"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

Hi Guys! With all the talk about pics and SBs I ran into a rarity this week. Generally I don't ask for picks before a M&G but always appreciate it if they offer them. I had one I was texting with recently who only sent me face pics. I could tell she was probably a little heavy, but I don't mind a little thickness if the price is right and she has a pretty face. We had the M&G set and I was just texting her details when she texts back "I'm a little nervous, I'm not exactly skinny and I'm afraid you won't like me". She attached a full length pic and she was waaay beyond what even I find acceptable for weight. I don't see how she could describe herself as "average" on SA, LOL I texted her back declining our M&G as diplomatically as possible. I told her I appreciated her honesty... And I really did.

Good Hunting,

Travelin.

[QUOTE=TravelinSD;2080289]Hi Guys! With all the talk about pics and SBs I ran into a rarity this week. Generally I don't ask for picks before a M&G but always appreciate it if they offer them. I had one I was texting with recently who only sent me face pics. I could tell she was probably a little heavy, but I don't mind a little thickness if the price is right and she has a pretty face. We had the M&G set and I was just texting her details when she texts back "I'm a little nervous, I'm not exactly skinny and I'm afraid you won't like me". She attached a full length pic and she was waaay beyond what even I find acceptable for weight. I don't see how she could describe herself as "average" on SA, LOL I texted her back declining our M&G as diplomatically as possible. I told her I appreciated her honesty... And I really did.

Good Hunting,

Travelin.[/QUOTE]SD4 M choices.

Slim. Most are, but if they are AA they might be more athletic.

Athletic. Could be in great shape up to thick but firm.

Average. Usually at least 20 lbs overweight.

Ample. Confusing because many girl relate this word to bust size not body size.

Cuddly. Always overweight.

Very cuddly. Grossly overweight.

Nationwide the average height and weight of the american woman is 5' 4" and 162 lbs. So at least 40 lbs overweight.

I would imagine the average height and weight of a viable SB is closer to.

5' 4' and 125 to 132 lbs. Even at 132 she would have to be an athlete not to be overweight.

I have a scale in my dining room that every girl has to step on, no exceptions.

A booty call girl I recently met was 5'8' and 135. Not a spinner, just average and tight. Saw her a few days ago, she says i gotta weigh myself. She was at 140 and so happy because she is trying to gain weight especially in her butt. Very common with a lot of girls watching too many music videos and thinking all guys want nikki minaj/ kim kardashian shaped girls. Remember when dating spinners to always comment on how perfect their body is (tell them over and over and over). Many have low self esteem due to so many haters telling them they are anorexic. My 5'4" and 105 MILF recently told me she wanted to go up to 120. I told her that would be a real turn off for me. In general society, spinners are out and big booty girls are in.

I have been a spinner lover since high school. Back then I was sometimes ashamed (and even stopped seeing girls) as I knew my friends were into big boobs and butts and i didnt want to hear their comments. After HS all that changed and I have never looked back. if you have a spinner never stop telling her how perfect she is because the pressure is on her to gain weight. I call it the Oprahfication of America. Once she made it OK to be fat, many women just gave up. Thank god I live in L.A. where thin is OK. But in the AA and Hispanic communities the pressure to be thick in all the right places is overwhelming.

[QUOTE=TravelinSD;2080289]Hi Guys! With all the talk about pics and SBs I ran into a rarity this week. Generally I don't ask for picks before a M&G but always appreciate it if they offer them. I had one I was texting with recently who only sent me face pics. I could tell she was probably a little heavy, but I don't mind a little thickness if the price is right and she has a pretty face. We had the M&G set and I was just texting her details when she texts back "I'm a little nervous, I'm not exactly skinny and I'm afraid you won't like me". She attached a full length pic and she was waaay beyond what even I find acceptable for weight. I don't see how she could describe herself as "average" on SA, LOL I texted her back declining our M&G as diplomatically as possible. I told her I appreciated her honesty... And I really did.

Good Hunting,

Travelin.[/QUOTE]I find MOST of the women on SA that describe themselves as "average", and don't provide a full body pic, are FAT. Plain and simple. Personally, I pass them by. They are either in denial or have no concept of what average is. Unless it's me. Perhaps "average" is now fat and I am just living in the past.....

Good thing you were able to bail out before the M&G. It's just too uncomfortable to sit there with a girl who you do not find attractive because she is bigger than you thought she would be. I had that happen 5 years ago. It was hard to tell her that I liked talking to her but I cannot get intimate with her. She didn't take it very well...

NEXT!

[QUOTE=HollywoodGuy;2080350]SD4 M choices.

Slim. Most are, but if they are AA they might be more athletic.

Athletic. Could be in great shape up to thick but firm.

Average. Usually at least 20 lbs overweight.

Ample. Confusing because many girl relate this word to bust size not body size.

Cuddly. Always overweight.

Very cuddly. Grossly overweight.

Nationwide the average height and weight of the american woman is 5' 4" and 162 lbs. So at least 40 lbs overweight.

I would imagine the average height and weight of a viable SB is closer to.

5' 4' and 132 lbs. Even at 132 she would have to be an athlete not to be overweight.

I have a scale in my dining room that every girl has to step on, no exceptions.[/QUOTE]I like that. I'm going to get a small scale I can keep in the trunk of my car and take into the no tell. I'll let you guys know how that works out for me...

[QUOTE=HollywoodGuy;2080350]In general society, spinners are out and big booty girls are in.
I have been a spinner lover since high school. Even then I was sometimes ashamed (and even stopped seeing girls) as I knew my friends were into big boobs and butts. After HS all that changed and I have never looked back. if you have a spinner never stop telling her how perfect she is.[/QUOTE]Whenever women say something to me like "they're trying to gain weight in their butt", I always think it's more or less to get a feel for whether I will still like them if they add a few trips to Taco Bell per week to their current diet. Now most of the black guys I know tend to like a lot more junk in the trunk than I do, but I always tell the girls if they want to know the overall attractiveness standard, take a look at the top-paid (or top-sought after) porn stars at any given time and try to imitate their shape and they can't go wrong. Typically the Riley Reid type draws a lot more clicks than Kim Kardashian types, but every dude has their own preferences so girls should target their weight depending on what they are looking for.

[QUOTE=JeezLizard;2080379]Whenever women say something to me like "they're trying to gain weight in their butt", I always think it's more or less to get a feel for whether I will still like them if they add a few trips to Taco Bell per week to their current diet. Now most of the black guys I know tend to like a lot more junk in the trunk than I do, but I always tell the girls if they want to know the overall attractiveness standard, take a look at the top-paid (or top-sought after) porn stars at any given time and try to imitate their shape and they can't go wrong. Typically the Riley Reid type draws a lot more clicks than Kim Kardashian types, but every dude has their own preferences so girls should target their weight depending on what they are looking for.[/QUOTE]Most true spinners are genetically predisposed to be what I call hard gainers. Forget the druggies. They are typically what's called skinny fat. No muscle tone at all. The truth is the only way to get a bigger butt (and not get bigger everywhere else) is to work out. Boobs are all fat. And all pro fitness models have fake boobs as their body fat % makes it impossible to have even normal sized boobs. Anyway, the point is. Praise your spinner daily as she is hearing 10 x more comments in the opposite direction.

[QUOTE=HollywoodGuy;2080393]Most true spinners are genetically predisposed to be what I call hard gainers. Forget the druggies. They are typically what's called skinny fat. No muscle tone at all. The truth is the only way to get a bigger butt (and not get bigger everywhere else) is to work out. Boobs are all fat. And all pro fitness models have fake boobs as their body fat % makes it impossible to have even normal sized boobs. Anyway, the point is. Praise your spinner daily as she is hearing 10 x more comments in the opposite direction.[/QUOTE]

See I like softness in a woman (up to a point of course). To me soft is feminine, hard is masculine. I don't want my lady to have veins bulging out of their neck and I feel sorry for those girls who feel empowered by reaching that level of fitness, because it might be attractive to some, but if some were the majority the porn industry would be flooded with female Lou Ferrignos and its not. When I see women like that I think they probably have a big schlong. I love spinners if they are fit, but the shorter they are, the more they need to be aware that even a few extra pounds can make a big difference. This is usually not a problem for the college age girl just trying to get by, but once they get a more comfortable lifestyle then look out if they are short. Oddly I find Asian girls to be an exception to this at times, since sometimes even the short ones seem to maintain their overall figure even to very mature age. Why the other races at same height tend to go full blown Ben & Jerrys syndrome is beyond me.

My first "official" SB (by that I mean we labeled each other as an SD / SB arrangement the night we met, but of course I'd "helped" girls before that and received help in exchange...) was a 20 year old dancer about 5'4", not really athletic by any means but slim and shapely, long legs and perfect ass. She'd already had a kid but did it young and had the height and overall genetic disposition to bounce back to the point where you'd never know (and I mean zero stretch marks or signs of elasticity). At her height and overall genetic shape she had a decent margin to gain or lose weight before anyone would notice. If a girl is 5'0" then an extra 4 lbs makes a big difference. That's hard for most of us guys to imagine. 4 lbs is probably the inbound weight of what I had for lunch and dinner combined, and I will work it all off before morning just squirming in bed thinking about sex and / or stressing about work. I would have to gain probably 20 lbs before someone close to me even noticed, and 40 lbs before coworkers started to ask me if I'm still working out or not.

4 lbs is a lot on a spinner, and 20 lbs is a hell of a lot on a woman of any size I'd be interested in fucking. My advice to them all is that less is more. Like I said I like softness, so I like a bit of cushion to grab onto and when I'm doggie styling I don't want for one second to feel like I'm gripping a lean muscular man-ass. But it seems easier to put weight on these girls than to force a fat chick to look good. At the end of it all, if they swallow enough of my load they will get a decent protein serving.

It really comes down to the girl, though. I've known a couple of waif-like frail girls that were really sexual and it was a turn on in an odd way. Honestly if it came down to anorexia vs. Obesity, I'd take the skinny chicks without hesitation.

Went on two meet and greets tonite. Remember I always make my offer of $ upfront and get confirmation prior to meeting anyone.

I was mad at my ATF so I looked for the prettiest BBW to just get a slam dunk HE or maybe a BJ and call it a night. I meet her at a coffee shop and within 5 minutes she tells me she is looking for an allowance. That was a fast date.

Called the next one. A super hot 19 year old. After I pick her up we talk in the car and she says she wants $$ for a quick fuck and covered and no BJ. She was so pretty I talked to her for 2 hours and then dropped her off.

So no money spent, got 2 girls off my list and went home.

Last week, partially due to my reading this thread, I joined SA and began the process of finding a SB. Perhaps a little background, 56, Divorced for a year this coming June. I live within a couple hours of Las Vegas and arranged my first M+G at the Mandalay Bay Resort. I had been texting with my first potential SB for the last 3 days and, being a coward, had not requested any definitive photo proving the SB actually looked like the photos she had sent me in addition to her profile photos.

Running a bit late because of Vegas traffic, I had called her to update my arrival time and asked her to suggest a restaurant at Mandalay Bay to meet at. Her response was to say " I don't really need to eat as I've got about 20 lbs to lose right now" Now, this SB is a UNLV student standing at 5'3". It didn't take an Einstein or my rapidly shrinking penis to visualize what 20 extra pounds on a girl her size would look like. What the hell, I was almost there and it was just lunch.

I entered through the rear parking structure and once entering the lobby I called her to make the final contact. As the phone was ringing I saw a short NFL Left-tackle in a dress and striped blouse on her phone. As I walked by the L-tackle I experienced that weird audio sensation where you hear a voice in your phone and from a secondary source at the same time. It was her. I had already made the mistake of describing what I was wearing to her and before I could run for my life I heard my name called out. My brain began a slow silent chant. You stupid fck. You stupid fck.

I was starving and we sat at a restaurant and ordered. The dialogue was friendly, and about as sexual as a conversation with your Mother or Sister can be. She wanted to discuss financials and her limits as to what she was willing to do. I, as politely as I could, told her that we were not a match and that we didn't need to worry about those details. That was pretty much the end of the lunch. Desert? Yes, she had ordered the biggest fcking chocolate something that I mistook for a mud bath when they wheeled it to the table.

It was my intention to start off my contribution to this forum with a cool story that would allow me to start my journey to becoming a Senior Member here. Through only my fault, it didn't work out that way. But this is my starting point and I hope over the next several weeks, months, and on to be able to post successes rather than failures. My name is Nitwit, glad to be here.

I'm fairly certain the 35 year old is a working girl just by the way she talks to me. I haven't been talking to her much anymore.

A new possible sb is a 19 year old from Minneapolis. She just moved here April 1st. She is not beautiful in a sexy way. She is kind of nerdy plain looking but looks okay and appears to have a slim / athletic body. And the body and attitude are my most important requirements. I get the vibe I could completely dominate her.

I'm just a little concerned about her. She is only 19 and moved here alone and doesn't work. So how is she surviving? Plus she is eager to meet. She sent me a personalized photo immediately, hasn't asked any questions about me, doesn't talk much and wants to meet asap. Hmmm.

One thing you might consider doing Rouleur is put something in your profile that the girl must be fit / take care of herself, etc. It helps prevent the overweight ones from contacting you, and even if you contact them by mistake it will make them think twice about trying to sidestep your physical preferences with "good personality" and outdated or incomplete photos, hoping you won't notice. On that particular date I would have bailed at any cost the moment she said "I need to lose 20 lbs" on the phone, but you'll get more successful with practice and I enjoyed the comedic value of your post.

One thing I always do when talking to a cute girl. Is even when I know nothing is going to happen, rather than just cut the meeting or conversation short, I talk as long as they will respond just to get in their head even if I am never going to get in their pants. From a convo this morning I had with a girl that rejected me I got an idea, posted it on CL and had a response in an hour.

Just like in any other forum, feedback is very useful for future situations.
Every loss just puts you one step closer to a win.

Yeah we're tricks. So what?. Anyway here's one you can use on SD4M . You send your intro letter. If they don't read it in 7 days delete the message from the sent box. The UTR's and pros will send an apologetic message and want to meet. The SB's probably aren't interested. Even better. They read it within 24 hours. If they don't respond within the next 24 hours delete the sent message. It's like a takeaway. Sometimes it works and they suddenly get right back to you. Everybody wants what they can't have. In this scenario 90% are SB/NP's because a pro or UTR doesn't have to think about it.

Today I sent a message. She reads it and nothing. I delete it a few hours later. She sees that and messages me back. "Sure! Let's try this". Meaning my guaranteed HE for a $. Stats. 40% of HE agreements go to BBFS. 30% go to BBBJ. 20% go to a HE. And 10% walk away at the M & G. For dudes that cover up, the numbers go even higher. And you can't argue with a demand for a cover. It's a legitimate request.

Unfortunately it was close to midnite when belle de jour responded to my takeaway so I'll have to do her tomorrow. It is possible to send an intro letter in the morning and be bangin by nite. Or even an hour later. A pro will always get right back to you with an overly positive response. A UTR may get back to you quickly but be less quick to set up a meet. A NP/SB can be anywhere on the map. I met my princess the first day she signed up. Did a 5 minute M & G that nite and then went straight to the FC. I was the only guy she met and then she had me delete her profile. We are still together a year later.

Not looking to start a discussion on whether to cover up or not. That issue has been mined to death on many threads.

One last comment. Always try to message a girl within 48 hours of her signing up.

I have noticed that there is very little posting on the weekend. Must be because you're all married or have a life. This one responded to a CL ad saying she never did anything like this before, but her cel is shut off. How am I supposed to get any work done thinking about that tight spinner body. I know it's not for everyone, but it drives me crazy.

[QUOTE=Rouleur;2081823]I live within a couple hours of Las Vegas[/QUOTE]I'd try setting up two or three of these per day over a couple of days, maybe take advantage of the low hotel rates during the week.