General Reports

[QUOTE=SimonSmash;7128934]So any girl in NC who has some guys number, can just say " he paid me for sex " and that's it? Case closed? What about due process? Does she have to have been a hooker? Suppose I guy leaves a business card at a bar, the bartender is a *****. Keeps card w cell number, calls cops says this guy tipped me a lot asking for head, so now that guy get 4 months and the stigma? This law seems very unconstitutional. What are the cops and judges going to do that monger?[/QUOTE]Your scenario would not work because there would have to be more proof than your business card and tips. The issue with providers is that if you are responding to an ad that advertises sex for money, set something up and show up for it, your actions show your intent to engage in prostitution. A woman who is not a known provider would have to provide evidence that you solicited her for sex beyond just making a statement. It becomes your word against hers unless she can show text messages, emails, voice mails, etc.

[QUOTE=LifeLine;7129210]Your scenario would not work because there would have to be more proof than your business card and tips. The issue with providers is that if you are responding to an ad that advertises sex for money, set something up and show up for it, your actions show your intent to engage in prostitution. A woman who is not a known provider would have to provide evidence that you solicited her for sex beyond just making a statement. It becomes your word against hers unless she can show text messages, emails, voice mails, etc.[/QUOTE]To catch a predator comes to mind. They only need to prove intent. But even if you are picked up and then released the fact why you were picked up and for what is going to be all out there.

So, with the new law I'm taking it easy for a bit to see what happens. Unfortunately libido doesn't go away LOL and I'll have to be taking matters in my own hands more. Despite the likelihood of getting flamed does anyone have experience positive / negative with fleshlights, automated blowjob machines etc? Curious if I should make an investment. Obviously not the same as the real things but.

Let's say I message a girl on seeking and we set up a time to meet and "get to know each other". Theoretically, that should be safe, right? And then whatever happens on the date is fair game?

Its 2 weeks since the law went into effect. I haven't seen any notices of any Johns being arrested.

At Doctor Detroit. I've not seen any in our area (Wake, Johnston, Cumberland). Nothing in the news either. I'm also not seeing many SWs out either.

At MisterMister46 - go to the SB thread and more info should be there. I would assume that as long as you are talking about meeting for a date (which most SBs will do), then it wouldn't be a problem. If you send explicit texts, VMs, or do it via video chat then you are definitely putting yourself in a possibly bad situation.

[QUOTE=Endorfn2002;7129739]So, with the new law I'm taking it easy for a bit to see what happens. Unfortunately libido doesn't go away LOL and I'll have to be taking matters in my own hands more. Despite the likelihood of getting flamed does anyone have experience positive / negative with fleshlights, automated blowjob machines etc? Curious if I should make an investment. Obviously not the same as the real things but.[/QUOTE]I own two 2 different ones (One for Anal and One for V) and honestly with proper lube it is always a good experience for me. I mean it would be no different than.

A dream with a girl and you have no idea what to expect until you try it.

Honestly though, I have been seeing 2 of my regular girls Reign (For Anal / Greek) and Tamara (For FS) but I am also back on the apps for Tinder and Bumble as well and I was able to gift 2-3 of the women I've seen this week.

Still struggling to understand the motivation with this new law regarding AMPs.

Certainly just going to an AMP is not committing any crime, there is no internet other than a massage. If something more happens behind closed doors, then you would either have to be caught in the act via a raid or a camera, correct? The other scenario is that the masseuse could, after the fact, notify law enforcement. But where is the evidence in this scenario? There are no texts or emails, just her word. Is that enough? And what is her motivation, certainly once the word gets out, that AMP will be out of business.

My other point is that if they really wanted to stop mongers from going to AMPs, then why doesn't law enforcement just shut them all down like they did in Greensboro 10-15 years ago. Not one to be found after the city shut them all down. This would be a much more cost efficient approach to reduce this so called "Human Trafficking" problem.

[QUOTE=Fharmonic;7131607]Still struggling to understand the motivation with this new law regarding AMPs.

Certainly just going to an AMP is not committing any crime, there is no internet other than a massage. If something more happens behind closed doors, then you would either have to be caught in the act via a raid or a camera, correct? The other scenario is that the masseuse could, after the fact, notify law enforcement. But where is the evidence in this scenario? There are no texts or emails, just her word. Is that enough? And what is her motivation, certainly once the word gets out, that AMP will be out of business.

My other point is that if they really wanted to stop mongers from going to AMPs, then why doesn't law enforcement just shut them all down like they did in Greensboro 10-15 years ago. Not one to be found after the city shut them all down. This would be a much more cost efficient approach to reduce this so called "Human Trafficking" problem.[/QUOTE]I mean I wouldn't call human trafficking so-called, mate. It is a problem and it makes Hobbyist like ourselves look bad because mongers.

Will go for the easiest and cheapest option they can find to get off regardless of age, consent, and cognizance. That is a problem in and of itself.

And makes the hobby difficult.

I'm a good man. I work a great job. I respect the women I see and I make sure the women I see are quality women who actually have focus in their lives.

No disrespect to anyone, but I am not usually at a bookstore or prowlng the streets looking for low budget kitty that has been ran through 10 times that day before me.

[QUOTE=Fharmonic;7131607]Still struggling to understand the motivation with this new law regarding AMPs.

Certainly just going to an AMP is not committing any crime, there is no internet other than a massage. If something more happens behind closed doors, then you would either have to be caught in the act via a raid or a camera, correct? The other scenario is that the masseuse could, after the fact, notify law enforcement. But where is the evidence in this scenario? There are no texts or emails, just her word. Is that enough? And what is her motivation, certainly once the word gets out, that AMP will be out of business.

My other point is that if they really wanted to stop mongers from going to AMPs, then why doesn't law enforcement just shut them all down like they did in Greensboro 10-15 years ago. Not one to be found after the city shut them all down. This would be a much more cost efficient approach to reduce this so called "Human Trafficking" problem.[/QUOTE]I answered the legal case question over in the Charlotte forum, if you want to take a look over there. Regarding AMP's they're going to be hitting them from multiple directions. I don't believe any of them will exist in 6 months in this state. 1. The state is ramping up its' massage licensing requirements and inspections. 2. The new law has stiffer penalties for the owners and of course, provides an incentive for providers to flip on them and mongers. 3. Appeals Courts have determined that being sex trafficked is automatic grounds for a deportation stay. If the providers are here on a visa, flipping actually enables them to stay here in the US, where otherwise deportation proceedings will begin immediately. That's both a carrot and a stick.

[QUOTE=MmceStep;7131759]I answered the legal case question over in the Charlotte forum, if you want to take a look over there. Regarding AMP's they're going to be hitting them from multiple directions. I don't believe any of them will exist in 6 months in this state. 1. The state is ramping up its' massage licensing requirements and inspections. 2. The new law has stiffer penalties for the owners and of course, provides an incentive for providers to flip on them and mongers. 3. Appeals Courts have determined that being sex trafficked is automatic grounds for a deportation stay. If the providers are here on a visa, flipping actually enables them to stay here in the US, where otherwise deportation proceedings will begin immediately. That's both a carrot and a stick.[/QUOTE]Thanks for all of your replies. Very concerning and much too risky now.

Here's to a quick and effective legal challenge to the new law. I don't think that's likely though.

[QUOTE=ThePolarVortex;7132745]Here's to a quick and effective legal challenge to the new law. I don't think that's likely though.[/QUOTE]I see a remote shot for the hospitality industry to strike some of the language that gives hotels liability, they should argue 'lack of foreseeability'. Success would only strike those affected elements of the law, and shit, that's at least 2-3 years away, if they really want to fight. Other than that, this law is here to stay. It doesn't even have a public group raising any opposition to it yet, which is a terrible sign after a year or so.

But you typically sure for damages, no? So unless a monger is caught and sues for unconstitutionality of the law, then I doubt it will go anywhere. Imagine the flak a group would get suing "oh, so you're for the trafficking of minors?

Just my 0. 02, again, not a laywer!

[QUOTE=MmceStep;7133687]I see a remote shot for the hospitality industry to strike some of the language that gives hotels liability, they should argue 'lack of foreseeability'. Success would only strike those affected elements of the law, and shit, that's at least 2-3 years away, if they really want to fight. Other than that, this law is here to stay. It doesn't even have a public group raising any opposition to it yet, which is a terrible sign after a year or so.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Santorin;7135157]But you typically sure for damages, no? So unless a monger is caught and sues for unconstitutionality of the law, then I doubt it will go anywhere. Imagine the flak a group would get suing "oh, so you're for the trafficking of minors?

Just my 0. 02, again, not a laywer![/QUOTE]No, a criminal case would have to be elevated to Appeals Court. Zero chance this NC Supreme Court would reject the law. Then, it would have to be elevated to Federal Appeals. The Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals might overturn, (it would probably be close), then NC would likely appeal to the SCOTUS. I have zero doubt that this SCOTUS would uphold, but by the time it gets there maybe the composition of the court could look different. We're talking 5-6 years from now.