"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[QUOTE=Zomby;1575282]I don't think it's completely fair to say that [i]every[/i]one's time is wasted. It absolutely is a waste of [i]your [/i]time, and would be of mine if I was yet in search mode on this one. However, a compensated non-sexual relationship is certainly a legitimate goal, and there are guys out there who want exactly that, however ludicrous most, if not all, the posters on this particular forum would find such a thing.[/QUOTE]You are, of course, correct that there are some guys out there that would accept a non-sexual sugar scenario. But I strongly doubt that there are any in my neck of the woods. This being the South and the buckle of the bible belt, it's pretty much social suicide for a guy to be seen in public with a half-his-age piece of arm candy. That can fly in cosmopolitan places that are used to it, like LA or NYC, but this ain't that sort of place. Hell, a couple weekends ago I was sitting in the waiting area of an restaurant on the other side of town, waiting for a pot to arrive for a M&G, when in walked a woman that's on a civic committee I'm on (I caught the pot outside and we went elsewhere.) That's even more true for the married SDs. As someone else said, if I want arm candy for some social event, she needs to be at least 40 (and I have several friends that can and have served in that capacity.)

So while a non-sexual connection may be a valid desire for some sexy young thing, it's probably not be a realistic one in many places.

I'm in san diego CA, what is the best site to find a good sugar baby in local areas? Email me

YMMV. I don't have much luck in San Diego. In both SA and SD4M. I suggest you try. .

[QUOTE=Albert619;1576258]I'm in san diego CA, what is the best site to find a good sugar baby in local areas? Email me[/QUOTE]

Preface: IANAL.

That said, I think legal worries are not a factor. The legal definition of the misdemeanor of soliciting requires specific things, which generally means an actual solicitation must happen to meet the criteria. Unless you are a fool, you're not going to blatantly solicit the girl at the M&G, and the cops are not going to invest tons of time and place an officer or CI in the risky situation of going to a private place alone with you to get to write a misdemeanor ticket.

But more importantly, there's a reason the solicitation and prostitution laws are worded as they are: the requirements remove all reasonable doubt that what's happening is *not* straight-up sex-for-money. Once you drop below that threshold, the slope gets very slippery indeed. What's the difference between a sugar arrangement developed with someone you found on SA, and meeting a random girl in a bar with whom you develop a financially- and sexually-involved relationship? How and why does the simple method of initially connecting push the situation over the bounds of legality? (It doesn't.)

In the end, *all* relationships are barter. Two people work together (or not) because they give things the other needs and need things the other gives. Somewhere along the line, those things usually include money and sex. If simply tying money and sex in a relationship was illegal, every marriage in the country would be a felony.

The cops are only interested in catching people in clearly-defined criminal activity, and the easier and safer it is the more they like it. While they might decide to try a sting op for this, it would have to be very carefully designed and planned and executed, all for the high likelihood that the cases would be dismissed. Much easier and safer to sting a bunch of poor working schmucks trying to pick up a streetwalker.

You need to empty out your inbox, my man. :)

[quote=john g smith; 1576019]i think some of you are blowing the legal issue out of proportion. as hernando mentioned, there's pretty much a miniscule chance you'll get busted for prostitution in the sugar bowl. i've haven't heard of a single case anywhere of a sugar daddy getting busted for propositioning an of-aged sb. again, as hernando noted police want to net as much johns as possible per sting. it's about arrest stats, revenue from fines, and sometimes election year publicity. going after sugar daddies who are located all over geographically and have erratic schedules for meets would take a lot more time, effort, and patience from le. it's a lot easier for them to create a bp ad and setup a sting in a local hotel and net a 10-20 local mongers in one night.

also when i negotiate over text / email, i don't mean you should be overly graphic. i never say "i'll give you 80 for a bbbj every time we meet and 150 for bbfs". what i do say is that i'm looking for an arrangement that has physical intimacy. and then later on i may give an offer like this,"how about i gave you a monthly allowance of 1000-1200, which i'll give it to you in pieces 200-300 per meet." no where i'm explicitly saying i'm paying for a sexual act. i'm just giving my sb a monthly allowance which i'm paying in installments or i'm just giving her money on our dates. nothing illegal with that. sure i'm making implications that part of the parameters of our relationship is that we become "intimate". but again that's not illegal and le would have a hell of a time trying to draw lines with absolute certainty that i'm paying directly for sex acts. otherwise le would have to arrest everyone who gets on one knee and proposes to his girlfriend to be his wife. using an expensive engagement ring as payment, the guy is proposing a relationship that with absolute certainty will have sex involved. in fact, marriage isn't even official until a sex act is committed. so it's actually very hard to draw a legal line of distinction between a sd / sb relationship and a regular relationship.

besides, if le really wanted to nab sugar daddies, they could very well have the sb wear a recording device and then have le grab you when you leave the restaurant. saying things face to face doesn't give you anymore safety than text / email if le really wants to get you.

but still, i think there's little to worry about. maybe down the line if there is some serial sugar daddy predator who gets major headlines, then le may take a bigger interest in this arena. but for now it's pretty much unmonitored. again, our biggest threat is making sure we avoid the **** babies. it doesn't take a sting for you to get in trouble, it just takes an angry parent / friend / brother / sister who calls the police on you. so tread carefully with babies in the 18-20 range. any baby under 20, i always verify their age by asking for their facebook page. usually this is enough.

and some people are misinterpreting me and think i'm saying i believe in "no m&gs". that's not what i'm saying. i'm just saying do a little more vigorous pre-screening before you do a m&g. before you buy her dinner / drinks and waste your time, make sure she's pretty much already down with the program. that way you're basically just using the m&g to verify her appearance and any personality quirks. and if everything looks good, chances are high you could proceed to the fc right after the m&g if time permits.

i'm just saying, i'm hearing a lot of guys here complaining about girls wasting their time or being no-shows at m&gs. so i'm just saying move the m&g to "stage 2 or 3", don't have it as your first step.[/quote][url]http://meridianstar.com/statenews/x681159809/supervisor-arrested-in-prostitution-sting/print[/url]

after many hours of searching this is the only thing i came up with. and in the end he beat the case.

[QUOTE=HollywoodGuy; 1576615][url]Http://meridianstar.com/statenews/x681159809/Supervisor-arrested-in-prostitution-sting/print[/url]

After many hours of searching this is the only thing I came up with. And in the end he beat the case.[/QUOTE]Interesting. And here's the official dismissal from the judge:

[url]http://slabbed.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/us-v-weiner-order-dismissal.pdf[/url]

To summarize what happened basically a guy was using SD4Me to find SBs. One of his co-workers saw him using the site and reported him to the FBI (what a dick). BTW, another co-worker just happen to be an ex-FBI official. The FBI then specifically targeted to go after this one man. They used two vice girls to basically entrap him. No one else was the target or pursued.

And there hasn't been a prior or future case against a SD aside from this case at the Federal level. The case reeks of a personal vendetta rather than some new FBI mandate to pursue sugar daddies.

Again, a SD isn't 100% immune from LE activity. But this case shows just how much effort it takes to catch one SD and they failed at that. They were hoping for a Federal charge to make it worthwhile because it's not worth the time and resources just for a misdemeanor solicitation charge at the state level, which usually only carries a $200 fine or 6 months in jail.

[QUOTE=FeelGoodMd; 1575816]Majest,

Welcome to the Bowl. What I (and many of the other members of this site, I'm sure) did was start here (

[url]http://www.usasexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?9746-quot-Sugarbabies-quot-quot-Arrangements-quot-Amateurs-or-Not/page150[/url]

And read forward. You will get a lot of great information, inspiration, and entertainment (often simultaneously, for that matter).

That's my prescription for the newbie in the Bowl.

Dr. Feelgood[/QUOTE]Thank for the help, I will start form that post. Was kind of hoping you would point me to a site that is good at finding SB.

Maybe not that easy, but so far the "SBs" I've met have all been really sweet, well put-together women with good heads on their shoulders. None of them have sought that much in they way of sugar. They all seem to be more in search of quasi-relationahips without the strings. One is already in a non-exclusive (for her, anyway) SD / SB relationship and just looking for more action than this guy is apparently giving her. From a purely payoff standpoint, it seems like a complete no-brainer. Several of the other ladies I've met are looking for non-currency transactions like paying her utilities, etc. So far none of these ladies look like they want to have an actual relationship and don't seem to care if I continue looking around.

I'm not naive enough to think it's this easy all the time, but so far the complete lack of drama has been amazing. I shoulda done this 10 years ago. LOL!

[QUOTE=Majest;1576911]Thank for the help, I will start form that post. Was kind of hoping you would point me to a site that is good at finding SB.[/QUOTE]Do yourself a favor and read this thread from beginning to end.

You'll save yourself from making the mistakes documented so thoroughly here. But, if you want to take your chances alone in the wild, google 'seeking arrangement' and off you go. Good luck.

Dodgeboy, you must be a lot more talented or desirable than I am. This is hard as hell! I lucked out finding my ATF but I was also paying her a boatload of coin, at least for me. I think age has something to do with it. These girls want a "mature" guy but not old, and I think over 50 is a tougher sell for 20 somethings. I have to admit that I have a taste for the 20s and not an easier age group of 40 plus. I'd probably have more success in that pool.

Anyway, like our friend Scott was going through a while back, I am in a dry spell.

SDFM : I had a M&G with an overweight but cute girl, gave her some "earnest " money (sucker money) and she is in the wind. I got complacent and too trusting after being off the market for 1 1/2 years. What a Dummy! I am embarrassed but I have to take my licks from the board. A Question for you all. Should I pursue her since I know where she works and threaten to report heer to the healthcare regulation board since she is a massage therapist, or just take my medicine and write it off as a bad debt?

Asian : She has cooled off and is making up excuses, so I am going to let her go. The dreams of a gang bang are gone. Sorry gents.

Mr Strict : " How and if these events have affected how you conduct your game. Has anyone quit? Doing things radically different? Or do you feel it just isn't a big concern and you have changed nothing."

In my case hope springs eternal and I am continuing to ply my trade in hopes of finding another SB like my ATF. I am pretty picky though and I realize that I am eliminating a lot of POTs right out of the box. I have a 26 yr old off SDFM who sounds great and we have a M&G for this weekend, so we shall see how that goes.

[QUOTE=Hernando; 1577061]Dodgeboy, you must be a lot more talented or desirable than I am. This is hard as hell! I lucked out finding my ATF but I was also paying her a boatload of coin, at least for me. I think age has something to do with it. These girls want a "mature" guy but not old, and I think over 50 is a tougher sell for 20 somethings. I have to admit that I have a taste for the 20s and not an easier age group of 40 plus. I'd probably have more success in that pool.

Anyway, like our friend Scott was going through a while back, I am in a dry spell.

SDFM : I had a M&G with an overweight but cute girl, gave her some "earnest " money (sucker money) and she is in the wind. I got complacent and too trusting after being off the market for 1 1/2 years. What a Dummy! I am embarrassed but I have to take my licks from the board. A Question for you all. Should I pursue her since I know where she works and threaten to report heer to the healthcare regulation board since she is a massage therapist, or just take my medicine and write it off as a bad debt?[/QUOTE]I would consider the massage gal a lesson and wouldn't attempt to get her in any trouble. The last thing you want to do is be the recipient of blowback. If she's not going to cost you anymore coin then I'd leave it alone.

I don't find gals under 30 appeal to me on many levels so it doesn't bother me to shoot a little higher in the age spectrum. I'm in my mid 40s (and by that I mean high 40s) and in pretty good shape but it's not worth the $ to try fooling myself that I'm going to light up some 20somethings libido. One of the gals I've seen is in my age bracket and an absolute freak of nature in terms of appeal and appetite. She's completely awesome. I'm still not looking to make a change in my real life, but she certainly makes my off hours fun.

Keep swinging. Eventually you'll knock one out of the park.

Here are two SDFM entries I would stay away from.

1) # 33492411 Probably an escort and GPS. Asked $600 for a date and wanted to know how many hours

2) # 3234784 Cash and dash Wants free dinners and earnest money

[QUOTE=Hernando;1577061]SDFM : I had a M&G with an overweight but cute girl, gave her some "earnest " money (sucker money) and she is in the wind. I got complacent and too trusting after being off the market for 1 1/2 years. What a Dummy! I am embarrassed but I have to take my licks from the board. A Question for you all. Should I pursue her since I know where she works and threaten to report heer to the healthcare regulation board since she is a massage therapist, or just take my medicine and write it off as a bad debt?[/QUOTE]I say,"Hell no!" W. W. T. S. D. = What Would Tony Soprano Do? Ok, maybe not quite that extreme. Yet! But this b1tch needs to be taught a lesson and made to understand that this type of behavior is unacceptable in the Sugar Bowl, before she becomes a serial runner. I don't think I would start with the licensing authority but save that for a last resort. Does she know you know where she works? If not, just stroll in one day and say,"What's up?" If she knows you are aware of her work, stroll in and say,"I want my MF pu$$ e, bi7ch!" (Too Tony Soprano?) Anyway, it needs to be nipped in the bud and quickly. Disappearing is one thing. But if I knew where she worked, I would feel obligated to myself to call her on it. It's BS, plain and simple.

[QUOTE=Hernando; 1577061]Mr Strict : " How and if these events have affected how you conduct your game. Has anyone quit? Doing things radically different? Or do you feel it just isn't a big concern and you have changed nothing."

In my case hope springs eternal and I am continuing to ply my trade in hopes of finding another SB like my ATF. I am pretty picky though and I realize that I am eliminating a lot of POTs right out of the box. I have a 26 yr old off SDFM who sounds great and we have a M&G for this weekend, so we shall see how that goes.[/QUOTE]Glad to see you on the horse again, Hernando. Stay focused and positive, brother.

Stay Safe.

Strict

Met a couple of sugar babies. One was willing to go as low as $50. Willing to do covered FS and BBBJ (no cim though). Would stay for a couple of hours and allow multi pops. But I didn't like her looks. Too shabby. Another one is willing to do couple of hours for 100, and another one, a nurse at a drug rehabilitation center who says she's good for doing everything for some compensation every now and then. She did not mention any amount. What do you think this third girl might be looking for? Would she feel offended if I gave her a 100 every now and then (would work out to around 50 per engagement). She's hot.