"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

Boys,

Thanks for the comments Scott. Your input is always appreciated. My adventures into the mysterious world of the bowl are very new but I can say they are exciting, invigorating, and even somewhat fulfilling. I am writing this on a late night flight from Austin back to the medium security facility, that is also known as my home. When I arrive for the weekend I will hand over the keys to the warden and she being the owner of the testicle lock box. (credit Rush Limbaugh on that one)

To comment on Scott's issue about babies going for the nasty without a demand for a glove. The first stripper I ever fucked many years ago. About 14 years ago, told me in no uncertain terms no glove no love. And she was quite strict about unauthorized access to that fabulous body. Long dark hair down to her perfect 22 yo ass, and a set of breasts that were perfect plump and pink. She was French decent from Rhode Island. Anyway she was one of the few that demanded. On the other hand I have had several that did not care either way or the other. In fact the little Cajun fried shrimp I just finished defiling this week did not demand it. I had to stop her and put it on when waxing that ass. Of course she did BBBJ a yeoman's job by the way. Yes she did prance around the hotel suite totally nude once again like being naked was how it was supposed to be. In fact when I asked to take a picture of her. She said I got some pictures in my phone already if you want those. The were taken at her dorm common bathroom mirror and funny thing was there was another chick running by naked in the background of one of the pictures. Another example was my current and first SB, F. Jumped on my dick in the moment of passion and we went at it like high schoolers. I actually came inside her and started worrying about it later. And asked if she was on birth control and she said no. That she did not need another kid and she would just get the morning after pill if needed! I about had a heart attack. Needless to say this did not stop the ice from flowing through my veins. I got tested about a month later. She did too. And she had her period on time.

Now I consider myself an intelligent and successful man. But that was just plain stupid. I still find that after that with F, I have to initiate the wrapper or she will just let me pound her au natural. And of course Jake certainly does not mind. In fact he leans a little the other way. I have some comments to make about this and the risks involved and at the risk of going against our politically correct culture. I believe everyone on here should consider this when fucking so much strange poon tang. But I want to save that for another post otherwise this one is going to be a novel.

Just to give a quick update. After some not so great results the past week. I am starting to get some quality hits. Made some minor adjustments to my offer letter. And out of the blue magically I got 4 responses. One appears to be a stripper. Which of course is a semi-pro, and says she is 38 which probably means 43. She even emailed me to come out to her strip club. Not going to happen. If I want to bag strippers I do not need SA for that. I want what you guys got. Loved you comments about this Scott and the unique connection and intimacy that a LT SD / SB arrangement can have. Another POT was very cute and she was texting me and I asked her if she ever had an SD before and she disappeared. I think she misunderstood and thought I asked her if she ever had an STD. Won't do that again. Another is ready to meet sent me pictures very strong thin body little boobies. Maybe a 8 body and a 6to7 head. Black hair and some tats, a personal trainer and she is bisexual. Looking forward to this. The last one seems really promising she has had two long term SD's in the past she is 27 and ready to jump in the bowl again. Wants to make her man happy and to be happy herself. I look forward to next week. Going real fishing offshore this weekend. Kingfish and Cobia have been biting. So no rest for the weary.

Finally some comments on Scotts comment about the dynamic of the sugar bowl. There is a lot here. For starters I believe the women that know what they want the SB's that are doing it for the fun of it, are light years ahead of other women who are sexually repressed and frustrated. I have seen very little in the way of anger or resentment in the ones I am dealing with. On another note and I think this is a key to the women in general and SB's even more that they are feminine and we are masculine.

And in any relationship there is a masculine and a feminine and the masculine is dominant and the feminine is submissive. And sometimes in our society the masculine and the feminine roles are switched because you cannot have both parties be one. So if the man stops leading giving up his masculine role then his woman will take over the masculine gender role and the male will revert to the feminine. This will lead to the loveless, sexless marriages many of are experiencing. Examples of this are not leading, letting wives make all the decisions, couch potatoes, not having a life outside of the marriage. And that is what the sugar bowl offers. A return to the correct masculine and feminine gender roles. Same for these young women. They date some guy who cannot provide for them, hell he can't or won't even pay for a dinner. He does not have any direction or a career. Probably lives at home with mommy or daddy, hell the 'manchildren' even brag about it. How they are getting everything from their parents for free. And to top it off these boys are overly concerned with their looks (see an episode of that Jersey Shore train wreck.)

So these poor girls are stuck with these pretty boys that do not provide anything that a woman truly wants. A man, who is dominant, assertive, can provide for her figuratively and monetarily, knows how to fuck her well, and is not hiding who he is to her. Guys this is powerful stuff. Women may be liberated. But we have only been domesticated for about 5, 000 years. We have over 200, 000 years of evolution running thorough these girls veins. And if I ever learned anything about women is that they do not think they feel. And if you make a woman feel like a woman. She will do anything for you. I don't pretend to have all of the answers but I have done quite a bit of reading on the subject. And if you want to read something that is truly revolutionary and non PC. Read 'Way of the superior man' by David Dieada. It will change your outlook forever. And help you understand how this stuff works.

Got to go. Plane landing. More comments to come. Having a blast. Sometimes life is good.

Revvo.

PS: This is a quote from my little Cajun morsel last night 'damn Revvo you tore my little pussy up, what am I going to do now'. She is 5; 2" 106 lbs.

My sugar bowl is starting to settle down. MsOxyMoron is looking for a studio to call her on with my help. Of course nothing in my name.

Had to reschedule my BigButtBeauty's trip out a couple of weeks. But we still talk almost daily and it will be a great time when we get together.

MsTeacher has moved on to a real relationship. The older MILF is still around, but no longer a top priority now (she does not have her own place or car. Too much work for me). I'm not quite sure how I'm going to handle her.

From SA, I've met a 30 year old mixed Asian / White / something else. She very cute has a great rack. She's about 5'4 and a little bigger than what I normally deal with, but she can still make it look good in tights, LOL. She knows how to dress for her body and is very passionate and sensual. We had a great meet-and-greet. I did have something happen that never ever happened before. She recognized my picture from her friend. Seems as though I went out on a M&G with her friend. Her friend decided to step away from the sugar bowl and get a real relationship. So we never had an actual date. So she calls the friend and the friend gives me this glowing recommendation. Wow!

So based on that recommendation, we chat, go out and have a great time. She has now moved into the #1 spot. So while MsOxyMoron is trying to find time and get a new place, I got 2 more dates set up with the newbie next week. I'm looking forward to it. I'm guessing by date #3, we'll be doing the Tiggabounce! (.60 was given at M&G) Like most of my SBs, her sugar requirements are very low. She was just tired of not going out or having to pay for everything when she does go out. She wants the dating life and a little cash every now and then. My kinda woman. She does not have her own place either. How do I keep meeting these types, LOL. But she's looking and expects to have one by the summer, this time I did not offer help, LOL.

BigTigg

Keeping it covered: I've also run across my fair share who were not to worried about protection. In some cases I was very strict and in some cases, not so strict. I do feel that if you are going to go about it au natural. You should have a discussion first and get some particulars out of the way. If you need more direct advice, PM me, LOL.

I'm definitely with you on the chemistry of a relationship that feels natural and "normal". Something to be said for that type of intimacy.

OMG. (I can't believe I used that term). But MsOxyMoron is exactly the same about bouncing around all naked. Now it's a great site to see, but I was so surprised by this activity. She even delayed some this last time together since I made a comment about the clothes coming off so fast, LOL. I want do that again. She didn't even hesitate when I said I wanted photos. I'm am so excited about our "up and cumming" younger generation, LOL.

I've also found that passion and romance are good and the women appreciate that too. But at some point you got to just bang them good hard an fast. My friend flying in, specially mentioned that as why she's visiting. She says the men there are ok, but she really needs my special type of attention given to the kitty.

BigTigg

Gents,

I am new to this board and want to thank you for all your posts in the sugar bowl arena. I have had some interest but nothing yet. I did set up a M&G at Starbucks but she did not show up. I guess she got cold feet. I will keep fishing in hopes of a bite.

Lovinglife

[QUOTE=BigTigger; 1662036]Keeping it covered: I've also run across my fair share who were not to worried about protection. In some cases I was very strict and in some cases, not so strict. I do feel that if you are going to go about it au natural. You should have a discussion first and get some particulars out of the way. If you need more direct advice, PM me, LOL.

I'm definitely with you on the chemistry of a relationship that feels natural and "normal". Something to be said for that type of intimacy.

OMG. (I can't believe I used that term). But MsOxyMoron is exactly the same about bouncing around all naked. Now it's a great site to see, but I was so surprised by this activity. She even delayed some this last time together since I made a comment about the clothes coming off so fast, LOL. I want do that again. She didn't even hesitate when I said I wanted photos. I'm am so excited about our "up and cumming" younger generation, LOL.

I've also found that passion and romance are good and the women appreciate that too. But at some point you got to just bang them good hard an fast. My friend flying in, specially mentioned that as why she's visiting. She says the men there are ok, but she really needs my special type of attention given to the kitty.

BigTigg[/QUOTE]Trading STD test reports is always a good idea when necessary. Chemistry is a must if its going to be more than a one or two nite stand. A solid banging is important to a lot of women. If you get totally honest with them you will find more than a few that don't really even want you to give them oral. They just want to get right down to business. Good and hard. I have always found that the best way to keep them coming back is to get them "adickted".

With regard to nudity, I've noticed the same thing about strippers in general, and my SB in particular. She'll be stripping her clothes off sometimes even before I have the door shut. I've met her at her house several times to pick her up, and there has been more than one occasion where I'm a little early, and she hasn't gotten dressed yet, lounging around in her skin when nobody else is home. She vastly prefers naked to dressed as well. And frankly, [I]I [/I]vastly prefer naked to dressed. On her, anyway. (:

As for raw doggin' it, we've been going bareback for the better part of two years now, and no pulling out for the climax, either. That was [I]her [/I]idea, by the way. Apparently I get a little, um, carried away when I cum, and she likes it that way. Stupid, I know, but it's just so tough to pass it up. When we part, it's going to be difficult for me to go back to using condoms, I'm sure.

I get tested every couple of months when I give blood, and she gets tested regularly too. No worries about pregnancy, either, I've been shooting blanks since before she was in kindergarten.

[noparse]/[/noparse]z

So this week is starting off with a bang already. I have been working on my profile and my offer letter and I am trying to get a good follow up letter put together also.

Review of the SB and POT SB's.

RSCSB1 F: We had a really good session last week and she has mellowed somewhat on the drinking and smoking and we are getting closer and closer. Lot more texts with Miss you, want you kind of stuff. She does not like the dirty talk except when in the FC. But today I got a desperate text from her saying her phone was going to be turned of and she needed help. Slipping back into NANDO 1 territory. I waited a long while and when I responded I said I may be able to get together with her late in the week if at all. Did not want to reward bad behavior. She told me last week that she wanted to buy a boat and a horse. Man talk about lack of financial planning. Anyway I would like to keep seeing her she is an absolutely beautiful blond, with a juicy pussy but I don't know. I am really busy and she is getting clingly and needy.

I won't go through the other stripper POT SB's but just to say radio silence on these.

Now for new POTs. One called CH, was real fun and flirty we really hit it off. I could tell she was perfect as a SB she had two SDs before and could banter great. Excellent chemistry. OK body but no picture of her face on SA. So I asked for Pics and bam, not good. Now I am not a snob. But if I am going to do this and spend all of this money she has to look at least somewhat good. She is young, decent body 7-8, but the head, ouch. Have you ever heard of the term butterface? You know when you say she has a nice body but her face. So I am distancing myself from her.

Then there is a new one well call her RSB2, we have liftoff. Yes it happened. Not positive she is not a semi pro though. She works at a strip club. I would have never known if she did not tell me. But I met her on SA. Have not found her pics anywhere else. She is a 38 yo MILF. Very cute kind of a pie face. Blond blue eyed, about a 7 body and a 7. 5 head, great attitude. Not as good looking as F. But absolutely no drama. So we meet at a Starbucks. Dude if you are not doing Starbucks you are not getting laid. This is the place.

Anyway we have a nice conversation and she is wearing a very conservative black dress, and cute little wedges. And her dress is unbuttoned just to enough to make you look. Nice breasts. So we talk for about an hour and I work all the charm I could and she is very level not over the top, but I can see she is warming up. I say lets get together later in the week. And she readily agrees. No discussion of sugar. After we leave she texts me and says she can take her kids to her mother and meet me later in the afternoon. The she says she is "feeling very sexual today" and that she has needs too. So I go to my business meeting and then text her back we arrange the meet at a hotel. Love hotwire.

She gets there and man the door closes and we are over each other like a cheap suit. She tells me that she really likes to have her nipples played with. No problem there. Awesome tits with hat hangers for nipples. Suffice it to say it worked out great. I am completely drained of semen. She was so juicy I had to clear some out of the way a couple of times. She came twice and I went through a three pack. You damn right I am braggin. I am 52! And if you did three in a 1 1/2 hour time period I would be slapping you a high five. Hell I haven't came with my wife 3 times in the last month! I am really starting to like this hobby. One last thing. As I was leaving I checked the mirror and we had started off making out with her naked and me with my nice dress pants still on. She was so wet and we were pushed up against each other. She left pussy juice on the front of my pants. Double check in the mirror.

Oh well the warden is coming home. More to tell on another report. But just a hint of things to come. There are some hot ones in the hopper. And one is a real model.

Stay tuned. Stay safe. Stay under the radar.

Revvo

I got quite a few topics I'd like to comment on, but so little time so I'll post just a few bits for now.

Anyway, I'm one of those guys who struggles to perform with latex, so if the situation and the girl feels right, I'm open to going bare. For me, pregnancy would be a bigger issue than a STD. All the mild STDs have antibotics and the severe stuff usually require there to be open sores present and a dangerous lifestyle (drugs, needles, and etc). Also the SO and I already have kids and not looking for more, so even if I passed something on to her while horrible it wouldn't be the end of the world. However, knocking up a SB would create more problems for me in my view. However statistically pulling out when done correctly is only 1-2% less effective than using condoms in terms of pregnancy prevention. So if my main concern is pregnancy, condoms don't really add that much protection compared to pulling out. So as long as I get the vibe that she's not a pro or a Nando1, then I'll roll the dice and go bare. (I'm thinking also about just getting my boys snipped if I can get over the psychological issue of having my boys snipped.)

I also tend to go after 18-22 year-old SBs. Unless they're pros or Nando1's they usually have pretty low mileage. Quite a few of the girls I encountered, had just a couple of long-term boyfriends and they finally wanted to be with a man who wasn't broke.

That said, I've only gone bare with 3 SBs and I stopped with one of them. There's a risk that if the SB gets too active in the sugar world, she'll start banging other SDs bare and pick up who knows what. This is kinda what happened to our dear friend Joe on this board. So if I'm going bare with a SB, I need to have a very good idea what other guys she may be sleeping with. Having access to their FB page and talking regularly via txt is a good way to gauge this. If she's constantly complaining about money problems which you can't fulfill and she has a lot of idle time, then there's a good chance she may be seeing another SD. It's also why I like Busy Babies. Busy Babies have far less time to maintain a roundtable of SDs. So even if they would like a little more money from you, they simply don't have the time to go on M&Gs and FCs with other SDs. Well that's the theory anyway.

So I pretty much ended things with my now ex-ATF SB. She basically became a Nando1. When we started up, she had an apartment (with roommates) , going to school, and looking for a job. But by the end, she had already gone back home (which she was getting kicked out of) , left school, and still couldn't find a job. She was having a lot of idle time and asking me for more and more money. She also started talking to me less except when she needed money (which wasn't the case before). When I told her I was looking for another SB, she actually wanted to get back together, but I got a bad vibe and just passed. Glad I never went bare with her, my suspicions were later confirmed that she was quite promiscuous with some shady characters.

[b]Backseat SB[/b]

After all the drama, I wanted to get back to some simplicity. I've recently gone back to my now 20-year-old (she was 19 when we met) SB from the summer who I hooked up with once a week in the car. I'll call her Backseat SB because that's pretty much the only place where we've been together. After a 2 month break (when I was seeing my ex-ATF SB) , we're now back on the weekly routine. I do go bare with this girl and I'm contemplating having her go on birth control. I may propose giving her a little extra per- week if she goes on birth control. This way I don't have to worry about pregnancies and I can finish inside. I just wish we had a little more mental chemistry. When she's not rocking my world in the backseat of my car, the conversation is very strained. So I don't really want to take her anywhere or go anywhere. Even meeting in an FC might be painful. For what it is, we have a good thing going. She's extremely busy with school and work (which I confirmed through Facebook) and she basically hits me up once a week for extra spending cash (I never initiate contact).

[b]Caretaker SB[/b]

This was actually my second ever SB from a year ago. She's 19 now (18 when we met) and I recently contacted her to fire things up again. She's a nursing student (aren't they all) and she takes care of her large family. What was nice about her was that she also took care of my needs and was the constant pleaser. I really shouldn't have dropped her, but I was new to the game so like most newbies to the sugar bowl I was sampling as much sugar as I possibly could. And she was maybe a "7" in the looks department, so she got lost in the shuffle while I was trying to reach for higher. But we actually got a long pretty well, she was great in bed, and wasn't really active in the sugar sites. So I'm giving her another shot and we're actually going to do an overnight this weekend. It's actually going to be my first overnight. Unlike many of you, I don't have business out of town so overnights would catch the attention of the warden. However I've been carefully molding my schedule so an occasional overnighter won't raise too many flags with the warden. So I'm hoping it goes well this weekend.

Otherwise things are beginning to quiet down and it's mostly by choice. I did do a mad dash on SA and SDFM the past couple of weeks, but didn't really find what I was looking for. Also I'm a little bit fatigued now by the Sugar Bowl, so for the next month or so, I'm going to stick with Backseat SB (who I'll see weekly) and Caretaker SB (who I'll see 1-2x a month). It's funny after all my sugar adventures, I'm basically back to the first few original SBs I started out with last year. All the new and recent connections are now dormant or tossed aside.

So I think I'll hang tight for the rest of winter. I'll maybe go on a new hunt around Spring Break.

Wow, just had this discussion with MsOxyMoron, she's getting them and I'm paying. Get this, she says she's never done it without condoms. So this should be fun. I think the BC will come before she gets a place, I can't wait to see her reaction.

BigTigg.

[QUOTE=John G Smith;1664637]I do go bare with this girl and I'm contemplating having her go on birth control. I may propose giving her a little extra per- week if she goes on birth control. This way I don't have to worry about pregnancies and I can finish inside.[/QUOTE]

Hi Gents. I have been playing mostly on CL, and did have some luck but it is becoming a graveyard. I've tried SA and SD4M and had very little luck. Perhaps my profile and sales pitch were very inefficient. I like to give these venues another try and would greatly appreciate any help I can get from you master fishermen. What do you say in your profile and offer letters? Please feel free to PM me if you like to lend a helping hand. Thanks

[QUOTE=Smokarz_XO;1664948]Hi Gents. I have been playing mostly on CL, and did have some luck but it is becoming a graveyard. I've tried SA and SD4M and had very little luck. Perhaps my profile and sales pitch were very inefficient. I like to give these venues another try and would greatly appreciate any help I can get from you master fishermen. What do you say in your profile and offer letters? Please feel free to PM me if you like to lend a helping hand. Thanks[/QUOTE]I like SD4ME. Be direct as possible without being vulgar. Works for me.

You know I forgot a lot of things over the years. But one memory was brought back to me today. That is how pleasant it can be to spend a nice sunny morning just chatting and getting to know a beautiful young woman. No pretense, no bullshit, no money negotiation. Just a nice couple of hours talking about what we wanted to talk about. With the ultimate possibility of there being much more. So I saw this profile on SA of a cute but not that great little blond pixie type about 24 yo. But her profile was not great. So I thought to myself. Why the hell not. So I texted her and we had some good banter and so we set up a meet. I gave it 20% chance she would show. We will call her POT RSB3.

Even though we have not hit it yet. I think chances are good we could. So she texted me the night before our scheduled coffee meet, and the morning also. Very prompt and efficient. Once again no bullshit. So I wait and then she is there. Cute as can be I could not believe those were her pictures. She was easily a 9 head and a very sweet little 8. 5 spinner body. A bit on the thin side. But Everything is in the right place. Total amateur I could tell she has never done this before. Actually she said she has only met a couple men and they were awful. I don't know what men are thinking. This girl is very intelligent, reserved, kind of quiet. Kind of watching me. So I started up the charm machine, but I did not need to. We just talked about everything and anything. It was great. Slowly I could see the sexual tension building.

But wait this one could take a while. Even though she is hurting for money. It aint going to happen quickly. But I think my chances are 80% at this point. Considering I only gave her 20% of showing for the meet and greet. We have a lunch date on Friday. We are going to go someplace nice and get her a nice meal and some wine. No FC though. Got to work this for a while and I really am not worrying about it. This is great. I should have done this a long time ago.

I have another meet and greet for tomorrow. Coffee and she is really cute in the pictures. Call her POT RSB4. Kind of Italian looking. Nice body and a great funny personality. We have talked on the phone extensively and chemistry is building. Women need emotional tension. Gents if you are not giving her emotional tension. You are missing out. This one is very much an amateur who has had a bad experience also. I have been treating them good and they are responding well to it. I don't think my profile or offer letter are very effective. But once I get the nibble. My chances go way up. By the way she is not getting too frisky yet either. But she did tell me how much sex she wants and how most men cannot keep up with her. I told her I am up for the job.

On to the blond MILF that I had the marathon fuck session on Monday with. She has texted me twice to come fuck her again. I am going to hold off. She is a very reliable fuck. But I don't see her as long term. Besides she drained me of all fluids. I have to recharge. More of a good standby in a dry spell. I'm such a working girl!

Got to go. Work calls and POT RSB3 is texting me.

Stay safe, stay cool, stay undercover.

Revvo

I have found, in my area, Chicago, that the SD4ME babies are a little skankier, while the SA ones are more skittish, but of a consitently higher quality. Sign up for both, with the caveat that SD4ME will bill your sorry ass each month until you cancel that credit card. Read back through the clubhouse journal and you will see various brothers' attempts to deal with it.

Good luck, and don't forget to write!

Scott

Hi Guys, (and Girl),

I am a long time lurker and participant in the sex scene in most of its manifestations. I began with strip clubs and evolved through CL, BP, hookers, then SB. Thanks to all the advice you all have imparted on this site I feel like I have a PHD in Sexanomics.

Without dragging through the past successes as well as failures I will impart a few of my latest explorations.

My budget and available time allows for one or two nights / week playtime since I travel for work and have an excuse to be on parole. Since I cut my teeth on hourly workers I now prefer under 30 yr old naive SBs.

SB fail #1 off SA was a 26 single mom who agreed to travel to me for $$$ overnight. We exchanged multiple texts, pictures, and talked on the phone for a week. It sounded fabulous and I gave it a 80 % chance of occurring. She was an 7-7-8 in hooker parlance 7 face. 7 body. 8 attitude. I was thrilled to land my 1st possible regular since she wanted a reg. Well, the day came and texted and called to no avail. She didn't call until the next day to cancel or reschedule, and just said she was busy. Obviously she got a better deal. When she called to reschedule I wisely blew her off. Bummer for a starter.

SB # 2 is realized. She is a 25 yr old wf off SA She is an 8-8-8. We texted and talked for a week and met in her apartment where she resides alone. She is a part time student and seems naive but has no visible means of support and no job. Hmmm, I am hopeful but not born yesterday so I wonder if she has another SD or two. Maybe daddy is supporting her. I prefer a monogamous relationship for several reasons. She does not seem to be promiscuous and is actually not sexually experienced or talented, but young vaginas are just too much fun to pass up. We continue to see each other once / week for $1000 / mo. We go out a lot but do spend time in and I stay all night. She is not warm and romantic so I think she is keeping an emotional separation. I prefer a more romantic attitude. Hey! It is mostly acting so do the best you can right?

SB pot # 3 I am exploring AM since these girls are generally "free" I would like to find a girl or two who just want to step out on daddy for a fuck occasionally. In that vein I am talking to a 35 yr old wf 7-7? She seems attractive enough but not a young hottie that I like. Still, if I can bag her for run around the FC I will. Stay posted. We're getting to the text phase.

SB fail #4 Is an 18 yr old HCB 9-9? Perhaps I shouldn't report on anyone I haven't met but this one was was a college frosh full time-barely legal and the texting was hot and heavy for several days. When I came up with a concrete plan for FC visitation soon she flaked. She responded that she was a classy girl and didn't have sex on the first date. Sooo, being creative I suggested that the first visit would entail 2 dates. First would be dinner followed by date two in the FC. I think it was too aggressive for her but the drive was 3 1/2 hrs and I was not going there without a guarantee that we were going to be intimate. As someone said you have to make your intentions known without being rude What is it about these girls who want money from us older men but won't put out? Are there guys who actually pay for only arm candy? Not me!

So that's it for now!

[QUOTE=Fredmoore;1666355]What is it about these girls who want money from us older men but won't put out? Are there guys who actually pay for only arm candy? Not me![/QUOTE]Bravo Fredmoore! Make these garden tools put in some work!

SubCmdr Out!

[QUOTE=BigTigger; 1664885]Wow, just had this discussion with MsOxyMoron, she's getting them and I'm paying. Get this, she says she's never done it without condoms. So this should be fun. I think the BC will come before she gets a place, I can't wait to see her reaction.

BigTigg.[/QUOTE]BigTigg, I forgot to mention what you're about to setup with the apartment is pretty much the ideal setup I'd like to have someday. Pay maybe 500 - 800 for a studio apartment per month located somewhat nearby and then show up just about whenever I please. As others have mentioned, it has to be someone you won't get bored of for 6-12 months, but with the right girl it can be the perfect setup. Wish you good luck and let us know how it goes.

I've had similar experiences as Scott F. On SA, I tend to have to do a longer warm-up act before getting to the nitty gritty details. In my experience, SA girls tend to be a little bit newer to the sugar world. Some of them might be a little more hesitant, but they're "fresher" and higher quality on the average. I see a lot more university / full time college SBs on SA than on SDFM.

With SDFM, Hollywood Guy is totally correct, being direct is key. A few weeks ago, I changed my approach on SDFM to be more direct and I literally got a 90% response rate. Some of the girls may have wanted more than what I was offering, but I still got responses even from hot chicks and sometimes there was room to negotiate. IMO, SDFM is mostly the hangout for seasoned SBs or girls who are already used to purely transactional arrangements (ie. Strippers and UTR Escorts).

Both sites have their share of GPSs. Though SA probably has the worst in my experience. Also SA I think have more girls who think guys will pay them 2-3k a month just to be arm candy and never put out. Whereas SDFM has more girls who are down with the program (for the right price).

I've personally had more success with SA, but I've been using that site longer and I probably wasn't using SDFM correctly until just about a few weeks ago.

If you haven't read them already, you should check out the posts of a particular member in the LA Non-Pro topics. Unlike many of the guys there who hunt for girls on CL and SD sites, he looks for opportunities in his day to day life in retail stores and such to convert young hotties into SBs of sorts. He has a low success rate, but when it works he taps a completely fresh normal girl who may have never heard about sugar daddy sites and such.

Since we were on the subject of websites, I thought I'd bring to the group on whether any of have attempted to approach a regular girl in your day-to-day life to make her into a SB? I know for me, I'm now much more confident with talking and approaching 18-22 year olds compared to just a couple of years ago. Though I haven't yet actually broached the subject of an arrangement to one in my everyday life.

Part of it is that I'm married so sometimes I'm damn tempted but I don't want to hit on a cashier who I might bump into later with my SO. But I'm thinking about trying out my skills at some out of the way malls or retail shops and look for fresh territory for potential SBs. Part of the problem with SD websites, is that you're competing with an unknown amount of guys also offering money, gifts, etc. And the girls themselves may be seeing multiple SDs. Going after a regular girl who's clearly working at a deadend job but hasn't discovered the sugar world is an opportunity to mine in fresh territory. Basically the old fashioned way, LOL.

That's why I like talking to the pot SBs on SA and SDFM even if it doesn't go anywhere. I'm trying to make a profile of the type of girl who eventually goes to these sites. This way when I'm out in the field, I'll know what signs to look for. When I have more time, I'll post some characteristics from my observations for you guys amusement and we can trade notes.

My take on SA and SD4M follow the others here, for my area. No one ever mentions sugardaddie dot com, though. The place seems to have the 30+ MILF segment locked up, which makes it much more appealing to me, but I've yet to meet anyone from there. Does anyone have experience with that site?

[QUOTE=John G Smith;1666663]Since we were on the subject of websites, I thought I'd bring to the group on whether any of have attempted to approach a regular girl in your day-to-day life to make her into a SB? I know for me, I'm now much more confident with talking and approaching 18-22 year olds compared to just a couple of years ago. Though I haven't yet actually broached the subject of an arrangement to one in my everyday life.[/QUOTE]This is the pool I'm starting to play in. Check your PM's.

Had a meet and greet today with a 25 year old with a killer body from SD4ME. She had gained a little since the pics. The date was ok, but she had been emotionally and physically abused as a youth. So she was a bit all over the place, hard to read and a little weird. She was a bit OCD and ADD at the same time. It was a bit confusing. However, she did not seem too spastic, so I engaged and we chatted. A couple of leg rubs and subtle flirting. At some point I snuck in kiss. She was surprised, but welcomed it, it was limited to a very quick peck. She doesn't like pre-mature affection.

However, she also had this weird sense of right and wrong, that I can take her shopping, etc on the first date, but affection has to go at a much slower pace. Right! She doesn't get it. I paid for lunch, gave her gas money and even gave her chocolates and a starbucks card. For the M&G. I was not expecting the Tiggabounce, but a bit more than that 1/2 hug and "no more kisses" would have been nice. It was an 1 and 1/2 hour lunch date. I can't touch the lips, but she can use those same lips to ask me to take her shopping. Anyway, more than likely that will be the last date. She called later that day to ask for another date tomorrow that included shopping. I told her I was busy, maybe next week. She actually lost me when she said that sex in the relationship wasn't very important and that she's not a fan of receiving oral sex. She was just so not what I was expecting, the pictures were so nice and her initial conversations were on point.

Anyway, in my quest to have the Tiggabounce at every site I try (AFF-success, AM-success, SD4ME-success, CL Ad-success, Sdaddie-success, SA=success, OBC-success, BPM-success). I've been chatting with this married pot from POF. This is my first foray into POF, but is seems to be ok. We exchanged lots of emails and plenty of texts today. She could not talk on the phone, so we texted today for hours, between all my meetings and driving. Athletic build. 43 years old and with a great smile. We live about 2 to 3 hours apart. So the first date will be a long one and probably end up in the Tiggabounce, that's too far to not get in the goodies. I'll just keep texting and emailing until she's cool with the hotel on the first date. Since it's POF, the fact that I'm paying for gas, means and room was very appealing to her. I'll still give her some cash too, but the pressure to give the "right" amount is not there.

-

I also contacted this 5'10 MILF who is 44 from SD4ME. She's ok looking, but not the cutest, however she has a manual labor job, hell on the face, great on the body. Oh my, the body is smoking. She's just horny as hell and wants a good working over. She's married and been deprived for years. We are meeting next week. We've talked on the phone, sexted, texted and exchanged pics. I asked about a M&G to get comfortable, then schedule the Tiggabounce. 2nd date. She said no, she wants to get to it on the first date. Does not want to go out, wants to meet at the room and just get worked over for a good couple of hours. I' 5'8, I told her I like 'them tall and to wear heels. She says she loves dressing up and will be looking great when she shows up. I need a more dependable booty call friend and she just might work. I'll keep you updated.

-The MILF that I had before wanted to go out again, I said no and pretty much told her I'd not be seeing her anymore. She went bonkers with all this I'm going to tell you wife, yada yada. Fortunately she doesn't have any of my real info. I knew she had a little crazy in here. She was a good lay, but too erratic.

- Chatted with another pot from sdaddie, she wanted me to drive 3 hours one way, spend 3 hours with her. 2 days a month for $$$$$$$$. You know that does not work with the TiggaMath!

-Got a number for a UTR from another thread, put the number in my phone and it was someone I had met on sdaddie dot com. Wow, she went from SD to non-pro to pro in less than six months.

-The one that was a referral from her friend has stopped replying to texts, emails and phone calls. I did one of each, I'm done, moving on. I am sad a little. I thought she was going to be the one to bounce all the others.

John G, thanks, I'll keep everyone updated. I hope this happens soon as I'm tired of the hustle with these others. I have a meeting with my young sphinx MsOxyMoron Friday night. She made it clear, she's very comfortable with me and doesn't want a bunch of non-essentials, like dinner, movie or pretense. She wants me in bed naked when she arrives and says that will be much of the same once she gets her place! BTW, I wish I could get a studio for that price, trust me, I've looked. In many cases I can get shared spaces, but I've not liked that setup.

[QUOTE=John G Smith;1666635]BigTigg, I forgot to mention what you're about to setup with the apartment is pretty much the ideal setup I'd like to have someday. Pay maybe 500 - 800 for a studio apartment per month located somewhat nearby and then show up just about whenever I please. As others have mentioned, it has to be someone you won't get bored of for 6-12 months, but with the right girl it can be the perfect setup. Wish you good luck and let us know how it goes.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=CantWinLosin;1667266]My take on SA and SD4M follow the others here, for my area. No one ever mentions sugardaddie dot com, though. The place seems to have the 30+ MILF segment locked up, which makes it much more appealing to me, but I've yet to meet anyone from there. Does anyone have experience with that site?[/QUOTE]I have had a lot of luck there, let me try to count, well over 8 to 10 scores (24 year old AA. 22 year dominican. 30 year old latin and a host of others). I just renewed my account yesterday and have 3 pots already. It's good, it's a bit more work, but I found it very useful.

BigTigg

I was so tempted to hit on my waitress today, but I knew the other young lady was coming. She was nice, reserved, ok body, cute face and engaging. Since my date was late. Uugh I hate that. I chatted her up and felt there was some connection. I'm tempted to go back and try my luck anyway.

[QUOTE=John G Smith;1666663]Going after a regular girl who's clearly working at a deadend job but hasn't discovered the sugar world is an opportunity to mine in fresh territory. Basically the old fashioned way, LOL.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=CantWinLosin;1667266]My take on SA and SD4M follow the others here, for my area. No one ever mentions sugardaddie dot com, though. The place seems to have the 30+ MILF segment locked up, which makes it much more appealing to me, but I've yet to meet anyone from there. Does anyone have experience with that site?[/QUOTE]It's been ages since I checked out sugardaddie dot com. If I recall correctly, the search is only at the state level and you can't narrow it down to distance from you. Is it still that way?

Since everyone is so good about acronyms for these HCBs I thought I would add my own and make an entry in this regard. CB would be Civilian Baby.

I frequently visit a large corporate client where I am well known. There is a drop dead gorgeous admin asst who I have SERIOUS hots for. She is early to mid 20s (I am 50s) and we are flirting, but she seems like a "good " girl and I am afraid that it would shock her beyond belief if I came on to her. However, the little head rules the day, so here's what happened. We were talking about the super bowl and she is going home to Baltimore to go to the game with her girlfriends and to pay down (gasp! A HCG with a school debt!) her loan. I know you are all thinking I made the move but I filed it away for another day. Hmmm. Sweetheart, would you like me to help you with your school debt? I know how hard it must be to make ends meet.

So does anyone have any slick line I can roll out there so that I could save face if she is totally not open to the SB scenario? Mandy, if you are still her perhaps you could weigh in on the subject of perverting (converting) a chaste young thing?

[QUOTE=Spitfire;1667691]It's been ages since I checked out sugardaddie dot com. If I recall correctly, the search is only at the state level and you can't narrow it down to distance from you. Is it still that way?[/QUOTE]That has not changed, but it's just as simple as asking, what part of "XX" are you in, in your first communication. It's a hassle, but not that much of one.

BigTigg

[QUOTE=John G Smith; 1666656]I've had similar experiences as Scott F. On SA, I tend to have to do a longer warm-up act before getting to the nitty gritty details. In my experience, SA girls tend to be a little bit newer to the sugar world. Some of them might be a little more hesitant, but they're "fresher" and higher quality on the average. I see a lot more university / full time college SBs on SA than on SDFM.

With SDFM, Hollywood Guy is totally correct, being direct is key. A few weeks ago, I changed my approach on SDFM to be more direct and I literally got a 90% response rate. Some of the girls may have wanted more than what I was offering, but I still got responses even from hot chicks and sometimes there was room to negotiate. IMO, SDFM is mostly the hangout for seasoned SBs or girls who are already used to purely transactional arrangements (ie. Strippers and UTR Escorts).

Both sites have their share of GPSs. Though SA probably has the worst in my experience. Also SA I think have more girls who think guys will pay them 2-3k a month just to be arm candy and never put out. Whereas SDFM has more girls who are down with the program (for the right price).

I've personally had more success with SA, but I've been using that site longer and I probably wasn't using SDFM correctly until just about a few weeks ago.[/QUOTE]Do you actually include specific amounts in your intro / mailings? Like ' I can reward you with $100 a date"? I think this would be too direct? I thouht these girls like to be treated like normal and not an escort. I am too having very little success with sd4m. Perhaps I really need to change my approach?

"Do you actually include specific amounts in your intro" Smokartz_XO.

Gents, we all know why most of these babies are here. They know it, and we know it. Some just want to pretend for a while, and others are actually pros in SB disguise. These sites are just another free marketing venue.

The best side to err on is the respectful one that is a little more subtle. Some of the guys here are very successful not mentioning $$ at all. I always like being up front after getting a feel for the SB from texting and talking. I do not want to waste my time by meeting a GPS and spending some spec money on her just to find out that she values her Quan at 5$/pop. I like to ask something like " what goals do you have in mind from our relationship "? Or more directly," What sort of help are you looking for?"

We all have discussed this in prior posts and every successful SB has his own formula.

[QUOTE=Hernando; 1668137]"Do you actually include specific amounts in your intro" Smokartz_XO.

Gents, we all know why most of these babies are here. They know it, and we know it. Some just want to pretend for a while, and others are actually pros in SB disguise. These sites are just another free marketing venue.

The best side to err on is the respectful one that is a little more subtle. Some of the guys here are very successful not mentioning $$ at all. I always like being up front after getting a feel for the SB from texting and talking. I do not want to waste my time by meeting a GPS and spending some spec money on her just to find out that she values her Quan at 5$/pop. I like to ask something like " what goals do you have in mind from our relationship "? Or more directly," What sort of help are you looking for?"

We all have discussed this in prior posts and every successful SB has his own formula.[/QUOTE]I offer $ a date period. The end. Lots of takers. I bring it up in the first email or message exchange. i am very busy and dont like to waste anyones time. seems to work best with 20 to 22 year olds. these are 7+ quality only. i date a lot so this still adds up on a monthly basis. long term regulars get perks, but then so do I. But for a first time or 2 or 3 meeting I don't budge. If i only wanted to date 10's .. then i would have to pay more. But what i might gain in looks i would loose in attitude. So for me it's not worth it. I would rather turn my 7's into 9's over time by suggesting all my donations go to hair, nails, clothes, etc. Let those other guys pay the rent, car payment, etc...

Obviously every situation is different. But my donation does not vary, although what they spend it on may.

I admire your style HG. More often than not I pay $250 / week, which ends up being once usually, plus social expenses such as dinner, flowers, etc. At $/pop I could date as often as I need.

Do you get it straight with them about a mandatory visit to the FC or do you have to work that in to the night? If the latter, what is your B / B ratio (bang / buck)?

[QUOTE=Spitfire;1667691]It's been ages since I checked out sugardaddie dot com. If I recall correctly, the search is only at the state level and you can't narrow it down to distance from you. Is it still that way?[/QUOTE]It's still that way. However, when I logged in there last night (first time in quite a while; I've been concentrating on SA) they prompted me to update my profile to add my city info, so it looks like they will be adding finer granularity in their searches soon. Whether that will be for-paying-folks-only or not (as SA does for several of their searches) I have no idea.

I scored my 1st from SD4ME the other day, we met for coffee, she was about a 7 or so a little older 40s. When we got to the amounts I asked what was she looking for? She said $1000 per month, I'm, a 1$ type so I asked how often would that be for? She said 3 times a week, I'm quick with numbers, so I calculated in my head mmmm 3x per week, that's 12 to 15 times per month depending on the month, so that brings the per meet number down to $80 or less! Haha. She went for it, and we went at it the next day. All was on the menu except anal. (I'm not a anal 1st date guy anyway) I've been to busy and had my standby friend over for free on the day she thought she was coming back.

I actually cut my first teeth in the sugar bowl on SDaddie. But the lack of a more local search really killed it for me. I then went to SA and never looked back. Maybe the state-only search is not as big an issue in smaller states, but for large states like California it's a huge pain when I'm just trying to look for someone in my local area. Usually 7 out of 10 people I contacted were more than 2 hours away, so a lot of time was wasted in PMs filtering out girls based on location when the site should already be doing this automatically. I actually ran a dating site way back in the day, so I know why they did this. Their membership wasn't that big, so to make the search results seem more impressive, they restricted it to the state-level. However their membership is clearly big enough now but I don't think they had the foresight to collect city / zip info, so now they're playing catch-up.

And yes, being direct as possible on SDFM seems to be the way to go. Though keep in mind the type of girls who respond to direct inquires. Girls who respond quickly to direct requests are likely to be UTR Pros, strippers, or serial sugar babies (who potentially have multiple SDs on stand-by).

Also, the problem with offering $ is that it's very easy to get outbid. So even if she accepts $/visit, you may want to still ask her what kind of expenses she has. If giving her 140 instead of 100 better covers her expenses, then it might be worth doing it so she's focused on pleasing you instead of sniffing around for other SDs to fill in the gaps.

Then again, a lot just depends on your playing style in the sugar bowl. If your playing style is to quickly move from one SB to another then this may not be as big as of a concern.

That said.

Sugar Bowl Tip #293: When negotiating a monthly or per visit allowance, ALWAYS ask what real expenses she has. Often times a girl may initially request a 1500. 2000 monthly allowance, but when it comes down to it, she just has about 800. 1000 in monthly expenses, sometimes less. If you can get them to look at it rationally, then you can explain to them for example how 1-2 weekly visits at $100-150 per meet can pretty much cover all their basic monthly needs.

I got some borderline GPS girls to become more rational by playing their book-keeper for a day. Also if you present yourself as helping with their expenses instead of simply paying per sex then the more "normal" girls won't feel like an escort.

BTW, I recently tried going to an AMP a couple of weeks ago and I just couldn't get into it. The Sugar Bowl has spoiled me with 18-22 year-old HYBs that AMP 40-something year-old asian women in laundry clothes don't do it for me anymore. Has the Sugar Bowl spoiled you from your other recreational activities?

[QUOTE=John G Smith;1668541]BTW, I recently tried going to an AMP a couple of weeks ago and I just couldn't get into it. The Sugar Bowl has spoiled me with 18-22 year-old HYBs that AMP 40-something year-old asian women in laundry clothes don't do it for me anymore. Has the Sugar Bowl spoiled you from your other recreational activities?[/QUOTE]To an extent. I'm definitely spoiled somewhat by what I get from her, but I still venture out occasionally for a little variety. I [I]would [/I] Absolutely say that my standards are higher now. Like you, I won't bother with most of the AMPs around here, because the level of service isn't what I want. However, there are a number of body rub girls in other establishments that I would consider, because they at least seem, based on others' reviews and my own limited experience, to step it up. Escorts have never really been my thing much in the first place, and though I have seen some, the experience overall isn't as good as getting a stripper out of the club. And I still do go to strip clubs, and still have an occasional romp in a back room, when it's inexpensive enough. Taking them out has gotten much rarer, though. I think there have been three in the last two years. (:

So with respect to higher standards, yeah, I'm spoiled, but it isn't like she's exactly ruined absolutely every thing else. I still get enjoyment elsewhere.

[noparse]/[/noparse]z

Joy drop and Johng,

I too have considered going freestyle with a civvies. I have been doing a hell of a lot more flirting. And I have been having pretty good success. The more amateur the better short of a virgin though. I am working on this really cute 22 yo blond from a hooters type bar. She has been crying poor and I think we are going to close the deal. My first SB was a very inexperienced stripper not a total amateur but never been a SB. And I recruited her on my own.

PM me and we can compare successes and failures? I think there is a huge untapped market out there that is yet to be exploited. The ultimate soft sell.

Revvo

[QUOTE=FredMoore; 1667944]Edit delete. I frequently visit a large corporate client where I am well known. There is a drop dead gorgeous admin asst who I have SERIOUS hots for. She is early to mid 20s (I am 50s) and we are flirting, but she seems like a "good " girl and I am afraid that it would shock her beyond belief if I came on to her. However, the little head rules the day, so here's what happened. We were talking about the super bowl and she is going home to Baltimore to go to the game with her girlfriends and to pay down (gasp! A HCG with a school debt!) her loan. I know you are all thinking I made the move but I filed it away for another day. Hmmm. Sweetheart, would you like me to help you with your school debt? I know how hard it must be to make ends meet.

So does anyone have any slick line I can roll out there so that I could save face if she is totally not open to the SB scenario? Mandy, if you are still her perhaps you could weigh in on the subject of perverting (converting) a chaste young thing?[/QUOTE]She is half your age and hot. The two of you are flirting. She mentioned bills.

It's best to shed the attitude:

[QUOTE=FredMoore;1667944]Hmmm. Sweetheart, would you like me to help you with your school debt? I know how hard it must be to make ends meet.[/QUOTE]Give her a card with $200 in it. Tell her it is her birthday present, and don't hang around. She knows how to contact you. The next move is hers. Give her space to make it. My bet is the clothes will come flying off giving her some money without mentioning a dime. If it doesn't happen you misread the flirting. The $200 keeps you from outing yourself.

Something never discovered by this board is giving a civie girl in distress money with no strings will cause the clothes to come flying off. All the posts focus on how to meet outed SB's over coffee, negotiate and not spend a dime doing it. There are more civie girls than those claiming to be SB's.

The question not asked,"Is it smart to mix business with pleasure on the premises of a good corporate client where I am well known?" Absolutely not.

Walk the fuck away. You will get burned on so many levels. Go find some other hottie to fuck that has no clue who you are! Unless of course you are single and have a skill set that will gain you employment anywhere at anytime. If that is the case do what Golfcart said and fuck the shit out of that hottie, then freshin up your CV.

LL

Have to agree with with Golfcart on all counts. Good advice, sir.

Golfcart, I really like your thoughts below. As well as other thoughts you have had on here about pushing the string. I use them myself now.

Question, have you applied the civvie technique in the past? If so how often does it work? What if there is no birthday on the horizon? Just make up another event?

Revvo