Wish this thread would be moved
This is such a valuable thread that it is a shame it is buried in the Richmond forum (no offense to the Virginia posters). I wonder if Jackson would consider making it a national forum.
This post may be somewhat controversial.
[QUOTE=Hernando;1222198]When a SB is ready to go to the FC I will ask her tactfully what she expects from our time together (edit delete). [/QUOTE]I'm sure Hernando handles the gift tactfully and it works for him. I handle it differently due to some strongly held views.
Women are good at expressing their feelings but not very good at making a decision when put on the spot. Just my view but I never ask a woman any question where the answer could make the situation more difficult for either of us. An example of what not to ask is the gift a SB is expecting. Without any experience on the subject (because I don't ask and I don't tell) I see little chance of an upside to discussing the gift in advance. I see risk the discussion will doom the relationship sooner or later no matter whether her answer is low, medium or high.
First, we have no way of knowing where she really is in her process of "coming out" as a SB. All we know is what she wants us to think. A question about her gift forces her to price herself to our face. That could kill the deal right there. She's traveled the thinking about it step and the accepting the idea step to some extent, all big steps, but each hypothetical steps only and in her head only. Now she is talking to us and this may be her first step actually talking the walk (I didn't say walking the walk) and here we are asking her to price herself. I call that being on the spot. Of course we won't present it that way but she will hear it that way and that's the problem. There's even this problem with a bona fide internet escort. They resent our attempt to put a price tag on them even though their websites do exactly that in most cases. This brings me to the obvious point that what people say about themselves is not fair game for us to say to them about themselves.
We need to make the SB's transition from talking the walk to walking the walk as easy for her to take on her own as we can or she'll walk the walk with some other guy. We can't let her "feel" she is being cornered by our questions. The risk is she will feel cornered no matter how we handle it; no matter how successfully (or luckily) we have handled it in the past. We must let her control her own pace in her own time and that means the pace of everything. We cannot push on a string over this or over anything.
Second, the question risks she may open with a number knocked out of the ballpark and that puts us at stalemate with no upside for having taken that risk. Questions should bring solutions not create problems or risk problems. This is not the way to negotiate.
Even if her number is in the outfield only our question brought us a number we're not happy with, and now we must treat each other like two used car dealers. I doubt any hot bedroom activity will flow from any of that. This is not the way to negotiate.
Suppose she opens with an infield fly. That's not any better for us. She'll figure out before long how she didn't know, how we knew better and took advantage of her, and we really did. Of course this will happen with a prize piece and we won't be able to save it because we did take unfair advantage, and what trust we had we lost. We get what we deserve. So much for our negotiating style. Again, just my opinion.
Maybe I'm not on the same page goal-wise with many here. If the idea is to have a series of one-shots and move on, well, okay. Talk money if it works.
Back to the programming for guys who want her around for a while until we decide to move on. Our negotiating style should be to not negotiate. Use fait accompli instead, and be fair and reasonable about it. Be someone she can count on who will not let her down. We become important that way.
I strongly think no discussion of her gift should be had ever, and in my experience I have never raised it and never had the woman raise it either. If I found one who did I would conclude she is a real pro, a pro in her own mind or at a minimum she has some real serious bills that must be paid by yesterday which means she is in a real corner, which is all the more reason to not take advantage of her situation. If she is that ready take her behind closed doors on the spot and pay her what she can really command. For that woman we know better what she is worth than she does. Tell her by showing her.
I've never failed to close a deal once we've talked on the phone, and not once has the gift ever come up. Everything is arranged and happens like an ordinary date in the ordinary world. This is part of not pushing on a string.
I’ve read about guys telling the girl what they were going to do with her in bed, her toes curling, and this and that, maybe that works, maybe I need some pointers.
The gift is handled when we are leaving each other. I use folded bills bound by a rubber band in my palm (she might be aware of the role occupied by the envelope, i.e., don't use an envelope) which I put in her purse palm down so she doesn't see a thing other than the top of my hand sliding in and out. She knows what is going on so there is no need for me to say a word. We all know what we say to a woman will get us into more trouble than most anything we do. This time is especially the time to not say a word. I deposit the gift when we are departing and I use a door opening or closing as the moment I've found that works the best. To make a reference to the gift at the time it is given, well, we might as well call her a name. She may even make reference to it herself but that doesn’t change that we should keep our mouth shut. We can always say things we don’t want others to say to us.
Only once have I experienced an issue with the gift. I was generous with a particular girl, generous meaning I gave her prevailing escort rates at the upper end (which she could command if she were in that market) (I figured she would know). Everything happened per usual and happened twice. She was very good, very accommodating and very hot. When arranging our third visit she surprised me by wanting to bargain up and had a much higher number in mind. The second surprise, she had driven to me the two times previous (the drive was 90 minutes one way which I acknowledge was material) and now she wanted me to drive to her. She wasn't talking about alternating the drive; she was talking about a permanent arrangement of me driving to her.
I took what I was hearing as sourced to the nature of her employment (she was a realtor; any offense taken by a realtor reading this, I'm sorry, but you do push on a string) and also by an affliction I did not know she had (the golden pussy syndrome). That syndrome always generates a deal breaker eventually so that was the end of that. While I have said we can't push on a string, the women can't either.
There is no future unless the parties accommodate each other naturally without working at it. Just my opinion.
Pushing on a string vs. Throwing the ACE of Spades
[QUOTE=Golfcart; 1223814]<edit delete
Only once have I experienced an issue with the gift. I was generous with a particular girl, generous meaning I gave her prevailing escort rates at the upper end (which she could command if she were in that market) (I figured she would know). Everything happened per usual and happened twice. She was very good, very accommodating and very hot. When arranging our third visit she surprised me by wanting to bargain up and had a much higher number in mind. The second surprise, she had driven to me the two times previous (the drive was 90 minutes one way which I acknowledge was material) and now she wanted me to drive to her. She wasn't talking about alternating the drive; she was talking about a permanent arrangement of me driving to her.
I took what I was hearing as sourced to the nature of her employment (she was a realtor; any offense taken by a realtor reading this, I'm sorry, but you do push on a string) and also by an affliction I did not know she had (the golden pussy syndrome). That syndrome always generates a deal breaker eventually so that was the end of that. While I have said we can't push on a string, the women can't either.
There is no future unless the parties accommodate each other naturally without working at it. Just my opinion.[/QUOTE]Golf is a plenty enough smart guy, maybe one of the brightest on the usasg site. I have enjoyed his perspective on many a circumstance via his many posts.
As to the situation of your Realtor gal, who moved the goal line on you in the 3rd quarter. Ala more sugar and you now driving the 90 miles instead of her. People don't generally throw out ultimatums (aka throwing the ACE of Spades) unless the results of such have little consequences to them. Either she didn't care if you followed thru on the new rules or maybe preferred that you didn't, but either way this may have been her way of breaking off the deal or letting you down slowly. Folks often feel better by offering an unrealistic or unreasonable alternative, rather than just stating their mind; e. G."I don't want to continue the gig". This way when you reneg on her offer, she didn't end things, you did; (in her mind) and that is what counted to her. Afterall, none of these gigs are meant to be forever. Some just last longer than others, but they all, with rare exception. Come to an end sometime.
As to this thread in general. It has certainly been one of the best reads of the entire site. I haven't beeen pursuing much in the way of new SB's, so have had nothing to contribute, but definitely enjoy the experiences of many here and the new contributors have further enhanced the lively discussions.
Sugar Talk and Multi Fucking
Re discussing sugar, I almost never do it in advance. I just put it in her purse or hand it to her afterwards. I don't go to the lengths Golf does but I can see why his way works and I can't see anything wrong with it. I don't think most of the girls I've been with are so shy about sugar after the fact as they are before.
Re fucking more than one, I find I get the hots for one girl and keep going back to her but I like keeping several more on the shelf in case my fave is unavailable. When I started, I thought I wanted to make the rounds all the time, but I find I don't.
Just my experience. Others may differ.
