Escort Reports

[QUOTE=AsianFlyer32;3981763]Scheduled a late night meet and greet with Jenna earlier this week. When the time came, didn't hear anything from her. She said she fell asleep, it was 2:30 in the morning when I scheduled to see her. So I tried again the following morning. Told her to set an alarm and that I'd call her instead of text. Same outcome. She hasn't said anything about it so I'm done with that one.

I scheduled to see Kat, who Marsh reviewed already, but the stupid hurricane came.

I was browsing this morning and came across this one:

[URL]http://savannah.skipthegames.com/female-escorts/black_caribbean/melt-in-my-not-my/472528955773[/URL]

We were about to meet when she became a ghost. Still haven't heard from her.

Then there's this one:

[URL]http://savannah.skipthegames.com/female-escorts/black_caribbean/you-will-never-forget-me/666694482806[/URL]

Same shit as mentioned above.

So now I have my eye on brandy. Never seen her but she is friends with Stacy and they stay in the same place in Pooler. Any info if she's worth it?[/QUOTE]Brandy has 2 reviews on them. One seems like it might be legit. Other seems flaky. Kat is here right now and if you like black girls, she has a great body.

A2-how long am I on probation? Hard to provide timely feedback and I think you should give free passes to seniors who call out newbies when they ask for info and it's two posts down. But whatever, not my loss.

Anyone been with Melinda lately? Worth it? Damage? Thanks.

[URL]http://savannah.skipthegames.com/female-escorts/black_caribbean/vixen-melinda/580530432724[/URL]

Long time reader. Never joined but figured I would since you others have helped me so much.

Had a dream with Jenna a couple weeks ago and she surely made an impact. I've been doing the hobbying for a few years and I'd consider this dream the best ever. Body wasn't a 10 but her attitude made up for it. Opted for the hr which started with a nice relaxing massage while playing with the kitty in hopes of working her up. Bbj then covered mish, rev mish & k9 with that fluffy ass in the air. She was open to everything and had a great attitude. We chatted after for a bit and I was on my way. Safe location and easy setup. Her recent posts states that she is leaving town this weekend. That's too bad, kinda hoping she'd stick around.

[QUOTE=BubbaZanetti;3983052]Anyone been with Melinda lately? Worth it? Damage? Thanks.

[URL]http://savannah.skipthegames.com/female-escorts/black_caribbean/vixen-melinda/580530432724[/URL][/QUOTE]She's pricier but worth it. I would say she's up there with Sade grindem when it comes to service.

[QUOTE=BubbaZanetti;3983052]Anyone been with Melinda lately? Worth it? Damage? Thanks.

[URL]http://savannah.skipthegames.com/female-escorts/black_caribbean/vixen-melinda/580530432724[/URL][/QUOTE]I would have to agree with the previous opinions on her that have been posted here. On the high end for the area but very good service. You should check her site for rate as it differs depending on what your looking for.

[URL]https://www.phatkatz.net/services[/URL]

[QUOTE=Homerun9;3983447]Long time reader. Never joined but figured I would since you others have helped me so much.

Had a dream with Jenna a couple weeks ago and she surely made an impact. I've been doing the hobbying for a few years and I'd consider this dream the best ever. Body wasn't a 10 but her attitude made up for it. Opted for the hr which started with a nice relaxing massage while playing with the kitty in hopes of working her up. Bbj then covered mish, rev mish & k9 with that fluffy ass in the air. She was open to everything and had a great attitude. We chatted after for a bit and I was on my way. Safe location and easy setup. Her recent posts states that she is leaving town this weekend. That's too bad, kinda hoping she'd stick around.[/QUOTE]When she leaves this week, hopefully she will be back soon due to the fact most of the original members and now us newbies are spending time with her and we are pretty safe with no drama. It might be a little tougher on her when she goes to Florida with more competition a lot of hustlers and everyone being new customers etc etc IMO. In the mean time at least Kandance is back from big house vacation, always nice and loves to please.

[QUOTE=Homerun9;3983447]Long time reader. Never joined but figured I would since you others have helped me so much.

Had a dream with Jenna a couple weeks ago and she surely made an impact. I've been doing the hobbying for a few years and I'd consider this dream the best ever. Body wasn't a 10 but her attitude made up for it. Opted for the hr which started with a nice relaxing massage while playing with the kitty in hopes of working her up. Bbj then covered mish, rev mish & k9 with that fluffy ass in the air. She was open to everything and had a great attitude. We chatted after for a bit and I was on my way. Safe location and easy setup. Her recent posts states that she is leaving town this weekend. That's too bad, kinda hoping she'd stick around.[/QUOTE]Nice whne someone points out a majority view.

[QUOTE=Rdtl43;3984179]When she leaves this week, hopefully she will be back soon due to the fact most of the original members and now us newbies are spending time with her and we are pretty safe with no drama. It might be a little tougher on her when she goes to Florida with more competition a lot of hustlers and everyone being new customers etc etc IMO. In the mean time at least Kandance is back from big house vacation, always nice and loves to please.[/QUOTE]In the past I've always been tempted to see her but never pulled the trigger. Anyone have anything they would like to share about her? Thanks e.

Had a dream with little Bit / Funsize. Communication was slow but got better later in the night. She was staying at the same palace Jenna was. Nice girl, cute, great body, good eye contact and seemed to enjoy it. Definitely a repeat.

[URL]https://www.adultlook.com/p/2966386[/URL]

The girl (camo clothes) in the second link travels with her. She wasn't very friendly when I met her.

[URL]https://www.adultlook.com/p/2942205[/URL]

[QUOTE=AsianFlyer32;3981763]

I was browsing this morning and came across this one:

[URL]http://savannah.skipthegames.com/female-escorts/black_caribbean/melt-in-my-not-my/472528955773[/URL]

We were about to meet when she became a ghost. Still haven't heard from her.

Then there's this one:

[URL]http://savannah.skipthegames.com/female-escorts/black_caribbean/you-will-never-forget-me/666694482806[/URL]

Same shit as mentioned above.

So now I have my eye on brandy. Never seen her but she is friends with Stacy and they stay in the same place in Pooler. Any info if she's worth it?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=GuyNBlue;3984414]Nice whne someone points out a majority view.[/QUOTE]No one should feel pressured to only post a positive review out of fear of insulting a happy customer.

I know that there have been bad reviews about Grace in the pass, but has anyone seen her lately and has she changed. She sure does offer a lot of interesting services.

[URL]https://cityxguide.com/escorts/grace-new-pic-s-new-location-outcall-912-342-2162-incall-912-346-2726-13162411[/URL]

Has anyone ever seen her? She posts a lot on cityx but recently started on stg.

Also, yes there was a raid at sun. If you look at bookings for that date 5 were busted. Charge was masterbation for hire.

Sorry I have been away for a bit, I can attest that the good reviews on Jenna are accurate though.

[QUOTE=Habitual;3985994]No one should feel pressured to only post a positive review out of fear of insulting a happy customer.[/QUOTE]Admin deleted my post and you would may have had better context! I have posted plenty of negative "reviews" (actual dissemination of information). My point with this post is when members come out the wood work and 9 of 10 give glaring reviews and the 10th does not just say I did not care for her that much! But instead basically says that the other 9 have no idea what they are talking about and are idiots! That is when you get the comments of "nice to see a good review".

[blue]I delete your posts on that subject because everybody can see it. There is no need for some of you guys to load up and quote the outlier 17 times in the rush to "call them out." What you describe is EXACTLY how the forum is supposed to operate. 10 guys post, 9 say one thing, 1 says something else. If I'm thinking of fucking her, I'm thinking I'm going with the nine.

What you want is 9 guys say one thing, 1 guy says something else, then 17 guys quote that one post and call him a liar.

A2[/blue]

[QUOTE=Clayy;3986928]Has anyone ever seen her? She posts a lot on cityx but recently started on stg.

Also, yes there was a raid at sun. If you look at bookings for that date 5 were busted. Charge was masterbation for hire.

Sorry I have been away for a bit, I can attest that the good reviews on Jenna are accurate though.[/QUOTE]I think there are a few of those Latinos that come threw town. Most of the time they advertise as Colombian. I saw one once. It is OK all business but nice looking.

I see some fresh faces today on stg. And some I haven't seen in awhile. Am I missing something? Is there anything happening in Savannah I don't know about?

Looks like LEO was busy in Pooler yesterday.

One of them looks familiar.

[URL]https://www.savannahnow.com/photogallery/GA/20181017/NEWS/101709998/PH/1?start=2[/URL]

[QUOTE=GuyNBlue;3988014]Admin deleted my post and you would may have had better context! I have posted plenty of negative "reviews" (actual dissemination of information). My point with this post is when members come out the wood work and 9 of 10 give glaring reviews and the 10th does not just say I did not care for her that much! But instead basically says that the other 9 have no idea what they are talking about and are idiots! That is when you get the comments of "nice to see a good review".

[blue]I delete your posts on that subject because everybody can see it. There is no need for some of you guys to load up and quote the outlier 17 times in the rush to "call them out." What you describe is EXACTLY how the forum is supposed to operate. 10 guys post, 9 say one thing, 1 says something else. If I'm thinking of fucking her, I'm thinking I'm going with the nine.

What you want is 9 guys say one thing, 1 guy says something else, then 17 guys quote that one post and call him a liar.

A2[/blue][/QUOTE]This is a good discussion. I don't see why guys here want to protect "their girls. " I hope admin lets this post fly. I rely on these reviews and I've been misled a few times.

Habitual said he hadn't seen Jenna. He didn't knock her. He said Kyla and Heidi aren't that great. I agree! Just because our options are lacking does not mean we have to put the few we have on a pedestal.

Guynblue. You love Kaley, you've posted about her too many times to count, and I think that's what made you upset here. Who does it help when she posts and ad looking like this and we all now she's pregnant as hell? That's the same pic she was using when I saw her and we both know she hasn't looked like that in years. To me, that's the definition of bait and switch. As a Sr member, I know this is going on, but a new dude walking in expecting this in the pic is going to be seriously disappointed.

[QUOTE=Tybeeman;3986823]I know that there have been bad reviews about Grace in the pass, but has anyone seen her lately and has she changed. She sure does offer a lot of interesting services.

[URL]https://cityxguide.com/escorts/grace-new-pic-s-new-location-outcall-912-342-2162-incall-912-346-2726-13162411[/URL][/QUOTE]It's been a few years since I saw her, but I would pass dude. She's 43 like I'm 15. I also can't imagine she's gotten any better living in extended stays and giving handjobs. On top of that, her attitude was the worst.

Is she still pregnant?

For the record, Kaley is not pregnant. She had the baby 4-5 months ago. She's not fat. She has gained weight but it's pretty much all in the hips and ass. Her stomach is a little bigger but no loose or saggy skin. She's suppose to be in Savannah for the weekend if anyone is interested.

Sup guys, sorry it's been a minute but damn did I miss some drama LOL! Anyways, seems like our Colombian / Venezuelan might have gotten picked up the other night by Pooler. Her ads are nonexistent today and her numbers disconnected. Anyways, I'll be out to play this weekend and will give you guys some insight on the new' faces around town. Have fun fellas.

[QUOTE=MikeJones21;3989944]For the record, Kaley is not pregnant. She had the baby 4-5 months ago. She's not fat. She has gained weight but it's pretty much all in the hips and ass. Her stomach is a little bigger but no loose or saggy skin. She's suppose to be in Savannah for the weekend if anyone is interested.[/QUOTE]She was very pregnant when I saw her and the pics / ad did not reflect that at that time. Ask her to post some recent ones. She doesn't GFE, DFK, CIM, do anal or any of that stuff she lists in her STG ad either. I don't care for the deception, but she was a nice girl and not bad when I saw her.

So many hours feel like have been wasted. So many times trying to set something up tonight. I either got a couple answers and then crickets. Or I just got no answer period. Although, I do have something set up for the early morning. Well, hopefully let's see what happens.

[QUOTE=Marshst924;3990386]She was very pregnant when I saw her and the pics / ad did not reflect that at that time. Ask her to post some recent ones. She doesn't GFE, DFK, CIM, do anal or any of that stuff she lists in her STG ad either. I don't care for the deception, but she was a nice girl and not bad when I saw her.[/QUOTE]I seen her Wednesday and she said the baby was like 4 months old. But I did mention that she should post more pictures and recent ones but she said no, you can tell what she looks like from the one she posts. She's a cool choice if you're looking for just regular service without drama or being rushed. I seen her off of recommendations from people in here. Personally, I prefer Kat whenever she comes around, off your recommendation. She offers me more than most plus her body is amazing. But Marsh, if those are the things you're looking for, you have to look for the bbw or the addicts LOL.

[QUOTE=MikeJones21;3990766]I seen her Wednesday and she said the baby was like 4 months old. But I did mention that she should post more pictures and recent ones but she said no, you can tell what she looks like from the one she posts. She's a cool choice if you're looking for just regular service without drama or being rushed. I seen her off of recommendations from people in here. Personally, I prefer Kat whenever she comes around, off your recommendation. She offers me more than most plus her body is amazing. But Marsh, if those are the things you're looking for, you have to look for the bbw or the addicts LOL.[/QUOTE]How long is this crap going to go on for? I think it's safe to say that no one likes to be misled or ripped off. I'm with Marsh, I think I'd be a little shocked if I went and saw someone and there's a bunch in the oven. (Also, a part of me if thinking, she can't get pregnant again) anyways, each one of us has their own preferences and their atf. That's fantastic. And most of us should know by now that YMMV. So don't get butthurt when someone doesn't give your girl a favorable review. So let's move on from this junk already.

And for the record, I tried seeing Kaley. I inquired about Greek lessons and cim (like her states) and she got rude about it. Like I took her mom to a seafood dinner and never called her back. When I texted her from another phone later that day and asked about the same things, gave me quotes no problem and where she was staying. Needless to say, I didn't schedule a visit. I really didn't feel like finding out if I'm going to get Jekyll or Hyde.

I'll be passing through headed south. Any intel on this one would be appreciated. Thanks guys.

[QUOTE=DusitMader;3952888]Yeah, pretty easy setup, accurate pics, BBBJ cfs. She is bbw, nice girl. Will repeat.[/QUOTE]Awww Thanks.

[QUOTE=Marshst924;3989042]This is a good discussion. I don't see why guys here want to protect "their girls. " I hope admin lets this post fly. I rely on these reviews and I've been misled a few times.

Habitual said he hadn't seen Jenna. He didn't knock her. He said Kyla and Heidi aren't that great. I agree! Just because our options are lacking does not mean we have to put the few we have on a pedestal.

Guynblue. You love Kaley, you've posted about her too many times to count, and I think that's what made you upset here. Who does it help when she posts and ad looking like this and we all now she's pregnant as hell? That's the same pic she was using when I saw her and we both know she hasn't looked like that in years. To me, that's the definition of bait and switch. As a Sr member, I know this is going on, but a new dude walking in expecting this in the pic is going to be seriously disappointed.[/QUOTE]I just have to disagree a little with you and A2, I guess it may be from some PMs not just post, but like or dislike no one can say on here I have not gone above and beyond not just posting trying to help "everyone" out. And instead of seeing "I did not have a good time" or "not what you said" it is to the poing of almost giving me crap! Anyway as far as why almost all of us "push" certain girls. How long has everyone been posting about it is hard to get talent here! So when one comes through and is decent or better it is good for all. However, with like Kaley, she stopped coming bc she was not getting anyone else to come through so not worth the drive. Well that hurts me but it also hurts anyone else who would see her. And I think another distinction that has been pointed out by others is that YMMV. NOt sure why but I useually get a lot of miles with many of those we have seen. But they useually ask not to post any of those extras bc they are for established repeats. If I (or any one) sold them out then they would stop with me / us!

And to put a bow on it Kaley and I are not visiting any longer. No problems just have decided it was a good run and leave it there!

My experience!

Kaley is good standard fun (3 weeks ago).

Kayla is a good GFE (2 yrs ago).

Jenna is a great time every time YMMV (last week).

Jessica was a great YMMV GFE who flaked out even to me (months ago).

Kinsey was a decent standard time when she did not flake (but did most the time) (6 weeks ago).

Brianna is decent stard fun YMMV (buit not much and upsale) (month ago).

[QUOTE=DifferentDays;3992173]I'll be passing through headed south. Any intel on this one would be appreciated. Thanks guys.[/QUOTE]Add about 15 years and 25 pounds to the pics. But she has a decent attitude. I visited once, no repeat.

I'm going to add my experience with Kaley since she's getting a lot of high praise here and I feel I'm doing customers sitting on the fence a disservice by not chiming in.

I initially called Kaley back when she first posted ads in Savannah when she was using a picture of her wearing a tanktop and sunglasses in a car. Looked decent enough so I made the call. She seemed friendly on the phone and set something up at her place at a well known midtown location. So knowing this location is a bit sketchy I arrived about 20 minutes early to survey the surrounding. Anyone who has been to this location knows there is a large parking lot with a restaurant adjacent to it. I saw some activity out in that parking lot with a group of AA men right up against the fence that borders the property. I pulled into the front of the adjacent restaurant lot and just watched. After I had been there for about 10 minutes I saw a door open on the 2nd floor facing the restaurant parking lot. It was her letting out a customer, and as soon as that guy had barely reached his car, someone else was going up. Mind you I had an appointment scheduled in 10 minutes.

So I texted her and told her I was there and got the standard "give me a few minutes to get ready" routine. I didn't hear anything back so at my scheduled time I texted her again and she didn't respond. After a half hour the door opened up again and the 2nd customer came out. So now it's around 20 minutes past my scheduled time and she texts me that she's ready. I told her I had left and she apologized and said we could try another day. At this point I was still in the parking lot and saw a third customer going in.

This was back when she first started going to Savannah and I have no idea if she's still triple booking people or if that group of men outside had anything to do with her but it was odd that they were in the parking lot next door looking right into her room. I'll also add that while Marshst924 is correct that she does not offer GFE or any of the other services listed in her ad she does upcharge for a service that one might want to think twice about taking her up on if she's triple booking people. This is probably the reason she's getting strong reviews. Unfortunately that's not enough to make you an all star.

[QUOTE=GuyNBlue;3994567]I just have to disagree a little with you and A2, I guess it may be from some PMs not just post, but like or dislike no one can say on here I have not gone above and beyond not just posting trying to help "everyone" out. And instead of seeing "I did not have a good time" or "not what you said" it is to the poing of almost giving me crap! Anyway as far as why almost all of us "push" certain girls. How long has everyone been posting about it is hard to get talent here! So when one comes through and is decent or better it is good for all. However, with like Kaley, she stopped coming bc she was not getting anyone else to come through so not worth the drive. Well that hurts me but it also hurts anyone else who would see her. And I think another distinction that has been pointed out by others is that YMMV. NOt sure why but I useually get a lot of miles with many of those we have seen. But they useually ask not to post any of those extras bc they are for established repeats. If I (or any one) sold them out then they would stop with me / us!

And to put a bow on it Kaley and I are not visiting any longer. No problems just have decided it was a good run and leave it there!

My experience!

Kaley is good standard fun (3 weeks ago).

Kayla is a good GFE (2 yrs ago).

Jenna is a great time every time YMMV (last week).

Jessica was a great YMMV GFE who flaked out even to me (months ago).

Kinsey was a decent standard time when she did not flake (but did most the time) (6 weeks ago).

Brianna is decent stard fun YMMV (buit not much and upsale) (month ago).[/QUOTE]I don't disagree with any of that. You are a good contributor. And I'm never bent out of shape here.

Marsh, who is at the top of your list currently?

[QUOTE=Habitual;3994740]I'm going to add my experience with Kaley since she's getting a lot of high praise here and I feel I'm doing customers sitting on the fence a disservice by not chiming in.

I initially called Kaley back when she first posted ads in Savannah when she was using a picture of her wearing a tanktop and sunglasses in a car. Looked decent enough so I made the call. She seemed friendly on the phone and set something up at her place at a well known midtown location. So knowing this location is a bit sketchy I arrived about 20 minutes early to survey the surrounding. Anyone who has been to this location knows there is a large parking lot with a restaurant adjacent to it. I saw some activity out in that parking lot with a group of AA men right up against the fence that borders the property. I pulled into the front of the adjacent restaurant lot and just watched. After I had been there for about 10 minutes I saw a door open on the 2nd floor facing the restaurant parking lot. It was her letting out a customer, and as soon as that guy had barely reached his car, someone else was going up. Mind you I had an appointment scheduled in 10 minutes.

So I texted her and told her I was there and got the standard "give me a few minutes to get ready" routine. I didn't hear anything back so at my scheduled time I texted her again and she didn't respond. After a half hour the door opened up again and the 2nd customer came out. So now it's around 20 minutes past my scheduled time and she texts me that she's ready. I told her I had left and she apologized and said we could try another day. At this point I was still in the parking lot and saw a third customer going in.

This was back when she first started going to Savannah and I have no idea if she's still triple booking people or if that group of men outside had anything to do with her but it was odd that they were in the parking lot next door looking right into her room. I'll also add that while Marshst924 is correct that she does not offer GFE or any of the other services listed in her ad she does upcharge for a service that one might want to think twice about taking her up on if she's triple booking people. This is probably the reason she's getting strong reviews. Unfortunately that's not enough to make you an all star.[/QUOTE]Remember I am not seeing her anymore so I have no play! If you find some of my original post you see that I mentioned she does not travel with any company but alos she is HIGH VOLUME any time she can be. SHe is one that is more like a "grazier" if it is there she is going to eat. Not knowing when the next "meal" might be. She has always been nice but also paranoid which I guess is a good thing. AS far as I know about upsale and extras? She never really upsold me and to my knowledge back then was not open to much extra. But I always think everyone does have a range. Maybe some did or did not. Again, I think she would setup 20 if she could but not so much that she was over booking on purpose, it was just she did not turn down munch as she told me often," never knew when we would stop coming through". I think her not being GFE had as much to do with quick turn around as just not doing that. But she never seemed to rush, just was ready always for next one up.

That was my sense.

[QUOTE=GuyNBlue;3996588]Remember I am not seeing her anymore so I have no play! If you find some of my original post you see that I mentioned she does not travel with any company but alos she is HIGH VOLUME any time she can be. SHe is one that is more like a "grazier" if it is there she is going to eat. Not knowing when the next "meal" might be. She has always been nice but also paranoid which I guess is a good thing. AS far as I know about upsale and extras? She never really upsold me and to my knowledge back then was not open to much extra. But I always think everyone does have a range. Maybe some did or did not. Again, I think she would setup 20 if she could but not so much that she was over booking on purpose, it was just she did not turn down munch as she told me often," never knew when we would stop coming through". I think her not being GFE had as much to do with quick turn around as just not doing that. But she never seemed to rush, just was ready always for next one up.

That was my sense.[/QUOTE]I was just making the observation about the upgrades and extras since you felt you were getting more millage than others. I'm just letting you know that not only are you not the only one she's giving that extra millage to, she offers it to people on the first visit and brings it up unsolicited. Just didn't want you being delusional about your relationship with her and giving her strong ratings based on the old "you're the only one I do this with" song and dance.

Looks like a new Asian has been rotated into the area. I saw the posting in Cityxguide. May not be a bad selection with the current crop of regulars in town.

[QUOTE=MikeJones21;3995883]Marsh, who is at the top of your list currently?[/QUOTE]Slim pickings and I don't know if there is much of a list here now. I would start with Sadie's white girl but she only does outcalls. Next I would try the Asians. Hit or miss. Next I would go with Sadie or Kat. I would go with all the above before the ones we usually talk about here except Jenna. Just my two cents.

If you don't mind spending a little money, watch Eros. Good ones visit on occasion.

Anyone sampled this young lady? She just recently started posting.

[URL]http://savannah.skipthegames.com/female-escorts/caucasian_w/cute-and-curvyready-to-play/241132425139[/URL]

Saw this one nice cute little thing. Cheap but all business everything covered and not touching. It is thin out here boys.

[URL]http://savannah.skipthegames.com/female-escorts/caucasian_w/here-for-a-few-days/495350217595[/URL]

[QUOTE=Jdwil;3999182]Anyone sampled this young lady? She just recently started posting.

[URL]http://savannah.skipthegames.com/female-escorts/caucasian_w/cute-and-curvyready-to-play/241132425139[/URL].[/QUOTE]She's not new. She goes by Julia, recently changed from Julie. She was a regular Craigslist poster when BP was still going strong. She probably just discovered stg, hence why her posts are just popping up.

The first time I met her was near derenne at some run down house. Went for a BBBJCIM and sprayed her face. It got the job done but I wouldn't repeat. Those pics look good though, doesn't it?

[QUOTE=Jdwil;3999182]Anyone sampled this young lady? She just recently started posting.

[URL]http://savannah.skipthegames.com/female-escorts/caucasian_w/cute-and-curvyready-to-play/241132425139[/URL][/QUOTE]That would be Julie from the CL days. Be careful with that one. Never know what side of her your going to get if you know what I mean.