Stupid Shit in NoVa

Bear with me folks. Just need to vent a bit. .

Let's talk about screening. As you all know, there are typically 3 types of screening processes to see an independent provider or a girl from an agency.

1. Through registration at services like P411, TER, etc. - Problem here is that most of these are closed by now.

2. Provide corporate and / or personal information. Uncle LEO will love this info!

3. At least 2 or more references from other independent providers in good standing.

Now let's talk about number 3 for a moment. How can I have references, if I need references to get these references in the first place?

And even if I have a reference, how would the new provider verify that unless I provided my personal information with both of them?

Let's not bring up the argument that she will remember you and can provide assurance that you are not LE. She won't.

If you saw her let's say 6 month ago, she wouldn't remember you unless you did something outrageous like wearing a pink hat while going down on her.

So the way I see this, this process is flawed and at least for me not working.

One alternative I could think of is, that when you arrive at the provider, before going down to business, you show your credentials like I'd, corporate I'd, your LinkedIn profile (from your phone), etc. And leave nothing behind.

That way she can be certain that you are not LE, and you that none of your personal information falls in the wrong hands.

What do you all think?

[QUOTE=HerbB;4213506]Bear with me folks. Just need to vent a bit. .

Let's talk about screening. As you all know, there are typically 3 types of screening processes to see an independent provider or a girl from an agency.

1. Through registration at services like P411, TER, etc. - Problem here is that most of these are closed by now.

2. Provide corporate and / or personal information. Uncle LEO will love this info!

3. At least 2 or more references from other independent providers in good standing.

Now let's talk about number 3 for a moment. How can I have references, if I need references to get these references in the first place?

And even if I have a reference, how would the new provider verify that unless I provided my personal information with both of them?

Let's not bring up the argument that she will remember you and can provide assurance that you are not LE. She won't.

If you saw her let's say 6 month ago, she wouldn't remember you unless you did something outrageous like wearing a pink hat while going down on her.

So the way I see this, this process is flawed and at least for me not working.

One alternative I could think of is, that when you arrive at the provider, before going down to business, you show your credentials like I'd, corporate I'd, your LinkedIn profile (from your phone), etc. And leave nothing behind.

That way she can be certain that you are not LE, and you that none of your personal information falls in the wrong hands.

What do you all think?[/QUOTE]Any provider who wants my sensitive personal information, including my employment information, isn't getting my business. You're correct about Uncle LEO, and you also have to be concerned about the news media as well. Nor will I divulge my social media information to any provider. As far as references, the providers who probably would have vouched for me at one time are now retired.

I doubt any of those providers claiming they have to "verify" potential clients before seeing them would allow us to "verify" them in a similar manner. They'd consider that an invasion of privacy. So why shouldn't we feel the same way?

So the question we have to ask is who are the idiots that give this level of information. Obviously many do or these fine ladies would not be asking for it and they would be out of business. Why would anyone tell where they work and expect it to be held in confidence.

So are there that many idiots out here that give out that information? That is scary as they are just waiting to be consumed in a major sting down the road or when the lady is caught and needs to bargain.

I don't know about everyone else, but I haven't met any lady that's worth what will happen with giving your professional and personal info.

Remember we can stop this BS by not playing the game.

HD29.

[QUOTE=TomMcAn;4213981]Any provider who wants my sensitive personal information, including my employment information, isn't getting my business. You're correct about Uncle LEO, and you also have to be concerned about the news media as well. Nor will I divulge my social media information to any provider. As far as references, the providers who probably would have vouched for me at one time are now retired.

I doubt any of those providers claiming they have to "verify" potential clients before seeing them would allow us to "verify" them in a similar manner. They'd consider that an invasion of privacy. So why shouldn't we feel the same way?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=HarleyDude29;4214041]So the question we have to ask is who are the idiots that give this level of information. Obviously many do or these fine ladies would not be asking for it and they would be out of business. Why would anyone tell where they work and expect it to be held in confidence.

So are there that many idiots out here that give out that information? That is scary as they are just waiting to be consumed in a major sting down the road or when the lady is caught and needs to bargain.

I don't know about everyone else, but I haven't met any lady that's worth what will happen with giving your professional and personal info.

Remember we can stop this BS by not playing the game.

HD29.[/QUOTE]HD29,

True, but quite a few folks tend to think with their little head when it comes to this hobby. Typically the rule of thumb is, the more attractive the girl and the more $$$ she asks, the more likely will she ask for screening.

Nowadays, almost any girl who is asking more than $350/ hr is asking for screening.

So if your little head really wants to see a smoking hot chick, you only have the options I mentioned.

HerbB.

[QUOTE=HerbB;4213506]Bear with me folks. Just need to vent a bit. .

Let's talk about screening. As you all know, there are typically 3 types of screening processes to see an independent provider or a girl from an agency.

1. Through registration at services like P411, TER, etc. - Problem here is that most of these are closed by now.

2. Provide corporate and / or personal information. Uncle LEO will love this info!

3. At least 2 or more references from other independent providers in good standing.

Now let's talk about number 3 for a moment. How can I have references, if I need references to get these references in the first place?

And even if I have a reference, how would the new provider verify that unless I provided my personal information with both of them?

Let's not bring up the argument that she will remember you and can provide assurance that you are not LE. She won't.

If you saw her let's say 6 month ago, she wouldn't remember you unless you did something outrageous like wearing a pink hat while going down on her.

So the way I see this, this process is flawed and at least for me not working.

One alternative I could think of is, that when you arrive at the provider, before going down to business, you show your credentials like I'd, corporate I'd, your LinkedIn profile (from your phone), etc. And leave nothing behind.

That way she can be certain that you are not LE, and you that none of your personal information falls in the wrong hands.

What do you all think?[/QUOTE]Except for agencies, there are as many screening procedures around as there are individual providers and, IMHO, they needn't be taken at face value. While many providers stick firmly to their screening rules, others are more flexible. There's no way to know for sure until you contact them and try. As with everything else concerning providers, YMMV applies.

As one example, when a provider has plenty of clients, she can afford to be picky and strict with screening. But, when business is slow, that can definitely change things. By how much depends on the provider, how slow things are, and her individual need for cash. Also, many providers like to hear a client's voice and just a phone call can sometimes make the difference.

If I'm interested in a provider who has, at least on paper, a strict screening process, the first thing I do is search for more info and intel on the web, this forum, and sites like E-Monkey and Listcrawler. I'm looking for at least two things: First, any reviews or monger posts indicating any kind of flexibility or variability in her process. Second, whether ads she's posted on different sites say different things about screening. Maybe her Eros or Private Delights ad talks about strict screening but her ad on Listcrawler doesn't.

When I've done enough homework and I think it's worth a shot, I'll call and tell her I saw her ad on whatever site had the least restrictive language regarding screening. Once we have a conversation going, my goal is to make her feel as safe and comfortable with me as possible. Sometimes she doesn't even bring up a screening process and we move right into scheduling a session. Other times she brings it up and I give her my handle for this forum and for TER. Or I might ask if she'd consider an alternative like a brief meeting at Starbucks, etc. It's all about the art of persuasion so there are no hard and fast rules. I'd guess I've had about a 40% to 50% success rate with this approach. Again, it all depends on how badly she needs $ and how well you can persuade her that you're a low-risk client. If nothing works and you hit an impasse, thank her politely and move on.

But, as other members have pointed out, there are plenty of good providers who don't have strict screening. And seeing some of those, at least the more responsible ones, should also give you a base of references to use in the future.

[QUOTE=HerbB;4217735]OK, I took the plunge and got myself screened at them. Their server is in Spain, so out of reach from uncle LEO. Glad I did.

Had a great session today with Giselle, a very hot looking Brazilian blonde with a fantastic attitude. True GFE and such a sweetheart. Booking was easy and very responsive.[/QUOTE]Glad you had a nice session with Giselle but I'm assuming, from the wording of your post, that you had to give them personal info to get verified.

My issue is that, even if the server is in Spain the agency booker or manager or someone still has to access that information in order to view it and approve you as a client. If that person is in the US, your info also resides on their laptop, desktop, tablet or phone. And that's exactly where LEO will find it If that agency gets taken down.

The problem is that once you hand over personal info you completely lose control of how it's used, how it's transmitted, where it's stored, etc. That keeps the risk level unacceptably high, IMHO. That's not to say there's no value in using foreign servers and domains. But the main benefit would seem to be making it more difficult for LEO to get server logs containing IP addresses and such that could then be used to track and identify a particular computer or access point. That's the strategy USASG uses, and it makes sense.

But handing over PII bypasses the need for IP info. If LEO has your DL or work info, that's all they need to link you to the agency. To my mind that completely changes the calculus and the odds, and not in a good way.

At the end of the day, everyone has to make their own risk analysis and decide for themselves. My uncrossable line is PII and keeping it under my control at all times. Foreign server storage sound good, in theory, but could be a false sense of security.

[QUOTE=JmSuttr;4218485]Glad you had a nice session with Giselle but I'm assuming, from the wording of your post, that you had to give them personal info to get verified.

My issue is that, even if the server is in Spain the agency booker or manager or someone still has to access that information in order to view it and approve you as a client. If that person is in the US, your info also resides on their laptop, desktop, tablet or phone. And that's exactly where LEO will find it If that agency gets taken down.

The problem is that once you hand over personal info you completely lose control of how it's used, how it's transmitted, where it's stored, etc. That keeps the risk level unacceptably high, IMHO. That's not to say there's no value in using foreign servers and domains. But the main benefit would seem to be making it more difficult for LEO to get server logs containing IP addresses and such that could then be used to track and identify a particular computer or access point. That's the strategy USASG uses, and it makes sense.

But handing over PII bypasses the need for IP info. If LEO has your DL or work info, that's all they need to link you to the agency. To my mind that completely changes the calculus and the odds, and not in a good way.

At the end of the day, everyone has to make their own risk analysis and decide for themselves. My uncrossable line is PII and keeping it under my control at all times. Foreign server storage sound good, in theory, but could be a false sense of security.[/QUOTE]Yes, it's a risk, but being screened is not illegal by itself. It only gives you access to their web site. That doesn't mean that I do a booking. That only means that you registered. As for my I'd, they were really only focussed on the photo and DoB.

All my communication from there on out happened encrypted via Proton / VPN. Is it a risk, yes. But for me it was a calculated risk.

[QUOTE=HerbB;4218863]Yes, it's a risk, but being screened is not illegal by itself. It only gives you access to their web site. That doesn't mean that I do a booking. That only means that you registered. As for my I'd, they were really only focussed on the photo and DoB.

All my communication from there on out happened encrypted via Proton / VPN. Is it a risk, yes. But for me it was a calculated risk.[/QUOTE]You're right that it's not illegal, in and of itself, for your info to be found on a server (or other device) belonging to an escort agency. If legal jeopardy is the only consideration then that's one level of risk analysis. Of course, if the agency gets caught up in any kind of "trafficking" (real or alleged) investigation, then things could get complicated.

But for many the non-LE risks might be just as significant. As the Ashley Madison incident demonstrated, info exposure can lead to adverse marital and job consequences, public embarrassment, loss of reputation, and even suicide. It doesn't really matter whether the info is hacked, leaked, or otherwise misused, once it's exposed the genie is out of the bottle and can't be put back in.

Using encrypted transmission methods is of course better than not. But, at the end of the day, there's an image of your DL, over which you have no control, in an escort agency's records. I'm sure you'll probably be fine but you've had to put your trust in people you don't really know. If they're responsible, they'll have permanently and thoroughly deleted that image once they verified you. Let's hope that's the case.

Obviously everyone's risk tolerance is different. For people with a lot to lose, it's a bit like running across a freeway because you want to get to the other side. If traffic is light, you probably don't have much to worry about. The only problem is that the consequences if something bad were to happen would be catastrophic.

Maybe I'm just more risk-averse than most but my tendency is to think of all the things that could go wrong and how badly that could mess up my life. So for me the answer is to use this forum to do good homework and find great providers who don't ask for PII.

[QUOTE=JmSuttr;4218485]Glad you had a nice session with Giselle but I'm assuming, from the wording of your post, that you had to give them personal info to get verified.

My issue is that, even if the server is in Spain the agency booker or manager or someone still has to access that information in order to view it and approve you as a client. If that person is in the US, your info also resides on their laptop, desktop, tablet or phone. And that's exactly where LEO will find it If that agency gets taken down.

The problem is that once you hand over personal info you completely lose control of how it's used, how it's transmitted, where it's stored, etc. That keeps the risk level unacceptably high, IMHO. That's not to say there's no value in using foreign servers and domains. But the main benefit would seem to be making it more difficult for LEO to get server logs containing IP addresses and such that could then be used to track and identify a particular computer or access point. That's the strategy USASG uses, and it makes sense.

But handing over PII bypasses the need for IP info. If LEO has your DL or work info, that's all they need to link you to the agency. To my mind that completely changes the calculus and the odds, and not in a good way.

At the end of the day, everyone has to make their own risk analysis and decide for themselves. My uncrossable line is PII and keeping it under my control at all times. Foreign server storage sound good, in theory, but could be a false sense of security.[/QUOTE]Two words - "Cooperating witness".

[QUOTE=JacobsPatrick;4219905]Two words - "Cooperating witness".[/QUOTE]Well one place that people have placed a lot of trust is p411. I know of people who have provided their PII for this service. Don't know how that would play out now.

[QUOTE=JmSuttr;4219616]You're right that it's not illegal, in and of itself, for your info to be found on a server (or other device) belonging to an escort agency. If legal jeopardy is the only consideration then that's one level of risk analysis. Of course, if the agency gets caught up in any kind of "trafficking" (real or alleged) investigation, then things could get complicated.

But for many the non-LE risks might be just as significant. As the Ashley Madison incident demonstrated, info exposure can lead to adverse marital and job consequences, public embarrassment, loss of reputation, and even suicide. It doesn't really matter whether the info is hacked, leaked, or otherwise misused, once it's exposed the genie is out of the bottle and can't be put back in.

Using encrypted transmission methods is of course better than not. But, at the end of the day, there's an image of your DL, over which you have no control, in an escort agency's records. I'm sure you'll probably be fine but you've had to put your trust in people you don't really know. If they're responsible, they'll have permanently and thoroughly deleted that image once they verified you. Let's hope that's the case.

Obviously everyone's risk tolerance is different. For people with a lot to lose, it's a bit like running across a freeway because you want to get to the other side. If traffic is light, you probably don't have much to worry about. The only problem is that the consequences if something bad were to happen would be catastrophic.

Maybe I'm just more risk-averse than most but my tendency is to think of all the things that could go wrong and how badly that could mess up my life. So for me the answer is to use this forum to do good homework and find great providers who don't ask for PII.[/QUOTE]Excellent points. As I read this I was reminded of two well-known politicians, one from each major party, who were found to be clients of escort agencies and allegedly saw providers in DC. Neither faced criminal charges, but their respective political careers went down in flames thanks to the embarrassment. There were also several well-known religious figures caught up in the Ashley Madison mess and each paid a significant professional price as I recall.

I suspect most of us aren't in those categories, but we could still suffer personal and family embarrassment, as well as possibly professional disaster, if Uncle LEO got hold of our PII in a raid on one of these agencies. That's one reason among many why I won't share my PII with a provider or agency.

I tip even at legit spas. 20% is pretty customary. If you got a good legit massage, it is reasonable for you to tip the customary amount. If she denied your request for services that you had received there in the past and you considered to be part of the package then you should have complained and withholding a tip would be reasonable. Just my two cents since you asked.

Old Man.

[QUOTE=PilotAviator;4228988]I visited a local MP where several ladies (all over the age of 40+) are employed as Massage Technicians.

I had visited before, enjoyed all aspects of the massage, and tipped accordingly.

When I arrived, the manager (who I had previously met and is well over the age of 40+) took my money and took me to the room.

The manager returned (evidently the other ladies were busy), and provided the massage -- then left the room and did not return.

The massage to my back and neck was good. Nothing else was massaged.

I had contracted for a massage. I received a massage.

I dressed. I had a few Jacksons in my pocket (but nothing else). I departed.

Opinions?

PA.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=PilotAviator;4228988]I visited a local MP where several ladies (all over the age of 40+) are employed as Massage Technicians.

I had visited before, enjoyed all aspects of the massage, and tipped accordingly.

When I arrived, the manager (who I had previously met and is well over the age of 40+) took my money and took me to the room.

The manager returned (evidently the other ladies were busy), and provided the massage -- then left the room and did not return.

The massage to my back and neck was good. Nothing else was massaged.

I had contracted for a massage. I received a massage.

I dressed. I had a few Jacksons in my pocket (but nothing else). I departed.

Opinions?

PA.[/QUOTE]I think what you did was fine if you don't plan to return. But if you plan to frequent there then perhaps maybe you could have left a Jackson in order to build goodwill. Just my two cents.

That's odd. If it was an hour, I would expect the full body (even with no NOVA) would be done competently. For 1/2 hour, not sure how much can be fit in.

In any case, if I go to an AMP which I don't know (particularly when traveling and havn't done adequate research) and am not sure there is any extras, I'm usually still prepared to tip 15%, unless there was bad service. 20% for a very good massage. If the back and neck was it, and it was under time paid for, no tip might be warranted. I see why you might not want to leave a Jackson. Otherwise, I have asked in the past for change at the front. Tough call.

[QUOTE=PilotAviator;4228988]I visited a local MP where several ladies (all over the age of 40+) are employed as Massage Technicians.

I had visited before, enjoyed all aspects of the massage, and tipped accordingly.

When I arrived, the manager (who I had previously met and is well over the age of 40+) took my money and took me to the room.

The manager returned (evidently the other ladies were busy), and provided the massage -- then left the room and did not return.

The massage to my back and neck was good. Nothing else was massaged.

I had contracted for a massage. I received a massage.

I dressed. I had a few Jacksons in my pocket (but nothing else). I departed.

Opinions?

PA.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=PilotAviator;4228988]I visited a local MP where several ladies (all over the age of 40+) are employed as Massage Technicians.

I had visited before, enjoyed all aspects of the massage, and tipped accordingly.

When I arrived, the manager (who I had previously met and is well over the age of 40+) took my money and took me to the room.

The manager returned (evidently the other ladies were busy), and provided the massage -- then left the room and did not return.

The massage to my back and neck was good. Nothing else was massaged.

I had contracted for a massage. I received a massage..[/QUOTE]Do you tip your barber? If the massage is good, 15-20% is reasonable.

[QUOTE=MangoBalls78;4229005]I think what you did was fine if you don't plan to return. But if you plan to frequent there then perhaps maybe you could have left a Jackson in order to build goodwill. Just my two cents.[/QUOTE]So you stiff a waiter or waitress, if you never plan to return! It's not fine. C'mon man!

[QUOTE=NyHornet;4229536]So you stiff a waiter or waitress, if you never plan to return! It's not fine. C'mon man![/QUOTE]While tips are optional in our society, tips are also a principal part of waiter, waitress and provider income. It is up to each of us to decide the right tip. I will tip less for bad service, but never nothing. For me the right response to truly poor service is to not return.

[QUOTE=OldBoomer;4230836]While tips are optional in our society, tips are also a principal part of waiter, waitress and provider income. It is up to each of us to decide the right tip. I will tip less for bad service, but never nothing. For me the right response to truly poor service is to not return.[/QUOTE]Do you tip at Starbucks? Or other carryout type places?

I tip regardless of the service. I understand the 'me-me' mindset. Pay for what you get, I get it. At the same time I don't know what's really going with the other person, in this case provider. Is she having a bad day? Was the last customer a jerk? Is she worried about surviving? Maintaining family? My point is I don't know. What I do know is that there was a short connection between us, be it good, poor or so-so. Yes, I paid for a service but I also know that the provider only gets a cut or in the case of an independent, she has expenses to maintain her business. Tipping helps and also acknowledges the time spent together.

A little kindness goes a long way.

[QUOTE=DoctorDoctor;4230897]Do you tip at Starbucks? Or other carryout type places?

I tip regardless of the service. I understand the 'me-me' mindset. Pay for what you get, I get it. At the same time I don't know what's really going with the other person, in this case provider. Is she having a bad day? Was the last customer a jerk? Is she worried about surviving? Maintaining family? My point is I don't know. What I do know is that there was a short connection between us, be it good, poor or so-so. Yes, I paid for a service but I also know that the provider only gets a cut or in the case of an independent, she has expenses to maintain her business. Tipping helps and also acknowledges the time spent together.

A little kindness goes a long way.[/QUOTE]I find that whether or not you tip is an indicator of who you are as a human being and your value. I only tip when I think others are watching.

[QUOTE=NyHornet;4229536]So you stiff a waiter or waitress, if you never plan to return! It's not fine. C'mon man![/QUOTE]I realized I posted this in the massage parlor thread. This is what I said:

If the service is exactly what you expect and you didn't get anything that was above and beyond than why should I tip? I don't really care for the mentality that just because you received some sort of service than you should tip. To me tipping should be used as a way to reward good behavior or a way to communicate your satisfaction with a certain level of service. I don't necessary agree with always tipping no matter what. I think we should be free to use your discretion on if and when we tip. Just my two cents.

[QUOTE=MangoBalls78;4237177]I realized I posted this in the massage parlor thread. This is what I said:

If the service is exactly what you expect and you didn't get anything that was above and beyond than why should I tip? I don't really care for the mentality that just because you received some sort of service than you should tip. To me tipping should be used as a way to reward good behavior or a way to communicate your satisfaction with a certain level of service. I don't necessary agree with always tipping no matter what. I think we should be free to use your discretion on if and when we tip. Just my two cents.[/QUOTE]Just to clarify my position and describe a couple differently scenarios.

Legitimate massage place that don't offer HE. The base price is usually between $60-$80. I always tip the lady for her service assuming it is acceptable. Usually $15-$20. This is like tipping your barber or waiter, etc.

A massage parlor where you expect and receive a NOVA bit of happiness: the usual tip is $40-$50. Now, if the service rises above, I. E. Clothes come off and additional services, the tip is expected to go up.

Independent Provider who charges $120 for FBSM. This is where I fully agree with you. I go in expecting a massage with HE and if that is exactly what I get, than no additional tip. I look at it like the MP standard of $80 + $40. Now, if more services are provided than that warrants more tip.

Happy Mongering!

I posted this a while back, but this tipping issue prompted me to put this out there again. Enjoy!

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWW4ZJYNahY[/URL]

[QUOTE=Pbarber307;4239522]I posted this a while back, but this tipping issue prompted me to put this out there again. Enjoy!

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWW4ZJYNahY[/URL][/QUOTE]That's a great movie and scene.

I din't think the topic of tipping was so polarizing. If we can't agree on this then what can we agree on? How do we expect to fix larger, more complex issues such as health care, education and rapidly changing environment conditions? I didn't know a forum dedicated to mongering could produce so much insightful thought and conundrums. I guess we are more than just a bunch of douchebags looking to get our dicks wet.

[QUOTE=Rhinopole;4615953]I am trying to see a new provider who asked for 2 references. She wants their email addresses. My problem is that I have mainly gone to AMPs. Generally they don't use email. I can obviously see some independents and then try to use them as references. Aside from that, has anyone thought of another way around this?

Thanks.

Rhinopole.[/QUOTE]Hi,

I was going to make some suggestions but then,

I looked back at a bunch of your posts and mostly all you do is mostly post questions and comments.

Your posts are not going to get you anywhere with "REAL" seniors to recommend you.

You certainly have built up Senior Level number of posts. BUT not senior cred in my book.

I suggest you post all your wonderful or bad AMP visits in reasonable detail, so we can take you seriously.

-Just my observation.

HG2.

[QUOTE=HappyGuy2;4617026]Hi,

I was going to make some suggestions but then,

I looked back at a bunch of your posts and mostly all you do is mostly post questions and comments.

Your posts are not going to get you anywhere with "REAL" seniors to recommend you.

You certainly have built up Senior Level number of posts. BUT not senior cred in my book.

I suggest you post all your wonderful or bad AMP visits in reasonable detail, so we can take you seriously.

-Just my observation.

HG2.[/QUOTE]HG2,

I'll make 2 points:

First, I don't frequent too many providers, so I don't have that many to comment on. But for those I see, I post. It's too bad you don't value my comments. Based on PMs, others do.

Second, I scanned your posts and a very small number of them talk about AMP details that you'd like me (and maybe others) to write about. Most of your posts are short and don't say too much. Based on what you've posted I'm not sure I missed too much by your not making any suggestions in response to my inquiry.

Rhino.

Anyone ever think about how rich we would be if we took all the donations we spend mongering and put it in the stock market instead LOL? That compound interest would be awesome.

[QUOTE=Mdubya;4641300]Anyone ever think about how rich we would be if we took all the donations we spend mongering and put it in the stock market instead LOL? That compound interest would be awesome.[/QUOTE]You can't take it with you so spend it now and enjoy it.

[QUOTE=MangoBalls78;4642683]You can't take it with you so spend it now and enjoy it.[/QUOTE]At a certain age you realize its either spend it on yourself or your kids eventually will spend.

[QUOTE=VamassageFan;4653377]At a certain age you realize its either spend it on yourself or your kids eventually will spend.[/QUOTE]Since I don't have kids and I don't see it happening soon. Hahahaha.

[QUOTE=Mdubya;4641300]Anyone ever think about how rich we would be if we took all the donations we spend mongering and put it in the stock market instead LOL? That compound interest would be awesome.[/QUOTE]I say use it while you can. Once Viagra Cialas or that snake oil fails, your snake has to be put to rest. My friend has a catheter and wished it still worked. LOL.

Maybe it's just a bad camera angle, the girl is just huge, or her head really is small.

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[QUOTE=OldManInVa;4691817]I was in the area for work yesterday and dropped in to Best in Chantilly. I was met by Sue at the door and was pleasantly surprised. She is probably in her early 40's but filled out her low cut dress pretty well. The table shower was pleasant and thorough. The massage started and included a fairly lengthy walk on my back. I was feeling pretty good on the flip. She asked what I wanted and she initially indicated I didn't bring enough for a test of her oral presentation skills. We agreed to $100 for full body contact and a HJ but shorty after disrobing and letting me enjoy her nice tits and shapely ass, she agreed to a CBJ but warned me it would cost more next time. She also told me to bring my own hat. I was very impressed by her skills and the attention she gave the boys. I will be going back. I was almost hesitant to post this for fear she might get too popular.

OldMan.[/QUOTE]I think you overpaid for what you received. You're close to FS rates there.

[QUOTE=Mustang946;4692790]I think you overpaid for what you received. You're close to FS rates there.[/QUOTE]I think $100 for a BJ isn't outrageous. Anything more than that is approaching the $140 I understand to be a FS rate. I don't want FS and there seems to be little discount for just a BJ. I know some guys have posted $80 as a standard price. I don't like to stress out over negotiations.

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She is here until next week. House fee is 120 and the more tips you give the more you get. Good luck bro.[/QUOTE]While it's definitely true that "the more tips you give the more you get," you also need to factor in the menu limits of the individual provider. From my visits with Candy, and from other board reports, anyone expecting oral (either way) or FS is going to be disappointed. That being said, she's definitely worth a visit (IMHO) for her looks, personality, and the quality of the massage. As long as expectations aren't out of line with available service options, all should be fine.

[QUOTE=Mustang946;4692790]I think you overpaid for what you received. You're close to FS rates there.[/QUOTE]I understand Mustang's perspective. However, depending on where I go, what I'm in the mood for, and what I receive paying what is a FS rate for a less than FS experience can be satisfying. I'll regularly pay a higher rate in Fairfax County for FS, BBBJ / CIM or a slightly lower rate for the same service in PG County. But I have a go to gal who doesn't give FS or even a CBJ, yet makes out like a teenager, gives a terrific TS, and enjoys DFK, DATY, DATO and has a great sense of humor. I happily pay her a fee approaching FS. Some would disagree with my approach, but it works for me.

Enjoy.

Rhino.

[QUOTE=Rhinopole;4696953]I understand Mustang's perspective. However, depending on where I go, what I'm in the mood for, and what I receive paying what is a FS rate for a less than FS experience can be satisfying. I'll regularly pay a higher rate in Fairfax County for FS, BBBJ / CIM or a slightly lower rate for the same service in PG County. But I have a go to gal who doesn't give FS or even a CBJ, yet makes out like a teenager, gives a terrific TS, and enjoys DFK, DATY, DATO and has a great sense of humor. I happily pay her a fee approaching FS. Some would disagree with my approach, but it works for me.

Enjoy.

Rhino.[/QUOTE]I think every monger has paid too much at one point or another. Sometimes it's done on purpose, such as to leave a favorable impression for future visits, and sometimes it's done out of laziness or because of "thinking with the little head" syndrome.

I think once you've been in this game for a while you can tell the difference. The classic scenario for encouraging GPS is consistently paying higher than market rates for AMP services. When an AMP girl (and they're mostly all excellent at upsell) asks for an $80 tip for a plain HJ, and the client pays what he knows is a ripoff price, then I think it's fair to point out how that encourages GPS and has an adverse impact on others.

For a single provider with whom you have (or think you have) a special relationship, I don't think too many would find much fault with that. OTOH, wouldn't it be a pisser if you found out she provided the same level of service to others for less?

[QUOTE=JmSuttr;4697471]I think every monger has paid too much at one point or another. Sometimes it's done on purpose, such as to leave a favorable impression for future visits, and sometimes it's done out of laziness or because of "thinking with the little head" syndrome.

I think once you've been in this game for a while you can tell the difference. The classic scenario for encouraging GPS is consistently paying higher than market rates for AMP services. When an AMP girl (and they're mostly all excellent at upsell) asks for an $80 tip for a plain HJ, and the client pays what he knows is a ripoff price, then I think it's fair to point out how that encourages GPS and has an adverse impact on others.

For a single provider with whom you have (or think you have) a special relationship, I don't think too many would find much fault with that. OTOH, wouldn't it be a pisser if you found out she provided the same level of service to others for less?[/QUOTE]JmS wrote "OTOH, wouldn't it be a pisser if you found out she provided the same level of service to others for less?" -- and that happened to me. Assuming the accuracy of the report (and I have no reason to doubt the accuracy), a monger brother recently reported he received the same service I get at forty dollars less with no complaints from the provider. I've not been back, and I am not sure I will.

To avoid her whine, I knew I was paying premium -- I thought I was being nice to the lady.

PA.

[QUOTE=PilotAviator;4697718]JmS wrote "OTOH, wouldn't it be a pisser if you found out she provided the same level of service to others for less?" -- and that happened to me. Assuming the accuracy of the report (and I have no reason to doubt the accuracy), a monger brother recently reported he received the same service I get at forty dollars less with no complaints from the provider. I've not been back, and I am not sure I will.

To avoid her whine, I knew I was paying premium -- I thought I was being nice to the lady.

PA.[/QUOTE]I think we've all had that experience at one point or another, or will have in the future. And, sadly, While you may get close, there isn't an exact science or mathematical formula that will sure strike everytime. Human beings are consistently inconsistent. I'll check forums, read reviews, or talk to mongers and find out my ATF is dishing out my special for 20.40. 60 less than what I'm paying, and while it does anger me I think its the art of the deal. There's many factors that can go into it, maybe if business is slow and they are desperate enough they'll offer more for less? I know a number of mongers use the play book "but this is all I have?" And they sometimes get lucky, and the lady goes "more next time" and maybe there's never a next time. LOL. Sometimes it's good business sense to charge less if it means gaining a regular. But now I'm just sitting here trying to get philosophical and dig into the mindset of someone who performs these acts for money. I once had an interesting conversation with an AMP gal who told me she once had a guy, who she told me was most likely a homeless man who tried to pay for a HJ using a roll of quarters. She told him to keep the money and gave him one anyway. Her act of charity for the year LOL. . why?. . it's a god damn mystery folks. But it's a story that racks my brain, provides me with senseless laughter, and brings me to my point. The research here certainly helps us to establish a fair price point for both sides but it's anyone's game out there in the wild Wild West.

I'd pay $500/ hr for Elite pussy if I didn't have to give up my PI. Guys paying for GPS is not the problem. It's the dummies out here giving away PI to play that causes the problem. Don't get desperate b / c they need us to survive.

Unable to pay for GPS just means that you need to work harder to pay for GPS. SMH.

[QUOTE=Nothumbs;4697593]I wanted to get verified by them too and they asked for similar info. I sent a selfie, a reference, and my drivers license with everything blocked out but my first name and picture. Not enough. I told them thanks but no thanks.

Stand your ground, gentlemen. Only you can determine what PII you're willing to give away and everyone has their own limits on screening. I understand the safety of the providers is important, but so is anonymity.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=EyeLavose;4700030]I'd pay $500/ hr for Elite pussy if I didn't have to give up my PI. Guys paying for GPS is not the problem. It's the dummies out here giving away PI to play that causes the problem. Don't get desperate b / c they need us to survive.

Unable to pay for GPS just means that you need to work harder to pay for GPS. SMH.[/QUOTE]Everyone must make their own determination about how much PII they're willing to share. For some, it's an issue of fear and potentially getting busted one day by Uncle LEO. A few agencies that horde our info is a valid concern, especially when they get pinched. But ultimately, giving up PII is free. There's no membership fee, no obligation to supply work emails, none of that if one isn't comfortable. And there's plenty of agencies / providers that offer zero screening procedures.

GPS, on the other hand, can be a serious issue. It's one thing if you're tipping a provider (or SB) for a fantastic time and quite another for overpaying exorbitant prices when there's plenty of other talent to be had. When an 18 year-old SB fresh new to college offers herself for 600 / hour, I wish she comes up empty as it would be a valuable reminder to her that she's not a pro. She shouldn't get to charge those kind of prices and expect to live the high roller life just because she's 18 and has girl-next-door looks (not even model-grade, either). But all too often, guys think with their little head and fork over the benjamins. Like PII-sharing, it's each individual's choice whether they want to engage in this sort of encouragement or overpay an escort just because she's "touring" the area and has DD bolt-ons with a California tan. But it makes it difficult for those not made of money who can only afford the escape this hobby offers at set (or random) intervals.

If you come from money, great! I'm certainly not hurting any myself. At the same time, I also don't like to just throw that shit easily away by "making it rain" in order to make a statement or lavishly treat a woman for an average (or worse) time. Doing so makes them justify continued GPS behavior far more than giving up one's PII. That's not an opinion, that's fact.

Also, anyone engaging in any sort of PBM are the absolute worst. That's a practice that should automatically be grounds for ignoring ANY provider. I don't care if she looks like the second coming of Pamela Anderson or Jessica Alba, that shit is beyond stupid and frankly deserving of being scammed. I've done it myself when first starting out and quickly learned my lesson. Sometimes, we have to learn the hard way or pick up on it over time. As you said yourself, "don't become desperate because they need us to survive. " We hold the real power in this hobby. I firmly believe if we all stopped cold turkey from any and all activity for a month, we'd see prices plummet in a real hurry. Probably not such a bad idea due to this virus spreading around. Cheers!