Grand Rapids Pugilistic Society

[QUOTE=RogerOver;3576942]I want to make sure I understand. Are you on a mission to make sure you pay the least possible for an HE? In order to end GPS?

Dude, some of us aren't counting our pennies here. I have pretty good experiences and yes, probably overpay. But there's a reason the girls I see will cancel an appointment with someone like you to see someone like me.

My advice: Just go buy a fleshlight, get the Oculus Rift and get an invite to a good porn torrent site. You'll save a shitload of money and teach all these chicks that they are out your twenty bucks! LOL.
BTW, I do want to throw out there that I think Britney is pretty fucking awesome.[/QUOTE]Clarity on GPS is what the conversation has been, you are coming in mid stream.

You have just confessed to over paying for a massage. So.. Off with your Head.

Over paying and Giving tips early is the cause of Golden Pussy Syndrome (GPS).

I have tipped a matching door fee to girls who give great CMT quality massages and great endings. Without the great massage, I'm not interested in seeing them again anyway, If they are rushing the massage and not following direction, I'm sure the ending will be lousy too.

This is a review I did on Joy awhile back, it's a good example of what is wrong with the MP's in Grand rapids and if you tip early you will most likely get ripped off from time or lousy massage. I'm glad I didn't tip Joy early.

I will not repeat.

I needed a good massage for my bum leg.

Tried seeing Amber at Royal Thursday and she wasn't working. My leg still hurting as I past Relaxation on Division decided to take a chance on getting a good Hhr massage and Joy was the only one working at 10 am. Checked my watch frequently to make sure I get my hhr for 40. She put on lots of oil, I said that was plenty and she still added more latter.

10 min. Into the massage she answers the phone and steps out. I asked for left hip and left thigh to be done, she did a little then continued her massage her way. Not bad but I needed the left thigh and hip.

The flip seemed early but I thought front thigh work would be nice. Nope, straight to the boys. I didn't ask for it but thought what the hell I knew I was getting shorted on Time. So when she asked for 40 I said. With lips, 20 with hand. She said 40, I said nope HJ is just another muscle to massage, 20. So she finished for 20 with 10 min. To spare on the clock. If the Time starts when I walk through the door, I got my hhr. But I'm thinking I got shorted 10 min. Plus the 2 min. On the phone.

Totally average experience but it only cost me 60.

I always gave Amber a tip that matched the door fee and I do the same for Amy at Healthy Habits because she gives a great CMT quality massage. These two girls give great massages and have never shorted me on time or service, that's what I what I tip for, Not being Hot. If you tip the hottie because she's a hottie or she demands tip up front like Brittany (blonde25), you are supporting GPS.

This is a service industry, I'm not trying to pay the least, I'm willing to pay for good service and it's hard to find in GR

I don't pay extra for hot escorts or rub girls. I pay for service. (BTW I don't watch porn).

I was asked to chime in on this topic by Bth9318 (post number 115 on this thread) Scroll down to read the whole story.

[QUOTE=MrLovaLova1;3576995]Anyone can have a different experience with these providers another person says is "pretty awesome. " I called Britnay (sp?) or Blonde25 to see if she'd be willing to do 60 minutes for me on a very jacked back. She blatantly hung up on me which I'd say is not awesome. In my opinion, she has an attitude problem partially because mongers like you blow smoke but hey just my opinion.[/QUOTE]It's not blowing smoke to have a great experience and then report it. If I had a "jacked back" I wouldn't be looking for a body rub erotic type provider to help me with it. I'd call a CMT or physical therapy professional.

[QUOTE=RogerOver;3577137]It's not blowing smoke to have a great experience and then report it. If I had a "jacked back" I wouldn't be looking for a body rub erotic type provider to help me with it. I'd call a CMT or physical therapy professional.[/QUOTE]I have been to many CMT appointments and Erotic Rub Salon appointments too. Always hoping for a perfect combination.

You can find both in Amy at Healthy Habits. You have to specify erotic or CMT and she will will deliver. When you get a great ending with a CMT quality massage, I'm willing to pay for it.

[QUOTE=Benz1;3577151] Always hoping for a perfect combination.... When you get a great ending with a CMT quality massage, I'm willing to pay for it.[/QUOTE]+1 in my book, too!

I am no more in favor of paying too much or supporting GPS than the next guy. Though I will be the first to recognize that we all have different tastes and preferences, and my preferences (and yours.) don't need to match or agree with the rest of the community. We are all allowed to like what we like and pay a rate that fits our own budget and needs. Just as the providers are allowed to pick a price for their services that works for them and what they will be. They can decide what that is, just like we can decide if we are willing to pay it.

[QUOTE=RogerOver;3577137]It's not blowing smoke to have a great experience and then report it. If I had a "jacked back" I wouldn't be looking for a body rub erotic type provider to help me with it. I'd call a CMT or physical therapy professional.[/QUOTE]I've gotten a lot of massages in my lifetime, some great and some not so great. There are providers that know how to massage enough to make a difference in my pain and also give me a little fun. Providers who claim to know about massage but really just want to provide an erotic service should just stick to full service and not even try to attempt massage imo. I would've tried Brittany out if she didn't have such an attitude problem but I'm glad she saved me $. If she comes to her senses and she starts to offer full service I may try again but she is not a provider of massage I want to experience.

[QUOTE=MrLovaLova1;3576995]Anyone can have a different experience with these providers another person says is "pretty awesome. " I called Britnay (sp?) or Blonde25 to see if she'd be willing to do 60 minutes for me on a very jacked back. She blatantly hung up on me which I'd say is not awesome. In my opinion, she has an attitude problem partially because mongers like you blow smoke but hey just my opinion.[/QUOTE]Her ad clearly says " Hours for regulars only! ". Maybe she just doesn't suffer fools gladly. I pay extra for that.

[QUOTE=MrLovaLova1;3577434]I've gotten a lot of massages in my lifetime, some great and some not so great. There are providers that know how to massage enough to make a difference in my pain and also give me a little fun. Providers who claim to know about massage but really just want to provide an erotic service should just stick to full service and not even try to attempt massage imo. I would've tried Brittany out if she didn't have such an attitude problem but I'm glad she saved me $. If she comes to her senses and she starts to offer full service I may try again but she is not a provider of massage I want to experience.[/QUOTE]Hey, let us know when you get her FS hour for 120 dollars. Wonder which one of you will come to their senses first?

[QUOTE=DaveUsa;3577497]Her ad clearly says " Hours for regulars only! ". Maybe she just doesn't suffer fools gladly. I pay extra for that.

Hey, let us know when you get her FS hour for 120 dollars. Wonder which one of you will come to their senses first?[/QUOTE]Nice to meet another one of this chic's white knights especially since she crawls this forum and probably gives perks to those who defend her (why else, right?) Who said I would only pay $120 for FS?? You not me but nice touch knight. I'm over this chic and haven't even met her from all her white knights.

GPS in GR.

There you have it Bth9318, if you read all the comments, you will see the culprits that support GPS are right here on this forum.

Confessions of paying more for Hotness and Whatever. At no time did any of them comment on tipping for quality of the message they received. It looks like they don't care about anything but the ending and Hotness and they are willing to tip very well for it.

GPS is running strong in the GR escorts too, 100 for ss and 120 hhr without cim or msog.

BTW there is No GPS in KandiLand, she offers BBBJws and continuous msog for your entire visit.

We just have to watch the postings of our fellow mongers who support GPS and make sure we don't follow them into the same GPS trap.

This concludes my portion of this rant for at least 30 days. There's really no reason to say anymore, It seems futile when so many dogs can't learn a new trick like / Mongers setting the prices, together we could change the formula. Instead of providers doing the Price fixing, Mongers do the Price fixing and learn to take matters into your own hands when providers start their upsell.
Happy Hunting

[QUOTE=MagicHands2;3577286]+1 in my book, too!

I am no more in favor of paying too much or supporting GPS than the next guy. Though I will be the first to recognize that we all have different tastes and preferences, and my preferences (and yours.) don't need to match or agree with the rest of the community. We are all allowed to like what we like and pay a rate that fits our own budget and needs. Just as the providers are allowed to pick a price for their services that works for them and what they will be. They can decide what that is, just like we can decide if we are willing to pay it.[/QUOTE]I believe this perfectly sums it up. It's not up to anyone else around here to determine what I should be paying for my fun, anymore than it's up to them to tell me how much I should pay for anything. Best of luck to everyone getting what they want.

[QUOTE=MrLovaLova1;3568650]I make more money than most millennials your point is invalid.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=MrLovaLova1;3577532]Nice to meet another one of this chic's white knights especially since she crawls this forum and probably gives perks to those who defend her (why else, right?) Who said I would only pay $120 for FS?? You not me but nice touch knight. I'm over this chic and haven't even met her from all her white knights.[/QUOTE]OK, the 120 was a cheap shot. You're self-admittedly a man of means whom I mistakenly conflated with the GPS complainers here. Sorry.

Not sure why you're calling me out as a White Knight having never met the girl in question (something you and I have in common apparently) nor expressed any opinion about her. If the glove doesn't fit. Well you know the rest.

Benz, I agree with your general POV, although not quite on the same scale when it comes to specifics.

One shouldn't over-pay thinking with their smaller head, to aid in driving market prices to Over-inflation (from over-paying).

But the key word is Over. And Market. Yes, the market prices are going to be higher for hotties, and lower for fuglies. That's a given. A guy should pay more for a hottie to a small degree in comparison to a normal cute gal, and doing so doesn't mean over-paying. Even when one could wait in line or find a lucky spot in time to get a particular gal of the same attraction where he'd pay a little less. I think where we differ on it is what the market prices are OK at.

IMO:

- What are called Tips aren't really tips. A true Tip is raising that "tip" price above what's asked / stated, After the fact. Kind of like dining out. The 20% "tip" isn't really a tip. Executing on 15% or 25%, is where the Actual "tip" comes into play (negative or positive).

- With this analogy, I agree guys shouldn't be rolling into a parlor with an average Jane doing an OK massage (no CMT; just "shrug", not bad, not awesome) and throwing down an analogous "30% whether it's before or after, because they heard they won't be short-changed and they're thinking with their little heads.

- But what is the comparative "20%" on a hhr and an hr? The baseline market price for nobody high or low in hotness or how they execute, is. ? IMO, it's 40/20 and 60/40 -- which includes a standard ops rub & tug. Refusal of rub & tug? If a great true CMT massage, the same, but otherwise. Not a bad massage, but no HE, even if adequately taking up expected time? 40/10, 60/20. Am I too far off on this? Again, not what *I* am willing to pay or not pay -- but what is the baseline price for the baseline situation.

- Allow roaming, naked, FIV, stuff like that -- that's where the real "tip" comes in. And it comes in after the fact. Otherwise, it's literally not a tip.

- However, I can Understand and have no qualms if someone like Brit is out there with reviews and wants a 40/40 walking in the door, but she's hot (as seen by the market) -- and gets nude and executes well with you also knowing what you're getting into walking in the door. Because there's no mystery. Sure, she could have a bad day and screw up -- fine. But the key is -- is she Market Worthy, without any factors of over-hype or over-ga-ga about a gal included? The answer is Yes. The feedback validates this. If she was just in a bikini and wanted more for top off, and another more for bottom off -- yeah, then I would say guys would be unnecessarily inflating the market going that route. But when the feedback is Hell Yeah from non-newbies & non-big-spenders guys in the field wanting / doing repeat visits for what they pay & what they get? Said gal fits the market price.

- So for someone like Brit, the 40/40 upon arrival isn't a 40 tip. It's basically just an added fee, not asking for any actual tip. Because they're saying you're Not getting just a massage right upfront. So there is peace of mind there, much like someone one may regularly see. "Hey Barb, I got time for a half hour session around 7. The usual," where he just throws down the base cost + $ that covers the extras he knows he's going to get. I can Understand one Not doing that, nor shouldn't, with some gal he hasn't seen who hasn't gotten rave reviews all over the place where he wouldn't hesitate to bet That money on the fact that he'll get what's been reported (and she not shy about it being known upfront out there, either).

- I think GPS is where they're asking for more than market price, with an attitude, as if it's some bargain, when really they're over-inflating it and are more above what the market price for herself and she does should be. Parlors asking for 40/60 on a half-hr topless and even possibly a tad better than purely mechanical tug, with an attitude that that is what she deserves and that's what gals Should get (flipping hair) -- yeah, GPS, see ya. As babe, you need to come down to earth on the real market price. If you literally ARE super-hot, and don't have a Valley Girl attitude. All while giving a great performance with open-book roaming and full time used? OK, if you're of that type & hotness, yeah, then you're around a real market price then.

Just dusted off my Econ 101 book. Just got to find my green shade visor and that gold plated pen.

I started my rant after Bth9318 asked me to chime in on post 115, seeing that we weren't fighting, why not put it in General reports, some of it spilled over to General Reports by my request.

I swore off the topic for 30 days but Charlie brings up a good question.

But what is the comparative "20%" on a hhr and an hr? The baseline market price for nobody high or low in hotness or how they execute, is. ? IMO, it's 40/20 and 60/40 -- which includes a standard ops rub & tug. Refusal of rub & tug? If a great true CMT massage, the same, but otherwise. Not a bad massage, but no HE, even if adequately taking up expected time? 40/10, 60/20. Am I too far off on this? Again, not what *I* am willing to pay or not pay -- but what is the baseline price for the baseline situation.

Those rates and tips are very close to what the CMT receives from a majority of their clients however that majority is primarily female clients. My utr CMT owns her own salon and we talk about the business often. A majority of male clients are going to the rub and tug looking for a good combination with real massage plus tug. After reading the response on this fourm, I notice nobody put any emphasis on massage skills except me.

The massage is the most important part to me, I have left in the middle of a massage at Serenity telling her, if that's all you can do I'm not interested in the rest. Paid the 40 and cut my loses. I need a massuse that listens and takes direction, I agreed with NoseJelly during a blow up with T-70 (he's a hot head) about GPS a long time ago, Grand Rapids MP Scene is Dead.
During those rants NJ was in lock step with my thinking so I gave him my utr CMT digits so he could get a taste of the good life, he has thanked me more than once. She's Not Hot but there is no better CMT for me. I still see her occasionally but she is very busy doing women in her own salon. So I still need a second go to.

I recieved a message from Amber at Royal indicating there is hope and she will listen and learn from her clients if they give her a chance. I told her I'm very picky, She was a very smart and convincing lady. I set up a 1 hr appointment because a real massage can not be done in a hhr. The first hhr would be me massaging her to show her what I wanted and she would massage me for the rest of the hour. It ended up being over one and a half hours. Amber became my second go to if my utr CMT wasn't available. Amber was happy with a matching door fee but that didn't work for me. 60/60 for HJ. She was nice and creative but I still felt like I needed the BJ, I would set up an appointment for a 40 BnG on my way home.

I'm a little different, maybe because of a knee replacement and my gate has been off for a long time.

I have become a conisoure of massage, I have one table I keep at home for giving my wife massages and another travel table I take to my favorite escort appointments, we trade massages and have great endings anyway I want them. My first meeting with the late great Mercedes was a shortstay that lasted 2 hours because she loved my massage, she always answered my calls whenever I wanted to see her.

If I go into a restaurant, order chicken and the Hot waitress brings me fish but tells me the fish is better and more expensive then flashes her tits to be more convincing. I will calmly ask if it comes with a BBBJCIM. If not, I'll send the fish back, ask for my chicken and another waitress.

Maybe so many years in the hobby have desensitized me to the hobby triggers that get mongers to lay down their wallets.

Happy Hunting Everyone.

Not loaded here. But lots of arguing over $20.

For me, Brittany is cool as hell. 80+20 gets 7/10 massage, plus guaranteed fun on flip- Russian body slide finish, nice shower, water bottle, fresh sheets and towels.

Also- the HHR from start to finish is usually closer to 45. Which based on some of the time shorting posts is what other HRs turn out to be.

Not white knighting. If she was trying for 150 for mechanical rushed HE like many I could see the beef. But this seems to be truth in advertising. If you want more than is offered from her, pick someone who advertises that. Just my opinion.

But if she brings me the chicken I ordered and flashes her tits I'll tip a bit better. Not double, but better. But I won't pre-tip, ever.
Far as escorts I still stand by minimum service I expect no matter her looks. Market dictates the hotter girls ask for and get more in rates. For those of us that prefer hotter, this is expected. That said, there's still limits.
No offense to new crystal but do you or anyone else think bbw like her can command a 200 hr rate?
I don't think Brianna Star is worth her big city rates either.
There has to be reasonable balance. I'll pay a little more to see Destiny but not unlimited more.
My baseline is 100 hhr. For decent service and cim with avg. Cute not overweight.
Homely or overweight its 80. Spinner hot 120.
If I want an hour and I'm willing to spend 200 you can bet I am going to book Destiny over Crystal every time. That is how the market works.
I've never paid more than 150 for an hour in GR but I seldom do an hour anyway.

I do agree generally that many massage girls expect too big a tip for he.
Most are barely attractive and give so-so massages and mechanicsl he.
I'll try a new one now and then but mainy stick to tried and true for a massage. Several I see do BBBJ, some FS. All topless and fiv and a couple totally naked even just for a tug ending. I tip 40 for those. 60 for BBBJ and 80 for FS.

[QUOTE=Benz1;3578371]
If I go into a restaurant, order chicken and the Hot waitress brings me fish but tells me the fish is better and more expensive then flashes her tits to be more convincing. I will calmly ask if it comes with a BBBJCIM. If not, I'll send the fish back, ask for my chicken and another waitress.
Maybe so many years in the hobby have desensitized me to the hobby triggers that get mongers to lay down their wallets.

Happy Hunting Everyone.[/QUOTE]