"Sugar Babies" and "Arrangements"

[QUOTE=JoyDrop;7403721]Tell me you don't understand women in their 20's without telling me you don't understand women in their 20's LOL.

In all seriousness, I really do think you're doing yourself a huge disservice with this line of thinking. A very significant percentage of the 20-something girls on SB sites harbor a fantasy of being squired about by a wealthy older man. For a successful guy in the 50-60 range, it can be like shooting fish in a barrel. Ask me how I know.[/QUOTE]I've not had any issue getting willing participants, the issue is finding the ones I'm willing to afford. Apparently, gray hair and a decent body are pretty desirable. I do treat them as a potential girlfriend, not an hourly date, however I have had a ton of luck in the 35-45 range without many rules.

[QUOTE=JoyDrop;7403721]Tell me you don't understand women in their 20's without telling me you don't understand women in their 20's LOL.

In all seriousness, I really do think you're doing yourself a huge disservice with this line of thinking. A very significant percentage of the 20-something girls on SB sites harbor a fantasy of being squired about by a wealthy older man. For a successful guy in the 50-60 range, it can be like shooting fish in a barrel. Ask me how I know.[/QUOTE]Hear, hear. See my post in the LA sugar thread about what I did w / my current SB. It isn't all just about the $. And there are definitely girls who strongly prefer much older guys. In particular, the subs. My current SB definitely has that leaning. Adores my hands wrapped around her neck. Not that I am totally into that. But because she is, catering to her gets me in her pants at my price point.

[QUOTE=Airmantroy;7403809]I've not had any issue getting willing participants, the issue is finding the ones I'm willing to afford. Apparently, gray hair and a decent body are pretty desirable. I do treat them as a potential girlfriend, not an hourly date, however I have had a ton of luck in the 35-45 range without many rules.[/QUOTE]Of course, you get it, and that is what was being discussed....how much these girls want, ppm or allowance. And how our age and our approach towards them generally affects that, if at all, in many cases.

[QUOTE=GoneForGood97;7403257]Yeah, this is a major reason pricing is all over the place. Some guys treat SBs like low volume escorts that do bare, and treat them as such. That is to say, minimum amount of effort to get their number, get their rate, and get them in the sack. And my observation is the guys that do this end up paying more.

If you treat SBs like you would any girl you're talking to on a dating site / app, then it's normally pretty simple to get them to a reasonable rate, since it's likely 1) they just like you more than the 10 other guys that all just asked her "how much to fuck?" since you're having an actual conversation with them and 2) you're more likely to filter out the actual pros who charge pro / high end escort rates.

If all you want is a low volume escort who does bare, by all means enjoy yourself. But you're almost certainly going to pay a higher PPM (400+) than someone who takes the time to get know the girl, flirts with them, and makes them feel like a potential GF instead of a hooker (sub 300 and they'll host if you build up some trust).

This isn't a right or wrong, it's just depends on what you're looking for, and accepting that wanting some things will require you to pay more than putting in the extra work to get something slightly different.[/QUOTE]Yeah, I do the wine and dine and get to know them, so I put in time. I've almost never been questioned about payment even though I was down in the mid 300's. When I distanced myself from the last steady one she basically said she couldn't find any nice guys and would travel or whatever if I found time for her. But Reddit has rotted my brain even though I know it normally applies to the top 5% in large and expensive cities. I didn't think it would work out long term with me with the latest POT, and I shot my mouth off and said I thought she could command $500 per meet. 46 year age gap but she wanted it to work from the jump. Meet 2 was 400 but just heavy foreplay. We had planned to take our time. If I wanted to be more aggressive we could have done it but maybe would have been a little guilty being she's 20. So the last time I backed up my mouth and gave her $500 for 5 hours. So I have overpaid a bit. I have it, but it's the principle. The upside is she hasn't been with many men. Downside is the same. The oral is not that great. Half shaft with an average sized man. She just hasn't given a lot of oral. NEVER recieved oral from any partner or BF so that was wild. Everything on point with hygiene. Said never again below 30. Selfish and no head. Too late to turn back on the rate. I'll just pay and eventually my age and the long drive will likely kill things off even though she said she can drive to me some as well. Thanks for the good analysis. I will share when I am done if she's looking.

[QUOTE=PeterJohnson;7403852]Of course, you get it, and that is what was being discussed....how much these girls want, ppm or allowance. And how our age and our approach towards them generally affects that, if at all, in many cases.[/QUOTE]So here's a tip on how to handle those astronomical GPS requests they throw out. Simply tell them to be realistic, many 40 hr a week jobs don't make $500. You're not looking for 40 hrs and it's the most pleasurable job ever. Then wait for them to actually think about it and get ghosted by the next 10-20 guys that didn't push back or were rude to them.

[QUOTE=JMAbacus;7403856]Yeah, I do the wine and dine and get to know them, so I put in time. I've almost never been questioned about payment even though I was down in the mid 300's. When I distanced myself from the last steady one she basically said she couldn't find any nice guys and would travel or whatever if I found time for her. But Reddit has rotted my brain even though I know it normally applies to the top 5% in large and expensive cities. I didn't think it would work out long term with me with the latest POT, and I shot my mouth off and said I thought she could command $500 per meet. 46 year age gap but she wanted it to work from the jump. Meet 2 was 400 but just heavy foreplay. will share when I am done if she's looking.[/QUOTE]I figure the two main factors is how much is the pussy worth to you, and also how much is the going market rate. As GfG has pointed out, even if it is worth 500 (to you), if the market rate is 300, then you are still unnecessarily overpaying. So I always take those two factors into account and adjust accordingly.

But hot girls in their 20's have guys trying to get in there constantly, and we are competing with quite a few whales with deep pockets. Women who have hit the Wall is a whole different category and different discussion.

I think I will try to take more of them to lunch first. I didn't like that before, because seemed like a waste of time and $, but $20 lunch is nothing and the girl can get more comfortable with you and you can also look for red flags.

[QUOTE=PeterJohnson;7403976]But hot girls in their 20's have guys trying to get in there constantly, and we are competing with quite a few whales with deep pockets. Women who have hit the Wall is a whole different category and different discussion.[/QUOTE]Please explain "hit the Wall".

[QUOTE=Airmantroy;7403881]So here's a tip on how to handle those astronomical GPS requests they throw out. Simply tell them to be realistic, many 40 hr a week jobs don't make $500. You're not looking for 40 hrs and it's the most pleasurable job ever. Then wait for them to actually think about it and get ghosted by the next 10-20 guys that didn't push back or were rude to them.[/QUOTE]Not bad, but. If you are negotiating sugar w / a POT via text, you are really more in the realm of an UTR escort than a SB. I only ever talk $ w / someone face to face. It is widely known how electronic communication (e-messaging, as well as posting online) makes people more critical and demanding. If you text to negotiate a per meet gift, you will get her highest, escort-like price. As if you are the worst troll and ogre. Face to face, people are much different. Concerned about rejection, and will therefore be more reasonable. And who knows, perhaps they like something about you (I hope you're going for that), and they could feel good about dating you at a more reasonable price point. This is more trouble than getting your pussy via Door Dash, but it's like anything in life.

Away. I agree. There are also dancers that do SB type arrangements, you just have to vibe with them. Some don't make money everyday in the club. $$ for 4 hours vs. $$ for 6-8 hours.

[QUOTE=FarFarAway;7404099]Not bad, but. If you are negotiating sugar w / a POT via text, you are really more in the realm of an UTR escort than a SB. I only ever talk $ w / someone face to face. It is widely known how electronic communication (e-messaging, as well as posting online) makes people more critical and demanding. If you text to negotiate a per meet gift, you will get her highest, escort-like price. As if you are the worst troll and ogre. Face to face, people are much different. Concerned about rejection, and will therefore be more reasonable. And who knows, perhaps they like something about you (I hope you're going for that), and they could feel good about dating you at a more reasonable price point. This is more trouble than getting your pussy via Door Dash, but it's like anything in life.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FarFarAway;7404002]Please explain "hit the Wall".[/QUOTE]Not the original poster, but I think this refers to women who have "peaked" in their looks due to age (obviously varies by woman, how much they smoke, and how much their body changed post kids, but sometime in their 30's normally) and therefore have "hit the wall" and will begin receiving less from men in general, not just lower allowance from SDs. Suddenly no one is buying them drinks when they go out anymore, guys aren't lining up to fix broken things for them, and so on.

[QUOTE=FarFarAway;7404099]Not bad, but. If you are negotiating sugar w / a POT via text, you are really more in the realm of an UTR escort than a SB. I only ever talk $ w / someone face to face. It is widely known how electronic communication (e-messaging, as well as posting online) makes people more critical and demanding. If you text to negotiate a per meet gift, you will get her highest, escort-like price. As if you are the worst troll and ogre. Face to face, people are much different. Concerned about rejection, and will therefore be more reasonable. And who knows, perhaps they like something about you (I hope you're going for that), and they could feel good about dating you at a more reasonable price point. This is more trouble than getting your pussy via Door Dash, but it's like anything in life.[/QUOTE]I do chat with them via text and occasionally via phone or video call, BEFORE I discuss any money. It's never like.

Hey!

Hi!

How much to fuck? (Or).

I'll give you $xxx for a taste of the cute pussy.

Anybody met Dixie? 36 white girl with tattoos and piercings. I think she's legit but something feels off when talking to her.

[QUOTE=FarFarAway;7404099]Not bad, but. If you are negotiating sugar w / a POT via text, you are really more in the realm of an UTR escort than a SB. I only ever talk $ w / someone face to face. It is widely known how electronic communication (e-messaging, as well as posting online) makes people more critical and demanding. If you text to negotiate a per meet gift, you will get her highest, escort-like price. As if you are the worst troll and ogre. Face to face, people are much different. Concerned about rejection, and will therefore be more reasonable. And who knows, perhaps they like something about you (I hope you're going for that), and they could feel good about dating you at a more reasonable price point. This is more trouble than getting your pussy via Door Dash, but it's like anything in life.[/QUOTE]Personally, I don't date SBs who live in the same town as me, so I'm driving a minimum of 30 minutes to meet one, and usually because Atlanta proper is the easiest place to find one it's oftentimes over an hour.

If I'm going to drive an hour to meet someone, I want to know what I'm getting. If they were 10-15 minutes away then sure, I'd chance an in person first meeting with no guarantee of intimacy, but if I'm driving an hour I need to know they'll put out somewhere in my budget.

[QUOTE=TooHotForYou;7407611]Anybody met Dixie? 36 white girl with tattoos and piercings. I think she's legit but something feels off when talking to her.[/QUOTE]I talked to her and yes something definitely off. She says "I've never done this before", but then sounds like a hardcore escort once the conversation progresses. I think she insisted on CFS as well, but I don't remember that part for sure. Anyway just not for me and I balied pretty quickly.

[URL]https://www.tiktok.com/@yeaathathappened[/URL]

Here's the tiktok for Rose who is on the site. I forgot her newer profile name. But she's bad news and had some thugs rob one of my buddies, and more.

Clearly some white trash energy in these videos. Yeah she looks good and I CIP'd, but was not worth it, and playing Russian roulette with your life if you see her.