"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[GoinDonkey]

https://www.seekingarrangement.com/m...c-b481b8c28360

This girl used to be on Backpage like two years ago. Worst tits I've ever seen, but there is something unique about a girl who's 4'8" (her profile says 4'9", but I think that's their lowest choice because I know she told me 4'8") I think she charged $120 or $140 for a half hour. The number I had for her doesn't work anymore, and my SA isn't paid currently, so I'm stuck waiting to see if she accepts my FB friend request for me to have a way to contact her because I'd like to hook up with her again.

https://www.seekingarrangement.com/m...7-4110f5a7f419

I haven't met this one yet, but I offered her $400 to come over and she agreed. High, but that body is killer enough to do it once. She's out of town for school most of the time so I haven't yet been able to line up a weekend where she was here and I was feeling rich enough to do it.

[Madaboutmax]

I'm curious, do you ever have girls refuse to meet because of that? I always offer something, though I've had some I sat across from at dinner and considered not giving the money once I could tell I had no interest in seeing them again LOL.

I never pay an allowance for a meet and greet. I always cover the meet expenses, but nothing more.

I have had a number of girls refuse to meet because of that, but I never felt like I missed out on anything. Some have asked, but still agreed to meet even though I refused to pay an allowance for the meet and greet. I feel like I avoided future headaches.

My impression is that girls who require an allowance for a meet and greet are scammers or have gps. Neither is my target demographic. LOL.

I'm curious, have others had successful arrangements with girls who demand an allowance for the meet?

[FruitNinja]

I agree that showing you read their profile is important. I'll compliment them on anything except their physical appearance, though. If it's about some specific physical attribute (that's above their shoulders), and you can make it come across as sincere, it can work, but a generic "you're pretty", or worse, "you're hot", falls flat coming from a total stranger (unless it's another woman). Waiting until they've gotten to know you well enough to actually *care* whether you think they're pretty or not, then telling them they are seems to work better.

I don't bring it up. Inevitably they will ask about it at some point. I ask them if they really think any normal man wouldn't want intimacy with them, and of course they realize how silly that sounds. But I stress that's not what I'm paying them for, that it's not mandatory, and that I don't want them to do anything they're not comfortable with. I've managed to get platonic girls with that before, though it required paying normal price for a number of platonic meetups first. I can understand a guy not wanting to make that investment, but for me it's worth it if the girl is a perfect 10. And the challenge of it can be fun.

Definitely. Keeping them in their texting app instead of in the SA app also helps reduce their exposure to the guys you're competing with. Plus their phone number sometime yields a Facebook profile that shows they don't look as good as their SA pics and you can save yourself some time (and money, for me). And if that gets you their real name, you can check for arrest records for them to make sure you're not dealing with a basket case.

I'm curious, do you ever have girls refuse to meet because of that? I always offer something, though I've had some I sat across from at dinner and considered not giving the money once I could tell I had no interest in seeing them again LOL.

Being able to make them feel you're interested in them, and giving them money, for their company and who they are, not for their body, is the overall key, I think.

One thing I've found helpful is to ask her sometime when you're hanging out, once things are established with her, to show you some awful messages she's gotten on SA, or awful profiles. Ask her what she didn't like about each one she shows you. You can improve a lot from seeing the mistakes other guys are making.

Some great info in both these posts. All I can add is once I meet and we are intimate I never stop telling them how pretty and special they are. I can't count how many times I tell my 19 year old Latina how special she is. I find the word "adorable" works well.

[FruitNinja]

I can tell you that if you are looking for "hos" that's pretty much all you'll ever find. Consistently landing real SBs (at least the cream of the crop) takes practice, and one of the key skills needed for success is knowing when to recognize a UTR / pro or any easy girl that's in it for simple pay per fuck so that you can avoid her. Until you acquire that skill, you will be disappointed with sugar dating.

Also there are some girls who will "pretend" to be overpriced escorts in order to get rid of you quickly. This is because it's easier for them to say they want $500-1000 per date (knowing full well its going to cause you to disappear) than it is for them to just say they're not interested. Many of them are only doing this as a ruse, they would just ghost and probably block someone that says "ok I'll give you $1k for a date". There are girls there who will fuck anyone for the right price, but they are the "hos" to be avoided and not real SBs.

And I've noticed on some of the other boards that a lot of you guys that seem to have bad luck in the bowl are in small towns. That's a big disadvantage, because hot women gravitate toward large metro areas, and most hot girls in small towns are willing to drive a couple of hours to meet an SD in the nearest large city, even just for an M&G. I love these small town girls, they are extremely adventurous and full of dreams, and the boredom of daily small town life has them so sexually bottled up that they are a lot of fun. They are not really interested in meeting SDs in the towns they live in, mostly because there's nothing to do there and they need a change of scenery. Also if they are truly hot, they likely have SDs contacting them that are willing to fly them to wherever the SD is, so they have no real motivation to look at local SDs. So for guys in smaller towns or rural areas, unless you're willing to do some traveling I don't think the bowl is going to be worthwhile for you.

I think the fact that someone would call them hos is part of the problem. That shows a level of disrespect, maybe a nicer approach. This is the thing they are running from. The other thing that I find useful is intelligent banter. These girls are in college. Show them you're intelligent. Let them know that you're successful. They have a lot of choices. There are guys that will fly them out to them. I took the 19 year old Latina to a high end steak house last night. I know the neighborhood she grew up in as I used to live there. She's never experienced anything like that. She was amazed at the service and the meal. She felt special. She didn't stop smiling the whole dinner. When we got home she ravished me.

[TwoDirection]

3) I compliment them in my first message and demonstrate I read their profile.

I agree that showing you read their profile is important. I'll compliment them on anything except their physical appearance, though. If it's about some specific physical attribute (that's above their shoulders), and you can make it come across as sincere, it can work, but a generic "you're pretty", or worse, "you're hot", falls flat coming from a total stranger (unless it's another woman). Waiting until they've gotten to know you well enough to actually *care* whether you think they're pretty or not, then telling them they are seems to work better.

7) I subtly introduce my interest in intimacy, but i don't focus on it. This makes them feel like less of an escort, but also weeds the platonic girls.

I don't bring it up. Inevitably they will ask about it at some point. I ask them if they really think any normal man wouldn't want intimacy with them, and of course they realize how silly that sounds. But I stress that's not what I'm paying them for, that it's not mandatory, and that I don't want them to do anything they're not comfortable with. I've managed to get platonic girls with that before, though it required paying normal price for a number of platonic meetups first. I can understand a guy not wanting to make that investment, but for me it's worth it if the girl is a perfect 10. And the challenge of it can be fun.

8) I move offline quickly. I need to get them before they get jaded and disable their profile.

Definitely. Keeping them in their texting app instead of in the SA app also helps reduce their exposure to the guys you're competing with. Plus their phone number sometime yields a Facebook profile that shows they don't look as good as their SA pics and you can save yourself some time (and money, for me). And if that gets you their real name, you can check for arrest records for them to make sure you're not dealing with a basket case.

10) I schedule a meet and greet quickly. I never provide an allowance for the meet and greet, but also make it clear there are no expectations from them.

I'm curious, do you ever have girls refuse to meet because of that? I always offer something, though I've had some I sat across from at dinner and considered not giving the money once I could tell I had no interest in seeing them again LOL.

I'm sure I've missed some other points and would be interested in things others do to pursue the elusive "Amateur" SB.

Being able to make them feel you're interested in them, and giving them money, for their company and who they are, not for their body, is the overall key, I think.

One thing I've found helpful is to ask her sometime when you're hanging out, once things are established with her, to show you some awful messages she's gotten on SA, or awful profiles. Ask her what she didn't like about each one she shows you. You can improve a lot from seeing the mistakes other guys are making.

[JZLizard]

I always started with hi when I tried to have a convo with this hos they never answer back but when I asking for rates then it's when I got an answer

I can tell you that if you are looking for "hos" that's pretty much all you'll ever find. Consistently landing real SBs (at least the cream of the crop) takes practice, and one of the key skills needed for success is knowing when to recognize a UTR / pro or any easy girl that's in it for simple pay per fuck so that you can avoid her. Until you acquire that skill, you will be disappointed with sugar dating.

Also there are some girls who will "pretend" to be overpriced escorts in order to get rid of you quickly. This is because it's easier for them to say they want $500-1000 per date (knowing full well its going to cause you to disappear) than it is for them to just say they're not interested. Many of them are only doing this as a ruse, they would just ghost and probably block someone that says "ok I'll give you $1k for a date". There are girls there who will fuck anyone for the right price, but they are the "hos" to be avoided and not real SBs.

And I've noticed on some of the other boards that a lot of you guys that seem to have bad luck in the bowl are in small towns. That's a big disadvantage, because hot women gravitate toward large metro areas, and most hot girls in small towns are willing to drive a couple of hours to meet an SD in the nearest large city, even just for an M&G. I love these small town girls, they are extremely adventurous and full of dreams, and the boredom of daily small town life has them so sexually bottled up that they are a lot of fun. They are not really interested in meeting SDs in the towns they live in, mostly because there's nothing to do there and they need a change of scenery. Also if they are truly hot, they likely have SDs contacting them that are willing to fly them to wherever the SD is, so they have no real motivation to look at local SDs. So for guys in smaller towns or rural areas, unless you're willing to do some traveling I don't think the bowl is going to be worthwhile for you.

[Cephlapod Love]

In my pursuit of "Amateur" SBs, I've learned a few things I've found to be important.

Great stuff and a great guide. Thank you for posting / sharing!

[Madaboutmax]

In my pursuit of "Amateur" SBs, I've learned a few things I've found to be important.

1) I catch them right after they first join. Like its been said, before they get jaded or chased away by the p4p offers.

2) I have a profile pic and an interesting profile, but not arrogant profile. Show a sense of humor and humility.

3) I compliment them in my first message and demonstrate I read their profile. Many are looking to be treated better then guys their age so I play the part by being a gentleman.

4) I share my success in past long term arrangements. Most newbies want someone who knows what they are doing and can show them the ropes.

5) I express an interest in developing a friendship, but not a serious relationship. They don't want to feel like escorts, but also don't want a boyfriend.

6) I make sure they know I understand the concept of an allowance, but never discuss specifics and that I make it clear i won't try to be the highest bidder. This weeds out the gps girls.

7) I subtly introduce my interest in intimacy, but i don't focus on it. This makes them feel like less of an escort, but also weeds the platonic girls.

8) I move offline quickly. I need to get them before they get jaded and disable their profile.

9) I don't push too hard, because I don't want to appear desperate or spook them away.

10) I schedule a meet and greet quickly. I never provide an allowance for the meet and greet, but also make it clear there are no expectations from them.

11) I always show a sense of humor. This takes the tension out of the discussion ad helps then feel comfortable.

12) I expect this to take a lot of work and I get rejected often, but I enjoy the challenge and the hunt. Persistence has paid off. Finding a straight p4 p deal with an escort doesn't meet my need for the "thrill of the chase".

I've had some great experiences that keep me coming back for more. I've had all night multiple rounds with extremely beautiful and freeky women where we never discussed an allowance (I've just slipped them something on their way out). This type of "relationship" allows many women to explore their freeky side in a comfortable non-judgemental setting.

I'm sure I've missed some other points and would be interested in things others do to pursue the elusive "Amateur" SB.

[BmanOhio]

Nice approach to all and understand about Willy Nilly handing over like a commodity. Sounds like you've had a blast, and for that matter so did the girls.

Win (freaking) Win!

You are spot on. There are a number of pros on the site but for the most part they are your average girls next door that heard about SA through a friend. I prefer girls going to school because they are the ones testing the waters. I like to get them when they just join. I have had four arrangements that have lasted from 2-3 years. One lived with me for three years. Moved in when she was a little over 18 and moved out a little after she turned 21. I had her for her best years. She was intelligent, mature for her age, submissive and had a body to die for. Most need a connection before they will go to bed with you. All a pro needs is the $$ You want a pros number? I have no problem providing that. You want the number of a SB? Not going to happen. Now if I hadn't deactivated my account and I knew one was a DTF I have no problem forwarding her profile and then you do the talking.

My last one loved threesomes. That would be her laying down. The blonde was one I had seen multiple times but our schedules were not compatible. Both amazing.

But that's the nature of USG, or maybe even the world in general. Everyone wants things handed to them. Do the effin work or go home. I've literally spent 10's of thousands of dollars over the years. Bought cars for them, taken them on vacations in the states and overseas. Like a real relationship. And then when I'm done for whatever reason I'm supposed to give their numbers out to random effin strangers. I'm sorry, I have too much respect for them. And if you think that this would be an OK thing to do then that's probably why you can't pull anything from SA. I don't care if she's a hooker from BP show them respect and you will go far. Make them laugh and you will go further, show them a good time and you're in.

When I explain life to the guy he sends me back a profane message. Really? Fuck that shit!

[TwoDirection]

if this hos pay 90 bucks for a membership they are expecting their investment back in large amounts

The women don't have to pay for memberships on SA. As long as they have a public pic available, they're allowed to read their messages for free.

They also usually don't realize that we do have to pay for it. I've talked to several who were surprised to hear that, and shocked to hear that it's $90/ month.

[TwoDirection]

I wish more guys knew how to navigate the waters and not scare away the newbies.

I don't think they care, though, since it doesn't effect them if they drive away non-pro's in their search for pro's.

I've found that if you don't catch a girl within the first few days of her signing up, it's probably too late. After that, they either stop using the site, they're a pro, or they've gotten jaded by all the disrespect and have become too tough a nut to crack.

It pays to refresh the recent list often. I like to catch ones whose pics haven't even been approved yet. If they're 18-20, slim, and either white, Asian, Middle Eastern or Indian, it's worth messaging them on the good chance they'll be hot. And they like that (they think) you were interested just based on what they wrote since their pic isn't up yet.

[Madaboutmax]

That hasn't been my experience at all. I'm able to have a conversation with many and just ignore the straight to arrangement types.

It's interesting how many of us have different experience. "If you are a hammer, everything looks like a nail. ".

I like those times when this girls are doing it for first time, make me feel like my first time too but in SA Sugarbb describe her needs you can see that they ask for easy transactions like no attachments and if it's possible make the main event quicker as possible like extract money from an atm at night in a bad area really quick also I always started with hi when I tried to have a convo with this hos they never answer back but when I asking for rates then it's when I got an answer, women never spend a dime trying to get a man and they never really make any hard afford to get a man they granted that men has to beg for women if this hos pay 90 bucks for a membership they are expecting their investment back in large amounts as always there is exceptions I haven't seen one those in my entire monger life no money no honey

.

[TheMarto1]

I like those times when this girls are doing it for first time, make me feel like my first time too but in SA Sugarbb describe her needs you can see that they ask for easy transactions like no attachments and if it's possible make the main event quicker as possible like extract money from an atm at night in a bad area really quick also I always started with hi when I tried to have a convo with this hos they never answer back but when I asking for rates then it's when I got an answer, women never spend a dime trying to get a man and they never really make any hard afford to get a man they granted that men has to beg for women if this hos pay 90 bucks for a membership they are expecting their investment back in large amounts as always there is exceptions I haven't seen one those in my entire monger life no money no honey”

One additional downside of treating SA like BP is that it tends to scare away my target demographic. Women who don't think of themselves as escorts get turned off quickly when propositioned for straight up pay for play.

Just like in strip clubs, proposition the right dancer you can get lucky, proposition the wrong dancer get slapped and thrown out by the bouncer.

I wish more guys knew how to navigate the waters and not scare away the newbies. Pros aren't hard to spot!! LOL.

.

[Waxxon]

I'm not sure what the problem is but I find SA very productive. I've done the pros all over the world, have been working CL for probably 8 years. They changed the posting rules so it sucks now, or I don't want to research how to get around it. But SA has been the most bang for the buck. In about a week or so I had a three girl rotation going with a shitload wanting to meet. Most have averaged out at $$$ or less. The Latina I'm playing with now is probably more than I should be spending but she's adorable and has a banging body. I mean shit, I'm 60 and banging a 19 year old Latina. Win! I'm just not understanding guys that say they are having a hard time on SA. It's not rocket science.

Think psychology.

Have found this board most informative in my short time on this site. Agree SA is a mongers playground, you just need some game and know how to take care of a woman, and be able to adapt to their intricacies. Rotation management is key, the latest addition has worked her way to #1 in just 3 weeks. It's a tad higher investment than my routine allowance (2-3), but she is lovely, long and slender with perfect curves, intelligent, stays overnight with 1-2 more play periods the next day, treats me like the man of her dreams with the chemistry that we all search for.

Thanks for the insight here.

[Madaboutmax]

One additional downside of treating SA like BP is that it tends to scare away my target demographic. Women who don't think of themselves as escorts get turned off quickly when propositioned for straight up pay for play.

Just like in strip clubs, proposition the right dancer you can get lucky, proposition the wrong dancer get slapped and thrown out by the bouncer.

I wish more guys knew how to navigate the waters and not scare away the newbies. Pros aren't hard to spot!! LOL.

I wouldn't be too surprised by that kind of interaction.

1) With the slow demise of BP and other sites, more guys are headed to SA to get girls. Dude's "problem" with SA is to pick out & avoid the pros & BP girls. True SB's "problem" is deciphering if a guy is really into an on-going arrangement or will dump them once they dated once. Dudes who use SA as an escort site are what ruins it for those of us who truly seek an on-going arrangement. Sigh.

2) When I post elsewhere I frequently get contacted by "members" with less than 50 posts (usually less than 20) who expect me to share the names, numbers and info on girls I have developed. Of course, when I politely decline, their sense of 'entitlement" kicks in and I get a similar profanity laced response. That always leaves me shaking my head, but in retrospect, I am grateful for the reply. See, anyone with that kind of attitude and short fuse has the potential to be a scary date for the girl and I sure would feel badly if I was the one who passed her on. Sadly bad behavior by a few often dissuades others from posting or sharing. Sigh.

Have had experiences where I shared an UTR girl with a "senior" member: dude shorted her on the Poetry Reading Fee and then tried to run her down with his car when she chased him to the parking lot. UTR girls tell me of dudes who provide "gifts" that are counterfeit cash. Oh and then there are the ones who give a girl $20 ask her to head into the convenience store and buy them smokes and then drive off. That on top of worse things. So none of these stories of bad monger behavior surprise me anymore, sadly. Can you imagine dealing with that sort of "attitude" 100-times over on a daily basis like someone here has to? Yousa!

Honor among thieves? Honor among mongers?