Printable View
[blue][Deleted by Admin][/blue]
[b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]This report was redacted or deleted to remove sections of the report that were [u]largely argumentative[/u]. Please read the Forum FAQ and the Forum's Posting Guidelines for more information. [i]Thank You![/i][/blue]
[QUOTE=Wnde8; 1725141]The psychological component to sex is 10 X greater than the physical component. As guys we naturally assume that we're all about physical stimulation, but if that were actually the case then a fleshlight and a porno movie would be much better than banging a 6/10 girl.
Don't make the mistake of undervaluing the intangibles that make sex so much better: the pursuit, the build up, the feelings of dominating, the experience of total, unrestricted immersion in the act, etc. All that stuff counts and makes for a much better experience.[/QUOTE]That is fine. A wonderful concept to bring into your civi relationships with your wife, SO or girlfriend. But this is P4P. We can not afford panty boy emotionally involved attitudes up in here. We are discussing a market transaction. One in which I at least am trying to apply reason, logic and critical thinking. These can easily become very emotional situations. Lose focus on the bottom line. Lose focus on what our objectives are and we loose our wallets and a lot more.
You cannot afford to have your P4P activities reveled to the great society around you. There are better attitudes towards gay marriage than P4P at this time. So, until this becomes an accepted type of relationship in our greater society my suggestion is to keep your heart in check and a firm grip on your wallet.
[QUOTE=SubCmdr; 1725389]Mr. Taylor has proved my point! His post shows that even though the market in Southern California does not require it. He thinks he is getting a 'better' product at $300 to $500. Even though the market does not require anything close to it.
The idea he presents is that his women are hotter (they be hos) , younger (they be hos) , more educated (they be hos) , have jobs (they be hos) more well adjusted (they be hos) , with no criminal background (they be hos) off of SA (they be hos). That he has higher standards (for his hos). And yet he provides no proof that these women are of higher quality in terms of photos or profiles from SA. Nor does he have any proof that anyone else here in Southern California are associating with women of lesser quality or appearance. Yet he is buying pussy from them and they are selling pussy. That makes them common garden tools. Expensive ones, yes, but are still garden tools. This is the same flawed reasoning that exists in the Richmond forum. That some how this is not a market place. That Sugar Babies are special and by paying a lot of money they are getting something other than a garden tool.
A value investor buys a $1 for 50 cents. And you wait until others recognize that your investment is worth a $1 and you sell it to them at a later time. Mr. Taylor provides the classic reasoning of the growth investor. Buy high and wait for the company to get bigger and sell to the next sucker before the fall off in sales.
There is room for all in the market place. And there is plenty of pussy for us all. But the concept that $300 to $500 pussy is 'better' than value priced pussy of $100 is flawed. A cell phone these days serves only four functions, voice, data, GPS and hotspot. Both an Android phone and an Apple phone serve those purposes equally well (as shown by the sales figures). You buy an Apple phone because it says something about you. There is no real functional or quality difference.
The same holds true in the pussy market despite Mr. Taylor's efforts to assert otherwise.
Attention! Commander on deck![/QUOTE]Just my personal experience. I have had way better sex with the normal priced girls than the gps girls. I am not totally sure why this is, but now I am just thinking out loud.
1. You start over paying anyone, a girl a wife an employee, they get a sense of entitlement and then their performance falls off everytime.
2. Anyone looking at only the money doesn't really care about or have a need for anything else, (like awesome sex)
3. GPS girls have no real sense of adventure or thrill, they are basically lazy in and out of the bedroom. They are so into themselves they can't ever be into you.
4. They were brought up spoiled rotten. Whenever I see that phrase in a girls profile I move on. Would you want to eat a piece of fruit that is spoiled rotten?
5. I fell in love once with a GPS girl whose prior SD was a free spending idiot and got her anything she wanted and plenty of stuff she didn't just to show off. This girl was a 20 year old 10/10 white girl. And a 3 in the sack. I improved her to about a 5 and that was it.
6. I am literally swamped with $ girls in my local area. I can find a minimum of 1 new one a week while working a full time job and balancing 4 other regulars. Lucky for me I prefer AA spinners to busty blond white girls. Although one is asian.
7. My age is definitely an advantage (having grey hair and being close to 60 makes you an instant sex symbol to many girls) , so for you younger guys out there maybe you have to pay more. I work in marketing and for some people there is a perception that if something costs more it must be better. One example. One day a man comes into our jewelry store with his gps white trash ho (used to be in that business). He announces loudly so everyone can hear "I want the most expensive watch you have." We took a 40k rolex, ripped off the tag and retagged it to 80k. He bought it for cash right on the spot. Don't be that guy.
Look for girls that think with their pussy and not with your wallet. The girls I know will take a big hard dick and some serious bedroom skills over some benji's any day of the week. Let some other guy pick up that slack, or date girls with a job or parental support.
Typical red flag statement "baby, I been thinking blah blah blah"
When they say that its always about you spending some money.
Cmdr,
I agree with you. I have no idea how to use a smart phone and don't want to know. My phone allows me to talk only and that's all I want. Pussy is the same way. To some guys a. 2 piece of ass off a SW is just as exciting as a $$$$$ piece from an escort is to other guys. That's why we all keep chasing after it. It's all the same, and different too, at the same time.
Carry on,
Dirty
[QUOTE=SubCmdr; 1725389]There is room for all in the market place. And there is plenty of pussy for us all. But the concept that $300 to $500 pussy is 'better' than value priced pussy of $100 is flawed. A cell phone these days serves only four functions, voice, data, GPS and hotspot. Both an Android phone and an Apple phone serve those purposes equally well (as shown by the sales figures). You buy an Apple phone because it says something about you. There is no real functional or quality difference.
The same holds true in the pussy market despite Mr. Taylor's efforts to assert otherwise.
Attention! Commander on deck![/QUOTE]
LOL a spirited economics debate sub LOL in regards to Chicago vs LA. When I pay 250-500 in LA. I get away better looking girl or a girl of higher social quality than 250-500 gets me in Chicago. I conceded that the California and Florida markets were superior.
Markets where my money goes further. In regards to the phone arguement smartphones have productvity apps that make my life easier and allow me to get things done or enjoy luxurys that, I only could from my computer a few years ago. There are high end smart phones (Galaxy S4, Iphone 5s) that have the best productivity apps hardware (faster processor) superior software integration.
With faster updates and support. Then you have prepaid android phones with less stellar software and hardware, but your right.
If all you trying to do is text and call and maybe just use apps every once in awhile that is find. There are value phones like the nexus 4 that give you close to comparable functionality of the high end at a discount but they are still more expensive than low end walmart android.
As it applies to girls, I assign value on market research, not blind faith I want a hott normal non flaky chick who is employed.
Educated and good in the sack (anything less and I might as well go back to complete civy dating with a quarterly high end escort.
Hrown in the mix). In my research when I would first offer girls to pay their cell phone bill for a month or two 75-200 bucks on a constant basis the girls that would respond to that were only average to below average in looks and had a high propesity exhibitnando traits. The hott chicks that I wanted kept refusing my offers, so now I do my cell phone payment opening bid, more than likely, the girls I want refuse and I up the price. I find value sometime, thats better than the 250-500 that I usaully score in. I aslo cross reference the quality of my girls vs what other guys say they get on the SB, non pro and escort market. I compare the girls picture to the cheap girls on backpage and the expensive girls on eros or high end agency sites. I determine what she would go for on those markets per hour and make my decision in addition to adding in her security risk. I also compare her to my civy dates and compare cost advantage.
I don't think these girls love me like some of the guys in Richmond, but the sugar is cross between the escort and casual civy dating market. Unlike escorts alot of SB's will refuse certain advances for various reasons. Tom Bradys wife would not marry him if he wasnt a rich football player, but she probably would not marry ray lewis or donald trump either, so there are different factors at work than just economics like the escort market.
[QUOTE=Rob Taylor;1725909]LOL a spirited economics debate sub LOL in regards to Chicago vs LA. When I pay 250-500 in LA. I get away better looking girl or a girl of higher social quality than 250-500 gets me in Chicago. I conceded that the California and Florida markets were superior.[/QUOTE]Hands down, los angeles has the largest number of good looking women in the world that are looking for a hand up.
[QUOTE=Rob Taylor; 1725909]LOL a spirited economics debate sub LOL in regards to Chicago vs LA. When I pay 250-500 in LA. I get away better looking girl or a girl of higher social quality than 250-500 gets me in Chicago. I conceded that the California and Florida markets were superior.
As it applies to girls, I assign value on market research, not blind faith I want a hott normal non flaky chick who is employed.
Educated and good in the sack (anything less and I might as well go back to complete civy dating with a quarterly high end escort.
I also cross reference the quality of my girls vs what other guys say they get on the SB, non pro and escort market. I compare the girls picture to the cheap girls on backpage and the expensive girls on eros or high end agency sites. I determine what she would go for on those markets per hour and make my decision in addition to adding in her security risk. I also compare her to my civy dates and compare cost advantage.
I don't think these girls love me like some of the guys in Richmond, but the sugar is cross between the escort and casual civy dating market. Unlike escorts alot of SB's will refuse certain advances for various reasons. Tom Bradys wife would not marry him if he wasnt a rich football player, but she probably would not marry ray lewis or donald trump either, so there are different factors at work than just economics like the escort market.[/QUOTE]Mr. Taylor,
Sprited debate indeed. We need more of your input in the Richmond Forum. You are a man of analytical thought. A rare thing in the sugar world.
I do have a question. How do you determine the "good in the sack" part before you "get in the sack"? Because I have found that looks, job, background, emotional and mental stability and the money they are willing to accept has nothing to do with sexual performance. Of course I will acknowledge that I don't really care about the ascetic qualities you factor in to your equation. I take my grading sheet and determine if they perform my preferred sexual acts and then rate the quality of the performance and their attitude.
And I disagree that sugar babies say no more than Escorts. On any given day on BP you and find ads that have qualifications based on race and age. I rarely see that on SA or SD4m. All of my rejections stem from one source only: Money or lack their of (lmao).
[QUOTE=SubCmdr; 1726256]Mr. Taylor,
Sprited debate indeed. We need more of your input in the Richmond Forum. You are a man of analytical thought. A rare thing in the sugar world.
I do have a question. How do you determine the "good in the sack" part before you "get in the sack"? Because I have found that looks, job, background, emotional and mental stability and the money they are willing to accept has nothing to do with sexual performance. Of course I will acknowledge that I don't really care about the ascetic qualities you factor in to your equation. I take my grading sheet and determine if they perform my preferred sexual acts and then rate the quality of the performance and their attitude.
And I disagree that sugar babies say no more than Escorts. On any given day on BP you and find ads that have qualifications based on race and age. I rarely see that on SA or SD4m. All of my rejections stem from one source only: Money or lack their of (lmao).
Attention! Commander on deck![/QUOTE]I determine sexual ability based on conversation, after I get them in the sack I determine do I want to continue with this arrangement based on abilities. I try to get a hot enough girl in the looks category that I could tolerate even if their sexual performance is mediocre so I don't waste money. (doesn't always workout). The asectic qualities are more for security and to lower the risk of getting (blackmailed, my place robbed, and other nando head aches) , because I like to save money by inviting girls to my place. I would feel more comfortable with college professional in my house, than an ex stripper who has friends that are escorts.
I also need someone that has huge incentives to be discreet, the more normal they are, The more incentive they have to be discreet. A girl with a good job has alot to loose, a girl who is living on her friends basement floor does not.
Yes some girls do discriminate on race and age on backpage, but if I message seven girls on sugar site, I might end up.
With three responses and maybe I bone one of them. If I call two chicks on back page its guranteed I'm getting laid within the next hour. The discrimination mainly only applies to AA males so if your not in that demographic its really a non issue and even if you are, you only have to spend another five seconds looking and you will be getting laid. The high end market these things are a non issue, because everybody is screened and provides references. The backpage market is less regulated.
[QUOTE=Revvo; 1723364]OK. Point taken. I am a slow learner. I need a few 2x4's to the head to learn. But I do learn.
Some one once said "the root of all suffering is attachment". I think I may be a little attached to the women as opposed to the deal.
Old habits die hard,
Revvo[/QUOTE]I agree that the first step is to establish the physical chemistry above all else. You may never go beyond that. But more often than not after a certain amount of time an emotional attachment will evolve with your long term babies. I love all my LTR's but am not currently "in love" with any of them. I would not be devastated if any of them ditched me. While I am not against this possibility (of falling in love) it hasnt happened in the last 5 years. And the last time it did, it ended badly. I would still be open to taking the risk if the feelings were there. I am sure I say I love you a few times a day to multiple girls. And I do love them. Just not to the point where I am going to risk my fortune or mental health over it.
Interesting discussion!
I actually agree with both sides to an extent. I tend to gravitate toward SBs who are in school (even community college) , live at home still, and work. My reasons are for both financial and security reasons.
Girls who are in college, live at home, and work generally have some stability and don't hit me every time just to put gas in their car or feed their "habit". Likewise, they don't need to solely live off my man-teet because their basic expenses are usually taken care of. I've found that girls in the 7/10 range who are college / job stable are usually happy with 150-250 per visit. Sometimes you can get it a little lower depending.
While I don't have SBs coming to my house, I like stable SBs because do they have an incentive to be discrete as well. A girl who works, goes to school, and lives at home isn't going to get too crazy generally. Even with college SBs and pots where it didn't work out, I've never had a stable SB give me any kind of trouble in terms of blackmail or threats. The times I had trouble were always from girls who had no job, not in school, and lived on their friend's sofa.
That's why I do segment SBs into different categories. If you treat and approach every SB the same, you're going to get yourself into trouble depending on your situation.
That said, at least out here in Southern California, you don't have to spend 300-500 per visit to get a stable SB. Granted, if you're aiming for perfect 10 white and asians, then maybe you'll have to spend that much. But there are a ton of very good looking young 20 something girls that can be had for 150-250 out here. It's still a buyer's market, so be careful that you're not over-paying. A lot of girls may come out the gate wanting 400-500 but can be fairly easily talked down to a lower amount if you sound serious and respectful.
Also be aware that many of the "10/10" girls who ask for 500 and above are indeed UTR highend call girls. Many highend call girls have "normal" day lives. So just be aware of that. Paying a premium price doesn't necessarily mean you're not getting a PRO.
I'm also one of the younger SDs on this board and it has both it's advantages and disadvantages. The advantage is that we sometimes have an easier time relating to 18/19 year-olds and the 20 somethings because we're only about a half a generation away from them. The downside is that many SBs don't think the young SDs have that much money and sometimes "quote" us higher amounts to make sure we're for real and not some young guy playing with a bonus check. And as Hollywood Guy said, there's a good chunk of girls who are on those sites simply because they have a thing for older men. SDs who are too close to their age may remind them of all the bad experiences they've had with men their age. It's probably why I've never had a SB over the age of 25. I'm in my 30s, so most SBs my age either want SDs in their 40s+ or they have a lot of baggage and expenses that I can't afford to support.
But overall, I'm believer that the SB game can be played in a many number of ways and with different objectives. I try not to pass too much judgment on any one method or objective. I just try to share my experiences given my own methods / objectives and let others readings determine if it's useful to them or not.
[QUOTE=John G Smith; 1727107]Interesting discussion!
That said, at least out here in Southern California, you don't have to spend 300-500 per visit to get a stable SB. Granted, if you're aiming for perfect 10 white and asians, then maybe you'll have to spend that much. But there are a ton of very good looking young 20 something girls that can be had for 150-250 out here.[/QUOTE]More like 2 tons. LOL. I realize that due to financial constraints I am always talking up the $ girls. But there are many worthy girls at $$. I sometimes get depressed at all my turn downs but being forced into the $ market has made me a better shopper and if and when I can return to the $$ market they would all have to be 9+/9+ with skills to match.
Beautiful face, awesome body, good skills. At $ you should get a minimum of 2 out of 3 but at $$ you should absolutely get 3 out of 3. If not the E volvement as subcomander likes to say is definitely factoring into your decision making. As a side note. I used to be married to the equivalent of one of those HouseWives type women. When I see the drama and expense those guys have to go through to get laid by girls that turn my gut (old, bitchy, demanding) i feel blessed to have lived long enough to have upped my game and slashed the price. My golden years how ever many i get will truly be golden.
Btw.. I am unaware of any other forum with the in depth and informative commentary on this topic on any site, other than this thread and the richmond thread. I want to thank all who contribute and on all the local L.A. threads as well. Super helpful all around.
[QUOTE=Rob Taylor;1725280]My CPO still comes out pretty good I'm young and so I recover quick and get multiple pops. Even in the California market, I shell about 250-500 for an 8-10 (non blk girl). I pay the premium to avoid Nando's and UTR. I fine girls who are verifiable, normal college educated a job no criminal history. Also I get most my girls off SA, because SA girls seem more normal then sd4me. The allowance publishing on SA causes GPS. You also have those sugar babys on the blogs, who are datig 1% guys and they ifluence others. Example I have a ddate with a latin MILF former fitness model, college educated, low security risk. This is what I pay that premium for. I could get a girl off sd4me for 150, but theres a chance she could be complete crazy nando. I need that piece of mind. Also, I think because I am on the younger end of sugar daddys. I rate girls a little harsher, because I associate with young woman in night clubs all the time. So a 7. 5 to some of you guys is a 5 or lower to me. I'm a lot more picky when it comes to looks is another reason, I pay a premium. [B][I]But no worries it just like smart phones, some people want cheaper androids and other wants a premium for apple[/I][/B].[/QUOTE]I have to respectfully disagreed with this. There's nothing an Iphone 5s can do that a Samsung S4, LG Optimus G, or an HTC One X+ can't do.
As a matter of fact, these "cheaper" Android phones can do a few things better than the 5s, once rooted and unlocked. The 5s, raw performance wise, is already behind their competitors.
But getting back to SB. There are lots of values to be had in the 100-150 range. Given, you have to put in some more leg work.
As you can tell, I am a value shopper. I don't pay $3k for brand spanking new 1080p 3D LED HDTV that released on day 1. I wait 6 months later and get it for $1k less, or get last year's model for half the price.
But whatever rocks your boat.
[QUOTE=Rob Taylor; 1725909]LOL a spirited economics debate sub LOL in regards to Chicago vs LA. When I pay 250-500 in LA. I get away better looking girl or a girl of higher social quality than 250-500 gets me in Chicago. I conceded that the California and Florida markets were superior.
Markets where my money goes further. In regards to the phone arguement smartphones have productvity apps that make my life easier and allow me to get things done or enjoy luxurys that, I only could from my computer a few years ago. There are high end smart phones (Galaxy S4, Iphone 5s) that have the best productivity apps hardware (faster processor) superior software integration.
With faster updates and support. Then you have prepaid android phones with less stellar software and hardware, but your right.
If all you trying to do is text and call and maybe just use apps every once in awhile that is find. There are value phones like the nexus 4 that give you close to comparable functionality of the high end at a discount but they are still more expensive than low end walmart android.
As it applies to girls, I assign value on market research, not blind faith I want a hott normal non flaky chick who is employed.
Educated and good in the sack (anything less and I might as well go back to complete civy dating with a quarterly high end escort.
Hrown in the mix). In my research when I would first offer girls to pay their cell phone bill for a month or two 75-200 bucks on a constant basis the girls that would respond to that were only average to below average in looks and had a high propesity exhibitnando traits. The hott chicks that I wanted kept refusing my offers, so now I do my cell phone payment opening bid, more than likely, the girls I want refuse and I up the price. I find value sometime, thats better than the 250-500 that I usaully score in. I aslo cross reference the quality of my girls vs what other guys say they get on the SB, non pro and escort market. I compare the girls picture to the cheap girls on backpage and the expensive girls on eros or high end agency sites. I determine what she would go for on those markets per hour and make my decision in addition to adding in her security risk. I also compare her to my civy dates and compare cost advantage.
I don't think these girls love me like some of the guys in Richmond, but the sugar is cross between the escort and casual civy dating market. Unlike escorts alot of SB's will refuse certain advances for various reasons. Tom Bradys wife would not marry him if he wasnt a rich football player, but she probably would not marry ray lewis or donald trump either, so there are different factors at work than just economics like the escort market.[/QUOTE]You do no that up side down the pussy is the same at 500. 00 or 150. 00, I can not my self indulge into this high price pussy.
OMG. I think I found my new "Tag Line"
[QUOTE=SubCmdr;1724939]Now, I would rather fuck a 6 three times than a 10 once.[/QUOTE]