"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[QUOTE=Graham111;2880437]My max is $$ per date and I find that works pretty well in NY State, Ohio and Minnesota. Sure I have them ask for more but it works. Below $. 5 gets a little dicey, although I have had term that accepted $.[/QUOTE]I have essentially the same question. I am not looking to make a career or lifestyle, but I am looking for one SB to spice up an otherwise boring life. I have a few meets, with one date scheduled. The typical ask has been 5, which I have rejected quickly. Some said aloha, some may be interested. I have two kids in college so my money is directed elsewhere, but what should I expect to invest in a nice new friend for a couple of dates per month?

Well. I have been with my latest SB for about 6 maths. Still does not know my real name (but kinda close) but has been to my place a few times. We are traveling soon. But she is traveling to the location separate so there is some cover. If it comes out. I do not think it will be a big deal. I think I am going to unload her after the trip anyway. Just a lot of trouble. Most not really her fault. She had her brother die not long ago who she was close too so that was lack of puss for awhile. Then hit it a couple time and she ends up having surgery. So no puss for awhile. Guess this is a make up trip. LOL. We have been in the sack recently but still she also lost her job (was bartending but at a nicer restaurant) due to being off with her brothers death and then extended surgery so of course cash was tight. Etc. Etc. And yes all the incidents I mentioned are verified. She is just one that always has real issues in addition to the ones they create for themselves. LOL. Anyway. Just a report. I will update after the trip!. Its only for for 4 nights.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2878273]Let us know if you figure that one out. The hotel check in dilemma is one of the reasons I've resisted playing closer to home during the day, its easier to just schedule M&G when I'm traveling to various cities already anyway and the hotel is an expense I would have with or without the date.

I suspect you might strike gold on CL with any combination of time and luck, someone out there will rent a room for a little extra cash.[/QUOTE]You can work early checkins pretty easily. If you're making the reservation the same day (most of us probably do in case of flakes), then before you make the reservation online call the hotel's direct number and ask for the front desk. Explain to the person you've just arrived after a long flight / drive, and you want to know if you can check in within the next hour if you make a reservation. Be prepared to explain what kind of room you want. Double / king etc. You can also do this the night before as they'll know availability. If they say no or equivocate, call another hotel.

I've checked in as early as 9 am this way. The only time you might run into a problem is if something is going on in the general vicinity and all the rooms are booked the previous night.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2878308]Absolutely, I met SBs on civy dating sites long before I started using dedicated SD sites. I used to use Match often for civy hookups, and sometimes would see the girls I was meeting on SD websites. A few times I brought it to their attention and they would typically say "haha that's funny I forgot I made a profile there" or whatever (in those cases it was true because I could see they had not logged in to the SD site in like a year and a half).

Match, POF and others have SBs that know what they are after, you can usually figure them out by the age range of dating they specify and income expectations of potential matches.

Now some of these girls in the past during my civy years I fucked them stupid for nothing more than dinner. Yes they were looking for an SD but not in the sense of "discrete hotel room" hookups, more in the sense of "boyfriend with a good job". So, they were usually fucking me for the possibility of becoming a long term relationship.

These days I do not go SB hunting on Match and POF for two reasons.

First reason is that it's more work. More work to identify the potential SBs and / or to flip girls who haven't really thought about it yet into being one. This leads me to the reason number two.

The second reason is that because if you have game you can usually flip civy girls into being an SB, but because I feel like the girls on Match or POF would really rather find love or a soulmate, my conscience does not let me comfortably be the one to game them. To me it's a little like the old saying about not taking advantage of single moms. To me there is something inherently wrong about taking a girl who might not already have entitled princess syndrome, and try to get her involved in that lifestyle. Most of the SBs I know have daddy issues or something missing in their life, and I doubt they will ever have successful marriages after they've gotten used to such a sense of entitlement. I don't want to be the one to corrupt nice girls who are not yet gold diggers and convince them they should be a gold digger. I could do it very easily but its not playing fair and like I said my conscience has its limits. There are enough gold diggers out there that know exactly what they are getting into the moment they declare themselves an SB, I'd rather limit my play to them because I know I cannot offer a real relationship to any of these girls.[/QUOTE]Well it happened to me. I met a Ukranian girl on Match. Long story short she asks to be exclusive we date for about a month and I then I find out she has a profile.

On SA. I am fine with someone being on SA. Just don't lie to me and tell me you want to date exclusively and then put up a profile. Damn eastern european women.

At least I got some good times out of her but I will miss her.

[QUOTE=BikeRider;2880929]You can work early checkins pretty easily. If you're making the reservation the same day (most of us probably do in case of flakes), then before you make the reservation online call the hotel's direct number and ask for the front desk. Explain to the person you've just arrived after a long flight / drive, and you want to know if you can check in within the next hour if you make a reservation. Be prepared to explain what kind of room you want. Double / king etc. You can also do this the night before as they'll know availability. If they say no or equivocate, call another hotel.

I've checked in as early as 9 am this way. The only time you might run into a problem is if something is going on in the general vicinity and all the rooms are booked the previous night.[/QUOTE]Back when I was doing hotel for the FC, I just checked [URL]hotels.com[/URL] to get a sense of how full the place was the day before and the day of the meet. If it didn't look too busy, I just showed up and asked for a room, no explanations given. If they had one ready, then I was in. The 12-18 mos or so that I did this I don't think I ever went without a room. Granted this was a place that was a little off the beaten path, so it was rarely if ever maxed out.

But in general I get the sense that hotels have seen it all, and as long as it represents revenue without liabilities, then there's no problem. Whether they are savvy to what's going on doesn't really change much.

At the hotel I used, the front desk woman was usually the same and she got to the point where she recognized me when I walked in. After awhile I noticed that my last name and address were slightly incorrect in the system, despite having to show my license each time. I got the distinct feeling that this wasn't accidental. I certainly wasn't going to ask them to correct it.

[QUOTE=Ltnric;2880955]Well it happened to me. I met a Ukranian girl on Match. Long story short she asks to be exclusive we date for about a month and I then I find out she has a profile. On SA. I am fine with someone being on SA. Just don't lie to me and tell me you want to date exclusively and then put up a profile. Damn eastern european women. At least I got some good times out of her but I will miss her.[/QUOTE]I just assume women are lying about all things dating related. I recently heard a theory that the reason women lie and manipulate is that it's their natural evolutionary compensation for being physically less powerful than men (I. E. They can't kick our ass, so they have developed the innate skill of mind fucking us -- it hurts a lot worse anyway).

When it comes to strippers or SBs, I don't believe anything they tell me. In civy dating, I believe maybe about 10% of what they tell me.

I've found a very small percentage of women to be consistently straight-forward and honest. Surprisingly the 2 or 3 I've had the strongest feelings for, including my current girlfriend, pretty much won my heart because they don't lie. My current girlfriend actually shocks me sometimes at how straightforward she is with the truth. In her case it's not really as honorable as it is selfish, she just doesn't like carrying the mental stress of lies and finds it more convenient to blurt out the truth even when it hurts.

With Match and POF hunting for SBs, you can find some really good stuff there. Even without the concern of preying on nice girls looking for soulmates and not trying to flip civs into SBs, sometimes you just stumble on genuine SBs that are just not yet ready to graduate to the dedicated SB site level or admit to themselves that this is what they want. The biggest obstacle I found was that unless they open up the age range of men they are looking for, the sites themselves sometimes make it difficult to make contact with them (I. E. At least POF used to block your messages if you were older than what she was looking for, I guess some girls complained of old creepers contacting them). And, some of them are afraid of what their friends think so they will only open the age range up to maybe 10 years older than their age, so you may have to fudge your real age on your profile to ever get a shot at them. But it can pay off, not only the cheaper cost of membership (or zero cost in the case of POF) but their expectations aren't really to walk away with a couple of hundred dollars per date, it's more like buy them dinner and drinks then fuck them, then later whatever they are really after will slowly surface (like someone to move in with, someone to help them get a vehicle, escape a relationship they're miserable in, maybe a green card in some cases, etc) so you get these epic fucks, often with stunners, for maybe $60 or whatever dinner at a cheap Mexican place and a few drinks cost. There was a time when the FC was my place instead of a hotel, so there was no hassle or extra cost of getting a room.

There are some challenges though. First, they don't always post their sexiest photos on match, whereas on SD sites they tend to present themselves in the sexiest light (bikini and underwear shots, etc). This can take away from the experience. The photos they post are often girl-next-doorish, and are more like the "every day" photos you see on some of these girls facebook. They want to present themselves as wife material rather than "how much is my pussy worth to you" photos. The lower membership cost means a lot more dudes hitting on them (dudes that would never pony up membership fees for SD sites). And of course you have to wade through a much higher ratio of homely looking broads compared to surfing the SD sites.

The biggest issue is that it's harder for the guys who are married or in LTRs. That tends to get frowned upon more by the girls on match / POF etc. That's one reason I don't mess with these sites these days. If I left my GF tomorrow, I'd be on about 5 civvy dating sites the next day, because I used to get tons of free pussy off them.

[QUOTE=BikeRider;2880929]You can work early checkins pretty easily. If you're making the reservation the same day (most of us probably do in case of flakes), then before you make the reservation online call the hotel's direct number and ask for the front desk. Explain to the person you've just arrived after a long flight / drive, and you want to know if you can check in within the next hour if you make a reservation. Be prepared to explain what kind of room you want. Double / king etc. You can also do this the night before as they'll know availability. If they say no or equivocate, call another hotel.

I've checked in as early as 9 am this way. The only time you might run into a problem is if something is going on in the general vicinity and all the rooms are booked the previous night.[/QUOTE]I want to try this one of these days, but if I do this, it would be close to home which means I would need to be hitting the same hotel (s) up with the same sob story of a long drive, which would be hard to explain living close by. Plus they are going to be wonder why is this guy taking a new college girl to his room for only a few hours each time he stays here with that same old story. LOL.

What are some effective reasons to text a "back-up" SB that I won't be seeing her for awhile but not wanting to "burn the bridge. " After almost a year in the sugar bowl I am about to do what I never thought I would. Genuinely be exclusive with one SB. My M O up until now has been to always works towards having a # 1 and # 2 as weekly visits while always adding back-ups in case either # 1 or # 2 fall out of the rotation. My M O Has been driven by the knowledge practically none of my SBs have stayed off the SA site plus I am one who is motivated both by the variety and the challenge. Separately I have a # 2 and a # 3 I have been in the FC 2 to 3 times plus a former # 1 who wants to re-connect. My best reason I can come up with is "I have met an SB who lives closer to me (or has a home / house to visit at, saving the cost of hotel rooms) and I want to take some time to see how it works out. " Anyhow, ask me in three weeks if I have successfully gone cold turkey from my M O. to committing to just seeing one SB.

[QUOTE=StormyTuesday;2881095]What are some effective reasons to text a "back-up" SB that I won't be seeing her for awhile but not wanting to "burn the bridge. " After almost a year in the sugar bowl I am about to do what I never thought I would. Genuinely be exclusive with one SB. My M O up until now has been to always works towards having a # 1 and # 2 as weekly visits while always adding back-ups in case either # 1 or # 2 fall out of the rotation. My M O Has been driven by the knowledge practically none of my SBs have stayed off the SA site plus I am one who is motivated both by the variety and the challenge. Separately I have a # 2 and a # 3 I have been in the FC 2 to 3 times plus a former # 1 who wants to re-connect. My best reason I can come up with is "I have met an SB who lives closer to me (or has a home / house to visit at, saving the cost of hotel rooms) and I want to take some time to see how it works out. " Anyhow, ask me in three weeks if I have successfully gone cold turkey from my M O. to committing to just seeing one SB.[/QUOTE]In the bowl I wouldn't just be straight up about wanting to keep them on old as second string to the new exclusive unless you absolutely have to. Women (especially in situations like this) usually don't want to hear the truth. They will actually respect you for coming up with some clever explanation even if they don't believe it deep down. I can't tell you how many times I've heard "just don't tell me about the others". Meaning, she knows I'm fucking someone else but she doesn't want me to come out and say there's someone else.

They know we are straightforward creatures by nature, but they don't admire that or respect that we prefer simplicity. They respect complication. So the more you come up with complicated reasons (that don't need to be completely believable as they need to be hard to disprove or completely figure out), the more likely they are to be there when you need them to be. Some of them may just like you enough or be open minded to always be there. I've had some girls give me pretty much a free booty call pass just because I never did anything except make time with them enjoyable and ended things without drama. You might lose a few, or they might be always-open going forward.

In general the younger they are the less likely they are to understand or appreciate the truth. If your SBs are older (late 20's or higher) they might be understanding to your plan but I'd say not worth the risk. SB hunting can be a lot of work and if you have a stable rotation you are happy with it's best to keep it going if possible.

Jeez is spot on, don't come clean especially to a younger baby. Even my #1 of well over 2 years doesn't know about my other friends. And she won't. As for keeping or being exclusive, when I started this game, I was in search of the perfect baby. Well, countless tries, haven't found it yet, always seems to be something. So the search continues! Finally turned loose my 20 yo backup. A little hard body bbueatiful young lady, but not into the fc like I would like to see. Smart, mature, fun to talk with, great communication, but boring in the sack. Next. Now on to a 5'10" 115# hottie, OMG. But I'm pretty sure ill find something wrong with her. I keep going back to my #1, not sure why that is. Need to talk to my shrink about that sometime. Well, maybe not, I'd like to hit that sometime as well, won't even open up to her.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2881133]In the bowl I wouldn't just be straight up about wanting to keep them on old as second string to the new exclusive unless you absolutely have to. Women (especially in situations like this) usually don't want to hear the truth. They will actually respect you for coming up with some clever explanation even if they don't believe it deep down. I can't tell you how many times I've heard "just don't tell me about the others". Meaning, she knows I'm fucking someone else but she doesn't want me to come out and say there's someone else.

They know we are straightforward creatures by nature, but they don't admire that or respect that we prefer simplicity. They respect complication. So the more you come up with complicated reasons (that don't need to be completely believable as they need to be hard to disprove or completely figure out), the more likely they are to be there when you need them to be. Some of them may just like you enough or be open minded to always be there. I've had some girls give me pretty much a free booty call pass just because I never did anything except make time with them enjoyable and ended things without drama. You might lose a few, or they might be always-open going forward.

In general the younger they are the less likely they are to understand or appreciate the truth. If your SBs are older (late 20's or higher) they might be understanding to your plan but I'd say not worth the risk. SB hunting can be a lot of work and if you have a stable rotation you are happy with it's best to keep it going if possible.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FScott;2858544]My brothers,


In the interest of sharing my insights on the elusive threeway, here's what I now know: it is just as hard for a hot baby to meet other hot babies to sleep with as it is for us. One said that there's really no place they can go to safely pick up another girl besides lesbian bars, and they aren't into the whole Bull Dyke scene. So if an SD would like to provide a service, of sorts, to these poor unfortunate HYBs, then he will be rewarded. Another thing I learned was that all these babies who responded were comforted by the fact that I already had an SB. I was pre-approved, so to speak, so you all might want to make mention of that in some way in your profiles.

Here is something else I discovered: if it's sometimes hard to schedule any FC time with one little fish, it is five times as hard to schedule it with two. You would think these girls were CEOs of major international corporations or something! Herding pussies is what came to mind, but once you get them both safely behind closed doors, it is a mindblowing experience, straight out of a porn flick. Both of mine lasted 4 to 5 hours, and when Little Scottie needed to catch his breath, the girls just carried on without him. The one negative I discovered, however, is that if there are two girls in a room together who like each other, there is a lot, and I mean a LOT, of talking, even if they are licking each others pussies! In balance, it is a small price to pay, but it did make me laugh.

I am now trying to round up another girl to share with my baby, and will take another run at getting two random newbies together. One warning: the concept does apparently draw the pros out of the woodwork, but thankfully they all called me "hun" in their first contact, which as we all know is hooker-talk for "john. ".

Feel free to ask me any questions if there are things I did not touch on, but I urge you all to take a stab at this. As I said, the many, many positives far outweigh the added effort of setting it up.

Cheers,

Scott.[/QUOTE]I have tried to arrange a three way multiple times, but have yet to succeed. I agree with your point about scheduling, it is amazing how these young women fill their schedules and setting up a m&g is difficult. I did succeed at one M&G with my SB and a POT, the meeting went very well but the girl mentioned she was 1 K per meet.

My SB ended up getting crazy idea that this was the norm and went seeking for the 1 K. Oh well.

[QUOTE=Latex;2881674]I have tried to arrange a three way multiple times, but have yet to succeed. I agree with your point about scheduling, it is amazing how these young women fill their schedules and setting up a m&g is difficult. I did succeed at one M&G with my SB and a POT, the meeting went very well but the girl mentioned she was 1 K per meet.

My SB ended up getting crazy idea that this was the norm and went seeking for the 1 K. Oh well.[/QUOTE]Er, why would you do it that way? Interview a new girl all alone and see if she is to your liking and then make an commercial arrangements with the new girl. Once that is done and only then, would I involved the regular SB in anything.

That way when a new girl turns out to be infected with GPS you kick her free and move on. If the existing SB doesn't trust your judgement enough to find a safe, reasonable girl for the three-way- Kick her to the curb.

I'd guess with the way girls socialize with others and network, that a decent SB knows another SB that might be willing to be a third on occasion.

But making a SB part of the M&G and negotiations? I wouldn't do that!

If I had a regular SB and wanted to add a second girl, I would probably either take her bar hopping and ask her to pick one she likes out that way, or I would try to find the girl separately on some non-SB website on my own (pending the SBs approval of course).

I just don't like the dynamics of having one paid SB, and adding another paid SB. To me it puts them on the same team -- the team of extracting as much money for their act as possible. I'm not saying that a good honest SB + SB threesome isn't possible, but just like you had the issue of non-matching allowances pulling the lower amount toward the direction of the higher amount (I. E. How is the $$ SB going to feel after she meets a girl of equal beauty that is used to $$$ or $$ Well like she's worthy of same that's what).

But beyond that I would just feel like they are both conspiring to maximize their profit from the activity, even if they don't know each other that well.

The way I look at it, my SB should be hot enough that she can attract sex with other girls without the second girl being paid to be interested, and from there adding the inclusion of the SD to the mix isn't that far of a leap.

If anything, I'd probably be more inclined to offer up the extra money as a bonus to my primary SB. If she wants to share some of that bonus with the girl then great, but it keeps my SB and me on the same team and the visitor in the proper role.

Also there are girls on the SD sites that regularly advertise in pairs. If you don't mind them being in cahoots together and want a simplified agreement maybe that's the way to go.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2881908]If I had a regular SB and wanted to add a second girl, I would probably either take her bar hopping and ask her to pick one she likes out that way, or I would try to find the girl separately on some non-SB website on my own (pending the SBs approval of course).

I just don't like the dynamics of having one paid SB, and adding another paid SB. To me it puts them on the same team -- the team of extracting as much money for their act as possible. I'm not saying that a good honest SB + SB threesome isn't possible, but just like you have the issue of non-matching allowances pulling the lower amount toward the direction of the higher amount (I. E. How is the $$ SB going to feel after she meets a girl of equal beauty that is used to $$$ or $$ Well like she's worthy of same that's what).

But beyond that I would just feel like they are both conspiring to maximize their profit from the activity, even if they don't know each other that well.

The way I look at it, my SB should be hot enough that she can attract sex with other girls without the second girl being paid to be interested, and from there adding the inclusion of the SD to the mix isn't that far of leap.

If anything, I'd probably be more inclined to offer up the extra money as a bonus to my primary SB. If she wants to share some of that bonus with the girl then great, but it keeps my SB and me on the same team and the visitor in the proper role.[/QUOTE]Most of these girls are bi and jump at the chance. Most like to point this out in their profiles and alot state in the profile that they can bring a gf. It usually don't long into texting whether they are up to it or not. Its not hard to find or set up.

[QUOTE=BikeRider;2880929]..
I've checked in as early as 9 am this way. The only time you might run into a problem is if something is going on in the general vicinity and all the rooms are booked the previous night.[/QUOTE]Is there a risk of the hotel telling on the phone that a room is available but is not when you show up? May be someone showed up at the front desk before me!

Also what is your preferred site / app for booking a room?