"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

Funny, situation I was in, I didn't want any part of the mother daughter thing, just didn't feel right. Your situation, same place, the excitement. Oh yeah, that sounded like fun! What a memory!

[QUOTE=PassinHoes;2896521]I actually banged a mom and daughter a few years ago from tagged. Hopped on, met e daughter was fucking within the hour. Left her, still hungry. Hopped back on tag and found a hot older woman. While flirting and browsing her profile I noticed a pic of her daughter I had recently fucked. Got her number anyway. Ended up going to the exact same apartment the daughter was at. It was about midnight at this point. Went straight to mom's room and ***** her out. Snuck out hastily before morning as to not alert the daughter. I still don't think they know about each other. Got the mom again about 5 months ago.[/QUOTE]

A first for me having a 22 yo VCU SB end up as a UTR. We are at our M&G dinner at a steakhouse. Things are going great with both of us laughing and would not have a clue that we just met. While waiting for the check, she starts rubbing my leg with her foot and saying she wasn't in a hurry to get back to studying for exams. I winked at her and said there a hotel across the street. She said let's go!

No mention of money beforehand so I am thinking I'm finally going to get some sugar for just the cost of dinner. So we get in the elevator and she's already kissing me. Once in the room it's clothes flying off and we end up on the bed all wrapped in each others arms and kissing like crazy. After a few minutes we end up with her on top of me rubbing her shaved kitty on my shaft. She leans in close and whispers in my ear that it is $ for a BJ and $$ for a fuck. Of course by now my little head is in full control and I say fuck. She rolls off me and grabs her purse. Out comes the condom and some lube. Then she proceeded to ride me. I think she was thinking that being an old guy and she being so young that I would pop quick. But I made her work for it and she was getting real tired when I finally shot my load.

Anyway, it was a nice evening and she sure knew how to play me. We will meet up again next week when I plan to sample her full menu. Willing to share her info with other senior members who have college cuties to trade info on in the Richmond / Charlottesville area.

[QUOTE=ToeLover57;2899625]No mention of money beforehand so I am thinking I'm finally going to get some sugar for just the cost of dinner. [/QUOTE]Ah hem.

[QUOTE=ToeLover57;2899625]Anyway, it was a nice evening and she sure knew how to play me. We will meet up again next week when I plan to sample her full menu. [/QUOTE]I am just curious why you would see her again if she knows how to play you? Is there a risk she plays the same game and in mid stroke ups the ante? Aren't you afraid you are setting yourself up to be rinsed by her and others?

[QUOTE=CephlapodLove;2899865]Ah hem.

I am just curious why you would see her again if she knows how to play you? Is there a risk she plays the same game and in mid stroke ups the ante? Aren't you afraid you are setting yourself up to be rinsed by her and others?[/QUOTE]I still liked her better than what I have been seeing on BP for more money. And she is a better dinner date than most SB's I have seen.

[QUOTE=ToeLover57;2899625]A first for me having a 22 yo VCU SB end up as a UTR. We are at our M&G dinner at a steakhouse. Things are going great with both of us laughing and would not have a clue that we just met. While waiting for the check, she starts rubbing my leg with her foot and saying she wasn't in a hurry to get back to studying for exams. I winked at her and said there a hotel across the street. She said let's go!

No mention of money beforehand so I am thinking I'm finally going to get some sugar for just the cost of dinner. So we get in the elevator and she's already kissing me. Once in the room it's clothes flying off and we end up on the bed all wrapped in each others arms and kissing like crazy. After a few minutes we end up with her on top of me rubbing her shaved kitty on my shaft. She leans in close and whispers in my ear that it is $ for a BJ and $$ for a fuck. Of course by now my little head is in full control and I say fuck. She rolls off me and grabs her purse. Out comes the condom and some lube. Then she proceeded to ride me. I think she was thinking that being an old guy and she being so young that I would pop quick. But I made her work for it and she was getting real tired when I finally shot my load.

Anyway, it was a nice evening and she sure knew how to play me. We will meet up again next week when I plan to sample her full menu. Willing to share her info with other senior members who have college cuties to trade info on in the Richmond / Charlottesville area.[/QUOTE]I'll update this report by saying I was surprised how well she came across as the innocent college student in our messages beforehand. Most don't spend much time messaging first.

[QUOTE=ToeLover57;2900975]I'll update this report by saying I was surprised how well she came across as the innocent college student in our messages beforehand. Most don't spend much time messaging first.[/QUOTE]Most are utr. If they have more than one daddy they are utr. A lot get straight to the point because they have been screwed over but the smart ones play the innocent card. Great selling tool and usually brings higher bucks.

[QUOTE=PassinHoes;2896521]I actually banged a mom and daughter a few years ago from tagged.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=ArcherSterling;2894014] I have found a 20-year-old SB and her 41-year-old mom -- who is actually hotter thanks to some bolt ons but to be fair has a prettier face -- both on seeking arrangement.How wild would it have been to bang a mom and daughter on the same day, six hours apart?[/QUOTE]You both are living my dream life.

[QUOTE=ArcherSterling;2894026]For hotels, a couple of options have worked for me.I own my own business, so I will book a hotel room on Hotel.com if the wife ever came to the office and saw my business credit card statements I would just say it's for one of my employees elsewhere in the US since [URL]hotels.com[/URL] doesn't show the specific location on the transaction.

I don't worry so much about showing my I'd. The bigger risk, if any, is in running into someone I know in the hotel lobby might be there for a meeting or conference are visiting a friend who's in from out-of-town. I will than a much much much smaller market than Charlotte so this is a real possibility so I have to be sure to pick discreetly located hotels were no one will see my car in the parking lot. The hotel across from Sam's Club is perfect for this so I can park in the Sam's lot and walk over.

Depending on your SB, and the younger they are the less they seem to care about their anonymity, is you book the hotel and their name. The only catch here, is even if you prepay the room on [URL]hotels.com[/URL], they usually ask for a credit card or debit card at check in to cover any quote incidental charges" this is less of a problem in the mid to lower scale properties that don't have room service or other things that end up on your room account, and they are set up to deal with the lower end of the economic scale and just block long distance calls pay-per-view and other billable items in your room.

My favorite is to play on pm am Double-header. Book the room after lunch, fuck for a few hours, and she can either go home and meet you again the next morning for another Fuck fest or you can line up a warning event with the second girl. Meet at nine you can usually get a check out at noon, bada bing, bad a boom, two rounds of fun for the price of one-at least on the hotel side. I have had some stay over and see them the next morning, but I make the two rounds and all-inclusive price for her tuition assistance grant. If I really like them or think they are worth the expenditure, I'll put them in a nicer hotel in a more happening part of town, and give them 50 bucks to go out and have dinner since I can't be with them.

Hope that helps.[/QUOTE]Those are good advice to take, if your booking hotels to do the deed with any SP.

Haven't had a FC with my LTR SB in some time. We linked up recently after she came over from a night clubbing. She was more explicit than ever before and porn star quality. It was the best sex I ever had and she was doing just about everything. I had no idea she had this type of performance in her. She was vocal and saying stuff like "this pussy is yours, no one else's", etc. You get the picture. The session left me mind-boggled. Was she holding back all the times before? Was it because she felt I was drifting away? I'm not sure, but she's been distant after the session and it left me wanted MORE.

I have no idea if she's back playing the field and learnt some new thing from one of the Bros. Or what. Anyways, she's leaving for a few months for a summer school program. She made no requests for sugar and I don't know if she's ready to move back in as the SB / SO / GFE role. I've been trying to replace her, but SA hasn't been too fruitful as far as inventory. I'm stuck at this point.

She left most of her clothes and belongings at my place, same as before we had a falling out. The main reason for our break-up was she spent far too much time with her peer group. While we were living together she had a habit of disappearing. She'd claim she would be staying at a girlfriends. We haven't seen much of each other because she claimed she needed space and living together with my "rules" was too much for her. She hasn't had access to my sugar and I don't know how she's dealing with bills.

I'm always hands-off with my SBs. I don't call or text them too often. I do this to not seem needy. I think I fell for her, especially after a round of renewing my SA and not finding the same 10/10/10 quality out there. This girl gave me the emotional, sexual connection I needed. The complete package and everything I wanted out a SB. I'm wondering if she found a better SB or if she's changed her mind about our SB / SD as an exclusive SO arrangement. I'm only hopeful that she'll come back around for the fall semester.

Any suggestions to fix this drought I'm in?

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2895702]I'm guilty of this too: looking at some of these young, firm students and wondering if my cock even deserves such tight, un-indoctrined to the rest of the world, pussy.

Don't underestimate the value of your own maturity as an aphrodisiac to them. Every now and then I put these SBs to the test as to why they should have a genuine interest in me beyond financial aspects, because they are young and hot and have so many pursuers.

Sometimes they send me actual screenshots of the shit these 18-22 year old dudes send them on their phones, or maybe they cut and paste their email (be careful of that if you ever use your real name by the way). And while I'm sure I'm sure they get some "good" messages they don't care to share, most of the time they are using this as evidence as to why they want to date someone up to their standard. Believe me if you saw the ridiculous attempts at getting pussy the average under 35 year old guy writes (and believe me I see a lot, they send me the transcripts) you would probably feel a lot better about your own intellect. Then there is facebook. What an incredible tool for the average SD. Some of these girls have these boyfriends or ex boyfriends that look like I could pick them up with one hand and shake them like a baby, but not the kind of baby I want. Some of these little twerps have more tattoo ink on their fucking bodies than dudes born in the 60's or prior have horny blood in their veins. No competition.

So just remember that as a mature SD you have a significant advantage when it comes to maturity and playing upon their psychology.[/QUOTE]Its easy to forget the plus you have as an SD. These girls are scrambling to pay cellphone bills and pocket money for a decent lifestyle. I did some PI work on my LTR and discovered info on her ex-boyfriend. He's a decent chap and excelled academically. He can't offer her the type of lifestyle I made her accustomed to. I didn't do anything phenomenal, but I offered her housing in a luxury condo, access to luxury cars she wouldn't drive otherwise. With me she also knew that I'd cover a shopping trip on the mall and money for her regular upkeep. It wasn't a lot out of pocket compared to a pay-per-date situation. Her dating other guys in her social circle may give her more social relatablility to her age group. Because of the age difference we're out of touch about music and social media accounts like Instagram and Facebook posts. The benefit I brought was safety and security. With me she wasn't worried about her cellphone being cut off. She knew she was good for food, dining out and pocket cash. I can't say the sex is better. My erections at late 30's aren't like when I was in my 20's and could go round after round. I take it as a plus that she could have sex in a proper bed, a guy with no roommates or competing 20 something girlfriends.

There was no drama in the relationship. Perhaps a routine with a SD can get dull. I can't gauge if her normal boyfriend types were better or not. I can only judge by her actions. She'd occasionally go dark. I don't know if she was seeing other guys. I have no proof. I only caught her being distant and chatty on her phone. It didn't bother me enough to want to see her text messages or try to crack her email accounts. 20 somethings operate in mystery. I can say that it added some excite be about the unknown. I can only attest to the younger SBs being more fun than women my age. I don't believe I can ever go back to dating my age. These girls bring firm bodies, great sex to the table. The psychological game of if she's trying to fleece me for my cash sucks. Overall, the experience seems worth the gamble.

I probably should be more confident in what I bring to the table. Women in general go off emotion. They use no logic or reasoning in how they go about things. One would think they'd be more submissive to an SD. These girls are wild and can't be tamed. There's nothing you can really do about. It's better to just be in the moment and enjoy the joy and fun they bring. It took some learning, but I no longer question there whereabouts and if they are really being exclusive. Doing that comes off as insecure and the last thing you want is to come off as needy. Once seen as needy or dependent on them, it's all downhill. Several lessons learned from my time in The Bowl.

A follow-up to my adventure with Mary. After a week, she overcame her moral qualms and we got lost in the Funhouse for another month until just a few days ago when she asked for extra money and I said I could not and she abruptly ended the relationship. Despite having often expressed admiration for me and enthusiasm for our meetings she suddenly became cold and told me to leave her alone. It was not the first time she had asked for extra money. She was very needy and demanding. All in all, I was spending over $1200 per month on her, which I can sustain for a few months but not indefinitely on my income. One advice I can offer to the forum is to have a budget and stick to it, even if that means you cannot afford a sugar baby. Now that looks like the case for me, at least not an exclusive hot 19 year old SB. Maybe a non-exclusive late-20's single mom would be more appreciative of my limited offer.

Also, it's important to guard your emotions. I don't feel too bad now because she was very cold in the end, and due to the fact that I'm relieved to get back to saving money for awhile. By August I should be back, financially, to where I was in January. Mary had several personal problems, some severe, which I won't go into here. But I think that quite a few SBs have problematic backgrounds and its something to keep in mind and be sympathetic to.

[QUOTE=Snake27;2846920]I've been out of the "monger" game for a few years now, but I've often been tempted by the rise of the sugarbaby (SB) online world. I had a few (3) SB relationships via the bar scene years ago, and almost feel like I "invented" the concept. Based on the reports here, it seems so much easier and efficient online.

I made a profile on SD4 M, it seemed to be less overhead than SA, though I've heard that SA is more of a college crowd which would be better for me. I may try SA later. My profile pic was a software blend of my face and another guy's face. I texted or emailed about 20 girls in the area, met three from the site, and had one SB relationship lasting two months, which ended strangely. Let's call her Mary. She was 19 and told me I was her third sexual partner.

It was nice while it lasted. A true GFE: kissing, friendship, wet pussy, orgasms, etc. She was intelligent, which I liked. Mary's SD4 M profile went unused during the time I knew her. The other SB prospects I met seemed to be professional SB, as they remained active online during the time I was on the site. Mary said she wanted to be monogamous with her SD. At my age (early 50's) it was amazing to find an attractive 19 yo who responded to me like that. I'm pretty sure it was real.

After two months, Mary called it off, citing moral qualms about taking money from my family. She was also unhappy with how much I paid her (200/ visit / week). But after breaking up, a remarkable sequence of events occurred. I was contacted by a friend in her dormitory, also a cute college freshman, who said my offer was adequate and she thought I was handsome. I was tempted, but it just seemed too weird for me, so I passed. Within a few days this led to more strange events: Mary trying to get back with me, her dorm friend sending angry messages (thank goodness for anonymous phone / email) and finally Mary giving up again.

I'd like to have one SB who is at least semi-normal and remain with her for a long time, but without getting too serious and as long as she accepts my budget. I think I'll try again.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=JohnHandCock;2901038]Most are utr. If they have more than one daddy they are utr. A lot get straight to the point because they have been screwed over but the smart ones play the innocent card. Great selling tool and usually brings higher bucks.[/QUOTE]Been doing more detective work than I should. I found a receipt in her luggage for some high-priced Louis Bouton (*sp) shoes. They cost about $1,000. The guy sent them to her college apartment address. I did some intel on the guy's name. He's married, late 50's, a COO position and is local to the area where me and my LTR SB / SO live. I thought about contacting him and having a man-to-man talk about the extent of their relationship. I'm glad I refrained from doing so. The guys doesn't seem like competition to me. I can't imagine a guy spending that type of cash with no sex though. I never confronted her about it. The receipt was around the time we started getting serious "exclusive". I don't know if she's in contact with the guy still or not. Since she doesn't flaunt or wear gifts other than the stuff I bought her I assume it was something from her past.

She's never asked me for expensive gifts straight up. She's hinted only. I figure because I'm late 30's and because I've met a couple of her girlfriends that she's probably more genuine in our SB / SD / SO status. There was one time that I was entertaining her and a GF at my place. The GF's date came up to my place to meet her friend. The guy was late 50's, married and was into the girlfriend. It was obvious that it was a SB / SD situation. It appears her GF probably has a SB profile up. My SB never introduced me as a SD, because I'm still pretty youthful we fly under the radar. I think she actually likes that aspect of our relationship. She wanted me to meet her parents a few times, which makes me think that she saw me more of a "rich" boyfriend type.

Anyways, she's been distant. I think it's because I started questioning her about when she's missing for a few days out of the week. Her response is that she needs time away to hang with friends. Basically, she's saying I'm the first guy she's lived with and the commitment is more than what she's ready for. I take it she's confused. She's hinted at marriage and a kid. In my mind, she's calculating the student loan debt she'll have after school. The security and support I offer vs what she could find if she dated her age and gambling on finding a better deal somewhere else. She's early 20's, body still firm and may think she's got better options. My doubt comes in when I think if I we just and old guy that she's stringing along to give her some perks while she's in grad school. I've come to realize that the cost of college is expensive. For some SB / SD is a job for them. Maybe she's just playing the game to make sure her expenses are covered. Realistically, I'll never really know if this is just a job for her or not.

[QUOTE=ToeLover57;2899625]A first for me having a 22 yo VCU SB end up as a UTR. We are at our M&G dinner at a steakhouse. Things are going great with both of us laughing and would not have a clue that we just met. While waiting for the check, she starts rubbing my leg with her foot and saying she wasn't in a hurry to get back to studying for exams. I winked at her and said there a hotel across the street. She said let's go!

No mention of money beforehand so I am thinking I'm finally going to get some sugar for just the cost of dinner. So we get in the elevator and she's already kissing me. Once in the room it's clothes flying off and we end up on the bed all wrapped in each others arms and kissing like crazy. After a few minutes we end up with her on top of me rubbing her shaved kitty on my shaft. She leans in close and whispers in my ear that it is $ for a BJ and $$ for a fuck. Of course by now my little head is in full control and I say fuck. She rolls off me and grabs her purse. Out comes the condom and some lube. Then she proceeded to ride me. I think she was thinking that being an old guy and she being so young that I would pop quick. But I made her work for it and she was getting real tired when I finally shot my load.

Anyway, it was a nice evening and she sure knew how to play me. We will meet up again next week when I plan to sample her full menu. Willing to share her info with other senior members who have college cuties to trade info on in the Richmond / Charlottesville area.[/QUOTE]Sounds like a good deal. She was straight-forward so you know what you're getting into. In my experience, the SBs never come off like that. I reject the ones that her focused on a set sugar amount. I only had one SB that was upfront about pricing. I met her at her college library. She was definitely a student. When I pressed about the FC, she explained she only makes out and offers "massages" for a set price. I didn't pursue it further because there's too many SBs that are happy with $ or $$ after a date and then the FC. Better to know its UTR than playing the innocent SB, getting emotion involved and not knowing what she's really after. I think most college SBs are driven by fantasy and movies. The reality of their expenses set in and the clumsily chart their way into "arrangements". I suppose that after a few M&Gs with bad POT SDs they adjust their strategy. In my case, I come off as more of a boyfriend type, so my experiences are more GFE and minimal sugar. I suspect because I don't press for FC and be because I don't need to sneak around in hotels that their behavior is more in line with normal dating. For all I know I could be converting UTRs to mask as GFE.

[QUOTE=HoyaSvnFgr;2904671]Been doing more detective work than I should. I found a receipt in her luggage for some high-priced Louis Bouton (*sp) shoes. They cost about $1,000. The guy sent them to her college apartment address. I did some intel on the guy's name. He's married, late 50's, a COO position and is local to the area where me and my LTR SB / SO live. I thought about contacting him and having a man-to-man talk about the extent of their relationship. I'm glad I refrained from doing so. The guys doesn't seem like competition to me. I can't imagine a guy spending that type of cash with no sex though. I never confronted her about it. The receipt was around the time we started getting serious "exclusive". I don't know if she's in contact with the guy still or not. Since she doesn't flaunt or wear gifts other than the stuff I bought her I assume it was something from her past.

She's never asked me for expensive gifts straight up. She's hinted only. I figure because I'm late 30's and because I've met a couple of her girlfriends that she's probably more genuine in our SB / SD / SO status. There was one time that I was entertaining her and a GF at my place. The GF's date came up to my place to meet her friend. The guy was late 50's, married and was into the girlfriend. It was obvious that it was a SB / SD situation. It appears her GF probably has a SB profile up. My SB never introduced me as a SD, because I'm still pretty youthful we fly under the radar. I think she actually likes that aspect of our relationship. She wanted me to meet her parents a few times, which makes me think that she saw me more of a "rich" boyfriend type.

Anyways, she's been distant. I think it's because I started questioning her about when she's missing for a few days out of the week. Her response is that she needs time away to hang with friends. Basically, she's saying I'm the first guy she's lived with and the commitment is more than what she's ready for. I take it she's confused. She's hinted at marriage and a kid. In my mind, she's calculating the student loan debt she'll have after school. The security and support I offer vs what she could find if she dated her age and gambling on finding a better deal somewhere else. She's early 20's, body still firm and may think she's got better options. My doubt comes in when I think if I we just and old guy that she's stringing along to give her some perks while she's in grad school. I've come to realize that the cost of college is expensive. For some SB / SD is a job for them. Maybe she's just playing the game to make sure her expenses are covered. Realistically, I'll never really know if this is just a job for her or not.[/QUOTE]Hoya. I really don't know where to start.

You clearly care for this girl a great deal. This is good in relationships, and bad in the bowl. My advice (not that it is worth anything) is to decide if you want her as your gf or sb. If you want a real relationship with her you, then need to start communicating better with her. If you want her as your SB, then you need to lay down some ground rules and start to detach.

Personally, I'd walk if I were you. You sound very successful (nice condo and luxury cars). You're in your late 30's, and single. That's prime hunting age for the mid to late 20's girls SB or not. Have confidence in yourself that you're attractive to women, and find a couple of replacements for her. You may not find a 10/10/10, but I'd take a lower number with less drama. You're tearing yourself up worrying about her, and ultimately she's replaceable.

[QUOTE=HoyaSvnFgr;2904479]Haven't had a FC with my LTR SB in some time. We linked up recently after she came over from a night clubbing. She was more explicit than ever before and porn star quality. It was the best sex I ever had and she I oh oh oh r 1was doing just about everything. I had no idea she had this type of performance in her. She was vocal and saying stuff like "this pussy is yours, no one else's", etc. You get the picture. The session left me mind-boggled. Was she holding back all the times before? Was it because she felt I was drifting away? I'm not sure, but she's been distant after the session and it left me wanted MORE.

I have no idea if she's back playing the field and learnt some new thing from one of the Bros. Or what. Anyways, she's leaving for a few months for a summer school program. She made no requests for sugar and I don't know if she's ready to move back in as the SB / SO / GFE role. I've been trying to replace her, but SA hasn't been too fruitful as far as inventory. I'm stuck at this point.

She left most of her clothes and belongings at my place, same as before we had a falling out. The main reason for our break-up was she spent far too much time with her peer group. While we were living together she had a habit of disappearing. She'd claim she would be staying at a girlfriends. We haven't seen much of each other because she claimed she needed space and living together with my "rules" was too much for her. She hasn't had access to my sugar and I don't know how she's dealing with bills.

I'm always hands-off with my SBs. I don't call or text them too often. I do this to not seem needy. I think I fell for her, especially after a round of renewing my SA and not finding the same 10/10/10 quality out there. This girl gave me the emotional, sexual connection I needed. The complete package and everything I wanted out a SB. I'm wondering if she found a better SB or if she's changed her mind about our SB / SD as an exclusive SO arrangement. I'm only hopeful that she'll come back around for the fall semester.

Any suggestions to fix this drought I'm in?[/QUOTE]I feel your pain. My read on the girl is that she is driven by sex in the same degree as most of us guys are. Likes the variety and when she wants it she wants it now. We need to accept the fact that some girls are addicted to sex as much as we are. I recently reached out to bi-curious SBs on SA that would be interested in fmf with some bdsm overtones and had a 19 yr old co-ed girl out a 3 page questionnaire on her experiences and desires / interests. Brought it to the m&g with my bi-SB and me. Compared to her sweet and innocent FB page you would say no way. Went to the FC 20 minutes later. Had a great time but now she has gone dark.

My only advice to surviving the emotional roller coaster these 18-25 single no-kid types put us thru is to work towards always having 2 good # 2's. Never have an exclusive # 1.

I can't have a live in because I have a SO but even if I could I wouldn't. But that's because I don't want a gf, I want multiple SBs.

[QUOTE=BikeRider;2905130]Hoya. I really don't know where to start.

You clearly care for this girl a great deal. This is good in relationships, and bad in the bowl. My advice (not that it is worth anything) is to decide if you want her as your gf or sb. If you want a real relationship with her you, then need to start communicating better with her. If you want her as your SB, then you need to lay down some ground rules and start to detach.

Personally, I'd walk if I were you. You sound very successful (nice condo and luxury cars). You're in your late 30's, and single. That's prime hunting age for the mid to late 20's girls SB or not. Have confidence in yourself that you're attractive to women, and find a couple of replacements for her. You may not find a 10/10/10, but I'd take a lower number with less drama. You're tearing yourself up worrying about her, and ultimately she's replaceable.[/QUOTE]Hoya I'd second BikeRider's comments and even take it a step further. If you are late 30's, you're still quite young, and if you have financial success at that point in your life you have a lot of options at your fingertips, many of which are better than the SD sites. When I was in my mid-late 30's I was coming out of a divorce situation, and at the time the idea of compensated companionship didn't appeal to me at all, so I stuck to civy dating. While I did dabble a bit in the bowl (not so much actually providing allowance as much as seeking out the type of girls who want it, and using "dangle the carrot" tactics to my advantage), it was really just a pass time. Back then I was legitimately looking for a partner -- I missed that feeling of something real. I was looking not only for pussy but someone I would want to be around outside the bedroom, and what's more I wanted someone who was into me -- not just a gold digger or a girl that's only happy when she's traveling or shopping. Cheesy as it sounds I wanted someone who laughed at my jokes, enjoyed my company, provided the kind of unconditional loyalty you usually get from a dog... lol. Okay expecting that level of loyalty from a woman is a bit of a stretch, but I got close enough to my goal.

So here I am now, I found her -- my soulmate -- or the closest thing to it. Someone I can potentially see myself with the rest of my life. It doesn't stop me from pursuing strange pussy, I go through varying cycles of remorse and guilt, but for now I have just conceded that my need to fuck new girls occasionally is just bigger than me and not a solvable problem, the only thing I can do is satisfy the craving while being as careful as possible. I guess in a way I am living proof that it is possible to have your cake and eat it too, as long as you are self-disciplined enough to be careful and not get too addicted or carried away. I did the same thing back in the day when I was married, yet she never caught me once (the marriage failed for unrelated reasons).

I guess what I'm saying is that you're young enough that I think you should be taking advantage of all the free pussy available to you, while looking for the partner that you seem to want -- play the field but keep an eye out for a winner. When it comes to quality women, none of them are on the SD websites. Every single one of those girls believes they are entitled to something beyond a traditional relationship and hard work. The very fact they signed up to be an SB in the first place indicates a sense of entitlement or an expectation of sorts that is a minefield in a relationship. Sure, some of them are just sweethearts with daddy issues but those daddy issues come back to haunt you in a real relationship -- any issues they have, if they take the easy way out the issues never get solved.

While its true the 18-20 year olds would be harder to come by if they aren't already sugar-minded, at your age there is a LOT of pussy available that's free and clear of any allowance expectation to a successful guy in his 30's with some game, especially if you look for girls in the late 20's to early 30's bracket. The problem is that once you enter the bowl you are spending time and resources on women who are never going to be good soulmate or wife material, and what's more you're spoiling yourself such that age-appropriate pussy is going to seem unattractive (it shouldn't. The best sex partner I ever had was in her early 30's).

I'm just offering my two cents because you seem to want a partner. I can relate, I'm the same way and if I split from my SO tomorrow I would keep a stable of strippers and SBs ready to satisfy my physical needs but I would look elsewhere for something real. I've just come to accept that my physical and emotional needs are two very different things. The women that satisfy my physical needs can be different individuals than the one who satisfies my emotional needs. In fact in my case, they have to be. I just need to make sure they don't know about each other.

Also just curious because you mentioned diminished erections -- late 30's is too early for that, are you exercising often? If not, ramp that up. I got lazy when I was married and got back into working out a lot when I was in my 30's. It makes a huge difference, if I stopped working out tomorrow, in about 4-6 weeks my entire cravings for sex, erections etc. Would start to diminish. As long as I work out regularly my sex drive is everything is was when I was a teenager, probably more so. If you haven't read it, look up my post on exercise (I think its in the FAQ index) and the importance of it to sexual function. Main thing is cardio for circulation, and some weight training for keeping your T levels high. Stay at it and you can go into your 80's without erectile dysfunction.

I like to message fresh faces as they show up on SA. Here lately it seems many never reply. I'm sure most get swamped with messages but I usually write an extended greeting. More than one have commented that was what made them interested in seeing me.

I was running around 75% replying, now only 40%. Add in the current batch that mention seeking platonic only, it has been a slow three weeks on my current monthly membership. Only one new that made it to the FC. Hope it picks up soon as I have lots of free afternoons in the next 30 days.

To all my brothers on here, THANK YOU. I am a long time lerker. I am going to now be a frequent poster. I feel that I can offer some help and ask for help myself.

First thing, do you guys text your POTs everyday? I think I messed up two situations by not texting them everyday. They both cancelled their profiles and I figured I was the guy. We did meet, everything went well. I never discussed sex or money, I thought that was the right approach (maybe not? I think their little brains just get sidetracked and not we don't text at all. I wonder what went wrong.

[QUOTE=ToeLover57;2906150]I like to message fresh faces as they show up on SA. Here lately it seems many never reply. I'm sure most get swamped with messages but I usually write an extended greeting. More than one have commented that was what made them interested in seeing me.

I was running around 75% replying, now only 40%. Add in the current batch that mention seeking platonic only, it has been a slow three weeks on my current monthly membership. Only one new that made it to the FC. Hope it picks up soon as I have lots of free afternoons in the next 30 days.[/QUOTE]I'm guessing a lot of the college SBs are getting summer jobs and are not as desperate for sugar. Or just being more selective.

[QUOTE=HoyaSvnFgr;2904671]Been doing more detective work than I should. I found a receipt in her luggage for some high-priced Louis Bouton (*sp) shoes. They cost about $1,000. The guy sent them to her college apartment address. I did some intel on the guy's name. He's married, late 50's, a COO position and is local to the area where me and my LTR SB / SO live. I thought about contacting him and having a man-to-man talk about the extent of their relationship. I'm glad I refrained from doing so. The guys doesn't seem like competition to me. I can't imagine a guy spending that type of cash with no sex though. I never confronted her about it. The receipt was around the time we started getting serious "exclusive". I don't know if she's in contact with the guy still or not. Since she doesn't flaunt or wear gifts other than the stuff I bought her I assume it was something from her past.

.[/QUOTE]I hate to tell you Hoya, but your LTR is playing the volume game. Who knows how many SDs she has -obviously at least one -and maybe many more. You either have to be OK with her being a Pro SB, or let her go. She has tasted the good life and probably can't give it up. It is easy money. The addiction for them is similar to that for us. We can't give up young pussy for age appropriate relationships, and they can't give up the money. A similar thing happened to me. I was "in love" with my 22 yr old and found out that she was working 3 of us. We parted ways. Does your LTR "love you " ? Maybe -in a way. But not enough to be monogamous to you.

[QUOTE=EnzoAmore;2906240]To all my brothers on here, THANK YOU. I am a long time lerker. I am going to now be a frequent poster. I feel that I can offer some help and ask for help myself.

First thing, do you guys text your POTs everyday? I think I messed up two situations by not texting them everyday. They both cancelled their profiles and I figured I was the guy. We did meet, everything went well. I never discussed sex or money, I thought that was the right approach (maybe not? I think their little brains just get sidetracked and not we don't text at all. I wonder what went wrong.[/QUOTE]I'm new here as well but have been lurking for over a year and read a lot of the tips elsewhere on this site. I doubt many text their SB's daily. I try to not seem needy with any that I contact. Usually I move my POTs over to email asap. Works better in my situation and gives me another option for background searching on them. Back to your question. Every situation is different but you should be able to quickly determine what the baby likes. I've got one that emails me every day. Been going on for 6 weeks now. Only seen her twice in that time and she is still active almost every day on SA. Usually its a "thinking of you" or "what are you watching on TV tonight". I assume its her usual approach with guys. Most I just message once a week and see every other.

[QUOTE=FredMoore;2907333]I hate to tell you Hoya, but your LTR is playing the volume game. Who knows how many SDs she has -obviously at least one -and maybe many more. You either have to be OK with her being a Pro SB, or let her go. She has tasted the good life and probably can't give it up. It is easy money. The addiction for them is similar to that for us. We can't give up young pussy for age appropriate relationships, and they can't give up the money. A similar thing happened to me. I was "in love" with my 22 yr old and found out that she was working 3 of us. We parted ways. Does your LTR "love you " ? Maybe -in a way. But not enough to be monogamous to you.[/QUOTE]I had something similar happened to me as well. I met this Ukrainian girl on match and she insisted that we become exclusive. I did and after two months I find out that she currently has an account on SA. I'm fine with my sugarbaby seeing other guys what I don't like it is when you try to pass yourself off as a civi date but then become a sugarbaby behind my back. She goes by the name Nicole and she's on that right now.

I let her pick the time and place. Sends me a message 15 minutes after we are supposed to meet. "I slept in". 10 am? You slept in? Never said she was sorry. And the best thing is her profile says "first impressions are important".

GPS has inflected these girls' brains.

[QUOTE=Ltnric;2907379]I had something similar happened to me as well. I met this Ukrainian girl on match and she insisted that we become exclusive. I did and after two months I find out that she currently has an account on SA. I'm fine with my sugarbaby seeing other guys what I don't like it is when you try to pass yourself off as a civi date but then become a sugarbaby behind my back. She goes by the name Nicole and she's on that right now.[/QUOTE]I tried exclusive once with a monthly allowance. She went 19 days without being active. Back on the day after my monthly membership ended and I deactivated my account. She didn't know I had a second account ready to use so I saw her online daily after that. I got my months worth out of her and let her go. She didn't protest too much so I figure she had another daddy going by then.

[QUOTE=EnzoAmore;2907400]I let her pick the time and place. Sends me a message 15 minutes after we are supposed to meet. "I slept in". 10 am? You slept in? Never said she was sorry. And the best thing is her profile says "first impressions are important".

GPS has inflected these girls' brains.[/QUOTE]If they don't have a job, they won't wake up. Has happened to me numerous times, as late as 1 pm.

Well. Had a little trip with my SB and went well. I did try to break it off with her on our return though. Just not enough sex going on the last few months. None of this is really her fault. Health issues and a serious family situation she had to leave town for a bit. All verified issues but now I forsee some other issues still coming up so have been looking on SA. FYI. She was a bit more upset than I thought she would be when I tried to break it off. We talked and I caved. LOL. But am on the hunt and am sure it will be easier if I have another definitely lined up so I have been on SA and had a couple dates with one late 20's which I really prefer for drama reasons. All seemed well. We talked allowance she seemed like it was adequate. And I likely would of done a little more if asked but then went ghost!. Oh well. Back on the hunt and now I have 2 20 yr olds I am working (yeah yeah. I'm not wired for 220. Har har har) anyway one lives in my area and the other an easy drive but about an hour away. Suppose to have meets this week. I have a preference for one over the other just because she is a tiny spinner type but we will see if the meets happen and how we click. Both attractive and fit though. Wish me luck!

[QUOTE=EnzoAmore;2907400]I let her pick the time and place. Sends me a message 15 minutes after we are supposed to meet. "I slept in". 10 am? You slept in? Never said she was sorry. And the best thing is her profile says "first impressions are important".

GPS has inflected these girls' brains.[/QUOTE]Yeah, flakiness seems to be "normal" for the 20-something girls. It is something to expect out of them and plan for. Some dudes double book in case a SB flakes.

Hardest thing for me was getting use this "style" in these girls. I guess if they were go-getters and able to schedule / plan, they might be otherwise employed? Then again, have seen them flake with their peers and think nothing of it.

So learning to put up with a bit of this flakiness is part of the process. Not to say one should put up with a BUNCH of bad behavior, but expecting normal business etiquette might be a bit of a stretch.

Nothing to do at work today so been online most of it. Messaged a "10" in the Norfolk area for the hell of it. Turns out she is UTR. She texted me some private pics and we are meeting at Williamsburg hotel tonight. I really don't care if she is SB or UTR. Going to cost me the same and actually cheaper as no dinner M&G! She texted me just now confirming so I hope my drive from Richmond is worth it.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2906002] Also just curious because you mentioned diminished erections -- late 30's is too early for that, are you exercising often? If not, ramp that up. I got lazy when I was married and got back into working out a lot when I was in my 30's. It makes a huge difference, if I stopped working out tomorrow, in about 4-6 weeks my entire cravings for sex, erections etc. Would start to diminish. As long as I work out regularly my sex drive is everything is was when I was a teenager, probably more so. If you haven't read it, look up my post on exercise (I think its in the FAQ index) and the importance of it to sexual function. Main thing is cardio for circulation, and some weight training for keeping your T levels high. Stay at it and you can go into your 80's without erectile dysfunction.[/QUOTE]Great post, Jeez. I'm very much interested in keeping my T levels high and would really love to read your post on this. I did seriously search in the FAQ but couldn't find it. It'd be very helpful if someone could post the link. Thanks.

[QUOTE=Lebruno;2908343]Great post, Jeez. I'm very much interested in keeping my T levels high and would really love to read your post on this. I did seriously search in the FAQ but couldn't find it. It'd be very helpful if someone could post the link. Thanks.[/QUOTE]The exercise post (or at least one of them) is referenced in post #7 of the Index and FAQ thread: [URL]http://www.usasexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?15100-Sugarbaby-Thread-Highlights-Index-and-FAQ[/URL].

There were some other posts I wrote on the value of exercise but that's at least one of them, not sure the others are indexed and they would be hard to dig up otherwise. I really would encourage Googling around to read about the effect of exercise on T levels from more authoritative sources, I'm just one person with my own anecdotal experiences.

Here's one link to get started: [URL]http://fitness.mercola.com/sites/fitness/archive/2012/07/27/increase-testosterone-levels.aspx[/URL].

Basically the only way to know how your T levels are is to get them tested by a doctor via lab work. If you do have low T (which by the official definition is actually fairly rare) you can definitely boost it through exercise and eating right, not to mention you need to do that anyway for overall good physical and mental health. But even if your T levels are average or above average, you still benefit sexually from intense exercise.

There's not too many things in life as good as getting text messages from some 19 year old you just gave a good solid fucking too, starting with about 15 minutes after she gets home after your date and spanning the next 2-3 days going on and on about how amazing the night was and how she'd never had sex like that in her life. It makes all the aches and pains of the exercise worthwhile. Yes I have dabbled with Viagra a little bit too, but it is just a supplemental for-fun thing and a backup plan for extenuating circumstances, not a necessity at this point or anything remotely close.

Word of caution: expressing a sudden interest in exercise or fitness is a big red flag to any SO. Wasn't an issue for me because it's a long-term thing that I've been into since the 80s. Work your way up to it slowly if married. A side benefit is that you can shower up and change clothes at the gym, and go home smelling like you didn't just fuck a 19 year old.

Hot Sexy Venus 29 wants 5 bills for dinner and date. [URL]https://www.seekingarrangement.com/member/ad67672f-1ded-4a6c-b398-95f32c17a9ab[/URL].

[QUOTE=ToeLover57;2909027]Hot Sexy Venus 29 wants 5 bills for dinner and date. [URL]https://www.seekingarrangement.com/member/ad67672f-1ded-4a6c-b398-95f32c17a9ab[/URL].[/QUOTE]GPS is relative but I would certainly include her ask as belonging to that category. I pretty much ignore all girls who ask for more than Practical. If they are throwing a dart at the SD Board hoping to get a big spender any adjustment downward to see me would leave them disappointed and feeling gypped. Who needs to start off with a girl who has already compromised. There are just too many SBs who are listing Practical to bother with the others. I realize that some of them are not expecting big bucks but are hopeful. But that is just the wrong attitude. Also posing with a Rolls sends the wrong message. I want a cutie who is sitting in her 10 yr old VW Beetle who will be impressed when I roll up in an my Series 5 BMW and not be disappointed because it wasn't a 7 Series. Now $500/ visit falls within the Practical range if the arrangement is on and FC activity is expected.

I was in a small metro area last week that I'm visiting regularly now. By small, I mean there are really only about 12 active profiles on SA for the 50 mile radius. I was fortunate and hit pay dirt early on with a 10/10/10. She's an unmarried pediatrician, spinner, and cross-fitter. I have no idea what she sees in me, but I'm not fighting it. We see each other often, and we're heading to Asia for a few weeks this summer together.

My regular was out last week for a family emergency, and I'm in the town that time forgot. I hopped on SA, and immediately had a bite from one of the few cuties in town. We set-up a meeting via txt for the hotel bar (yeah the town isn't that small), and I wait. Twenty minutes passed the meeting time, I txt her ' She replies 10 minutes. Forty minutes later (now an hour after the meeting time), I tell her to forget it. I'm not into games, and drama. I head out to a local pub, and knock back a few. While at the pub, I get a txt that she's at the hotel bar and wants to see me. This is followed by a voice mail. The voice mail sounds like she's high. I take away my private pics on SA.

I head back to the hotel after about two hours at the pub, and a car from the local police is at the front door. I park and head-up the back stairs just out of an abundance of caution. I check SA, and five minutes prior to my arrival at the hotel she requested my private pics. She now calls my number. I block her on Google voice and SA.

I either avoided a sting (unlikely), or more likely a NANDO 1. She arrived at the hotel bar and made a scene, and so the locals were called. She told them she was meeting a guy at the hotel, and thus her desire to see my pics and call.

The moral of the story is don't let your little head think on SA. Due your diligence before setting up a meeting.

[QUOTE=FredMoore;2907333]I hate to tell you Hoya, but your LTR is playing the volume game. Who knows how many SDs she has -obviously at least one -and maybe many more. You either have to be OK with her being a Pro SB, or let her go. She has tasted the good life and probably can't give it up. It is easy money. The addiction for them is similar to that for us. We can't give up young pussy for age appropriate relationships, and they can't give up the money. A similar thing happened to me. I was "in love" with my 22 yr old and found out that she was working 3 of us. We parted ways. Does your LTR "love you " ? Maybe -in a way. But not enough to be monogamous to you.[/QUOTE]I had been hinting about letting her go and she would always say that I didn't mean it. She'd even go as far as saying we'd be together forever, etc. It was borderline psycho how she wouldn't agree to ending things. We've had no contact for a little over a week. She surprised me by cutting it off with me. I thought I'd be saddened, but I felt tons of relief. I realize that this girl may have Borderline Personality Disorder. Everything I've read on it matches up with her. It was a toxic relationship. I'm feeling better. Since I got off the sugar I'm looking forward to having more free cash too.

In summary, the emotion and the sugaring was all for an experience. It added some fun to my life. I haven't totaled up how much I've spent in this "hobby", but in retrospect it was worth it. I came out better than I did in my divorce 😃. Cheers to The Bowl. I know I can't go back to dating my age. Overall this has been an experience of a lifetime. I showed some colleagues pictures of my SB / SO and they were floored. I never imagined this lifestyle when I was married. Gents, in some ways we've found the holy grail and a medicine for vitality.

[QUOTE=HoyaSvnFgr;2909532]I had been hinting ....... I showed some colleagues pictures of my SB / SO and they were floored. I never imagined this lifestyle when I was married. Gents, in some ways we've found the holy grail and a medicine for vitality.[/QUOTE]NO ONE will believe the hotties I'm getting, even I showed them the pics.

Heck, I don't believe it, some days.

BikeRider. That's a scary situation. I am glad you made the right moves at the end.

[QUOTE=BikeRider;2909380]I was in a small metro area last week that I'm visiting regularly now. By small, I mean there are really only about 12 active profiles on SA for the 50 mile radius. I was fortunate and hit pay dirt early on with a 10/10/10. She's an unmarried pediatrician, spinner, and cross-fitter. I have no idea what she sees in me, but I'm not fighting it. We see each other often, and we're heading to Asia for a few weeks this summer together.

My regular was out last week for a family emergency, and I'm in the town that time forgot. I hopped on SA, and immediately had a bite from one of the few cuties in town. We set-up a meeting via txt for the hotel bar (yeah the town isn't that small), and I wait. Twenty minutes passed the meeting time, I txt her ' She replies 10 minutes. Forty minutes later (now an hour after the meeting time), I tell her to forget it. I'm not into games, and drama. I head out to a local pub, and knock back a few. While at the pub, I get a txt that she's at the hotel bar and wants to see me. This is followed by a voice mail. The voice mail sounds like she's high. I take away my private pics on SA.

I head back to the hotel after about two hours at the pub, and a car from the local police is at the front door. I park and head-up the back stairs just out of an abundance of caution. I check SA, and five minutes prior to my arrival at the hotel she requested my private pics. She now calls my number. I block her on Google voice and SA.

I either avoided a sting (unlikely), or more likely a NANDO 1. She arrived at the hotel bar and made a scene, and so the locals were called. She told them she was meeting a guy at the hotel, and thus her desire to see my pics and call.

The moral of the story is don't let your little head think on SA. Due your diligence before setting up a meeting.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FTP1999;2909573]

Heck, I don't believe it, some days.[/QUOTE]If SA existed 15 years ago -- when I had 2 x the income and all the trappings of a corporate tool --I don't think I ever would have dated again or gotten married.

Even the "dating" side of SA -- the messaging, M&Gs, flakes, test drives that prove less than anticipated -- is far less time and money than I spent on traditional dating.

Of course, 20 years ago, 20 something hotties were not yet of the mindset of mindless NSA hook ups that they exhibit now.

I think it's worthwhile to remember that SB / SD scene has been around since the beginning of time. I "experimented" in the bowl even when I was in my 20's, and was not old enough or successful enough to be anything remotely resembling a true sugar daddy. One of my favorite moments from back in the early 90's involved handing a POT an envelope with some cash because she had been complaining about paying the bills and such. I could see her sit there in the passenger seat of my car, literally feeling the thickness of the envelope with her fingers for a number of seconds, silently trying to guess what was behind door number three. Well ultimately she handed me back the envelope without opening it, and saying she would not take my assistance because she didn't want it to become like a sugar daddy scenario, she wanted a real relationship with me. Later she brags to one of her friends (who told a friend of mine) that about how she turned down a $1000 handout from me (remember, she never opened the envelope, she didn't realize there were a bunch of fives in there, and maybe 125 bucks total. LOL). But yes some of her friends were fucking 50+ year old men who were giving them weekly allowances. It's not a new practice at all.

Fast forward and the only thing that has changed is the process of meeting SBs has been made more efficient via the Internet and specific SD websites. Even before SA and such, sugar babies could be found on any of the early dating websites, and even before the Internet that in bars, nightclubs, the servers at restaurants, etc. Before most folks were online, some SDs used to troll for SBs using newspaper classifieds (although I never personally tried that method).

The problem with the newfound efficiency is that it is also drawing escorts / UTRs and guys who want that sort of thing, jeopardizing the future of these sites. A year ago, most of the chatter around the SB / SD scene was taking place here in the Richmond forum, and maybe one or two other forums on USASG. Now, every day when I look at the front page I see SD discussions taking place in dozens of different city forums, sometimes with "sugar babies" in the title, sometimes with SA in the title, etc. Often times what's actually being discussed in those threads has nothing to do with SBs at all, it's just guys swapping info about UTR escorts, and about back page girls that are polluting the scene, because they've discovered that with a bit of acting skill they can get paid more, choose their customers, and fuck less often for same income.

I believe it's only a matter of time before the influx of escorts and johns who are using SD sites as an escort alternative results in legal attention that causes problems for SA and the like. For that reason, I don't think any of us should plan our future around SA or depend on its existence for our happiness. It very well might go away some day. Learning how to find SBs off regular dating sites is a good skill to have if the landscape should change and the SD sites get shut down, or worse if the good websites start charging three hundred per month for membership due to increased SD demand and just because they can.

Personally, I'd like to envision USA learning from other countries and becoming more lenient about the world's oldest profession rather than wasting legal resources trying to stop it, but unless that happens I do believe that there is a risk of SD sites being identified as a facilitator for illegal activity, and with enough bad luck that can result in big problems for them.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2910797]I think it's worthwhile to remember that SB / SD scene has been around since the beginning of time. I "experimented" in the bowl even when I was in my 20's, and was not old enough or successful enough to be anything remotely resembling a true sugar daddy. One of my favorite moments from back in the early 90's involved handing a POT an envelope with some cash because she had been complaining about paying the bills and such. I could see her sit there in the passenger seat of my car, literally feeling the thickness of the envelope with her fingers for a number of seconds, silently trying to guess what was behind door number three. Well ultimately she handed me back the envelope without opening it, and saying she would not take my assistance because she didn't want it to become like a sugar daddy scenario, she wanted a real relationship with me. Later she brags to one of her friends (who told a friend of mine) that about how she turned down a $1000 handout from me (remember, she never opened the envelope, she didn't realize there were a bunch of fives in there, and maybe 125 bucks total. LOL). But yes some of her friends were fucking 50+ year old men who were giving them weekly allowances. It's not a new practice at all.

Fast forward and the only thing that has changed is the process of meeting SBs has been made more efficient via the Internet and specific SD websites. Even before SA and such, sugar babies could be found on any of the early dating websites, and even before the Internet that in bars, nightclubs, the servers at restaurants, etc. Before most folks were online, some SDs used to troll for SBs using newspaper classifieds (although I never personally tried that method).

The problem with the newfound efficiency is that it is also drawing escorts / UTRs and guys who want that sort of thing, jeopardizing the future of these sites. A year ago, most of the chatter around the SB / SD scene was taking place here in the Richmond forum, and maybe one or two other forums on USASG. Now, every day when I look at the front page I see SD discussions taking place in dozens of different city forums, sometimes with "sugar babies" in the title, sometimes with SA in the title, etc. Often times what's actually being discussed in those threads has nothing to do with SBs at all, it's just guys swapping info about UTR escorts, and about back page girls that are polluting the scene, because they've discovered that with a bit of acting skill they can get paid more, choose their customers, and fuck less often for same income.

I believe it's only a matter of time before the influx of escorts and johns who are using SD sites as an escort alternative results in legal attention that causes problems for SA and the like. For that reason, I don't think any of us should plan our future around SA or depend on its existence for our happiness. It very well might go away some day. Learning how to find SBs off regular dating sites is a good skill to have if the landscape should change and the SD sites get shut down, or worse if the good websites start charging three hundred per month for membership due to increased SD demand and just because they can.

Personally, I'd like to envision USA learning from other countries and becoming more lenient about the world's oldest profession rather than wasting legal resources trying to stop it, but unless that happens I do believe that there is a risk of SD sites being identified as a facilitator for illegal activity, and with enough bad luck that can result in big problems for them.[/QUOTE]IMHO if the day comes the sd site disappear then so will the biggest part of the sds on these sites. There will always be women who need financial help but once the sites are gone it will take more looking and time. It will be more of a civy type search which is a pain in the ass for most. The other big problem will be for the older guy who hunts the youngest sb's. Are they hanging out in the college bars, shopping malls trying to find these girls. The sites put the girls and money in the same place which makes it so convenient. If they disappear that takes the ease of finding them requiring the guys to actually have some sort of game. Big problem for most.

Most of the women with kids are going to be the easiest converts but bringing the subject up will take time. Then if your that comfortable with them why not get it for free? That leads us back to relationships and having the time and game. Most guys don't want that.

[QUOTE=JohnHandCock;2910855]IMHO if the day comes the sd site disappear then so will the biggest part of the sds on these sites. There will always be women who need financial help but once the sites are gone it will take more looking and time. It will be more of a civy type search which is a pain in the ass for most. The other big problem will be for the older guy who hunts the youngest sb's. Are they hanging out in the college bars, shopping malls trying to find these girls. The sites put the girls and money in the same place which makes it so convenient. If they disappear that takes the ease of finding them requiring the guys to actually have some sort of game. Big problem for most.

Most of the women with kids are going to be the easiest converts but bringing the subject up will take time. Then if your that comfortable with them why not get it for free? That leads us back to relationships and having the time and game. Most guys don't want that.[/QUOTE]Agreed on all points. To be clear on my position, I just don't want the SD scene to become so overrun with escort activity that it attracts LE attention. The tenfold uptick in discussions of SBs here on USASG over the last few months just demonstrates how real this risk is. Not only will LE attention increase the risk of website closures, but once the stigma is attached to it such that the line is blurred between younger women dating successful men and flat out escorting, the real sugar babies won't want to be a part of the sites. And even if they do stay open, nothing but high volume UTRs and escorts pretending to be SBs will be left.

My main point is that a SD should always see himself as a confident player and in charge of his own destiny -- and never become too reliant on the current status quo to define our social life. Getting pussy is always a lot of work no matter how you do it, however anyone who has some reasonable combination of:

(a) game with meeting & talking to women.

(b) financial success.

(c) confidence in themselves.

(d) sexual skill / physical fitness.

Will always have a reasonable amount of fine young pussy depending on how strong they are in each area (note many of them go hand-in-hand, for example B breeds C, and so does D, and all three of them help enable A, so they aren't really distinctly separated traits).

But above all a SD should not get totally dependent on SA or some other specific website to be the center of their pussy-obtaining strategy. Brandon Wade's net worth is estimated around $35 million, and he is now married. With that kind of money in the bank, all it would take is one Ashley-Madison scale hack job and the associated lawsuits to make him say "fuck it, time to pack up and go home".

There will be other SD sites but that is part of my point, there will always be SDs and always be SBs if you know where to look. It might be harder work, but at the same time back before the SD sites were available, there was also less SD competition for the SBs. Judging by the proliferating interest observed on USASG, it's starting to look like its becoming a saturated, high-volume market. Good for Brandon Wade but also probably pushing him closer to the quit-while-ahead point where he decides to retire before the class action lawsuits or other legal troubles pour in.

My advice is simply that pussy is always there if you know where to look. Remain adaptable to changing times, because times always change.

Thank you for sharing. This is very useful and timely for what I was searching for. Now I'm going to work to tune myself up to be in condition to have a mind-blowing sex with a 19 yo. LOL.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2908948]The exercise post (or at least one of them) is referenced in post #7 of the Index and FAQ thread: [URL]http://www.usasexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?15100-Sugarbaby-Thread-Highlights-Index-and-FAQ[/URL].

There were some other posts I wrote on the value of exercise but that's at least one of them, not sure the others are indexed and they would be hard to dig up otherwise. I really would encourage Googling around to read about the effect of exercise on T levels from more authoritative sources, I'm just one person with my own anecdotal experiences.

Here's one link to get started: [URL]http://fitness.mercola.com/sites/fitness/archive/2012/07/27/increase-testosterone-levels.aspx[/URL].

Basically the only way to know how your T levels are is to get them tested by a doctor via lab work. If you do have low T (which by the official definition is actually fairly rare) you can definitely boost it through exercise and eating right, not to mention you need to do that anyway for overall good physical and mental health. But even if your T levels are average or above average, you still benefit sexually from intense exercise.

There's not too many things in life as good as getting text messages from some 19 year old you just gave a good solid fucking too, starting with about 15 minutes after she gets home after your date and spanning the next 2-3 days going on and on about how amazing the night was and how she'd never had sex like that in her life. It makes all the aches and pains of the exercise worthwhile. Yes I have dabbled with Viagra a little bit too, but it is just a supplemental for-fun thing and a backup plan for extenuating circumstances, not a necessity at this point or anything remotely close.

Word of caution: expressing a sudden interest in exercise or fitness is a big red flag to any SO. Wasn't an issue for me because it's a long-term thing that I've been into since the 80s. Work your way up to it slowly if married. A side benefit is that you can shower up and change clothes at the gym, and go home smelling like you didn't just fuck a 19 year old.[/QUOTE]