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[QUOTE=RoadHead;4870544]There is zero evidence that hospitals are upcoding cause of death to covid to get more federal money. The amount medicare pays for covid is similar to that for other respiratory diseases[/QUOTE]Also, the payments are for the TREATMENT of patients with Covid-19; not for the deaths. It wouldn't help the hospital at all to change the cause of death to Covid for a patient who was treated for, say, cardiac arrest.
[QUOTE=WinterKnight;4871530]Also, the payments are for the TREATMENT of patients with Covid-19; not for the deaths. It wouldn't help the hospital at all to change the cause of death to Covid for a patient who was treated for, say, cardiac arrest.[/QUOTE]Several months ago the Michigan medical director or whatever her title is, announced on air how they tally death vis Covid. She admitted that people with suppressed immune system who contracted Covid, then died, is listed as a Covid death, even though it could have been the cause of their weakened immune system. The same applies with the flu. The flu kills people also with suppressed immune systems and if contracted and die, it's a flu death. I'm trying to debate with myself if that right to do whereas a part of me says, that disease may have push them over the edge but the reality is, their suppressed system was the real problem and ANY disease can push them over the edge. Even with the total numbers, I believe the margin of error is broad.
[QUOTE=RoadHead;4870544]There is zero evidence that hospitals are upcoding cause of death to covid to get more federal money. The amount medicare pays for covid is similar to that for other respiratory diseases.[/QUOTE]Payments are subject to documentation. Lab tests, xrays etc. There is also an audit process which could be 9-15 months later. Upcoding carries a big risk, so isn't common. Get your Medicare payments suspend, the hospital closes. Most patients have been over 65.
DRG payments are different for pneumonia, pneumonia needing ICU, and Covid-19 breathing treatment and Intubation. Starts at $5k, $13k and $37k
[QUOTE=MiloGonads;4872100]Several months ago the Michigan medical director or whatever her title is, announced on air how they tally death vis Covid. She admitted that people with suppressed immune system who contracted Covid, then died, is listed as a Covid death, even though it could have been the cause of their weakened immune system. The same applies with the flu. The flu kills people also with suppressed immune systems and if contracted and die, it's a flu death. I'm trying to debate with myself if that right to do whereas a part of me says, that disease may have push them over the edge but the reality is, their suppressed system was the real problem and ANY disease can push them over the edge. Even with the total numbers, I believe the margin of error is broad.[/QUOTE]True but then you have to say no one dies from cancer, they really die from organ failure. No one dies from a car accident, they die from brain damage, which leads to cardiac arrest. In reality, under your analysis, the only true cause of death is heart failure.
[QUOTE=RoadHead;4872843]True but then you have to say no one dies from cancer, they really die from organ failure. No one dies from a car accident, they die from brain damage, which leads to cardiac arrest. In reality, under your analysis, the only true cause of death is heart failure.[/QUOTE]Not really. A healthy person who develops cancer and dies actually died from cancer, even though it shut down their organs, the initial cause is cancer. A healthy person who dies from brain trauma sustained from an accident, died from the cause of the accident. These are healthy people who died from single causes regardless of that cause shutting down an organ. An unhealthy person with an already suppressed immune system, such as asthma, heart condition, diabetes, etc. Is already at risk of premature death caused by that condition. A virus heightens and worsen the condition, resulting in death whereas the chance of a healthy person who contracts, as proven, isn't a certainty of death. Therefore, did the virus actually cause the death or simply worsen the suppressed immune system to finally cave, which as I stated, any virus would do the same.
[QUOTE=RoadHead;4870544]There is zero evidence that hospitals are upcoding cause of death to covid to get more federal money. The amount medicare pays for covid is similar to that for other respiratory diseases.[/QUOTE]Zero evidence.
Going back to re-code deaths to COVID that weren't. Payments for coding it beforehand already incentivized it, payments for it after.
Payments for being hooked to a respirator are higher. And, communists know how communism works; if there is a disease and "emergency" then more money flows to that area. Trump is tweeting at hospitals with COVID research, dude! Guess what that does to donations and grants????
This is how the game works! It worked the same in the "college rape" game. You report more rapes, you get more govt, charity, and individual donation $$$$$$$$. So, every unwanted brush of a hand on an arm is now reported as a rape. You would think people on this board would know how the game works.
Italy claimed high rates despite NO testing and evidence. Italy knows how communism works.
Sorry bud, it's common sense and incentives and payouts. The claim "ZERO EVIDENCE THAT CEOS WANT MORE MONEY! Is retarded. They get more money directly (which you only address for a fraction of the cases), at university / hospitals for study, and in CITIES to work with hospitals to turn buildings into COVID facilities and stock them with government-price paid utilities.
"ZERO EVIDENCE" dude. You have all the evidence you need. Local hospitals were approached across the nation to takeover convention centers and get paid to do it.
ZERO EVIDENCE guy. You're not that bright.
[QUOTE=RoadHead;4872843]True but then you have to say no one dies from cancer, they really die from organ failure. No one dies from a car accident, they die from brain damage, which leads to cardiac arrest. In reality, under your analysis, the only true cause of death is heart failure.[/QUOTE]COVID isn't something you can test for 100%. Most of the tests picked up past COVID strains which led to false positives, and there have been lots of false negatives. You seem to think they have tests for COVID only and it's perfect... nope, not true. And, you really die from what you really die from. Yes, the flu may have caused you to die from problems you already had with organs. You died from: 1) Organ failure, 2) the flu, 3) NOT COVID. There is no test for it, the true cause is heart failure, bro. If you didn't have shitty organs or diabetes a virus or flu or whatever just accelerates your actual death due to organ failure. You actually did die due to organ failure. Your excuse making to inflation COVID is retarded.
BC you actually died from it and everything else is a guess.
When you die and they go back and look to see if you had a cough. Guess what? You died from heart failure bc you had a weak immune system.
Your entire point rests upon some fantasy that COVID is widespread. It's less than 0. 5% by government numbers that call every death a COVID death.
And. They already were using COVID as primary bc it's easier and in their liberal interests.
Amazed by that. I always thought people here understood how govt worked to shame the public into getting them to comply. Apparently we have a lot of complaint followers.
OMG! Gretchen is following "the science" and dudes here say "it took me 5 seconds for Google to tell me she's right. ".
Guess what else Google will tell you is right about your activities LOL. Such followers. Or, fatties that know they might die a few minutes sooner if a dancer's mask doesn't block 1/1,000th of her spit. How boring.
Maybe it's a combination of the two. Followers and fatties? We should have a weight / health requirement before some of these ballsy followers get too aggressive with their posts about how smart they iz for listening to Grams Gretchen's "science" she refuses to tell the source of.
You can make fun of fatties all you want, but the fact is a huge percentage of the population has 2 conditions that increase your Covid19 death rate. And on a website where we talk about paying for sex, its probably even worse. I'm sure the 50 year old fatties here plan on living a couple more decades.
[QUOTE=Taz41;4873063]COVID isn't something you can test for 100%. Most of the tests picked up past COVID strains which led to false positives, and there have been lots of false negatives. You seem to think they have tests for COVID only and it's perfect... nope, not true. And, you really die from what you really die from. Yes, the flu may have caused you to die from problems you already had with organs. You died from: 1) Organ failure, 2) the flu, 3) NOT COVID. There is no test for it, the true cause is heart failure, bro. If you didn't have shitty organs or diabetes a virus or flu or whatever just accelerates your actual death due to organ failure. You actually did die due to organ failure. Your excuse making to inflation COVID is retarded.
BC you actually died from it and everything else is a guess.
When you die and they go back and look to see if you had a cough. Guess what? You died from heart failure bc you had a weak immune system.
Your entire point rests upon some fantasy that COVID is widespread. It's less than 0. 5% by government numbers that call every death a COVID death.
And. They already were using COVID as primary bc it's easier and in their liberal interests.[/QUOTE]I guess people who die from cancer also should be classified as dying from a weak immune system. You are a conspiracy theorist tard.
[QUOTE=Taz41;4873077]Amazed by that. I always thought people here understood how govt worked to shame the public into getting them to comply. Apparently we have a lot of complaint followers.
OMG! Gretchen is following "the science" and dudes here say "it took me 5 seconds for Google to tell me she's right. ".
Guess what else Google will tell you is right about your activities LOL. Such followers. Or, fatties that know they might die a few minutes sooner if a dancer's mask doesn't block 1/1,000th of her spit. How boring.
Maybe it's a combination of the two. Followers and fatties? We should have a weight / health requirement before some of these ballsy followers get too aggressive with their posts about how smart they iz for listening to Grams Gretchen's "science" she refuses to tell the source of.[/QUOTE]What the hell is wrong with you people? Why do you have to mock someone who is actually trying to tackle the pandemic in the most humanely as possible, just look at the chart, compare our state with the recent top ones you'll see the difference, learn to appreciate the effort and please don't spread conspiracy theories here!!
[QUOTE=RoadHead;4873235]I guess people who die from cancer also should be classified as dying from a weak immune system. You are a conspiracy theorist tard.[/QUOTE]Since April 14th anybody who dies with covid regardless of why they actually died has been counted as a covid death.
"As of April 14,2020, CDC case counts and death counts include both confirmed and probable cases and deaths. " You can look it up on the CDC's site, I'm tired of linking to it.
When you add in the financial incentives for hospitals to classify deaths as covid then yup, the system is ripe for abuse. That's why Colorado went back and reclassified all their cases as Died of and Died with.
Still a 99.74% overall survival rate which never is mentioned, especially when they do the danger porn announcements of number of cases. They make them sound as if all of those people are dead. Saying "ok 10000 new cases were reported yesterday and 9974 of them are going to be just fine in 3-5 days doesn't generate as many clicks.
[QUOTE=Nick6789;4873168]You can make fun of fatties all you want, but the fact is a huge percentage of the population has 2 conditions that increase your Covid19 death rate. And on a website where we talk about paying for sex, its probably even worse. I'm sure the 50 year old fatties here plan on living a couple more decades.[/QUOTE]We have 400,000 registered members on this site. If every single one of them was infected with covid then 398,960 of them would be over it by next week and would be writing about pussy and looking for where they would be getting their next blowjob.
You may not like that, it may not make you feel as virtuous as shaming people for not believing it's the black death but none the less it remains a fact not open for debate or perception. 99.74% survival rate. Since they are all being assumed to be 50 and overweight their chances of dying this year of a heart attack are much higher. When the election is over and no media outlet is posting about covid any longer are you going to start insisting that anybody with a BMI over 15 can't eat meat?
Just wondering.
[QUOTE=NickHalden7;4873374]What the hell is wrong with you people? Why do you have to mock someone who is actually trying to tackle the pandemic in the most humanely as possible, just look at the chart, compare our state with the recent top ones you'll see the difference, learn to appreciate the effort and please don't spread conspiracy theories here![/QUOTE]Seriously the most humane way possible? Brother I know you think that is true but have you ever heard the saying that when the US Economy sniffles the rest of the world gets pneumonia?
This is the result of the covid mitigation and 30,000,000 lost jobs in the US.
[URL]https://www.cnbc.com/2020/04/09/coronavirus-could-push-half-a-billion-people-into-poverty-globally.html[/URL] Of the 400,000,000 people who have been forced back into extreme poverty what percentage do you think will be dead of starvation in the next year?
Here's another one, this is rght now in Colombia. About a week ago I heard the mayor of Medellin getting a handjob interview on NPR about what a great job he was doing because "only" 1000 people died. He was bloviating about how successful their safety net was being. Fucking liar. I know people there that are putting their kids to bed hungry every day now. And again 99.74% overall survival rate, I'm just going to keep saying that. 99.74%.
[url]https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/11/world/americas/coronavirus-latin-america-inequality.html[/url]
If you don't care about poor brown people far from the US then lets talk about the people closer to home. In the book "The De-Industrialization of America" Barry Bluestone makes that case that every 1% increase in the unemployment rate accounts for 38,000 deaths. This work was published long before covid and he's a lefty so nobody can call it faulty. The US has had I think a 12% increase in unemployment so that's 456,000 deaths. As of now the US has had 120,000 deaths for people WITH covid and that has been clearly flat the last two month regardless of what CNN says. I guess my question is, do the 456,000 not count because they don't have the disease that MSNBC, CNN, CBS, ABC, NBC are talking about 24/7?
If you want to be humane then all those lives are important and we are killing them for a disease that has a 99.74% survival rate. This is the chart, daily deaths which are down. It took all the really sick people in March and April so them deaths have been on the decline. They are going to jump soon because people are looking at it and they will have to change some reporting standard like they did in mid April when there wasn't enough deaths s that all the states that tried to return to life can be "proven" reckless but there is no denying that it's been declining for two months.
I know some of you team lockdown guys are going to try and shame me but all of you will attack me personally because none of you have anything of value to say about the covid mitigation induced deaths that will be 10 x what covid would have been. All you have is "so every doctor. " blah blah fucking blah.
I can't wait for November when this all ends.
A2.
Meanwhile at testing centers around the globe: