its 100% like you said, you will lose.
I don't shit in my pants if a cops catches me with a SW. It happened to me 3 times, and I only admitted what I was doing once, and my record is clear, except Im in the database in one city. 1st time, I gave a girl $10 before the act. It turned out she brought drugs with it, and the cops followed me and pulled me over, the girl tossed it before they pulled me over. We didn't say anything, and we were let go. Since then no stopping and getting back in my car. 2nd time, the girl wanted me to drop her off near a drug house, I said no problem, but your not coming back in my car. The dumb cops stops us before I could drop her off, separated us, they said, she admitted that I paid her for sex. My story was I was only dropping her off, and that if what she said was true, she would make a bad witness, it turns out she didn't say anything like that. 3rd time, I was followed, but I took the girl to a motel, so they didn't see anything, and when we finished she didn't get back into the car. The cops ( task force) were looking for a seriel Killer,a guy called Willliam Suff, who they later caught., I could tell they were not fooling around. I told them everything they wanted to know. I was let go, but they put me in their database. ( all these things happened many years ago)
I rarely, do SW's anymore, since Im getting older, and TJ is only one hour away from where I work. I drive a small sports car so anything in the car is now out of the question, but from time to time I recuit a newbee, go to a MP, or find women in Las Vegas.
Its too bad, CJ doesn't want to debate my question, regarding Kobe. I don't believe CJ, would ever say, in minor, or major crimes to invoke the 5th. I don't know him, but from his writings, it seems like he loves talking, and he could never keep quiet.
Well, at least I got him to keep quiet regarding this post and to not response to everything.
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Poky Says:
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"When I am pulled over for speeding, and the Cop asked me," do you know why I'm pulling you over? I say, no but I'm sure you're going to tell me. Sometimes they get a little pissed, when I say that, but I am not going to admit guilt, even in minor traffic tickets. I win 50% of the time, but only because the cops will show up only 1/2 the time. When they do show up, its 100% like you said, you will lose."
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Why be a dickhead about it? Why even put yourself or the cop in the position of having to deal with a bullshit remark like that? Why can't you just treat people with dignity and respect? After all, it was YOU who ran the light, blew the sign or whatever it was, not the cop.
What you are really saying is "I'm a smartass and I know you pulled me over because you have nothing better to do than to pick on little old me."
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"Its too bad, CJ doesn't want to debate my question, regarding Kobe." See Below.
"CJ, as I understand your position, you would tell Kobe, the Berretta manta, and say to cooperate with the police, because they know the answers anyway. If you don't cooperate with them, they will get upset, and treat you harshly. " See Below.
"Is this your postion? If not, please explain, because it seems to me, and some other readers, you are telling mongers to rolllover and confess to the police."
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The police had what they thought was sufficient evidence at the time to press Kobe so at the time they believed they already had most of the answers.
Kobe might be a mega millionaire but he also has a dick. As such it is not unreasonable for the cops to believe that he was a viable suspect under the circumstances given the amount of detail they had about the incident.
Given the serious nature of the accusation (rape as opposed to prostitution) I would have told him to keep his mouth shut until his attorney showed up which he apparently did. To be honest, I am not following the case closely. I'm just saddened to see what should have been a star career polluted by this mess.
If on the other hand the cop walks up on the swaying SUV and Kobe is observed doing the glam slam in a public place, I'd advise him to co-operate and not try to bullshit the officers.
There is a huge difference between the two issues you raise Poky.
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"I don't believe CJ, would ever say, in minor, or major crimes to invoke the 5th. I don't know him, but from his writings, it seems like he loves talking, and he could never keep quiet.
Well, at least I got him to keep quiet regarding this post and to not response to everything.
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Poky, you only invoke the 5th when you're on the stand in your own criminal trial, before a grand jury etc in order to prevent testifying against your self that would lead to proving your own guilt. You know this. I'm not sure why you would have made such a statement but I can guess all day long.
As far as the rest of your post in concerned, more mindless dribble. Every once in a while you seem to have something worthwhile to say without engaging in flaming tactics.
I understand you better than you think. I've arrested gangs of guys like you. You should take a moment and decide whether your flaming tendancies really get you anywhere. Even though they might work for you, you can't expect people to take you seriously forever.
Hopefully I've addressed your questions.
Be Safe and BE NICE
Country John
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any attorney in the US will tell you the same thing! "keep your fricken mouth shut!" If Le ever questions you about a speeding violation, running a stop sign, paying for sex, you have an absolute right to say nothing. If they have enough proof of these violations to charge you then they will, if they don't, they will try and intimidate you into believing they do. they will try and find a bargaining point. They might suggest, it's really the hooker we want and not you, they will often offer to let you pass if you make a statement against the girl. Only one problem with this, the girl who is 30 feet away and out of you hearing range, is likely being offered the same deal. Unless you have it in writing, it's simple. The cops are lying to you. They can and do lie. They don't give a shit how or what they do to nail you with solicitation. So please, do not takes CJ advice.
If you're screwing a hooker and you get caught red handed. It's simple! SHUT YOUR PIE HOLE!
You do not have to show the cops disrespect, you don't have to lie to them, you don't have to make a deal. Just shut your mouth! In this type of scenario, it will likely piss the cops off, why? Because now they will have a much, much harder time charging you and the girl with prostitution! SIMPLE! AND............if the cops involved get really pissed off and charge you with something because they are emotional and angry at your lack of cooperation, they know it will likely be thrown out in court!
Here are some simple facts to remember:
1. If you are busted in an undercover sting, you might be in for it and be rightfully charged. This type of situation should never happen. It's my opinion this only happens to stupid mongers.
2. If you doing the deed, caught picking up a hooker, followed and pulled over, they walk up on you with your pecker in her mouth or vagina, whatever the situation might be, they is nothing other then a possible indecent exposure they can charge you with, UNLESS ONE OR BOTH OF YOU ADMIT TO HAVING SEX FOR $!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Comprendo???????????????????
So if you're in your car having a good time, or you pickup a hooker and get followed by the cop and then pulled over, unless you fall for their tricks in getting you to turn on her and her to turn on you and admit to paying for it, there is nothing they can do! UNDERSTAND??
So basically pickup girls you know will hold their ground, discuss it with them before hand. Tell them both of us will keep our mouths shut, no matter what and go have fun!
Last, don't be stupid and fall for a sting. These are so easy to spot, it's almost comical!
So cooperate all you want with LE, take Country John's advice. You will get nailed, and cited and probably do a few days in jail. You will likely have a record. All for opening you mouth!
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I would only respond that GT's post is seriously lacking in common sense, as usual.
I mean there you are, pecker in mouth, and you are going to insult someone's intelligence by saying nothing. Not only is it stupid but it's really stupid. No, it's really really stupid. Start that and you're going to give the cop a "book of probable cause."
'Cmon GT, you're smarter than that, this is just another opportunity to flame 'ol Country John. As soon as you stop your lie'n ways, we'll take you seriously again. Until then, don't bother. You're just wasting everyone's time.
If you are detained for something serious then of course, keep your mouth shut but when you're caught and you know you're caught then don't be stupid too. We all know there are penalties for mongering, you're not going to go to jail (unless something else comes up). Being stupid could make the difference between a 15 minute experience and who knows how long. Treat the cops with respect. They'll reciprocate (in most cases). Be an asshole and you'll be treated just like one (in all cases). There's no sense in prolonging an already difficult situation.
If you can't make sense out of this you shouldn't be out there taking chances that will get you in trouble.
Be Safe and BE NICE.
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Well, I see no advantage whatsoever to being quiet or spouting off if I'm stopped for speeding or some other misdemeanor or, in some cases, solicitation. Doing that means I'm going to be ticketed or arrested, and even if I decide to invest the time to try to beat it it's gonna be a major pain.
I'd far rather try to talk my way out of it, and I'm not going be able to do that if I make clear to the cops I'm a smartass or by stonewalling them. Far better to fess up to a smaller version of things or to try to read the cop well enough to know whether or not telling the plain truth is going to get me off. If I fess up I'm not going to win a court case, but the entire idea is never to have to deal with one at all.
And if they're going to take my car I'm sure as hell going to try to talk them out of it.
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Could you two please explain to me how it's obvious? Did they see how much you paid her, or offered her? One cannot assume when it comes to the law. Only hard facts holdup in court. If I do not admit to it and she does not either, they have no evidence! Even if she is a known hooker. For all they know it could have been a mercy date! For all they know she could have just been horny! For all they know she could have been an old GF!
Unless they saw $ being offered or changing hands for the act of sex, or YOU ADMIT IT! THEY HAVE NOTHING ON YOU! It will never holdup in court and you two are wise enough to know this.
As for it being way to much hassle as JZ contends, baloney. 99-1 they drop the charges if you fight it. The prosecution attorney will look at the evidence, the cop will likely not even show and the case gets booted!
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GT, most of us know the rules relating to evidence. But why put yourself in that position in the first place. Sure if you get charged, most likely the case will get thrown out, but, won't your attitude bring unwanted embarresment? The cops will most likely let you go provided you are courteous and polite. To flame them thus getting charged, just smacks of shere stupidity.
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Here's a question for someone with a legal background:
What's the legality of making direct plans to go mongering in a foreign country? For example, when Country John makes plans to meet up with men for the stated purpose of picking-up prostitutas, is he violating the law? Can he, and any men who show, be charged with anything by the US LE ? I'm pretty sure that conspiring to break a US law in a foreign country is borderline at best, but my limited law classes in college (mostly in the area of intellectual property) never covered this.
Just wondering...Have Fun, guys!
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it is theoretically possible that under some state or federal statutes this could be considered a crime.
however, the number of prosecutions of such offenses are to my knowledge, zero. there are many unused and silly criminal laws on the books that are not enforced - for example in kentucky people are required under threat of prosecution to take a bath once a year.
[b]no[/b] u.s. prosecutor is going to waste one second of time on something like that, unless there is something much more sinister involved than simply going abroad to sleep with trixies.
in that vein, germany has (rightly) initiated some prosecutions of its citizens who have gone abroad for **** sex tours with very young women. this was done under german law.
-uncle otto
