"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2566472]I think someone looking for a true SB situation is going to have a problem with their "boyfriend" or SD bringing girls over by the hour. Just one of the differences between SBs and UTR escorts.[/QUOTE]There are many true SB's that accept the multiple baby theorem. Its pretty simple. Would you rather be with a guy that can prove he takes care of his girls (with in your face absolute proof). Or take your chances on a Mr Big Talk and that might be married?
(sorry guys)

And of course there is always the mystique of being with a guy that attracts more women than he could ever fuck. They want to know what makes that guy so special. Must be something good, right?

And then uniquely in my case if they happen to see my daughter or her car they are blown away. So I got a few features that get me my benefits. And the 5 steps, that will work for anyone. Modified or just brainlessly mailing it out en mass.

Plus the whole responsible but still a bad boy type. A risk worth taking for many.

I have been enjoying the posts on this 'side' of the site, for some time. I tried early on to find a suitable SB that was reasonably local. Actually stumbled on one at CL. She was looking for a ltr and after a zillion emails we met back in March. I took it very slow and didn't push for sex, right away, though she knew that would be the goal. Long story short, we have had a great relationship sexually. In fact it has been some of the best I have EVER had. She's a 10 in the sack and submissive. She loves the daddy / daughter dynamic. But enough about her.

3 months ago I joined SA and found it to be one of the most frustrating experiences I've had with women. Cancellations, late arrivals, one even showed up with a GUY (her neighbor who was 'looking out' for her. I had had it! Then something told me to stick it out for one more month.

I did and everything changed. I found an 18 yo (19 now) Asian girl who lives out of town. Fortunately (and by design) she is in an area I work regularly. We talked by email for a month, before we did a M&G. It went just okay, I thought and wouldn't have been surprised if she blew me off when I called.

I called her the next week and she agreed to see me, but said she expected 5 for a visit. I used the HWG method of reason but it didn't seem to take. I thanked her for her time and wished her much success. Two days later, she texts me and apologizes and agrees to my terms.

She doesn't have a car, so I pick her up at her apt. We get a nice dinner and head to my hotel. (FWIW Indian food is a BAD idea for a first date. Her choice) We chat a while and I take the lead and start oral on her while she's sitting in a chair. There is nothing more satisfying than 18 yo pussy. I glove up and we roll for 45 minutes. I was exhausted. She was tired too, so I offered to drive her home.

She gets this wounded puppy expression and asks if I was unhappy with her performance?? I say no, but we can fine tune it. She informs me that the glove is unnecessary because of BC.

We go again and then I HAVE to sleep. Of course we're both naked in bed and I can help myself. Twice I wake her and we go at it. Have to love youth.

We have another date this week. I am SOOOO happy that I listened to that little voice. Now there seem to be several who are interested. Do they talk with each other? Anyway, thanks for the invaluable guidance!

This spinner seems to be ready to rock. AA 5'7" and 110. A dancer currently on the road but says she will be in L. A. soon. She called me, so that's always a positive sign as I had lost her number.

[blue][Deleted by Admin][/blue]
[b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]This report was edited to [u]remove references to underage persons[/u].

I am aware that the vast majority of references to underage girls are legitimate attempts to warn other fellow members about how easy it is to accidentally pickup an underage girls, the potential dangers of being caught with underage girls, etc. However, past discussions in the Forum has repeatedly demonstrated that the subject simply cannot be discussed intelligently, in any form or for any reason, without being misinterpreted, and without starting flame wars.

Please do not post references to underage persons in the Forum. [i]Thanks![/i][/blue]

[QUOTE=HollywoodGuy;2566596]There are many true SB's that accept the multiple baby theorem. Its pretty simple. Would you rather be with a guy that can prove he takes care of his girls (with in your face absolute proof). Or take your chances on a Mr Big Talk and that might be married?
(sorry guys)

And of course there is always the mystique of being with a guy that attracts more women than he could ever fuck. They want to know what makes that guy so special. Must be something good, right?

And then uniquely in my case if they happen to see my daughter or her car they are blown away. So I got a few features that get me my benefits. And the 5 steps, that will work for anyone. Modified or just brainlessly mailing it out en mass.

Plus the whole responsible but still a bad boy type. A risk worth taking for many.[/QUOTE]I get what you mean and agree when considered in a certain context. There are plenty of true SBs out there that might even join in on the fun with other girls if the circumstances are right. But, what I didn't communicate very well is that I was speaking mostly about Asian SBs. Yours might be a bit different in the sense that she grew up (I'm assuming) in the USA. But, if she is as innocent as she claims, and from a rich family as she claims, she would be subject to some of the cultural anomalies of her "non-Americanized" counterparts.

To an Asian girl, most of the traits you've described above would not impress them. Bad boys / playboys / etc. Who get all the pussy they can find time for are all over their male dominated culture, so being "that guy" doesn't buy much with them. They have in their minds that they should always be an SB to a large extent, even in a "regular" civy relationship, it's up to the male to take care of them. Its a cultural thing. They are also more likely to get jealous or possessive, particularly after you're fucking them, than an American girl would, and less likely to be open-minded to threesomes and what not. They can also get weird even if you are in a fairly open arrangement with them when it comes to being accepting of you having unprotected sex with other girls, partially because of the perceived health risk to them. I can remember dating one who was cheating on her fianc with me. She knew another girl was coming to stay the weekend with me and she didn't even bat an eye, until later it dawned on her that I was probably going bareback with the other girl just as I had been doing with her, then she started freaking out giving me lectures about HIV and so forth.

Now all of this is shamefully stereotypical and you will absolutely find exceptions (particularly if they grew up in the US), but once you've been with countless numbers of them you will start to notice patterns of generalizations that do seem to hold up overall.

Oh yeah, and you've already encountered some of the menstrual madness. Get ready for a lot more of that rollercoaster with Asians. lol.... it can get pretty bad. Worse IMO than with USA girls.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2566894]I get what you mean and agree when considered in a certain context. There are plenty of true SBs out there that might even join in on the fun with other girls if the circumstances are right. But, what I didn't communicate very well is that I was speaking mostly about Asian SBs. Yours might be a bit different in the sense that she grew up (I'm assuming) in the USA. But, if she is as innocent as she claims, and from a rich family as she claims, she would be subject to some of the cultural anomalies of her "non-Americanized" counterparts.

To an Asian girl, most of the traits you've described above would not impress them. Bad boys / playboys / etc. Who get all the pussy they can find time for are all over their male dominated culture, so being "that guy" doesn't buy much with them. They have in their minds that they should always be an SB to a large extent, even in a "regular" civy relationship, it's up to the male to take care of them. Its a cultural thing. They are also more likely to get jealous or possessive, particularly after you're fucking them, than an American girl would, and less likely to be open-minded to threesomes and what not. They can also get weird even if you are in a fairly open arrangement with them when it comes to being accepting of you having unprotected sex with other girls, partially because of the perceived health risk to them. I can remember dating one who was cheating on her fianc with me. She knew another girl was coming to stay the weekend with me and she didn't even bat an eye, until later it dawned on her that I was probably going bareback with the other girl just as I had been doing with her, then she started freaking out giving me lectures about HIV and so forth.

Now all of this is shamefully stereotypical and you will absolutely find exceptions (particularly if they grew up in the US), but once you've been with countless numbers of them you will start to notice patterns of generalizations that do seem to hold up overall.

Oh yeah, and you've already encountered some of the menstrual madness. Get ready for a lot more of that rollercoaster with Asians. lol.... it can get pretty bad. Worse IMO than with USA girls.[/QUOTE]Yeah, I don't date too many asians. Except for my ex roommate, I have only had a few. Here is a cute indonesian girl I lived with until she tried to get me to kick the habit for good. I managed to stay exclusive to her for 6 months until it just became too much for me to handle. And this girl was a 9 in the sack. And a little kinky.

I my situation I can't really hide what I do, so I have to just find girls that are accepting of my lifestyle. This is the last one that made any real attempt to, and that was already maybe 3 years ago. Not gonna happen.

[QUOTE=HoundOnI81;2567196]At what point does an SB become something more professional? Is the difference how you meet her? Or how many guys she is seeing?

I have met SBs from the SA site that seem to be very low volume. I've met SBs from craigslist that seem to be very low mileage.

I would consider backpage contacts as escorts or UTR- no plans on trying that.

Take out from restaurants- always a fun challenge and I consider them UTR.

I would like to make sure future posts go in the right section.

Hound.[/QUOTE]We all go back and forth on this. But IMHO a Pro is someone working 2 or more men for money. For your purposes posting on this this thread, any SB found IRL or on a Sugar website, and who is not listed on CL, BP, with an agency or pimp or has her own professional webpage can be considered an Sb until being proven otherwise. One could argue that a true SB could come from anywhere -like CL or BP, or in the personal listings FFM or other dating sites like AM, Fling, Match, etc. There is a fine line between Pros and SBs. I guess that line would be the existence of a relationship beyond just sex for money.

Timely topic, I've been chatting with the SB and just got her digits. A quick google shows she's advertised on BP under escorts.

Any advise on how to maximize my enjoyment with her?

[QUOTE=Telcova;2567323]Timely topic, I've been chatting with the SB and just got her digits. A quick google shows she's advertised on BP under escorts.

Any advise on how to maximize my enjoyment with her?[/QUOTE]Forget about her.

Its been just over a year since I broke up with my GF/SB. I ended it due to poor performance in the FC. But we have been talking the entire time. Recently I suggested she come by just for a casual visit. Maybe tomorrow. I know she has a GF right now, but a lot of insecure young girls will retreat to that when their personal confidence is low, if they are emotionally dissatisfied or their overall disdain for men in general gets too high.

I have some experience with bi-girls as my first wife was a true blue bi, and still is to this day. After 5 years of being married to her and 40 years of talking to her I have a pretty good idea of what goes on in some girls minds about this, that are not full on lez.

At this point my conversations with my x SB are not "sugar coated" and I think there is still a chance for a reunification of sorts. With a girl this fine its worth it to me to hang in there. Our feelings for each other were very strong. Also I miss the whole GF dynamic.

Looks wise, she is my version of a 10/10. Face Body. Turns 22 this month. 5'5" & 102.

[QUOTE=HoundOnI81;2567196]At what point does an SB become something more professional? Is the difference how you meet her? Or how many guys she is seeing?

I have met SBs from the SA site that seem to be very low volume. I've met SBs from craigslist that seem to be very low mileage.

I would consider backpage contacts as escorts or UTR- no plans on trying that.

Take out from restaurants- always a fun challenge and I consider them UTR.

I would like to make sure future posts go in the right section.

Hound.[/QUOTE]I'd highly recommend using the Index and FAQ thread to catch up on a lot of these topics, many of them have been discussed at length and you can get a feel for each differing opinion:

[URL]http://www.usasexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?15100-Sugarbaby-Thread-Highlights-Index-and-FAQ[/URL]

[QUOTE=HollywoodGuy;2567350]Forget about her.[/QUOTE]Agreed.

And while you're at it chastise her for not being smart enough to realize that sugar babying and escorting are two different things, and tell her to stick to BP.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2567404]Agreed.

And while you're at it chastise her for not being smart enough to realize that sugar babying and escorting are two different things, and tell her to stick to BP.[/QUOTE]She is smart enough to realize that the lines are blurred between Sugar and Hooker. We all know escorts use Sugar sites for recruiting. Sometimes it's hard to tell the difference. I met a cute 27 yr old 8/8/7/7 on a Sugar site-many of you know her, fucked her a few times, and saw her transition to an UTR site, then to BP, and blew up as a full on hooker. At least 5 guys were writing about her on another USA site. She is a single Mom, had a decent professional job, then went downhill. Sad. She must've gotten on drugs IMO.

The point is -you can't tell sometimes. If they are seeing 2 or more guys for money they are escorts.

[QUOTE=FredMoore;2567435] If they are seeing 2 or more guys for money they are escorts.[/QUOTE]I think lots of them start out with the great expectations filling their heads and then find out that they aren't going to be able to live off of one guy. If they are desperate for cash it's easy for them to make the mental leap from a single SD to multiples. Pretty soon they are an UTR.

My favorite for a while was an 18 year old latina who told me I was her first SD. I kind of believed her but you never know. I kept seeing her active on SA so I gathered she was either looking for more than one or a better deal than my 120. Sure enough, before long she broke it off with me, saying she had met someone who was willing to give her 300. I tried to use the "he's looking for a notch and will dump you" logic on her, to know avail. A few weeks later she changed her profile heading to "this was a mistake", then deleted the profile. Recently she started texting me again, had moved back in with her parents, was on lockdown, and was feeling low. I offered to take her to lunch, NSA, no sugar. We had a nice lunch and I dropped her back off near her house. That afternoon she texted me that she was thinking about being a SB again because she owes her sister money and wanted to get out from under the debt. I told her I would take her back on the same terms. At first she said no, she had gotten greedy (her words) and didn't want to ask me for more money. I countered with the offer to see her more frequently than before but at the same rate until her debt was paid, and she agreed. She is supposed to come over later this afternoon for our first meeting in months. So while I think she crossed the line a while back, I think she found it was not to her liking and wants something more on the lines of a real SB arrangement. She may go UTR again in the future, but for now I don't think she will be seeing anyone else just because her parents are keeping her on such a tight leash. We shall see.

[QUOTE=Dsprdo;2567461]I think lots of them start out with the great expectations filling their heads and then find out that they aren't going to be able to live off of one guy. If they are desperate for cash it's easy for them to make the mental leap from a single SD to multiples. Pretty soon they are an UTR.

e.[/QUOTE]Totally true -It is easy money until they encounter an abusive user. And think about it -if we "had" to screw every hag that came along life would not seem so grand. At least we choose who we are going to bless with our family jewels. Once you start down the road where you take all cum-ers it could be pretty miserable. I think it is too tempting for these girls -particularly the young ones-to pass up the big bucks just for lying on their backs. You can see how it goes -making $120 X 4 =$480 / month. Pick up another and another $500 -1000. Tempting. I wish someone would pay me to screw them.

[QUOTE=FredMoore;2567435]She is smart enough to realize that the lines are blurred between Sugar and Hooker. We all know escorts use Sugar sites for recruiting. Sometimes it's hard to tell the difference. I met a cute 27 yr old 8/8/7/7 on a Sugar site-many of you know her, fucked her a few times, and saw her transition to an UTR site, then to BP, and blew up as a full on hooker. At least 5 guys were writing about her on another USA site. She is a single Mom, had a decent professional job, then went downhill. Sad. She must've gotten on drugs IMO.

The point is -you can't tell sometimes. If they are seeing 2 or more guys for money they are escorts.[/QUOTE]It's not a matter of whether idiots do it or not, it's a matter of whether they should. I'm saying chastise her for entitling herself to ignore the terms of service of the site while simultaneously agreeing to them.

It takes an enormously self-centered person to go through life believing the rules don't apply to her. Not surprising, from a gold digging hooker, but at the same time those who understand and respect the differences should feel empowered to strike back and preserve their hobby however they need to.

As far as SD's the advice to avoid these girls is good, because they've had loads in their mouth from every variety of crackhead and needle-marked degenerate out there. Most SDs I think are looking for some cleaner poon than that.

My first monthly subscription ended about two weeks ago and here's the update.

Ton of messaging, almost like drinking from a fire hose. Lots of utr's, maybe one or two worth following up.

Had one from the wrong side of town tell me she thought rimming me out would be way hot. Almost thought about going for it but the pics didn't really move the needle.

Ton's of flakes, including day of. Had one show up that was the thing that ate the chick in her pictures she sent.

6 m&g's, 4 ending in BJ's in the parking lot, 2 worthy of seeing again.

Probably the best of the 4, 24 yo 8 face, 9 body. Had her bobbin for jizz, cheering her on with some dirty talk (that's it baby, suck daddy's dick, oh yea, suck daddy's dick) Helping her with additional torque and velocity.

She got hotter and more into it as we went and she finished up by swallowing all the gravy. We talked for a while after and all seemed right with the world, after our episode she ask if she could call me daddy from time to time, (my dick just moved) but she fell off when she made the mental leap that she wasn't just sucking some guys dick, she was going to get money, making her a bit of a prostitute. I don't think she could handle it. We exchanged a message recently and who knows maybe she'll come back.

Two are worth a follow up but require hotel arrangements so I'm going to try to keep them on hot standby while I work the remaining prospects.

Having an s o limits my availability so I have to pick and choose. The idea of a baby with her own place is a definite plus, but not always easy to find.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2566894]I get what you mean and agree when considered in a certain context. There are plenty of true SBs out there that might even join in on the fun with other girls if the circumstances are right. But, what I didn't communicate very well is that I was speaking mostly about Asian SBs. Yours might be a bit different in the sense that she grew up (I'm assuming) in the USA. But, if she is as innocent as she claims, and from a rich family as she claims, she would be subject to some of the cultural anomalies of her "non-Americanized" counterparts.

To an Asian girl, most of the traits you've described above would not impress them. Bad boys / playboys / etc. Who get all the pussy they can find time for are all over their male dominated culture, so being "that guy" doesn't buy much with them. They have in their minds that they should always be an SB to a large extent, even in a "regular" civy relationship, it's up to the male to take care of them. Its a cultural thing. They are also more likely to get jealous or possessive, particularly after you're fucking them, than an American girl would, and less likely to be open-minded to threesomes and what not. They can also get weird even if you are in a fairly open arrangement with them when it comes to being accepting of you having unprotected sex with other girls, partially because of the perceived health risk to them. I can remember dating one who was cheating on her fianc with me. She knew another girl was coming to stay the weekend with me and she didn't even bat an eye, until later it dawned on her that I was probably going bareback with the other girl just as I had been doing with her, then she started freaking out giving me lectures about HIV and so forth.

Now all of this is shamefully stereotypical and you will absolutely find exceptions (particularly if they grew up in the US), but once you've been with countless numbers of them you will start to notice patterns of generalizations that do seem to hold up overall.

Oh yeah, and you've already encountered some of the menstrual madness. Get ready for a lot more of that rollercoaster with Asians. lol.... it can get pretty bad. Worse IMO than with USA girls.[/QUOTE]A lot of what you say is true as I have experienced that with my ex (Chinese), as she comes back to visit me once or twice a month even though she is engaged with someone new. I get the same lectures about using protection with the other girls. She doesn't believe me and wants me to use protection with her. We never did that before, but I also get a touch of jealousy from her even though she's doing her new fiance. But she was like that when we were married as our marriage was fairly open.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2567404]Agreed.

And while you're at it chastise her for not being smart enough to realize that sugar babying and escorting are two different things, and tell her to stick to BP.[/QUOTE]I had to do that within the past two days with two girls that contacted me. I did my part of encouraging her off the site and to stay with BP. All of us need to do our part of keeping the escorts off this site.

[QUOTE=FredMoore;2567435]She is smart enough to realize that the lines are blurred between Sugar and Hooker. We all know escorts use Sugar sites for recruiting. Sometimes it's hard to tell the difference. I met a cute 27 yr old 8/8/7/7 on a Sugar site-many of you know her, fucked her a few times, and saw her transition to an UTR site, then to BP, and blew up as a full on hooker. At least 5 guys were writing about her on another USA site. She is a single Mom, had a decent professional job, then went downhill. Sad. She must've gotten on drugs IMO.

The point is -you can't tell sometimes. If they are seeing 2 or more guys for money they are escorts.[/QUOTE]I don't know. Not being difficult but why can't a SB have two daddies? Escorts to me have several guys / customers, but a girl that steadily sees just two daddies is one also?

[QUOTE=Mike7794;2564015]Very nice HG, very nice indeed. I love the shiny jet black hair Asians have.

JL you have me laughing at the pulse comment.

Sunday 23 yo, 5'3" slim, Asian.

Later today I'll be meeting a POT 28 yo, 5'5" athletic build?

And trying to confirm times for Saturday with 21 yo, 5'4" slim.[/QUOTE]An update from my weekend.

The Asian I met went very well. We sat for a few hours talking on a patio at a bar. She is a Phillipino Asian. 9 face, 8 body, 9 intellect. Her Asian features turned many a head, but it was her intellect that turned me on. We met yesterday and set up another meeting for Wednesday that ultimately got moved to today. We hit the FC and it was pretty prime. We spent a few hours in the city first, because we click so well we both enjoy each other's company. Kind of an old soul as she is into collecting vinyl records, 1980 sports cars, and is turned off by social ineptness, and a daddy not being able to distinguish between "your" and "you're" LOL (her words). I don't sense the possessiveness of this Asian as has been discussed earlier in this thread. She might be a keeper.

The 28 year old 5'5" naked 10 body. High drama as she couldn't meet this past Friday as she had car issues of it being repossessed and working on getting it back, then Saturday she went to Tennessee to be with her father that died that day, then Sunday after getting her car back on Friday it broke down in TN. Today she was deathly sick. Normally I would move on, but that little 10 body is worth being patient for. I want to do this one in the worst way. I would give her a score of 10/9/5.

The 21 year old 5'4" I was supposed to meet on Saturday. She is having fear issues of being new to the site, but seems like a really nice young woman. I will also be patient with this one as her little body is another 10 killer for me. I like this one's personality. Kind of a clean girl who needs a daddy to help her break through the barrier. I would give her a score of 10/9. I can't give the last score because I haven't talked to her enough to have a score in that area. She has been silent since Saturday.

That left me with a zero for Friday night with the 28 yo, and not being able to hook up with her for Saturday and the 21 yo on Friday, so I set up a FC with my regular senior to be university student for Saturday. At the same time I set up a new appointment with a 31 year old 5'2" slim POT (pic below) I started talking to for Sunday in case the Asian flaked on me. She didn't and I then had two M& G that day. The 31 year old turned out to look much better than her pictures and more petite than her picture looked. Connected well over dinner and talked for maybe three hours. We set up a FC session for tomorrow.

I'm still working on that 28 yo. Tomorrow's out since I'm seeing the 31 yo and I have too much going on at work during the day with meetings to attend, so I'm hoping to see her on Wednesday. If I get that 28 yo in the sack she is going to pay from daddy for putting daddy off for so long.

I usually just move on from the obvious girls just looking for a platonic relationship, but this one was so ridiculous I almost had to respond. Almost. I did just move on, but thought you all would get a laugh out of this. This was posted in her profile.

"I have a lot of inquiries so if your interest is serious I'm asking a $400 deposit before I speak to anyone. Thanks!

What I'm looking for.

Just a young girl that wants to be spoiled and have fun! Not looking to be in a committed relationship or a sexual one, just want to be someone's arm candy when they need it / want it! * Important: I have very strong morals and boundaries that I'm not willing to change for anything that anyone has to offer, I'm saving myself so the only type of relationship (friendship) I'm interested in is an intellectual one not physical. ".

Good Hunting!

Travelin.

[QUOTE=TravelinSD;2568070]I usually just move on from the obvious girls just looking for a platonic relationship, but this one was so ridiculous I almost had to respond. Almost. I did just move on, but thought you all would get a laugh out of this. This was posted in her profile.

"I have a lot of inquiries so if your interest is serious I'm asking a $400 deposit before I speak to anyone. Thanks!

What I'm looking for.

Just a young girl that wants to be spoiled and have fun! Not looking to be in a committed relationship or a sexual one, just want to be someone's arm candy when they need it / want it! * Important: I have very strong morals and boundaries that I'm not willing to change for anything that anyone has to offer, I'm saving myself so the only type of relationship (friendship) I'm interested in is an intellectual one not physical. ".

Good Hunting!

Travelin.[/QUOTE]I've seen some of those myself in my area. It is tempting to respond. Amazing.

[QUOTE=Mike7794;2568067]An update from my weekend.

The 31 year old turned out to look much better than her pictures and more petite than her picture looked. [/QUOTE]LOL! Last week for only the 2nd time I ended a date as soon as the girl got in the car. This one described herself as "average". I should have guessed when her profile had only face shots and the one private pic she was in very loose clothing. As she came walking out to the car she was obviously way past "a few extra pounds" and solidly into "overweight". She got in the car and I told her I was sorry, but this just wasn't going to work. She did take it fairly well.

Good Hunting!

Travelin.

[QUOTE=TravelinSD;2568088]LOL! Last week for only the 2nd time I ended a date as soon as the girl got in the car. This one described herself as "average". I should have guessed when her profile had only face shots and the one private pic she was in very loose clothing. As she came walking out to the car she was obviously way past "a few extra pounds" and solidly into "overweight". She got in the car and I told her I was sorry, but this just wasn't going to work. She did take it fairly well.

Good Hunting!

Travelin.[/QUOTE]Early on I got fooled or just wasnt thinking and had the same experience, more than once. Always have good pics before meeting. LOL.

Personally I think that's some interesting scores that makes the subscription worthwhile.

BTW, do you subscribe to SA? And, in which area do you normally fish?

[QUOTE=SouthShoreAlex;2567682]My first monthly subscription ended about two weeks ago and here's the update.

Ton of messaging, almost like drinking from a fire hose. Lots of utr's, maybe one or two worth following up.

Had one from the wrong side of town tell me she thought rimming me out would be way hot. Almost thought about going for it but the pics didn't really move the needle.

Ton's of flakes, including day of. Had one show up that was the thing that ate the chick in her pictures she sent.

6 m&g's, 4 ending in BJ's in the parking lot, 2 worthy of seeing again.

Probably the best of the 4, 24 yo 8 face, 9 body. Had her bobbin for jizz, cheering her on with some dirty talk (that's it baby, suck daddy's dick, oh yea, suck daddy's dick) Helping her with additional torque and velocity.

She got hotter and more into it as we went and she finished up by swallowing all the gravy. We talked for a while after and all seemed right with the world, after our episode she ask if she could call me daddy from time to time, (my dick just moved) but she fell off when she made the mental leap that she wasn't just sucking some guys dick, she was going to get money, making her a bit of a prostitute. I don't think she could handle it. We exchanged a message recently and who knows maybe she'll come back.

Two are worth a follow up but require hotel arrangements so I'm going to try to keep them on hot standby while I work the remaining prospects.

Having an s o limits my availability so I have to pick and choose. The idea of a baby with her own place is a definite plus, but not always easy to find.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Mike7794;2567985]I don't know. Not being difficult but why can't a SB have two daddies? Escorts to me have several guys / customers, but a girl that steadily sees just two daddies is one also?[/QUOTE]My personal opinion -Yes- each to his own. A label is just that but it is good to know in your own mind how to process your activities. Does that make us Johns if we see 1 SB? Probably. If a girl is collecting men to pay her and is willing to have sex to do it then she is a pro by definition. The only way to avoid that definition is the existence of a relationship that is not solely dependent on a sex / money dynamic. Most SBs would not see any of us unless they were getting paid. And we would not pay them without the expectation of sex. An exception to that rule is the true IRL bar / dating site pickup. I know my SBs "like" me and many are thrilled with the sex, but I have yet had one offer to drop the allowance. I know it happens because some of you report it, but those girls see some of you as a potential IRL "catch".

For those of you who see Escorts you know the difference in mentality between a naive college girl wanting to pay for her tuition and taking a dick for the effort vs a working Pro with a Pimp, website, agency, etc. The SB college girl is just starting on that slippery slope to being a Pro. It isn't long before she sees how easy it is to bang some geeze and pocket an easy $$$ ,then another and another. Same with us guys. If I had the time and $ I would see a different SB every day ala Hollywood in his prime. I want to catch the SB at the naive stage where she hasn't acquired the hooker mentality, and actually can still respond emotionally and actually enjoy the ride.

[QUOTE=FredMoore;2568482] I want to catch the SB at the naive stage where she hasn't acquired the hooker mentality, and actually can still respond emotionally and actually enjoy the ride.[/QUOTE]That is the real difference between this and just hitting pro's in a nutshell. There have been several SB threads started in other cities over the past few months and a comment I think I've seen on all of them (and probably on this one, too) is "the SB thing takes too much time and effort, it's easier for me to stick to a tried and true pro. " Easier, yes, but IMHO the difference in the experience is more than worth the effort and there is no comparison between the two.

[QUOTE=FredMoore;2568482]Most SBs would not see any of us unless they were getting paid. And we would not pay them without the expectation of sex.I have yet had one offer to drop the allowance. [/QUOTE]I've had one that I reported on, and she's coming over today. She's kind of a train wreck, headed for divorce, wants to feel wanted and to get laid, which she isn't at home. I have a hotter, younger SB that I would rather see, but I can't turn away a goft horse like that, can I? Funny thing is if I were still giving her allowance we would probaably be done.

[QUOTE=FredMoore;2568482] I want to catch the SB at the naive stage where she hasn't acquired the hooker mentality, and actually can still respond emotionally and actually enjoy the ride.[/QUOTE]That is the name of the game. The longer I do it, the easier it gets in some ways and harder in others. (no puns intended).

"Average" for WHAT?

[QUOTE=TravelinSD;2568088]LOL! Last week for only the 2nd time I ended a date as soon as the girl got in the car. This one described herself as "average". I should have guessed when her profile had only face shots and the one private pic she was in very loose clothing. As she came walking out to the car she was obviously way past "a few extra pounds" and solidly into "overweight". She got in the car and I told her I was sorry, but this just wasn't going to work. She did take it fairly well.

Good Hunting!

Travelin.[/QUOTE]

Girls on my A list.

1. A super hot Latina that's engaged, has a kid with and lives with her fiance.
Says she can sneak out this Saturday. Thats a big maybe.

2. My little Church Girl that went back to church.
She will come back to me one day, but who knows when.

3. My ATF who I banged 2 days ago in spite of her injuries from her motorcycle accident.
Can't really push her till she gets better.

4. My X GF/SB that I haven't fucked in a year. Supposed to see her this week.

5. My X Roomy. She is a prisoner of love and living with her new BF.

6. My Virgin. Out of town till tomorrow. This may be all over anyway.

7. My MILF who is now a Nando 1. Way too boozy and woozy for me.

So for now its back to prospecting and banging this little mexican UTR girl I met off CL a week or so ago. She is hot in most every way, but it's strictly business. Date number three looks like a for sure for tonite. I am lucky I met her during this transitional phase.

[QUOTE=FredMoore;2568482]My personal opinion -Yes- each to his own. A label is just that but it is good to know in your own mind how to process your activities. Does that make us Johns if we see 1 SB? Probably. If a girl is collecting men to pay her and is willing to have sex to do it then she is a pro by definition. The only way to avoid that definition is the existence of a relationship that is not solely dependent on a sex / money dynamic. Most SBs would not see any of us unless they were getting paid. And we would not pay them without the expectation of sex. An exception to that rule is the true IRL bar / dating site pickup. I know my SBs "like" me and many are thrilled with the sex, but I have yet had one offer to drop the allowance. I know it happens because some of you report it, but those girls see some of you as a potential IRL "catch".

For those of you who see Escorts you know the difference in mentality between a naive college girl wanting to pay for her tuition and taking a dick for the effort vs a working Pro with a Pimp, website, agency, etc. The SB college girl is just starting on that slippery slope to being a Pro. It isn't long before she sees how easy it is to bang some geeze and pocket an easy $$$ ,then another and another. Same with us guys. If I had the time and $ I would see a different SB every day ala Hollywood in his prime. I want to catch the SB at the naive stage where she hasn't acquired the hooker mentality, and actually can still respond emotionally and actually enjoy the ride.[/QUOTE]Not all college SBs are headed toward a sex career though. Not all of them are even college SBs, some of them have waitress or bartender jobs or retail jobs which pay the basic bills but they still like fucking older guys and have a fantasy about a better life with one, whether that involves a long term relationship, or just a travel partner that can take them to see things they would not otherwise be able to see.

Yes we can say the line is blurred between the two extremes, but that's really an over-simplification of the facts. The fact is that there is a spectrum, and we could say that all females fall somewhere on that spectrum. If we give the spectrum a numeric scale, we could say:

0 - a streetwalker. Fucks anyone with money.

1 - BP escort. Fucks anyone with money.

2 - UTR escort, might work only on referrals or fuck anyone with money but is careful not to advertise as such. Might attempt legal ads like SB and CL.

3 - Stripper that does a little free lancing outside the club.

4 - True sugar baby or financially dependent girlfriend. Likes dating above her wealth level and being spoiled, but does not cross the legal boundaries of prostitution or do direct pay for play.

5 - Typical wife or girlfriend.

6 - Sugar momma who is independently wealthy but spends her money fucking cubs or men who otherwise wouldn't look twice at her. Most likely donut and bagel addicted.

Everyone from a 0 to 5 has two fundamentals in common -- they have a pussy and they like money but they don't have it. 6 almost has that in common except they have money so we can filter them out of the discussion for now.

So the question is, what categorization of women should be allowed to use the SD sites, knowing that terms of service is designed explicitly for #4 on the SB side of the equation (not including sugar mommas looking for young meat but honestly I wish they would give those their own site).

Ok, so we know that #2 and #3 creep into the SD sites sometimes. But how can anyone who wants the SD sites to sustain support them becoming polluted with #0 and #1? It will only result in the wrong kind of legal attention. #0 and #1 already have perfectly good areas to conduct their business, why must they infect ours?

So, it is not really accurate to say the line is blurred. The line is crystal clear and it is defined by the law. Sugarbabying is perfectly legal and the sites allow that behavior. They do not allow breaking the law and anyone who does is endangering the hobby and the future viability of these sites.

I wonder how many people want to stand up in front of a judge and say "well your honor the way I see things the line is kind of blurred about what the law is or is not". Hint of the day -- it won't fly and it isn't an acceptable excuse. Ignorance of the law is not an acceptable crutch.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2568820]Not all college SBs are headed toward a sex career though. Not all of them are even college SBs, some of them have waitress or bartender jobs or retail jobs which pay the basic bills but they still like fucking older guys and have a fantasy about a better life with one, whether that involves a long term relationship, or just a travel partner that can take them to see things they would not otherwise be able to see.

Yes we can say the line is blurred between the two extremes, but that's really an over-simplification of the facts. The fact is that there is a spectrum, and we could say that all females fall somewhere on that spectrum. If we give the spectrum a numeric scale, we could say:

0 - a streetwalker. Fucks anyone with money.

1 - BP escort. Fucks anyone with money.

2 - UTR escort, might work only on referrals or fuck anyone with money but is careful not to advertise as such. Might attempt legal ads like SB and CL.

3 - Stripper that does a little free lancing outside the club.

4 - True sugar baby or financially dependent girlfriend. Likes dating above her wealth level and being spoiled, but does not cross the legal boundaries of prostitution or do direct pay for play.

5 - Typical wife or girlfriend.

6 - Sugar momma who is independently wealthy but spends her money fucking cubs or men who otherwise wouldn't look twice at her. Most likely donut and bagel addicted.

Everyone from a 0 to 5 has two fundamentals in common -- they have a pussy and they like money but they don't have it. 6 almost has that in common except they have money so we can filter them out of the discussion for now.

So the question is, what categorization of women should be allowed to use the SD sites, knowing that terms of service is designed explicitly for #4 on the SB side of the equation (not including sugar mommas looking for young meat but honestly I wish they would give those their own site).

Ok, so we know that #2 and #3 creep into the SD sites sometimes. But how can anyone who wants the SD sites to sustain support them becoming polluted with #0 and #1? It will only result in the wrong kind of legal attention. #0 and #1 already have perfectly good areas to conduct their business, why must they infect ours?

So, it is not really accurate to say the line is blurred. The line is crystal clear and it is defined by the law. Sugarbabying is perfectly legal and the sites allow that behavior. They do not allow breaking the law and anyone who does is endangering the hobby and the future viability of these sites.

I wonder how many people want to stand up in front of a judge and say "well your honor the way I see things the line is kind of blurred about what the law is or is not". Hint of the day -- it won't fly and it isn't an acceptable excuse. Ignorance of the law is not an acceptable crutch.[/QUOTE]The sites themselves will never be able to eradicate the pro's from joining. The best they can do is not allow the offer of sex for money on profiles, and they're pretty good about that. So really, the only way to keep them off is to make it too much work for them. And this can only be accomplished through the men on the site. If the men insist on meet and greets before going to the FC, and don't discuss pay for play through messaging, the pro's will have to put in too much work to make it worth their while. Especially when they have to compete with the majority of women on the site who aren't professionals. All of the pro's on SA in my area do not last. I've recognized quite a few who's ads I've seen on BP, or who's phone numbers I've gotten and then googled only to see their escort ads. Most of these women are on the site consistently for a month or so before they delete their profile or stop logging on. So the best way to keep the pro's off the site? Keep the john's off the site. Or at the very least, educate the john's on proper behavior. Easier said then done of course, but if the typical monger starts seeing these sites as an alternative to BP, then the escorts will start to show up in droves.

[QUOTE=DogSun;2568834]The sites themselves will never be able to eradicate the pro's from joining. The best they can do is not allow the offer of sex for money on profiles, and they're pretty good about that. So really, the only way to keep them off is to make it too much work for them. And this can only be accomplished through the men on the site. If the men insist on meet and greets before going to the FC, and don't discuss pay for play through messaging, the pro's will have to put in too much work to make it worth their while. Especially when they have to compete with the majority of women on the site who aren't professionals. All of the pro's on SA in my area do not last. I've recognized quite a few who's ads I've seen on BP, or who's phone numbers I've gotten and then googled only to see their escort ads. Most of these women are on the site consistently for a month or so before they delete their profile or stop logging on. So the best way to keep the pro's off the site? Keep the john's off the site. Or at the very least, educate the john's on proper behavior. Easier said then done of course, but if the typical monger starts seeing these sites as an alternative to BP, then the escorts will start to show up in droves.[/QUOTE]There are lots of pros on the so called normal dating sites as well. Its an imperfect system that can't be corrected as it is not in the financial interest of the site owners to do so. SA isn't Silk Road. And the gov knows that. Very little chance they will have any FTC or CC processing problems going forward.

BP can have CC processing tomorrow if they want to go offshore. But they dont want the higher fees, 3 week hold times, and overall sketchiness of some of these outfits.

[QUOTE=DogSun;2568834]The sites themselves will never be able to eradicate the pro's from joining. The best they can do is not allow the offer of sex for money on profiles, and they're pretty good about that. So really, the only way to keep them off is to make it too much work for them. And this can only be accomplished through the men on the site. If the men insist on meet and greets before going to the FC, and don't discuss pay for play through messaging, the pro's will have to put in too much work to make it worth their while. Especially when they have to compete with the majority of women on the site who aren't professionals. All of the pro's on SA in my area do not last. I've recognized quite a few who's ads I've seen on BP, or who's phone numbers I've gotten and then googled only to see their escort ads. Most of these women are on the site consistently for a month or so before they delete their profile or stop logging on. So the best way to keep the pro's off the site? Keep the john's off the site. Or at the very least, educate the john's on proper behavior. Easier said then done of course, but if the typical monger starts seeing these sites as an alternative to BP, then the escorts will start to show up in droves.[/QUOTE]You summarized it as well as I could have.

The only other thing I would add is that when we encounter an escort trying to sneak in, sending her away with a bad vibe is probably the best way to combat it. She will eventually think "I don't have to put up with this shit hooking off BP" and go away.