Vietnamese Bars

[QUOTE=Member 69]Is the place completely shut down? I visited the place a few weeks ago. At the time it was run by the old lady mama from club velvet and the 2 sisters (tina and tiffany). Gay guy Ben also works there. Problem is that they allow smoking in the place and the ventillation system doesn't clear the air out so the place reeks of cig smoke. There were some other girls working at the time too. I stopped going to the place because I hated having my clothes reek of cig smoke whenever I visited.

As for Sandy and Jens, only Jenny (one with a tat, she drove a BMW 745 a year or more ago) and Wendy work there. The mama is viet but there are a number of Chinese girls working there.[/QUOTE]

I liked the smoking personally and spent more there because of it. Folks that don't like the smell of smoke have lots of other bars to go to. I don't blame Tiffany for letting it, they could barely pay their rent and I heard it was often late because the ban pissed off so many patrons. She got in at the worst possible time, even having her grand opening on the 16th of November 2006.
It's come to my knowledge that data obtained from the liquor commission got passed around at the state capital. 2 am's lost 5 figures and 4 am's lost 6 figures, the 4 am's lost close or $200,000 or about 20-30% gross by July alone - after years of increase. No wonder the bars sued the state.
For all you guys that don't smoke I'm glad you have so many places to enjoy - please respect the few places that still let smokers be smokers.

Mahalo and peace my brothers.

[QUOTE=Thumperforq]By Nite's location has a new club named Moulon Rouge opening up in its place. Ben is working at Sky Lounge until he figures out what he's going to do. I'm not sure where Tina and Tiffany are now. Most of the old Velvet / By Nite girls were at Sandy & Jens last week; don't know if they're going stay.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the info thumper. The two sisters may have gone home for the holidays, one has a kid so may be taking it easy for the holidays. Ben lights up at sky lounge too, jackie allows it but not sure if lyna will.

Night colors, I'm opposite of you. Where I used to spend some bucks on the girls there (I like the taller of the two sisters), my friends and I hardly go there anymore. Can't have it both ways so since they (the girls) also smoke, they went with smoking. Their loss (for some customers not visiting because of the smoke). I have a number of friends that smoke, they don't have a problem going outside in most kb's and vb's to smoke but I do know of friends that refuse to visit bars that do allow smoking, including by nite. I don't think the closure of by nite can be blamed on the smoking ban because word was out that the place allowed smoking for the past 6 to 8 months, but really the place is in a bad location, not much free parking or available street parking since you have to compete with femme nu and you have to pay for parking in the lot so customers don't visit as much. Previous bars there didn't do well either.

As for the loss figures, what is not mentioned is that business has been slow overall even before the smoking ban. Many of the kb's do allow smoking in the rooms, but they are still claiming losses. What they don't mention is that most places now charge $$$ for champagne and $$ for wine in the rooms, where a couple of years ago it was only $$ for champagne and $. 2 for wine. IMHO ever since they raised the prices of drinks guys aren't spending as much at the bars so overall spending in the bars has been bad. I don't see as many customers go to the rooms like a few years ago. I also don't go to the rooms much anymore because of the prices, cheaper to go to an AMP instead.

[QUOTE=Member 69] What they don't mention is that most places now charge $$$ for champagne and $$ for wine in the rooms, where a couple of years ago it was only $$ for champagne and $. 2 for wine. IMHO ever since they raised the prices of drinks guys aren't spending as much at the bars so overall spending in the bars has been bad. I don't see as many customers go to the rooms like a few years ago. I also don't go to the rooms much anymore because of the prices, cheaper to go to an AMP instead.[/QUOTE]

Couldn't agree more with you. Most of the bars try to charge $$$ - $$$$$ for champagne and $$ - $$$.5 for wine in the rooms and the girls that go into the rooms will do as little as possible. The bars are forgetting that only good service and entertainment can justify higher prices. When you see prices go up and service go down, you lose customers.

[QUOTE=Thumperforq]Couldn't agree more with you. Most of the bars try to charge $$$ - $$$$$ for champagne and $$ - $$$.5 for wine in the rooms and the girls that go into the rooms will do as little as possible. The bars are forgetting that only good service and entertainment can justify higher prices. When you see prices go up and service go down, you lose customers.[/QUOTE]Gentlemen,

What I don't understand is when you order a bottle and pay $$$+ and go to the back room, you expect to get cozy with the girl. But half the time the girl is pouring warm chanpagne in a bucket of ice then covering it with a napkin to pour it into your glass and spilling half the bottle all over the tablean tray then dumping the rest of the champagne in glass into the trash can. So commonly seen.

Not only we lose money on the bottle but in 30 minutes your bottle is dry and their asking for another. They rush the crappy service and they continue to take 15 min bathroom breaks. Where's the good service like before? To these girls its all about the $$$$ not the service they provide.

Anyone checked out Cache Lounge lately? That place is straight to the point, no problem talking to the girl and getting straight to the reason why you are there. Limited on girls but make up for it with great attitudes and knowing what the customer wants. For my brothas out there with not so deep pockets, this is the place for you!

[QUOTE=Twitch26]

Anyone checked out Cache Lounge lately? That place is straight to the point, no problem talking to the girl and getting straight to the reason why you are there. Limited on girls but make up for it with great attitudes and knowing what the customer wants. For my brothas out there with not so deep pockets, this is the place for you! [/QUOTE]
Years ago I was a customer at that bar (although it may have had a different name then), and full service was available in a back room. Is full service still available, and if so, how much should a customer currently expect to spend there for full service? Because you mention that it's a good place for guys with "not so deep pockets," I'm wondering whether full service might be less expensive there than in an AMP?

Off of "You Tube" these are the numbers;

"Honolulu gross liquor sales from late night bars;
2003 = $34.1 million
2004 = $34.8 million
2005 = $35.1 million
2006 = $36.4 million
2007 = $29.27 million post ban -20% RAW"

and member69 I respect your right not to smoke but would you push a girl that came to your home and made love to you outside in the rain to have a smoke after sex? I want to respect you but the law will not let me.

We get rained on and it sucks. We get no patio area where we can still drink and hang out - no nothing. It just sucks! I have no choice but to smoke inside or get the treated like a dog.

[QUOTE=Night Colors]Off of "You Tube" these are the numbers;

"Honolulu gross liquor sales from late night bars;
2003 = $34.1 million
2004 = $34.8 million
2005 = $35.1 million
2006 = $36.4 million
2007 = $29.27 million post ban -20% RAW"

and member69 I respect your right not to smoke but would you push a girl that came to your home and made love to you outside in the rain to have a smoke after sex? I want to respect you but the law will not let me.

We get rained on and it sucks. We get no patio area where we can still drink and hang out - no nothing. It just sucks! I have no choice but to smoke inside or get the treated like a dog.[/QUOTE]Night colors, I don't have a girl smoke in my home. I have her smoke out on my balcony if she wants to smoke. Yes if I didn't have a balcony I would push the girl outside to smoke if she wanted to smoke. I smoked for many years and quit over 15 years ago (was having upper respiratory problems) and won't allow any smoking in my house. I won't even let my mother smoke in my house or car and she respects that.

As for the numbers you show, it's easy to say that it was all because of the smoking ban but as I said before, if you haven't noticed, not as many customers are going into the rooms at the kb's anymore, not because of the smoking ban but because they jacked up the prices and even have higher prices for beers and drinks. A lot of my drinking buddies first drink outside of the bar before going in (I do too), we buy a six pack to get a buzz first. Many of the kids don't drink as much at the bars because of that too. IMHO, kb's cannot say that their loss in business is only because of the ban because I know that many of my friends don't drink as much in the bars, first because of the higher drink prices and also because of the threat of DUI's.

Anyway, lets drop this issue, I'm not going to change your mind and you aren't going to change mine. I just mentioned it because I liked the girls at by nite and would spend a few hundred on them at a time but since I can't stand the smoke I no longer go there, my friends too, which is their loss for allowing smoking inside.

Peace bruddah

There is a Thai girl who is the bartender during the day but sometimes stays later and sits with customers, she has a very nice rack.

Does anyone know if she plays? if so is it worth it?

[QUOTE=Mr Chin]There is a Thai girl who is the bartender during the day but sometimes stays later and sits with customers, she has a very nice rack.

Does anyone know if she plays? if so is it worth it?[/QUOTE]I thought that the girl working is Pam. She worked at romantei previously. Her rack is enhanced. Not sure about play, guess you gotta try and report back to us. I think YMMV, it may depend on how she feels about you as I heard others that got no play. IMHO I don't think that she plays like some of the other regular girls there (cindy, kayla, etc.).

Thought she was viet. Her sister is michelle, who worked at romantei, glamour/velvet, etc.

[QUOTE=Member 69]I thought that the girl working is Pam. She worked at romantei previously. Her rack is enhanced. Not sure about play, guess you gotta try and report back to us. I think YMMV, it may depend on how she feels about you as I heard others that got no play. IMHO I don't think that she plays like some of the other regular girls there (cindy, kayla, etc.).

Thought she was viet. Her sister is michelle, who worked at romantei, glamour/velvet, etc.[/QUOTE]

They are both Thai and have or had a Thai last name, since Michelle still uses her ex-husbands surname. They also have an older half-sister named K. K.

Michelle is working the bars on Maui, I think in Wailuku but I'm not positive. I haven't heard any reports that any of them play however.

Michelle is a cutie and a nice person to be around if you get to know her. However she tends to run from problems rather than fix them and lacks any sort of finacial discipline in her private life.

[QUOTE=Brett Pounder]Gentlemen,

What I don't understand is when you order a bottle and pay $$$+ and go to the back room, you expect to get cozy with the girl. But half the time the girl is pouring warm chanpagne in a bucket of ice then covering it with a napkin to pour it into your glass and spilling half the bottle all over the tablean tray then dumping the rest of the champagne in glass into the trash can. So commonly seen.

Not only we lose money on the bottle but in 30 minutes your bottle is dry and their asking for another. They rush the crappy service and they continue to take 15 min bathroom breaks. Where's the good service like before? To these girls its all about the $$$$ not the service they provide.[/QUOTE]

Try going when it's really slow. Thats when you get hustled less and it's more friendly, at least for sitting at the bar and buying an occasional $20 drink. If they know you as a regular that's even better. The best is if you are the only customer in the place and to get them talking about something they find interesting. Their only other choice is the Megatouch which costs them money and get boring after a while. At least the $20 drinks are still $20, although a few girls are trying to push it to $40 which I oppose. If to many folks say yes to the $40 it may catch on and that would suck.

[QUOTE=Night Colors]They are both Thai and have or had a Thai last name, since Michelle still uses her ex-husbands surname. They also have an older half-sister named K. K.

Michelle is working the bars on Maui, I think in Wailuku but I'm not positive. I haven't heard any reports that any of them play however.

Michelle is a cutie and a nice person to be around if you get to know her. However she tends to run from problems rather than fix them and lacks any sort of finacial discipline in her private life.[/QUOTE]

I don't know Pam that well, but I dated Michelle for a while. She can be a sweetheart, but she has a bad gambling problem. It's the reason she was asked to leave Glamour, eventhough she was a part owner.

[QUOTE=Thumperforq]I don't know Pam that well, but I dated Michelle for a while. She can be a sweetheart, but she has a bad gambling problem. It's the reason she was asked to leave Glamour, eventhough she was a part owner.[/QUOTE]

She does have a gambling problem and so does gay ben. Some folks say that her being around him makes her problem worse. I'm surprised she didn't go to By Nite, the staff there was highly tolerent of gambling and openly gambled right on the bar. I'm also surprised the LC didn't see them doing that, it's totally illegal, not that I care because I'm not a gambler and I'm not a rat. It doesn't matter now to post this online since By Nite is no more. With Loni back in control those days are over, she won't allow it. Loni wants some of the younger girls to come back since she only has old timers now however.

One good thing they did was they banned that old J.C. dude. He was loud, rude, and insulting both to customers and the girls and is banned from almost every other bar in Honolulu.

[QUOTE=Night Colors]

"Honolulu gross liquor sales from late night bars;
2003 = $34.1 million
2004 = $34.8 million
2005 = $35.1 million
2006 = $36.4 million
2007 = $29.27 million post ban -20% RAW"[/QUOTE]
Even if there's been an adverse financial impact on bars, that should be weighed against the substantial medical harms and costs of carcinogenic secondhand smoke. Smokers who smoke inside bars that serve the general public are illegally polluting indoor air with poisonous chemicals that all non-smoking customers and employees must breathe. Smokers can smoke in their own homes, their own vehicles, or outside, but they have no right to spread poisonous chemicals in enclosed areas where there are any non-smoking customers or employees.

[QUOTE=Kapalua]Even if there's been an adverse financial impact on bars, that should be weighed against the substantial medical harms and costs of carcinogenic secondhand smoke. Smokers who smoke inside bars that serve the general public are illegally polluting indoor air with poisonous chemicals that all non-smoking customers and employees must breathe. Smokers can smoke in their own homes, their own vehicles, or outside, but they have no right to spread poisonous chemicals in enclosed areas where there are any non-smoking customers or employees.[/QUOTE]

It should be up to the owner. It's their bar. It's like if nudity offends you, don't go to strip bars. Anyhow, we all need to get along and this topic is getting old again. I have to agree with member 69, lets move on to something else because nobodies going change their minds over it.

[QUOTE=Kapalua]Even if there's been an adverse financial impact on bars, that should be weighed against the substantial medical harms and costs of carcinogenic secondhand smoke. Smokers who smoke inside bars that serve the general public are illegally polluting indoor air with poisonous chemicals that all non-smoking customers and employees must breathe. Smokers can smoke in their own homes, their own vehicles, or outside, but they have no right to spread poisonous chemicals in enclosed areas where there are any non-smoking customers or employees.[/QUOTE]
I'm with you Kap!

Actually, when the law was passed, it wasn't for the health of the customers, but for the workers. Something to do with equal, non-health threatening, employment opportunities for all.

[QUOTE=Night Colors]Off of "You Tube" these are the numbers;

"Honolulu gross liquor sales from late night bars;
2003 = $34.1 million
2004 = $34.8 million
2005 = $35.1 million
2006 = $36.4 million
2007 = $29.27 million post ban -20% RAW"

and member69 I respect your right not to smoke but would you push a girl that came to your home and made love to you outside in the rain to have a smoke after sex? I want to respect you but the law will not let me.

We get rained on and it sucks. We get no patio area where we can still drink and hang out - no nothing. It just sucks! I have no choice but to smoke inside or get the treated like a dog.[/QUOTE]Be interested to see the numbers by months.

There has been an increase in personal bankruptcies and a slowing of the economy as a whole, beginning mid/late 06. That accounts for far more than the smoking ban. Look at this christmas season, with people saying they spent less than last year. Gas bills must be taking toll on suv and heavy vehicle drivers, with no end in sight. There is simply less disposable income out there. The numbers don't lie, but the figures can be manipulated.

And I take my business elsewhere if the smoking ban is not enforced.

[QUOTE=Night Colors]

Anyhow, we all need to get along and this topic is getting old again. [/QUOTE]
We can all "get along" on the forum and still respectfully express our viewpoints. It's nothing personal -- I even have some friends who are smokers.

[QUOTE=Night Colors]

It should be up to the owner. It's their bar. [/QUOTE]
When a bar is licensed to serve the general public, the bar is subject to laws that protect non-smoking customers and employees from poisonous chemicals. If I went into a bar and put poisonous chemicals such as arsenic, lead and tar into the drinks and food of smokers, I would very likely get punched in the face. Yet some smokers seem to think that they should be able to pollute the air that non-smoking customers and employees must breathe with the same poisonous chemicals and many others. As the Surgeon General's comprehensive 2006 report on secondhand tobacco smoke emphasizes, it is "a known human carcinogen (cancer-causing agent)," and can result in both "lung cancer and coronary heart disease in nonsmoking adults."

Here it is: [url]http://www.surgeongeneral.gov/library/secondhandsmoke[/url]

[QUOTE=Night Colors]

It's like if nudity offends you, don't go to strip bars. [/QUOTE]
First, a stripper's nudity isn't going to kill people. Second, even in a strip bar, a customer simply doesn't have to look at the stripper if he doesn't want to do so. However, in a bar with air polluted by poisonous smoke, non-smoking customers can't simply stop breathing.

[QUOTE=Pursuer]Be interested to see the numbers by months.

There has been an increase in personal bankruptcies and a slowing of the economy as a whole, beginning mid/late 06. That accounts for far more than the smoking ban. Look at this christmas season, with people saying they spent less than last year. Gas bills must be taking toll on suv and heavy vehicle drivers, with no end in sight. There is simply less disposable income out there. The numbers don't lie, but the figures can be manipulated.

And I take my business elsewhere if the smoking ban is not enforced.[/QUOTE]

This is from the star bulletin. It may explain why a few bars feel compelled to let people. I spoke with him before and he said the big hit happened overnight with the ban. No hostess bars or strip clubs are openly public like this guy.

"....In the meantime, Pigskins bar owner Lance Gomes said he owns a smoking bar again. He has posted 'no smoking' signs inside and outside and tells customers that smoking inside is illegal, in accordance with the law.

In the first three months after the smoking ban went into effect, Gomes said he tried to enforce it himself.

'I told people they had to smoke outside,' Gomes said. 'People were pissed. I had two people walk out on tabs. People were rained on outside. I lost 50 percent of my business. After that, I said I am going to be a smoking bar again and from that day, I was.'

Since then, Gomes said his business went up 30 percent, but is still down about 20 percent from pre-ban days. ...."

That's not to say that our economic climate has no effect, but this man is frank about what the elephant in the room was. He also said in print that all of his employees smoke.

Based on the comments on the thread and those I'm hearing and seeing at the bars, it seems clear that the worst hit bars caved in to their high percentage smoking clientele and the less effected ones strictly enforced the ban. This appeares to be having the effect of people that loath smoking fleeing to smoke free venues and those that demand it taking flight to smoking speakeasies. For those that it is no big deal, they dig both. If you walk in Pigskins now, 3/4 or more of his customers are smoking. He really had no choice but to let this happen.

[QUOTE=Pursuer]Be interested to see the numbers by months.

There has been an increase in personal bankruptcies and a slowing of the economy as a whole, beginning mid/late 06. That accounts for far more than the smoking ban. Look at this christmas season, with people saying they spent less than last year. Gas bills must be taking toll on suv and heavy vehicle drivers, with no end in sight. There is simply less disposable income out there. The numbers don't lie, but the figures can be manipulated.

And I take my business elsewhere if the smoking ban is not enforced.[/QUOTE]

Good, leave. I don't want guys like you sitting next to me at the bar while I smoke. To defeat this law, all the restaurant owners and bar owners have to do is unite and not enforce it. If the workers don't want to work around smoke, fire them and hire others.

[QUOTE=Thumperforq]To defeat this law, all the restaurant owners and bar owners have to do is unite and not enforce it. If the workers don't want to work around smoke, fire them and hire others.[/QUOTE]
Well, if that is done, then the bar owner could probably expect law suits from terminated employees, and for the LC, or whomever enforces it, to shut them down. You can skirt the law to some extent, but I think to openly and blatantly do it is asking for trouble.

[QUOTE=Night Colors]She does have a gambling problem and so does gay ben. Some folks say that her being around him makes her problem worse. I'm surprised she didn't go to By Nite, the staff there was highly tolerent of gambling and openly gambled right on the bar. I'm also surprised the LC didn't see them doing that, it's totally illegal, not that I care because I'm not a gambler and I'm not a rat. It doesn't matter now to post this online since By Nite is no more. With Loni back in control those days are over, she won't allow it. Loni wants some of the younger girls to come back since she only has old timers now however.

One good thing they did was they banned that old J.C. dude. He was loud, rude, and insulting both to customers and the girls and is banned from almost every other bar in Honolulu.[/QUOTE]Actually from what I heard, michelle left for maui because of her large gambling debts. Wouldn't have helped by just working at by nite, as you said, with ben and the others there it would have just made it worse so she finally got enough sense to leave the island.

I saw her a few weeks ago. She is one of the managers at the viet bar there, saigon nites or something. She is doing well, catching up with her debts. Although there isn't much to do there and so many mauians gamble (I'm from maui and gambling was a big thing there) she doesn't gamble at all. She does visit honolulu once and a while, may be here for the holidays already. Yeah, you're right, she is thai, I forgot.

Btw, some nice viet girls working at her place. No play though. But they do seem very busy with customers.

Night colors, thanks for not continuing the flaming, I know we both have differences on the smoking issue and you're right, everyone has their own opinions already formed whether they like smoking or not and nothing anyone says will change their minds. Too bad they can't have seperate areas for smokers but I guess the "in" thing nowadays is to push for the smoke free environment. If by nite had a better ventillation system where the smoke wasn't that bad I may have visited more but I was gagging whenever I stepped through the door so had to stop visiting the place.

Happy new year!

[QUOTE=Hypo Luxa]Well, if that is done, then the bar owner could probably expect law suits from terminated employees, and for the LC, or whomever enforces it, to shut them down. You can skirt the law to some extent, but I think to openly and blatantly do it is asking for trouble.[/QUOTE]

Several of the sports bars have already done this; I don't see any lawsuits or LC forcing them to shutdown. By Nite did this; no enforcement or shutdown. It's time to end the Nannystate laws.

[QUOTE=Hypo Luxa]Well, if that is done, then the bar owner could probably expect law suits from terminated employees, and for the LC, or whomever enforces it, to shut them down. You can skirt the law to some extent, but I think to openly and blatantly do it is asking for trouble.[/QUOTE]I think we had enough of this smoking issue. Can we please move on... issue is DEAD!!

Out at Sky tonight to pick up a young vixen to celebrate my new years. There are a few that are cute and that I'd like to play with (Sara, Abby and Cat. Cat is on the mainland?)

I hope the girls want to work for their money tonight, especially Abby. I read about her, but I've been sitting with her for a couple months. I've been taking her to lunch and dinners and we talk on the phone. We shop and we kiss when she feels like it. She loves to play.

She's the hottest looking and sexiest bar girl. I saw her at the car show with Lyna and the girls. All the bar girls were beautiful. Abby says she's single but with me she feels different so she says. I hope you all have happy endings tonight.

[QUOTE=Thumperforq]Good, leave. I don't want guys like you sitting next to me at the bar while I smoke. To defeat this law, all the restaurant owners and bar owners have to do is unite and not enforce it. If the workers don't want to work around smoke, fire them and hire others.[/QUOTE]Why don't you want me at the bar while you smoke? Could it be that you know second hand smoke causes all kinds of health problems? How thoughtful of you. :D

[QUOTE=Member 69]Actually from what I heard, michelle left for maui because of her large gambling debts. Wouldn't have helped by just working at by nite, as you said, with ben and the others there it would have just made it worse so she finally got enough sense to leave the island.

I saw her a few weeks ago. She is one of the managers at the viet bar there, saigon nites or something. She is doing well, catching up with her debts. Although there isn't much to do there and so many mauians gamble (I'm from maui and gambling was a big thing there) she doesn't gamble at all. She does visit honolulu once and a while, may be here for the holidays already. Yeah, you're right, she is thai, I forgot.

Happy new year![/QUOTE]

You are correct about Michelle needing to leave. I'm glad she tryed to take stock of the problem, even if it ment running away again. By Nite wouldn't have helped her quit gambling anymore than it would have helped me quit smoking, not that I want to. I do miss her company at the bar, however.

Time to turn this computer off for now and go hang out with some girls and blow some fireworks off. Cheers :)

I haven't been out and about for a few months and was wondering if Que(sp?) was still around and working at a bar. She was pretty fun to sit with and go into the room with. Now that I think of it, I may have last seen her over a year ago. I guess I need to get out more.

[QUOTE=Matisse]I haven't been out and about for a few months and was wondering if Que(sp?) was still around and working at a bar. She was pretty fun to sit with and go into the room with. Now that I think of it, I may have last seen her over a year ago. I guess I need to get out more.[/QUOTE]

Q is no longer working at Sky Lounge; she was asked to leave by Jackie and Lyna because of her problems with substance abuse.

Does anyone have any experience with Avon from Sandy and Jen?

She is older 40 or so, viet, but looks local, tanned and with really toned legs and butt, long reddish tan curly hair. No panties, so got lots of touching in the booth. Ofcourse she suggested the karaoke room, but knowing it is expensive, I quit after buying her 3 drinks. She did give me her digits. Does anyone know if she delivers in the room, or does it just end up as a much more expensive tease?

If you prefer PM me.

Question to some of you guys:

I've been mongering for many years and travel all over the place. Unfortunately, I don't foresee getting to Honolulu soon, but I like reading many of the forums, especially threads about AMPs and such.

So what I'm wondering is what is the appeal of these Bars? I mean, I realize it's part of the scene and action can be had, but it seems like it's a lot more dicey and you can spend a lot of money and get nothing. On the other hand, it seems like you have your share of massage places that are well-reviewed and much more of a good bet.

I realize there may be an element of challenge here, too, but ... I've read several pages of the Vietnamese and Korean Bar threads and it seems like there's a lot more negative and uncertainty than positive.

Am I missing something? I'd enjoy any insights - thanks.

[QUOTE=TwistedBrother]Question to some of you guys:

I've been mongering for many years and travel all over the place. Unfortunately, I don't foresee getting to Honolulu soon, but I like reading many of the forums, especially threads about AMPs and such.

So what I'm wondering is what is the appeal of these Bars? I mean, I realize it's part of the scene and action can be had, but it seems like it's a lot more dicey and you can spend a lot of money and get nothing. On the other hand, it seems like you have your share of massage places that are well-reviewed and much more of a good bet.

I realize there may be an element of challenge here, too, but ... I've read several pages of the Vietnamese and Korean Bar threads and it seems like there's a lot more negative and uncertainty than positive.

Am I missing something? I'd enjoy any insights - thanks.[/QUOTE]
Korean and Vietnamese bars are more of a group activity that can be shared with friends. It is pretty much hanging with the boys drinking some beer and if there is a pretty girl working there, just call her over. This all stems from the Asian influence we have in our society. The first bars in the the 50s/60s were run by Japanese mamasans. In the 70s/80s, our Korean bars first popped up. In the 90s, vietnamese bars picked up steam. In the new Millenium, there are Filipino bars, Thai bars and Chinese bars.

I've been at the bars and have worked large business deals in the past. Back in the 70s/80s, many of the large development deals went down or were celebrated in hostess bars. In fact, one of the large construction companies used to have a person on staff whose sole purpose was to entertain clients at the bars! In the ensuing years (90s+), the younger crowd (21 - 30) started to go barhopping for entertainment.

[QUOTE=John Ross]Korean and Vietnamese bars are more of a group activity that can be shared with friends. It is pretty much hanging with the boys drinking some beer and if there is a pretty girl working there, just call her over. This all stems from the Asian influence we have in our society. The first bars in the the 50s/60s were run by Japanese mamasans. In the 70s/80s, our Korean bars first popped up. In the 90s, vietnamese bars picked up steam. In the new Millenium, there are Filipino bars, Thai bars and Chinese bars.

I've been at the bars and have worked large business deals in the past. Back in the 70s/80s, many of the large development deals went down or were celebrated in hostess bars. In fact, one of the large construction companies used to have a person on staff whose sole purpose was to entertain clients at the bars! In the ensuing years (90s+), the younger crowd (21 - 30) started to go barhopping for entertainment.[/QUOTE]To each goes, and how we also really use to do business also when we had clients from the US, Europe, Italy, or Asia. We always after a day of meeting with clients, dinner, then a little (as a quote a past client, "I heard about your bars, where can I get some K Tail")

We have also closed some large contracts in some of the KBs we use to go to, back in the wild wild west of the 80s & 90s. Different, but just LE more on the lookout in the New Age, where before I personally use to go w/friends (high ranking LE) use to hookup also in our pasts. Was nutz, but again, YMMV.

[QUOTE=TwistedBrother]

So what I'm wondering is what is the appeal of these Bars? I mean, I realize it's part of the scene and action can be had, but it seems like it's a lot more dicey and you can spend a lot of money and get nothing. On the other hand, it seems like you have your share of massage places that are well-reviewed and much more of a good bet.

I realize there may be an element of challenge here, too, but ... I've read several pages of the Vietnamese and Korean Bar threads and it seems like there's a lot more negative and uncertainty than positive.

Am I missing something? I'd enjoy any insights - thanks.[/QUOTE]
In addition to the comments by John Ross, there may also be a few other factors that are worthwhile to consider. Some hostess bar customers might enjoy more of a "female companionship" experience in hostess bars (drinking, eating, conversation, singing, etc.) than in AMPs. Some hostess bar customers may feel more comfortable with bar hostesses, and think of bar hostesses as more desirable, because of their perception that bar hostesses are usually less like explicit "prostitutes" than AMP providers. It's probably easier for a customer to believe that a woman likes spending time with him when the customer is buying drinks rather than making a direct cash payment for services rendered. Also, as you mention, there is "an element of challenge" in hostess bars that isn't present in AMPs. Some guys would rather go fishing than simply buy a fish. :)

Years ago I used to frequent hostess bars, had some good times, and met several bar hostesses who eventually became girlfriends. However, as I grew older I wanted a higher probability of sexual pleasure, rather than to face any sort of a challenge and risk wasting time and money. So I became more focused on AMPs and street prostitution, which usually provide a better "bang for the buck."

[QUOTE=TwistedBrother]So what I'm wondering is what is the appeal of these Bars?[/QUOTE]
Another fact is that the girls in the bars are fashion model quality. I mean perfect 10s. A BBBJ or DATY from one of them for $$$ vs. all you can get in an AMP for $$ may be considered a better deal by some.

I'm an AMP guy myself, but definitely see the attraction and stunning beauty of the K/VB girls.

Thanks for the feedback ... I definitely "get" some of these perspectives and can see how I, too, could enjoy or at least appreciate all aspects of this scenario in certain circumstances. Interesting stuff.

[QUOTE=TwistedBrother]Question to some of you guys:

I've been mongering for many years and travel all over the place. Unfortunately, I don't foresee getting to Honolulu soon, but I like reading many of the forums, especially threads about AMPs and such.

So what I'm wondering is what is the appeal of these Bars? I mean, I realize it's part of the scene and action can be had, but it seems like it's a lot more dicey and you can spend a lot of money and get nothing. On the other hand, it seems like you have your share of massage places that are well-reviewed and much more of a good bet.

I realize there may be an element of challenge here, too, but ... I've read several pages of the Vietnamese and Korean Bar threads and it seems like there's a lot more negative and uncertainty than positive.

Am I missing something? I'd enjoy any insights - thanks.[/QUOTE]


Actually in addition to what was posted here are others. Many of the patrons of kb's/vb's are not in their 20's but older. They don't like the club scene or sports bar scene so need someplace else to relax and have a few. Unlike many places on the mainland, many of us would rather go to a kb and not worry about trying to hook up with a girl at a regular bar. To me IMHO that is a bigger crapshoot. At least at the kb's and vb's the girls working know the score so a guy can hook up with a girl for a few drinks without worrying about all the emotional crap going on at a regular bar.

As others have said, we also go to kb's to relax with friends and have a few. No need to sit with the girls, but nice to watch as some of them wear some sexy outfits.

Unlike AMP's, to get fs isn't the primary reason we go to kb's, yes it's great if that is the end result but for many of the older guys (especially over 50 or 60), to have a young girl fawn over you and spend time with you, the kb's and vb's are probably the only places where they can sit with a girl many years younger and not be out of place.

And then there is the thrill of the hunt to try to hook up with a kb or vb girl.

Besides, how many hot looking girls at pick up bars would even think about sitting with some ordinary looking or older guy.

JR and Kapalua are right on the money on this one. The hostess bar thing is much more of a group effort unlike amps. And it is more care free. Don't have to worry about time (just money and how much is she's drinking). Personally being pa'ke I would go for the amps. If you are new to the bar scene you could get stuck with the old ladies and have to stare at the hot ones at the next table thinking wtf man. Happend at "tomorrow" the bar on keamoku a few years back when i first went there. I would have to say that amps are the way to go as it is more bang for your buck, and I hate wasting money. But to each their own.

[QUOTE=Tendo]JR and Kapalua are right on the money on this one. The hostess bar thing is much more of a group effort unlike amps. And it is more care free. Don't have to worry about time (just money and how much is she's drinking). Personally being pa'ke I would go for the amps. If you are new to the bar scene you could get stuck with the old ladies and have to stare at the hot ones at the next table thinking wtf man. Happend at "tomorrow" the bar on keamoku a few years back when i first went there. I would have to say that amps are the way to go as it is more bang for your buck, and I hate wasting money. But to each their own.[/QUOTE]
You should never get stuck sitting with a girl or buying her drinks if you do not like her. Just tell her "next time" or "maybe later" in a nice way.

[QUOTE=John Ross]... In the new Millenium, there are Filipino bars, Thai bars and Chinese bars.[/QUOTE]Would you care to elaborate on the bar (s) that have predominately Thai girls?

I feel Evergreen seems to have the best mix. 1 or 2 girls circulate thru there from various non-Korean countries, but they don't seem to stick around for long. If there's a club that leans toward the Thai persuasion, I'd sure love to find it.

Thanks in advance