"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

A couple of commercial sites specialize in hookups with girls who aren't supposed to be pros but definitely want something more than a kiss on the cheek at the end of the evening. The sites themselves offer "free trials" but once you sign up you get a couple emails per day, supposedly from girls who want to meet you. You can't actually contact them unless you become a paying member though. So are these sites worth it? Are they really a place where you can meet so-called amateurs who don't advertise elsewhere? The question is complicated by the fact that there appears to be a range of girls on the sites, from strippers to students. I have posted in other threads about my experiences with the one site I belong to. In the case of the other site, which emphasizes "arrangements," I'm not a paying member but I have a "free trial." It lists 2, 700 girls in Virginia. In Richmond, here's what one girl says about herself:

[I]Hi my name is Angel and I am an exotic dancer. I've danced in Las Vegas and on the East Coast. Originally from Va. Beach, Virginia, my first love is the ocean, and living a healthy, happy lifestyle is so important to me. I love shopping, getting my hair done, massages, manicures, pedicures, and tanning. I am available for generous gentlemen who want to go out once or twice a week to dinner, movies, or events. I like strip clubs, visual fun for both of us. And I would like to get a new car this year.

My Appearance: 36c-24-34, long blonde hair, green eyes. 5'5, tan, athletic. 125 lbs. Look forward to meeting someone sweet and nice. Lots of love, Angel. Xxooxxx[/I]

Angel says she is 26 and doesn't indicate what kind of arrangement she is seeking, other than she wants a car. Do you think she might accept donations to a "car fund"? Probably negotiable is my take on it.

Another girl has a nude pic with her nipples whited out (?) , wants to go out and have fun, and says she is a 19 (or 20) year old receptionist seeking $3k. $5k per month (!)

[I]"Just need help paying for tuition and some living expenses"[/I]

Then there is a 19-year old, somewhat awkward looking in her (fully clothed) pix, who says:

[I]"Hey! I'm an artist living in richmond. I love going to the movies, hanging out with my girlfriends, meeting new people, comedy, going out, staying in, just about everything. I'm super laid back and I always have a good time. I get along with just about everybody and love to laugh and be merry. Let me know if you are interested in meeting me!

I gave this a shot earlier this year but ended up dating someone. Needless to say; I'm single again and ready to give it another go.

Nothing special about my situation. Just a young woman frustrated with "dating" men my age. I enjoy the company, conversation, and other benefits of an older gentleman."[/I]

For what it is worth, my initial estimate is that here we have 1. A moonlighting stripper; 2. An escort or a want to be escort; and 3. A girl who is clueless but willing to hang out with older men who she knows will expect sex from her.

Now to each his own, but for me, if I were going to pursue one of these girls, it would be number 3, the 19-year old "artist." It's the awkwardness and self-consciousness she displays in her post that I like, and her photo shows a reasonably pretty girl. She'd be a little nervous and we would beat around the Bush for a while, but I think she is the one with the most potential for a mind-blowing fuck. But that's just me.

So back to the question, are these sites worth it? The answer appears to me to be: not if you are looking for or prefer pros. Pros are going to advertise elsewhere. Strippers you can go fondle. Well, not in Richmond. And take for a test drive before you ask her for takeout. But an awkward, fully clothed. 19 year old artist coming off a relationship who wants to meet older men who are looking for a mistress? I don't know any other reliable way of finding such girls. Maybe if you hang out at the laundromat long enough.

Here's a question I got on another thread about the so-called amateurs on the other websites.

[QUOTE=Jayblack;1110741]I'm a little confused by a few things here. First off are you really "averaging" 16 bucks a provider because the 250-300 Christmas presents seem to say otherwise. Also, I'm wondering why your bothering to share these experiences at all on this site: over the last few years there have been some people who use the site, but this site is for sharing PERTINENT information. I mean if these are girls that can only be gotten through SD then maybe you should review them there for other people who may have the opportunity to partake. And honestly the way you describe them makes them sound like prostitutes not just the way everyone else labels them.[/QUOTE]The $16 was an average cost of finding a girl, not the cost of the girl. The girls I've seen haven't asked for anything specific. I could have walked away from them without giving them anything. On the one hand, for me, this makes it more interesting. Are they prostitutes? There's two parts to that. Morally I know some or all consider these girls "just the same as prostitutes." Morally, maybe they are. As are some wives. But legally is this prostitution? I don't see how. Maybe somebody else who understands the kind of sex LE is interested in can explain it. Personally, it seems to me these "so-called amateurs" are not like the girls on the escort sites or BP because they aren't advertising themselves as escorts, let alone prostitutes. So I would say: morally, maybe. Legally, no.

As to why post if I'm not going to give out contact info. First, I'm not a pimp or an escort referral service. Second, I've learned a lot by reading usasg over the years. There are a lot of subjects of interest on the topic of sex with women. One of them is how to find new girls to fuck who don't consider themselves pros. This is what I'm talking about. There's a million methods to find new girls to fuck. This one has a good probability of success.

[QUOTE=Literal2; 1110934]A couple of commercial sites specialize in hookups with girls who aren't supposed to be pros but definitely want something more than a kiss on the cheek at the end of the evening. The sites themselves offer "free trials" but once you sign up you get a couple emails per day, supposedly from girls who want to meet you. You can't actually contact them unless you become a paying member though. So are these sites worth it? Are they really a place where you can meet so-called amateurs who don't advertise elsewhere? The question is complicated by the fact that there appears to be a range of girls on the sites, from strippers to students. I have posted in other threads about my experiences with the one site I belong to. In the case of the other site, which emphasizes "arrangements," I'm not a paying member but I have a "free trial." It lists 2, 700 girls in Virginia. In Richmond, here's what one girl says about herself:

[I]Hi my name is Angel and I am an exotic dancer. I've danced in Las Vegas and on the East Coast. Originally from Va. Beach, Virginia, my first love is the ocean, and living a healthy, happy lifestyle is so important to me. I love shopping, getting my hair done, massages, manicures, pedicures, and tanning. I am available for generous gentlemen who want to go out once or twice a week to dinner, movies, or events. I like strip clubs, visual fun for both of us. And I would like to get a new car this year.

My Appearance: 36c-24-34, long blonde hair, green eyes. 5'5, tan, athletic. 125 lbs. Look forward to meeting someone sweet and nice. Lots of love, Angel. Xxooxxx[/I]

Angel says she is 26 and doesn't indicate what kind of arrangement she is seeking, other than she wants a car. Do you think she might accept donations to a "car fund"? Probably negotiable is my take on it.

Another girl has a nude pic with her nipples whited out (?) , wants to go out and have fun, and says she is a 19 (or 20) year old receptionist seeking $3k. $5k per month (!)

[I]"Just need help paying for tuition and some living expenses"[/I]

Then there is a 19-year old, somewhat awkward looking in her (fully clothed) pix, who says:

[I]"Hey! I'm an artist living in richmond. I love going to the movies, hanging out with my girlfriends, meeting new people, comedy, going out, staying in, just about everything. I'm super laid back and I always have a good time. I get along with just about everybody and love to laugh and be merry. Let me know if you are interested in meeting me!

I gave this a shot earlier this year but ended up dating someone. Needless to say; I'm single again and ready to give it another go.

Nothing special about my situation. Just a young woman frustrated with "dating" men my age. I enjoy the company, conversation, and other benefits of an older gentleman."[/I]

For what it is worth, my initial estimate is that here we have 1. A moonlighting stripper; 2. An escort or a want to be escort; and 3. A girl who is clueless but willing to hang out with older men who she knows will expect sex from her.

Now to each his own, but for me, if I were going to pursue one of these girls, it would be number 3, the 19-year old "artist." It's the awkwardness and self-consciousness she displays in her post that I like, and her photo shows a reasonably pretty girl. She'd be a little nervous and we would beat around the Bush for a while, but I think she is the one with the most potential for a mind-blowing fuck. But that's just me.

So back to the question, are these sites worth it? The answer appears to me to be: not if you are looking for or prefer pros. Pros are going to advertise elsewhere. Strippers you can go fondle. Well, not in Richmond. And take for a test drive before you ask her for takeout. But an awkward, fully clothed. 19 year old artist coming off a relationship who wants to meet older men who are looking for a mistress? I don't know any other reliable way of finding such girls. Maybe if you hang out at the laundromat long enough. [/QUOTE]"Angel" is closer to 40 than 26, has been known by many names, and was busted in a very highly publicized and very visible bust a few years ago as being the madam of an escort service along with her pimp be / f. She did hard time. Avoid her like the plague.

There are a lot of girls on these sites that have seen the news-magazine pieces on this sort of thing happening in NYC and LA, and have pretty unrealistic expectations for what they can make, hence the ads for average-looking-but-fancy-sounding girls that have learned marketing but think they're worth a whole lot more than they are. OTOH, there are rich SOBs out there that will pay that sort of money. For a primo porn-star-quality girl. None of those types from around here on the SB sites, although there are a few very-nice ladies and a couple of seriously-hot MILFs.

That said, there are some girls. And some MILFs. That are hurting in this economy, and are turning to this as a way to make ends meet. Some are trying the SB thing first because it offends their sensibilities less than turning multiple tricks per day. Until they learn that the SB scenario is not (usually) a steady income, at which point they either give up or become your traditional escort.

As for legalities, if it's an exchange of sex for anything of value, it's prostitution. Proving that it's that and not just your typical date that includes sex is the tough part, especially if the exchange is not in cash or is unassociated with the meeting. This is one reason the ladies like the arrangement of a single monthly stipend that's exchanged outside the normal contact of the relationship. But you also have to remember that, in most jurisdictions, prostitution is a misdemeanor, which means two things: first, the cops must either witness the illegal act or you or your friend admit to the crime, and that's very unlikely in these scenarios; and second, the cops' first interest is always the visible-to-the-public activity. Get the walkers off the street and the obvious hookers out of the motels. There are relatively few SBs, they're almost never public in what they do, and the effort (cost to the taxpayer) it takes to pursue and actually bust a SB for prostitution is way too high for what will be a misdemeanor conviction. The law is pretty specific as to what constitutes prostitution exactly so that taking a date out to dinner and then going back to your place for sex is not considered prostitution. SBs live on that difference.

I am on the SD site! There are a few local escorts on there trying to mask there real intent. There are also some real woman on there who want to be spoiled (their words)! I'm in contact with a few woman on there now. They are very eager to meet and get something going. I haven't decided which one I really want to see. When I do I'll let you know the outcome. Either way no matter what label they use it's all the same.

[QUOTE=Cantwinlosin; 1111221]"Angel" is closer to 40 than 26, has been known by many names, and was busted in a very highly publicized and very visible bust a few years ago as being the madam of an escort service along with her pimp be / f. She did hard time. Avoid her like the plague.

There are a lot of girls on these sites that have seen the news-magazine pieces on this sort of thing happening in NYC and LA, and have pretty unrealistic expectations for what they can make, hence the ads for average-looking-but-fancy-sounding girls that have learned marketing but think they're worth a whole lot more than they are. OTOH, there are rich SOBs out there that will pay that sort of money. For a primo porn-star-quality girl. None of those types from around here on the SB sites, although there are a few very-nice ladies and a couple of seriously-hot MILFs.

That said, there are some girls. And some MILFs. That are hurting in this economy, and are turning to this as a way to make ends meet. Some are trying the SB thing first because it offends their sensibilities less than turning multiple tricks per day. Until they learn that the SB scenario is not (usually) a steady income, at which point they either give up or become your traditional escort.

As for legalities, if it's an exchange of sex for anything of value, it's prostitution. Proving that it's that and not just your typical date that includes sex is the tough part, especially if the exchange is not in cash or is unassociated with the meeting. This is one reason the ladies like the arrangement of a single monthly stipend that's exchanged outside the normal contact of the relationship. But you also have to remember that, in most jurisdictions, prostitution is a misdemeanor, which means two things: first, the cops must either witness the illegal act or you or your friend admit to the crime, and that's very unlikely in these scenarios; and second, the cops' first interest is always the visible-to-the-public activity. Get the walkers off the street and the obvious hookers out of the motels. There are relatively few SBs, they're almost never public in what they do, and the effort (cost to the taxpayer) it takes to pursue and actually bust a SB for prostitution is way too high for what will be a misdemeanor conviction. The law is pretty specific as to what constitutes prostitution exactly so that taking a date out to dinner and then going back to your place for sex is not considered prostitution. SBs live on that difference. [/QUOTE]

I mentioned I have been zeroing in on a third girl from "that site." The other two were easy, pussy pix of one, which you have seen and the squirter. Number 3 is turning out to be harder. Very hot in the texting,"oh! My pussy is so wet for you," that kind of thing, but now I am trying to get close enough to actually fuck her she is dancing around,"oh! Maybe I can't do it, not now, we'll do it later," etc. Etc. Frustrating? Yes. But fun. I love the chase almost as much as catching a girl. (I realize many guys don't, no disrespect intended to anyone else's preferences). So I don't think I will get to fuck number 3 this weekend after all but I may make some progress. I do plan to return to Tabby and see if I can get her to squirt again. Not in jail, no.

When I originally spoke of these other sites I didn't know it would cause such an uproar. It's only my opinion when I speak of them. Funny tho. I brought 3 different girls to everyones attention from those sites because I share when I can. And it seems alot of guys enjoyed my find. They came from those sites. You that are curious can go back and check for the 3 I shared. How many have most of you brought in or shared? Maybe it doesn't work for some but they work for me. Thats all I will say to this.

Good Luck all.

Be safe

Personally I would never have tried the sites beyond the worthless free trials if it hadn't been for your posts OBX. I'm having a blast and I'm grateful to you. Yes, you are generous with leads too. I don't think you caused an uproar. I caused the uproar because I ignored the correct classification of the threads and some folks really, really care about classification. Plus this is an anonymous monger forum and mongers get grouchy without enough pussy. That equals uproar. So don't worry about it. Thanks again.

Been on SD site and connected with a very agreeable and attractive BBW.a little too big for my liking. The problem there is presenting enough information including pictures to come to the attention of these ladies, who are looking at 100's of EMails. Literal, you must have the magic answer to get them to respond-and therefore open up the treasure chest.

Here is the problem I have with monthly stipends-lack of performance. Once you pay up front the excuses start rolling out.

I have had 2 such arrangements. Both are hot and wonderful performers, but after a short while the agreed on weekly visits became less frequent.always an excuse-and finally hooking up became like pulling teeth. We have wives who provide that service quite well, SBs / GFs are not supposed to.

Ergo, human nature being what it is, people will do as little as possible for a guaranteed salary. So my advice.and ongoing practice, is to link any stipend to performance-pay for play, which gets us back to the escort mentality.

This is an interesting topic. I also prefer Under The Radar UTR girls and avoid girls who are doing a high volume of business. I think in most cases the high volume girls get burned out and are not into their job, though there are exceptions and it would also depend on the guy. Many high volume girls have emotional problems stemming from either an unhappy childhood or bad life experiences.

My ideal UTR GF is a reasonably stable single woman who has a job outside the sex industry but is struggling to make ends meet and needs extra money. Usually they have a kid or two and the father has deserted them. Actually there are many such women. But where to find them?

I have not tried the online sites because from everything I've read (including a section called Dating Agencies on this forum in the Special Interests section) they are a complete waste of time and money. Too much spam, fakes, and undesirable women. Since I haven't tried the online sites I'd be curious to know if they work, but I think even if they did work the women there are not really UTR by definition.

I have not dated many UTR girls, partly because they are so rare and partly because I'm not that keen on it anyway. But here is what I've found both from experience and a bit of research. Sometimes they'll cruise stripclubs to pick up men. These could be high volume girls. In addition, some of the civilian girls who go to SCs are lesbian. A short conversation will establish what they are doing there. I would not date a stripper, though. Usually if a stripper accepts an arrangement they are either a high volume girl or they don't sleep around much but are very expensive. In a way I would not mind the expense of a stripper but they are in a sex industry job and, as I said above, this tends to burn them out. Another place to find the UTR girls is regular nightclubs. They are so rare that I cannot give any general advice on how to pick them out of the crowd. As I said, my success rate is pretty low. Actually only three girls in 10 years. But that's ok, I'm patient. I have a SO. I'm not desperate.

There is some risk to the UTR girls, both from my experience and from what I've heard and read. For one thing, they may cling to you and then get "dramatic", call your SO, put your business out in public, etc. That didn't happen to me yet. Also you may get attached to them if they are interesting and fun to be with, which can have an emotional toll. Then there's the risk (which is actually a good thing for the girl) that if they have a lot of good qualities they will eventually get scooped up by a high-qualilty single man, and your arrangement is finished. That happened to me earlier this year.

[QUOTE=Pistol Peter; 1113253]Been on SD site and connected with a very agreeable and attractive BBW. A little too big for my liking. The problem there is presenting enough information including pictures to come to the attention of these ladies, who are looking at 100's of EMails. Literal, you must have the magic answer to get them to respond-and therefore open up the treasure chest.

Here is the problem I have with monthly stipends-lack of performance. Once you pay up front the excuses start rolling out.

I have had 2 such arrangements. Both are hot and wonderful performers, but after a short while the agreed on weekly visits became less frequent. Always an excuse-and finally hooking up became like pulling teeth. We have wives who provide that service quite well, SBs / GFs are not supposed to.

Ergo, human nature being what it is, people will do as little as possible for a guaranteed salary. So my advice. And ongoing practice, is to link any stipend to performance-pay for play, which gets us back to the escort mentality. [/QUOTE]Yes, I'm not against using a little sugar to get my foot in the door, but after things start rolling along I wouldn't contnue if the relationship didn't become or remain a penetrating one.

I think maybe I was just lucky.

We shall see.

Here is how I approach it. First off I am what they need and not the other way around. You must keep that in mind. The most I have ever agreed to is 1k per month with visits of 2 or 3 times a week. Broke up on a 1st and 15th =500 each. Its fair to both and trust me all I am going to say is true. I ask for pic's and never give them one. I am married and that would not be discreet If I sent them. I will offer a description. I usually ask for pic's up front so I don't waste my time. If they say no fuck them. Move on. It helps to weed out the non-real ones. I keep it in this area. I only want ones who have a place by themselves that we can use. They must be attractive to me. I'm not just looking for a port. Its not storming in my life. 1k per month is alot for some people but it works for my budget. I never chat sex for $. I ususally talk about rent and such. I always make it know that there has to be chemistry. Both mental and physical. So I will ususally agree to something fair for first visit. If the girl is really in need she will agree to all I have said. If not move on. Trust me. More on there every week. I am seeing a 21 yr olod VCU student from that site now. She is off it now. Beautiful. Giving. A real pleaser. Hot as hell and can suck a ball thru a keyhole. All this is just my opinion and thoughts. Like them? Fine. If not f-you. LOL.
Good hunting + be safe

[QUOTE=Obx Fun;1113937]Here is how I approach it. First off I am what they need and not the other way around. You must keep that in mind. The most I have ever agreed to is 1k per month with visits of 2 or 3 times a week. Broke up on a 1st and 15th =500 each.[/QUOTE]I have signed up for the sight but only for free. I was not sure if it was worth paying. I'm curious as how you make the payments. Do you make a deposit to her bank account or is it a cash payment? Is she willing to accommodate her schedule to yours? I would love to find a situation I could make work once a week with NSA. I have to admit you're making me think about biting the bullet and signing up.

Coolhand2

Many thanks to OBX for sharing some of his technique. I am following along, trying to figure this so-called amateur scene out.

Coolhand, inmo this is a cash business. There are a hundred reasons why. None of them are to comply with tax regulations. On the "other site", the "arrangements" site (of which I am not a member) , it seems to me they try to get you to sign up in advance for some kind of monthly commitment. Maybe that will work better with some girls. You still should be able to figure out how to pay in cash though. Otherwise you leave a trail and I'm not talking about pecker tracks.

So I zeroed in on SB3, she of the emails saying how she wanted me to fuck her so bad etc. Summary: when I tried to meet her she said she was nervous and didn't quite have the time. So I'm kicking this one down the road for a while. I'll revisit later, still would like to taste that sweet pussy. I gave her some sugar in advance, maybe she'll just pocket it and drop me. We'll see.

[QUOTE=Literal2;1114905]Coolhand, inmo this is a cash business. There are a hundred reasons why. None of them are to comply with tax regulations. On the "other site", the "arrangements" site (of which I am not a member) , it seems to me they try to get you to sign up in advance for some kind of monthly commitment. Maybe that will work better with some girls. You still should be able to figure out how to pay in cash though. Otherwise you leave a trail and I'm not talking about pecker tracks.[/QUOTE]Your right about the cash only. My concern was about leaving a trail. What is the"arrangement" site you're refering to? I don't mind having an arrangement, if we can agree on an amount, but not in writing.

[QUOTE=Coolhand2;1115056]Your right about the cash only. My concern was about leaving a trail. What is the"arrangement" site you're refering to? I don't mind having an arrangement, if we can agree on an amount, but not in writing.[/QUOTE]Google seeking arrangements. Let us know what happens.

[QUOTE=Literal2;1115189]Google seeking arrangements. Let us know what happens.[/QUOTE]I did as you suggested. Too rich for my blood. I did pay the SB site. No responses yet to emails.

For what it is worth I've sent maybe 15-20 different girls emails and only have a "continuing relationship" with 3. Two of them were online at the same time and I sent emails asking if they wanted to meet. Both initiated chat during which we exchanged cell #'s and one I met and fucked the next day with no preliminaries and the other after a week during which I met her in public for a get acquainted session first. The third has been more difficult as we exchange emails frequently as I work to break out of the wolfpack of pussyhounds on her scent. We shifted to regular email instead of that on the site which helped. Pretty girls are bombarded on the site. Finally she met with me and she's hot hot hot but didn't have time to be alone. So I'll try again in a few weeks. I've given her some sugar but no more until penetration occurs. If it occurs. She is a ferocious cock teaser. Will try some others soon. Inmo you have to be direct enough in the initial contact so that she gets a little thrill but not so direct that she thinks you are weird.

[QUOTE=Snake27;1113367]I also prefer Under The Radar UTR girls[/QUOTE]Hi. Not from this neck of the woods but the thread came up the same day I paid my close to. 5$ for a month on the SA site. I've been doing UTR for a few years (in addition to the street. I tend to avoid the public pros. Rarely worth the admission price in my book) , mostly by posting on CL Casual Encounters. The filters on CL now catch most of the 'mutually beneficial arrangement' type posts, and the replies are now pretty much entirely spam (as opposed to the former 99. 9% spam). There is a broad range of UTR talent, from dumpy old pros to gals who've done professional modeling. I've had semi-regular things with some spectacularly beautiful women with dinner dates followed by 100% GFE and given them 200 a meeting for their time with which they were happy. Rare, but there. I've currently got an ongoing thing with a 22-year-old former member of her college swim team for 100 / visit, so there's some good things to be had out there.

I decided to try 1 month paid after I saw 4 of the girls I'd been with from CL responses on the SA site, which let me know that at least some of the girls there are real (including the swimmer). We'll see how it goes. Of course we're all looking for the 19-year-old model material who humps like a wild monkey all night then quietly leaves in the morning with $100 and is happy. She doesn't exist.

I never pay an allowance in advance. As noted, once she's got the cash in hand she's got what she wants and will go looking for another well to provide.

Thud, how do you handle the "how much can / will you spend per month" question in your profile on SA? Also, do you post photos of yourself? Finally, what is your opening line? (I've tried "loved your profile" and "want to have fun" and some others all equally lame. It's amazing I ever get laid. Just trying to learn before they haul me off to the cemetary.)

[QUOTE=Literal2;1116871]Thud, how do you handle the "how much can / will you spend per month" question in your profile on SA? Also, do you post photos of yourself? Finally, what is your opening line?[/QUOTE]Bottom line: it works. Requires substantial investment of time (and, of course, cash). Met 4, boned 2, new meets scheduled every night this week. All attractive, one spectacular 20 year old (met but not boned, but looks promising). Tiring. However, the membership only lasts a month, so have to make the most of it unless I decide to renew.

As soon as my profile went up I got a handful of requests, before I'd paid so I couldn't respond. There are roughly 2500 listings in my 50 mile default radius. I've now scanned through about 1000, responded to about 150, and have gotten replies from about 15, maybe half of which are prospects. No overt scams (yet) and no increase in SPAM in my associated e-mail.

To answer your questions, no I don't post my pic, but I send on request when someone has replied with a private e-mail address and I'm interested. I'm honest with my intentions: I'm not looking to 'keep' anyone (can't afford it) , just something weekly (well, I'm probably looking for at least two different weekly girls, but that's more than I can afford). I've only explicitly talked amounts with one girl, and the two I took home with me we didn't talk amounts, I just gave them an envelope with a 'gift' (200). One girl was very happy and txt'ed me saying 'thanks' and 'let's do it again'; the other one I haven't heard back from and haven't contacted again. That's my basic offer. 200 / date, which I call $1000 / month (on a 5 week month). I don't respond to girls asking more than 1. 3K; most are 'open for negotiation' which is what I put in my profile. I have about a 3 paragraph message that I send to the girls I respond to, giving a rough but accurate self-description, what I'm looking for (put nicely) , and what I'm offering (not explicit numbers, but that I'm offering a supplement, not full support).

I'd say worth it. However, I'm doing a kind of 'run'. Got an extra few thousand at year's end, and I'm having some fun with it. Maybe I'll end up with a semi-regular thing (although I tend toward variety). It is a way to meet some good looking girls and have a much better time than with a pro (at least in my experience). Both the girls I've brought home have been full date / GFE experiences. Dinner / drinks, followed by around 3 hours of fun for 200 plus the restaurant tab. I'm having fun (but getting tired) , and it's getting tough to schedule things. I'm about to have to back out of a date I've got scheduled for Thursday (body builder) for a better looking prospect (Russian).

I was unable to log in for a few days or I would have responded sooner. Thud, thank you for the useful post re how you do it using the so-called amateur sb sites. I hope you get laid every night this week, man. I'm headed back to my squirter sb today but this will be the third time so it's beginning to feel like a relationship which is not really what I want. I mean I do want it when I want it but most of the time I don't. I need to get back to work and sort thru the available talent and see if I can find another nice new hot wet "amateur" pussy.

I've gotten into a boring mess of personal details with sb4 and still haven't laid a hand or anything else on her. I'm working a bunch of new girls on the site.

I have to be discreet so it's hard to keep communications going back and forth quickly enough to build up a relationship to where getting together comes up naturally. I think I'm averaging about one response for every three attempts.

Thud and OBX, how you fellas doing out there?

As for me, I wasted a lot of time with the third girl I met on the site (sb3). She sent me pussy pix and everything and said she couldn't wait to fuck etc etc. I met her once briefly in a neutral location. I gave her a little sugar ($). She reconfirmed her interest but soon developed complex personal problems and disappeared. I know, I'm an idiot. I think in this case she was seriously considering fucking me though (she gave me her address and everything) but just changed her mind. So I'm finished with sb3.

As to sb2 (the squirter). I saw her several times but I began to grow less interested. It got harder for me to cum with her. Her squirting diminished too. Time passed. We exchanged affectionate notes but no more meetings. Then I got an email saying she needed more money to keep the relationship going. I said thank you and sayonara.

On to sb4, which was another waste of time. I spent days emailing chit chat and proposals and cross proposals to a hot Euro babe "on vacation with her family" in the US. She insisted on knowing all details in advance including the financial details, which I don't like to talk about except in general terms. She declined to state her own requirements. Finally I took an idea from Thud and talked about 1k a month to help out with expenses, blah blah. She responded that nobody on the site had ever made her such a small cheap offer. So screw her.

There were maybe 3-4 other sb's I talked to without any serious prospects developing, so as Thud says, this can be a lot of work. Also, like OBX, I want them to host because the whole hotel thing adds a layer of cost and logistics I'd rather avoid.

Pressing onward, I am now talking to two more sb's. A 27 year old who "just wants to have fun" and a 19 year old who needs a little assistance (I'm hoping).

Whew. Oh well, it's a great game. Personallly, I prefer it to cruising for SW's or dialing for pro's. Not that there's anything wrong with that. They are my back up. No offense intended towards anyone else who has different views.

Things continue apace, although I think I'm starting to wind down through the stack. It is a combination of pros, semi-pros, pros trying to act like non-pros, and the occasional real non-pro. Also wild fluctuations in what the girls want in the way of support, although most seem to have a pretty good idea of what the escort rate is and ask for something in that range. One big difference is that many of the girls, even the pro / semi-pros (e. G. Dancers) are using their real names and are not trying to hide who they are. This is helpful in doing background research (e. G. Discovering that one girl who was recently a dancer had a background as a competitive gymnast). We had a one-night stand, and she's requesting a return engagement, but she also wants 300 / date, which is over budget. I've had several meet-and-greets with girls who want in the 4. 500 range, and I decline (well, I'm planning a one-night stand with one 400 girl just because she's so spectacular I can't help myself. Probably end up disappointed, but I want to give it a try). Dinner meet with a 19-year-old yesterday and she's up for a return engagement with private time and was fine with my offer of 200 / date. Plan is to have an early dinner then retire to my place with a bottle of tequila (I'm fortunate to have a bachelor pad). The Russian wanted 300, so that was a no-go. Meeting with a 24-year-old artist tonight that I've had good e-mail with. There's a late 20's / early 30's perhaps semi-pro that I've been with a couple of times now at 200 / who's suggested that I come over some afternoon and she'll invite her friend the LMT over with her massage table for us to both get massages with some fun afterwards. That sounds promising. 3-way.

I've not had any rip-offs, although one girl tried to pay me, saying that 1000 / month. 200 / meeting was fine but that she had some immediate financial problems that required $900 to get beyond. I wished her all the best. Even a non-pro is likely to be less interested in coming to hang out and screw if she's already gotten and spent the money. Maybe if I actually run a long-term thing with someone I'd be willing to help them out in advance, but it's just human nature for that not to work out well. That's the only girl who wasted any of my time, because we exchanged many more e-mails than I usually would before a meeting (she was very attractive) before she told me about her 'immediate needs'.

I've also seen several ads from girls who want support but say they're not interested in getting involved with anything sexual. One of them was asking for $20K. $30K / month for 'conversation'. I've met some pretty good conversationalists in my day, but none of them were worth a quarter million a year. Sheesh.

I'm down to about a week-and-a-half on my membership left and I think I'll not renew but keep plowing the fields I've seeded this month. I've got a couple of 19-year-olds on tap who are young but fun, and couple of mid-20s who are pretty but expensive, and a couple of 30+ girls who are also pretty and very easy to get along with and not too expensive, but do show a little age. Don't know if I've found one I want to stick with yet. Probably end up seeing a couple of them for a while.

There hasn't been much interesting to report on the sb front in recent weeks. Lots of prospecting but no action. A string of broken dates: I got a room in Short Pump for one sb girl who didn't show and I quickly called a referral from a good old boy on this site but the girl who showed probably wasn't actually the one he referred plus was flabby in the extreme so I sent her away. That was a wasted evening, except for the ego-boost I got at a bar from a red haired 26 year old beauty who rejected several dudes half my age before accepting my offer of a drink. Probably thought I'd be harmless and good cover. Then there was the sb who agreed to a date but canceled because of her period. Then there were two 19 year olds who emailed me furiously for a week confirming and reconfirming our dates only to disappear just before they were to take place. Has anyone noticed teenagers can be unreliable? Then I worked a 22 year old Euro student / model and offered a monthly allowance for weekly meets. She said it was the lowest cheapest offer anyone ever made her on the site. OK, I said, how about the entire monthly allowance for one meet? This was acceptable and we set it up for tomorrow. Meanwhile, another sb emerged on a trip out of state, I'll call her SB4 or "Abby." She's a slim 25 year old, long haired brunette, flawless tight skin everywhere, perfect teeth, about 5"2," big breasted and small firm butt. A knockout, in other words. One of the top three prettiest girls I've ever dated. Very tight vagina. I licked and fingered her and she came in about three minutes, squirming to get away from me at the end as her clit got oversensitive. I love that. She cried out a little every time I thrust into her. It was just great. She tells me she gets so many emails on the sb site that she can't possibly read them all. I gave her 5x$. To me she was worth it, but that's just my opinion. I canceled tomorrow's date with the Euro.

I got an email this AM from a girl I'd been chasing without success on the SB site asking to meet right away. I was pressed for time but I set it up for 12 noon. She wanted to meet at a Walmart first to check me out. She arrived half an hour late then wanted to buy cigarettes. More time wasted. Then we walked to her house where the utilities had been cut off which is why she contacted me I guess. The place was a mess. She has to shower next door and has a baby to care for. She wanted to talk about a regular relationship. I said we'd have to see. She is real skinny and small breasted but took off her clothes and got on the bed. More talking about how long a relationship woud I commit for. I said I don't know yet. She said no sex on first meeting but she'd give me a BJ, which she commenced. I pulled her up after a while and tried to home in on her pussy, but she said it was too soon, no DATY either. I said WTF and started to leave. She said she was sure I would like her over time and she would loosen up, but if I wanted FS today it would be 8x$. I walked out but left her some sugar to help pay her bills. I don't care much for real skinny girls anyway.

Surprise surprise. I opened my email yesterday to a sweet email from SB5 (the one who didn't want FS right now but who attempted to placate Mr Johnson orally). Now she has thought it over, she says, I really am a wonderful guy and she will accept all my terms and conditions and wants to "make love" if I will just agree to see her again. So I guess this means she is ready to be fucked. Maybe next week.

SB6 showed up tonight. Nothing like her pic which was admittedly a little blurry. This girl is 38, spiky blond hair, and heavy. Not so much flabby though, just big butt, big thighs, big belly and big boobs. Also she is on crutches. Some knee problem. I was going to turn her away but she was an hour late and I had already turned away SB7 in a phone call and Mr Johnson wanted some pussy. So I let her stay. She turned out all the lights. OK, I can deal with that. I peeled off her clothes as her breathing got harder and faster by the minute. She turned out to be a great fuck. Why? Because she was totally passionate and into it. Still, I am a little weirded out: I don't fuck heavy girls. This is only about no 2 fat girl out of 65 or so total girls to date. She asked for nothing. In fact she thanked me. I gave her $$$ which delighted her. I won't see her again.

I am worried about SB4. I am going to a lot of inconvenience in order to fuck her again on Wednesday. She is so fine. So tight. So pretty. So firm everywhere. So passionate. (She's not perfect. She's a lousy housekeeper.) I am worried I will start behaving irrationally because of her and this may affect my stability. The only thing I can think to do is to try to fuck another few girls during the same time period. I find this tends to reduce the infatuation factor.

Thank you for the guidance and insights, USASG.

Thank you Heaven for Mr Johnson.

Thank you girls, for all your wonderful body parts.

I hope I die with my dick in a 25 year old girl.

Not right now though.

I decided to skip SB7 who called yesterday until she sends me a pic with her clothes off, which I asked for last night after I got home from SB6. Why? Because some of these SB girls are NOT TRUTHFUL when they post their pix online. I'm SHOCKED!

SB6 as I said was much heavier than her pix showed and her body type was not "average" as she claimed. But she had a certain firmness and was a heavy breather and smelled good so Mr Johnson took over the meet as I previously reported. I don't regret it. She was a good fuck.

The next SB girl was a different story. I ran into her out of state. She did not look anything like her pix online and she had lied about her weight online. She was a fatso. As soon as I saw her I realized Mr Johnson did not approve so I just had her spread her legs and took a few gyno shots for you guys (if these offend you don't look).

I think the sb website has three types of girls. 1. Real amateurs who want some money but would never think of themselves as escorts. 2. Girls who are escorts or part time escorts. 3. Girls too unattractive to be escorts. I don't partake of the SW scene so I don't know how they compare. I assume the SW's are also at the low end of the looks department, but I don't really know.

Anyway with SB8 I just fingered her for a while, never took off my pants. BTW, she was a little smelly in the pussy. You know how some of that aroma is nice? Well too much of it isn't. Even so, Johnson started to perk up as the girl rolled around and helped out with the fingering. I thought maybe he was going to take over again which would have been very depressing. Just then the doorbell rang. The girl said come back in a few minutes. We resumed pussy play. The doorbell rang again. It turned out there was a delivery team right outside the door trying to deliver a sofa. I went in the bathroom to wash my hands. No soap. WTF. I opened the door and said come on in guys I was just leaving. Funny I guess but kind of repulsive too. I have to get tougher on who I will see off that website.

Oh well. At least I should see SB4 again in a few days.

[QUOTE=Literal2;1143865]I think the sb website has three types of girls. 1. Real amateurs who want some money but would never think of themselves as escorts. 2. Girls who are escorts or part time escorts. 3. Girls too unattractive to be escorts. I don't partake of the SW scene so I don't know how they compare. I assume the SW's are also at the low end of the looks department, but I don't really know.[/QUOTE]I have been on SB site since mid-December last year. I have had one success which I have seen every couple of weeks since beginning of the year. I have been searching for something fresh but have not come up with anything. Question for you is; how old are the women you've been seeing and what is the age limit their looking for? Thanks in advance for your help.

Coolhand

There are a few different SB sites out there. The two biggest seem to be SeekingArrangement and SugarDaddyForMe. The former has more women, but I've had better success on the latter. Which are you guys using?

For what it's worth, my best success used to be posting on the women-seeking-men section of Craigslist. But now that they're policing the posts much more thoroughly, it's become alot more difficult to make a post that gets across what you're really looking for without getting deleted, and posting on the casual-encounters section is a complete waste of time.

[QUOTE=Cantwinlosin;1145172]There are a few different SB sites out there. The two biggest seem to be SeekingArrangement and SugarDaddyForMe. The former has more women, but I've had better success on the latter. Which are you guys using? [/QUOTE]I'm using SugarDaddy.

[QUOTE=Coolhand2; 1144975]I have been on SB site since mid-December last year. I have had one success which I have seen every couple of weeks since beginning of the year. I have been searching for something fresh but have not come up with anything. Question for you is; how old are the women you've been seeing and what is the age limit their looking for? Thanks in advance for your help.

Coolhand[/QUOTE]Let me think. I started with the site in November. I search for 18-45 and recently began restricting by body type. I have probably contacted 60 to 70 girls by this point and received replies from 20 or so. I've seen 7 and been stood up twice when the girl was a no show at the meeting place and at least twice more when the girl made a date but failed to make the last confirmation but I didn't have to go to the meeting place. Of the girls I've met, I've fucked 4, two of them more than once, and I've walked away from 2 (one too heavy though with a pretty cootch, see the previous pix, and another too restrictive, she's the one who now wants to meet again) and one wouldn't meet me alone after a get acquainted session.

I've got two now who say they want to meet and I need to figure out how and when. One should be a sure fuck if I want it since she's already had my dick in her mouth but I walked out when she got restrictive about access to her pussy. She's mid-twenties and a single mother. The other is an artsy student type in early thirties, she says.

Of the 4, two are mid-thirties and two are late twenties. Two of them are single mothers. Girls over 23 commonly misstate their ages on the site. So do I. I look younger than way past 60 which is what I am. A lot of girls say they are looking for 30 to 75 or 18 to 90, but many others state they are looking for guys no older than 45 or 50. Several girls agreed to see me even though my stated age didn't meet their stated age requirement. I don't bother with a girl who wants someone close to her own age, because they aren't looking for a sugardaddy or a customer, they're looking for a husband. Two girls who state they are 19 but looking for older men acted like teenagers by making dates with me and then failing to confirm at the last minute, so they probably are teenagers. Anyway that's what I think.

[QUOTE=Cantwinlosin; 1145172]There are a few different SB sites out there. The two biggest seem to be SeekingArrangement and SugarDaddyForMe. The former has more women, but I've had better success on the latter. Which are you guys using?

For what it's worth, my best success used to be posting on the women-seeking-men section of Craigslist. But now that they're policing the posts much more thoroughly, it's become alot more difficult to make a post that gets across what you're really looking for without getting deleted, and posting on the casual-encounters section is a complete waste of time. [/QUOTE]Thanks for the info about your methods. I love usasg. I learn something new about how to search for pussy every day. The site I'm using is the second site you refer to.

It's possible to find near-perfection in an sb, sometimes for some of us anyway. I met SB4 for the second time yesterday. If anything it was even better than the first time. This woman is gorgeous inmo. Perfect figure, lovely face, lovely long thick dark hair, white teeth, plus she's smart as hell. A butt to die for. Pussy so clean you could eat all your meals off it. She's had a boob job which took her up to double D's. I'd prefer she had stayed natural and she didn't want to get that big but right now they are very pretty to look at. Like some body art and piercings that she has, she will regret these things with time, but for now they just make her look exotic and they are well done and I love them! She's very affectionate, calling me sweet names in our emails, very sexual and cums easily, but I can tell from her vagina wetness factor and failure to ask for my dick in her mouth that she is putting up with me rather than going nuts over me (like the squirter I talked about did). She's late twenties. She's had a couple of long term sugardaddy relationships with guys about my age in the past and I'm not sure how long I can hold on to her but I have limits in terms of what I will spend and how often. So far her allowance needs have been reasonable but I took some risk seeing her yesterday. I have to drive for hours to get to her. On the way back I had a goddam flat tire! I was out in the boonies at night with a rented car and curfew looming back at the prison. I am cursing and sweating and trying to change the friggin tire with a local beer drinking dude asking nosy questions and one eye on the time. It took me about 30 minutes, which was my cushion. I made it back to my cell with about two minutes to spare before the warden would have gotten suspicious. Whew.

One of the sb's was into unsafe sex before I could stop it. I checked out [url]http://www.tstd.org/[/url] And got anonymous std screening for about $$.5.

[QUOTE=Literal2; 1145554]Let me think. I started with the site in November. I search for 18-45 and recently began restricting by body type. I have probably contacted 60 to 70 girls by this point and received replies from 20 or so. I've seen 7 and been stood up twice when the girl was a no show at the meeting place and at least twice more when the girl made a date but failed to make the last confirmation but I didn't have to go to the meeting place. Of the girls I've met, I've fucked 4, two of them more than once, and I've walked away from 2 (one too heavy though with a pretty cootch, see the previous pix, and another too restrictive, she's the one who now wants to meet again) and one wouldn't meet me alone after a get acquainted session.

I've got two now who say they want to meet and I need to figure out how and when. One should be a sure fuck if I want it since she's already had my dick in her mouth but I walked out when she got restrictive about access to her pussy. She's mid-twenties and a single mother. The other is an artsy student type in early thirties, she says.

Of the 4, two are mid-thirties and two are late twenties. Two of them are single mothers. Girls over 23 commonly misstate their ages on the site. So do I. I look younger than way past 60 which is what I am. A lot of girls say they are looking for 30 to 75 or 18 to 90, but many others state they are looking for guys no older than 45 or 50. Several girls agreed to see me even though my stated age didn't meet their stated age requirement. I don't bother with a girl who wants someone close to her own age, because they aren't looking for a sugardaddy or a customer, they're looking for a husband. Two girls who state they are 19 but looking for older men acted like teenagers by making dates with me and then failing to confirm at the last minute, so they probably are teenagers. Anyway that's what I think.[/QUOTE]I second the thanks for the info about your methods. Part of my problem is I choose not to use the city where I live but use Richmond since I get a pass from the warden to go there two to three times a month on business. This restricts the amount of time I can spend in pursuit so I'm looking for a home-run right off the bat. I'm debating if it would be a better use of time to focus on escorts with good reviews. The allure of SB was to hook up with amatures but they sure take a time investment. I'm going to give it another month or so. Keep us posted on how your search is going and I will do the same.

Coolhand

I decided to take SB5 at her word and accept her offer to come over and fuck her which I did yesterday. Skinny but nice and tight and good oral skills. Smokes like a fiend and her place stinks of smoke. I can tell she's going to be clingy so I must execute exit strategy.

Later I met up with SB9 an artist / student type who I've been emailing for nearly a month. Bad news is she was late to our meeting at a bar and I was out of time so I just paid for her drinks and left. Good news is she is gorgeous. She has told me that if we agree to an arrangement she can use her friend's apartment to host. I'm hoping this one works out because that would give me two really fine girls to fuck, SB4 being the other one.

It was an active week for me with four SB's opening their pussies for my inspection and pleasure.

I was trying to figure out how long it took from initial contact to penetration in each case. Two girls spread their legs within a day or two of our first contact, but those were the heavy ones. Of the other two, SB4 was a repeat. Although by far the best so far, my first contact with her a few weeks ago was followed quickly by penetration within a few days. On the other hand, SB5 didn't respond to my emails on the site for many days and when she did she wanted to meet right away but she spent the first session talking about her restrictions so I walked out. So from first contact to penetration in SB5's case took at least three weeks and two visits.

I agree that if you want a sure thing you are better off with well-reviewed escorts. For me the excitement of the chase enhances the sex, but that's just me.

[QUOTE=Literal2;1147109]I agree that if you want a sure thing you are better off with well-reviewed escorts. For me the excitement of the chase enhances the sex, but that's just me.[/QUOTE]I understand the chase enhancing the sex. That was the main reasons I started on the SB site. According to their stats, I've emailed a hundred, received messages from 85, (somewhere between a third to half of those are unsolicited messages from out of state) and hit my home run on the one meeting that was actually set. I've seen her twice. Early thirties, not bad looking housewife type who is totally into the sex. I leave her $$ and she has always been very grateful. I'll probably see her at least once more but I'm ready for something new. I have five who say they're ready to meet and one I'm set to meet a week from tomorrow. Since my visits to the city are limited, I reserve one visit a month for an escort visit because that gives me both variety and certainty. If this meeting next week works out I'm going to substitute her for the escort visit, drop the housewife, and focus on expanding my circle of SB's. To this point funds have not been an issue but there is a limit for these type of activities. Thanks again for the info. Keep the updates coming and stay safe.

Coolhand

Thanks for the data, Cool. Can I ask you is your housewife still married and living with the husband? Mine have all been divorced or single moms. Also, for the five that are ready to meet, have you discussed money yet? How do you handle it? Finally, are the meetings get acquainted meetings in public or are they meetings where you will be alone?

Just curious.

[QUOTE=Literal2;1147810]Thanks for the data, Cool. Can I ask you is your housewife still married and living with the husband? Mine have all been divorced or single moms. Also, for the five that are ready to meet, have you discussed money yet? How do you handle it? Finally, are the meetings get acquainted meetings in public or are they meetings where you will be alone? Just curious.[/QUOTE]She told me from the beginning that she is still married but that the husband was cool with everything. We set date, time, and amount of help over email outside of the SB site. Both meetings have been at her house; once in the evening and once in the afternoon. I know there is at least one child because she needs a couple of days notice to arrange work schedule and babysitting. Plus I see kids stuff around. There was no "get acquainted" meeting and she was dressed and ready for action when I got there. She has never mentioned money outside of the email which said what her expectations were. I put it in a visible but inconspicuous place before I leave. I do have to say one thing; I'm not sure there is a husband. I can't see a man's presence in the bedroom we use (although I don't get a lot of time to check it out) so it might be a cover story to make her feel safe.

Of the five that are ready to meet, time and place have not been set but I don't think there married. Two have said how much money their looking for and the others have not said anything about it. I do try to make sure they know that the SB site is not about the traditional relationship and that my expectation is for a discrete SB / SD experience.

I think you were absolutely right about the three types of women on that site. The housewife (CSB1) is in the first category of amateurs who needs financial assistance. I'm not sure yet which category the one (CSB2) I'm meeting next week falls into. I'll let you know the type of meeting it turns out to be when it's set. The two that have said the dollar amount (not yet worthy of designation) I think fall into the second category of semi-pro.

This whole SB thing takes a lot of work.

Coolhand