The Rat Trap

[QUOTE=WayneAshley380;6697769]Here's the thing.

All that codespeak can be used as reasonable suspicion of prostitution.

If she asks if you are affiliated with law enforcement it Is used.

I have read police reports that include that as probable cause.

Annnd.

Cops can show their dicks and touch the girl if she asks them to.

There's No adequate cop check..[/QUOTE]Lmao I thought this was some new unspoken rule that we had to go by. I hadn't been on the forum in a few months and I saw everyone talking like this and got super confused but went with it.

Glad to know I wasn't the only one confused as hell.

Thank you very much for dropping it.

[QUOTE=JimDandy8392;6699423]Thank you very much for dropping it.[/QUOTE]But it did give us something to read over all the negative provider posts that pop up almost daily now.

Removed all ads, have no intention to reimburse providers.

Sometimes I wish guys would be more open about their own attributes. Because it seems like some of my experiences with providers differ greatly with other mongers.

With some, I have an amazing time where others have been less enthusiastic about their visit.

Other times it's the opposite, where a girl is supposed to be super-passionate or something, and my experience has been maybe less than that.

I know everything varies according to chemistry, but I'm wondering if guys sharing their age / size / race would help winnow out the differences in experiences.

I figure if we all have certain types we respond better to, I'm sure the providers do too.

Reading the last few pages I see why things happen the way they do now. I'm still fairly new but have gone to the AMPs significantly less lately here since experiencing the NYC scene, but man, I can really see why it's not better here in Orlando now. Dudes are simping hard with this, "I care are about the girls, let me treat them like queens and give them extra money all the time". LOL nah man. They are there to be plowed and then when you leave the next dude is there to plow. It's strictly business. None of these girls care about any of us, they are trying to make money. If they did, you wouldn't be paying. Yea that doesn't mean be an ass or whatever, but it's not EHarmony. Just be chill and clean and you'll get good service 9/10, it's really that simple. Let me say that again in case it didn't translate.

Just be chill and clean and you'll get good service 9/10, it's really that simple.

But worse, all this "I laid down $300 to get treated better" and "I paid extra because I know it'd be good" is mind-blowing. I'm not a genius at all but even I can see rates rise because of that. When you "pay $300" or whatever, eventually you can push the standard higher. THEN you'll be paying $350 to "be better" while everyone has to pay $300. Then after that you'll be "paying $400". Etc etc. All you're doing is making the girls feel like they are underpaid by others, raising the rates, and then paying even more than the new standard. From my short time in the game I've already seen it happen once because of dudes. In the NYC spots everyone is paying more as a whole and the pay structure has changed for this exact same reason. It just doesn't make any sense at all.

Ultimately this entire post is pointless, because some going to simp no matter what, but this needed to be said regardless.

MMAFighter205 - Never Stop Fighting.

[QUOTE=MMAfighter205;6700441]Reading the last few pages I see why things happen the way they do now. I'm still fairly new but have gone to the AMPs significantly less lately here since experiencing the NYC scene, but man, I can really see why it's not better here in Orlando now. Dudes are simping hard with this, "I care are about the girls, let me treat them like queens and give them extra money all the time". LOL nah man. They are there to be plowed and then when you leave the next dude is there to plow. It's strictly business. None of these girls care about any of us, they are trying to make money. If they did, you wouldn't be paying. Yea that doesn't mean be an ass or whatever, but it's not EHarmony. Just be chill and clean and you'll get good service 9/10, it's really that simple. Let me say that again in case it didn't translate.

Just be chill and clean and you'll get good service 9/10, it's really that simple.

But worse, all this "I laid down $300 to get treated better" and "I paid extra because I know it'd be good" is mind-blowing. I'm not a genius at all but even I can see rates rise because of that. When you "pay $300" or whatever, eventually you can push the standard higher. THEN you'll be paying $350 to "be better" while everyone has to pay $300. Then after that you'll be "paying $400". Etc etc. All you're doing is making the girls feel like they are underpaid by others, raising the rates, and then paying even more than the new standard. From my short time in the game I've already seen it happen once because of dudes. In the NYC spots everyone is paying more as a whole and the pay structure has changed for this exact same reason. It just doesn't make any sense at all..[/QUOTE]Perfectly stated. Treating the girls decently and overpaying are two completely separate issues and should not be conflated.

Anyway unless the forum policy changes to ban all of these simp posts, I won't be writing any further reports. I am not going to share info with guys who are just going to overpay and ruin the good action for everyone else.

[QUOTE=MMAfighter205;6700441]Reading the last few pages I see why things happen the way they do now. I'm still fairly new but have gone to the AMPs significantly less lately here since experiencing the NYC scene, but man, I can really see why it's not better here in Orlando now. Dudes are simping hard with this, "I care are about the girls, let me treat them like queens and give them extra money all the time". LOL nah man. They are there to be plowed and then when you leave the next dude is there to plow. It's strictly business. None of these girls care about any of us, they are trying to make money. If they did, you wouldn't be paying. Yea that doesn't mean be an ass or whatever, but it's not EHarmony. Just be chill and clean and you'll get good service 9/10, it's really that simple. Let me say that again in case it didn't translate.

Just be chill and clean and you'll get good service 9/10, it's really that simple.

But worse, all this "I laid down $300 to get treated better" and "I paid extra because I know it'd be good" is mind-blowing. I'm not a genius at all but even I can see rates rise because of that. When you "pay $300" or whatever, eventually you can push the standard higher. THEN you'll be paying $350 to "be better" while everyone has to pay $300. Then after that you'll be "paying $400". Etc etc. All you're doing is making the girls feel like they are underpaid by others, raising the rates, and then paying even more than the new standard. From my short time in the game I've already seen it happen once because of dudes. In the NYC spots everyone is paying more as a whole and the pay structure has changed for this exact same reason. It just doesn't make any sense at all.

Ultimately this entire post is pointless, because some going to simp no matter what, but this needed to be said regardless.

MMAFighter205 - Never Stop Fighting.[/QUOTE]You posted some very valid points. Especially about mongers thinking they become a special client just by tipping more.

However, rising rates are certainly more impacted by the economic reality of inflation. Everything is costing more than it did three years ago. Even our hobby favors.

An example is I just purchased two pounds of sliced deli cheese from Costco. Three years ago this package cost $7. 99. Now it's $9. 99. Same cheese. Same package. Same flavor. That's a 25% increase in three years. Pretty typical for everything from food to rent to cars. And why this dramatic increase? Because other cheese mongers were overpaying to get special cheese? Nope. Inflation. Simp. Nothing more than that.

So apply that same inflating to hobby costs. What cost $160 three years ago should be $200 now. What cost $200 three years ago should be $250 now. What cost $240 three years ago should be $300 now. And that's where we are at. Inflation. Simp. No need to get a special prosecutor involved. This one boils down to economic reality.

Just my opinion. But it's right.

Postulate.

G2.

[QUOTE=Gene2;6700643]You posted some very valid points. Especially about mongers thinking they become a special client just by tipping more.

However, rising rates are certainly more impacted by the economic reality of inflation. Everything is costing more than it did three years ago. Even our hobby favors.

An example is I just purchased two pounds of sliced deli cheese from Costco. Three years ago this package cost $7. 99. Now it's $9. 99. Same cheese. Same package. Same flavor. That's a 25% increase in three years. Pretty typical for everything from food to rent to cars. And why this dramatic increase? Because other cheese mongers were overpaying to get special cheese? Nope. Inflation. Simp. Nothing more than that.

So apply that same inflating to hobby costs. What cost $160 three years ago should be $200 now. What cost $200 three years ago should be $250 now. What cost $240 three years ago should be $300 now. And that's where we are at. Inflation. Simp. No need to get a special prosecutor involved. This one boils down to economic reality.

Just my opinion. But it's right.

Postulate.

G2.[/QUOTE]These Simpflation rates are getting out of hand.

Very well stated. It is simple economics. The price of everything and I repeat everything is determined by what someone else is willing to pay.

GS.

[QUOTE=MMAfighter205;6700441]Reading the last few pages I see why things happen the way they do now. I'm still fairly new but have gone to the AMPs significantly less lately here since experiencing the NYC scene, but man, I can really see why it's not better here in Orlando now. Dudes are simping hard with this, "I care are about the girls, let me treat them like queens and give them extra money all the time". LOL nah man. They are there to be plowed and then when you leave the next dude is there to plow. It's strictly business. None of these girls care about any of us, they are trying to make money. If they did, you wouldn't be paying. Yea that doesn't mean be an ass or whatever, but it's not EHarmony. Just be chill and clean and you'll get good service 9/10, it's really that simple. Let me say that again in case it didn't translate.

Just be chill and clean and you'll get good service 9/10, it's really that simple.

But worse, all this "I laid down $300 to get treated better" and "I paid extra because I know it'd be good" is mind-blowing. I'm not a genius at all but even I can see rates rise because of that. When you "pay $300" or whatever, eventually you can push the standard higher. THEN you'll be paying $350 to "be better" while everyone has to pay $300. Then after that you'll be "paying $400". Etc etc. All you're doing is making the girls feel like they are underpaid by others, raising the rates, and then paying even more than the new standard. From my short time in the game I've already seen it happen once because of dudes. In the NYC spots everyone is paying more as a whole and the pay structure has changed for this exact same reason. It just doesn't make any sense at all.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Gslvs69;6701483]Very well stated. It is simple economics. The price of everything and I repeat everything is determined by what someone else is willing to pay.

GS.[/QUOTE]People blame inflation and what not for the up cost. Yeah that can be said for groceries and rent but not this. WE and only US control the pricing, if a girl gets GPS it's because, like he said, someone put it in her head that she is worth more. And most of the time that's not even the case.

I'm having a hard time finding a companion down here on vacation (granted I'll take some of the blame since I didn't pay for a rental car, not being able to do outcall has cost me a few times already) but I figured a vacation spot would have ample opportunity.

Nope, got nothing. Unless I want to fork over what I believe is GPS pricing.

[QUOTE=YoungOne23;6703060]People blame inflation and what not for the up cost. Yeah that can be said for groceries and rent but not this. WE and only US control the pricing, if a girl gets GPS it's because, like he said, someone put it in her head that she is worth more. And most of the time that's not even the case.

I'm having a hard time finding a companion down here on vacation (granted I'll take some of the blame since I didn't pay for a rental car, not being able to do outcall has cost me a few times already) but I figured a vacation spot would have ample opportunity.

Nope, got nothing. Unless I want to fork over what I believe is GPS pricing.[/QUOTE]Not trying to throw this topic fullly into economics lessons, but that's the same as any other commodity. You pay more because others are willing to pay more. If the price of Swiss cheese goes up, and the public in general rejects that price save for the few "cheese simps" out there, the price will either lower or the Swiss cheese sellers will have to rely on a very small customer base.

Bottom line is, one or two overpayers aren't going to drive up prices in an open market. They may be stupid for their spending habits, but the market price is going to stay where the average buyer controls it. It's no different than if a bunch of guys start haggling the price down all the sudden. The price isn't going to lower. It will still remain at the average, and some buyers will offer less and get a sale, others will not.

I can understand GPS if a provider is only seeing a few clients a month and one or two overpay. But in the AMP market or the regular escort market (where this complaint seems to have started from) the law of averages based on the volume of their business keeps those few over-payers (and hagglers) from driving the price either way. I don't think it's worth bitching about, honestly.

So we all hate it when a provider strings us along and wastes our time and resources. It's happened to all of us. They pester us for deposits and / or "verification" pictures. We waste hours of time driving to a location and get ghosted, sometimes after having given some money and / or pictures, sometimes not.

But either way it pisses us off when we get ghosted or cancelled last minute because we lost out on time / money and got nothing to show for it.

What do we do? We all go right to the Negative Escort reviews and put that girl on blast when it happens to us, right?

Well, what about the guys who string a provider along, cause her to lose hours of time, and pester her for pic after pic? Where does that provider get to go to put the monger on blast?

Reason I ask, is a provider whom I'm friends with had that happen today. She shared receipts with me, so I know it's true. A senior member who posts all over the state pulled this shit on her. Texted her incessantly asking for nudes, asked for special accommodation in regard to her schedule (she had to make arrangements for family stuff to make his appointment happen) and then cancelled last minute on her. That's bullcrap. I'm not going to name the member just yet. I'm going to PM him a link to this post.

I think he owes her an apology and maybe a little bit of compensation. But if it gets ignored, I think I'll post receipts so maybe he gets blacklisted on other UTR lists aside from this provider's. We need to make sure the girls we like to see aren't being treated like shit.

Although in theory the idea is sound, the problem in reality is that there is anonymity for the Monger. There are no photos or anything for the providers to share and write with. Mongers can change their name, and their #s. So, how would a provider share information reliably?

Also, then comes the question of how to trust what the providers share? - Unless 2 providers know each other very well: Considering mental histories: How could one provider trust the words of another?

Being moral and upright for a monger is good to have, but in this line of biz, can we really expect that? Morality and righteousness?

SG.

[QUOTE=Cocoacruiser;6716522]So we all hate it when a provider strings us along and wastes our time and resources. It's happened to all of us. They pester us for deposits and / or "verification" pictures. We waste hours of time driving to a location and get ghosted, sometimes after having given some money and / or pictures, sometimes not.

But either way it pisses us off when we get ghosted or cancelled last minute because we lost out on time / money and got nothing to show for it.

What do we do? We all go right to the Negative Escort reviews and put that girl on blast when it happens to us, right?

Well, what about the guys who string a provider along, cause her to lose hours of time, and pester her for pic after pic? Where does that provider get to go to put the monger on blast?

Reason I ask, is a provider whom I'm friends with had that happen today. She shared receipts with me, so I know it's true. A senior member who posts all over the state pulled this shit on her. Texted her incessantly asking for nudes, asked for special accommodation in regard to her schedule (she had to make arrangements for family stuff to make his appointment happen) and then cancelled last minute on her. That's bullcrap. I'm not going to name the member just yet. I'm going to PM him a link to this post.

I think he owes her an apology and maybe a little bit of compensation. But if it gets ignored, I think I'll post receipts so maybe he gets blacklisted on other UTR lists aside from this provider's. We need to make sure the girls we like to see aren't being treated like shit.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=StainGlass;6716996]Although in theory the idea is sound, the problem in reality is that there is anonymity for the Monger. There are no photos or anything for the providers to share and write with. Mongers can change their name, and their #s. So, how would a provider share information reliably?

Also, then comes the question of how to trust what the providers share? - Unless 2 providers know each other very well: Considering mental histories: How could one provider trust the words of another?

Being moral and upright for a monger is good to have, but in this line of biz, can we really expect that? Morality and righteousness?

SG.[/QUOTE]There is a small and growing group with a den mother.

They share names, numbers and descriptions.

And.

The UTRs complain to their gates who put them on ignore lists.

They categorize us as Number Collectors, Photogs, Window Shoppers, Pen Pals, Assholes / Creeps, Tourists and Regulars.

A good gate will keep up with their lists and put you on the ignore list for getting new numbers and some of the gates talk to each other.

Some of the girls will send A head shot, some won't.

UTRs are told if I ever see a head shot of them it should be taken by her next gate.

If you want more pictures than are already provided you can pay for them.

That separates the time wasters.

Also.

We get good reviews also. Nothing specific, just whether they like you or not. Those guys get put into backchanneks and are first in line for any new girl or when an elusive girls drops back in for a minute. It pays to keep your face clean.

[QUOTE=StainGlass;6716996]Although in theory the idea is sound, the problem in reality is that there is anonymity for the Monger. There are no photos or anything for the providers to share and write with. Mongers can change their name, and their #s. So, how would a provider share information reliably?

Also, then comes the question of how to trust what the providers share? - Unless 2 providers know each other very well: Considering mental histories: How could one provider trust the words of another?

Being moral and upright for a monger is good to have, but in this line of biz, can we really expect that? Morality and righteousness?

SG.[/QUOTE]Mongers can change their names, but they lose their seniority status and all the content the UTR providers use to validate them. So, sure. A monger can still ghost on this site, but doing so burns them as well. I think most of us value our reputations on here enough that we'd choose to keep our name and clear up any issues we might have caused.

Case in point: The monger in question chose to do the right thing and make amends with that provider. I've heard from both parties involved. I won't be giving out his name because he appears to have seen his error and is fixing it.

As far as providers and their mental status, thats a valid point. There are some providers out there who might try to abuse a system and leverage someone’s status. I think we as a group would be able to see thru that though.

But if they have receipts about the concern I think they should have a place to air their grievances and if it turns out the monger has a valid defense, they can bring it. It might turn out that a discussion online will sort out wrinkles in communication for either side.

[QUOTE=Cocoacruiser;6716522]So we all hate it when a provider strings us along and wastes our time and resources. It's happened to all of us. They pester us for deposits and / or "verification" pictures. We waste hours of time driving to a location and get ghosted, sometimes after having given some money and / or pictures, sometimes not.

But either way it pisses us off when we get ghosted or cancelled last minute because we lost out on time / money and got nothing to show for it.

What do we do? We all go right to the Negative Escort reviews and put that girl on blast when it happens to us, right?

Well, what about the guys who string a provider along, cause her to lose hours of time, and pester her for pic after pic? Where does that provider get to go to put the monger on blast?

Reason I ask, is a provider whom I'm friends with had that happen today. She shared receipts with me, so I know it's true. A senior member who posts all over the state pulled this shit on her. Texted her incessantly asking for nudes, asked for special accommodation in regard to her schedule (she had to make arrangements for family stuff to make his appointment happen) and then cancelled last minute on her. That's bullcrap. I'm not going to name the member just yet. I'm going to PM him a link to this post.

I think he owes her an apology and maybe a little bit of compensation. But if it gets ignored, I think I'll post receipts so maybe he gets blacklisted on other UTR lists aside from this provider's. We need to make sure the girls we like to see aren't being treated like shit.[/QUOTE]Great post, if we don't take care of the good ones we won't have any good ones.

Another point to consider is that when mongers are wasting all the girls bandwidth it prevents legit inquiries from getting through. Providers I know have shown me the endless list of texts they get sometimes. I have even experienced this when sharing info on providers I get 50 questions from interested mongers.

GS.

So many times I see a negative review and I decide to go check out a chick anyway because she peaked my curiosity. Sometimes the negative reviews are warranted, but I have also found the girl turns out to be pretty damn good! The same is true for ones that have great reviews and she sucks not in a good way. Sometimes I have also seen where some nut jobs in hobby will post shit about a girl because they don't want others to have her. Yes it does happen more than you think. Guys with multiple handles just causing shit for a girl for no reason then they are a nut job and maybe jealous. So my advice is sometimes give a chick a chance you might find your golden egg! I've had a few! Also don't always believe everything your read there are nutjobs that can cause havoc and run these girls through hell with bogus reports and fucking with them through multiple numbers and fake date setups. Not saying some don't deserve to starve and not get our money! I can name a few that should!

Now as we head into Christmas things slow down for our Favorite girls. If you have the means think about sending something random for Christmas! Some will give me shit for this advice as they haggle every penny they spend to put their cock in one of these girls. Maybe I'm messing up the pussyflation or causing some GPS. If you have the money and you have one you see on the regular send them a little something on the cash ap to help them out around Christmas. You might be surprised on how it comes back to you in the future. Maybe you don't get shit out of it. I have the means to do so and have taken care of a couple of my favs this Christmas! Maitland mom and Jenna are my two ATF girls from the UTR board. If you don't have the means and will miss the money don't do it. Save your $$.

Just some friendly advice! Take it or leave it. JB.

What a wonderful msg for the longer term. You rock.

This is very true for any longer term relationship to work. For ATFs, your goto lists. This is a treasure trove, and thanks definitely for bringing it up and reminding people that it is good to give, and the good notions. If this is done without any expectation. You would realize that the potential it comes back (IF it comes back, is many folds greater).

I wish we had some Emojis or +1 on these kind of beautiful posts.

SG.

[QUOTE=JohnyBig;6722930]So many times I see a negative review and I decide to go check out a chick anyway because she peaked my curiosity. Sometimes the negative reviews are warranted, but I have also found the girl turns out to be pretty damn good! The same is true for ones that have great reviews and she sucks not in a good way. Sometimes I have also seen where some nut jobs in hobby will post shit about a girl because they don't want others to have her. Yes it does happen more than you think. Guys with multiple handles just causing shit for a girl for no reason then they are a nut job and maybe jealous. So my advice is sometimes give a chick a chance you might find your golden egg! I've had a few! Also don't always believe everything your read there are nutjobs that can cause havoc and run these girls through hell with bogus reports and fucking with them through multiple numbers and fake date setups. Not saying some don't deserve to starve and not get our money! I can name a few that should!

Now as we head into Christmas things slow down for our Favorite girls. If you have the means think about sending something random for Christmas! Some will give me shit for this advice as they haggle every penny they spend to put their cock in one of these girls. Maybe I'm messing up the pussyflation or causing some GPS. If you have the money and you have one you see on the regular send them a little something on the cash ap to help them out around Christmas. You might be surprised on how it comes back to you in the future. Maybe you don't get shit out of it. I have the means to do so and have taken care of a couple of my favs this Christmas! Maitland mom and Jenna are my two ATF girls from the UTR board. If you don't have the means and will miss the money don't do it. Save your $$.

Just some friendly advice! Take it or leave it. JB.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Cocoacruiser;6716522]So we all hate it when a provider strings us along and wastes our time and resources. It's happened to all of us. They pester us for deposits and / or "verification" pictures. We waste hours of time driving to a location and get ghosted, sometimes after having given some money and / or pictures, sometimes not.

But either way it pisses us off when we get ghosted or cancelled last minute because we lost out on time / money and got nothing to show for it.

What do we do? We all go right to the Negative Escort reviews and put that girl on blast when it happens to us, right?

Well, what about the guys who string a provider along, cause her to lose hours of time, and pester her for pic after pic? Where does that provider get to go to put the monger on blast?

Reason I ask, is a provider whom I'm friends with had that happen today. She shared receipts with me, so I know it's true. A senior member who posts all over the state pulled this shit on her. Texted her incessantly asking for nudes, asked for special accommodation in regard to her schedule (she had to make arrangements for family stuff to make his appointment happen) and then cancelled last minute on her. That's bullcrap. I'm not going to name the member just yet. I'm going to PM him a link to this post.

I think he owes her an apology and maybe a little bit of compensation. But if it gets ignored, I think I'll post receipts so maybe he gets blacklisted on other UTR lists aside from this provider's. We need to make sure the girls we like to see aren't being treated like shit.[/QUOTE]So a regular provider of mine had another issue where a monger here stalled her for hours and pulled a complete no-show. Of course she sent receipts.

Come on guys, you're hurting these girls and you're keeping those of us who actually show up from being able to. She coulda been making money with me or someone else during the time she sat around waiting on you to show up or call or text.

That hurts her especially bad with it being the holiday season where girls are seeing less traffic. This girl lost out on another opportunity because the first guy was booked. Then the first guy (our monger) no-showed. Same deal, I'm going to give him time to make amends before I name names.

Like Johnny Big mentioned in the report just before mine, this is the time of year we should be looking out for the good ones. Giving a bit extra or just sending them a little gift money if you don't have time to visit them. If she is a Positive Review-level provider, we should try to take care of her in her slow season.

Look I get it. But it's just money and math. You are a limited time to make something happen, a limited amount of funds, your managing risk on a number of fronts. The only logical thing to do is have a number of conversations happening at once. I guarantee that hobbyist started out as a "these girls are real people and deserve respect," kind of dude. But after about four or five times getting stuck in various types of precarious situations, you do what you got to do. Once I'm in the room, I'm all about respect and humanity. But until we get to that point, this is a business. Business is about numbers and opportunity. Everyone is jockying for best position in a free market. You aren't going to put an end to this. You protect your time, your money, and your freedom at all costs. If you try to spend your time being a sweetheart in a coldhearted world, no one gets burned but you. Everyone has to protect themselves. Provider should know these signs and protect her time and shut it down. Easy peasy. John is a very common name.

[QUOTE=Cocoacruiser;672]So a regular provider of mine had another issue where a monger here stalled her for hours and pulled a complete no-show. Of course she sent receipts.

Come on guys, you're hurting these girls and you're keeping those of us who actually show up from being able to. She coulda been making money with me or someone else during the time she sat around waiting on you to show up or call or text.

That hurts her especially bad with it being the holiday season where girls are seeing less traffic. This girl lost out on another opportunity because the first guy was booked. Then the first guy (our monger) no-showed. Same deal, I'm going to give him time to make amends before I name names.

Like Johnny Big mentioned in the report just before mine, this is the time of year we should be looking out for the good ones. Giving a bit extra or just sending them a little gift money if you don't have time to visit them. If she is a Positive Review-level provider, we should try to take care of her in her slow season.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=EonBlues;6723910]Look I get it. But it's just money and math. You are a limited time to make something happen, a limited amount of funds, your managing risk on a number of fronts. The only logical thing to do is have a number of conversations happening at once. I guarantee that hobbyist started out as a "these girls are real people and deserve respect," kind of dude. But after about four or five times getting stuck in various types of precarious situations, you do what you got to do. Once I'm in the room, I'm all about respect and humanity. But until we get to that point, this is a business. Business is about numbers and opportunity. Everyone is jockying for best position in a free market. You aren't going to put an end to this. You protect your time, your money, and your freedom at all costs. If you try to spend your time being a sweetheart in a coldhearted world, no one gets burned but you. Everyone has to protect themselves. Provider should know these signs and protect her time and shut it down. Easy peasy. John is a very common name.[/QUOTE]I'll be honest, I've wasted a few girls' time. But at the end of the day, like you said; it's business. When the lock clicks I'm in simp mode, but until then, it's dog eat dog. I for one don't appreciate the poor communication from these girls that makes you not give two cares about their bottom line. Maybe they need to organize and clean that mess up collectively. When you send a message and don't get a reply until 3 hrs later. And when they message you back and you reply a couple SECONDS later and they don't answer until like 15-20 min later (and sometimes hrs later)? I mean seriously. I understand they have other dudes hitting them up but cmon, this is their business. This is their job. "I'm a business woman" LOL No other business operates with the customer service that these ladies give and not go out of business. Literally, the only people that respond right back when you message them are the scammers who will say they are in whatever city / state you tell them you're in that are trying to get you to give a "deposit. " Then there's the bait and switching that is rampant upon a lot of these girls. So whenever I reach out and I get a reply in less than a min, it's a red flag to me.

I show up to places knowing that they aren't going to be the ones in the pics, so I'm ready to bounce as soon as I see they catfished me. When they start acting with integrity, I'll follow along. Again, I'm all about treating them like they are people just like everyone else, there are even a couple that I would even date if they gave up this life, but overall, they have to do better not wasting our time before mongers give them the benefit of the doubt.

[QUOTE=SingleStroller;6724115]I'll be honest, I've wasted a few girls' time. But at the end of the day, like you said; it's business. When the lock clicks I'm in simp mode, but until then, it's dog eat dog. I for one don't appreciate the poor communication from these girls that makes you not give two cares about their bottom line. Maybe they need to organize and clean that mess up collectively. When you send a message and don't get a reply until 3 hrs later. And when they message you back and you reply a couple SECONDS later and they don't answer until like 15-20 min later (and sometimes hrs later)? I mean seriously. I understand they have other dudes hitting them up but cmon, this is their business. This is their job. "I'm a business woman" LOL No other business operates with the customer service that these ladies give and not go out of business. Literally, the only people that respond right back when you message them are the scammers who will say they are in whatever city / state you tell them you're in that are trying to get you to give a "deposit. " Then there's the bait and switching that is rampant upon a lot of these girls. So whenever I reach out and I get a reply in less than a min, it's a red flag to me.

I show up to places knowing that they aren't going to be the ones in the pics, so I'm ready to bounce as soon as I see they catfished me. When they start acting with integrity, I'll follow along. Again, I'm all about treating them like they are people just like everyone else, there are even a couple that I would even date if they gave up this life, but overall, they have to do better not wasting our time before mongers give them the benefit of the doubt.[/QUOTE]I just I know I hate it when my time gets burned up by someone stringing me along making promises, and it sounds like you do too. We have a place where we can warn other guys when this happens. Not a black list or anything, just a spot where we can point them out and say "hey guys, this provider gave me the run-around or catfished or whatever". So other mongers can take that info and make up their own mind as to whether to chase after seeing that provider. But the providers on this forum don't have that. Not here anyway.

We've all made mistakes in this hobby. I don't think anyone needs to be burned at the stake if they messed up and caused an issue.

But, just like we like to know about providers who have a pattern of poor behavior, maybe they should have a way to see that too. That's all.

[QUOTE=Cocoacruiser;6723863]So a regular provider of mine had another issue where a monger here stalled her for hours and pulled a complete no-show. Of course she sent receipts.

Come on guys, you're hurting these girls and you're keeping those of us who actually show up from being able to. She coulda been making money with me or someone else during the time she sat around waiting on you to show up or call or text.

That hurts her especially bad with it being the holiday season where girls are seeing less traffic. This girl lost out on another opportunity because the first guy was booked. Then the first guy (our monger) no-showed. Same deal, I'm going to give him time to make amends before I name names.

Like Johnny Big mentioned in the report just before mine, this is the time of year we should be looking out for the good ones. Giving a bit extra or just sending them a little gift money if you don't have time to visit them. If she is a Positive Review-level provider, we should try to take care of her in her slow season.[/QUOTE]Update: the monger in question made amends.

I've been around for a minute, made a few friends here, shared a ton of info with lots of ya, got every set of UTR digits I've ever asked for, gotten references from one UTR to another for being polite, clean, and all that happy BS, and now I'm being denied UTR digits when regular members are getting them. Go figure, they say SM's only and I get denied and a regular posts on his good time. SS96 out.

[QUOTE=MarkGew;6771746]Seeing a lot of bad reviews, maybe because it's near the end of the month and their ready for time off?? 15 plus tricks a day 7 days a week for a month or 2 or 3(ouch) Hopefully a fresh batch comes in February.[/QUOTE]Shrugs. I tend to take any reviews from either extreme with a grain of salt.

We have some people on the forum who always write such glowing reviews for the same exact spa and / or Penthouse forum letters that don't match any of the reality I've ever seen. So I always figure those people are either owners, shills or simps who are doing reviews at the request of a girl to get more business.

Then we have some people who seem to come in on the other end where it sounds like they're just exceptionally high-maintenance 'Karens' who want to ***** about even the slightest inconvenience or irregularity. Which always makes me laugh as I think to myself -- Well I guess beggars CAN be choosers after all.

It was the same back when Milk was in the top game in town and it's the same now. All I know is that I go fairly often and I haven't had a bad experience in quite a long time.

Well said!

[QUOTE=OlderThanRocks;6771789]Shrugs. I tend to take any reviews from either extreme with a grain of salt.

We have some people on the forum who always write such glowing reviews for the same exact spa and / or Penthouse forum letters that don't match any of the reality I've ever seen. So I always figure those people are either owners, shills or simps who are doing reviews at the request of a girl to get more business.

Then we have some people who seem to come in on the other end where it sounds like they're just exceptionally high-maintenance 'Karens' who want to ***** about even the slightest inconvenience or irregularity. Which always makes me laugh as I think to myself -- Well I guess beggars CAN be choosers after all.

It was the same back when Milk was in the top game in town and it's the same now. All I know is that I go fairly often and I haven't had a bad experience in quite a long time.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=OlderThanRocks;6771789]Shrugs. I tend to take any reviews from either extreme with a grain of salt.

We have some people on the forum who always write such glowing reviews for the same exact spa and / or Penthouse forum letters that don't match any of the reality I've ever seen. So I always figure those people are either owners, shills or simps who are doing reviews at the request of a girl to get more business.

Then we have some people who seem to come in on the other end where it sounds like they're just exceptionally high-maintenance 'Karens' who want to ***** about even the slightest inconvenience or irregularity. Which always makes me laugh as I think to myself -- Well I guess beggars CAN be choosers after all.

It was the same back when Milk was in the top game in town and it's the same now. All I know is that I go fairly often and I haven't had a bad experience in quite a long time.[/QUOTE]I concur. In the 2+ yrs in getting into this hobby I've only had one really sub-par experience at You Massage. Every other time has been either on the level or amazing. I just try to describe what the girls look like because looks are pretty important for my experience. You all don't need every little detail unless they do something extraordinary. I've been enough that I know the regulars that I like and they know what I am looking for. These forums have been helpful though in identifying new places or spots to avoid. I am not one to TOFTT. It costs too much to risk having a bad experience.

[QUOTE=OlderThanRocks;6771789]Shrugs. I tend to take any reviews from either extreme with a grain of salt.

We have some people on the forum who always write such glowing reviews for the same exact spa and / or Penthouse forum letters that don't match any of the reality I've ever seen. So I always figure those people are either owners, shills or simps who are doing reviews at the request of a girl to get more business.

Then we have some people who seem to come in on the other end where it sounds like they're just exceptionally high-maintenance 'Karens' who want to ***** about even the slightest inconvenience or irregularity. Which always makes me laugh as I think to myself -- Well I guess beggars CAN be choosers after all.

It was the same back when Milk was in the top game in town and it's the same now. All I know is that I go fairly often and I haven't had a bad experience in quite a long time.[/QUOTE]It's quite obvious what most reviews are nowadays. Everything has become exaggerated for sensationalism. I'm personally out of the review game for a couple reasons but mostly because it's become a dick measuring contest. I've always felt that reviews should be more about information than a story. Shills are putting out penthouse reviews that never match up to expectations. I've known all the popular girls in town for a few years now and while I enjoy every moment of my time with each of them, some of those girls don't do everything that you put in these over the top reviews. It doesn't detract from my experience as I know these girls enough to know what to expect, but someone here might read one of these reviews and go there expecting the same exact experience and end up leaving with a less than experience. I'd honestly say that these shill posts are so obvious that it would actually turn off potential customers who can see such blatant exaggeration. Which is disappointing because they are worth your time and money that they don't need anyone shilling for them.

Feel free to PM me if you want any Intel. I'll keep it real.

Providers that you guys are paying for is laughable. Most say they will repeat even with so so service. Wake the hell up.

[QUOTE=SlimShady96;6771426]I've been around for a minute, made a few friends here, shared a ton of info with lots of ya, got every set of UTR digits I've ever asked for, gotten references from one UTR to another for being polite, clean, and all that happy BS, and now I'm being denied UTR digits when regular members are getting them. Go figure, they say SM's only and I get denied and a regular posts on his good time. SS96 out.[/QUOTE]You got girls on old Cheney giving it away for as low as 10 dollars but got a bunch of mongers saying there's nothing out there don't worry about it in this game there's always going to be greedy gatekeepers shift idk what's worse cheap hoes or there gatekeepers.

[QUOTE=SlimShady96;6771426]I've been around for a minute, made a few friends here, shared a ton of info with lots of ya, got every set of UTR digits I've ever asked for, gotten references from one UTR to another for being polite, clean, and all that happy BS, and now I'm being denied UTR digits when regular members are getting them. Go figure, they say SM's only and I get denied and a regular posts on his good time. SS96 out.[/QUOTE]Some UTRs take an active role in the picking and choosing.

They each typical have their own criteria for who gets their number.

Gatekeepers aren't pimps and the UTR doesn't just fuck anyone they get sent.

And occasionally a mistake is made and a regular slips through or some one who should get a number gets overlooked in a blitz.

But senior status is the minimum requirement usually.

Some girls want a high post count, some girls want a particular type of guy, some girls just want him to have a dick and a wallet.

For the most part UTR are low profile low volume amateurs with a whole nother life, not any dick'll do fuck pros.

Damn. Some dudes just don't get it.

G2.

[blue] And you are that dude.

I'm not sure what you thought you would accomplish with this but in the future I will immediately ban any user of yours I find.

A2[/blue]

Some utr have told me that even with seniors that they actively look at your posts and see how you talk about people in general. Disrepect is never appreciated by them.

[QUOTE=WayneAshley380;6782392]Some UTRs take an active role in the picking and choosing.

They each typical have their own criteria for who gets their number.

Gatekeepers aren't pimps and the UTR doesn't just fuck anyone they get sent.

And occasionally a mistake is made and a regular slips through or some one who should get a number gets overlooked in a blitz.

But senior status is the minimum requirement usually.

Some girls want a high post count, some girls want a particular type of guy, some girls just want him to have a dick and a wallet.

For the most part UTR are low profile low volume amateurs with a whole nother life, not any dick'll do fuck pros.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=ParraDice;6789083]Had the same experience with her last night. Incredible body, very toned stomach, and soft big ass. Very comparable to Miah but Sofia's face is more pretty. Miah also gives slightly better service. She left for Ft Lauderdale without plans to come back to Orlando after all her recent drama. Very similar to what happened to Miah and why she swore not to come back to Orlando. Obviously Miah has said she's returning now but hopefully people don't drive her away again. Sucks that two excellent providers have terrible opinions of it here. But they all return eventually.[/QUOTE]I thought this would happen when all that drama happened and pissed her off. Sucks to lose another one again but don't blame her if everyone know why. As for Miah I be surprised if she does come because of a certain situation here. If she does probably going to see her regulars no ads just let the ones she knows aware. Also I did post about PR Bianca coming but was waiting for her to reply on snapchat because everyone kept asking about her ad. So she did say yes she coming Friday to me but she hasn't replied to me since Saturday when I asked about if she really is here because there's no ads of her when everyone kept asking for it. So I'll give out her snapchat it's realbriannafl. That's the snapchat she posted on Friday.

[QUOTE=FlthotSlayer;6790004]I thought this would happen when all that drama happened and pissed her off. Sucks to lose another one again but don't blame her if everyone know why. As for Miah I be surprised if she does come because of a certain situation here. If she does probably going to see her regulars no ads just let the ones she knows aware. Also I did post about PR Bianca coming but was waiting for her to reply on snapchat because everyone kept asking about her ad. So she did say yes she coming Friday to me but she hasn't replied to me since Saturday when I asked about if she really is here because there's no ads of her when everyone kept asking for it. So I'll give out her snapchat it's realbriannafl. That's the snapchat she posted on Friday.[/QUOTE]Did she get an MBA and a round of angle financing to start her own company? Doesn't she still have rent? And if she did you do realize that there are a thousand more?

Don't put shit like this on review threads, that's why I moved it to the stupid shit thread.

She caused the drama by inciting her white knights to ride.

A2.

These are all great points and I'll add one more. Not only do they stay away from those that post allot of negativity but I have been made aware that they favor those that leave positive reviews. They know that positive reviews help them build the clientele they want so they will avoid those that don't leave reviews at all.

GS.

[QUOTE=Bjceb;6782716]Some utr have told me that even with seniors that they actively look at your posts and see how you talk about people in general. Disrepect is never appreciated by them.[/QUOTE]