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[QUOTE=CrestWood87;5652671]
As for your claim that the vaccine is for the good of the people. That is just another page from Hitler's playbook.[/QUOTE]' "Why do the protected need to be protected from the unprotected by forcing the unprotected to use the protection that didn't protect the protected in the first place?" '
[QUOTE=Niteluvr;5652727]Then don't get vaccinated, don't infect anyone and don't complain if you die from it. Life is simple, so no need to debate on how to dissect a fart.[/QUOTE]I'd agree 100% if we didn't have this administration forcing mandates, and putting people out of work who choose not to get vaccinated. This absolutely does force the need for intelligent debate on this topic, which has been suppressed by this administration and the mainstream media in order to further their agenda. The choice you pose then becomes not so simple for many people, who have families to support. They have every right to be angry, and every right to voice their dissent. I'm surprised a veteran like you doesn't recognize the importance of this, and is willing to triviaize Americans' rights so easily.
Don't you have any Vet friends who have chosen not to get vaccinated? Have you asked them how they feel about having their benefits stripped from them after all their years of service?
[QUOTE=AaronHamlet;5653145]' "Why do the protected need to be protected from the unprotected by forcing the unprotected to use the protection that didn't protect the protected in the first place?" '[/QUOTE]Here is their argument.
[QUOTE=ILuvEmall;5653403]I'd agree 100% if we didn't have this administration forcing mandates, and putting people out of work who choose not to get vaccinated. This absolutely does force the need for intelligent debate on this topic, which has been suppressed by this administration and the mainstream media in order to further their agenda. The choice you pose then becomes not so simple for many people, who have families to support. They have every right to be angry, and every right to voice their dissent. I'm surprised a veteran like you doesn't recognize the importance of this, and is willing to triviaize Americans' rights so easily.
Don't you have any Vet friends who have chosen not to get vaccinated? Have you asked them how they feel about having their benefits stripped from them after all their years of service?[/QUOTE]I haven't run across any veteran yet who doesn't want to get vaccinated. That said, many of them are older guys and most probably have a health issue of some sort. I agree that civil, national debate should take place. For those with families to support, I wonder what their real fear is. Nobody I know has grown horns after having been vaccinated, so why worry? If a person chooses not to get vaccinated and then loses his / her job, then so be it as it was a personal choice. We all make life choices every day and we have to accept any negative consequences. This vaccine thing is no different.
[QUOTE=AaronHamlet;5653145]' "Why do the protected need to be protected from the unprotected by forcing the unprotected to use the protection that didn't protect the protected in the first place?" '[/QUOTE]Very cute. Very meaningless.
We all live in a society. That means we all need to work together to promote the common good. When a medical crisis arises, it is up to all of us to do as much as we can to lessen its effects on everyone. In this case, it means getting vaccinated and taking whatever measures you can to prevent its spread to others.
I really is that simple. And you really aren't that stupid.
But it was cute. And meaningless.
Joe Biden's Amerika:
[URL]https://gfycat.com/flawedeverlastingarieltoucan[/URL]
I did 23 years in the Army and will not get the shot. My retired Navy DR stated that he could not argue with the scientific facts I stated and he was does not try to push people to get the shot because our bodies more than likely will survive. The death rate is still very low! Since I work for myself, no one can fire me. It has bounced off every single sibling, nephew and niece in my family who are type O.
[QUOTE=Niteluvr;5653682]I haven't run across any veteran yet who doesn't want to get vaccinated. That said, many of them are older guys and most probably have a health issue of some sort. I agree that civil, national debate should take place. For those with families to support, I wonder what their real fear is. Nobody I know has grown horns after having been vaccinated, so why worry? If a person chooses not to get vaccinated and then loses his / her job, then so be it as it was a personal choice. We all make life choices every day and we have to accept any negative consequences. This vaccine thing is no different.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=SgtLurker;5654204]I did 23 years in the Army and will not get the shot. My retired Navy DR stated that he could not argue with the scientific facts I stated and he was does not try to push people to get the shot because our bodies more than likely will survive. The death rate is still very low! Since I work for myself, no one can fire me. It has bounced off every single sibling, nephew and niece in my family who are type O.[/QUOTE]Really? Does your doctor give scientific / medical pause when you, the patient, give your medical opinion? I barely get 15 minutes with my doctor and I don't think she'd appreciate a medical opinion from me unless I was the surgeon general.
Here is a scientific fact, those with Type O blood are the least likely to catch the disease and if they do, have a very mild case. As I stated, it bounced off 3 of siblings, 1 son, 4 grandkids, all of whom are type O. Matter of fact, two only had sniffles for a couple days and tested positive for the antibodies a few months later. That my friends, is science. Another point of science, it is a virus and the death toll is tiny and remains tiny. I do not get the flu shot either and he never pushes. When I went to India twice, a regular doctor may have taken advantage to give me all sorts of shots but he state we have had enough to the rest of our life. He only gave me Hydroxychloroquine to prevent Malaria.
He is a Doctor who cares about his patients, not his wallet.
[QUOTE=Niteluvr;5654261]Really? Does your doctor give scientific / medical pause when you, the patient, give your medical opinion? I barely get 15 minutes with my doctor and I don't think she'd appreciate a medical opinion from me unless I was the surgeon general.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=SgtLurker;5654478]Here is a scientific fact, those with Type O blood are the least likely to catch the disease and if they do, have a very mild case. As I stated, it bounced off 3 of siblings, 1 son, 4 grandkids, all of whom are type O. Matter of fact, two only had sniffles for a couple days and tested positive for the antibodies a few months later. That my friends, is science. Another point of science, it is a virus and the death toll is tiny and remains tiny. I do not get the flu shot either and he never pushes. When I went to India twice, a regular doctor may have taken advantage to give me all sorts of shots but he state we have had enough to the rest of our life. He only gave me Hydroxychloroquine to prevent Malaria.
He is a Doctor who cares about his patients, not his wallet.[/QUOTE]Its an interesting idea, but I wouldn't go so far as to bet my future health on my blood type. Here is a compendium of nine studies done on the subject: [URL]https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8286549/[/URL].
For those of you who do not wish to read the whole report, their conclusions are reprinted below. The use of the term "may be" shows a confidence level well below "scientific fact" but I leave that judgement up to you.
4. Conclusions.
Since the onset of the COVID-19 pandemic, a concentrated research effort has been undertaken to elucidate risk factors underlying viral susceptibility and illness. Among these efforts, several recent studies have investigated the association between blood type and COVID-19 infection. Each of these reports provides important information with regard to understanding the underlying disease process. Although these reports might be inconsistent in their findings, certain trends are evident. Many studies report that blood type A might predispose one to increased susceptibility of infection with SARS-CoV-2, and type O and Rh-negative blood groups might be protective. Although this appears to be an emerging trend, the impact of blood type on clinical outcomes remains unclear. At this point in time, there does not appear to be any relationship between blood type and COVID-19–related severity of illness or mortality. Current literature does not support blood type as part of a predictive model of viral illness or mortality, and ABO / Rh screening should not be used as a triage mechanism. Future investigations can focus on the creation of a global COVID-19 database to account for population-based differences in blood types and testing protocols. In addition, further studies are necessary to understand the molecular mechanisms by which blood types might engender susceptibility to SARS-CoV-2 infection, and ultimately, develop countermeasures to viral infection and illness.
[URL]https://www.deepcapture.com/2021/09/affidavit-of-ltc-theresa-long-m-d-in-support-of-a-motion-for-a-preliminary-injunction-order/[/URL]
I think it's well worth taking the time to actually fully read her affadavit, and comprehend her arguments, as they're very well laid out. It may not change your mind, but it should help you understand why people object to these mandates. For me, there's 3 primary reasons:
1) The vaccines are not proven to effectively stop the spread of Covid. In fact, to the contrary, they have shown to be ineffective at preventing the spread of Covid. Even the vaccine manufactures don't make this claim, and now you even have the vaccines biggest proponents, like Bill Gates, openly making this admission in a left-wing liberal rag like The Guardian: [URL]https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/nov/04/bill-gates-call-for-huge-global-effort-to-prepare-for-future-pandemics[/URL].
Since the prevention of the spread can be the only rational basis for the mandates, and this has proven to be an abject failure, the mandates should be withdrawn.
2) The vaccines have shown to have a 10 x higher reported adverse event incidence rate than all other vaccines combined, and their long-term health effects are still unknown since no long-term studies have ever been performed:
[URL]https://childrenshealthdefense.org/defender/safety-signals-covid-vaccines-full-transparency-cdc-fda/[/URL]
[URL]https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=322068649730237&set=a.215071360429967[/URL]
More on this in my response to your other post below.
3) I think there's a very good chance that due to the nature of these vaccines being "leaky" (see point 1 above), this mass vaccination approach is entirely wrong and is only exacerbating the problem via ADE. This is debatable, but it is a debate the scientific community should be having, instead of the censorship that is taking place. So far, it sure looks like it's played out much closer to the way those who theorized this predicted, and the rabid pro-vaxxers who promised the vaccines as a cure-all have been all wet.
[QUOTE=Niteluvr;5654261]Really? Does your doctor give scientific / medical pause when you, the patient, give your medical opinion? I barely get 15 minutes with my doctor and I don't think she'd appreciate a medical opinion from me unless I was the surgeon general.[/QUOTE]
Article:
[URL]https://www.cnn.com/world/live-news/new-covid-variant-south-africa-11-28-21/index.html[/URL]
A new variant has arrived and this that and the third. People nearly 3 years later are still gobbling this up LOL. Potential lockdowns coming near you. "we're in a race against time" blablabla. Very funny that they never mentioned all these variants are caused by the vaccinated shedding spike proteins etc.
Not to mention the majority of cases across the world are people whom are fully vaxxed. As it's been known for months across the world:
HEALTH AND SCIENCE CDC study shows 74% of people infected in Massachusetts Covid outbreak were fully vaccinated.
[URL]https://www.cnbc.com/2021/07/30/cdc-study-shows-74percent-of-people-infected-in-massachusetts-covid-outbreak-were-fully-vaccinated.html[/URL]
Amazing. Next shot for the sheeple.
You must have a pretty limited network. My father and 3 brothers are vets. My dad is elderly and is vaccinated, as is one brother. That's a 50% rate on the family poll there. I also take my dad to the VFW because he likes to go there to get out. I talk to a lot of the vets there, and plenty of them are not vaccinated. That said, looking them over, they're probably of the age and health demographic (almost all 75, and many of them heavy smokers, and not in great shape) that puts them in the high risk category.
You're right, we all make life choices every day, but mostly those are choices of free will, not choices that are forced upon us. This vaccine thing is entirely different. There is no basis for forcing a choice with no real justification, especially when your choices are a) your livelihood, or b) your potential health.
While you might not have personally known anyone who has suffered health consequences from the vaccines, that doesn't mean they don't exist. There have been plenty, and once again, and I don't believe this can be understated at this point, we can't possibly know the long-term effects of these vaccines yet, as there have been no long-term studies done. But, in the meanwhile, there are some things we do know:
[URL]https://americasfrontlinedoctors.org/2/frontlinenews/500-increase-in-sudden-cardiac-and-unexplained-deaths-among-fifa-athletes-in-2021/[/URL]
Hmmm, you don't find that a little strange? It's not only happening in Soccer, by the way. Even the Hawks lost a player last year due to blood clots (Brandon Goodwin) who claimed it was due to the vaccine, but you probably never heard about it, as he was told to not to say that by both the Hawks and the NBA. There are many more examples.
[URL]https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/11/shocking-uk-study-stuns-medical-community-vaccinated-people-60-younger-twice-likely-die-unvaccinated-people/[/URL]
This study from the UK shows the overall death rate for the vaccinated being 2 x that of the unvaccinated. Yes, some arguments of age bias for the unvaccinated can be made, but still, I find it alarming. The crossover is especially interesting and sensible, and potentially explainable. It certainly warrants watching long term, and would be interesting to see a breakdown of finer age bands.
All this to say there is a lot that is different here, a lot that is left to be seen, and no justification at this point for forcing this mandate. People have a right to be worried, in fact should be worried, and should feel free to voice those worries. It was not a personal choice for that person to lose his job- it was a Presidential choice thrust upon them by a liar who said this was something he would never do (as did Jen Psaki, as did Nancy Pelosi, as did Tony Fauci). People should not just have to accept such dire negative consequences because they were lied to, and particularly because those lies are built upon a house of lies to start with (I. E. - the vaccines inability to prevent the spread of Covid).
[QUOTE=Niteluvr;5653682]I haven't run across any veteran yet who doesn't want to get vaccinated. That said, many of them are older guys and most probably have a health issue of some sort. I agree that civil, national debate should take place. For those with families to support, I wonder what their real fear is. Nobody I know has grown horns after having been vaccinated, so why worry? If a person chooses not to get vaccinated and then loses his / her job, then so be it as it was a personal choice. We all make life choices every day and we have to accept any negative consequences. This vaccine thing is no different.[/QUOTE]
I get that people are frustrated right now. I am to. Let's not turn this into another political forum about vaccines and mandates. If I wanted that, I'd not block for / against people on Facebook.
I agree. I'd move my posts over if I could. I didn't mean to get started on this here, I was just trying to lend some understanding on why people are passionate about this. I also think that's a good thing, as there's far too much apathy in this country. But you're right, this is not the forum for that.
By the way, I really love your posts. Good wisdom there. Strip clubs are not my thing, but if they were, I'd take your advice and follow your MO. Peace.
[QUOTE=Joesouncool;5654879]I get that people are frustrated right now. I am to. Let's not turn this into another political forum about vaccines and mandates. If I wanted that, I'd not block for / against people on Facebook.[/QUOTE]