"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

So in the never ending quest to control the significant costs of this wonderful hobby. I noticed that the cost of a three pack of condoms at the local CVS / Walgreens is an exhorbitant $7. 80. Never really paid much attention to this because it was a small amount. But I started to do the math and it was costing me around $60. 00 per month just for these convenient 3 packs of rubbers! Too much I say. Hell I could get a vasectomy for the cost of 9 months of condoms. So I noticed that at Walmart they are less than half the cost for the same item. But even better I was the large forty pack. It was only an astounding $10. 00 at Walmart! Hell it would take me about two months to go through that many. This really adds up.

Anyway it got me thinking of how much money I am saving vs when I first started. It is significant. And I am getting at least three times as much pussy as before. Check out this comparison between my first SB and today. 10 months later.

First SB:

Sugar: 400.

Hotel: 95. 00 (she liked expensive restaurants and she drank a lot)

Meal / Drinks: 85.

Condoms: 7. 70.

Total: 587. 70.

Major hassle always something coming up or drama or hitting me up for more money which I never gave her. She was gorgeous but not ATF material.

Current SB's:

Sugar: 150.

Hotel: 0.

Meal / Drinks: Sometimes 25 (sometimes nothing)

Condoms: 1. 20.

Total: 176. 20.

Freedom from hassle: Priceless!

Damn that is a big difference. I would have never imagined this at the beginning. Pays to really understand what your expenses are.

Revvo

I usually don't update on POTS. Its like at work when an agency tells me they are going to have something awesome in a week or two. Great. Tell me then. I only care about the here and now. But I get it. So here goes.

Sad to say I am going to have to break up with my 19 year old little princess. It's been six months and the sex just isn't what I was hoping for. So instead of just telling her goodbye and leaving her clueless (my usual m. o.). I tried to talk to her about it. It wasn't a mistake but its not going to change anything. The spontaneity just isn't there. Or the skills.

Its sad because she is such a looker. There are very few non GPS girls in her league. A few amazing romps in 6 months just doesn't cut it. I"ll try to see her once or twice a month, but I doubt that will work after finding her replacement. At this point she is a 10/10/8/6

POT 1. An 18 year old latina beauty school student. Works part time doing hair. We are having lunch tomorrow just to lay eyes on each other. Maybe a 7/8/8/?. She dropped off the site after a week. Not dating anyone.

POT 2. A 27 year old AA beauty. Spinner body. Full time job and goes to school at night for her B. A. Maybe a 9/9/9/?. She dropped off the site after 3 days. No meeting set up. Just trying to warm her up. Not dating anyone,

POT 3. A 20 year old mixed AA / white bi spinner and her dark spinner AA GF that I did a M&G with a year ago. I went to see them ostensibly to hit the FC at their place. I got there and they said we had to get a room. I declined as the total damage would have been $$$ and set up a meeting for later in the week. A week later the mixed one calls me and says she wants to fuck me right now. I just came back home from doin my SB at the time and declined again. That failed as the mixed one suddenly moved back to N California for health reasons. I sent her a $ because I felt sorry for her and then lost touch with her. Suddenly she pops up today, says she moved back to L. A. And asks me over. I will probably see her Thursday to see if the chemistry is still there. Maybe a 8/8/8/?. She just went back on the site today. She is very adventurous in every way. This might work.

POT 4. A 23 year old petite latina. Been on the site for about 2 weeks. I originally thought she was a UTR girl, but after a lot of txting I see she is just a hopeful but discouraged wannabe SB. Full time job and lives not too close by. Maybe a 7/8/8/?. Not sure of her dating status.

POT 2 seems closest to my ideal in looks and probably skills. So I am slowly getting something going. Still got my 2 regulars. They love me and are not going anywhere except to the FC whenever I want.

Just curious how many of you swordsmen are using Craigslist and having success. I have a couple of ads that work pretty damn well, I don't get dozens of replies unless you count the spam, but I do get quality replies. Testing ad types and wording has taught me a few things.

Tips.

1. Use verbiage that says "I can help" in an ad title that says something along the lines of Bills Suck. By far my most responded to ad.

2. Mentioning that you are looking for a sugar baby will often get your ad flagged.

3. Think outside the box. Casual encounters are full of leeches and SPAM magnets, talent gigs is not.

[QUOTE=WoodSlinger; 1871410]Just curious how many of you swordsmen are using Craigslist and having success. I have a couple of ads that work pretty damn well, I don't get dozens of replies unless you count the spam, but I do get quality replies. Testing ad types and wording has taught me a few things.

Tips.

1. Use verbiage that says "I can help" in an ad title that says something along the lines of Bills Suck. By far my most responded to ad.

2. Mentioning that you are looking for a sugar baby will often get your ad flagged.

3. Think outside the box. Casual encounters are full of leeches and SPAM magnets, talent gigs is not.[/QUOTE]Great advice man. I have been considering using CL but did not know where to start. There seems to be some wild shit on Casual Encounters, W4M. What is Talent Gigs?

How long is your ad? Do you post a pic? Is it of yourself? Do you ask for pics right off? Do you have an offer in your ad? How much are you spending for a visit?

Thanks for the info.

Revvo

I met a current regular with no sugar requirements via CL. Like everything, including the SB sites, it is hit or miss. I have met a couple of pretty good babies on there, and I've met a couple that were "one and done". Typically the pricing is much better with CL babies. No sugar is probably an exception, but I live in a GPS area for SBs and the sugar for CL babies has been in the $100-$150 range. Like Wood, I've had no luck in the casual encounters section so I post in the men looking for women section. I agree the use of the word "help" is, well, helpful. You can do a search for "I can help" or "mutually beneficial" or other terms to get wording others have used. I'm not proud. I will steal good verbiage anytime. Just another source in our never ending search.

[QUOTE=WoodSlinger; 1871410]Just curious how many of you swordsmen are using Craigslist and having success. I have a couple of ads that work pretty damn well, I don't get dozens of replies unless you count the spam, but I do get quality replies. Testing ad types and wording has taught me a few things.

Tips.

1. Use verbiage that says "I can help" in an ad title that says something along the lines of Bills Suck. By far my most responded to ad.

2. Mentioning that you are looking for a sugar baby will often get your ad flagged.

3. Think outside the box. Casual encounters are full of leeches and SPAM magnets, talent gigs is not.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Revvo; 1871477]Great advice man. I have been considering using CL but did not know where to start. There seems to be some wild shit on Casual Encounters, W4M. What is Talent Gigs?

How long is your ad? Do you post a pic? Is it of yourself? Do you ask for pics right off? Do you have an offer in your ad? How much are you spending for a visit?

Thanks for the info.

Revvo[/QUOTE]No pic is posted in the ad, I do not make offers in the ad, I do ask for pics in their response, and to write something in the subject line that the spam bots won't catch. Once we exchange pics and they see I am normal. Negotiations commence if I can find them by their email on facebook. I try to keep costs around $ per visit. Some girls want more and if they are hot enough I have offered up to $200 per session. The session usually lasts 2-3 hours in a mid range hotel.

One girl was quite the adventurous type, kayaking with me into the middle of Clearwater harbor and fucking me bareback, in the water, with jet skis zipping all around the little island we paddled out to.

Talent gigs can be found on the front page of CL, lower right side. Under the jobs section. I use Casual encounters too, but that is a SPAM magnet, count on getting 15 shit replies to every legit response you might get. Ad wording is critical to get them to respond. You will also get the Pros that are posing as a potential suitor.

Good luck out there

Hello fellow adventurers! I've now been casually wading around in your well hunted waters for about a month. I've got one HCB firmly in the SB category and I really like her. She's cute and smart and incredibly normal. I'd give her straight 9s. Thank you all for this encyclopedia of how to get incredibly hot young pussy for next to nothing. This is the best thing ever.

I thought about just sticking to the one girl because she really is quite amazing in every way. Nando 6 maybe, but I don't dare call that out after only one of these relationships. But, long story short, I decided I want some other young pussy. Call me crazy.

So I was texting with this girl who is a student at Indiana U and I thought I'd ask the group how they would negotiate the following situation from here.

Me: So are you still looking to earn some extra money?

Her: Yes! I wondered why you didn't respond! .

Me: No apologies necessary! Let me know when you can be back in town for an evening so we can hang out.

Her: Well actually I don't mind driving up if you don't mind paying.

Me: How much seems fair to just get straight to business? No sense beating around the Bush!

Her: Gas, meeting half way would be great as well. A little something extra guaranteed for the trip though. Its a long way to drive for nothing, I'm sure you understand.

Me: Name what is fair to you. I want you to be all in.

Her: Well it depends on what we do.

Me: I want to fuck you. You are very pretty and very cool. And I want to fuck you.

Her: Mmmm. Well it's 900 for that.

Me: Well there is no way we are even going to get close to that.

Her: I'm sorry.

Me: That is what I am paying per month for a girl who is literally a fashion model. If you have someone doing that for you then hang on to him!

Me: I'm sorry too.

Me: If you change your mind and want a steady $1, 000 a month please don't lose my number!

Her: For how many meets?

Me: Once a week.

Her: That's only 250 a meet no way.

Me: That is what the prettiest girls are asking so I don't know what guys you have met? What arrangements have you had so far?

Her: You're extremely insulting. I'm gorgeous and if you're trying to say otherwise just to talk me down forget it. I really thought you were a nicer guy than that.

Her: And trying to lie and say you're new at this when you've clearly been at it for awhile.

Her: I would do 500 but seriously no less. 300 for no intimacy.

Me: I have met one person and that's it but I've talked to a lot. I'm not tying to insult you and I would never do so. That's not me.

Her: Well just for future reference, you're not going to get very far talking about how much prettier other women are. I've been offered 10, 000 a month when all I did was go to dinner with the guy. I'm really not joking. And the reason I said no was because he was extremely creepy nd made me feel like a piece of meat. And he investigated my personal life and it was freaking me out. So sorry 250 isn't even close and I'm worth a lot more.

Her: Especially when I'd have to drive to Indy all the time.

Me: Ok. I truly did not mean to offend you. I wasn't comparing your looks. I hope you don't have to hang out with some creeps! We are just not on the same page which is sad. Maybe someday we will be!

Her: I'll settle for 450 but this makes me pretty sad.

End.

So, we have here an obvious case of GPS. Side note: which of you pervs informed her (correctly) that she is a piece of meat? Here's the thing. I really want to fuck this girl. She's really hot. How would you negotiate from here?

Having now read almost all of the pages of this subf-orum I have jumped in with both feet. I have had pretty good luck in a short period with three attractive ones, and have a regular SB for the cost of the room and taking care of her minor problems for less than a bill a visit. A couple of the others have been 150 for fun but they are less dependable. But I am finding it really funny that it is the marginal girls that are asking 4-6 benjis and getting bent when you say no way.

They have all had criminal records. But they have all been better than the BP girls hands down and my regular is ahead of my better escort experiences for a lot less money.

Do the experienced hands make an offer first or ask the ladies if they have something in mind? I have been using the later approach but it leads to a long email dance that most disappear in the middle of before I can get them to agree to a meet and greet. I am open to suggestions.

[QUOTE=Nostra3; 1871730]Hello fellow adventurers! I've now been casually wading around in your well hunted waters for about a month. I've got one HCB firmly in the SB category and I really like her. She's cute and smart and incredibly normal. I'd give her straight 9s. Thank you all for this e.

So, we have here an obvious case of GPS. Side note: which of you pervs informed her (correctly) that she is a piece of meat? Here's the thing. I really want to fuck this girl. She's really hot. How would you negotiate from here?[/QUOTE]Agree to 450, pay her 250. If she does not ask for the money before the deed, then just have 250 in 10s in an envelope. If she asks, tell her 1/2 at the beginning and 1/2 at the end. Giver her the 225 upfront and skip out after it is over.

Either way, I would avoid altogether. Sounds like chemistry will be bad. For a trophy fuck, it is better to pay for a well viewed professional.

BT

[QUOTE=BigTigger; 1871774]Agree to 450, pay her 250. If she does not ask for the money before the deed, then just have 250 in 10s in an envelope. If she asks, tell her 1/2 at the beginning and 1/2 at the end. Giver her the 225 upfront and skip out after it is over.

Either way, I would avoid altogether. Sounds like chemistry will be bad. For a trophy fuck, it is better to pay for a well viewed professional.

BT[/QUOTE]Total agreement, there's better for less. Stay the course and fuck a has been, 23 yo porn starlet that will treat you way better. For less.

[QUOTE=BigTigger; 1871774]Agree to 450, pay her 250. If she does not ask for the money before the deed, then just have 250 in 10s in an envelope. If she asks, tell her 1/2 at the beginning and 1/2 at the end. Giver her the 225 upfront and skip out after it is over.

Either way, I would avoid altogether. Sounds like chemistry will be bad. For a trophy fuck, it is better to pay for a well viewed professional.

BT[/QUOTE]I agree that this is a lost cause, and nothing good will come of it. Move on to the next, Nostra. There will be many, many more in your future, and you need to accept that frustration and lost opportunities are part of the game. If you've read the Journal, you know that these babies often throw out a high number just to see what might happen, but it seems to me that your back-and-forth has degraded to the point of non-salvageable. Pull her profile up on your laptop and take care of things yourself, if you catch my drift. It will be waaay cheaper, and just as "personal".

Tigg, I never figured you for a fuck-and-duck kind of guy LOL! Were you just trying to suggest that he teach this baby a lesson?

Be proud,

Scott

[QUOTE=BigTigger; 1871774]Agree to 450, pay her 250. If she does not ask for the money before the deed, then just have 250 in 10s in an envelope. If she asks, tell her 1/2 at the beginning and 1/2 at the end. Giver her the 225 upfront and skip out after it is over.

Either way, I would avoid altogether. Sounds like chemistry will be bad. For a trophy fuck, it is better to pay for a well viewed professional.

BT[/QUOTE]Ducking out could land you in hot water. You do not want a scene if she is a cash counter, and she sounds like she might be an UTR or Pro. If she gets a gander at your license plate you don't need the heat. Offer her your bottom line and put it back on her. She will be gone anyway and I would be shocked if you hear back.

Keep looking.

[QUOTE=FredMoore; 1871815]Offer her your bottom line and put it back on her. I would be shocked if you hear back.

Keep looking.[/QUOTE]I wouldn't contact her again, personally. The Bowl is not about begging, it's about finding a mutual comfort level. If you do bargain her down, she will resent it, and at best just spread her legs and lie there. Sounds a lot like those blow up dolls they sell at porn shops. No thanks.

Second scenario: you enter into a protracted and increasingly bitter text war with her, resulting in No Pussy Access anyway, but you have just wasted time in your life that you will never get back, and which could have been better spent wooing the next SB in line. Move on, my man, and consider it your first lesson. It won't be your last, I promise you. I see this as a lose / lose scenario, honestly. We have all been there, but the goal of the Journal is to help newbies get up to speed faster. Well, and also to relate some excellent stories.

Speaking of which, I had a very interesting experience at my bikram yoga class this morning, which I would love to relate, but don't have quite enough time before my SO docks to fully craft. Here are some hints: hot Asian spinner teacher in a sweat-soaked shortie unitard, looking at a fully-extended Scottie in bike shorts, then into my eyes and smiling. My head is swimming, but I don't know if I have the balls to pull it off. My real name is in their computer, but good heavens she is hot. And talk about flexible!

Close to the red line,

Scott

[QUOTE=Nostra3;1871730]So, we have here an obvious case of GPS. Side note: which of you pervs informed her (correctly) that she is a piece of meat? Here's the thing. I really want to fuck this girl. She's really hot. How would you negotiate from here?[/QUOTE]Have you actually met this girl? I wouldn't want to commit to much of anything (maybe gas money or lunch) without seeing who I'm dealing with. Let's say you meet and she's as hot as you think, but is a cold fish. Now you've wasted 450, the hotel and all your time. Meeting isn't foolproof, but you can tell if there is some sort of chemistry.

[QUOTE=Nostra3;1871730]So, we have here an obvious case of GPS. Side note: which of you pervs informed her (correctly) that she is a piece of meat? Here's the thing. I really want to fuck this girl. She's really hot. How would you negotiate from here?[/QUOTE]I wouldn't. Waste of time