"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

" Now that I've resolved myself to getting some on the side, I'm happier, she's happier, our relationship is better and to be honest I don't see much of a reason for our relationship to end. Assuming I don't get caught. " Dog Sun.

Welcome Brother Dog. Your experience is usually what brings us all to the cheating side of town. Inadequate, infrequent or boring sex. If only women would look the other way and allow us the leeway to satisfy our cravings there would be a lot less divorces and a lot happier marriages. It is pretty clear from relationship studies that the excitement phase (lust) of most new couples lasts 1 to 2 years, but at that point of maturation a deeper more satisfying bonding ensues (supposedly) . Some are able to maintain a high level of excitement but most are not. Therefore many couples have poor sex lives and struggle forever until the frustration is too great. Once we discover the world of sugaring, we realize that life without sex is no longer necessary and off the reservation we go. Most of us need to change sugar partners every 4 to 6 months due to staleness of sex with the same person. Sex alone is exciting but in the absence of other attractions it is not enough.

So, wives for life, SBs for sex! Amen!

[QUOTE=FredMoore;2113557]" Now that I've resolved myself to getting some on the side, I'm happier, she's happier, our relationship is better and to be honest I don't see much of a reason for our relationship to end. Assuming I don't get caught. " Dog Sun.

Welcome Brother Dog. Your experience is usually what brings us all to the cheating side of town. Inadequate, infrequent or boring sex. If only women would look the other way and allow us the leeway to satisfy our cravings there would be a lot less divorces and a lot happier marriages. It is pretty clear from relationship studies that the excitement phase (lust) of most new couples lasts 1 to 2 years, but at that point of maturation a deeper more satisfying bonding ensues (supposedly) . Some are able to maintain a high level of excitement but most are not. Therefore many couples have poor sex lives and struggle forever until the frustration is too great. Once we discover the world of sugaring, we realize that life without sex is no longer necessary and off the reservation we go. Most of us need to change sugar partners every 4 to 6 months due to staleness of sex with the same person. Sex alone is exciting but in the absence of other attractions it is not enough.

So, wives for life, SBs for sex! Amen![/QUOTE]I'm as red-blooded an American as you can find. With that said, I travel a lot and I have to say Europeans got a few things over on us old Americans. The wives in Europe will actually approve of their hubbies having a mistress. It's common practice. They typically have two rules, "don't bring it home and don't knock her up. " and they prefer not to have it in their face. A sort of denial thing. In France, Germany, Italy and such, it is as common as a second family car. Although perhaps not cheered about, men discuss their mistresses with their male coworkers around the water cooler. It's not a big deal. And most still cherish and love their wives and provide for them, but these cultures have accepted facts of life we Americans still tend to be in denial about.

[QUOTE=DogSun;2113510]I've read all the posts on how this lifestyle has negatively impacted your relationships with the wife / gf, but my experience has been the exact opposite.

<snipped for brevity>

Assuming I don't get caught.[/QUOTE]It's that last sentence that's really the operative statement.

For the most part your situation is very similar to mine, except I haven't been denied sex in my relationship. She is not as sexual a person as I am or girls I've dated in the past, but it's fine enough and she's there when I need it. I'm the type that always craves variety, but I can control my craving well enough simply because I've been with enough women during my civy dating years that I've got kind of a sense of BTDT. I've come to realize that for every woman that's perfect in bed, there is some aspect to her that makes her intolerable as a partner for me. Some of the best fucks I've had were the ones that I couldn't get far enough away from after I blew my load. And naturally that's not a good trait in any sort of long-term partner, so for someone I'm going to spend lots of time around I need not only someone physically attractive but also pleasant to be around and hang out with. Much harder to find than a good fuck.

I spoke before about it taking me a full month to get back to the point of being an attentive partner to my GF. It was not because I can't handle fucking lots of random hot girls. I've been there before and while I didn't have the maturity to take it all at face value without getting addicted when I was younger, I do now. However what happened during my last SB season was different. The last SB I hooked up with had so much going on (not only perfect looks, great sex etc.) but she also exhibited the GF-like traits I mentioned above, and set off my "LTR material" alarm in a way that probably only 1% of the sugarbabies out there could ever do. By that I mean I can meet and bang hot women all day long, but it's not really that often that I meet girls that are half my age, yet exhibit maturity and intelligence of someone my age, that love sex, and not only movie-star in their looks but also (and here's the key. Compatible with me. My own personality is hard to match up with, and the fact that she was able to really left me in sort of a mind fuck.

So, I hope you never meet that rare SB that both rocks your world but has you looking at your current GF in a different light, but if you do I think you'll relate to the perils I've mentioned.

And yes, whatever you do, don't get caught. Meeting an SB that leaves you feeling mind-fucked is one thing but the feeling fades soon enough. Getting caught cheating leaves deep scars and often some level of irreparable relationship damage.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2113598]

So, I hope you never meet that rare SB that both rocks your world but has you looking at your current GF in a different light, but if you do I think you'll relate to the perils I've mentioned.

And yes, whatever you do, don't get caught. Meeting an SB that leaves you feeling mind-fucked is one thing but the feeling fades soon enough. Getting caught cheating leaves deep scars and often some level of irreparable relationship damage.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the input Jeez. When I first met my gf, I was head over heels for her. She was and still is everything I wanted in a woman (with the exception of the sex obviously.) The fact is, my crazy desire for her has worn off at this point, much like it does in EVERY relationship after a certain period of time. We've settled into the comfort phase. We love each other, but the crazy, almost obsessive in-love feelings are gone. I have enough experience with relationships to know that this always happens in every relationship. Luckily for me, I'm still able to think predominantly with my intellect as opposed to my dick or my emotions, so even if this rare sb does come along, I'm very confident I'll be able to check myself and realize that even if this sb is rocking my world right now, those feelings are going to end at some point.

And fortunately for me, my work and home situation is very conducive to not getting caught. We live seperately, and I own my own business which allows me to work from home. Me and the gf probably only see each other 3-4 times per week, which gives me plenty of opportunity to play without too much fear.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2113352]Since it seems there is some agreement that there is a lot of value in a dedicated SD / SB forum, any thoughts on how best to request a SD section under "special interests" rather than states and cities, and collectively begin moving discussions into more organized discussions by topic that would be easier to follow (and easier to re-locate and reference old posts on a particular topic later)? I know there is an amateur section there now, but in my mind SD / SB is really its own genre or genre of sexual pursuit.

The more I think about the benefits of this rather than one massive sequential thread under the Richmond VA forum, the more it strikes me as a much-needed action.[/QUOTE]I think we can try posting here:

[URL]http://www.usasexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3821-Suggest-New-Topics-Here[/URL]

And hope the admin sees it and considers it. After reading the new posts, I think discreet hobbying would be a good sub-topic where we can discuss our tools and methods to keeping things smooth at home.

[QUOTE=Dolato;2113682]I think we can try posting here:

[URL]http://www.usasexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3821-Suggest-New-Topics-Here[/URL]

And hope the admin sees it and considers it. After reading the new posts, I think discreet hobbying would be a good sub-topic where we can discuss our tools and methods to keeping things smooth at home.[/QUOTE]Thanks, I have posted the request. Please chime in for support on post #50 at the above link if you would like to see our own topic here. I believe it will help cut down on redundant discussion and benefit us all overall by making our posts easier to organize and reference at a later date.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2113445]Well I'm all in favor of anything that boosts female to male ratio, whether in the SD scene or any other scenario, but I guess I don't feel that organizing this thread would draw more men to the bowl any more than it would increase the male population of the Richmond area.

Men with sex addictions are going to be drawn to this site eventually anyway. Not everyone has the disposable income to be an SD, nor does everyone want to be. Some guys who find themselves low on motivation to exercise and eat right would be better off with escorts anyway, so if you look at the number of guys that access this forum and compare the ratio of SDs to mainstream hobbyists I think the SD population is relatively small.

I don't know, maybe I'm wrong about what would result, but I can't envision that having a dedicated forum puts us any higher on anyones radar than the subject line "Sugarbabies" showing up in the recent post summary as often as it does.[/QUOTE]Perhaps I'm in the minority, but I prefer to keep this topic in Richmond's backyard. It's off the beaten path a bit, which helps keep the noise down and quality high. Yes new posts appear on the front page, but there's 500 - 1000 posts a day on this site. So you have to be an active member on this site to find it and you need to know where to look to find it again.

We're also pretty open with our experiences (which BTW carries its own risks). We're from all over the country, but by having it in a sub-forum based from a modest sized southern city, it makes it harder for a casual observer to stumble on to these SB reports and start connecting dots on someone. They would have to know where to look. For the casual observer we're all in Richmond, Virgina not in their backyard so they'll skim over the topic.

So I'll probably keep posting in the Richmond topic just because I don't like making certain types of posts in the glaring spotlight. Perhaps I'm being paranoid, but having a public structured sugar baby forum and sub-forums would attract a lot of attention and potentially from some sugar babies themselves.

[QUOTE=DogSun;2113510]
Now that I've resolved myself to getting some on the side, I'm happier, she's happier, our relationship is better and to be honest I don't see much of a reason for our relationship to end. Assuming I don't get caught.[/QUOTE]First off, I totally agree with what you're doing because I'm more or less in the same boat as you. I'm a big believer as Fred put it "Wives for Life, SBs for Sex", LOL. It's tacitly accepted in a lot of cultures.

That said, even though you're happier, you haven't actually fixed the relationship. You basically put a band-aid on it. If your SO was accepting of you getting your sex needs elsewhere because she couldn't provide it and you came to an agreement, then it would be truly fixed. But as you said, if you get caught, the whole thing crashes down.

I usually don't comment on another man's marriage because who am I to give advice? But it does seem you truly love your SO and value the relationship. You're not just hanging on for the assets and kids like some of us. Sugaring is a very high risk activity, in terms of how it affects a marriage the great majority of the time it doesn't end well. I'm at the point with my marriage where it's not the end of the world if I got divorced, so if at some point I make a fatal mistake with my sugar activities and I'm exposed I'll be able to accept it and move on. Also my SO is a foreigner, so she has the European view on mistresses, so even if I'm exposed I could probably bounce back providing I didn't rub it in her face or get someone knocked up. But if you highly value your relationship and your SO would be absolutely devastated if she found out you were cheating, then I would tread extremely careful. Because often times there's no going back with certain women after they're aware they've been cheated on. But if you get the vibe that she might be a little ambivalent toward mistresses and such, then you're probably in a good spot. Another thing you could try is bringing up the idea of an open relationship or try a swinging event. I've been jealous of those guys who've managed to get their long-term SO into an open relationship, understanding that our sexual needs crave variety and freshness, yet still holding on to the companionship of a long time partner.

[QUOTE=JohnGSmith;2113965]Perhaps I'm in the minority, but I prefer to keep this topic in Richmond's backyard. It's off the beaten path a bit, which helps keep the noise down and quality high. Yes new posts appear on the front page, but there's 500 - 1000 posts a day on this site. So you have to be an active member on this site to find it and you need to know where to look to find it again.

We're also pretty open with our experiences (which BTW carries its own risks). We're from all over the country, but by having it in a sub-forum based from a modest sized southern city, it makes it harder for a casual observer to stumble on to these SB reports and start connecting dots on someone. They would have to know where to look. For the casual observer we're all in Richmond, Virgina not in their backyard so they'll skim over the topic.

So I'll probably keep posting in the Richmond topic just because I don't like making certain types of posts in the glaring spotlight. Perhaps I'm being paranoid, but having a public structured sugar baby forum and sub-forums would attract a lot of attention and potentially from some sugar babies themselves.[/QUOTE]Wasn't quite sure what you mean about needing to be an active member to find posts. If you launch a browser in private mode (forgets any of your login cookie), launch the root site and click on Frequent Members enter here, you'll see the recent reports list, and "sugarbabies" almost always has an entry there, and actually stands out because the quotes. Where to look (Richmond) is also listed and linked in that same list, so even if they miss it one day they are sure to catch it the next time they even try to pay attention. I don't mean to come off as disagreeable here but I wanted to be sure we were talking about the same thing, because most web sites have multiple ways of entry.

I won't be bothered in the least if other folks don't have an interest in creation of the new topic. To be honest I do not want to be the front-runner of that effort and I do not have time to play as any sort of volunteer moderator, as I admittedly don't even read all the daily posts here (although I try to, I miss some. I'm only guaranteed to have read any post I write a response to. LOL). I just think that there are lots of sub-discussions and since none of us are ever going to remember everything that's written in the current format or even remotely be able to keep track of who said what, I thought it would be nice to get it in a format to handle the volume better. If not, that's fine too.

As far as awareness of the SD / SB hobby, I do want to point out that there is not a talk show on national network television that does not mention by name sites like SA, SD4 ME etc. Everybody knows about this hobby. Whether or not someone makes a conscious effort to join the hobby is something different. One of my SB's already alerted me to the fact that these SBs do at times discuss and review us (according to her anyway) comparing notes, so there is pretty much no escape there. I suspect we are probably more prolific with our information sharing than they are, but I've met a number of girls on there who were friends with other girls I was talking to on there (hell, it was their friend who talked them into trying the site), yet NONE of them told me they knew each other, I discovered it via Facebook research and seeing each other on their friends list. I saw a show on 20/20 or one of those programs not long ago about a website where women rate guys, giving their full name, discussing what a jerk they are, posting photos, etc. Even providing links to the guys Facebook account. This is one of the reasons none of my SBs have ever known my real name and I highly recommend other SDs with anything to lose practice the same level of covertness.

Anyway, I fully understand if folks prefer to keep posting here. I am only a seasonal SD and I probably get more than I give from this thread alone. It's really more of an entertainment source for me than something that really affects how I do things. I enjoy hearing others' experiences but I don't think my interactions with women have changed that much since I was in high school. The Internet has just made it all a little bit more efficient, especially for rapid out of town hookups.

STDs and unprotected sex have been discussed here, but if anyone specifically talked about the possibility of getting throat cancer from eating pussy (HPV) then I missed it. I figure Michael Douglas had access to some pretty high quality pussy, so it's not like it's a threat only streetwalker mongers need to be aware of. I've eaten an awful lot of pussy in my days, and that includes my SBs. Every one of them. I would never go down on a known pro in a million years, but a lot of guys do, even guys who won't put their schlong in it without a condom for fear of STDs. Does it matter that throat cancer from DATY via HPV potentially as bad if not worse than as getting HIV. Maybe there hasn't been enough in the media about it to scare folks off? Personally this tends to concern me more than most other STD exposure types, personally. Maybe I'm just weird.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2114052]STDs and unprotected sex have been discussed here, but if anyone specifically talked about the possibility of getting throat cancer from eating pussy (HPV) then I missed it. I figure Michael Douglas had access to some pretty high quality pussy, so it's not like it's a threat only streetwalker mongers need to be aware of. I've eaten an awful lot of pussy in my days, and that includes my SBs. Every one of them. I would never go down on a known pro in a million years, but a lot of guys do, even guys who won't put their schlong in it without a condom for fear of STDs. Does it matter that throat cancer from DATY via HPV potentially as bad if not worse than as getting HIV. Maybe there hasn't been enough in the media about it to scare folks off? Personally this tends to concern me more than most other STD exposure types, personally. Maybe I'm just weird.[/QUOTE]There is good evidence that an ingredient in ordinary toothpaste, sodium dodecyl sulphate can kill the HPV virus, so brushing your teeth after DATY may be a good practice. . google it.

I'm not sure what the benefit of a new thread is, but I'm happy having everything in one place. There is a thread on Performance enhancers and I like going there from time to time so I don't have to dig back through the posts. Maybe the answer is searching by title within this thread.

DATY: I will dine at that table for ever. How sweet it is! (usually).

Re: the Richmond market, I would rather rename it the generic Sugarbabies not associated with us here. I am worried that local girls might recognize the stories about themselves and be able to identify us. Perhaps it is not a good idea to let it be know what state / city we each are in. But that train has left the station unfortunately.

Completely concur -- at first it seemed a good idea. But with these thoughts I agree it is better UTR.

[QUOTE=JohnGSmith;2113965]Perhaps I'm in the minority, but I prefer to keep this topic in Richmond's backyard. It's off the beaten path a bit, which helps keep the noise down and quality high. Yes new posts appear on the front page, but there's 500 - 1000 posts a day on this site. So you have to be an active member on this site to find it and you need to know where to look to find it again.

We're also pretty open with our experiences (which BTW carries its own risks). We're from all over the country, but by having it in a sub-forum based from a modest sized southern city, it makes it harder for a casual observer to stumble on to these SB reports and start connecting dots on someone. They would have to know where to look. For the casual observer we're all in Richmond, Virgina not in their backyard so they'll skim over the topic.

So I'll probably keep posting in the Richmond topic just because I don't like making certain types of posts in the glaring spotlight. Perhaps I'm being paranoid, but having a public structured sugar baby forum and sub-forums would attract a lot of attention and potentially from some sugar babies themselves.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FredMoore;2114228]I'm not sure what the benefit of a new thread is, but I'm happy having everything in one place. There is a thread on Performance enhancers and I like going there from time to time so I don't have to dig back through the posts. Maybe the answer is searching by title within this thread.

DATY: I will dine at that table for ever. How sweet it is! (usually).

Re: the Richmond market, I would rather rename it the generic Sugarbabies not associated with us here. I am worried that local girls might recognize the stories about themselves and be able to identify us. Perhaps it is not a good idea to let it be know what state / city we each are in. But that train has left the station unfortunately.[/QUOTE]About the new thread and Richmond. I can see how folks outside of Richmond would like it to remain here as it detaches them a little in terms of future evidence for the SO, and folks in the Richmond market would probably rather the thread be detached from their primary city. As far as benefits there are a number of benefits I see:

1 - Right now there are a lot of other SB threads popping up in other cities. Some of those have posters that don't post here at all, yet they have good ideas, stories or relevant news article to share. If we stick to following this thread we never see them or benefit from the knowledge exchange.

2 - Even worse, I'm afraid the SDs in other cities that are not here yet will start posting here and it will just increase sequential traffic to a single thread, which will only make the thread even more difficult to follow. Once the volume hits a certain level in a single thread, things get really rough to keep up with because there's just no division or organization of information. It becomes a big cluster fuck where, when you do respond to someone's post, it ends up landing several dozen posts down and several pages away from the original message it was replying to.

3 - When I first started participating in this thread, I was wondering what some of the terms like nando 1 meant, and someone wisely suggested I catch up on the history of terminology that's been posted here. So I tried to do that. Yeah right. Like finding a needle in a haystack. I eventually figured out what I need to know but searching for specifics like that in this thread is next to impossible.

4 - Some have said they are afraid a dedicated thread that puts us too high on the radar. I personally believe that because of some of the features of this site, having a gazillion different SB threads across multiple cities actually makes the hobby higher on the radar than tucking all SD discussions into a single thread which can be branched off into sub-topics such as Addiction, Pricing, Hiding the hobby from the SO, New SD sites, Anecdotal Stories from M&G to the FC, etc.

A couple weeks ago there were comments about the status of the females. I discovered yesterday that my newest favorite is also married. So, for 2014 the totals are 2 models, single and way too high maintenance (and mediocre sex) to be married, 2 engaged, and 4 married. Of those, 2 married and one engaged have been regulars, multiple visits per month.

So. Just food for thought as to why your SO is not looking real hard at what you do, or caring that the browser's cookies are being cleaned. She might be getting what she wants from me, or someone like us. It certainly became clear to me in the civi world when I word got out that I was getting divorced 10 years ago that married women cheat just as much as men. They would show up in the middle of the day and all they were interested in was hot sweaty sex. Sound familiar? I know some of you have a thng about that, but being someone that is in the bowl because I like BB sex, the married and engaged ones almost always have the birth control thing taken care of.