Massage Parlor Reports

[QUOTE=Big Money; 1110861]I'll post some background about how many of the K-chicks end up in the AMPs based on what I have learned in more than 30 years of mongering as there seem to be some ignorance about the AMP K-chicks.

About 60% of the K-chicks that work in AMPs came to America thru military marriages. No, their original goal was not to work in AMPs, but to build a future with their husbands and migrate their relatives to the US. On average for every K-chick marrying an American GI, she would bring another 10 of her Korean relatives to the US. Simple example is Fort Hood in Killeen, Texas, where the population is about 120, 000, but with 60K Korean population.

Now, most of the K-chicks that married American GIs are not the most educated of the bunch. Most were bar girls or run thrift shops near the US base, etc. And with the military marriages having a higher than the 50% national average divorce rate, most of these K-chicks end up being 30s to 40s year old old maids with little marketable skills, and having kids to take care of. With the structured military pay, child support is barely sustenance level, plus they get kicked out of the military housing. And not to mention that some have to support the other 10 relatives that they brought over. About 60% of the AMP K-chicks in San Antonio, Dallas and Houston all have this similar background. I mentioned that to some of the K-chicks here and they too had something similar, or could empathize.

Another 10% of the AMP K-chicks would be relatives that were brought over from the original 60. They were first brought over maybe to study English and get into college, etc. But they failed to make the grades so they did not learn any marketable skills either along with their bad Engrish. But they end up somehow having the responsibility to support the family as well. So they go to work in AMPs.

Now there are another 10-15% that are second or third generation of the original 60. These are the younger ones in their 20s that probably speak good English and have American attitude. I see a lot of these in southern California or NYC AMPs. They think that their pussies are worth more than gold. There background bears resemblance to the American crack ho's. Most were teen rebels, and many ended up pregnant early with their pimp's baby. And end up neglecting her own baby by having some relative take care of it. Most are in it just for their next high with some sending money to the relative to take care of her baby.

And finally there are another 10-15% that are here on 6-month visas to make quick money and return to Korea most likely for school, or are here on student visas going to school and working on the side. Most of these are in their 20s, and probably still speak with an accent, but are understandable at least. Although money for school seems like an extraneous cost here in the US, it is highly valued in Korea. Relatives would pool their money just so the one with the most potential could go to college. If they all fall short, the girl would rather go work 6-months in the US AMPs than to disappoint her relatives.

Over 90% of the K-chicks in the AMPs would fall under one of the 4 above categories. Very rarely is it an option, although I did have one telling me that she is working for a down payment on a house. I rarely go for the 20s but opt for the 30s or 40s because they have more vested interest in getting a regular clientele.

But Atlasiangirth is right that most live at the AMP when they are working. And what they are bound to is this agreement. Mamasan or the house owner would pay for the girl's airfare and hospice fee, for the sake of an example say, a 2-month stay. Don't forget most ladies come in with nothing. During the agreed 2-month period, the lady is contractually bound to stay in the house 24/7. She works on tips and the house time (40 or 60) goes to the house to pay off the plane fare, hospice and the house cut. This is the reason mamasan says 100 tip is okay, but the ladies always want more. And if a customer complains or house rule is broken, the house penalizes the lady with a hefty fine like 200 to 300. And trust me, it is not unheard of for a lady to pay 2000 in penalty to the house in a month.

There are some occasion where the house make agreement with other houses to rotate girls, or if the house owner already owns other houses, and he could rotate them there. But the lady is essentially the house property until the contract agreement period is fulfilled. After the agreement date, that is usually when the lady is allowed to go shopping, or run errands. On rare occasion, they may bring in a fugly that the house can not re-coup its airfare or hospice fee to break even on the lady. In which case, they would just send the lady home at a lost. Ladies who are more resourceful end up paying their own way, but this is about less than 10% of working girls. Or if they live locally, they just drive to work, but this is equally less likely at less than 10, because they don't want to run into customers near where they live. There is a considerable percentage in which the lady will run away before the contractual date.

The condition of living in an AMP house 24/7 for even 2-month sounds easy, but is most unbearable for normal people. If you worked 2-weeks on an oil platform, you know what I'm talking about. You have no privacy. You are stuck and can not go anywhere. You are in constant vigilance for LE, and in case of a bust, you have no where to run, or no one to bail you out. You have little to no rights-like you can't pick or choose which customers to serve.

And my guess is that this no choose of the customer is causing most of the problems here in Atlanta. This is the fundamental difference between AMPs and SWs or CL providers. SWs or CL providers can refuse to service you. AMP ladies can not for the most part. And it is this fundamental difference that makes the AMP chicks stressed out, and screwed up in the head in the long run.

Sure they are there to make money and love a "nice guy" sucker. But as I've mentioned from my previous experiences, being nice can be better in the long term. It makes the job bearable for them. It makes them want to work even more. With more chicks working, that is more supply for mongers to choose from, and can even drive down the going rate.

So I repeat,

Customer Jerk. Ladies leave. Supply decrease. Cost increase.

Customer Nice. Ladies stay. Supply increase. Cost decrease[/QUOTE]Big Money,

Good post, thanks for taking the time to post some of it I agree and some I don't I can understand most of your case study come from you living in Texas in a mostly Army base location and I know there are a few Air Force bases there too, me being ex Navy and being station around the world you didn't see many sailors getting married to Korean chicks most married girls from the P. I, so were are the P. I. Spas around the Naval bases? You don't see them.

I wish I got a dime each time I ended up fucking one of these dumb sailors wife he pick up from a bar he is going to save from the life, IF you look around Atlanta all you see are broken down ugly looking 40 year old women working here LOL

Maybe what you saying is the case around Army bases maybe if we had a HUGE Army base maybe we would get younger looking girls working in them and send these old woman into retirement LOL.

I really think most of these girls that work in Gold's come here on tourist Visa's and sell ass and than return later for a few more weeks, and as far as a girl having to fuck anything that walk in the door even if it's a 300lb ape forget it lol there is a reason WHY there are TV's and two-way mirrors were the girls can see you before you get buzz in, all they do is hide out in one of the rooms until you leave why is it once you walk out you hear guys talking about all the dimes they see walking around lol

I know tons of Brazilian girls and I am friends with almost 270 of them on face book, I met many over the decades and you should see how many have came here to the states on Visa's that some dumb ass gringo spent his money on to only have her calling up horny ex tricks she knew in Rio and she having them fly her around the USA to stay a week or two here and there, many are here in Atlanta now sleeping with different guys until he finds out she fucking half his crew when he at work.

So, I see your point but with suckers marrying girls they met on these mail order braids site, and clowns going to Thailand and Rio falling in love with hookers you see more and more who#es here in the states now without getting married to Army guys, as long as there are Obese, bald, short, NERDED, geeks here in the states you will find young, ex hookers here in the states looking for a way to upgrade her life style.

I have a quick one for you there a well known hooker that have turned tricks in Costa Rica for years now she hit the lotto and married some Hollywood actor son she met him when he was on vacation in Costa Rica she met him at the mall, I still chat with her on facebook when she online and to others I know from other countries.

The bottom line is why it seem these K-girls are the ones that always seem to find their way right back in a massage parlors fucking jerks, geeks, nerds all day LOL and these other ex hookers from other countries like Costa Rica, Brazil, Colombia are doing so much better here in the states either they open up a hair salons, food places, nail shops, dry cleaners etc. Or they still married to the trick they married and just stay at home and keep it clean.

BUT, look I am saying this not to hurt anyone feelings but from what I seen over the years walking out of these spas you only have about two types of tricks the married fit in shape business guy looking to release some stress and want some different pussy, or you have the single guy that can only get ass by paying for it he get used by females so much until he tells himself well you pay for it one way or the other he he, so no matter how sweet or nice you are to these chicks the bottom line is money and if you going there paying for ass most of these girls hate you anyways either you cheating on your wife or girlfriend or THEY think you must be a goof ball that can't get or keep a woman so no matter what you do by kissing their ass and bringing them flowers etc. They don't or won't respect you they will smile and laugh at your corny jokes but at the end of the day you paying them not them paying you.

Kid Cisco

[QUOTE=Big Money; 1110790].

I really hope my contract in Atlanta does not get re-newed since many here can not think past the 5 seconds after they cum. . [/QUOTE]I don't really have much of an opinion on strategies on how best to maximize mileage with K ladies. Especially given how frequently they come and go. Not buying the argument that "word gets around" to the new girls about a specific monger. These girls don't remember guys names until they actually see them and recall seeing them, so how is the new girl to know? (LMAO at the conversation the girls must have. "Le-le, the guy called X is nice and the guy called Y is a SOB. Give X a break on his rates, because he is so nice. Good luck, I am going back to Korea now.")

Seriously, I figure any dude with sufficient green in his wallet has the right to decide how and under what circumstances to give out that green. Really don't see it as any of my business. I am just grateful to read about which places are legit and which places offer extras. Can't say I remember anything from NL or the others here asking how to go about mongering in Atl. I do seem to recall a post to that effect from Big Money though. Probably just poor recall on my part.

But something did strike me odd in Big Money's post, is he really saying he hopes he does not get a paying job renewed because he does not like the other mongers? In fairness, I think he was saying he hoped to not get renewed on a paying contract because he does not like how the other mongers treat the girls. Whether someone is new to mongering or has 30 years of experience, whether someone mongered extensively in Asia or during the military,. Nice reading but who gives a flip? Can we get back to where the better ATL places are NOW? I have been around long enough to say without hesitation, the ATL market has changed over the years and will continue to keep changing.

Does anyone seen either Julia or Sohpia around?

I went back to Maia but apparently it is now a history.

Please let me know.

Thanks

[QUOTE=Amp Fme;1111030]But something did strike me odd in Big Money's post, is he really saying he hopes he does not get a paying job renewed because he does not like the other mongers? In fairness, I think he was saying he hoped to not get renewed on a paying contract because he does not like how the other mongers treat the girls.[/QUOTE]I think he's saying that he's just ready to leave because the AMP scene in Atlanta has been quite terrible this year. And on top of that, the reports that Big Money reads on this board, he's been getting the sense that ALL of us Atlanta mongers are rude asshats whenever we're at an AMP. This is completely untrue and a misunderstanding on Big Money's part.

Nite lays everything out pretty clearly in his posts. Most of us are decent people and we visit AMPs just to have a good time. But let's not forget that we are paying customers and if we're met with rude attitudes as soon as we walk through that "second door", well I'm sorry if you're having a bad day but I'm not paying you to be a ***** to me. Big Pun's recent experience at Fuji is a perfect example of this. Now I would've left as soon as I met her and she was giving out bad vibes, but if I was thinking with my other head and went ahead with the session and sure enough this lady who I'm paying for a service is a complete ***** to me, then I'd be pissed too and walk out to tell the mamasan.

Now I'm not saying that there aren't any asshole mongers in this community. There are quite a few people on this board who I don't agree with and just from reading their reports, I can tell that they're not the most understanding type of people. But as the saying goes, it's only the small percentage of unsatisfied people who are the loudest in their complaints that you always hear from in any community.

So to Big Money I'm sorry that if you think all of us out here in Atlanta are jerks, but again that's a misunderstanding. There are some jerks here that you will always hear from, but even those people are only responding to the low quality bitchy AMP ladies that Atlanta has been plagued with recently. And I don't believe that the drop in quality and supply has anything to do with how mongers react to them, but rather the heavy LE crackdowns that's been going on here lately. I still think we have it good in Atlanta as far as service / prices go because I've been out to CA, NY, FL, Vegas this year and the AMPs there are either more expensive or the service isn't any different than what I can get here. I've never been out to TX, but if the AMPs there are amazing as Big Money tells us, I may have to visit next year.

[QUOTE=Big Money; 1110861]I'll post some background about how many of the K-chicks end up in the AMPs based on what I have learned in more than 30 years of mongering as there seem to be some ignorance about the AMP K-chicks.

About 60% of the K-chicks that work in AMPs came to the US thru military marriages. No, their original goal was not to work in AMPs, but to build a future with their husbands and migrate their relatives to the US. On average for every K-chick marrying an American GI, she would bring another 10 of her Korean relatives to the US. Simple example is Fort Hood in Killeen, Texas, where the population is about 120, 000, with 30K military personnels but with 60K Korean population.

Now, most of the K-chicks that married American GIs are not the most educated of the bunch. Most were bar girls or run thrift shops near the US base, etc. And with the military marriages having a higher than the 50% national average divorce rate, most of these K-chicks end up being 30s to 40s year old old maids with little marketable skills, and having kids to take care of. With the structured military pay, child support is barely sustenance level, plus they get kicked out of the military housing. And not to mention that some have to support the other 10 relatives that they brought over. About 60% of the AMP K-chicks in San Antonio, Dallas and Houston all have this similar background. I mentioned that to some of the K-chicks here and they too had something similar, or could empathize.

Another 10% of the AMP K-chicks would be relatives that were brought over from the original 60. They were first brought over maybe to study English and get into college, etc. But they failed to make the grades so they did not learn any marketable skills either along with their bad Engrish. But they end up somehow having the responsibility to support the family as well. So they go to work in AMPs.

Now there are another 10-15% that are second or third generation of the original 60. These are the younger ones in their 20s that probably speak good English and have American attitude. I see a lot of these in southern California or NYC AMPs. They think that their pussies are worth more than gold. There background bears resemblance to the American crack ho's. Most were teen rebels, and many ended up pregnant early with their pimp's baby. And end up neglecting her own baby by having some relative take care of it. Most are in it just for their next high with some sending money to the relative to take care of her baby.

And finally there are another 10-15% that are here on 6-month visas to make quick money and return to Korea most likely for school, or are here on student visas going to school and working on the side. Most of these are in their 20s, and probably still speak with an accent, but are understandable at least. Although money for school seems like an extraneous cost here in the US, it is highly valued in Korea. Relatives would pool their money just so the one with the most potential could go to college. If they all fall short, the girl would rather go work 6-months in the US AMPs than to disappoint her relatives.

Over 90% of the K-chicks in the AMPs would fall under one of the 4 above categories. Very rarely is it an option, although I did have one telling me that she is working for a down payment on a house. I rarely go for the 20s but opt for the 30s or 40s because they have more vested interest in getting a regular clientele.

But Atlasiangirth is right that most live at the AMP when they are working. And what they are bound to is this agreement. Mamasan or the house owner would pay for the girl's airfare and hospice fee, for the sake of an example say, a 2-month stay. Don't forget most ladies come in with nothing. During the agreed 2-month period, the lady is contractually bound to stay in the house 24/7. She works on tips and the house time (40 or 60) goes to the house to pay off the plane fare, hospice and the house cut. This is the reason mamasan says 100 tip is okay, but the ladies always want more. And if a customer complains or house rule is broken, the house penalizes the lady with a hefty fine like 200 to 300. And trust me, it is not unheard of for a lady to pay 2000 in penalty to the house in a month.

There are some occasion where the house makes agreement with other houses to rotate girls, or if the house owner already owns other houses, and he could rotate them there. But the lady is essentially the house property until the contract agreement period is fulfilled. After the agreement date, that is usually when the lady is allowed to go shopping, or run errands. On rare occasion, they may bring in a fugly that the house can not re-coup its airfare or hospice fee to break even on the lady. In which case, they would just send the lady home at a lost. Ladies who are more resourceful end up paying their own way, but this is about less than 10% of working girls. Or if they live locally, they just drive to work, but this is equally less likely at less than 10, because they don't want to run into customers near where they live. There is a considerable percentage in which the lady will run away before the contractual date, but I don't have a good feel for that number.

The condition of living in an AMP house 24/7 for even 2-month sounds easy, but is most unbearable for normal people. If you worked 2-weeks on an oil platform, you know what I'm talking about. You have no privacy. You are stuck and can not go anywhere. You are in constant vigilance for LE, and in case of a bust, you have no where to run, or no one to bail you out. You have personality issues with other ladies or mamasan. You bicker with others over why they make more or less money. You have little to no rights-like you can't pick or choose which customers to serve.

And my guess is that this no choose of the customer is causing most of the problems here in Atlanta. This is the fundamental difference between AMPs and SWs or CL providers. SWs or CL providers can refuse to service you. AMP ladies can not for the most part. And it is this fundamental difference that makes the AMP chicks stressed out, and screwed up in the head in the long run. And the customers being jerks just adds to the unpleasantness of the job. And remember this is Atlanta where many houses were busted just a few months ago. This isn't Rio where hot chicks are cheaper by the dozen.

Sure they are there to make money and love a "nice guy" sucker. But as I've mentioned from my previous experiences, being nice can be better in the long term. It makes the job bearable for them. It makes them want to work even more. With more chicks working, that is more supply for mongers to choose from, and can even drive down the going rate. Not only that, your Momma would be proud of you for being nice.

So I repeat,

Customer Jerk. Ladies leave. Supply decrease. Cost increase.

Customer Nice. Ladies stay. Supply increase. Cost decrease[/QUOTE]Damn.

If your report is true, my intel is way off from the guy who told me. Either way, the point was that they live a pretty shitty life and if they had other options than sucking mongers dicks, I'm sure they'd be doing it.

Either way, love the intel and posts from everybody and appreciate all the advice.

Be Safe

[QUOTE=Kid Cisco; 1110613]WOW! LOL LOL LOL

I have a main lady in my life and I don't and won't kiss a wh#re in her mouth after she just took 40oz. Of cum from some monger just before I got there or when she left the next room or after she licked out some obese monger that just gone to Taco Bell LOL LOL.

Kid Cisco[/QUOTE]Alway remember "one mans ho is always another mans house wife" al women have an inner ho that comes out to play at different times for different reasons and no man can change that.

[QUOTE=Gag on It;1111134]Alway remember "one mans ho is always another mans house wife" al women have an inner ho that comes out to play at different times for different reasons and no man can change that.[/QUOTE]What's up Gag on It? It's always good to hear from you bro, I agree with a lot of what you said, BUT I feel a guys wife should be the working girl to and for her man / husband in the bedroom and not still whoring around when she still getting and letting some poor simp / trick support her.

BUT, when I go on and log on to facebook I shouldn't see or have a guys wife trying to chat with me or trying to hook up with me when her husband is doing everything for her there is a girl from Brazil I know that married a football player that lives in Sugarloaf whenever it's a away game she is trickin with some guy she met in Rio thats now lives in Atlanta she calling me and others to go over there or meet her to party and have sex with her, this just goes to show you that you can have millions and live in a mansion BUT you can't change that working girl into a housewife.

Kid Cisco

I have worked in the Spas for fifteen years and I agree with you fort the first part of your post. I've worked in many Spas all over the country, especially Atlanta. I've never had a Spa buy my airplane ticket or pay for me to work there. In most Spas we pay for room and board. Then we have to pay a tip to the managers and the kitchen mama. In some places the house fee goes to the house and the tip to the girls but in Atlanta everything is split 50/50.

I've worked with many Korean girls, Thai Girls and so on but I never heard of a case where the girl didn't have the freedom to pick and choose where they work or quit whenever they felt like it. You are correct in saying that when we are working in the spa we tend to live there until we quit (on vacation) because most of us go to work in a different state then where we live. Many girls do send a portion of their money home to the people they support but a lot more waste their money on gambling, drinking, name brand items and jobless Korean boyfriends. I just broke my friendship with one Korean girl because she wanted me to help scam some poor guy that she knew and had received money from before.

I agree that treating the girls nicely normally works in getting better service but there are a lot of bad apples out there that don't care. And you guys if you do get lousy service please complain or stand up for yourselves otherwise the management won't know to get rid of that bad apple.

AMP Girl

[QUOTE=Sarasate2000; 1111056]Does anyone seen either Julia or Sohpia around?

I went back to Maia but apparently it is now a history.

Please let me know.

Thanks[/QUOTE]I've heard from a few guys that the former Maia hotties are long gone but that they re-opened after the bust and were functioning with just one old mamasan providing services. Have you confirmed that they've shut down for good?

[QUOTE=Devontei234; 1111123]I think he's saying that he's just ready to leave because the AMP scene in Atlanta has been quite terrible this year. And on top of that, the reports that Big Money reads on this board, he's been getting the sense that ALL of us Atlanta mongers are rude asshats whenever we're at an AMP. This is completely untrue and a misunderstanding on Big Money's part.

Nite lays everything out pretty clearly in his posts. Most of us are decent people and we visit AMPs just to have a good time. But let's not forget that we are paying customers and if we're met with rude attitudes as soon as we walk through that "second door", well I'm sorry if you're having a bad day but I'm not paying you to be a * to me. Big Pun's recent experience at Fuji is a perfect example of this. Now I would've left as soon as I met her and she was giving out bad vibes, but if I was thinking with my other head and went ahead with the session and sure enough this lady who I'm paying for a service is a complete * to me, then I'd be pissed too and walk out to tell the mamasan.

Now I'm not saying that there aren't any asshole mongers in this community. There are quite a few people on this board who I don't agree with and just from reading their reports, I can tell that they're not the most understanding type of people. But as the saying goes, it's only the small percentage of unsatisfied people who are the loudest in their complaints that you always hear from in any community.

So to Big Money I'm sorry that if you think all of us out here in Atlanta are jerks, but again that's a misunderstanding. There are some jerks here that you will always hear from, but even those people are only responding to the low quality bitchy AMP ladies that Atlanta has been plagued with recently. And I don't believe that the drop in quality and supply has anything to do with how mongers react to them, but rather the heavy LE crackdowns that's been going on here lately. I still think we have it good in Atlanta as far as service / prices go because I've been out to CA, NY, FL, Vegas this year and the AMPs there are either more expensive or the service isn't any different than what I can get here. I've never been out to TX, but if the AMPs there are amazing as Big Money tells us, I may have to visit next year. [/QUOTE]Shit, that's basically what I've said all along but some have failed to comprehend basic English. .

[QUOTE=Humble81;1110795]Went to Tong Tong in Duluth today, got a massage from a girl named WeiWei, looks 40's. She did the pretend like she didn't normally do HJ routine for like 10 whole minutes. The massage and HE were both uninspiring. I paid for an hour and added an extra Andrew Jackson for the ending. I might go back there whenever low on cash.[/QUOTE]That was my experience as well. The Tong Tong women leave a lot to be desired. Would be great to have a few AMPs with FS who are run by other Asian groups (non-Korean) to see if they could inspire a little friendly competition.

[QUOTE=Niteluvr;1111324]That was my experience as well. The Tong Tong women leave a lot to be desired. Would be great to have a few AMPs with FS who are run by other Asian groups (non-Korean) to see if they could inspire a little friendly competition.[/QUOTE]Actually, does you or anyone know any massage parlors that have European girls (Russians). I thought these were the ladies that started this business but yet I haven't heard much intel about them in the ATL. Does anyone know of the parlors in the area? Are the prices and service the same as the AMP's in the ATL?

[QUOTE=Atlasiangirth;1111417]Actually, does you or anyone know any massage parlors that have European girls (Russians). I thought these were the ladies that started this business but yet I haven't heard much intel about them in the ATL. Does anyone know of the parlors in the area? Are the prices and service the same as the AMP's in the ATL?[/QUOTE]Yeah, but none of them offer extras. There's the infamous Irina in Roswell. She and her girls look hot and do a very thorough massage and TS, but no HJ for $140. I tried them one time. The masseuse I had was hot as hell, gave a great massage, then a thorough TS but would not give me a HJ. The closest I got was DIY with her rubbing my balls.

There's another place always advertising on Shallowford Road in a converted house. They offer massage for $60 / hh and $100 / hr but they remain fully clothed don't even allow roaming outside of their clothing. No HJ there either.

There's at least one more place in the Roswell area that I've seen ads for on either BP or CL but they sounded legit on the phone.

Do a search on BP and / or CL for "European" "Europe" "Russian" or similar words and you'll find the ads.

[QUOTE=Niteluvr; 1111463]Yeah, but none of them offer extras. There's the infamous Irina in Roswell. She and her girls look hot and do a very thorough massage and TS, but no HJ for $140. I tried them one time. The masseuse I had was hot as hell, gave a great massage, then a thorough TS but would not give me a HJ. The closest I got was DIY with her rubbing my balls.

There's another place always advertising on Shallowford Road in a converted house. They offer massage for $60 / hh and $100 / hr but they remain fully clothed don't even allow roaming outside of their clothing. No HJ there either.

There's at least one more place in the Roswell area that I've seen ads for on either BP or CL but they sounded legit on the phone.

Do a search on BP and / or CL for "European" "Europe" "Russian" or similar words and you'll find the ads. [/QUOTE]Nite.

Thanks for the heads up. With that intel, I don't even think its worth 2 minutes of my time to look up if the best thing you got was a DIY with a nut rubbing action for. Damn, I would like to change it up a little with some white meat but I guess beggars can't be choosers.

[QUOTE=Atlasiangirth; 1111481]Nite.

Thanks for the heads up. With that intel, I don't even think its worth 2 minutes of my time to look up if the best thing you got was a DIY with a nut rubbing action for. Damn, I would like to change it up a little with some white meat but I guess beggars can't be choosers. [/QUOTE]European women know they're a hot commodity amongst Caucasian women and know they can charge pretty much what they want without offering extras and get away with it. Too many guys interested in trying that overseas mystique which usually turns out to be a disappointment. Instead of looking for AMP-type situations with Europeans, it's better to hunt for an individual provider and hope she'll offer extras. They're rare but the occasional one can be found.