"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[QUOTE=LoVecchio;3381010]I have been in the bowl for the last three years and have been amazed by the new vistas it opens up. I am in my mid-60's and have to confess that I've been having the best sex of my life with women 1/3 to 1/2 my age. Because I am married, I am limited to discreet meetings in hotels and have never tried to meet a baby when I'm traveling. A few weeks from now, I'm going to be going to a far-away city where I won't be so constrained and was thinking that it would be nice to meet up with an SB with the idea (well, my idea, anyway) of taking her to a very nice restaurant and then hoping to take her back to my hotel.

I'm at a bit of a loss in figuring out how to approach girls and also which ones to approach. I can't offer more than a one-time thing, because although I occasionally go to that city, I'm generally with my wife when I do so. I assume that it would be easier if I could dangle recurrent visits, but I can't really do that in good faith. So, I have to make clear that this is a one-time thing (or at least be careful not to seem like I'm promising more than that), which makes it hard to approach someone without offending her and making it seem like I am treating her as an escort. On the other hand, I don't want her to think that I JUST want a dinner companion. So, I'm having trouble figuring out how to approach a woman..[/QUOTE]Plenty of utr girls on sa that should fulfill what you're looking for since you're looking for a one time thing. Plenty of the girls that run a rotation the way the guys do that could squeeze you in. These girls know the score and don't require the effort that a sb would require. These girls will work something out online with you or do the traditional m / g and go from there. If your going to a city that has a sb thread go there and ask for advice or a reference or read the reviews that they have posted. Finding a one nighter is simple.

Started with three Ben Franklins with an SB after a couple of meetings I lowered it to two and after a few more hookups I texted that it has to be reduced to just one in response to her text about how much she enjoyed being with me and cannot wait to get together again but did not hear from her againoh well!

I've used a different approach. After I've had a great time with an SB that I'm confident she enjoyed too, I will tell her I would love to see her, but my budget was limited for various reasons. Sometimes, I get the "let me know when you have the money again", but I'm surprised how often I get "that okay, I really just enjoyed time with you and you can help what you can". I always make them feel like they are worth more than I can afford. It helps if I make them feel valued even if I can't a afford the "full value".

[QUOTE=PghGuy2005;3381683]Started with three Ben Franklins with an SB after a couple of meetings I lowered it to two and after a few more hookups I texted that it has to be reduced to just one in response to her text about how much she enjoyed being with me and cannot wait to get together again but did not hear from her againoh well![/QUOTE]

There are definitely some good advice posts on contacting road babies earlier in the thread. In particular, see post #8869 by TravelinSD and #13562 by F Scott.

I've got an extended trip coming up next week. Did research to pick out possibilities who had been online recently, narrowed things down a bit, and sent a message to a bunch of them (with a few personalizations based on stated interests). Thus far, I've had all but a couple of them view it, and a slightly surprising 25% hit rate for responses and interest. For what it's worth, here's approximately what I sent out:

"Hi. I travel to CITY frequently for work, and will be out there again soon. I can't be your full-time SD, but I think we can have some fun whenever I'm there. I'd be happy to do dinner to discuss things or just get together to enjoy ourselves, and if we do spend time together, I'll provide some spending money. Take a look at my profile, and if that sounds like something you'd be interested in, let me know. ".

This is showing an improved response over the previous message I'd tried, which didn't discuss dinner and just said "we could have some fun together". Also have a few other POTs who didn't see my previous message until after I'd returned home, and expressed interest. So, plenty of POTs, and we'll see how this trip turns out.

[QUOTE=JohnHandCock;3379599][URL]http://amp.nj.com/v1/articles/20619452/man_charged_with_harassing_woman_he_met_on_dating.ampsugar[/URL][/QUOTE]Assuming her version is the truth I hope the guy gets convicted and hung out to dry.

[QUOTE=JZLizard;3381422]I was hoping to be able to contribute something useful, since I'm strictly a traveling SD, don't play close to home, so what you described you want to do in your first paragraph is exactly what I do (well, sometimes the date involves more than dinner but that's not a requirement. Sometimes its no dinner, a couple of drinks at the hotel bar, then off to the FC). However the more I read the more I think I don't fully understand your question.

It seems like you normally play close to home, but do so in a way that gives you peace of mind that you won't get caught. You'd like to date SBs in a city you visit regularly with the SO, so you want the same peace of mind. I'm not clear on what would be any different? Whatever is preventing you from getting caught in your home city would probably be even more effective toward same in a city that you only occasionally visit, so I would just do the same thing but make it clear to the SB that your availability is dependent on your visits to that city. Everything else stays the same. Just don't take the wife to a restaurant where she waits tables or whatever.

Or did I misunderstand the question?[/QUOTE]You understood the question; I just didn't explain the facts very well. When my wife and I are in the distant city, we are just there for a few hours to get a car and a meal before we drive to our destination about 150 miles away. So, we are just passing through, really, and it only happens no more than once a year. That's why I think that the risk is virtually nonexistent. I just mentioned the part about telling POTs that I was occasionally in the city, but encumbered, as a way of perhaps subtly indicating that there's always the possibility that I might be there again (or at least familiarity with the locale). But, as I said, I can't legitimately hold future meetings out as an option, because it's unlikely that I will be there on my own to do a repeat. It's the one-time nature of the thing that causes my concern.

The reason that I can't do what I usually do at home is that at home I make clear that I want an ongoing arrangement as opposed to a one-time thing. The babies I have found that way would not, I'm pretty sure, have been interested if I had gone in with the explicit intention of not seeing them again. I guess what I was most interested in getting input on is how (or even whether it's possible) to attract the kind of baby that I'm used to when all I can offer is a fancy dinner (and, implicitly, at least, some cash and me) on a one-time basis. My goal is more than getting laid. I'm almost certain that I could find a UTR to spend a few hours with. On the other hand, I really enjoy the companionship of an interesting young woman and like to eat at fancy restaurants. The typical UTR is probably out of her element in that kind of setting. I thought that this would be an opportunity to actually have the kind of "date" that I'm not able to have at home.

It may be that the criteria that I am laying out work at cross-purposes, such that what I am looking for is impossible to find.

[QUOTE=LoVecchio;3382333]You understood the question; I just didn't explain the facts very well. When my wife and I are in the distant city, we are just there for a few hours to get a car and a meal before we drive to our destination about 150 miles away. So, we are just passing through, really, and it only happens no more than once a year. That's why I think that the risk is virtually nonexistent. I just mentioned the part about telling POTs that I was occasionally in the city, but encumbered, as a way of perhaps subtly indicating that there's always the possibility that I might be there again (or at least familiarity with the locale). But, as I said, I can't legitimately hold future meetings out as an option, because it's unlikely that I will be there on my own to do a repeat. It's the one-time nature of the thing that causes my concern.

The reason that I can't do what I usually do at home is that at home I make clear that I want an ongoing arrangement as opposed to a one-time thing. The babies I have found that way would not, I'm pretty sure, have been interested if I had gone in with the explicit intention of not seeing them again. I guess what I was most interested in getting input on is how (or even whether it's possible) to attract the kind of baby that I'm used to when all I can offer is a fancy dinner (and, implicitly, at least, some cash and me) on a one-time basis. My goal is more than getting laid. I'm almost certain that I could find a UTR to spend a few hours with. On the other hand, I really enjoy the companionship of an interesting young woman and like to eat at fancy restaurants. The typical UTR is probably out of her element in that kind of setting. I thought that this would be an opportunity to actually have the kind of "date" that I'm not able to have at home.

It may be that the criteria that I am laying out work at cross-purposes, such that what I am looking for is impossible to find.[/QUOTE]I think I understand the issue now, you are fairly certain you won't be passing through this town without the wife again any time in coming months is that correct? If so, that is a bit different than my situation.

What I would probably do in that particular case, assuming you have enough time before the trip and are willing to exert a little extra effort, is to cast a wide net with the mindset you are "placing an ad" for a companion for one spectacular night. When I say cast a wide net, not only start sending a standard "fishing" message to girls in that city on SA, but also place an ad on Craigslist about what you're looking for (never know what you might find), also maybe 2-3 other SD sites. I've never used WYP but it sounds perfect for your needs? You can just place an emphasis on classy / educated or whatever you're looking for in your requirements. It might take a bit more work (thus not a good plan for a last minute hook up) but you can find some real gems this way. You might find a girl that's never been an SB at all but is intrigued by the idea. The fact that sex is a secondary goal for you actually works in your favor here.

Also, I don't have much experience with UTRs or pros, but there are escorts out there that cater to upscale clientele, some of which I'm sure are capable of being interesting companions and are right at home in fancy restaurants.

I have had a few years experience on S. A. And I have found it to be a win, win situation for me and my S. B. s. I practice a few ground rules that have worked so far for me. 1 Under no circumstances do I tell them my real name. 2. I use a throw away walmart refillable phone I never use my regular phone. 3- Under no circumstances do I tell them my real name. I try to think with the big head as much as possible when I'm with a S. B. 4 - I don't wine and dine them ever. Many of them don't want to be seen in public, could create a lot of questions if a friend or family member see them. Maybe a coffee shop for the first meeting, after that its a private location or onto another potential S. B. There was mention of a girl named Summer in an earlier post, she attempted to blackmail one of us. I saw her about 3 months ago she was a normal pro. If they don't get personal info on you they can't blackmail you. , These S. B. s are smarter than we think sometimes, it is about the money. There are more and more pros, getting on S. A. , they do stand out, too quick to meet and they usually are available day or evening. Good hunting. One side note for anyone who has a significant other who is suspicious of your activities. Verizon has a new device called hum, it attaches to the computer port under the dash of your car and you can download an app on your phone to follow that car. I just found about it yesterday this could be old news to some, it was new to me. Beware.

This is a common thing they say to make you feel special and to squeeze you for what you do have.

[QUOTE=PghGuy2005;3381683]Started with three Ben Franklins with an SB after a couple of meetings I lowered it to two and after a few more hookups I texted that it has to be reduced to just one in response to her text about how much she enjoyed being with me and cannot wait to get together again but did not hear from her againoh well![/QUOTE].

[QUOTE=FigLeaf;3380260]I went to my granddaughter's college graduation this weekend. As I am looking around, all I keep thinking is.
That blonde could be my baby.
That gorgeous hot thing could have me as her daddy.
That redhead is probably a wildcat freak in the sack.

The amount of young ass and boob's on display was phenomenal.

Thank God we were outside and I had sunglasses on.[/QUOTE]Tis the season, and sunglasses are definitely required!

[QUOTE=LoVecchio;3381010]I have been in the bowl for the last three years and have been amazed by the new vistas it opens up. I am in my mid-60's and have to confess that I've been having the best sex of my life with women 1/3 to 1/2 my age. Because I am married, I am limited to discreet meetings in hotels and have never tried to meet a baby when I'm traveling. A few weeks from now, I'm going to be going to a far-away city where I won't be so constrained and was thinking that it would be nice to meet up with an SB with the idea (well, my idea, anyway) of taking her to a very nice restaurant and then hoping to take her back to my hotel.

I'm at a bit of a loss in figuring out how to approach girls and also which ones to approach. I can't offer more than a one-time thing, because although I occasionally go to that city, I'm generally with my wife when I do so. I assume that it would be easier if I could dangle recurrent visits, but I can't really do that in good faith. So, I have to make clear that this is a one-time thing (or at least be careful not to seem like I'm promising more than that), which makes it hard to approach someone without offending her and making it seem like I am treating her as an escort. On the other hand, I don't want her to think that I JUST want a dinner companion. So, I'm having trouble figuring out how to approach a woman.

I'm also having trouble figuring out which women to approach. The choice seems to boil down to: 1) approaching the same women I would approach if I were trying to set up a long-term arrangement. These would be women who are educated or on their way to being educated and are people I think would be interesting dinner companions but perhaps far less than sure things to take back to the FC; or 2) approaching women who might be less educated, perhaps single mothers, who even if nice people might be less than enchanting dinner companions (and perhaps out of their element at a nice restaurant) but perhaps more of a sure thing to get to the FC because they may be more highly motivated by the money.

That leads me to the next thing, which is how to make it clear (or at least clear enough) that I am offering more than just a free meal if the night goes well.

Anyway, it seems that finding a Road Baby presents some different challenges from finding one close to home. If anyone has any advice, I would love to hear it.[/QUOTE]What I do is mention that I visit frequently (if you do, if you don't just leave it out), and that I'm just looking for a nice dinner, great conversation, and perhaps an amazing dessert.

I'm heading to a city I visit a few times a year later this week, and I have three women lined up for two nights. One is a definite freebee. The other two are TBD.

Be polite, but have an edge. You'll do fine.

[QUOTE=BaldEagle;3382838]I have had a few years experience on S. A. And I have found it to be a win, win situation for me and my S. B. s. I practice a few ground rules that have worked so far for me. 1 Under no circumstances do I tell them my real name. 2. I use a throw away walmart refillable phone I never use my regular phone. 3- Under no circumstances do I tell them my real name. I try to think with the big head as much as possible when I'm with a S. B. 4 - I don't wine and dine them ever. Many of them don't want to be seen in public, could create a lot of questions if a friend or family member see them. Maybe a coffee shop for the first meeting, after that its a private location or onto another potential S. B. There was mention of a girl named Summer in an earlier post, she attempted to blackmail one of us. I saw her about 3 months ago she was a normal pro. If they don't get personal info on you they can't blackmail you. , These S. B. s are smarter than we think sometimes, it is about the money. There are more and more pros, getting on S. A. , they do stand out, too quick to meet and they usually are available day or evening. Good hunting. One side note for anyone who has a significant other who is suspicious of your activities. Verizon has a new device called hum, it attaches to the computer port under the dash of your car and you can download an app on your phone to follow that car. I just found about it yesterday this could be old news to some, it was new to me. Beware.[/QUOTE]I've not heard of hum. Thanks! Lots of places have been selling GPS trackers with magnets in waterproof cases (put under the hood or wheel well) for a while now.

The long and short of it is if your SO wants to catch you. She probably will. It's all risk v. Reward.

I had the oddest conversation the other day with a young lady.

I usually avoid discussing allowance. The one exception is if the SB says she's had a SD previously. I usually ask what were the terms of the arrangement just to get an idea of her expectations (yes I know they most probably lie about the amount). This young lady gave me the amount and said that they usually stayed indoors for discretion. The amount she indicated was super high, and I said I can't do nearly that amount as I need to get a hotel room etc. Etc. Her reply was "I'm not a prostitute".

After I stopped laughing, I told her I didn't say she was and that I presumed she met her last SD in a hotel unless he was single since they stayed indoors. She replied that he was married, but they'd meet at his house when the wife was at work. I told her that won't work for me, and I wished her luck.

I have to say it was the oddest conversation I've had on SA, and that's saying something!

I don't know how many of you have followed the cheerleader / SA story in the news, but here is one media story that is probably good for the lifestyle, in contrast to all the recent negative press.

Good move by Brandon Wade.

"The operators of a dating website reportedly used by members of Coastal Carolina University's cheer-leading squad will be reaching out to the cheerleaders' attorney to offer to pay for legal fees following the team being suspended indefinitely. ".

[URL]http://www.wmcactionnews5.com/story/35098582/operators-of-dating-website-offer-to-pay-legal-fees-for-ccu-cheerleaders[/URL]

[URL]http://www.teenvogue.com/story/college-suspended-cheerleaders-for-allegedly-being-escorts[/URL]

I have been texting with this girl and she wants to meet. She looks familiar but I can't place her. Anyone?

[QUOTE=BikeRider;3383446]I had the oddest conversation the other day with a young lady.

I usually avoid discussing allowance. The one exception is if the SB says she's had a SD previously. I usually ask what were the terms of the arrangement just to get an idea of her expectations (yes I know they most probably lie about the amount). This young lady gave me the amount and said that they usually stayed indoors for discretion. The amount she indicated was super high, and I said I can't do nearly that amount as I need to get a hotel room etc. Etc. Her reply was "I'm not a prostitute".

After I stopped laughing, I told her I didn't say she was and that I presumed she met her last SD in a hotel unless he was single since they stayed indoors. She replied that he was married, but they'd meet at his house when the wife was at work. I told her that won't work for me, and I wished her luck.

I have to say it was the oddest conversation I've had on SA, and that's saying something![/QUOTE]You absolutely did the right thing by wishing her luck. I know you said you usually don't discuss allowance but I would encourage everyone to "never discuss allowance." In this instance you may have lost a good POT by going down the road of discussing (negotiating) the allowance up front. Believe me I know how this goes bc my first year in the bowl I used to do the same exact thing. However, I have learned to simply stick with JL's approach on the discussion of allowance. Frankly at the end of the day it does not matter if they had a SD previously. Asking her about the previous arrangements only gives her an opportunity to embellish (lie) so her answer is moot. Doesn't matter bc it is no doubt bs anyway and worse, starts her down the road of lying from the get go. Moreover taking her high dollar fib and then putting the hotel factor into the convo continues to make it a negotiation. You don't want that. What you want to do is strictly side step the $ topic and never give a definitive ($) answer. If you give her an answer to the $ topic then guess who is in control. It ain't you. Just sayin. They either go the hotel room or they don't. If they do then a few minutes before she leaves put an an envelope with a nice card (I purchase very appropriate cards at a boutique card shop) into her purse. If the SB is worth repeating I put in 200 (a ben franklin and a 100 visa gift card). If she isn't worth repeating or is in a very rural area then a Grant and a 100 visa card. If she ghosts me after that then so be it. But she is a fool if she does bc I always make sure they have a good time. BTW as far as her story about meeting at the guy's house, she is either lying or IMHO the SD is a damn fool.

[QUOTE=StormyTuesday;3386410]You absolutely did the right thing by wishing her luck. I know you said you usually don't discuss allowance but I would encourage everyone to "never discuss allowance." =* * * * I have learned to simply stick with JL's approach on the discussion of allowance. * * * * What you want to do is strictly side step the $ topic and never give a definitive ($) answer. If you give her an answer to the $ topic then guess who is in control. It ain't you. Just sayin. They either go the hotel room or they don't. If they do then a few minutes before she leaves put an an envelope with a nice card (I purchase very appropriate cards at a boutique card shop) into her purse. * * * * [/QUOTE]This is an area in which I have a hard time adhering to what I acknowledge is sound advice. So, if she raises the issue at the M&G, I usually give a number. I figure that if I don't, there are two possibilities: 1) she declines to go forward in the absence of a commitment about the amount; or 2) she goes forward but then has to be worrying the whole time during the date if she is going to get stiffed (the wrong way). I actually worry more about number 2 than about number 1. There are enough sketchy guys on the site that a woman has to be wondering what the ultimate outcome is going to be. I think I give off pretty trustworthy vibes, but a wise SB is going to know that the most successful con men (not to mention people like Ted Bundy) do also.

[QUOTE=StormyTuesday;3386410]You absolutely did the right thing by wishing her luck. I know you said you usually don't discuss allowance but I would encourage everyone to "never discuss allowance." In this instance you may have lost a good POT by going down the road of discussing (negotiating) the allowance up front. Believe me I know how this goes bc my first year in the bowl I used to do the same exact thing. However, I have learned to simply stick with JL's approach on the discussion of allowance. Frankly at the end of the day it does not matter if they had a SD previously. Asking her about the previous arrangements only gives her an opportunity to embellish (lie) so her answer is moot. Doesn't matter bc it is no doubt bs anyway and worse, starts her down the road of lying from the get go. Moreover taking her high dollar fib and then putting the hotel factor into the convo continues to make it a negotiation. You don't want that. What you want to do is strictly side step the $ topic and never give a definitive ($) answer. If you give her an answer to the $ topic then guess who is in control. It ain't you. Just sayin. They either go the hotel room or they don't. If they do then a few minutes before she leaves put an an envelope with a nice card (I purchase very appropriate cards at a boutique card shop) into her purse. If the SB is worth repeating I put in 200 (a ben franklin and a 100 visa gift card). If she isn't worth repeating or is in a very rural area then a Grant and a 100 visa card. If she ghosts me after that then so be it. But she is a fool if she does bc I always make sure they have a good time. BTW as far as her story about meeting at the guy's house, she is either lying or IMHO the SD is a damn fool.[/QUOTE]I do sometimes ask (usually in an indirect way) about their previous experiences in the bowl, partially because I'd just like to see what she says. I don't expect honest answers, most females are elusive and downplay all past sexual experiences anyway (she might for instance say she was in a platonic arrangement when it was really much more than that). When I do this, its usually only because I want to lay the groundwork to talk about my own expectations (again nothing involving numbers). The expectations I want to let her know about often relate to my travel schedule, to make sure she understands that both of our time is valuable, and to be sure she won't engage in flaky behavior and then not show up after we have a date.

Sometimes they do take this as some sort of request for prior gift amounts and use it as an opportunity to tell me what their previous SD gave them or did for them, which in most cases I automatically assume is exaggerated, but above all I do not respond to the number aspect of what she says. Sometimes they push to ask about that, sometimes they don't. The ones that push about gift amount (either what I give them or how much I've gifted in the past) are not invited to a M&G with me, so the problem corrects itself soon enough.

As an example of how my question about past SDs can head down the number road yet still be fully workable, I once met a very nice, early 30's MILF with a good job and strong sex drive. When I asked her about prior SDs, she said her prior SD was a married guy that she spent about one weekend a month with and he would give her $500 on the last morning of the visit. I was thinking to myself that was very reasonable considering getting full use of her body for a whole weekend! But I didn't react to the amount or even acknowledge it, and it wasn't long after throwing the $500 number out there that she basically clarified that this was just what he liked to do, and that she wasn't saying she necessarily expected same amount or arrangement from me because she wasn't just in it solely for the money. So it can work both ways.

I just use whatever conversational tactics make sense for the particular situation to determine if she's going to be a PITA or GPS girl, or the type that will make daddy happy.

[QUOTE=LoVecchio;3387027]This is an area in which I have a hard time adhering to what I acknowledge is sound advice. So, if she raises the issue at the M&G, I usually give a number. I figure that if I don't, there are two possibilities: 1) she declines to go forward in the absence of a commitment about the amount; or 2) she goes forward but then has to be worrying the whole time during the date if she is going to get stiffed (the wrong way). I actually worry more about number 2 than about number 1. There are enough sketchy guys on the site that a woman has to be wondering what the ultimate outcome is going to be. I think I give off pretty trustworthy vibes, but a wise SB is going to know that the most successful con men (not to mention people like Ted Bundy) do also.[/QUOTE]Your pretty well on point with this. At the end of the m / g if we both want to go further then we discuss the arrangement. Every person has self worth and if they feel that they had a say in the process then that's one less thing to be worried about and makes for a much more enjoyable time for both. This giving what the guy deems she is worth at the end of the fc usually turns out to leave a bad experience for the sb. Lots of predators play these girls giving them nothing to robbing them and moving on to the next without seeing them. Girls who have never done this before are easy prey thinking that they are going to be mutually benifited at the end of the fc and receive little or nothing. At the end of the m / g if their expectations are to much I just simply reply that I will consider it. Then the ball is in her court, she can try to negotiate or hold firm. At the end however it goes she had a say in the process and is a happy camper and so am I. If one is trying to do better than escorts why short change a girl. No escort allows you to decide afterwards what she is worth so this tactic is just taking advantage of a girl IMHO.

Anyone have an intel on this SB in Richmond?

[URL]https://www.seekingarrangement.com/member/60c75684-83c6-4d1a-b964-1a429e4bad81[/URL]

I am looking at a huge # of POTs these days because I am on a hall pass, and I think I am beginning to develop a sense about which are submissive from their looks. Does anyone else have a sense about this? Here is a profile that I think has 'the look'.

[URL]https://www.seekingarrangement.com/member/c0fea8e6-e101-4e28-bdb0-7a644ae627e8[/URL]

Some are bold about saying it in their profiles, but many aren't. How about those who say they are shy?

When I can't get a response out of a girl initially, I have followup messages I use, and the one that most often gets a reply is about how they are naughty and asking if they want to be directed. Truly it is my go-to strategy to get a specific girl. I did this w / a girl today who really showed no hint in the profile of being submissive, but came right back saying that she was but she wasn't able to find a man on SA who would be dominant. Obviously, she didn't try very hard.

I am debating w / myself about what to do w / a girl I stumbled upon. She's 20, a fat asian. Her profile is all about being taught, and in messaging she has admitted she is a virgin, in fact never kissed anyone. I pretty much believe this. I am debating w / myself whether I want to go to the trouble. She would be had for little to no sugar, but her skills are questionable, and no visual benefits.

I couldn't do it. Enthusiasm and attitude are important, but looks and skills are deal breakers. I don't judge, so report back and let us know how it goes.

[QUOTE=FarFarAway;3389808]I am debating w / myself about what to do w / a girl I stumbled upon. She's 20, a fat asian. Her profile is all about being taught, and in messaging she has admitted she is a virgin, in fact never kissed anyone. I pretty much believe this. I am debating w / myself whether I want to go to the trouble. She would be had for little to no sugar, but her skills are questionable, and no visual benefits.[/QUOTE]

I also like submissive women. Some straight out express an interest in being submissive, dominant men, bdsm or ddlg. Other clues are saying they are shy and want to be taught or expressing an interest a confident man who likes to be in control. I've also found a high percentage of women that wear chokers in their pics are also submissive.

I say I am naturally dominant in my profile and I get women ask about that when they message me. LOL.

I'm curious what others have noticed.

[QUOTE=FarFarAway;3388741]I am looking at a huge # of POTs these days because I am on a hall pass, and I think I am beginning to develop a sense about which are submissive from their looks. Does anyone else have a sense about this? Here is a profile that I think has 'the look'.

[URL]https://www.seekingarrangement.com/member/c0fea8e6-e101-4e28-bdb0-7a644ae627e8[/URL]

Some are bold about saying it in their profiles, but many aren't. How about those who say they are shy?

When I can't get a response out of a girl initially, I have followup messages I use, and the one that most often gets a reply is about how they are naughty and asking if they want to be directed. Truly it is my go-to strategy to get a specific girl. I did this w / a girl today who really showed no hint in the profile of being submissive, but came right back saying that she was but she wasn't able to find a man on SA who would be dominant. Obviously, she didn't try very hard.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Madaboutmax;3390893]I also like submissive women. Some straight out express an interest in being submissive, dominant men, bdsm or ddlg. Other clues are saying they are shy and want to be taught or expressing an interest a confident man who likes to be in control. I've also found a high percentage of women that wear chokers in their pics are also submissive.

I say I am naturally dominant in my profile and I get women ask about that when they message me. LOL.

I'm curious what others have noticed.[/QUOTE]Well, I didn't say I liked them, particularly, but after a year I've found I can't play in the bowl without being aware of this particular kink. Someone listed 'little girl' as her occupation, and when I asked her at the M&G if she was submissive, she said she wasn't getting many contacts, and her GF offered to 'fix' her profile so she'd get some more. And that's where it came from.

Of course, those discussing 'teaching', etc., are candidates. I hadn't keyed into the choker thing. Certainly I've seen some pix that include leather chokers and I figured they were kinky, but there are quite a few profiles where the girls have these chokers that look like they are a necklace or ribbon or something similar. Do you include that in your evaluation?

Below is a report I posted on the Louisville board. One or two other guys are using this too with some success. So I thought I would share the sotory on this board and offer us some options for wasting the scammers time. Hope you enjoy!

Coolcold scammer.

Text for a bit. Setup a meet. Ohh wait. Can you please send money so I can get someone to watch my mom while we meet. Blahh. Blahh. Sure babe. Is $300 enough. Oh yeah that should take care of it. Ok. Ill get that to you. Ahahhahaahha. Have you sent it yet. Oh yeah. What you have not gotten it. Nooo /. Well here is the tracking (fake number). They say that is not a tracking numer. Hello. You there. Hello. Ahahhahahha. They went to walmart and wasted their time. I love this!

[URL]https://www.seekingarrangement.com/m...4-5588b213d8c2[/URL]

[QUOTE=Madaboutmax;3390893]I also like submissive women. Some straight out express an interest in being submissive, dominant men, bdsm or ddlg. Other clues are saying they are shy and want to be taught or expressing an interest a confident man who likes to be in control. I've also found a high percentage of women that wear chokers in their pics are also submissive.

I say I am naturally dominant in my profile and I get women ask about that when they message me. LOL.

I'm curious what others have noticed.[/QUOTE]I just came across another term. Alpha male. I pretty much figure someone looking for that is submissive.

One other point though. I had my current SB, a 30 YO smart foreign fitness model, tell me at the M&G she was very, very submissive. We've been together a month w / several FC trips, and while I do a lot of verbal stuff and have been sometimes aggressive (tossed her around the bed a little, pulled on her hair at times), I haven't really thought of her as all that far out of the norm. Anyone else find these girls say they are submissive but it's only in their minds?

[QUOTE=LikeMike1963;3391683]Below is a report I posted on the Louisville board. One or two other guys are using this too with some success. So I thought I would share the sotory on this board and offer us some options for wasting the scammers time. Hope you enjoy!

Coolcold scammer.

Text for a bit. Setup a meet. Ohh wait. Can you please send money so I can get someone to watch my mom while we meet. Blahh. Blahh. Sure babe. Is $300 enough. Oh yeah that should take care of it. Ok. Ill get that to you. Ahahhahaahha. Have you sent it yet. Oh yeah. What you have not gotten it. Nooo /. Well here is the tracking (fake number). They say that is not a tracking numer. Hello. You there. Hello. Ahahhahahha. They went to walmart and wasted their time. I love this!

[URL]https://www.seekingarrangement.com/m...4-5588b213d8c2[/URL][/QUOTE]So, why is this only wasting their time? How about yours? It is also against the site terms of service to solicit $ for sex or offer commercial services, so you can just report her.

So, why is this only wasting their time? How about yours? It is also against the site terms of service to solicit $ for sex or offer commercial services, so you can just report her. So, why is this only wasting their time? How about yours? It is also against the site terms of service to solicit $ for sex or offer commercial services, so you can just report her.

I do report them. I have yet to see SA take one down for being reported. At least that I can tell. And in the beginning it is wasting my time. But when I turn the tables I am not wasting my time. I am having a level of entertainment by wasting theirs!

Quote Originally Posted by LikeMike1963.

Below is a report I posted on the Louisville board. One or two other guys are using this too with some success. So I thought I would share the sotory on this board and offer us some options for wasting the scammers time. Hope you enjoy!

Coolcold scammer.

Text for a bit. Setup a meet. Ohh wait. Can you please send money so I can get someone to watch my mom while we meet. Blahh. Blahh. Sure babe. Is $300 enough. Oh yeah that should take care of it. Ok. Ill get that to you. Ahahhahaahha. Have you sent it yet. Oh yeah. What you have not gotten it. Nooo /. Well here is the tracking (fake number). They say that is not a tracking numer. Hello. You there. Hello. Ahahhahahha. They went to walmart and wasted their time. I love this!

[QUOTE=FarFarAway;3391734]I just came across another term. Alpha male. I pretty much figure someone looking for that is submissive.
[/QUOTE]
It could mean that, and I'm sure it does in many cases, however I have met some women that were the highly independent types that say they want an alpha male, just because they want to be sure they don't meet a man that's less independent than they are. I used to encounter women saying that in their profile a lot in on line civvy dating, and in those cases it wasn't necessarily a sexual request as much as an attempt to weed out the wallflowers, insecure / indecisive guys, or the ones looking for a "mama".

Most of us here in the bowl probably have a hard time imagining what goes through the mind of a guy afflicted with the "mommy kink". I've never heard an SB tell me she met one, but countless strippers tell me about guys that request that kind of role playing behavior in the couch rooms. I try not to judge but it seems weird to me, and I have to think it's rooted in mama issues, same as most SBs have daddy issues. The strippers seem to think its creepy too, but they enjoy telling me the stories and laughing about it. I bet escorts encounter that a lot too.

[QUOTE=FarFarAway;3391737]So, why is this only wasting their time? How about yours? It is also against the site terms of service to solicit $ for sex or offer commercial services, so you can just report her.[/QUOTE]I see you guys are still beating a dead horse. There are plenty of escorts on the site and plenty of mongers that look for that. Again the only way to get them off the site is ignore them. If they get no business then they delete their profile. But guess what, that doesn't happen cause that's what most guys are looking for. Check any of the sb threads that actually review. Most are providing the sa and BP or whatever forum they advertising in link. So the solicitation is here to stay. Oh and its just natural that a brand new girl is going to ask "what's in it for me". Not one guy here would go do a job for a day without asking what they were getting. The come work for me and ill give you what I think your worth wouldn't fly with me either LOL. Time wasters are on both sides so jyst a fact of life. To the people who aren't happy with Sa don't pay the membership fee and go back to your previous methods. The term sb means something different to everyone and sadly alot consider sex workers a sb so don't blame the girls LOL.

This has to some extent been reported on, I believe by BikeRider or F Scott. There is a website / app called hotelsbyday that enables one to book a room, typically between 10 am and 4 pm, at a good rate. When first reported on this board, the main problem was the limited # of hotels that participated. I had a M&G scheduled this morning, and for some reason I just felt that there was potential to take it right to the FC, so I looked at the website, and indeed there was one hotel in my town on the site, and they had their basic room at $90 + tax. I put the app on my phone and off I went. The M&G was everything I hoped, a mid-20's hot blond professional athlete. After the usual flirting and small talk and get down to business talk, we retired to my car for more negotiation / testing. Responding to a request for a kiss, I knew she was a real SB. Discussion moved to 'when' and she said 'we could just get a room'. I agreed and went on the app.

It was clunky in that nothing could be prefilled. You can't set up an account in advance w / all your info and method of payment, at least as I have been able to discern. It took me about 10 minutes on my just OK smartphone to enter everything, and I needed to be careful to protect it from her. I enter a close misspelling of my real name so that I can use my real DL and reloadable prepaid debit card. Unfortunately, it also has my real name, but I have no alternative, since I also have to show my DL at check in. I chose the $10 cheaper room that charged my card immediately, but I had no question the baby was going to be there. The app sent me an email with a confirmation # and instructions just to show the email at checkin. Unfortunately, they swiped the card again as a deposit against 'incidentals', and of course that's going to take several days to be refunded to the card. I need to use it again for FC tomorrow night, so I'll have to put more $ on it. When I checked out, there was no paper receipt, and I haven't seen an email receipt other than the original one.

The good. A reasonable price for a top-notch hotel room. The bad. There is still a risk b / c it involves our IRL identity.

[QUOTE=JohnHandCock;3392076]I see you guys are still beating a dead horse. There are plenty of escorts on the site and plenty of mongers that look for that. Again the only way to get them off the site is ignore them. If they get no business then they delete their profile. But guess what, that doesn't happen cause that's what most guys are looking for. Check any of the sb threads that actually review. Most are providing the sa and BP or whatever forum they advertising in link. So the solicitation is here to stay. Oh and its just natural that a brand new girl is going to ask "what's in it for me". Not one guy here would go do a job for a day without asking what they were getting. The come work for me and ill give you what I think your worth wouldn't fly with me either LOL. Time wasters are on both sides so jyst a fact of life. To the people who aren't happy with Sa don't pay the membership fee and go back to your previous methods. The term sb means something different to everyone and sadly alot consider sex workers a sb so don't blame the girls LOL.[/QUOTE]As are you; if you believe that all human behavior is pre-ordained, indeed there is no point in educating anyone about anything. Some people don't see the connection between reviewing SBs like they review streetwalkers and a threats to the sugar world. It is worth posting here if the number of people who operate that way goes down, even a little.

Just wondering if anyone has the same issues I'm having or maybe it's just me. I've sent messages to a few however they are not premier level so they can't read or respond to my message. This seis me to limit us that pay the monthly payment to who we can contact. Reallly am looking for a young petite Asian and thought I'd found the right match but can't seem to contact her. Just a rant here. Very frustrating.

[QUOTE=Titleist2323;3393221]Just wondering if anyone has the same issues I'm having or maybe it's just me. I've sent messages to a few however they are not premier level so they can't read or respond to my message. This seis me to limit us that pay the monthly payment to who we can contact. Reallly am looking for a young petite Asian and thought I'd found the right match but can't seem to contact her. Just a rant here. Very frustrating.[/QUOTE]There may be technical glitches. I've experienced some recently, though not that one. Sometimes the favorite button doesn't show up, it has been slow, etc. If I were you I would be sure to clear my cache, restart the browser, reboot the computer, etc.

[QUOTE=FarFarAway;3391734]I just came across another term. Alpha male. I pretty much figure someone looking for that is submissive.

One other point though. I had my current SB, a 30 YO smart foreign fitness model, tell me at the M&G she was very, very submissive. We've been together a month w / several FC trips, and while I do a lot of verbal stuff and have been sometimes aggressive (tossed her around the bed a little, pulled on her hair at times), I haven't really thought of her as all that far out of the norm. Anyone else find these girls say they are submissive but it's only in their minds?[/QUOTE]Have you shown up with rope, handcuffs, blindfolds etc? The personal trainer I was seeing talked about submissive sex, but the first few dates were just regular sex. Then, to see if she meant it I blindfolded her when she met me once and shrink wrapped her to a desk top and went after her with a feather and a vibrator for about half an hour. She went nuts. She just sent me a text about coming back to town and asking if I still had my blindfold. After I did that to her she mentioned that she found that guys would just do what she asked them to do when it came to domination so she didn't like to talk about it. She was waiting to see if I would just do it.

I know this has been posted before but I can't remember what page, could someone explain how you guys use pre paid cards anonymously to pay for memberships? Appreciate any info.

[QUOTE=ThatMDguy;3393753]I know this has been posted before but I can't remember what page, could someone explain how you guys use pre paid cards anonymously to pay for memberships? Appreciate any info.[/QUOTE]I'd like to extend this request to all the regular brothers, even if you have posted your prepaid credit anonymity plan details before. If possible, I would like to add a new index post to the FAQ and Highlights thread that contains several posts on this subject. Since there is no way to edit / update individual posts within the index for any length of time after they've been posted, the only reasonable way to do this is for me to make note of individual post number references, and add them after I have a reasonably complete collection of links to posts.

I'm going to create a second post with the official "information gathering" request in a more simplified "survey" format. I'm also going to try to add another frequently recurring topic regarding daytime hotel / FC solutions to the same post. Unfortunately, I don't use anonymous cards or need daytime FC, so I can't contribute directly to the answers here, this is for the benefit of the recurring brothers that ask these questions.

This is to add a new entry to the Highlights / FAQ Index Thread. If these questions apply to you, please take a moment to respond, and feel free to add more information to either question you believe would benefit the FAQ. Even better if you can label your answers according to the numbering below, as it adds value to the indexing post by keeping the posts that they link to in a reasonably consistent format.

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(#1) Prepaid credit cards and handling anonymous website memberships (if applicable to you):

A. Where do you buy yours? (Specific store, card label etc)?

B. How much balance do you typically load onto it?

C. What is the process you use to retain privacy / anonymity?

D. Does it require you to tie the card to a phone, and if so do you use a burner phone?

E. Any other helpful tips or things to be aware of you can add?

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(#2) Daytime Hotel Room solutions or alternative (if applicable to you):

A. If you have an SB you need to take to the FC in the morning or early afternoon, how do you go about it, particularly given the limitation that hotel check-ins are typically late afternoon?

B. Any other helpful tips or creative solutions, aside from a hotel or car date?

[QUOTE=JZLizard;3394311]This is to add a new entry to the Highlights / FAQ Index Thread. If these questions apply to you, please take a moment to respond, and feel free to add more information to either question you believe would benefit the FAQ. Even better if you can label your answers according to the numbering below, as it adds value to the indexing post by keeping the posts that they link to in a reasonably consistent format.

-----------------------------------------------------
(#1) Prepaid credit cards and handling anonymous website memberships (if applicable to you):

A. Where do you buy yours? (Specific store, card label etc)?

B. How much balance do you typically load onto it?

C. What is the process you use to retain privacy / anonymity?

D. Does it require you to tie the card to a phone, and if so do you use a burner phone?

E. Any other helpful tips or things to be aware of you can add?

------------------------------------------------------
(#2) Daytime Hotel Room solutions or alternative (if applicable to you):

A. If you have an SB you need to take to the FC in the morning or early afternoon, how do you go about it, particularly given the limitation that hotel check-ins are typically late afternoon?

B. Any other helpful tips or creative solutions, aside from a hotel or car date?[/QUOTE]Does my post just below on this page - #13903 - do the job for #2?