General Reports

[QUOTE=FlbMac31;2995833]Reading the law very carefull and trying to get a good feel for the elements of the citation. Looking over the Galvin case, it appears he made a few monger mistakes that are well-published no-nos. Obviously circling the block and pulling to the side is too fuckin' obvious. It also sounded from the print media that communication was not in the car, but thru the window. And then he asks her to show hers. If you ask you're making the assumption the gal is a SW.

A few questions for the group. Is this law Florida-wide or just for Tampa? Bottom line is that it doesn't make a difference for what you're arrested for, you still have the arrest record on file.

I'm paranoid of the damn cops. They really don't need much to pull you over. Frankly, I'm more concerned about my guest having drugs.

But I'm LOL because this new law means that the next time I hear my daughter's boyfriend ask to see her tits. I got the fucker. Crap, I think it only applies to over 18.

I am by no means an expert monger, but my personal approach is to basically never travel without a GPS unit in the car. I'm not out after 11 period. After all, I get lost easily and my damn GPS failed. And I take decongestants which tend to make my sleepy or scatterbrained. Yeah, I live in the area, but I rely on the sweet voice in the GPS to get me home. So I pull to the side of the road or into a parking lot to see if I can get it to work. If I chance to meet someone I just simply say I'm lost, can you help me with directions? It's interesting how many helpers there are who jump in the car.

I never rush to drive off right away unless I'm positive I'm alone. If I'm stopped a few blocks away I am simply a scatterbrained citizen who asked ford directions and this angel offered to show me how to get to a gas staton with plenty of lights so I get my damn GPS to work again.

So, what's the answer in light of the precurser laws? No say, no tell. Just wait until business is conducted in the car and voluntary?

Let's hear from the group.[/QUOTE]This is a Hillsborough County Ordinance:

These so-called "precursor acts" occur when a prostitute or a customer seeking sex asks the other party to expose his or her genitalia or breasts. The tactic is a common way for prostitutes or customers looking for sex to find out if they are dealing with an undercover officer.

The ordinance, passed in October 2011, can only be used in public settings, such as a conversation on the side of a road.

Tampa has its own prostitution precursor ordinance. It also applies only to public settings.

Chapter 14 Division 4 of the Tamp Code:

Prostitution.

Sec. 14-77. Violation attempt.

Sec. 14-78. Giving information concerning prohibited acts, etc.

Sec. 14-79. Immoral services.

Sec. 14-80. Precursor acts facilitating prostitution unlawful.

Sec. 14-80. Precursor acts facilitating prostitution unlawful.

(a) Definitions:

(1) Public encounter means contact between two (2) or more persons which originates in the City of Tampa where at least one (1) of the parties thereto is on a public street, on a public sidewalk, on the public right-of-way or is visible from any of the foregoing, regardless of whether any party is in a motor vehicle.

(2) Contact means sufficiently close proximity between two (2) or more persons as to permit verbal communication between them.

(3) Right-of-way shall be defined as provided in Tampa Code section 23-4.

(b) It shall be unlawful for any person participating in a public encounter to:

(1) Demand or request any other encounter participant to expose his or her sexual organ.

(2) Demand or request any female encounter participant to expose her breast;.

(3) Expose his or her sexual organ;.

(4) Expose her breast if female;.

(5) Fondle or touch the sexual organ of any other encounter participant, whether or not the sexual organ is covered by clothing or any other material;.

(6) Fondle or touch the breast of any female encounter participant, whether or not the breast is covered by clothing or any other material;.

(7) Demand or request any encounter participant to fondle or touch the sexual organ of any other encounter participant, whether or not the sexual organ is covered by clothing or other material;.

(8) Demand or request any encounter participant to fondle or touch the breast of any female encounter participant, whether or not the breast is covered by clothing or other material.

(c) Violation of this section is not contingent upon the participants expressly mentioning money, prostitution, sexual acts or any euphemism for any of those terms.

(e) Enforcement: In order to limit application of this ordinance to prostitution related activities and not prohibit otherwise lawful behavior between persons not involved in prostitution related activities, this section shall be enforced only when a law enforcement officer is one of the participants in the public encounter. This fact need not be known to the other participant (s).

Florida Statues are:

796.04: Forcing, compelling, or coercing another to become a prostitute.

796.045: Sex trafficking; penalties.

796.05: Deriving support from the proceeds of prostitution.

796.06: Renting space to be used for lewdness, assignation, or prostitution.

796.07: Prohibiting prostitution, etc. ; evidence; penalties; definitions.

796.08: Screening for HIV and sexually transmissible diseases; providing penalties.

796.09: Coercion; civil cause of action; evidence; defenses; attorney's fees.

Ultimately you are violating ordinances and not State law. Punishment may be equal to a class B misdemeanor but it is not a misdemeanor.

[QUOTE=PeterPiper52;2994545]I took a road trip to MA last week, and while driving on I-95 through Georgia and S. Carolina, I saw a few billboard ads for AMP's. I'd have to think that their target is long haul truckers. But, I did get a chuckle out of it.[/QUOTE]I've had some relaxing times at some of those places. YMMV but if you are ready to stop for the night or for a bite to eat you might want to drive by one.

[QUOTE=Expedia12;2996147]This is a Hillsborough County Ordinance:

These so-called "precursor acts" occur when a prostitute or a customer seeking sex asks the other party to expose his or her genitalia or breasts. The tactic is a common way for prostitutes or customers looking for sex to find out if they are dealing with an undercover officer.

The ordinance, passed in October 2011, can only be used in public settings, such as a conversation on the side of a road.

Tampa has its own prostitution precursor ordinance. It also applies only to public settings.

Chapter 14 Division 4 of the Tamp Code:

Prostitution.

Sec. 14-77. Violation attempt.

Sec. 14-78. Giving information concerning prohibited acts, etc.

Sec. 14-79. Immoral services.

Sec. 14-80. Precursor acts facilitating prostitution unlawful.

Sec. 14-80. Precursor acts facilitating prostitution unlawful.

(a) Definitions:

(1) Public encounter means contact between two (2) or more persons which originates in the City of Tampa where at least one (1) of the parties thereto is on a public street, on a public sidewalk, on the public right-of-way or is visible from any of the foregoing, regardless of whether any party is in a motor vehicle.

(2) Contact means sufficiently close proximity between two (2) or more persons as to permit verbal communication between them.

(3) Right-of-way shall be defined as provided in Tampa Code section 23-4.

(b) It shall be unlawful for any person participating in a public encounter to:

(1) Demand or request any other encounter participant to expose his or her sexual organ.

(2) Demand or request any female encounter participant to expose her breast;.

(3) Expose his or her sexual organ;.

(4) Expose her breast if female;.

(5) Fondle or touch the sexual organ of any other encounter participant, whether or not the sexual organ is covered by clothing or any other material;.

(6) Fondle or touch the breast of any female encounter participant, whether or not the breast is covered by clothing or any other material;.

(7) Demand or request any encounter participant to fondle or touch the sexual organ of any other encounter participant, whether or not the sexual organ is covered by clothing or other material;.

(8) Demand or request any encounter participant to fondle or touch the breast of any female encounter participant, whether or not the breast is covered by clothing or other material.

(c) Violation of this section is not contingent upon the participants expressly mentioning money, prostitution, sexual acts or any euphemism for any of those terms.

(e) Enforcement: In order to limit application of this ordinance to prostitution related activities and not prohibit otherwise lawful behavior between persons not involved in prostitution related activities, this section shall be enforced only when a law enforcement officer is one of the participants in the public encounter. This fact need not be known to the other participant (s).

Florida Statues are:

796.04: Forcing, compelling, or coercing another to become a prostitute.

796.045: Sex trafficking; penalties.

796.05: Deriving support from the proceeds of prostitution.

796.06: Renting space to be used for lewdness, assignation, or prostitution.

796.07: Prohibiting prostitution, etc. ; evidence; penalties; definitions.

796.08: Screening for HIV and sexually transmissible diseases; providing penalties.

796.09: Coercion; civil cause of action; evidence; defenses; attorney's fees.

Ultimately you are violating ordinances and not State law. Punishment may be equal to a class B misdemeanor but it is not a misdemeanor.[/QUOTE]Good feedback. So Public encounter means contact between two (2) or more persons which originates in the City of Tampa where at least one (1) of the parties thereto is on a public street, on a public sidewalk, on the public right-of-way or is visible from any of the foregoing, regardless of whether any party is in a motor vehicle. MEANS if both parties are in the car already it may not apply?

[QUOTE=FlbMac31;2996250]Good feedback. So Public encounter means contact between two (2) or more persons which originates in the City of Tampa where at least one (1) of the parties thereto is on a public street, on a public sidewalk, on the public right-of-way or is visible from any of the foregoing, regardless of whether any party is in a motor vehicle. MEANS if both parties are in the car already it may not apply?[/QUOTE]It does apply because the vehicle is on a public Street also if you're in public View they can get you with the indecency as well.

[QUOTE=FlbMac31;2996250]Good feedback. So Public encounter means contact between two (2) or more persons which originates in the City of Tampa where at least one (1) of the parties thereto is on a public street, on a public sidewalk, on the public right-of-way or is visible from any of the foregoing, regardless of whether any party is in a motor vehicle. MEANS if both parties are in the car already it may not apply?[/QUOTE]The only loop is private dwellings. That's why this law doesn't apply to backpage.

We have mentioned before that undercover female officers will NOT get into the car with you; this is just too much of a safety risk to the officers for the sake of a potential misdemeanor arrest. SWs will (99% of the time, in my experience) slide right into the passenger seat as if their ass was greased simply by your making eye contact, a smile and asking if they "need a ride". Drive a couple of blocks or so and then ask if you can touch them. In the extreme, this would be a great legal defense, as you can just say you picked up a pretty girl and wanted to make out, etc.

(e) Enforcement: In order to limit application of this ordinance to prostitution related activities and not prohibit otherwise lawful behavior between persons not involved in prostitution related activities, this section shall be enforced only when a law enforcement officer is one of the participants in the public encounter. This fact need not be known to the other participant (s).

[QUOTE=Fwiffo;2996555]We have mentioned before that undercover female officers will NOT get into the car with you; [/QUOTE]In last month's round of arrests in Pasco county, undercover officers did get in the car and drive a few blocks with hobbyists before the arrest was made. At least, that's how it was reported.

[QUOTE=Lickyzhills;2996624]In last month's round of arrests in Pasco county, undercover officers did get in the car and drive a few blocks with hobbyists before the arrest was made. At least, that's how it was reported.[/QUOTE]Can you provide a link to that report?

I'd like to read that!

Thanks!

I had read.

[QUOTE=Lickyzhills;2996624]In last month's round of arrests in Pasco county, undercover officers did get in the car and drive a few blocks with hobbyists before the arrest was made. At least, that's how it was reported.[/QUOTE].

[QUOTE=Ajdal;2996802]I had read.

.[/QUOTE]Please provide a link, as this would be a total game changer.

[QUOTE=Skiper;2996890]Please provide a link, as this would be a total game changer.[/QUOTE]Skiper check out review #2582 on the Pasco walker board for a descrition from a witness.

Here is a link to the story. They were taking mugs in the back of a Police SUV, then sending them off with a summons to appear.

[URL]http://www.tampabay.com/news/publicsafety/crime/sting-targets-brazen-prostitution-on-us-19-in-pasco/1231908[/URL]

[QUOTE=JayTwogo;2996905]Skiper check out review #2582 on the Pasco walker board for a descrition from a witness.

Here is a link to the story. They were taking mugs in the back of a Police SUV, then sending them off with a summons to appear.

[URL]http://www.tampabay.com/news/publicsafety/crime/sting-targets-brazen-prostitution-on-us-19-in-pasco/1231908[/URL][/QUOTE]I can find nothing in that article that references LEO getting into the car with a John. Furthermore, the original post over on the Pasco board was made by a Regular member whom isn't active any longer? At least, the search function wasn't showing any of his posts.

I'm not questioning anyone's integrity, per se, but like Skiper I would really like to see some solid intel on this one.

With decoy getting in car was reported a couple of months back. I'll dig for it. It was by the Cactus. The decoy got in the car, the monger drove maybe a block west and got pulled over / blocked in. I also remember it saying the decoy might have been a male cop dressed like a girl and got in the back seat. . It was in SW reports iirc. Ajdal out

[QUOTE=Skiper;2996890]Please provide a link, as this would be a total game changer.[/QUOTE].

St Pete SW reports of 06-03-15 Ajdal out or search Cactus

[QUOTE=Skiper;2996890]Please provide a link, as this would be a total game changer.[/QUOTE].

The news story is 5 years old, 2012, and says nothing about a decoy in a monger's vehicle.

But, both in Pasco and Pinellas, mongers report watching stings where this's happened. Very interesting, I had missed those reports. That totally changes the game.

Another interesting note is Hillsborough does not bust anywhere near the number of mongers that Pasco or Pinellas does. Hillsborough targets sellers way more often than buyers. The few males that get busted are often workers.

[QUOTE=JayTwogo;2996905]Skiper check out review #2582 on the Pasco walker board for a descrition from a witness.

Here is a link to the story. They were taking mugs in the back of a Police SUV, then sending them off with a summons to appear.

[URL]http://www.tampabay.com/news/publicsafety/crime/sting-targets-brazen-prostitution-on-us-19-in-pasco/1231908[/URL][/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Fwiffo;2997027]I can find nothing in that article that references LEO getting into the car with a John. Furthermore, the original post over on the Pasco board was made by a Regular member whom isn't active any longer? At least, the search function wasn't showing any of his posts.

I'm not questioning anyone's integrity, per se, but like Skiper I would really like to see some solid intel on this one.[/QUOTE]