"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2569134]Believe me if the US government can shut down Megaupload, which was based in Hong Kong and run by folks who never set foot on US soil, and put the owner in jail in his country of residence (New Zealand) with a constant threat of extradition to the USA for trial, you better believe that no website in any country is safe.

And they didn't do this over human trafficking. They did it over simple file sharing and copyright laws. They weren't based in the US, they just passed network traffic through our servers and its game-fucking-over for them.

In terms of credentials, I've been involved in this sort of stuff since before Americans had ever heard the word Internet. Online and the legalities that drive it have been around since we first connected computers to phone lines, long before the world wide web was created.

I'm really not trying to be a dick here but I've given numerous examples that prove the "offshore" theory is just plain wrong. Allofmp3, silkroad, megaupload. They all prove my point in one way or another.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megaupload[/QUOTE]All those sites are what's referred to as egregious offenders. No dating site can stop the occasional pro from posting an ad. And even if a girl is a pro that doesn't mean she isn't entitled to a social life. Men paying women for their company is part of every cultures traditions. I just don't see a dating site, that is obviously not an escort site getting shut down. A BP may be a different story. Those sites you mention were violating so many laws as were the individual owners on a personal level, that you couldn't count the number of felonies they were committing. The SD sites and especially SA are run by a totally different crowd. The primary owner of SD4M was once run out of a business a number of years ago. The business was not illegal in any way, but his particular business practices were. And would have eventually forced any owner to close practicing similar tactics to defraud or abuse the telecom system. Just my 2 cents.

Now hey, what about that pussy?

[QUOTE=HollywoodGuy;2569181]All those sites are what's referred to as egregious offenders. No dating site can stop the occasional pro from posting an ad. And even if a girl is a pro that doesn't mean she isn't entitled to a social life. Men paying women for their company is part of every cultures traditions. I just don't see a dating site, that is obviously not an escort site getting shut down. A BP may be a different story. Those sites you mention were violating so many laws as were the individual owners on a personal level, that you couldn't count the number of felonies they were committing. The SD sites and especially SA are run by a totally different crowd. The primary owner of SD4M was once run out of a business a number of years ago. The business was not illegal in any way, but his particular business practices were. And would have eventually forced any owner to close practicing similar tactics to defraud or abuse the telecom system. Just my 2 cents.

Now hey, what about that pussy?[/QUOTE]The SD sites aren't illegal, when used according to terms of service. Neither are nightclubs in most cities, but the cities can still choose to shut them down as a "public nuisance" if too much illegal activity is tied to the business. It's the same sort of risk. As I said before, it's not going to happen over the occasional misdemeanor transaction taking place, but something like a high profile case in the media (examples I used before are something like the Google exec / heroin death, or maybe someone gets caught trafficking some minor on one of the sites).

Allofmp3 wasn't breaking the law. Neither was megaupload. Their users were. Its an almost perfect analogy.

And speaking of pussy. I while back I said I might decide to go an alternate route and pay $$ a date (here and there), but then just date a little less. I just made my first $$ offer today, to this girl, based off her message to me that a $ just wasn't going to cut it.

I would never normally do this, but since being with my ATF who is 6' tall, I have come to appreciate the kinetic dynamics of our love making. This girl is close to 6 feet as well.

Anyway, she just accepted my offer of a "no sex, no money" date to see if we click.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2569134]
And they didn't do this over human trafficking. They did it over simple file sharing and copyright laws. [/QUOTE]I know I should stay out of this, BUT-"simple file sharing and copyright laws" are in effect taking hundreds of millions of dollars OUT of the pockets of people in the entertainment industry that have the motivation, the contacts, the money, and the legal backing to influence the government to take action. The only motivation of the government to commit all the might of the Federal machine to shutting down SA, SD4 M or others are headlines during an election cycle. The history of politicians grandstanding against vice goes back as long as we've had a government, is cyclical in nature, and will probably never end. That being said, if there is big money out there on one side of this issue, it is on the side of the internet services that are filling a market. Something like this is GOING to exist in one form or another. Can the government shut down SD4 M? Absolutely. Is the government going to eliminate men with means' desire for the company of younger women or the desire of those women to have more than they can get otherwise? Never.

Now, as a smart guy said, how about that pussy?

[QUOTE=Dsprdo;2569244]Can the government shut down SD4 M? Absolutely. Is the government going to eliminate men with means' desire for the company of younger women or the desire of those women to have more than they can get otherwise? Never.
[/QUOTE]As I said in an earlier message, sugar daddying was around before the websites and would be around after. The negative side effect however would be that if the websites are pushed underground or if there is a stigma of illegality created around it in the media, there is a certain category of girls that will no longer use those sites. Unfortunately that category of girls are the best kind.

The SD sites would continue to popup under different names and find ways to continue operating, but if they aren't getting basically promoted on the Dr. Phil show and similar, we are not going to benefit from the same level of popularity.

Its not the willingness of the men to seek out the hobby that would fade -- the problem is all the young ladies that would be chased away by a stigma that there is something wrong / illegal with the hobby.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2569339]

Its not the willingness of the men to seek out the hobby that would fade -- the problem is all the young ladies that would be chased away by a stigma that there is something wrong / illegal with the hobby.[/QUOTE]Societal norms do change over time, I agree. Don't think that women's desire to trade on their attractiveness to men has changed since the beginning of time, and doubt that it ever will, based on empirical evidence. A generalization that some women will hate, I know, but I'm pretty confident that position is backed by a myriad of day to day examples.

So I contacted a college student a couple of weeks ago who had the usual profile about looking for LTR with a SD to help out with tuition. Her reply was only for me to send her a text. A google search turned up her many ads and pics.

I didn't reply as I wasn't interested in going that route. Last night she wrote back why I had contacted her. So you explained why. She replied that she wasn't an escort and wanted to know why I thought that. After sending her the link I got off of google, she replied back, "Oh ok but how did you find that as all I get is nothing like that when I look up my phone number". After I told her how to search for her ads, she said thanks and call me if I change my mind.

I don't have anything against escorts as I've used them before but I prefer to know upfront. Just started meeting another college student who is probably utr but at least we did a m&g and a couple of dinners before hitting the fc.

[QUOTE=HollywoodGuy;2569233]And speaking of pussy. I while back I said I might decide to go an alternate route and pay $$ a date (here and there), but then just date a little less. I just made my first $$ offer today, to this girl, based off her message to me that a $ just wasn't going to cut it.

I would never normally do this, but since being with my ATF who is 6' tall, I have come to appreciate the kinetic dynamics of our love making. This girl is close to 6 feet as well.

Anyway, she just accepted my offer of a "no sex, no money" date to see if we click.[/QUOTE]And here is a front shot of the aforementioned 6 foot girl. After sleeping on it. I am just not sure. But I guess I can meet her for free and see what happens.

[QUOTE=FredMoore;2568482]My personal opinion -Yes- each to his own. A label is just that but it is good to know in your own mind how to process your activities. Does that make us Johns if we see 1 SB? Probably. If a girl is collecting men to pay her and is willing to have sex to do it then she is a pro by definition. The only way to avoid that definition is the existence of a relationship that is not solely dependent on a sex / money dynamic. Most SBs would not see any of us unless they were getting paid. And we would not pay them without the expectation of sex. An exception to that rule is the true IRL bar / dating site pickup. I know my SBs "like" me and many are thrilled with the sex, but I have yet had one offer to drop the allowance. I know it happens because some of you report it, but those girls see some of you as a potential IRL "catch".

For those of you who see Escorts you know the difference in mentality between a naive college girl wanting to pay for her tuition and taking a dick for the effort vs a working Pro with a Pimp, website, agency, etc. The SB college girl is just starting on that slippery slope to being a Pro. It isn't long before she sees how easy it is to bang some geeze and pocket an easy $$$ ,then another and another. Same with us guys. If I had the time and $ I would see a different SB every day ala Hollywood in his prime. I want to catch the SB at the naive stage where she hasn't acquired the hooker mentality, and actually can still respond emotionally and actually enjoy the ride.[/QUOTE]Well said. It is a fine line. I was thinking along the lines of your second paragraph type of SB. I too like that type of SB. In fact my senior to be at a university is like that, as she took her profile down a couple of months ago.

[QUOTE=TravelinSD;2568088]LOL! Last week for only the 2nd time I ended a date as soon as the girl got in the car. This one described herself as "average". I should have guessed when her profile had only face shots and the one private pic she was in very loose clothing. As she came walking out to the car she was obviously way past "a few extra pounds" and solidly into "overweight". She got in the car and I told her I was sorry, but this just wasn't going to work. She did take it fairly well.

Good Hunting!

Travelin.[/QUOTE]I had two of those early this year. They qualified as a few extra pounds for sure.

[QUOTE=Dsprdo;2569403]Societal norms do change over time, I agree. Don't think that women's desire to trade on their attractiveness to men has changed since the beginning of time, and doubt that it ever will, based on empirical evidence. A generalization that some women will hate, I know, but I'm pretty confident that position is backed by a myriad of day to day examples.[/QUOTE]I mentioned earlier in this discussion that the worlds oldest profession will never go away.

What would be in jeopardy, however, of diminishing is the simple convenience of meeting good clean college aged babes by simply signing up for a website. If it is not dead-simple and convenient, free of legal risk and social stigma for them, the numbers would drop off exponentially and we'd mostly be dealing with escorts and BP skanks.

Trust me when I say SBs can still be found on Match/POF etc all day long. It's just a LOT more work to do so with much less to choose from.

Is the Trumpster rejuvenating the American spirit? Something is going on, on the Internet. Online sales have jumped dramatically in the last 5 weeks (in the slowest month of the year except August). This directly impacts my ability to play in the bowl. And part of my reason for having the confidence to offer $$ to that model below. I hope this keeps up, because my game is way up even from a couple years ago. So if my paycheck goes up proportionately, I could go on an awesome sugar run till the end of the year.

Smiley Face.

[QUOTE=HollywoodGuy;2569724]Is the Trumpster rejuvenating the American spirit? Something is going on, on the Internet. Online sales have jumped dramatically in the last 5 weeks (in the slowest month of the year except August). This directly impacts my ability to play in the bowl. And part of my reason for having the confidence to offer $$ to that model below. I hope this keeps up, because my game is way up even from a couple years ago. So if my paycheck goes up proportionately, I could go on an awesome sugar run till the end of the year.

Smiley Face.[/QUOTE]I guess online sales of what would be the salient question. Sometimes a simple media trend can cause a run on anything. Just a couple of weeks ago, anyone selling confederate flags was pretty much an overnight success as folks started stockpiling them. The economy overall is in good shape though. Folks can say what they want about Obama but I'll take this over the Bush era anyday.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2569739]I guess online sales of what would be the salient question. Sometimes a simple media trend can cause a run on anything. Just a couple of weeks ago, anyone selling confederate flags was pretty much an overnight success as folks started stockpiling them. The economy overall is in good shape though. Folks can say what they want about Obama but I'll take this over the Bush era anyday.[/QUOTE]Everything is up. Health related stuff, stuff for seniors (always a good sign as they have the tightest wads), dating sites, cosmetic surgery, college enrollment. All across the board really. An interesting slight down trend is coupon cutting (although it is still very popular). People are just being less paranoid about spending money.

And lol.. I did sell a ton of flags this summer. As far as politics I was literally printing money under bush (and sugaring about 20k a month including alimony), under obama I actually thought I might go out of business (which is how I got started on my $ plan and dropped the alimony to 1k a month). Kind of like Hannity's penny plan on steroids.

Because before obama I was paying $$$+ daily on girls, no problem. People are feeling the winds of change. Hope is replacing fear again. There is huge pent up buyer demand. Vacation spending is going to be massive this month. As it always is, just more than the last few years. This xmas should be insane. Watch car sales start to creep up again. Hasn't happened yet but it will next year I think. Cars sales are a good indicator. High end sales are already up. And inexpensive cars have been doing well for a while. When the middle priced cars start selling again you know for sure the economy is rising.

Shit, I was spending 7k a month on my daughter alone. I cut that to 2k. Since the X Wifey and my daughter are now stabilized at about 3k a month total, this would allow any extra money to go straight to savings and sugaring. A happy prospect for sure. Now if I can only get my health back up so I can drive normally again, this could be a fun 3rd and 4th quarter. its a lot tougher and more expensive when the girl has to always drive or transport over to me. One reason I hooked up with the car-less virgin was her close proximity to my house.

I have noticed lately there are lots of ads that have the privacy warning that I first saw on (and associate with) AFF, also read something by a lady who was not on SA, but her pic / profile was, also profiles that have no text or text written by some who don't have a command of the English language. I have also received messages from SB's who go from local to 200-2000 miles away a few days after writing. There is a newish SB thread from cincy that goes into a fair amount of detail about dubious profiles. I'm in central Va. And have had great luck, but have not renewed for a while due to lack of free time. I see profiles that have me ready to pull the trigger then some of this weirdness goes on.

Oh well, I'm always optimistic so may pay soon. Any feedback on local girls appreciated (Krill are you out there?) , Ideally I need a young lady with a great head game who can host me during the day as I have a so. Thanks, J.