"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[QUOTE=IluvSmellyFish;2673133]I have a SO, and so based on that logic, my Karma would be in the toilet the day I started playing in the bowl.

If I break plans or reschedule, I generally give plenty of notice for the date to find other plans. My definition of a flake is when someone pulls a last minute bailout without warning.

What annoyed me about the situation was that not only did she previously agree to a FC trip after a dinner date, but she confirmed during dinner, which caused me to book the hotel and then changed her mind after 10 minutes.[/QUOTE]Now that would piss me off.

[QUOTE=IluvSmellyFish;2674490]FM is on point. The answer is that it depends. I've gone to the FC for free with a hot young Asian after the m&g, bareback, access to all holes, and then a bbbjnqns to finish the job. I've m&ged with ladies who used pictures from 10 years and 20 lbs ago who expected an allowance as a part of the m&g.

These are of course extreme outliers, but region has a huge impact on expectations. NYC and DC pots often want double the amount you're proposing if they're young and hot. Based on HWGs former posts, the ladies on the west coast expected a quarter of what some of the hot nyc and dc pots are looking for.

Check out a local board on your region for expectations that are in line with where you are. Alternatively, if your area doesn't have a local board, let folks on this thread know where you play and I'm sure you'll get some advice.

Lastly, timing also plays a role in expectations. I've found that the start of a new semester and the holidays often drives up an imbalance in the SDs favor. Lots of young ladies need allowance for gifts, school, books, etc during these times, which means many more are looking for a SD. Simple economic rules of supply and demand apply to the sugar bowl as well.[/QUOTE]I try to stay in the 150 range and don't have a problem in RVA. The SBs that quote a lot more receive an education from me about supply and demand. As I have said before we need to avoid contributing to kitty inflation. The Fed hasn't raised interest rates so we shouldn't either. The funny thing is that many of them don't know what GPS means. It is always fun to hit 'send' when I tell them what it means.

Hey guys. Been posting a couple of times a year for a good number of years on other threads here but just started using SA this past summer and it has been great. I read this thread a lot and always wondered why you guys were so protective of your experiences with specific women. I'm in the Richmond area and I've met in the FC with 6 - 8 women (most of them more than once) over the last 5 months and laid out between $. 50 - $$$ per date. I mostly focus on young college girls. I'm a 1-2 dates a month guy, so paying a little more for young, beautiful SBs is not an issue for me. It's about quality not quantity. Sorry if I've inflated the rates for some of you guys, but what can I say except, get over it. My experience is that although many SBs say they don't want a "pay for play" arrangement, most seem okay With it after the M&G. Some might call these women "pros" or UTR, but I think that is misguided. I know the real identities of all the girls I've met and most are enrolled and attending a local college and need or want the extra money. They are not living in hotels trying to get their next fix. They don't have kids they are trying to support. They are real co-eds going to classes during the day and out with friends at night. Many are artistic / liberal in nature (which means some tats and piercings) but they are beautiful 18 - 23 year old women. I'v have seen many women from BP and UTR Craigslist women and I can tell you, there is a huge difference. I have grown tired of the BS, attitude, setting, looks and situations of many of the women who are usual suspects on BP. SA has provided access to amazing, smart, beautiful young women who I have really enjoyed spending time with.

Over the next several days I will provide some reviews of the girls I have seen in the FC and others I have interacted with. Since I see most of them on a short term basis (I like variety) and I don't seek "exclusive" relationships, I don't mind passing on some info regarding my experiences with them. If I review a girl that you have also met or are interested in, and you want additional info, hit me up. I will respond if I can. I'm not a "senior" member, so if I don't respond to you it will not be because you are not a "senior". It will be all about the quality of your previous posts, how I'm feeling that particular day and how much time I have. I've seen a lot of women over the last 7-8 years in the RVA area and just because I don't post here enough to gain "status" doesn't mean that I don't have quality info to share. But I'm not going to give info to just anybody.

I'm not about outing these women on this board or doing anything that would be a negative for them. I will review them based on their usernames. But frankly, the biggest negative about SA is that it takes a ton of time. There are a lot of pros, "no intimacy" girls and "I just thought I would try this out" girls that you must wade through in order to find the girls who are serious. A little heads up would benefit all of us. And save us wasted time and money going to M&Gs that aren't going anywhere in the end.

Stark.

Is it possible to stay anonymous to the host?

[QUOTE=PghGuy2005;2673601]I got suckered into advancing the sugar for 2 future meetings to a nando type SB during the first meet and trip to FC. The next day she wanted more to pay her rent at which point I blocked her #.

Should I contact her and ask for the 2 meets? Or is it a lost cause.[/QUOTE]I wouldn't ask for 2 meets up front. I suppose just confirming the next meet would be enough. I've advanced before, but it really depends on chemistry and if I get the sense that the SB likes me. If you did get stiffed just charge it to the game.

I stay away from pay per date type of arrangements and stick to girls looking more for GFE / rich boyfriend type of relationship. I find your money stretched longer in those type of situations.

Stark,

There are so many girls for every guy in most areas that whatever you pay won't have any effect on prices. You do run the risk that the girls will work out that you can be milked, but if it doesn't worry you, no problem.

It is the stories about big spenders who are bait that bring girls to the sugar websites, but once there, most girls will accept a switch to lower "benefits".

Had a visit scheduled with my SB today. I confirmed the time and day on Saturday and than again at noon today. Set up meeting for 5:00 pm. Took my cialis at 4 pm and at 430 sB texts she doesn't think she can make it at 5 but maybe 7. I'm like ok. I can deal with that. Cancels at 7 pm. Apologizes and sends me nude pics but I'm out the hotel and the cost of the cialis. Very frustrating. She is a 23 year old college grad who lets me do whatever I want to her, but pretty flighty. May have to start looking for a new one.

Guys, are there rules you set for the SB when you are drafting the arrangement before the FC? If yes, what are they? How you bring your message through to them?

[QUOTE=LaoMai;2679235]Guys, are there rules you set for the SB when you are drafting the arrangement before the FC? If yes, what are they? How you bring your message through to them?[/QUOTE]Thats what the M&G is for, to discuss what each expects.

Just one big one. Sugar for sugar. The sugar flows when the panties hit the floor.

Interesting discussion on advances. Agree with Hoya. It depends on chemistry and the SB. I had a visit scheduled with SB 25 and had to cancel. Turned out she was going on vacation and needed the $$. She had told me about vacation previously. I offered the advance and met her at a quick stop for the exchange. Heard from her as soon as she returned and received a stellar performance. But have been burned as well so it goes both ways.

[QUOTE=LaoMai;2679235]Guys, are there rules you set for the SB when you are drafting the arrangement before the FC? If yes, what are they? How you bring your message through to them?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=PghGuy2005;2678578]Is it possible to stay anonymous to the host?[/QUOTE]Often you are dealing wiht the owners, not detached hotel employees.

Also, they can review you as a guest, and if you leave signs of activities, they will redflag you and others won't rent to you.

[QUOTE=BeardedMan67;2679150]Had a visit scheduled with my SB today. I confirmed the time and day on Saturday and than again at noon today. Set up meeting for 5:00 pm. Took my cialis at 4 pm and at 430 sB texts she doesn't think she can make it at 5 but maybe 7. I'm like ok. I can deal with that. Cancels at 7 pm. Apologizes and sends me nude pics but I'm out the hotel and the cost of the cialis. Very frustrating. She is a 23 year old college grad who lets me do whatever I want to her, but pretty flighty. May have to start looking for a new one.[/QUOTE]Use the [URL]hotels.com[/URL] app and book when she is in front of you.

Always good to have a back up gal you see occassionally to promote to a regular.

[QUOTE=RubberyMan;2678947]Stark,

There are so many girls for every guy in most areas that whatever you pay won't have any effect on prices. You do run the risk that the girls will work out that you can be milked, but if it doesn't worry you, no problem.

It is the stories about big spenders who are bait that bring girls to the sugar websites, but once there, most girls will accept a switch to lower "benefits".[/QUOTE]Rub. I agree but if you read the threads on this board you see guys constantly begging everyone to negotiate down to a certain range so that all the SBs stay in their price range. Sorry, but I'm not working with your interest in mind. In RVA, the halfway decent BP girls get $ - $. 50 for half an hour. The top end agency girls and independents get $$. 50 - $$ 50 for an hour and won't do a half. So for a couple of hours with a girl who is 20 or younger, hot, smart, clean, GFE and fun to be with (not just bone) it seems to me that $$ - $$$ is a pretty good deal. I wouldn't pay more than that, and I have negotiated with a couple of them, but hard-core negotiating up front just seems like a negative to me. If you want to drive a Mercedes you pay for a Mercedes. Some guys have mentioned starting at a lower price and then moving up but I find that it is much easier to move the sugar down after the first FC encounter. At that point, many of the risks and unknowns have been removed. An SB who knows that you are not a creep, not a freak and just a regular guy that they don't mind spending time with is much more willing to be flexible with their sugar requirements.

So as promised, I'm going to share some info from my SA experiences in the RVA area. First up is "MrsLilRed". She is mid 20's, a natural red-head, cuter than her pictures and divorced. Works part time and goes to school part time. We met back in early summer. She responded quickly and was willing to set up M&G right away. She is still active on SA as of a couple of weeks ago. I'm pretty sure she has a kid, but does not have custody. Met her only once, M&G for lunch and then straight to the FC a little later. As far as performance, she is GFE, DFK, BBBJ, DATY and CFS. She had great breasts and really seemed to enjoy the session. She is larger around the mid-section but not much true baby damage. All in all you can tell she was smoking hot before the kid. Was willing to work on a date by date basis. She was fun, good to talk to, relaxed and not at all a flake. We spent about two hours together. We've talked multiple times since then but have not met again. Mostly by my choice. I've had good luck on SA and enjoy the hunt and there were bigger fish to fry. I would recommend her to anyone based on my experiences. I know her real identity and have social media info and additional background info. Not promising that I will share though. My advice. If you like what you see, go for it. Sugar was $. 60 for the date plus lunch.

Stark.

[QUOTE=Starkey2008;2679550]Rub. I agree but if you read the threads on this board you see guys constantly begging everyone to negotiate down to a certain range so that all the SBs stay in their price range. Sorry, but I'm not working with your interest in mind. In RVA, the halfway decent BP girls get $ - $. 50 for half an hour. The top end agency girls and independents get $$. 50 - $$ 50 for an hour and won't do a half. So for a couple of hours with a girl who is 20 or younger, hot, smart, clean, GFE and fun to be with (not just bone) it seems to me that $$ - $$$ is a pretty good deal. I wouldn't pay more than that, and I have negotiated with a couple of them, but hard-core negotiating up front just seems like a negative to me. If you want to drive a Mercedes you pay for a Mercedes. Some guys have mentioned starting at a lower price and then moving up but I find that it is much easier to move the sugar down after the first FC encounter. At that point, many of the risks and unknowns have been removed. An SB who knows that you are not a creep, not a freak and just a regular guy that they don't mind spending time with is much more willing to be flexible with their sugar requirements.[/QUOTE]First of all, what you do with your own money is your business. You can feed it to a furnace for fun if that's what floats your boat.

While it is true that if you want to drive a better car then you generally have to pay more, that is often not the case in p4 p, and definitely not the case in the sugar bowl as anyone who has been doing it for any time will agree. In fact, some of the best performances can come at lower prices, while poor performance can come from higher prices. That is, while you do get a better car for more $, it is often the case that you get worse performance for more $ in p4 p and the bowl. This is because that coed who needs to make rent tomorrow, or else, is a lot more motivated than someone who just needs an extra pair of designer shoes. Unless you think that someone wanting another luxury item is somehow going to be more motivated than someone needing rent in order to keep a roof over the head.

Of course, by all means, if you absolutely have to have a particular woman, and no other will do, then pretty obviously you pay what she asks, and that's a bargain for you. Great. But most likely, the next guy she negotiates with will laugh in disbelief and she will too, and give just as good a performance for him at a fraction of the cost.

Finally, I do agree that guys here seem more worried than they should about some guys "overpaying". Personally, I think it is the stories of guys overpaying that brings most girls to the site, and the stories of some chumps being circulated amongst them is a good thing. The sugar bowl is like a lottery for them. In a lottery, most get nothing, quite a few get small returns, a couple do well and one in a million hit the jackpot. In the bowl, most don't even get an inquiry, most have to be happy with $- inly a very few hit the jackpot. But, here's the important point, just like in a lottery, it is the hope of winning the big one that keeps them trying, and the noise from the occasional win keeps them hanging in there.

So, I rather say thanks to those guys who pay more than they need to. It is their sacrifice that keeps women flocking here.