Rants, Raves and Opinions AKA "The Octagon"

You have to remember that LE is LAZY. They go after low hanging fruit most of the time.

[QUOTE=Hooter12;2436521]No you are correct. The police have a little more to do than go through phones of providers, get a search warrant to get all the numbers, try to figure out which ones are clients, get subpoenas for every single number from every single carrier, and go to those prospective homes to talk to the possible clients to file misdemeanor charges. This over the top paranoia and belief of what the police can and can't do and will or won't do is amusing. Uninformed but amusing.[/QUOTE].

LE tends to be lazy, the aren't running down every number in a phone. The key issue is, as you indicated, you get on the radar and become part of a "non-obvious relational connection" so to speak. A lot of that isn't even outside the realm of the 4th amendment protections. Those extra data points to make you guilty of a crime, but it definitely adds to the pot they want to stew you in.

FH.

[QUOTE=Twisted69;2436735]Where to begin. Hmm. The point is LEO does not always follow the 4th amendment rules. The main jest of the issue is not LEO following up on every phone number found on a cell phone but logging it to cross reference later to how many times it shows up on other suspicious phones. So if someone would get jammed up and their number shows up on the data base for a number of suspicious persons phones. Explain the way out of that along with the current issue. That extra tracking shows habit not single incident behavior. Closely related is that anyone cruising the routes for SW and LEO gets behind you for a bit most likely your license plate got ran and logged as to time and place for tracking purposes later if you get jammed up (I was stopped in a hot zone and then given this info by a CPD a long time ago so it is probably worse with the license plate cameras on the cars) - again to add to the single issue, explain being in this area a number of times as well. If you think all of our local uncles are honest and forthright, keep drinking the kool-aid. Look what Philly is going through right now and the number of convictions being tossed out from crooked cops. Keep it real. T69.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Twisted69;2436735]Where to begin. Hmm. The point is LEO does not always follow the 4th amendment rules. The main jest of the issue is not LEO following up on every phone number found on a cell phone but logging it to cross reference later to how many times it shows up on other suspicious phones. So if someone would get jammed up and their number shows up on the data base for a number of suspicious persons phones. Explain the way out of that along with the current issue. That extra tracking shows habit not single incident behavior. Closely related is that anyone cruising the routes for SW and LEO gets behind you for a bit most likely your license plate got ran and logged as to time and place for tracking purposes later if you get jammed up (I was stopped in a hot zone and then given this info by a CPD a long time ago so it is probably worse with the license plate cameras on the cars) - again to add to the single issue, explain being in this area a number of times as well. If you think all of our local uncles are honest and forthright, keep drinking the kool-aid. Look what Philly is going through right now and the number of convictions being tossed out from crooked cops. Keep it real. T69.[/QUOTE]Jesus man seriously take a pill. You were not given this information especially by a CPD officer. Trust me I know. I have far far more knowledge about this than you can imagine. I'll let you figure out how. You have your basement lined with aluminum foil also so the government can't read your mind too?

Moved from Escort Reviews.

[QUOTE=Selective69;2432712]And your opinion of Indys being reliable is also your worth mound of salt. As a matter of fact I rate Indys far superior to USA because of P. O. S. Like you who run your mouth with baseless comments for which you know nothing about. Take your 600 post and put them on a roll of toilet paper.[/QUOTE]Thanks for proving my point, now go back to PI's silver mine or whatever in the hell he is calling that internet man cave he hosts for his fudgepacking posse.

Yeah, Slappy, I'm talking to you.

Anyway, unlike that shitty independent board, we here take research and information very seriously. It is after all the mandate of the board. Please quit clogging up our nicely organized review and report sections with your internet dick measuring. Do it here where the rest of us assholes gather to annoy the fuck out of each other.

I see everyone has exchanged their medical degree from last week, (by the way, what was that guys problem?, a pimple on his side? Or something like that), for brand new law degrees this week.

[QUOTE=Hooter12;2437039]Jesus man seriously take a pill. You were not given this information especially by a CPD officer. Trust me I know. I have far far more knowledge about this than you can imagine. I'll let you figure out how. You have your basement lined with aluminum foil also so the government can't read your mind too?[/QUOTE]It chafes a little but I got my groin covered. No secret pictures of my junk.

Anyone who buys a phone from someone in a questionable line of work or a complete stranger is a moron. Anyone that thinks your data is safe on a cellular device or any wireless form of communication is still living in the 80's. It does not take a special device built for LE to intercept and steal data, you can go online and buy a signal receiver with output detection for about $100 there used by electrician and IT people. Don't be a dumbass or a cheapskate go to your local dollar store and buy one of those cheap peices of crap that takes 5 minutes to set up without the need to enter personal info. Anyone who isn't smart enough to do that or is dumb enough to buy a phone from a provider is stupid and gets what they deserve.

There are dozens of reviews about Velvet, virtually all good to glowing, from many regular and Senior Members, over several years, with no legal issues from anyone on the board associated with her. THIS VERSUS: Lugnutz who has NEVER SEEN HER, makes wild speculations about what might have happened and for some reason seems to have an axe to grind. I know, she's my ATF and I consider her a friend, but check the facts and make up your mind. And let's face it guys, with all this drama from him, I certainly take any of his comments with a grain of salt. None of us really know each other, so our word is all we can use for our credibility. I think I'm in pretty good shape, I think Velvet is in pretty good shape and I trust most of the guys who have supported her. I, for one, plan to keep doing so.

[QUOTE=Lugnutz;2436115]I'll move this discussion from Buy / Sell / Trade over to Rants / Raves / IncredulousSoundsofDisbelief. Not to be overly paranoid, and continuing to be undecided on the whole controversy of recent months regarding Stormy aka VelvetRayne, but I think you would have to be nuts to buy a used cell phone from a provider advertised on this site. Any provider. Under the circumstances, even more so. If anyone who buys one of these phones would be kind enough to raise his or her hand so I know not to have any electronic communications with him / her, that would be much appreciated.

Why'all do know that LEO has been known to clone and / or track phones they've come into contact with, right?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Hooter12;2437039]Jesus man seriously take a pill. You were not given this information especially by a CPD officer. Trust me I know. I have far far more knowledge about this than you can imagine. I'll let you figure out how. You have your basement lined with aluminum foil also so the government can't read your mind too?[/QUOTE]I don't know what to say, but here is some interesting reading that backs up what I was told personally. And I was given the info about data collection as a bonus in part due to my career before retirement. T69.

[URL]http://codes.ohio.gov/oac/4501:2-10[/URL]

[URL]http://www.policechiefmagazine.org/magazine/index.cfm?fuseaction=display_arch&article_id=1823&issue_id=62009[/URL]

[URL]https://www.aclu.org/feature/you-are-being-tracked?redirect=alpr[/URL]

[URL]http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/dhs-renews-quest-for-access-to-national-license-plate-tracking-system/2015/04/02/4d79385a-d8a1-11e4-8103-fa84725dbf9d_story.html[/URL]

[URL]http://www.wired.com/2014/05/license-plate-tracking/[/URL]

Folks- there has been a rich discussion around this topic in bits and pieces over time. I wonder if one or more of the experts on the topic create a post titled 'rules for data safety' and ensure that all involved follow those to ensure safety in general. For example, delete data as soon as it is generated to omit any lingering trails of crumbs. More like snapchat. Thoughts?

[QUOTE=NoAlibis;2437172]I see everyone has exchanged their medical degree from last week, (by the way, what was that guys problem?, a pimple on his side? Or something like that), for brand new law degrees this week.[/QUOTE]I got my degree online from the venerable law firm of Gang, Tyer and Brown.

[QUOTE=Twisted69;2437744]I don't know what to say, but here is some interesting reading that backs up what I was told personally. And I was given the info about data collection as a bonus in part due to my career before retirement. T69.

[URL]http://codes.ohio.gov/oac/4501:2-10[/URL]

[URL]http://www.policechiefmagazine.org/magazine/index.cfm?fuseaction=display_arch&article_id=1823&issue_id=62009[/URL]

[URL]https://www.aclu.org/feature/you-are-being-tracked?redirect=alpr[/URL]

[URL]http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/dhs-renews-quest-for-access-to-national-license-plate-tracking-system/2015/04/02/4d79385a-d8a1-11e4-8103-fa84725dbf9d_story.html[/URL]

[URL]http://www.wired.com/2014/05/license-plate-tracking/[/URL][/QUOTE]OMG! That's got to be some of the scariest info I've ever read! I don't know how any of that is legal? But I can see it is, I had no idea the elaborate tracking systems currently used against us, I don't understand why all this is needed but I know it can't be due to terrorist, that's an excuse.

That's blatant communism.

[QUOTE=Twisted69;2437744]I don't know what to say, but here is some interesting reading that backs up what I was told personally. And I was given the info about data collection as a bonus in part due to my career before retirement. T69.

[URL]http://codes.ohio.gov/oac/4501:2-10[/URL]

[URL]http://www.policechiefmagazine.org/magazine/index.cfm?fuseaction=display_arch&article_id=1823&issue_id=62009[/URL]

[URL]https://www.aclu.org/feature/you-are-being-tracked?redirect=alpr[/URL]

[URL]http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/dhs-renews-quest-for-access-to-national-license-plate-tracking-system/2015/04/02/4d79385a-d8a1-11e4-8103-fa84725dbf9d_story.html[/URL]

[URL]http://www.wired.com/2014/05/license-plate-tracking/[/URL][/QUOTE]Learn what parallel construction is -- even if they acquire the data on you, they don't have to be honest with you (or your attorney) about how they're using it on you.

I've heard a rumor that one of the three letter agencies is getting ready to put static plate readers on MCM in the next 3-6 weeks.

Be safe.

This is way off the current topic, but I use this site on my phone and that big yellow final notice sign is getting old to scroll past. A2, when will they be getting rid of it. Its been up for months.

[QUOTE=MisforMaster;2438019]Learn what parallel construction is -- even if they acquire the data on you, they don't have to be honest with you (or your attorney) about how they're using it on you.

I've heard a rumor that one of the three letter agencies is getting ready to put static plate readers on MCM in the next 3-6 weeks.

Be safe.[/QUOTE]After scanning these articles (thanks for sharing! I feel as though I would be safer going to appointments on foot and in disguise or on my bicycle!

I hope the ACLU is aggressively fighting the widespread use of these, the data retention and sharing. Orwell, the KGB and the Stasi couldn't even imagine the capabilities and potential abuse of this technology.

The 2 biggest issues I see are the length of time the data can be retained and sharing of data with third parties. Data should not be retained more than it would take to solve a crime. 3 months should be plenty of time. Second, if data can be shared with third parties, restrictions placed on LE would be irrelevant. The opportunity for abuse is endless.

Recently, a provider I have seen for some time has threatened me with blackmail. She says she has kept all texts and if I didn't pay X she would copy them and send them to my wife. In corresponding with another monger, I have found I am not the only one she has threatened. Any words of advice?

[QUOTE=3-MinutePassion;2438442]Recently, a provider I have seen for some time has threatened me with blackmail. She says she has kept all texts and if I didn't pay X she would copy them and send them to my wife. In corresponding with another monger, I have found I am not the only one she has threatened. Any words of advice?[/QUOTE]I can understand she knows you're married, but how does she know who your wife is, and, how to contact her? How much information do you share with these girls?

Extortion / ikˈstrSH (601 and / the practice of obtaining something, especially money, through force or threats.

Blackmail /712;blakˌmāl / the action, treated as a criminal offense, of demanding money from a person in return for not revealing compromising or injurious information about that person.

Negotiate / andə712;609;333;SHē716;257;t / try to reach an agreement or compromise by discussion with others.

1. Don't be afraid to ask for what you want. 2. Shut up and listen. 3. Do your homework. 4. Always be willing to walk away. 5. Don't be in a hurry. 6. Aim high and expect the best outcome. 7. Focus on the other side's pressure, not yours. 8. Show the other person how their needs will be met. 9. Don't give anything away without getting something in return. 10. Don't take the issues or the other person's behavior personally. I am not married but if I was and wanted to protect my marriage from the info, the gloves come off and nothing is too extreme. Contact a attorney to protect yourself in the event the damaging info becomes known to married other. Share the name of provider" thru private message" so others don't get preyed on also.

[QUOTE=3-MinutePassion;2438442]Recently, a provider I have seen for some time has threatened me with blackmail. She says she has kept all texts and if I didn't pay X she would copy them and send them to my wife. In corresponding with another monger, I have found I am not the only one she has threatened. Any words of advice?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=3-MinutePassion;2438442]Recently, a provider I have seen for some time has threatened me with blackmail. She says she has kept all texts and if I didn't pay X she would copy them and send them to my wife. In corresponding with another monger, I have found I am not the only one she has threatened. Any words of advice?[/QUOTE]If you hire an attorney he will be bound by confidentiality rules and he can discretely tell this provider the punishments for blackmail. He will tell her in no uncertain terms that if she follows through with the blackmail you may get divorced but your divorce will be over before she gets out of prison.

Discretely save the blackmail threats. Give your attorney the information you have on her and he will find out her real background using Lexis / Nexis which will give him ammunition to talk about when he contacts her'.

In the future don't give out real information.

RIL.

[QUOTE=Resipsaloquito;2438484]If you hire an attorney he will be bound by confidentiality rules and he can discretely tell this provider the punishments for blackmail. He will tell her in no uncertain terms that if she follows through with the blackmail you may get divorced but your divorce will be over before she gets out of prison.

Discretely save the blackmail threats. Give your attorney the information you have on her and he will find out her real background using Lexis / Nexis which will give him ammunition to talk about when he contacts her'.

In the future don't give out real information.

RIL.[/QUOTE]Hire an attorney? Thats funny. Sounds like this girl is talking out her ass, and wants to see if he'll take the bait. She's probably an addict, I'm sure she's a master mind when it comes to extortion.

How about telling the board who this provider is so that the rest of us stay clear of her and save us the grief that your going through. Sorry to hear that you are having to put up with this BS.

[QUOTE=3-MinutePassion;2438442]Recently, a provider I have seen for some time has threatened me with blackmail. She says she has kept all texts and if I didn't pay X she would copy them and send them to my wife. In corresponding with another monger, I have found I am not the only one she has threatened. Any words of advice?[/QUOTE]

No Alibis as a point in that you have to make the judgment upfront whether you believr she is serior about this or as he so aptly states she is "talking out of her ass. ".

My initial response was based on the belief that you already concluded she could and would follow through with her extortion threats and wanted to be proactive. However, bearing in mind that hiring an attorney will cost some serious mongering cash you should do the evaluation of her ability to follow through with the threats. Of course, being proactive takes that evaluation out the equation.

Under no circumstances pay her a dime as she will only come back for more and will be emboldened to try this scheme with others.

The fact that she is probably stupid as No Alibi imagines is not a positive thing for your situation as my experience is that it is the stupid ones that act irrationally. The fact that she is too stupid to realize she has more to lose than you is not a good thing.

[QUOTE=NoAlibis;2438522]Hire an attorney? Thats funny. Sounds like this girl is talking out her ass, and wants to see if he'll take the bait. She's probably an addict, I'm sure she's a master mind when it comes to extortion.[/QUOTE]My response was to tell her not to contact me again, EVER. She has done so several times, ramping it up each time, telling me she is at FedEx printing up the package she is going to send. I tried to work with her initially. I then asked her how did I have any assurances she would not come knocking again when times get tough. She said this is a one and done. Of course, I can't trust her. If I could I wouldn't be getting threats in the first place.

As bad as this sounds, I was ready to help her but her texts got so nasty so fast, I just said don't contact me again. A real Dr. Jekyll, Mr. Hyde. Couldn't believe it. Bi-polar or something. Blown away. This was someone I had really gone out of the way to help previously.

For those of you who want to know who she is, I am not going to say, but you can probably figure it out by previous correspondence. Also, she has not placed ads anywhere so the likelihood of you encountering her are very low.

[QUOTE=3-MinutePassion;2438574]My response was to tell her not to contact me again, EVER. She has done so several times, ramping it up each time, telling me she is at FedEx printing up the package she is going to send. I tried to work with her initially. I then asked her how did I have any assurances she would not come knocking again when times get tough. She said this is a one and done. Of course, I can't trust her. If I could I wouldn't be getting threats in the first place.

As bad as this sounds, I was ready to help her but her texts got so nasty so fast, I just said don't contact me again. A real Dr. Jekyll, Mr. Hyde. Couldn't believe it. Bi-polar or something. Blown away. This was someone I had really gone out of the way to help previously.

For those of you who want to know who she is, I am not going to say, but you can probably figure it out by previous correspondence. Also, she has not placed ads anywhere so the likelihood of you encountering her are very low.[/QUOTE]I'd still like to know how she got so much info on your personal life. Maybe she is bipolar or crazy, but she has to be dealt with appropriately. If it's too the point you state it is, well, I'm just not a bleeding heart liberal, if you get my drift. People dig there own holes. She needs to understand, there's more than one way to skin a cat.

This reminds me of another guy on a different board who stated it was ok to give a girl my employment info. He stated she would only use it to verify me, then disregard it.

[QUOTE=ChickaAmante;2437832]Folks- there has been a rich discussion around this topic in bits and pieces over time. I wonder if one or more of the experts on the topic create a post titled 'rules for data safety' and ensure that all involved follow those to ensure safety in general. For example, delete data as soon as it is generated to omit any lingering trails of crumbs. More like snapchat. Thoughts?[/QUOTE]I have taken an intrest on this topic because my job involvoles data collection and electronics. The only true way to get rid of data is to remove it from the server. Simply removing it from the device does not make it disapere. The only real way to avoid getting in trouble in this digital world is to not do anything you will regret. Not trying to burst any bubbles or worry anyone its just the plain hard truth.

[QUOTE=3-MinutePassion;2438442]Recently, a provider I have seen for some time has threatened me with blackmail. She says she has kept all texts and if I didn't pay X she would copy them and send them to my wife. In corresponding with another monger, I have found I am not the only one she has threatened. Any words of advice?[/QUOTE]Remember the chick that tried to blackmail Rick Pitino he got the police involved if I'm not mistaken the FBI, the lady got 7 years in the prison. Blackmail is a heavy crime and I would let her that you saved all her text and if she doesn't back off the police will be involved.

HL29.

[QUOTE=NoAlibis;2438597]I'd still like to know how she got so much info on your personal life. [/QUOTE]I got lazy. I allowed, through discussions and intimacy, her to obtain info I should have never given. Anyone who has seen a provider for a long time, who you have gotten to know well, probably knows what I am talking about. Casual conversation, allowing them access to things, etc.

I will never make this mistake again. I have learned my lesson and in so doing I hope this educates a few mongers out there to never do what I did, regardless of how well you think you know the person.

A few of you have PMed saying I ought to rough her up but I have kids, a wife, etc. That is just not me anyway. Maybe that is why she is trying this. She knows I would never physically harm her. At any rate, learn from my mistakes, is the bottom line.

[QUOTE=HuntLadys29;2438735]Remember the chick that tried to blackmail Rick Pitino he got the police involved if I'm not mistaken the FBI, the lady got 7 years in the prison. Blackmail is a heavy crime and I would let her that you saved all her text and if she doesn't back off the police will be involved.

HL29.[/QUOTE]HL, I am somewhat familiar with what happened to Pitino. I was not aware the gal got 7 years. Good info I can pass on. Thanks.

I'd contact a lawyer and tell him the deal. If you have her sending you these texts in and writing he may be able to help you scare her off. Blackmail or extortion IS against the law.

In any case I personally wouldn't be held up by someone like this. I make my own bed, so I'd tell her to go for it. Remind her that once she does, you don't really have anything to lose.

It's a shitty situation. I'm curious like the other guy asked. How much info do you share with these girls?

[QUOTE=3-MinutePassion;2438442]Recently, a provider I have seen for some time has threatened me with blackmail. She says she has kept all texts and if I didn't pay X she would copy them and send them to my wife. In corresponding with another monger, I have found I am not the only one she has threatened. Any words of advice?[/QUOTE]

We need a chat room. Sitting here drinking a chard and smoking a cigar. A chat would be nice. Surely someone is awake in Memphis or Cincinnati besides me. I can't be the only USA monger awake now.

[QUOTE=3-MinutePassion;2438736]I got lazy. I allowed, through discussions and intimacy, her to obtain info I should have never given. Anyone who has seen a provider for a long time, who you have gotten to know well, probably knows what I am talking about. Casual conversation, allowing them access to things, etc.

I will never make this mistake again. I have learned my lesson and in so doing I hope this educates a few mongers out there to never do what I did, regardless of how well you think you know the person.

A few of you have PMed saying I ought to rough her up but I have kids, a wife, etc. That is just not me anyway. Maybe that is why she is trying this. She knows I would never physically harm her. At any rate, learn from my mistakes, is the bottom line.[/QUOTE]And for those of you that think you are immune to being cuuuntstruck, you just haven't been doing this long enough (25+ years here) cause that is the first step on the slippery slope: thinking you are immune.

With that said, this is why we post more than reviews here. Search is your friend. You will find horror stories and solutions. Don't be afraid to stand on the shoulders of giants. You can find great advice here; even if it comes from an old post where one of us admits to screwing up, and the others offer "next time" advice. While a lawyer might be the best end game, it is the last resort. I think you have other options before you go to defcon 4. PM me and I will try to help you, paying the debt that those that came before me and mentored me through similar troubles.

To all of you: If you don't yet have an executable exit plan, start putting one together. Better to have one and not need it, than to try to scramble at the last minute, if you fuck up.

I could go for something like that. Don't know how that would play into the heavy moderation workflow they have here though.

[QUOTE=Glockman;2439044]We need a chat room. Sitting here drinking a chard and smoking a cigar. A chat would be nice. Surely someone is awake in Memphis or Cincinnati besides me. I can't be the only USA monger awake now.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Glockman;2439044]We need a chat room. Sitting here drinking a chard and smoking a cigar. A chat would be nice. Surely someone is awake in Memphis or Cincinnati besides me. I can't be the only USA monger awake now.[/QUOTE]Jax and I have been thinking about this. As you guys know our priorities are always in order, pussy first work second, it's why everything takes so long here, we get a lot of pussy. Anyway, we have been talking for the last year about having a subscription site that would cost money, (no idea how much) but one of the things we are thinking about deploying in that is live regional chat. That way guys could shoot the breeze and chicks could get on there. That would be one of the enhanced features that would be involved in a pay site, or pay area.

It would be expensive to build and not worth it unless guys were paying for it, otherwise the douchebags would just take trolling to a new level, but we are talking about it.

Maybe sometime this year.

A2.

P.S., for all you cheap bastards freaking out about the words pay site, we are not contemplating changing this site, we are thinking about what expensive to build or buy features that serious mongers might find enough value in to give us the price of a couple packs a smokes a month for.

[QUOTE=FirstHalf;2439271]I could go for something like that. Don't know how that would play into the heavy moderation workflow they have here though.[/QUOTE]Not sure how it would be monitored, but I would definitely participate and pay a bit for a feature like that. Another yay vote, A2!

I would pay for that sort of enhanced functionality.

[QUOTE=Admin2;2439301]Jax and I have been thinking about this. As you guys know our priorities are always in order, pussy first work second, it's why everything takes so long here, we get a lot of pussy. Anyway, we have been talking for the last year about having a subscription site that would cost money, (no idea how much) but one of the things we are thinking about deploying in that is live regional chat. That way guys could shoot the breeze and chicks could get on there. That would be one of the enhanced features that would be involved in a pay site, or pay area.

It would be expensive to build and not worth it unless guys were paying for it, otherwise the douchebags would just take trolling to a new level, but we are talking about it.

Maybe sometime this year.

A2.

P.S., for all you cheap bastards freaking out about the words pay site, we are not contemplating changing this site, we are thinking about what expensive to build or buy features that serious mongers might find enough value in to give us the price of a couple packs a smokes a month for.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=3-MinutePassion;2438736]I got lazy. I allowed, through discussions and intimacy, her to obtain info I should have never given. Anyone who has seen a provider for a long time, who you have gotten to know well, probably knows what I am talking about. Casual conversation, allowing them access to things, etc.

I will never make this mistake again. I have learned my lesson and in so doing I hope this educates a few mongers out there to never do what I did, regardless of how well you think you know the person.

A few of you have PMed saying I ought to rough her up but I have kids, a wife, etc. That is just not me anyway. Maybe that is why she is trying this. She knows I would never physically harm her. At any rate, learn from my mistakes, is the bottom line.[/QUOTE]FWIW, I've made my share of mistakes too. For example, I once saw a provider at the biggest shit hole on Dream Street with laptop and other work stuff in my vehicle. Fortunately, nothing bad happened. I lucked out.

I've never given my real first name to a provider before. But I have come close to breaking that rule. Why? Probably for the same reasons many mongers have broken mongering rules. We start to get attached. I know I have started to get attached if I've seen them at least a few times.

Of course, the advice in that case is to know that it's happening and to allow the big head to prevail over the little one. But as always, this is easier said than done. Hope this all works out for you in the end.

[QUOTE=FirstHalf;2439271]I could go for something like that. Don't know how that would play into the heavy moderation workflow they have here though.[/QUOTE]You don't need much moderation on pay sites. People pay and if they fuck up you throw them off, then they lose their money. It's not like here where they just create a new user. They would have to pay again.

I pay for the international site under the same handle. It's interesting, but it hasn't helped me yet, to the point that I don't even bother logging in lately. This site, on the other hand, provides nearly daily / weekly value. Realtime chat is much more worthwhile.

Also, I dunno that whole money thing. I don't behave myself just because I'm paying. If I'm going to be a dick, then that's what I'll be whether you have my whopping $15 per year or not. I'm sure it's not hard to see who's trying to chip in and who isn't.

[QUOTE=Admin2;2439712]You don't need much moderation on pay sites. People pay and if they fuck up you throw them off, then they lose their money. It's not like here where they just create a new user. They would have to pay again.[/QUOTE]

1. Don't EVER PAY! This is beneficial ONLY to the provider, not only does it give her an idea of your actual fear of being revealed, but it also encourages her to do it to the next client.

2. She's just as fearful of being exposed to her community as YOU ARE, flip the table and tell her how you had your phone on several occasions taping tour services, not for blackmail purposes, just for later reviewing of a great time, though now your glad you did as it will help show the world who she is and what she does, it's easy to blur out your own face and distort your own voice, YouTube has a free channel and Facebook allows videos too, let her know you will make flyers if needed of just her in positions un tasteful to community standards and plaster them anonymously through her home area, or her families home area.

3. Don't play the victim or show fear or remorse, tell her she not only lost a steady income, but just ruined her own reputation as a provider because you intend on warning other clients on every forum of hat she did!

4. Finally, fight DIRTY, she broke a rule! Which means playing fair is now off the table, let her know you'll go above and beyond what's needed, let her know for her even considering hurting a family that had nothing to do with her, she has crossed a line of no return, tell her from this day forward, all of your spare time will be used to locate her, warn every guy before he walks thru her door, and let her know you've taken the time to to make a police report about her texting you, threatening you, and I've seen a monger on here sent me text messages he obviously manipulated, I don't how how he did it, but I know what I texted him and I had it still on my phone, yet he sent pictures of screen shots of text messages that had been altered to say things that was never said!! So there must be apps on smart phones or computers where people who are computer savvy can alter texts.

Stick to your guns, tell her you've prepared your family for a possible situation where a girl has been flirting with you and manipulated texts, so she has no ammo on you!

I had to help a client of mine out of a situation like this before, it doesn't take much to stall out these attempts. Bottom line don't communicate after you've said your part, show no fear, and don't EVER PAY!