Rants, Raves and Opinions AKA "The Octagon"

If you do either of these or both.
Let us know if you survive.

[URL]https://tryst.link/escort/veronicajasmine[/URL]

[URL]https://tryst.link/escort/brooke-diesel[/URL]

[QUOTE=WanderingAbout;6843932]If you do either of these or both.
Let us know if you survive.

[URL]https://tryst.link/escort/veronicajasmine[/URL]

[URL]https://tryst.link/escort/brooke-diesel[/URL][/QUOTE]I will start out by saying I would visit the first one if it was free. The second one would have to pay me.

I do not like ladies that are more masculine than I am. I cannot believe mongers pay those rates for ladies like these two.

Makes the rate I pay the semi UTR I have been seeing seem like a deal and she is about a third of the size.

I guess we pay per pound now days.

[QUOTE=JimJaimes;6836797]You folks swinging off tRumps n*ts are so wacked out you'd hang Ronald Reagan in effigy for being a leftist "rino". You hate our allies in Europe while kissing up to Putin and Kim Jung Un. Each and every one of you hate the constitution and the founding principles our country was founded on all while claiming to be Patriots. If the founding Fathers were alive today they'd tar and feather the entire lot of you if not outright hang your asses. And FYI you fascist bootlicker, most of what you consider to be "libs" are WHITE. And most of what goes for a lib these days are yesterdays USA loving Republicans. We're bitching about a FORMER president that has zero moral fortitude and commits all 7 deadly sins on a regular basis that is unworthy of running a sewer plant much less representing the greatest country on earth. I read posts like yours and it makes me realize the grand 'ol USA is swirling in the bowl, never in my life did I ever think there would be this much support for a horrible human being. Unbelievable.[/QUOTE]I was in that normal Republican Party that was a home for conservatives not crazies. The crazies won out and worship an orange figure with every quality of an anti-Christ. And continue to demonize anyone with a D next to their name. It's funny that our current prez has been in Washington like 50 years and was a good, moral, likable guy for 45 of those years and now he's the worst. How ignorant! Mother Theresa would be crucified by this new party of orange-lovers.

This year's Easter Sunday is also Transgender Visibility Day.

[URL]https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13255111/easter-2024-white-house-bans-religious-eggs.html[/URL]

[QUOTE=WanderingAbout;6846470]This year's Easter Sunday is also Transgender Visibility Day.

[URL]https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13255111/easter-2024-white-house-bans-religious-eggs.html[/URL][/QUOTE]Sure. But just wait until 2029. That's when Easter falls on April 1 and the GOP will lose their minds that Easter is going to be one big joke. That's the day Jesus will rise, come out of the cave, and when he sees his shadow, there will be six more weeks of winter.

So, what's your point? In a nation that recognizes 1500 religions, you think one religion has dibs on specific days? 300 million people in the country.

For those of you enjoying your time here in hell, perhaps you'll see the light in Kentuckiana. About a 2 hr drive give or take depending on where you are in the city and how fast you drive. Takes me about 1. 5 hrs. I have some reviews pending that will help you think about repenting your ways that have led you here.

[QUOTE=WanderingAbout;6846470]This year's Easter Sunday is also Transgender Visibility Day.

[URL]https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13255111/easter-2024-white-house-bans-religious-eggs.html[/URL][/QUOTE]Why can't it figure people body / gender dysmorphia? I, for one, could give a shit less. I think they're idiots but what he said, legislation, and what they do has no effect on any part of my life. Again, I think they're fucking weird as do most of my LGB friends, but oh well. I left out TQqia+ or whatever on purpose.

I've never met or have yet to meet one on the end of the rainbow that was a well adjusted person. But again, let them be.

[QUOTE=SmokeyGringo;6847209]Why can't it figure people body / gender dysmorphia? I, for one, could give a shit less. I think they're idiots but what he said, legislation, and what they do has no effect on any part of my life. Again, I think they're fucking weird as do most of my LGB friends, but oh well. I left out TQqia+ or whatever on purpose.

I've never met or have yet to meet one on the end of the rainbow that was a well adjusted person. But again, let them be.[/QUOTE]Zombie, or mummy? Mummies went through a burial and wrapped. Zombies just get bitten by another zombie.

[QUOTE=SmokeyGringo;6847209]Why can't it figure people body / gender dysmorphia? I, for one, could give a shit less. I think they're idiots but what he said, legislation, and what they do has no effect on any part of my life. Again, I think they're fucking weird as do most of my LGB friends, but oh well. I left out TQqia+ or whatever on purpose.

I've never met or have yet to meet one on the end of the rainbow that was a well adjusted person. But again, let them be.[/QUOTE]I've not met one that was right in the head. I don't think that's a coincidence. My (40+ year old) gay brother and his friends are all disgusted by the scene these days, apparently the OG gays absolutely hate the younger generation.

But thankfully it is easily avoided. Not my monkey, not my circus.

[QUOTE=YoungOne23;6848589]I've not met one that was right in the head. I don't think that's a coincidence. My (40+ year old) gay brother and his friends are all disgusted by the scene these days, apparently the OG gays absolutely hate the younger generation.

But thankfully it is easily avoided. Not my monkey, not my circus.[/QUOTE]I have met a few TG people who were healthy and not crazy. But they don't come across as anything but well adjusted people of their apparent gender. I suspect the well-adjusted ones basically are invisible because they don't stand out. So what you tend to see is the ones who are wacky.

TGD.

I have been thinking about this and years ago almost all escorts would not take donation until done playing. That way there was over a 98 % chance it was not a cop as only rotten ones because they can't do that. Now you have all these escorts demanding payment up front. I think I am going to remind them that if I was a cop, I can lie about that all day and not get in trouble. They do it all the time when going to arrest people. Knock on a hotel door say room service or this is management they open the do and they bust them. So they can say they are not a cop but once you hand the money over before playing I believe that is no longer considered a donation and they can be charged with prostitution. Especially if you say I thought we were going to play first. Another thing I have been doing from time to since I have retired is play games on the fake ads on LC. I get them so they think they are going to real in another sucker and just when they think they have me I will say in which one of the 6 cities that you are running the same ad saying you are in that city. It really pisses them off.

[QUOTE=MallGuy101;6858019]I have been thinking about this and years ago almost all escorts would not take donation until done playing. That way there was over a 98 % chance it was not a cop as only rotten ones because they can't do that. Now you have all these escorts demanding payment up front. I think I am going to remind them that if I was a cop, I can lie about that all day and not get in trouble. They do it all the time when going to arrest people. Knock on a hotel door say room service or this is management they open the do and they bust them. So they can say they are not a cop but once you hand the money over before playing I believe that is no longer considered a donation and they can be charged with prostitution. Especially if you say I thought we were going to play first. Another thing I have been doing from time to since I have retired is play games on the fake ads on LC. I get them so they think they are going to real in another sucker and just when they think they have me I will say in which one of the 6 cities that you are running the same ad saying you are in that city. It really pisses them off.[/QUOTE]Hey, Mall Guy--I'm certainly no expert on this stuff but I think you're generally correct. Likewise, we can be arrested if our "escort" is really a cop. When I meet someone new I do one of two things: first, if her ad showed her nude body ALONG WITH her face, and I know for certain that the girl who answered the door is, in fact, the same girl as in the photos, then I believe I'm safe. On the other hand, if the ad did NOT show body parts and face (all in the same photo), or if there's any question in my mind whatsoever, then I drop my pants, pull my friend out for her to see and tell her, "I'm not a cop". I then ask her to prove that she's not a cop by showing me some body parts or grabbing my rod. I think that's a pretty fool-proof method.

[QUOTE=WanderingAbout;6843932]If you do either of these or both.
Let us know if you survive.

[URL]https://tryst.link/escort/veronicajasmine[/URL]

[URL]https://tryst.link/escort/brooke-diesel[/URL][/QUOTE]Not even on a dare.

[QUOTE=MallGuy101;6858019]I have been thinking about this and years ago almost all escorts would not take donation until done playing. That way there was over a 98 % chance it was not a cop as only rotten ones because they can't do that. Now you have all these escorts demanding payment up front. I think I am going to remind them that if I was a cop, I can lie about that all day and not get in trouble. They do it all the time when going to arrest people. Knock on a hotel door say room service or this is management they open the do and they bust them. So they can say they are not a cop but once you hand the money over before playing I believe that is no longer considered a donation and they can be charged with prostitution. Especially if you say I thought we were going to play first. Another thing I have been doing from time to since I have retired is play games on the fake ads on LC. I get them so they think they are going to real in another sucker and just when they think they have me I will say in which one of the 6 cities that you are running the same ad saying you are in that city. It really pisses them off.[/QUOTE]The laws these days can get you for conspiracy, I know a guy who did time for conspiracy to sell drugs. Nothing ever changed hands. The DUI laws in Ohio can get you for intent if you're drunk and walking to your car with your keys in hand, or a DUI if you're sleeping in your car and the keys are in the trunk, I think it's best to assume that the laws are in their favor and if you do walk into a setup you're probably going to get arrested despite technicalities or whatever tricks you use to protect yourself.

[QUOTE=MallGuy101;6858019]I have been thinking about this and years ago almost all escorts would not take donation until done playing. That way there was over a 98 % chance it was not a cop as only rotten ones because they can't do that. Now you have all these escorts demanding payment up front. I think I am going to remind them that if I was a cop, I can lie about that all day and not get in trouble. They do it all the time when going to arrest people. Knock on a hotel door say room service or this is management they open the do and they bust them. So they can say they are not a cop but once you hand the money over before playing I believe that is no longer considered a donation and they can be charged with prostitution. Especially if you say I thought we were going to play first. Another thing I have been doing from time to since I have retired is play games on the fake ads on LC. I get them so they think they are going to real in another sucker and just when they think they have me I will say in which one of the 6 cities that you are running the same ad saying you are in that city. It really pisses them off.[/QUOTE]There are two reasons a lady asks for money before. First is they are going to rob you. Second is they want to make sure you have the money and will not rob them. The semi UTR I have been visiting recently got stiffed by a monger and now require first time visitors to lay the money down in plain sight before they start.

As FOR LOE it is safer if payment is made after. It is not fool proof because LEO does not always follow the rules. It is safer for the monger because I would believe it would be difficult to find a female police officer to do the deed to arrest a monger. I guess they could use a prostitute and have video.

Nice girl. Good time. She PM'd asking not to talk on here about her gaining weight. Okay. Will let her own picture speak a 1,000 words.

[QUOTE=WanderingAbout;6878339]Nice girl. Good time. She PM'd asking not to talk on here about her gaining weight. Okay. Will let her own picture speak a 1,000 words.[/QUOTE]That photo is at least a year old, what prompted this post, is she back?

Golfguy, playing through.

[QUOTE=WanderingAbout;6878339]Nice girl. Good time. She PM'd asking not to talk on here about her gaining weight. Okay. Will let her own picture speak a 1,000 words.[/QUOTE]I have not seen her ad for a while. Does she still come to cincy? I thought she moved to colorado, maybe?

[QUOTE=KJessup;6878700]I have not seen her ad for a while. Does she still come to cincy? I thought she moved to colorado, maybe?[/QUOTE]She is on tryst for now. Nice person. People seem to like her. Ymmv

[URL]https://tryst.link/escort/kyliexxreid[/URL]

[QUOTE=WanderingAbout;6878339]Nice girl. Good time. She PM'd asking not to talk on here about her gaining weight. Okay. Will let her own picture speak a 1,000 words.[/QUOTE][QUOTE=WanderingAbout;6878806]She is on tryst for now. Nice person. People seem to like her. Ymmv

[URL]https://tryst.link/escort/kyliexxreid[/URL][/QUOTE]That ad link says the page is down already. Only terrible people operate like this. She's really packing on the pounds and its probably going to get a lot worse soon.

[QUOTE=WanderingAbout;6878806]She is on tryst for now. Nice person. People seem to like her. Ymmv

[URL]https://tryst.link/escort/kyliexxreid[/URL][/QUOTE]I have seen her sever times. Never a problem an her weight never bothered me her service was always outstanding a not a clock watcher.

[QUOTE=PearishBA;6879082]That ad link says the page is down already. Only terrible people operate like this. She's really packing on the pounds and its probably going to get a lot worse soon.[/QUOTE]She looks good with the weight gain and not bad. But I know everyone on the forum here all have the face of Channing Tatum and the body of Stallone in Rocky 4 so of course they'll be critical of her.

[QUOTE=FootMan2007;6879467]She looks good with the weight gain and not bad. But I know everyone on the forum here all have the face of Channing Tatum and the body of Stallone in Rocky 4 so of course they'll be critical of her.[/QUOTE]But it still doesn't matter because she appears and disappears like a big fat fart in the wind. Come on down here to reality with me and lets say it together: We are the customer, they are the product. We are the wallet, they are the tits and ass minus as much of the usual female bullshit as possible.

I am surprised at how many mongers ask you for information and you type up a nice PM to get the box is full notice.

Before asking for someone to send you a PM delete old messages. Better yet delete them once and awhile.

Weed. The stench of weed. Over the years I have met a few girls I really liked, but every time I smelled the weed on them I had trouble getting past it. Walk in to a house, the cloud of smoke still lingers, and I usually smell it before I reach the door. Hair? Smells like weed. Breath? Weed. Mouth? Like stale weed. Crotch? Weed and a fish market, because stoner girls are always wet but rarely fresh like a mountain spring. I don't mind if someone smokes, I just don't want to smell it, or worse, taste it. Triggered by recent experience. Rant over.

I know FOSTA caused a huge chilling effect over everything, but I continue to wonder what happened to the "Casual Encounter" women on Craigslist. It took some time and effort but I had some good luck there. So where are they now? They weren't looking to get paid and they wanted anonymity so that seems to eliminate dating apps. I dunno. Just wondering.

[QUOTE=Wielic;6881562]Weed. The stench of weed. Over the years I have met a few girls I really liked, but every time I smelled the weed on them I had trouble getting past it. Walk in to a house, the cloud of smoke still lingers, and I usually smell it before I reach the door. Hair? Smells like weed. Breath? Weed. Mouth? Like stale weed. Crotch? Weed and a fish market, because stoner girls are always wet but rarely fresh like a mountain spring. I don't mind if someone smokes, I just don't want to smell it, or worse, taste it. Triggered by recent experience. Rant over.[/QUOTE]That is why these ladies should be required to pass Home Ec in high school so they can bake brownies. Think of how many mongers they would get if they offered pot laced brownies with their horizontal refreshment.

[QUOTE=IrlFan;6881863]I know FOSTA caused a huge chilling effect over everything, but I continue to wonder what happened to the "Casual Encounter" women on Craigslist. It took some time and effort but I had some good luck there. So where are they now? They weren't looking to get paid and they wanted anonymity so that seems to eliminate dating apps. I dunno. Just wondering.[/QUOTE]It doesn't eliminate dating apps. That's where they are now. You can easily use a fake name and if you use pics that you take especially for the apps, pics that aren't linked to your IG or FB profiles, you can stay pretty close to anonymous.

I've had really good luck with tinder and bumble. To the point that I don't even really monger anymore, at least not here in Ohio. If you are reasonably handsome and have anything interesting or funny to say, there are LOADS of women who just want to get fucked. It might cost you the price of a some hot wings and a couple of beers, but if you have a little patience, a divorcee, or a married broad looking for some strange will let you do damn near anything you want to her for free if you invest a little time. It's a 1000% better option that some cracked out possibly infected, that you had to chase for hours or days in text messages to see in some filthy shithole and maybe get robbed by.

Since internet porn got so mainstream, women are lot less inhibited than they used to be. 3 Weeks ago I went to an Outback steakhouse on a Thursday night, sat at the bar to have dinner and a beer and ended up with a lady taking me balls deep in all 3 holes before 10 pm. Its true what the ads say, local MILFS in your area want to fuck.

[URL]https://www.eros.com/ohio/files/468688.htm?cat=3859[/URL]

Apparently, there is a market for porn stars from the 1980's who are now in their 60's and over 200 lbs. Does this mean someone could open a nursing home / brothel for retired porn stars in Nevada as a workable business model? I don't get it.

[QUOTE=Ginzo666;6889237][URL]https://www.eros.com/ohio/files/468688.htm?cat=3859[/URL]

Apparently, there is a market for porn stars from the 1980's who are now in their 60's and over 200 lbs. Does this mean someone could open a nursing home / brothel for retired porn stars in Nevada as a workable business model? I don't get it.[/QUOTE]Hear, hear, Ginzo! I completely agree.

I have no doubt that she will get some takers, though.

I have never understood the granny obsession that is so prevalent on boards like this one. I understand that as a practical matter, not every provider is going to be a 24-year-old supermodel. Sometimes you have to take that 35-year-old because she's the best that's available. I get it.

I am also amenable to arguments that really young providers and SBs (18 or 19) are often "more trouble than they're worth. " For me, the sweet spot is probably 23 to 30.

I do *not*, however, understand the guys who proactively seek women over 40.

Granted, I see a few passably hot MILFs in real life. But they are *never* as hot as the 20-somethings. And the older women in the hobby are almost always beat to heck and back.

For reference: I am not a "young" guy myself. I am in my mid-50's, and I can well remember the 1980's. I have no desire to see providers who can remember the 1980's, let alone porn stars from that era.

[QUOTE=ToddCincy;6889265]Hear, hear, Ginzo! I completely agree.

I have no doubt that she will get some takers, though.

I have never understood the granny obsession that is so prevalent on boards like this one. I understand that as a practical matter, not every provider is going to be a 24-year-old supermodel. Sometimes you have to take that 35-year-old because she's the best that's available. I get it.

I am also amenable to arguments that really young providers and SBs (18 or 19) are often "more trouble than they're worth. " For me, the sweet spot is probably 23 to 30.

I do *not*, however, understand the guys who proactively seek women over 40.

Granted, I see a few passably hot MILFs in real life. But they are *never* as hot as the 20-somethings. And the older women in the hobby are almost always beat to heck and back.

For reference: I am not a "young" guy myself. I am in my mid-50's, and I can well remember the 1980's. I have no desire to see providers who can remember the 1980's, let alone porn stars from that era.[/QUOTE]I saw a 50 year-old provider a few times last year. Not because someone that old is my first choice, but because it was convenient, inexpensive, and nearly impossible to find someone under 40 who didn't want a ridiculous donation. It helped that she was all right for that age. But then I had a 27 year-old a couple times early this year, and there was no comparison. Much, much prefer chicks in their 20's and 30's.

[QUOTE=Ginzo666;6889237][URL]https://www.eros.com/ohio/files/468688.htm?cat=3859[/URL]

Apparently, there is a market for porn stars from the 1980's who are now in their 60's and over 200 lbs. Does this mean someone could open a nursing home / brothel for retired porn stars in Nevada as a workable business model? I don't get it.[/QUOTE]Be nice guys; tastes differ. At least the Granny Grabbers are not competing with us for the spinners. She is not asking $600 ppm. At her level she is sure to find a few customers.

BAM.

[QUOTE=BamBam;6889534]Be nice guys; tastes differ. At least the Granny Grabbers are not competing with us for the spinners. She is not asking $600 ppm. At her level she is sure to find a few customers.

BAM.[/QUOTE]Why are you clutching pearls in the Octagon? This is what $300 ppm gets you now: Obese and eligible for Medicare.

Just 2 years ago I could find very hot early 20s on SA that fucked like porn stars and hosted for $300.

What happened? LOL.

[QUOTE=Ginzo666;6889570]Why are you clutching pearls in the Octagon? This is what $300 ppm gets you now: Obese and eligible for Medicare.

Just 2 years ago I could find very hot early 20s on SA that fucked like porn stars and hosted for $300.

What happened? LOL.[/QUOTE]2 years ago, I was finding super hot SB's on Tinder from UC for 300 and they'd stay as long as I wanted, fucked like rabbits and did anything I wanted. Stocked up on the morning after pill b / c most of them were fine doing BB and getting filled up. Now Tinder is all bots and no hots.

[QUOTE=Ginzo666;6889570]Why are you clutching pearls in the Octagon? This is what $300 ppm gets you now: Obese and eligible for Medicare.

Just 2 years ago I could find very hot early 20s on SA that fucked like porn stars and hosted for $300.

What happened? LOL.[/QUOTE]Bidenomics! Plane and simple.

Golfguy, playing through.

[QUOTE=ToddCincy;6889265]Hear, hear, Ginzo! I completely agree.

I have no doubt that she will get some takers, though.

I have never understood the granny obsession that is so prevalent on boards like this one. I understand that as a practical matter, not every provider is going to be a 24-year-old supermodel. Sometimes you have to take that 35-year-old because she's the best that's available. I get it.

I am also amenable to arguments that really young providers and SBs (18 or 19) are often "more trouble than they're worth. " For me, the sweet spot is probably 23 to 30.

I do *not*, however, understand the guys who proactively seek women over 40.

Granted, I see a few passably hot MILFs in real life. But they are *never* as hot as the 20-somethings. And the older women in the hobby are almost always beat to heck and back.

For reference: I am not a "young" guy myself. I am in my mid-50's, and I can well remember the 1980's. I have no desire to see providers who can remember the 1980's, let alone porn stars from that era.[/QUOTE]I like them within a certain age too Todd just like you. You and I have both been very vocal of the degradation of talent within our market.

With that being said, she at least has some actual adult work clout. Now I'm quite sure she was never m / f action and it was just "Busty" "Juggs" "Score" and whatever gas station nudie mag so there's the nostalgia / star aspect for dudes. Basically they can finally get her. There's quite a few over the hill pornstars I would take a $300 swing at. Hell, I used to have a MILF fetish too until I realized I'm older than the MILF pornstars. These other skin bags doods keep posting don't even have that. They're just used up trashy ugly old Marlboro and Mt. Dew receptacles. Looking at you Lilsexyme lovers. I don't know what doctor thought it was a good idea to stick bolt ons on a skeleton but, there she was.

And to circle back around, we have an actual verifiable "porn" lady asking 1/3 to 3/4 less of what most of the current crop want. Even as attractive as they may be, never forget their also now starting demand deposits and super bs PII that should be a blockade for 99% of men. But here we are. Tryst keeps getting more unbelievable by the day and the dudes paying money like you've commented "to just have dinner and go out or be seen out is unreal and keeps fucking the market.

Let her get it. I wholly support her. I hope she causes at least two less overpriced slags and Fatties phones to not ring.

And watching economic data as I have been, the reckoning is coming.

[QUOTE=MeadnMrsJones;6882168]It doesn't eliminate dating apps. That's where they are now. You can easily use a fake name and if you use pics that you take especially for the apps, pics that aren't linked to your IG or FB profiles, you can stay pretty close to anonymous.

I've had really good luck with tinder and bumble. To the point that I don't even really monger anymore, at least not here in Ohio. If you are reasonably handsome and have anything interesting or funny to say, there are LOADS of women who just want to get fucked. It might cost you the price of a some hot wings and a couple of beers, but if you have a little patience, a divorcee, or a married broad looking for some strange will let you do damn near anything you want to her for free if you invest a little time. It's a 1000% better option that some cracked out possibly infected, that you had to chase for hours or days in text messages to see in some filthy shithole and maybe get robbed by.

Since internet porn got so mainstream, women are lot less inhibited than they used to be. 3 Weeks ago I went to an Outback steakhouse on a Thursday night, sat at the bar to have dinner and a beer and ended up with a lady taking me balls deep in all 3 holes before 10 pm. Its true what the ads say, local MILFS in your area want to fuck.[/QUOTE]Any pointers you could give on using dating apps? I've never had any luck with those.

[QUOTE=GolfGuy;6889700]Bidenomics! Plane and simple.

Golfguy, playing through.[/QUOTE]Except the orange cheetoh colored shitzinpants and "dances like he's jerking two guys off at once" loud mouth psycho paid for a pornstar well above market rates and even more to shut her up. And now he's on trial. DRUMPONOMICS!

Your comment makes me think you're playing thru at a Putt-Putt level.

[QUOTE=GolfGuy;6889700]Bidenomics! Plane and simple.

Golfguy, playing through.[/QUOTE]Inflation is a worldwide problem- basically corporations are screwing everybody, continuing to raise prices even though supply chain issues are back to pre-COVId. Its actually been dropping in the US relative to the rest of the world.

I like your reviews and perspectives, but this ain't Biden's fault.

The good Dr.

[QUOTE=DrDave39;6889969]Inflation is a worldwide problem- basically corporations are screwing everybody, continuing to raise prices even though supply chain issues are back to pre-COVId. Its actually been dropping in the US relative to the rest
of the world

I like your reviews and perspectives, but this ain't Biden's fault.

The good Dr.[/QUOTE]It's all Communist Joe's fault. He started with a war on fossil fuel that raised the price of transporting all the product we depend on and in case you didn't know this but fossil fuel runs our economy. He also caused labor cost to increase that fuels inflation and once that cat is out of the bag labor cost never comes down. Labor cost is at least 45% of the cost of doing business but you probably already knew that. Bottom line is higher prices are here to stay.