"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[QUOTE=Dsprdo;2140448]Been texting with a 29 yo latina part time underwear model. 9/9/9. She has been a good communicator and didn't seem GPS. We finally set up a meet, dinner on Saturday night. She lives about a half hour from me so I asked her to pick a place near her. This has worked out in the past, usually they pick someplace less expensive than I would have. She picked a very high end steak house (talking $60 entrees). I actually like hitting those places once in a while and wouldn't have a problem with taking an established SB but was taken back by that as a M&G. Does the combined wisdom say this a harbinger of her tastes and expectations for all things sugar? I am thinking about ditching her because I don't need the headache and don't plan to commit a major chunk of the sugar budget to one girl.

Helping to nudge me in that direction is the fact that I too seem to be in an "up" period for SB's. Met the girl who flaked on me Sunday night last night for dinner. We have confirmed a FC visit for Friday. Have a M&G tonight with a 29 yo blond 8/8, tattooed, harley riding MILF whose pics look like she should be on the cover of a bike magazine. She has had a SD before and appears ready to go if we agree on sugar. I'm canceling a previously scheduled meet with my regular SB tomorrow (she was just over yesterday) in order to have lunch with a 20 yo first timer, 7/8, white, long brown hair. She has agreed in principle to come back to my place to "hang out" after lunch if we connect. Then I have dinner tomorrow night with a 24 yo latina nursing student / MILF, 7/9, who also says she is new to this but is completely okay with the idea. If I close even 2 of the 4 (and one seems a done deal); then I won't have time, funds, or energy for the UW model. But she is sooo hot!

What say you?[/QUOTE]I might be thinking with the small head for you, but the UW model sounds hot! I think I'd take her to the fancy steak house. Tell her you had a late lunch and aren't hungry so just order a small app or some drinks. Keep the bill under $100 and get down to bizness!

[QUOTE=Dsprdo;2140448]Been texting with a 29 yo latina part time underwear model. 9/9/9. She has been a good communicator and didn't seem GPS. We finally set up a meet, dinner on Saturday night. She lives about a half hour from me so I asked her to pick a place near her. This has worked out in the past, usually they pick someplace less expensive than I would have. She picked a very high end steak house (talking $60 entrees). I actually like hitting those places once in a while and wouldn't have a problem with taking an established SB but was taken back by that as a M&G. Does the combined wisdom say this a harbinger of her tastes and expectations for all things sugar? I am thinking about ditching her because I don't need the headache and don't plan to commit a major chunk of the sugar budget to one girl.

Helping to nudge me in that direction is the fact that I too seem to be in an "up" period for SB's. Met the girl who flaked on me Sunday night last night for dinner. We have confirmed a FC visit for Friday. Have a M&G tonight with a 29 yo blond 8/8, tattooed, harley riding MILF whose pics look like she should be on the cover of a bike magazine. She has had a SD before and appears ready to go if we agree on sugar. I'm canceling a previously scheduled meet with my regular SB tomorrow (she was just over yesterday) in order to have lunch with a 20 yo first timer, 7/8, white, long brown hair. She has agreed in principle to come back to my place to "hang out" after lunch if we connect. Then I have dinner tomorrow night with a 24 yo latina nursing student / MILF, 7/9, who also says she is new to this but is completely okay with the idea. If I close even 2 of the 4 (and one seems a done deal); then I won't have time, funds, or energy for the UW model. But she is sooo hot!

What say you?[/QUOTE]I love when they say they just want to hang out. But skip the 60 dollar steaks on a first date. Most girls would rather have the cash anyway unless it all about just wining and dining. I always say lets just meet at starbucks.

[QUOTE=HollywoodGuy;2140882]I love when they say they just want to hang out. [/QUOTE]"Hook up" is pretty unambiguous, and I think "hang out" is pretty much the next step down on the euphemism scale for "these kids today!

[QUOTE=HollywoodGuy;2140882] But skip the 60 dollar steaks on a first date. Most girls would rather have the cash anyway unless it all about just wining and dining.[/QUOTE]I think her suggesting this is a SB credit check. Just don't know if I want to pass.

I have tried the SD thing over the years with very little success, but things may have taken a turn recently. I live in a college town (Richmond) and love college age girls but ever since I left the bar business getting college aged girls had been tough. Recently I decided to give SD4 M another try and sent out about 30 emails to girls within 10 miles of my zip code. Looking over the selection, I was very surprised at the number of Asian girls and really good looking white girls (8+ on the scale) in my area. Even more surprising was the 11 fast replies. I booked all 11 for M&Gs and 8 showed; I haven't even bothered to call the no-shows. 3 of the M&Gs turned into motorcycle rides and 1 stayed over. The sex was just Ok that evening but the morning session was a whole different thing. I'm 46 and she's 20. I think she tried to kill me. At this point she is the only one that I've come to a standing arrangement with; her need is very modest (300/ month) with 4 overnights a month and any extra dates include sex- lets call her Tall1. She's 5'11 slender w brown hair and grey / blue eyes. She looks very much like Pippa Middleton but taller. Two days later "The Short1" texted to see if I could take her to dinner; I said "yes, but I'm more horney than hungry, what do you think?" She replied with "I love to fuck after a few drinks and I wouldn't have called if I didn't know the deal". I LOVE broke college girls. She's 22,5'0 blonde w green eyes and built like a cheerleader. She's starting grad school this fall and looking for 1 or 2 SDs to make that easier. We didn't come to a deal but we stayed in a boutique hotel downtown and fucked like it was our job. It was an expensive evening between the room, dinner and many drinks but she was great fun. I have a date with "The Asian1" this weekend and she has already mentioned her friend (another Korean 18 yo) wanted to "hangout" too. God help me and pass the viagra.

[QUOTE=Dsprdo;2140901]"Hook up" is pretty unambiguous, and I think "hang out" is pretty much the next step down on the euphemism scale for "these kids today![/QUOTE]Hooking up is having sex. Some kind of sex. Hanging out can mean no sex. But some SB's as has been discussed here, don't just want to only hook up. If they can't hang out with you they don't want to have sex with you. I am the hangout type with some girls. But only want to hook up with others. So knowing what the possibilities are beyond that, is always helpful.

[QUOTE=Dsprdo;2140904]I think her suggesting this is a SB credit check. Just don't know if I want to pass.[/QUOTE]Every girl has the bar set at some level. I would still try to see her but just redirect the M&G to a different venue. If you are that attracted to her.

[QUOTE=Tidad;2140919]I have tried the SD thing over the years with very little success, but things may have taken a turn recently. I live in a college town (Richmond) and love college age girls but ever since I left the bar business getting college aged girls had been tough. Recently I decided to give SD4 M another try and sent out about 30 emails to girls within 10 miles of my zip code. Looking over the selection, I was very surprised at the number of Asian girls and really good looking white girls (8+ on the scale) in my area. Even more surprising was the 11 fast replies. I booked all 11 for M&Gs and 8 showed; I haven't even bothered to call the no-shows. 3 of the M&Gs turned into motorcycle rides and 1 stayed over. The sex was just Ok that evening but the morning session was a whole different thing. I'm 46 and she's 20. I think she tried to kill me. At this point she is the only one that I've come to a standing arrangement with; her need is very modest (300/ month) with 4 overnights a month and any extra dates include sex- lets call her Tall1. She's 5'11 slender w brown hair and grey / blue eyes. She looks very much like Pippa Middleton but taller. Two days later "The Short1" texted to see if I could take her to dinner; I said "yes, but I'm more horney than hungry, what do you think?" She replied with "I love to fuck after a few drinks and I wouldn't have called if I didn't know the deal". I LOVE broke college girls. She's 22,5'0 blonde w green eyes and built like a cheerleader. She's starting grad school this fall and looking for 1 or 2 SDs to make that easier. We didn't come to a deal but we stayed in a boutique hotel downtown and fucked like it was our job. It was an expensive evening between the room, dinner and many drinks but she was great fun. I have a date with "The Asian1" this weekend and she has already mentioned her friend (another Korean 18 yo) wanted to "hangout" too. God help me and pass the viagra.[/QUOTE]This is how its done. Rack up those numbers. If you have the quantity some quality will be in there. And no one says you have to go on a bad date twice. Outside of sticking to whatever your demographic is, there is really now way to predict chemistry and performance. We all wish their performance was tied to their looks, it would make life a lot easier. The date I had monday looked a lot sexier to me after we did it than before.

Now that I am restricted as to time and money I have gotten blunter and more creative.

My new SB #1 is Asian and very naive sexually. I rocked her world on the FC visit. I hit her with a low monthly allowance and she is OK with 4 + meets / month. So the key to securing a lower price is the emotional involvement. If you have an inexperienced girl and open her eyes (and vagina) to new wonders she will want to see you at almost any price. I am giving her an experience of a lifetime that she will have a hard time beating. In a way it will spoil her for a normal horny 20 something who busts a nutt in 4 strokes. But that is a value all of us give our young girls.

Pot # 2 is a 20 + yr old White 7/9/? . She needs money and when asked what her expectations are she said $ 3 to 500 . I countered $ and she agreed. So asking price doesn't always mean anything. I will have to get a Roach motel for the deed at another $50 ,but she looks delicious.

Pot #1 is super hot and ready to go to the FC and told me to give her whatever??

FB is back and will go to the FC for a quickie. But there is value in getting a nutt inside a slim tight baby. There is no emotional connection so she is just an UTR I guess.

Having fully explored the monger hobby for about 15 years, I quit about 10 years ago for various reasons. Recently I discovered the Sugar Bowl, and after spending about 10 hours reading this forum I decided to participate about 4 weeks ago.

My experience thus far:

I opened a account on SA, created a introductory email template and emailed about 50 SB based on location and recent profiles, and received about 6 responses and was able to schedule 2 M&Gs.

M&G 1: 30 years old MILF that is recently divorced and in my book a solid 8/8, she was very open about her life and told me that she had a SD for 4 months that recently ended. We mutually decided to meet again at a hotel in a few days. After the M&G we texted back and forth and she mentioned the financials, I asked her how the last arrangement worked. She informed me that she met about 4 times per month and financial assistance ranged around $$$ per meeting. We met at a hotel had a few drinks and fun for 3 hours, the total damage was about $$ including hotel drinks and M&G cost.

M&G 2: 26 year old college girl who also recently lost her SD. I rated her about 6/7 but her personality was not to my liking. A bit to hyper. She is looking for someone to pay her rent and expenses of $1200 per month. I politely ended the meeting and via email told her I had found someone already.

POT 1: Apparently she is new to SA, and wants to discuss my budget before we have a M&G. She claims to have multiple SD offers but all below her expectations. I respond with 1 K per month budget, haven't hear back yet.

My initial observations is that the Sugar bowl: Consumes a considerable amount of time, lots of SBs having high expectations, the responses from UTR girls seem to be easier to get.

I will post a list of questions and observations soon.

[QUOTE=CuriosIt;2141295]Interesting to see this from the other side. I consider myself UTR and not SB. I have 1 that I see about 4 times a month for $$$ each time, regardless of whether it is an hour or 3 hours or overnight. BUT I also see other people here and there as well. Most of them repeats, but not what I would classify a "regular" thing. Personally, if I found another 2 regulars I'd not see anyone else.[/QUOTE]Truth in advertising is good Curiosit! Many SBs we all see are UTR and we just don't know that they are seeing others. I would rather know and make the decision whether I am OK with that or not. I like a nice blend between naivte and skill. I like to feel like I can show my SB something that she has not had in the same way before.

[QUOTE=Latex;2141197]
My initial observations is that the Sugar bowl: Consumes a considerable amount of time, lots of SBs having high expectations, the responses from UTR girls seem to be easier to get. [/QUOTE]Considerable amount of time is right! That's the one part of it that I don't miss during my leaves of absence from the bowl. I usually aim for the true SBs and sidestep the UTRs as much as possible. As you said, they are harder, so that of course lowers the quantity, increases the amount of time required, and increases the risk of something else going sideways like the chemistry not being right.

This is why I don't even try to approach the SB's with a "how much per fuck?" game plan -- I try to remove the transactional aspect as much as possible. The problem is most of the true SBs would either not respond to a "how much" question or would quote ridiculous (500,1000, 1500 etc) per date expectations, so why bother. It's better to meet them and try to drum up the natural chemistry, throw a few drinks down their throat and try to get them motivated to get in bed thinking about the act rather than the payment. That way whatever I gift them at the end always ends up being well-received. I don't think I force myself to pay these girls what they would quote me if I asked.

On the other hand, if you want lots of girls with less hassle, honing skills identifying UTRs is probably the way to go. There are times when I wish I had a list of fallback options for the slow nights, but with the time window of my once-a-year SB season, I really only get one opportunity to present who I am and what I'm looking for to each girl.

[QUOTE=FredMoore;2141684]Truth in advertising is good Curiosit! Many SBs we all see are UTR and we just don't know that they are seeing others. I would rather know and make the decision whether I am OK with that or not. I like a nice blend between naivte and skill. I like to feel like I can show my SB something that she has not had in the same way before.[/QUOTE]My experience with women has been mostly that you have to assume they are fucking someone else unless they live with you and you really know where they are and what they are doing at all times. A true SB might have other SDs that she may or may not admit, or just banging dudes her age.

So I wouldn't say an SB is a UTR just because she has other SDs. I think what differentiates an SB from a UTR is how selective she is and whether money is her only selection criteria. Although I might say that if there is really such a thing as an exclusive UTR, it might be fair to say she is gravitating toward the behavior of a real SB just by the fact she is exclusive, because that means she has selectively chosen to fuck only one guy -- unless she has been a UTR escort at one point prior, I'd say she is more SB than UTR in that particular case.

In other words I think it's a safe assumption that even if you have an SB who says she's exclusive, she's fucking someone else whether it's an SD or just one of her boyfriends and just not telling you about it. Some women in the civy dating world are above that, but in general women lie so in order to prevent feeling like a chump it's safer to assume they will or do cheat.

It's fair play though, most of us are cheating too when we do this.

But I know. Individual semantics are what they are. I just like to categorize the girls and distinguish them clearly because to me it greatly defines their worth. I wouldn't want to gift a UTR girl at the same rate I would gift a true SB.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2141706]My experience with women has been mostly that you have to assume they are fucking someone else unless they live with you and you really know where they are and what they are doing at all times. A true SB might have other SDs that she may or may not admit, or just banging dudes her age.

So I wouldn't say an SB is a UTR just because she has other SDs. I think what differentiates an SB from a UTR is how selective she is and whether money is her only selection criteria. Although I might say that if there is really such a thing as an exclusive UTR, it might be fair to say she is gravitating toward the behavior of a real SB just by the fact she is exclusive, because that means she has selectively chosen to fuck only one guy -- unless she has been a UTR escort at one point prior, I'd say she is more SB than UTR in that particular case.

In other words I think it's a safe assumption that even if you have an SB who says she's exclusive, she's fucking someone else whether it's an SD or just one of her boyfriends and just not telling you about it. Some women in the civy dating world are above that, but in general women lie so in order to prevent feeling like a chump it's safer to assume they will or do cheat.

It's fair play though, most of us are cheating too when we do this.

But I know. Individual semantics are what they are. I just like to categorize the girls and distinguish them clearly because to me it greatly defines their worth. I wouldn't want to gift a UTR girl at the same rate I would gift a true SB.[/QUOTE]I have to say I disagree. I only consider girls that are with one guy at a time an SB. More than one they go to UTR status. Maybe being single and having some flexibility at work lets me dig deeper into what these girls are doing on their own time. If you see anyone more than once a week and for weeks or months at a time you are going to know what's going on. I have people doubt my ability to judge these situations correctly all the time. But I am usually pretty right on and don't get in denial. But of course I am always on the lookout and always investigating. Could I be fooled. Sure. But I really don't think I am and usually have no trouble getting the truth out of any girl as far as who and how many or is it really exclusive.

A few days ago I met a potential SB who, during a couple days of emailing back and forth, stated many times that she was totally single, had not had sex for ages and was up for some FC fun. We met for lunch and decided we should take it to the next stage. Up in the hotel room we proceeded to act like animals in heat to the point where I flipped her over onto her stomach with the intent of taking her from behind. Much to my curiosity, there appeared to be bruises that matched the pattern of two hands on both cheeks of her ass. In fact, when I grabbed her cute butt cheeks with my hands it was like a perfect fit with the bruising. I also noticed what looked like a bite mark on her left shoulder near the back of her neck.

I was all in at that point and she, like so many other SBs I've met, told me she likes it rough and not to be afraid to bite her. WTF? How do I end up with these types? LOL Anyway after the fireworks had gone off for both of us we were laying there just sort of cooling off when I asked her casually if it had been as good as the last time she had fcked. With the most straight- poker tournament winning- face she told me the last time she had fckd was Christmas and that she felt like it was Christmas all over again. You know what? If I hadn't seen the bruises I would have believed her as well. At least I didn't drink the previous Christmas's eggnog! One and done.