Printable View
[QUOTE=FarFarAway;3119565]
We still need to find a prepaid debit card that is approved for international purposes.[/QUOTE]No such beast. I've searched. You can get virtual credit card numbers on the dark web, but you're getting credit card numbers and a web interface from someone completely unknown to you. The potential to be ripped off is high.
If they'll take the digits over the phone or via email at SA, what bother with anything else?
[QUOTE=FarFarAway;3119833]Second follow up. What I've done since.
...
It's not like a OneVanilla that has only my zip code. .... [/QUOTE]No need to use your real zip code. Just set it to one you'll remember easily.
[QUOTE=BikeRider;3120151]No need to use your real zip code. Just set it to one you'll remember easily.[/QUOTE]Yep, that's what I've been doing. I have a total sugar identity, with the sugar last name that goes with an address with a zip code I always use. That part I've got OK.
I met a decent girl, who wants $1200 per month (or a little more). She claims we have to sneak in her apt (she has roommates but has her own room). The way she talked, I could see her 2-3 times per week. She lives in a very poor area (not DC, NYC).
When I offered $1000 and she take down her SA and whatsherprice ads, she kind of got mad. She stated "I don't know why $1200+ is a problem for you, all the other guys that I start to talk to are completely ok with that. You are the complete package and they are not. My needs ($1200) are greater than my wants (me I guess) right now. ".
Should I take the plunge and go for the $1200 per month? The bedroom skills could be a home run or a dead fish. $1200 per month is above my sugar budget for the month but 2-3 times a week of mind blowing sex might be worth it.
Any advise is appreciated! Thank you gentleman. Keep the hunt going!
[QUOTE=EnzoAmore;3120539]I met a decent girl, who wants $1200 per month (or a little more). She claims we have to sneak in her apt (she has roommates but has her own room). The way she talked, I could see her 2-3 times per week. She lives in a very poor area (not DC, NYC).
When I offered $1000 and she take down her SA and whatsherprice ads, she kind of got mad. She stated "I don't know why $1200+ is a problem for you, all the other guys that I start to talk to are completely ok with that. You are the complete package and they are not. My needs ($1200) are greater than my wants (me I guess) right now. ".
Should I take the plunge and go for the $1200 per month? The bedroom skills could be a home run or a dead fish. $1200 per month is above my sugar budget for the month but 2-3 times a week of mind blowing sex might be worth it.
Any advise is appreciated! Thank you gentleman. Keep the hunt going![/QUOTE]Its simple, first for 2-3 times a week plus she has a place its a good value. 2nd if you can't afford it move on or get a second job.
[QUOTE=EnzoAmore;3120539]I met a decent girl, who wants $1200 per month (or a little more). She claims we have to sneak in her apt (she has roommates but has her own room). The way she talked, I could see her 2-3 times per week. She lives in a very poor area (not DC, NYC). When I offered $1000 and she take down her SA and whatsherprice ads, she kind of got mad. She stated "I don't know why $1200+ is a problem for you, all the other guys that I start to talk to are completely ok with that. You are the complete package and they are not. My needs ($1200) are greater than my wants (me I guess) right now. ". Should I take the plunge and go for the $1200 per month? The bedroom skills could be a home run or a dead fish. $1200 per month is above my sugar budget for the month but 2-3 times a week of mind blowing sex might be worth it. Any advise is appreciated! Thank you gentleman. Keep the hunt going![/QUOTE]Well this is one reason I avoid the ones that insist on talking money up front. It forces the entire situation to revolve around some number that's in her head or your head or both. I tell them numbers are for escorts, I'm in this to date, and I enjoy gifting the girls I date. I could never see the logic in two people discussing some monthly amount up front when the two haven't even met yet. You might not like each other. You might think each other smells bad. You might think the other doesn't look like their pics. So how does it make sense to come up with some firm agreement based on presumptions that could turn out to be wrong? Isn't it better for both of you to see what you're really working with, and figure that all out once the facts are known?
If done any other way, she's basically telling herself "hmm, how much would it take for me to fuck this random guy I've never even seen before". Only a pro, UTR or pro-wannabe would do that.
That said, if you have already made the mistake of discussing money up front and really want this girl, then for what she is saying (12 visits a month for $1200), I'd say that's a fairly economical expectation in the sugar world. Sometimes I practice negotiating with girls in markets that I have no intention of visiting just to stay on top of that game and keep skills sharp on what makes these girls tick. Fairly regularly I can talk girls down from $400-500 per visit expectation to $100 per visit, but again my purpose here is not the numbers themselves but paying close attention to the processes involved in causing them to revalue their pussy at 20% of their original twat-appraisal, and zeroing in on what works with what girl and what does not.
Or, another thing you could do is agree to her original offer contingent on pay per visit, then just visit her 10 times a month instead of 12 and you've hit your desired target.
So I took the advice from many mongers. I got a vanilla one card and then I texted the information to SA help desk. In less than 12 hours they emailed me and said my subscription was paid. It was very easy.
I already had the meet and greet with her. We talked at the end of it and she said her bills were $1200 minimum a month.
[QUOTE=JZLizard;3120844]Well this is one reason I avoid the ones that insist on talking money up front. It forces the entire situation to revolve around some number that's in her head or your head or both. I tell them numbers are for escorts, I'm in this to date, and I enjoy gifting the girls I date. I could never see the logic in two people discussing some monthly amount up front when the two haven't even met yet. You might not like each other. You might think each other smells bad. You might think the other doesn't look like their pics. So how does it make sense to come up with some firm agreement based on presumptions that could turn out to be wrong? Isn't it better for both of you to see what you're really working with, and figure that all out once the facts are known?
If done any other way, she's basically telling herself "hmm, how much would it take for me to fuck this random guy I've never even seen before". Only a pro, UTR or pro-wannabe would do that.
That said, if you have already made the mistake of discussing money up front and really want this girl, then for what she is saying (12 visits a month for $1200), I'd say that's a fairly economical expectation in the sugar world. Sometimes I practice negotiating with girls in markets that I have no intention of visiting just to stay on top of that game and keep skills sharp on what makes these girls tick. Fairly regularly I can talk girls down from $400-500 per visit expectation to $100 per visit, but again my purpose here is not the numbers themselves but paying close attention to the processes involved in causing them to revalue their pussy at 20% of their original twat-appraisal, and zeroing in on what works with what girl and what does not.
Or, another thing you could do is agree to her original offer contingent on pay per visit, then just visit her 10 times a month instead of 12 and you've hit your desired target.[/QUOTE]It is often difficult to not discuss numbers prior to meeting. From the woman's perspective she doesn't want to waste her time on someone doesn't have the means or desire to meet her expectations. From my perspective, I don't waste the time for a meeting only to find out she has GPS. I do see JZ's point though.
I approach it on a case by case basis. I prefer to take JZ's approach, but there are times where I can't or prefer to just have a more transactional meeting. When I know it is just going to be transactional, I always discuss the gift up front to avoid wasting time and potential restaurant drama.
[QUOTE=BikeRider;3121151]It is often difficult to not discuss numbers prior to meeting. From the woman's perspective she doesn't want to waste her time on someone doesn't have the means or desire to meet her expectations. From my perspective, I don't waste the time for a meeting only to find out she has GPS. I do see JZ's point though.
I approach it on a case by case basis. I prefer to take JZ's approach, but there are times where I can't or prefer to just have a more transactional meeting. When I know it is just going to be transactional, I always discuss the gift up front to avoid wasting time and potential restaurant drama.[/QUOTE]If I were just going for quantity, I would have to say I definitely lose a measurable amount of opportunity by sending the money-first girls on their way, but I've already accepted that sugaring is a lot of work, so after a while I think it actually makes things easier to just pass on the girls who insist on discussing it. There are a lot of girls who are conditioned to discussing money first, because the blogs have told them that's the only way they should do it, and that behavior has been reinforced by guys that are willing to play their game to get in their pants. And that's fine, because I'm willing to forego getting in their pants, because the less time I waste on them, the quicker I can find the kind of girl I really want.
But as I've mentioned before, I absolutely do discuss money when hunting for stripper takeout, that's all about the art of the deal (and part of the fun, I think). But then again whenever I walk into a strip club, I'm going in with the knowledge that there may not even be any girls in the place I like, and even if there are, there may not be any that are available enough or interested enough to go home with me, regardless of the offering. I just know its going to cost me one way or another because they went to work to make money that night and at a minimum I will have to buy them out.
But well employed strippers are a different group. As far as SBs go, My personality is just too dominate to do things her way. And to do things my way is more like "let's meet and see if we like each other and go from there" which I think is fair enough. I don't like transactional sure things. It's just my preference but the challenge and going into it not knowing exactly how it is going to turn out is part of the fun. I don't mind paying money (actually prefer to) but I don't want payment to stand in the way of the suspense.
My newest baby, OCHottie, went to the FC with me for the morning today. This is my 2nd experience with a mystical 'girl 1/3 my age' - she's 21. Unlike the first experience, this girl wasn't pudgy. Big tits (not firm, not floppy), serious skills. She's a first timer, and I teased her that she would only be an official sugar baby once I penetrated her. And when I did, she immediately got 'that look', and I knew we were good.
Sorry to be repetitive, but my playing in the bowl is due all to the outstanding senior members who post such excellent advice here. I couldn't have imagined even in May that I could be having mind-blowing sex with a 20-something. I am far better in the FC than I've been in civi life over the past couple of decades. Sometimes I feel I am racing to do this before I die. I will at least do so with a smile on my face.
[QUOTE=EnzoAmore;3121145]I already had the meet and greet with her. We talked at the end of it and she said her bills were $1200 minimum a month.[/QUOTE]Ok, I misunderstood the situation a bit, I think you did the right thing by meeting with her first at least. The only time I've had a meet and greet, then discussed money, it turned out badly (yes that was a mistake I made exactly one time in the past, never again).
The other times I showed her, via taking her out for a night on the town, that I am very much for real in terms of my ABILITY to give her what she really wants (never confuse ability with willingness). I might be staying in an expensive hotel, I might take her for dinner and drinks at expensive places and burn $200 just on that portion of the date and I might throw the waiter a ridiculously generous tip for doing his job well.
This sends a very clear message to the girl. I can afford to do the above because I'm not just some Walmart door greeter pretending to be successful on the Internet, I am what I say I am and I got here for a reason. Now its up to her to prove she's good enough. By this time she's smart enough to know she's not the only 20 year old in the world who would like to get fucked by me and helped with life's bills. She realizes she is in competition, and that if she fucks the date up she might lose the chance.
So prior to the M&G I tell her let's just meet and see if we have a good time. Then I make sure she has a good time, from the conversation to making sure she orders whatever she wants from the menu and / or goes wherever she wants for a night on the town, to the sex afterwards. Call it micro-spoiling if you want. What is somewhat tricky about it is that I enjoy the dating aspect too, so even if I blow a significant amount of cash on dinner and drinks, she really only benefited from roughly half of that, the other half of the expenses were enjoyed by me.
In bed, I'm not overly focused on what I want to do, but equally focused on what it takes to get her off. That last sentence is what really saves you on the total gift amount and ensures future interest. Solve that problem and it really doesn't matter what you gift them in cash the next morning, they will continue texting you non stop for the next week about how over the top amazing it was and how they can't get it out of their mind.
If they feel like they are there solely to meet your needs, they will bill you for it. If you're meeting THEIR needs, they are way too busy enjoying the moment to to worry about they are getting paid.
In my case, the hotel room is overhead I would have had anyway from traveling, so it would be an expensive hobby if I rolled that into the mix, but since it needs to be paid whether or not I have a girl I don't figure it in to the total.
Enzo sounds like you've got a pot on the hook. My recommendation would be to break up the allowance initially to make sure she doesn't pull a grab and dash. Tell her you prefer weekly allowance at first until trust is developed. When she balks, tell her that you would never expect intimacy from a baby without giving her an allowance, and would expect the same consideration from your future baby. If she responds by saying that she can be trusted and that by breaking up the allowance you are making her feel cheap, tell her that you've reconsidered, and that you'll provide the allowance on a monthly basis at the end of the month (I. E. After your 3-4 visits are completed). I've found this tactic to cause a pot to backtrack and to become very happy with weekly allowance, which is essentially a pay per meet allowance with the upside of having the possibility of a free date if you see the baby more than once in that week.
By characterizing the allowance as "weekly" you avoid the stigma attached to "pay to play". You also get to sample the goods before going all in with a $1,200 investment. If she is a dead fish in bed, then you've protected yourself. This also has the added bonus of guaranteeing 4 meets a month (assuming you have the time for four meets).
There are plenty of guys in the bowl that consider paying for a date and providing a very modest gift as their "allowance" to a baby. I know this because my prior babies have complained about guys like this. These SDs talk up a girl, setting expectations high, dance around discussion of allowance but provide just enough of a hint of some huge payday that the pot is willing to take a chance but then leave a gift that doesn't match expectations. The babies are often too inexperienced in life to complain, and who would they complain to? Not something you would share with a family member or a friend. This tactic works for some who travel since there is no expectation of a recurring relationship and on an inexperienced pot. After a pot is burned once though, you can rest assured they will almost never agree to a fc date without first establishing what the allowance will be. Then the next SD is left with a situation where the pot won't come to the m&g until allowance is discussed.
I don't critcize the above method since to each his own, but in my experience, if you are trying to build up a rotation of recurring SBs, the better way to do it is to communicate expectations after the m&g, as you have done.
Remember, this is the sugar bowl. If these girls wanted to date an older guy for fun without the expectation of an allowance they would be on tinder or match.
Good luck with your pot. May you have many trips to the fc with her.
Fish out.
[QUOTE=EnzoAmore;3121145]I already had the meet and greet with her. We talked at the end of it and she said her bills were $1200 minimum a month.[/QUOTE]
Ffa, congrats again! It's childish, I know, but I have to say I told you so. You have hit paydirt by reading the board, studying the tactics, and reviewing the tips compiled by an enterprising brother (the one where JizzLizzard is the admini assistant, or whatever his new handle is now).
Technology is a wonderful thing. No? If you really like this new baby, set her up with subscription accounts like Pandora One, Pandora Plus (all these young babies love Electronic dance music) and / or Netflix. These subscriptions are super cheap, but have the effect of cementing your arrangement.
My post below was from a few weeks ago. I'm glad that the bowl has worked out for you!
[QUOTE=IluvSmellyFish;3096032]Congrats on the win Ffa. As you continue to play, I think you'll find that you'll hit paydirt eventually. That spinner you're looking for is waiting for you.
It's a numbers game. Even a fat, arrogant, narcissist has a chance in the bowl.
Read the entire thread that was put together by an enterprising young SD (I think JeezLizzard is the admin assistant for that thread).
It has great tips for how to differentiate yourself from the other daddys (e. G. Work out, be nice, always leave an encounter by being respectful even if it doesn't end up at the fc since they tend to cum back after meeting the Jerks etc).
Give it time and you'll meet that 20 year old spinner, who looks like a librarian when she walks into the hotel in the trench coat you bought for her, but is wearing nothing but a bra, garter, and black nylon thigh highs underneath. When she's on the bed facedown begging you to take her in the ass, while she's playing with her dripping wet pussy, you'll be glad you stuck with it. You may even start to like doggy more.
Oh how I miss my swim instructor some days.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=IluvSmellyFish;3121639]Ffa, congrats again! It's childish, I know, but I have to say I told you so. You have hit paydirt by reading the board, studying the tactics, and reviewing the tips compiled by an enterprising brother (the one where JizzLizzard is the admini assistant, or whatever his new handle is now).
Technology is a wonderful thing. No? If you really like this new baby, set her up with subscription accounts like Pandora One, Pandora Plus (all these young babies love Electronic dance music) and / or Netflix. These subscriptions are super cheap, but have the effect of cementing your arrangement.
My post below was from a few weeks ago. I'm glad that the bowl has worked out for you![/QUOTE]Thanks for the attaboy, Fish, and the encouragement after '1/3 my age' #1. Are there technical details about getting a girl a scrip to those services discretely that you can share? I'm not familiar with them. Some who have ongoing babies are getting instruction from their girls about the new techno world, but I'm not quite there yet. I have another trip to the FC with a model-quality 20's girl next week. Hitting my wallet hard, but I jumped over many other wannabee daddies to get there. Will post the outcome.